Money for nothing

Should society send people money because they get old?

The answer in Canada is yes. We started paying wrinklies in 1927 – but only those over 70 who were destitute. By the 1940s old age payments were being recouped from the estates of the deceased – seriously ticking off beneficiaries. In 1951 Canada began giving money to everyone over seventy who had lived in the country for a couple of decades. In that year 308,825 old geezers collected the full amount – $40 a month.

Today there are 7.23 million frisky folks who are 65+. The number is swelling rapidly. Massively. All those people receive $685 a month (or $754 after age 75). The cost of this program to the federal treasury exceeds $65 billion a year. By 2030, says the Parliamentary Budget Officer, OAS will cost $108 billion. Today the old age pogey takes more cash than the child benefit and our armed forces combined.

Now, in order to get the full OAS your income must be south of $130,000. So, 95% of the country’s population collects. And this program is unlike the CPP – which is funded by premiums made by employees and employers over an entire working life. The OAS is not directly funded by anyone who benefits from it. In fact, given our ongoing deficits and trillion-dollar national debt, all of the OAS is being offloaded onto the shoulders of future taxpayers.

Is this fair?

Maybe. Old people, in general, aren’t doing so hot. The average retiree household earns $61,000, of which about half comes from the public purse (OAS and CPP). Every year there are fewer folks collecting corporate pensions, which means those people with gold-plated DBs are becoming the snowy-haired aristocracy.

This also means that after working for four or five decades, the majority of Canadians have failed financially. Meanwhile, way too many locked all their net worth in a house, then never got it out again. As a country we therefore send millionaire property-owners $685 a month so they can survive because of poverty-level incomes. Seems messed up.

Well, this brings me to Susan. “The feds are at it again,” she wrote me. “We can’t understand why the elected politicians continue to give away taxpayer money with no holds barred. Again (as in the Covid payout), the Liberals don’t appear to have learned to offer support via a means test. Of course, it is really vote-buying isn’t it? Why does the reasonably well-educated population of Canadian voters fall for this charade of Smoke and Mirrors?”

Susan is over 75, which is why she just got this gift from the federal Liberals.

Source: Department of Finance. Click to enlarge.

The 10% boost is permanent. It comes atop a $500 payment made last summer to this age cohort and the usual inflation-adjusted increases. Sue will receive an extra $766 a year. So will 3.3 million others her age. The additional federal spending for this initiative will be $2.5 billion. It’s the first permanent hike in OAS in almost fifty years. And everybody gets it.

Said Deb Shulte, then Minister of Seniors (that you never heard of): “It builds on measures to support all seniors, which include restoring the age of eligibility for the OAS pension and the GIS to 65 from 67, strengthening the Canada Pension Plan for future retirees, increasing the GIS for single seniors, raising the GIS earnings exemption and reducing income taxes for all Canadians.”

Wait. Did she say we’ve all seen a tax reduction? Huh?

But how can we go on as a country continuously increasing income support payments and reducing the tax base? Isn’t that exactly the strategy which just sank sad UK prime minister Liz Truss, who came close to causing an international financial crisis?

Yup. But apparently nobody cares.

As interest rates creep higher, the cost of servicing Canada’s $1.1 trillion federal debt mounts. The nation has gathered more new debt in the space of one prime minister’s tenure than that of every PM who went before, combined. At the same time federal spending has topped $1 trillion per year under the current administration (first time). The lion’s share of that is money which cannot be trimmed back – health care, family subsidies, transfers to provinces, indigenous funding and old people’s pogey.

It makes you wonder how the current crop of GenX leaders, in directing largesse to their parents, could so easily steal from their kids.

But we know the answer. Politics. Will Canadians ever vote for people who promise less? Would any party even attempt that?

Nah. And it’s why you need to top up your RRSP, TFSA, RESP, RRIF and DC pension plan. There’s tax storm coming.

About the picture: “This is our Newfoundland dog, Olaf,” writes Lisa. “She is happiest playing with my boys and loves snow. Here she is playing fetch in Rainbow Park in Whistler. Hope this helps with your request for dogs in action.”

154 comments ↓

#1 Captain Uppa on 10.25.22 at 3:49 pm

Dougie is going to allow three units on one property in Ontario.

Oh boy.

#2 Linda on 10.25.22 at 3:55 pm

Olaf is one big happy pup:)

I’ve always wondered why the OAS cutoff was so high. Not a whole heck of a lot of Canadians earn north of $65K NET per annum in retirement & until you do, you get the whole enchilada.

#3 SunShowers on 10.25.22 at 3:57 pm

“Every year there are fewer folks collecting corporate pensions, which means those people with gold-plated DBs are becoming the snowy-haired aristocracy.”

So what you’re saying is that between low wages and the disappearance of pensions, the government is essentially subsidizing private corporations by topping up their inadequate compensation packages with taxpayer money.

#4 It’s Boomers stupid! on 10.25.22 at 3:59 pm

The Boomers and their corporate interests are paying off these GenX politician “leaders” to do what they are doing?.

Why?

Clearly there is a strategic reason that suits them.

Most likely, since Boomers and their assets are benefiting at the cost of the kids, it is at the top of the list – looking after themselves.

#5 enthalpy on 10.25.22 at 4:07 pm

with population decline a real future threat….will this uptick in the 65+ bracket be “temporary pain”, before the amount owed starts to decrease?

Say in a generation or so?

#6 GINO on 10.25.22 at 4:15 pm

I make $165,000 a year with few tax deductions and have $300,000 in RSP which is growing. I am in my early 40s. I have a bank paid defined pension (the legacy kind). Should I continue contributing to RSP? I’ve also maxed our TFSA FYI. My principle residence is paid off and I have other cash savings/investments and no debts. I will also receive an inheritance in the future. I’m worried if I continue to contribute to RSP it will claw back my OAS.

#7 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 4:17 pm

Trudeau is a cartwheeling disaster. I feel bad for my kids, and future Canadians. The OECD hit the nail on the head regarding their downgrade of Canadian prosperity for youth over the next 4 decades. How could it not be?

#8 cuke and tomato picker on 10.25.22 at 4:18 pm

Yes it is really interesting how our government rewards
people who have vegetated with income supplement,
GIS, and rental supplement what a comedy act. Those
who have sacrificed and have created the charmed life
by working are rewarded by paying higher taxes to
prop up those who retired early, played big shot and neglected to provide for their old age.

#9 LG on 10.25.22 at 4:18 pm

Sunshowers #3

…the government is essentially subsidizing private corporations.

That, but mostly it creates a dependency. The government takes responsibility, and control.

People choose this with their votes. Mediocre people making mediocre choices, living mediocre lives.

It’s these choices that create the government.

The government we have reflects the values of the people who vote for them.

#10 Prince Polo on 10.25.22 at 4:18 pm

And it’s also why one should FIRE as soon as possible!

#11 Ronaldo on 10.25.22 at 4:22 pm

Yippee….I get a raise. That will pretty much cover my truck insurance.

#12 epic bear on 10.25.22 at 4:22 pm

just like in 1994 when Canada came close to a failed bond auction that forced Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin to make some drastic changes… the party ends when you can’t get funding.

#13 John on 10.25.22 at 4:23 pm

More government handouts. Old people don’t want to work anymore. Rather sit around and live on government handouts..

#14 JD on 10.25.22 at 4:30 pm

Seems like higher taxes are inevitable so does it make sense to grow in a non-registered fund for a few years and move that into RRSP when the hikes are in place? After maxing TFSA, RESP and DC Pension of course.

#15 tbone on 10.25.22 at 4:31 pm

If you delay taking your OAS , it increases every year by
7.2 % . A 36 % increase at 70.
For those that feel lucky.

#16 yvr_lurker on 10.25.22 at 4:31 pm

Now, in order to get the full OAS your income must be south of $130,000. So, 95% of the country’s population collects
—————–
I think that the OAS is too generous as those who are earning 75K don’t need it like those retirees who live on half of that. However, your statement above is misleading: they receive the “full OAS if they are south of 130K,”, but at 130K it will all be clawed back by taxes unless one is fortunate to be able to reduce income by splitting and other tricks…. how many people in this group are able to take advantage and not have most of it clawed back by the Gov’t…

#17 Ustabe on 10.25.22 at 4:33 pm

Story Time. Been a long time but here we go, mostly for Fartz.

We broke our long term road trip/camping vehicle this summer. In Dawson City. Badly. That is a complete other story. For now, suffice it to say BCAA doesn’t offer towing from Yukon back down to Vancouver Island. Wasn’t a mechanic available in either Dawson or Whitehorse, the economic activity up there is unbelievable.

So we and the vehicle make it home only to discover the repair needed is well north of the vehicle’s worth.

So we buy a new to us vehicle. This is a $50,000+ unit new. Its a couple of years old, 40,000 kms.

ICBC runner compares, cheaper to go all ICBC, full coverage, liability, collision, comp, uninsured, Roadside.

The whole enchilada. We pay these things in full but if we were to go monthly our full coverage via ICBC would have been $95/month or $1140 for the year. We paid less as we didn’t finance the premium.

So, tell me how bad ICBC is again.

#18 KuatoLives on 10.25.22 at 4:38 pm

All systems collapse, it’s just a question of time frame.

#19 enthalpy on 10.25.22 at 4:39 pm

#6 worried about what?
Go on vacation and be happy. You are more than fine.

#20 ElGatoNeroYVR on 10.25.22 at 4:41 pm

All excellent points.
OAS should 100% be capped starting a lot lower and based on a combination of NetWorth and income percentage.
I would at least start the clawback at 60K income and eliminate at 80K.
We should aslo apply a percentage reduction to the OAS pay on a progressive scale starting at 500K net worth.
Why are we subsidizing people with properties worth millions is beyond me.Likley we shoud consider the million plus investment portfolios as well.
Alternative is to just kill all social programs and replace with a minimum income guaranteed per family member ,including children (not necessarily a BLA) to keep it simple .
The time to steal from future generations and thenworking poor in order to subsidize millionairs must come to an end if the society is to survive.
Time for some of these people to turn paper wealth into real wealth that can be taxed and benefit the society overall.

#21 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 4:41 pm

The average retiree earns $61,000

————

That’s for a Seniors Economic FAMILY Garth, more than 1. And in 2019 their MEDIAN After Tax income was:

$64,300

= Non Gov Income $39,600, Gov Handouts $30,000 less CRA $4,800 (StatCan Math, close enough for Gov work)

Seniors (individuals) NOT in an Economic Family MEDIAN After Tax income:

$29,500

= Non Gov Income $12,600, Gov Handouts $19,100 less CRA $900 (ibid)

Senior Family After Tax median income dropped by $300 from 2018 to 2019, $64.8K to $64.3K. Individuals went up by $500 from $29K in 2018 to $29.5K in 2019.

Above the latest I could find from StatCan …
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/210323/t001a-eng.htm

—-

The above jives with 2018 tax year CRA data, filtered for the wrinklies, individual tax filers:
https://twitter.com/bsant54/status/1585003487330385920

Source, CRA p. 15, 2018 tax year, unfiltered.
https://www.canada.ca/content/dam/cra-arc/prog-policy/stats/itstb-sipti/2018/tbl04-en.pdf

PS:

– 76% or about 5 million wrinklies made $46,605 or less in 2018.

– 6.2 million wrinklies, 95% of them, made $93,208 or less. THAT is GROSS INCOME and NOT After-tax.

————————

Susan needs to zip it and count her blessings. More money for her Coffee Klatsch.

Most +65 yrs in deep $ trouble cash flow wise.

Now on the RE Wealth, that’s a different issue but it’s falling fast enough so that RE wealth —> cash is in the process of being tapped out thanks to high rates.

#22 Richard L on 10.25.22 at 4:42 pm

It is financially imprudent and morally wrong to borrow money to enrich boomers who will not have to pay it back.

I make this argument to my millennial daughter she disagrees and says it is a good thing. Oh well.

#23 Robert B on 10.25.22 at 4:43 pm

Heres a start…..

ONTARIO HIKES NON-RESIDENT HOUSING SPECULATION TAX

Ontario is further tightening the screws on non-resident real estate speculators, announcing it will increase the tax rate on those buyers to 25 per cent from 20 per cent, effective today. The move comes as housing affordability hits crisis levels, though research generally suggests that action targeting non-resident speculators only impacts the province’s housing market at the margins. Ontario had previously increased the speculation tax rate to 20 per cent from 15 per cent back in March.

#24 Shawn on 10.25.22 at 4:43 pm

Retirress make HOW much?

The average retiree earns $61,000, of which about $20,000 comes from the public purse (OAS and CPP).

****************************
Can that be right? So $122,000 average for a couple? Should read more like $31,000?

Retirees make the equivalent of $30.50 per hour based on if they worked a full 2000 hours a year (50 weeks at 40 hours)?? $10.00 of that from CPP and OAS???

This sounds high.

And OAS and CPP are fully indexed to official CPI.

Young people are indeed getting shafted.

And most of this group complains endlessly.

#25 Brett in Calgary on 10.25.22 at 4:44 pm

At Alberta Health Services (AHS) there is currently a battle for bodies. Contrary to popular belief most IT, and support staff are non-unionized at AHS which is fine by me (I am one). But the time is nigh, and the unions are a-comin’ looking for recruits because someone has to
pay it forward…

#26 ElGatoNeroYVR on 10.25.22 at 4:46 pm

#6 GINO on 10.25.22 at 4:15 pm
He,he good one. Bonus points for being funny.

#27 habitt on 10.25.22 at 4:47 pm

130K before oas clawback. Too funny. Lower it to say
30 K. If you earn 20K from cpp oas you’re getting the max. With the real wage gains of average working people being so pitiful for so long it’ll be three generations in the house again. Voila no more housing crises. LOL. Plenty of folk worked their whole life in lower paying jobs with little benefits. Some certainly could have done better to improve their lot. Fact is those jobs needed to be done. Limited resources should be allocated to those truly in need. That’s civilized. Let’s get over this universal program BS. Got a friend who is Mayor of a small village in cottage country. Both he and wife had good careers. One in banking the other office worker at community college. Both retired. The lady fell and damaged a knee. She still gets around fine but applied for and received 2K disability tax credit. So in order get it one needs taxable income! They don’t need it. Now if you are on a 23K income from cpp oas and gis you have no taxble income so no credit! I pity those in the bottom 30 percent when they retire. They will eat dog food. The poor are always the easiest to trample on. Let them eat cake eh

#28 Shawn on 10.25.22 at 4:49 pm

Getting your old age pension fully clawed back:

It’s a badge of honour. A sign of accomplishment. Something I aspire to.

Many investors will achieve that once they start withdrawing from RRSPs. And that’s a good thing.

A feature, not a bug.

#29 Robert B on 10.25.22 at 4:50 pm

Now only if a Prime Minister can allow pipelines to be built to the west coast then you would not have to raise taxes….
Canada has a plethora of oil and natural gas…..have corporation pay the carbon tax and get on with it.

Green doesnt work….not enough copper and not enough Lithium to make the transition to electric…

#30 Reality Check on 10.25.22 at 4:54 pm

There is one important point about OAS, it is fully taxable. This means it is not $108 billion in the future, it is more like $80 to $83 billion a year by 2030. Also, I am sick and tired of governments always saying I am the problem. What is never pointed out is all the taxes after 40 to 50 years paying to all governments the amount of taxes probably $500,000 to $1,000,000 per taxpayer on average. This does not include the interest accumulating on that total taxes, so really $1,000,000 to $1,250,000 with interest. Just the interest alone is $50,000 to $62,500 a year each old taxpayer is losing due to all the taxes paid. Even if it was half that, $25,000 to $37,500 a year lost interest and hundreds of thousands of dollars not in their pocket in their retirement years.

#31 Reality Check on 10.25.22 at 4:54 pm

For Gen X and Millennials blame boomers for the fiscal irresponsibility of the liberals is a bit rich.

After all it was Gen X and millennials that were the main recipients of the hundreds of billions of individual and business subsidies paid out during covid. And then they re-elected the Liberals.

Ultimately you get the government you deserve.

#32 Linda on 10.25.22 at 4:54 pm

Holy doodle. Just looked at the OAS cutoff & it is over $81K NET as of 2022 before any clawback occurs. No wonder pretty much everyone gets the full amount whether they need it or not.

But that is the issue. An awful lot of Canadians have inadequate or no retirement savings whatsoever. No employer pension of any sort in addition to CPP or a TFSA or RRSP, let alone $ in a B&D portfolio to provide a decent standard of living in their ‘golden years’. Given very few qualify for full CPP & most start it by age 60, which means whatever they are entitled to get is reduced by 36% anyone trying to survive on ‘just’ CPP/OAS is almost certainly going to qualify for the GIS benefit too. There is a reason why the homeless shelters are seeing increases in residents over age 65 & it isn’t because those old folks want to reside there.

As for corporate pensions, be they DB, DC, a hybrid of the two types or some sort of RRSP top up have to say the track record doesn’t lead one to presume they can be depended upon with the sole exception of the RRSP deal & even that can be a tad iffy when it comes to ROI. Sears, Nortel, the big 3 auto manufacturers, Air Canada, Stelco etc. have shown that just because the employer offers a pension plan doesn’t guarantee said plan will be viable & paying out come the day the contributors retire. And as many unhappy retirees have learned, those promised benefits can be reduced or even ended if the former employer enters bankruptcy proceedings.

So what is the solution to inadequate retirement income as well as increasing taxpayer cost to provide for an aging population? The only thing I see that would work is to substantially increase CPP to the point where benefits equal those offered by the much envied DB plans ‘enjoyed’ by government employees. This would of course mean a much higher CPP premium being deducted from salaries, as well as much higher costs to employers. But: this would replace the need to provide OAS or GIS. Employers who formerly offered workplace plans would pay into CPP as they do now, but not need to deal with the issues of funding a separate workplace pension plan. Employees would no longer need worry their employers financial issues would lead to shortfalls, pension ‘holidays’ or even the complete loss of all deductions into said workplace pension plan late in their working careers. Those with the means/discipline could still build up additional sources of income via a portfolio/savings. Not sure whether RRSP’s & TFSA’s would continue to be a thing – the point of having them in the first place was to allow Canadians who didn’t have a workplace pension plan the means to provide for their old age – but no doubt some sort of deal could be reached where those vehicles continue to exist but without the income tax deferrals or tax free status that those programs currently enjoy.

Would it be a massive change in how things are done? Yes. Would folks scream bloody murder at seeing their CPP deduction jump from $3K per annum to $9K per annum? You bet! You get what you pay for, folks. Or we can just continue to kick that tax can down the road until it explodes. Tick, tick!

#33 Amok on 10.25.22 at 4:54 pm

People will have less children. Boomers will die off in droves, and the global population will naturally decline. Drought, depletion of fish stocks, polluted rivers, and collapse of key ecosystems will ensure that humans are cut back. It’s so blatantly obvious that there are too many people using too many resources. Economic exponential growth is insane, and anyone who think humans can keep multiplying past 10 billion is delusional.
Enjoy you life. Eat good food. Don’t have kids.

#34 Roofer on 10.25.22 at 4:58 pm

Dear Susan,

You seem to be completely oblivious to the fact that Canada has stepped into the boundaries of communism and venturing deeper by the day. Is it really vote buying or is the transitional phase?

Best Regards,
Roofer

#35 Bill zufelt on 10.25.22 at 5:04 pm

Living in a million dollar home and receiving $685 month CPP is messed up but quite a few are also getting the GIS(guaranteed income supplement)—now that is a real mess.

#36 Renna on 10.25.22 at 5:04 pm

The personal amount that everyone can use yearly for their income taxes is at least $5,000 understated for years during the Chretien, Martin Federal Liberal years and inflation being calculated way less than it used to be calculated. This is a savings to the Federal government of $750 per year per taxpayer. This does not include bracket creep, paying higher income taxes because they are not being fully inflation adjusted every year or at all, Chretien, Martin Liberals years they stated inflation was below 3% for 9 years, this is over 25% lower personal amount just those years. There are many more examples they have chipped away at our incomes by taxing us all Canadians just by not inflation adjusted the real cost of living, inflation for decades.

#37 Dosouth on 10.25.22 at 5:07 pm

I find one statement misleading. Per capita indigenous population receives more funding and grants than all the other groups combined, not cotton tops. Starting with reports from the Fraser institute reference a December a 2013 article. To this year..

“It is projected to rise from about $25 billion in fiscal 2021-22 to about $35.5 billion in 2026-27, an increase of 42 percent in nominal dollars. Indigenous spending continues to rise as a proportion of the federal budget, from 6.1 percent in 2019-20 to 7.7 percent in 2026-27—an increase of 26 percent in seven years.Jun 28, 2022
https://www.fraserinstitute.org › ind…
Indigenous Spending in Budget 2022 | Fraser Institute

#38 Devon on 10.25.22 at 5:13 pm

The Liberals, NDP will start a new thing called an RRSP, RRIF tax bracket or RRSP, RRIF income tax threshold. It is just for RRSPs only. Every $10,000 RRSP more you withdraw you pay a 5% higher income tax rate. They will get you at 55% to 60% after you take all your money out.

Will. Never. Happen. – Garth

#39 Uncle Cedit Card on 10.25.22 at 5:15 pm

If there was a uncle who took credit cards out in the name of his nephews and nieces and then charged for his dental work, services and living amenities, we would be outraged at him. In parallel, if we vote for programs future generations have to pay for we get to be outraged at anyone who questions such liberal spending, or so it seems…. If you thought the Boomer Millenial relationship was bad, hold onto your hat. Future generations will be seething looking at the bills we will leave them.

#40 The General on 10.25.22 at 5:17 pm

I remember an old farmer who passed on in my neighborhood. His family discovered a thick stack of pension cheques in his house. None were cashed. He had an outhouse, and no debt. I salute him. Another neighbor had the original belt for his 1947 auger. Canadians are slaves on conveyer belts of debt. We’ve lost our way, in my opinion.

#41 Tanya on 10.25.22 at 5:21 pm

What about the amount of government pensions costing per year. This is probably alot too. I think the federal government should just pay a lump sum now with interest rates much higher so their present values are currently much lower compared to 2 years ago. The TFSA should of never been lowered from $10,000. Actually, it should be more encouraged and be $12,000 by now.

Government OAS and CPP is a joke anyway. You should top up RRSPs, TFSAs each year and just keep piling up money you would be way better off in 40, 50 years, millions in those things if you do it with discipline and smarts.

#42 Nonplused on 10.25.22 at 5:23 pm

Here is a good rant from one of Canada’s more famous Millennials. They aren’t all lefties.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS0_uIOFHVM&ab_channel=LaurenSouthern

This is gold, even if you don’t like some of her other stuff.

My favorite quote: “But the sad part is when I talk to people, especially young people, there not like “OMG a disaster is coming I’m terrified!” It’s like “finally, I’m going to be able to buy a house.” …..I cannot emphasis enough how f’ed up your civilization has to be for your young people to see the only opportunity for them to be in the collapse of your civilization.”

That bit starts about 10:26 but the whole video is golden.

#43 Sockeyemoon on 10.25.22 at 5:26 pm

Somehow, the house wealth has to become an income source – so you have the HELOC adds, deferred property taxes etc.

What’s next?

Somehow, sooner or later, these houses will be listed for sale. And who’s gonna buy?

#44 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 5:27 pm

#4 It’s Boomers stupid!

Says the Non-Boomer.

———–

By in large, it is CLEAR that the ≤ 35 yrs crowd make diddly squat Gross Income, 77% make $46.6K or less.

https://twitter.com/bsant54/status/1585016365936955394

with not even 2 nickels to rub together in terms of Wealth, $49K net worth, yet miraculously and by divine intervention have $350K worth of RE, left table.

https://twitter.com/bsant54/status/1585014284614242305

I have to wonder where that MANNA from HEAVEN came from?

Oh … look, STUPID Boomers mortgaging themselves so that JUNIOR(s) can have the LIFE THEY BELIEVE THEY SO RICHLY DESERVE, right table above.

See Mortgages Principal and Other if left in doubt.

Funny thing, where did Junior get $168K of PLAY MONEY for “Other Mortgage” a.k.a., Speculative RE?

[Hint: see Boomer right table above]

———–

Will Rogers

“All I know is just what I read in the papers, and that’s an alibi for my ignorance.”

——————

Median numbers more indicative as Average skewed by high income earners etc. Wealth source, Notes and if you want slice & dice for a different age group be my guest …

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1110001601

Taxable income source in my prior Comment.

#45 Adam on 10.25.22 at 5:33 pm

“And it’s why you need to top up your RRSP, TFSA, RESP, RRIF and DC pension plan. There’s tax storm coming.”

———

Okay I feel like an idiot here, but if tax rates are only going to go up and a tax storm is coming, wouldn’t it make sense to convert registered funds into cash, instead of the other way around? Go easy on me.

How is cash going to finance your future? – Garth

#46 Charia on 10.25.22 at 5:33 pm

What if they start taxing annual increased values of capital gains in RRSPs, RESPs, RRIFs, TFSAs, non-registered every account. They would say it is not an annual wealth tax but an annual capital gains tax. Knowing tax laws, if there is a capital loss any year, it is not applicable and you can not get a tax refund.

I would not be surprised if they get rid of interest expenses as being a deduction and now you can only get a non-refundable tax credit means you only save 15% tax versus 50% to 56% depending on province you reside maximum today.

Who knows, they might even start taxing TFSAs each year. They can simply charge an annual tax of say $1,000 a year per TFSA account. They are a bunch of scoundrels.

Tax shelters will not be taxed. Give it up. – Garth

#47 American Rental House Owner on 10.25.22 at 5:36 pm

Canadians are dumbest when around a local realtor.
Get on zillow or redfin and buy your cheap American rentals direct. Have them bring in American rent dollars for the rest of your life. Wake up and smell the coffee.

#48 Ponnaps on 10.25.22 at 5:40 pm

Or rather delay your top ups until the tax storm is within viewing distance..

#49 Anna on 10.25.22 at 5:41 pm

Since the federal government and all governments keep growing alot, really alot. I think they should pay more of the freight. Each government employee has 2 choices, pay $4,000 each more in taxes each year than they do today or get no OAS at 65 or whatever age the future they are eligible.

They can afford it as they get job security, many benefits very generous pensions, benefits from sick days to dental, life insurance, disability insurance, dental. paid fully funeral at death etc. It is about time they make the sacrifice for Canada and for Canadians.

#50 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 5:42 pm

#42 Nonplused

2022 Langley BC version of 1847 Evangeline, A Tale of Acadie.

She needs to start subscribing to StatCan The Daily.

I liked it that she provided her Bitcoin Wallet: 1JLM6GJwaPdNv4dM8K5KkcFHeziXXXMGKT

From her Instagram account it appears she has not found her lost love Gabriel in the forest.

Gabriel seen running as fast as he can thru the forest and beyond after viewing this video and image of 2022 Evangeline (Langley Lauren) …

https://www.instagram.com/p/CiGs-2pvLJW/
https://www.instagram.com/p/CdbwthpPM98/

Times have changed, THAT’S for sure.

#51 Get the numbers right on 10.25.22 at 5:43 pm

GT said “Now, in order to get the full OAS your income must be south of $130,000. ”
Actually to get any OAS at all your income has to be south of $130,000, above $81000 you begin losing it
To get full OAS your income has to be south of $81,000 as Linda said.

OAS Income Year 2022
Min. Income $81,761 ie clawback begins
Max. Income$133,141 ie OAS has reached zero

#52 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 5:45 pm

#17 Ustabe on 10.25.22 at 4:33 pm
Story Time. Been a long time but here we go, mostly for Fartz.

We broke our long term road trip/camping vehicle this summer. In Dawson City. Badly. That is a complete other story. For now, suffice it to say BCAA doesn’t offer towing from Yukon back down to Vancouver Island. Wasn’t a mechanic available in either Dawson or Whitehorse, the economic activity up there is unbelievable.

So we and the vehicle make it home only to discover the repair needed is well north of the vehicle’s worth.

So we buy a new to us vehicle. This is a $50,000+ unit new. Its a couple of years old, 40,000 kms.

ICBC runner compares, cheaper to go all ICBC, full coverage, liability, collision, comp, uninsured, Roadside.

The whole enchilada. We pay these things in full but if we were to go monthly our full coverage via ICBC would have been $95/month or $1140 for the year. We paid less as we didn’t finance the premium.

So, tell me how bad ICBC is again.
———-

My truck was 47K new, I pay 650.00/yr full coverage, 2 Mil liability. That’s in Ontario. 19 year old vehicle though. Sorry to hear of your beloved Nissan’s passing. It was the trans right?

#53 Leftover on 10.25.22 at 5:45 pm

“Our goal in beating the deficit is not simply to make the bond market feel better. Our goal is to be in a position to tell the bond market to get lost.”

Paul Martin, February 1995

It was quite a budget. Federal debt was 67% of GDP (today it’s 65%) and IMF intervention was on the table. Cuts weren’t debatable, they were the only option.

But Chrystia Freeland is not Paul Martin. Bill Mourneau, the closest thing they had, got clipped. Now it’s not in the Liberals’ wheelhouse to slow anything down, let alone cut it. Political (hapless opposition) and historic (Covid) cover has allowed profligacy to reign unabated.

By Feb 2025, the thirtieth anniversary of Martin’s cathartic budget and, not coincidentally, the eve of our next federal election, the IMF will be too busy cleaning up after Putin and the barbarians will truly be at the gate.

Full circle.

#54 never say never on 10.25.22 at 5:47 pm

Isn’t there $900 billion in RRSPs these days. If I remember correctly, Paul Martin years back was thinking going to tax annually RRSPs. They might revisit this again. The government does it with property taxes on houses, condos, cottages etc.

#55 Happy Gramps on 10.25.22 at 5:48 pm

A 10% increase to my OAS, I’ll take, but I haven’t received any notification as yet.

My income, which is pretty much all CPP and OAS amounts to less than $20,000 per year. My savings are minimal as I lived to spend everything I made in the past.
So any little increase does help me. But giving seniors whose income is up to $130,000 is not right. It should be reduced to approximately $50,000. And, if you have assets overs $500,000 you don’t get any OAS.

It’s time to rethink how we give out this money. It is also time to add a capital gains tax structure on home sales. I have a great formula that I think would work. This will also reduce the cost of housing and increase the availability of rentals.

All we need is a government with balls, which is lacking in pretty much all parties.

#56 Ronaldo on 10.25.22 at 5:57 pm

#6 GINO on 10.25.22 at 4:15 pm
I make $165,000 a year with few tax deductions and have $300,000 in RSP which is growing. I am in my early 40s. I have a bank paid defined pension (the legacy kind). Should I continue contributing to RSP? I’ve also maxed our TFSA FYI. My principle residence is paid off and I have other cash savings/investments and no debts. I will also receive an inheritance in the future. I’m worried if I continue to contribute to RSP it will claw back my OAS.
—————————————————————-
All of that at age 40 and you’re worried about a clawback to your old age pension 20 years down the road. You can’t be serious. LOL Nice try though. I needed a good laugh.

#57 JSS on 10.25.22 at 6:01 pm

#25 Brett in Calgary on 10.25.22 at 4:44 pm
At Alberta Health Services (AHS) there is currently a battle for bodies. Contrary to popular belief most IT, and support staff are non-unionized at AHS which is fine by me (I am one). But the time is nigh, and the unions are a-comin’ looking for recruits because someone has to
pay it forward…

—-
In the public sector, it’s the unionized salaries that are going up. For people like you who are non-unionized, your salaries will sit stagnant for years and years. You have no collective bargaining contract which provides you of annual raises.

#58 Anthony on 10.25.22 at 6:03 pm

My wife and I used to be able to use our annual RRSP administration fee as a deduction but now we can not. This is costing us $140 a year in new taxes plus $39 HST per year we pay on them. Also, we can not deduct our RRSP transfer fees which probably cost us another $300 in taxes in the last 20 years or so. They may seem small but I can see the government imposing new or higher taxes on RRSPs, RRIFs any other tax shelter in the future.

They also reduced the severance annual amounts that can be put in an RRSP which cost us at least $3,000 in higher income tax rates.

#59 Ustabe on 10.25.22 at 6:04 pm

My truck was 47K new, I pay 650.00/yr full coverage, 2 Mil liability. That’s in Ontario. 19 year old vehicle though. Sorry to hear of your beloved Nissan’s passing. It was the trans right?

This new unit will be cheaper when it hits 19 years old. We only made it to 17 with the X Trail. Just too many years of asking the 2.5 cyl, I4 to do too much.

Second head gasket, last one just shy of ten years ago. Not this time, they wholesale now for under $3,000

We went for HP, torque, interior space and heated seats this time. Leather heated seats.

#60 Midnight’s on 10.25.22 at 6:06 pm

Dougie is going to allow three units on one property in Ontario.

Oh boy.

No my boy, that’s the smell of MONEY!!

#61 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 6:07 pm

75 bps minimum tomorrow.

If it were left up to me, it would be North of 200 bps, well North.

As anyone can see, Cdns have really, really cut back on Consumer Spending due to the current, as they will tell you, because of the ONEROUS BoC rate (sarcasm):

https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/consumer-spending

LYING sacks of horse manure.

In fact, spending or DEMAND picked up a notch in July. Unless, miracle of miracles, BoC has current data to the end of 3rd Qtr that shows a DROP in DEMAND then

75 bps

minimum.

————————-

Garth, the rate increases to date are NOT WORKING. That’s 60% of the economy. Demand increasing a lot since 2021, UNABATED.

If BoC wants to get serious about stomping out inflation, the rate has to be as history has shown to work well:

1.5 to 2x

the inflation rate or 10.4% to 13.8%.

Cdns LYING thru their teeth about how hard done by they are and have NOT missed a beat in spending, it has gone up at a brisk rate.

BoC with these anemic rate increases will repeat the same error of not raising rates high and fast enough.

Mark my words.

#62 Fred Hache on 10.25.22 at 6:09 pm

A thought-provoking piece. While it emphasizes OAS, the issue is the cost of the welfare state social safety net vis-à-vis the tax base. Policy debates never seem to include how an expansion of the social safety net will be funded. It is always a chicken in every pot. Retirement as currently thought off is a relatively new concept – post WWII. Before then you worked until you could not physically continue and died a few years later. Back when OAS stated, those that made it to 70, did not collect it for very long on average. Harper had a plan to extend the eligibility date for OAS. Socks nixed it.

#63 West New West on 10.25.22 at 6:12 pm

In the 90’s I was in my 20’s. There were many challenges then as there are now…..but we just put our heads down and worked hard and hoped for the best. Sometimes we won and other times we lost. We played the hand we got dealt. Not once did it ever occur to us to blame older people for what frustrated us. Opportunities are there now as they were then.

#64 Tron on 10.25.22 at 6:13 pm

Hi Garth. As usual thought provoking post!
Though I disagree with the reader that such programs should be means-tested. You are right to note that the issue is programs without appropriate taxation (for legitimate social programs – not liberal profligacy).

One route is to means-test and maintain a conservative (small-c) tax regime. The other is to encourage universal programs but institute a more progressive tax-regime (i.e. the scandinavian model).

The advantage of the latter is that it is easier to maintain social support for programs because they are universal.

So I would agree taxes are too low for the number of programs AND the Libs as usual are making a mockery of social democracy by creating ad hoc vote buying programs. But the answer isn’t necessarily to means-test as your reader suggests. We could tax away the benefit for those with higher incomes and wealth but maintain the universality of the programs.

Of course this doesn’t apply if the libs just use the government coffers to buy votes.

Thanks for the great post. Keep it up please!

Your fan on the Left. Tron.

#65 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 6:14 pm

#42 Nonplused on 10.25.22 at 5:23 pm
Here is a good rant from one of Canada’s more famous Millennials. They aren’t all lefties.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS0_uIOFHVM&ab_channel=LaurenSouthern

This is gold, even if you don’t like some of her other stuff.

My favorite quote: “But the sad part is when I talk to people, especially young people, there not like “OMG a disaster is coming I’m terrified!” It’s like “finally, I’m going to be able to buy a house.” …..I cannot emphasis enough how f’ed up your civilization has to be for your young people to see the only opportunity for them to be in the collapse of your civilization.”

That bit starts about 10:26 but the whole video is golden.
————-

I like that quote she mentioned too, I’m always an optimist for my own prospects. Two thumbs up for the hat.

#66 baloney Sandwitch on 10.25.22 at 6:15 pm

Jag Singh has written a letter to the PM complaining about BoC rate hikes. He says they are unnecessary.

The solution to OAS is to eliminate it and replace it with UBI (OAS for all) and a flat tax for everyone from 10K to 130K.

Re: stock – today’s action confirmed that the double-bottom on the S&P I wrote about yesterday is the real camel toe. Thanks to #49 yesterday for the url – it made me chuckle.

#67 Blobby on 10.25.22 at 6:19 pm

Heard on radio – NDP is demanding that CB stop raising rates, and want the government to get involved.

Yeah – that’s sensible.. Im sure the inflation that will result (and the resulting CAD value drop) would REALLY help people.

(sigh)

#68 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 6:20 pm

I’ll tell you something Garth, it is disheartening to the see the Big 5 Cdn Banks floundering YTD:

https://www.google.com/finance/quote/BNS:TSE?comparison=TSE%3ATD%2CTSE%3ACM%2CTSE%3ARY%2CTSE%3ABMO&window=YTD

My Cdn ETF goes up and down with their performance. This is their 4th? attempt at getting back to 0% YTD.

I hope they make it.

My other ETFs based on yeah oil are doing just that. Hopefully the Banks and the Financials will get themselves out of the funk they so far this year.

Mr. Market is saying future earnings for Financials not looking good. Will get worse as rates go up, future earnings will be discounted even more.

—————–

Investor me says keep rates low per the above, human compassion me says raise them so Johnny Canuck can be rid of high inflation and get on with affording their lives.

I do not envy BoC, not a single bit. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

#69 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 6:21 pm

#55 Happy Gramps

I like your thinking on the caps.

Born out by the CRA Gross Income thresholds and Median Wealth Stats.

Well thought out indeed.

Ways and Means. All for it.

#70 Fragrant Cookie on 10.25.22 at 6:28 pm

I think the 130k cut off is rather high for OAS. If your income is 130k, the after-tax cash is $7,755 per month. A couple of retirees will live very comfortably at this level even in Vancouver/Toronto (no mortgage, no personal debt). They will barely bat an eye at the $600-700 of OAS per month, that’s just a cherry on top. The government should be giving people bread (for survival and dignity), not party favours for people who can afford to cruise around the world couple times a year.

#71 Robert on 10.25.22 at 6:31 pm

Do not agree with this blog at all,

#72 Old Boot on 10.25.22 at 6:31 pm

Sounds like some form of CERB will be making a comeback if the expected recession results in significant job losses.

And it probably should. I was shocked by this statistic:

“Research shows that the percentage of unemployed Canadians who received EI benefits has dropped from 83 per cent in 1990 to 38 per cent in 2019.”

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/chrystia-freeland-recession-employment-insurance-wherry-1.6628774

Looks like CERB was not such a bad response to the pandemic job losses. A significant majority of affected workers likely wouldn’t have even qualified for EI.

——————

Does the likelihood of higher taxes in future mean that maybe some of us should consider melting our RRSPs while delaying CPP/OAS?

Or does that only work for those who have fewer non-contributory years to CPP? Early retirement definitely blows a hole in one’s anticipated CPP amount.

#73 tbone on 10.25.22 at 6:38 pm

I worked 44 years full time and paid lots of tax , so i think i earned my OAS. Dont need it but im not sending it back.

You paid ziltch into OAS. – Garth

#74 Shawn on 10.25.22 at 6:41 pm

Linda at 32 said:

Sears, Nortel, the big 3 auto manufacturers, Air Canada, Stelco etc. have shown that just because the employer offers a pension plan doesn’t guarantee said plan will be viable & paying out come the day the contributors retire.

************************************
Nortel and I think Stelco are fair points. Nortel pensioners definitely got a hair cut. I don’t know for sure with Stelco.

Air Canada I almost 100% sure got no haircut. In an affront to nrmal bankruptcy rules the pension liabilities went on as Air Canada emereged from bankruptcy. The new Air Canada is still paying all those pensions.

Only 2 of the big 3 went bust. Ford never did. Again, the pensioners and pension plans were protected and the new companies that emerged out of bankruptcy of GM and Chrysler are paying those old pensions fully. I am almost certain. I think this was part of the government deal when they were (sort of) bailed out. Shareholders of AirCanada and GM and Chrysler got maybe a penny on the dollar if that. Debt holders also got very little.

Getting a haircut on a DB pension happens but is fairly rare as far as I understand it.

I tend to agree with you that CPP should be enhanced and in fact it is happening slowly at this time.

#75 Tony on 10.25.22 at 6:45 pm

Virtually no one I know makes under $130,000 a year so they get zilch every year. All of them are 65 or older. Some worked two jobs so they end up with nothing. Canada caters to the poor and married couples with children.

#76 Søren Angst on 10.25.22 at 6:46 pm

#28 Shawn

Getting your old age pension fully clawed back … Something I aspire to.

——————

You will have made into the Top 3% of the +65 yrs crowd ($93K to $144K tax bracket – 177K souls in all), probably less than 3% at the $130K clawback threshold. My bracket, not fully clawed back this year but will probably be by next year.

Hope you make it and that’s the Spirit.

And on that note, you can have your AB Passport back.

#77 Don Guillermo on 10.25.22 at 6:54 pm

#13 John on 10.25.22 at 4:23 pm
More government handouts. Old people don’t want to work anymore. Rather sit around and live on government handouts.

#######

Hahaha, good one John. I’m one of those old people that just want to NWFH.

#78 Blobby on 10.25.22 at 7:01 pm

“Tax shelters will not be taxed. Give it up. – Garth”

Never say never.. Who knows what will happen if someone as clueless as PP gets put in charge :D

#79 habitt on 10.25.22 at 7:04 pm

#32 Linda. That was awesome. Thank you. Lots of good comments today. Thanks all.

#80 PBrasseur on 10.25.22 at 7:06 pm

Poverty is what’s in store for many older Canadians, up to a third of them.

A disaster and a shame!

But at least they got free access to our imploding health care system.

#81 Marty on 10.25.22 at 7:12 pm

tbone, I agree with you. They set up OAS to say it is a gift from the government but is funded by general taxes, revenues. Someone that paid taxes and worked full time for 44 years paid for OAS, healthcare, roads, police, emergency services, many other government costs, expenses, wasteful programs and bloated bureaucracies. You paid alot of taxes and still do i bet.

When there is a deficit taxes do not cover spending. – Garth

#82 DON on 10.25.22 at 7:13 pm

#52 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 5:45 pm
#17 Ustabe on 10.25.22 at 4:33 pm
Story Time. Been a long time but here we go, mostly for Fartz.

We broke our long term road trip/camping vehicle this summer. In Dawson City. Badly. That is a complete other story. For now, suffice it to say BCAA doesn’t offer towing from Yukon back down to Vancouver Island. Wasn’t a mechanic available in either Dawson or Whitehorse, the economic activity up there is unbelievable.

So we and the vehicle make it home only to discover the repair needed is well north of the vehicle’s worth.

So we buy a new to us vehicle. This is a $50,000+ unit new. Its a couple of years old, 40,000 kms.

ICBC runner compares, cheaper to go all ICBC, full coverage, liability, collision, comp, uninsured, Roadside.

The whole enchilada. We pay these things in full but if we were to go monthly our full coverage via ICBC would have been $95/month or $1140 for the year. We paid less as we didn’t finance the premium.

So, tell me how bad ICBC is again.
———-

My truck was 47K new, I pay 650.00/yr full coverage, 2 Mil liability. That’s in Ontario. 19 year old vehicle though. Sorry to hear of your beloved Nissan’s passing. It was the trans right?

******
I pay just under $700 for the 95 gmc 4×4. That was a nice surprise from ICBC. Newer cars not so lucky. Two more years and I can apply for collectors insurance for the once in a while driver.

#83 Bezengy on 10.25.22 at 7:13 pm

We haven’t even gotten to the stage where we can admit we have a spending problem.

See comments from Ryan’s Oct 8 blog entry. I believe the word is hopeless.

#84 Fred on 10.25.22 at 7:18 pm

Blobby, most taxes and massive tax increases in Canadian history are done by Liberals, NDP, Green Party a socialist party in disguise of the environment if the have they chance. This is fact, 150 years plus of history the tax, debt, spend parties are Libs, NSP etc. PP as you are referring to will not save your government job or family’s government job as they must cut, cut, cut unlike JT is a former drama teacher that could not even keep his class in check let alone the country of Canada.

#85 Harvey on 10.25.22 at 7:22 pm

Don’t send me more OAS….You know that I’ll just buy more silver ? Where am I supposed to store all this stuff ?

#86 WTF on 10.25.22 at 7:38 pm

Well if anyone is feeling benevolent and wants to compete with Wonder Boy and his financial blunderbuss.

92 Yr old Momsie just got an insert from CPP with a pamphlet and application to contribute a portion of her CPP to the United Way and they will do their best to spend it on her behalf. Not sure I would want the United

#87 Airfix on 10.25.22 at 7:40 pm

#55 Happy Gramps on 10.25.22 at 5:48 pm

And you probably collect GIS too?

Easy for you to make suggestions when they wouldn’t affect you, by your own admission you’ve worked a lifetime and have almost nothing financially to show for it.
Those of us that have paid medium to high taxes all our lives but still managed to put some away for retirement should not be penalized for being prepared.
The limit exists already but it certainly should not be reduced to 50K.
Also lots of seniors with assets over 500K,, barely buys a small condo in the GTA or BC LM. They still need to eat, just like you.

Do you own a home?
If not it’s easy to suggest taxing the sale.

#88 Tedfifty on 10.25.22 at 7:40 pm

in order to get the full OAS your income must be south of $78,000 gross earnings after which it is clawed back up to $0 by $130,000 gross. Different than what you posted

#89 WTF on 10.25.22 at 7:41 pm

way handling my donation $ but so very kind of them to offer. Momsie declined their offer, she needs it to cover half of the cost of her assisted living.

#90 Tony on 10.25.22 at 8:02 pm

You have to put a lot of your money into something that doesn’t produce income to avoid the clawback. They hit the grossed up amount of Canadian dividends so beware if you’re in a clawback situation.

#91 Quintilian on 10.25.22 at 8:05 pm

Garth has alway advised not sell into a storm.

However, most people panic and do sell.

So the wealth transfer from the relative poor to the relative affluent continues as always.

Some of it must have been from curmudgeons who had been investing/ gambling with their retirement nest egg.

#92 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 8:05 pm

#59 Ustabe on 10.25.22 at 6:04 pm

This new unit will be cheaper when it hits 19 years old. We only made it to 17 with the X Trail. Just too many years of asking the 2.5 cyl, I4 to do too much.

Second head gasket, last one just shy of ten years ago. Not this time, they wholesale now for under $3,000

We went for HP, torque, interior space and heated seats this time. Leather heated seats.
——

Yeah head gaskets are a tough one. Had a Jeep that blew one. Pulled the head, had it milled, new gasket and bolts, did the post heat cycle re-torque too – didn’t last. I think the block deck might have warped too, plus the more material you mill off the head, the more likely you’ll blow another one. Still, the X-trail likely didn’t owe you much after 17 years, best quit while you’re ahead.

There is something to be said for a burly engine and a pile of torque. The 496” V8 in my 2500 was born in the 60’s, all iron, and refined over a 40 production run. It uses a lot of gas… You might not like your new ride’s mileage, but a 3K repair you never had, buys a lot of gas! Plus heated leather and a big cargo hatch never gets old.

#93 Regjeg on 10.25.22 at 8:12 pm

Rate on my RBC HELOC is 5.45%. That’s less than 1/2 the rate quoted by Travis last week on his TD LOC.

Wait for your letter. – Garth

#94 the Jaguar on 10.25.22 at 8:15 pm

Olaf. Pure joy, exuberance, enthusiam and beauty all captured in one photograph. The legend of Lord Byron’s “Botswain” lives on. His expression says ” I am ‘King of the World’!Thank you for giving him a beautiful life. Take care of ice crystals that sometimes form between a dog’s toes as they romp about in the snow. The heat of their paws thaws the snow to hard pellets and they can be painful if they break the delicate web skin between their toes…

As for OAS rollbacks, good luck rolling that back. Just establish a reasonable threshold, but that should also be applied to baby bonus (three kids max regardless of your religious beliefs), and, say…maybe we should open up the whole discussion to who gets free dental care, free education at post secondary level, etc. Let’s go ‘whole hog’ on this equality of opportunity thing free from the usual identity politics. ( Crickets)…..

Never mind. The real news is Wednesday’s rate increase. At some point creeping socialism and Modern Monetary Theory spending baffelgab just can’t counter inflation caused by artificially low interest rates. While many benefited from the associated asset bubbles it created, the party is offically over.

Tiffster, proceed to the ‘on deck batter’ box’. Jerome is up next where he will secure his legacy as the head of the US Central Bank who refused to sell his soul, but preferred to follow his conscience like Atticus Finch. We need a Grand Slam to keep all animals on the Arc safe. Amen.

#95 rikk on 10.25.22 at 8:19 pm

You paid zilch into OAS. – Garth

So where does OAS come from if not from “tax”?

Lately, from deficit financing. The point was simple – unlike CPP, no premiums are collected to finance it. This is just old people’s welfare. – Garth

#96 crossbordershopper on 10.25.22 at 8:20 pm

ive been saying this all the time. There are many people who structure there affairs by having paid off houses, max tfsa and never had pension plan. They max out govt benefits at 65, but are in no way considered poor.
i think it was a mistake to give the 75 year olds more, it has no basis of anything, old people barely buy anything, i know some that rarely even leave there home. My 95 year old uncle in Guelph and his 91 year old wife never leave there house. everything is brought to them and looked after by there children. I hope that society changes more than discussions about 685 cheques to old people. If families worked together more, than there would be dignity in old age, not what i see, which is generally poor alone seniors whith no family around. It is very very common to have a sad life in your last 10 years of life in Canada unless you have family around. the govt has replaced families and they think money is the answer, its actually the problem, dont give money to be poor and alone, give them nothing, and force them to live with there children and maintain the family unit. Money will be recycled through the generations, but trust me having your grandmother with you when you are a kid, creates a foundation in your mind that they day will come when i sit in her chair. I hope that happens.

#97 the Jaguar on 10.25.22 at 8:25 pm

Crap. ‘animals on the Arc ‘ meant to be ARK.

#98 TurnerNation on 10.25.22 at 8:31 pm

Obscene nation debt? Well the Internet Consp. Theorists always said that the (former) First World Countries will be brought to their knees this way. What do they know.

———
Didn’t have to room to post this yesterday but — Elections: Toronto’s mayor, and Ontario’s premier (as with QC’s Prem) will be re-elected. These guys tow the line, the Lockdown crew. Globalist pets. There’s still more to be rolled out.

GTA/Toronto and select other cities are to become MEGA UN Smart Cities. Crowded and fetid.

Let me offer some Facts.
The other month in ON, Doug the Slug changed the laws, giving local mayors more power. The first edict? Loosening the development laws natch.

Your first hint that during the 2022-22 Economic & Social lockdowns the one thing not banned was residential condo construction. Get a clue.

Next up:

.Doug Ford to end development fees for homeowners who add rental units (thestar.com)

.Ontario to announce sweeping housing changes allowing up to three units on many residential lots (cp24.com)

The best thing to do now it repeat your Leftist mantras over and over. We need more people. We need more people. We need more people.

#99 Yukon Elvis on 10.25.22 at 8:38 pm

#95 rikk on 10.25.22 at 8:19 pm
You paid zilch into OAS. – Garth

So where does OAS come from if not from “tax”?

Lately, from deficit financing. The point was simple – unlike CPP, no premiums are collected to finance it. This is just old people’s welfare. – Garth
+++++++
When u get re-elected you can cancel the OAS and sleep well at night again.

Perhaps it should just go to those who need it. – Garth

#100 Robert Merton on 10.25.22 at 8:40 pm

“Said Deb Shulte, the Minister of Seniors (that you never heard of):…”

Hardly a statement dignified of someone who’s a member of the King’s Privy Council: Deb Shulte is no longer Minister of Seniors, but you already knew that.

May also explain why no one has heard of her (except me).

Is this indicative of the kind of financial advice you offer to clients as well?

Retract and/or correct.

She was the minister who said those words, in that portfolio, at that moment. Who peed in your tea? – Garth

#101 Neo on 10.25.22 at 8:46 pm

If only our corrupt puppet government held onto petro Canada instead of giving it to for profit corporations with foreign shareholders.

Canada would be flush like Norway.

Who am I kidding. Canadians are idiots

#102 Ronaldo on 10.25.22 at 8:49 pm

#88 Tedfifty on 10.25.22 at 7:40 pm
in order to get the full OAS your income must be south of $78,000 gross earnings after which it is clawed back up to $0 by $130,000 gross. Different than what you posted
————————————————————-
Actually about $3000 more Ted. Here’s the link:

https://www.canada.ca/en/services/benefits/publicpensions/cpp/old-age-security/recovery-tax.html

#103 Wrk.dover on 10.25.22 at 8:51 pm

OAS should begin claw back at peak poverty level reaching all gone at median retired income level.

GIS is a worse curse. In-laws of mine get GIS and GIC rebates, which elevate them to a level similar ours, which has a DBP.

What is the use of contributing to a DBP, if GIS almost will match it if you don’t contribute?

#104 Ronaldo on 10.25.22 at 8:58 pm

#90 Tony on 10.25.22 at 8:02 pm
You have to put a lot of your money into something that doesn’t produce income to avoid the clawback. They hit the grossed up amount of Canadian dividends so beware if you’re in a clawback situation.
—————————————————————–
And that something would be the TFSA for most people at the bottom end of the scale.

#105 Wrk.dover on 10.25.22 at 9:00 pm

Yesterday, Shawn belittled NS for refusing to frack.

Everywhere in NS is within 40km of salt water. There are no Albertan glaciers from which to harvest meltwater to drink.

Aquifiers are tricky things to mess with. Ours are small, and presumed fragile.

Fracking might not have dire consequences under the Tobiatic unpopulated game preserve, but the gas is under Lake Ainsley in CB. If the frack goes wrong, TINA for drinking water.

We have Goldsboro pegged as the LNG terminal, if PQ lets the gas flow through.

PQ allows gas to arrive, but not flow through….

#106 Flop… on 10.25.22 at 9:06 pm

Flop Drops.

“Special Hobbit Style House sitting on 50×120 sqft inner street.”

When I read that, it gave me a headache, probably because at 6 foot 2, I envisioned myself walking around this house banging my head on every bulkhead.

Probably get the bulldozer treatment, or could be site of next year’s Burning Man Festival, dunno.

Things have been a lot slower to come down on the North Shore, Richmond and Burnaby, compared to Vancouver proper.

East Van got ahead of them, correction wise, partly to do with smaller lots, and bigger drug problems on the Downtown Eastside.

Anyway they’re playing catch-up, let’s see what happened with this one on the North Shore.

The details…

1384 Hope Rd, North Vancouver.

Original ask 1.5m

Assessment 1.41

Just sold for 1.2

https://www.zealty.ca/mls-R2718209/1384-HOPE-ROAD-North-Vancouver-BC/

Only time will tell, I thought a similar structure would get bulldozed in Flopville, on King Edward, and a condo development said they would incorporate and protect it if my memory serves correct.

Maybe Elgin Hall needs to self-identify as a Hobbit House?

Not the house for me, perhaps someone more of the Danny DeVito variety of human being…

M48BC

#107 TurnerNation on 10.25.22 at 9:08 pm

The Long Game. The shut downs accomplished many many things.
This is perfect. What the governments wants, dumber and poorer tax slaves only glued to their ‘smart phones’ which are free of ‘mis-information’ and original thought.

.Test scores show historic COVID setbacks for kids across US (cp24.com)

.California Students Have Dismally Low Math and Reading Test Scores (sfgate.com)

—————–

A.I., Automation? No worry two more new industries were just created: ESG and ‘Climate’.
Yes, much busywork to done, other people’s money to be spent, many important titles. Some may even lurk in this comments section.

——————-
I’ll file this under Control over our Breeding. Another facet of recent years accelerated in 2020:

.By 2030, 45% of working women aged 25 to 44 in the United States will be single. That will be the largest share in history, according to research by Morgan Stanley (MS), using data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. (cnn.com)

#108 Terry on 10.25.22 at 9:22 pm

“Should society send people money because they get old?”

Answer – YES!

“Today the old age pogey takes more cash than the child benefit and our armed forces combined.”

Solution – Eliminate the child benefit! Stop paying people to have kids! Secondly, use half of the child benefit cut to further fund our military…….we are going to need it shortly. Take the other half of the child benefit cut and give it to the wrinklies because they have most certainly earned it.

That is all!

P.S. Vote for me if I decide to run for PM.

#109 Robert Merton on 10.25.22 at 9:22 pm

“Said Deb Shulte, the Minister of Seniors (that you never heard of):…”

“She was the minister who said those words, in that portfolio, at that moment. Who peed in your tea? – Garth”

Thanks for setting the record straight, Garth.

You should have either said that the first time, or at least indicate she was the former minister.

Henceforth, we shall all commit to refer to everything you say as “said the Minister of National Revenue…” with the caveat that “it may not have been said in that portfolio, or at that moment he was Minister, but Minister, he was”.

No one peed in my tea, thanks, but the lady doth protest too much, methinks.

#110 rknusa on 10.25.22 at 9:24 pm

re: #35 Bill zufelt on 10.25.22 at 5:04 pm
Living in a million dollar home and receiving $685 month CPP is messed up but quite a few are also getting the GIS(guaranteed income supplement)—now that is a real mess.

and they can be taking out a reverse mortgage and still collect GIS

#111 Robert Ash on 10.25.22 at 9:30 pm

Harper had it correct in the strategy to increase OAS, and CPP eligibility, to the age of 67 to reflect longer life expectancy for North Americans. The Liberals changed this proposed savings for government in order to achieve election in 2015.
There are many comments, that seem to challenge the notion of supporting Seniors in Canada. Many Seniors have not had long term, retirement planning, and there are a lot of folks, who just worked average jobs, but paid taxes, for decades, and need some support, to mange their advanced years.
I would vote to maintain support for folks, who need it, given our Nations advantages. That being said, we do need to engage all Canadians, in a review of the Priorities we need for our Budgeting. I believe we have to review and prioritize our top spending areas, and reduce the less important budgets…. Certainly not an easy objective

#112 Jeff on 10.25.22 at 9:37 pm

Is it fair that ex-MP’s get a pension after 4 years? How about the tax dollars lost through the Panama and Bahama papers?

leave the average Joe alone

No pension after four years. – Garth

#113 Overheardyou on 10.25.22 at 9:47 pm

Perhaps the current PM expects interests rates to drop back to Pandemic levels thereby giving them a longer runway…

#114 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.25.22 at 9:50 pm

Agree.
OAS and GIS should be subject to some need testing.

#115 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 9:55 pm

#82 DON on 10.25.22 at 7:13 pm

I pay just under $700 for the 95 gmc 4×4. That was a nice surprise from ICBC. Newer cars not so lucky. Two more years and I can apply for collectors insurance for the once in a while driver.
——

Old vehicles are pretty sweet on insurance. I had an ‘86 Bronco II a few years back, straight from Arizona. 450.00 per year full coverage. They could get written off over a fender bender though. I think pickups tend to be the cheapest vehicles to insure for private use (they win most accidents).

#116 Steven on 10.25.22 at 10:02 pm

I will be working past 65 anyway. Like what am I going to do sit on a lawn chair and rot?

#117 Quintilian on 10.25.22 at 10:04 pm

As a country we therefore send millionaire property-owners $685 a month so they can survive because of poverty-level incomes. Seems messed up.

And that’s not all; they also, in addition to the unfair Homeowner Grant, they get an additional over 65 Grant, resulting in almost no property tax.

Yes, you curmudgeon love eating your young.

#118 Bobby on 10.25.22 at 10:09 pm

DELETED

#119 Yukon Elvis on 10.25.22 at 10:19 pm

#99 Yukon Elvis on 10.25.22 at 8:38 pm
#95 rikk on 10.25.22 at 8:19 pm
You paid zilch into OAS. – Garth

So where does OAS come from if not from “tax”?

Lately, from deficit financing. The point was simple – unlike CPP, no premiums are collected to finance it. This is just old people’s welfare. – Garth
+++++++
When u get re-elected you can cancel the OAS and sleep well at night again.

Perhaps it should just go to those who need it. – Garth
+++++++++
Yes. Like oldsters who are considered low income in their province of residence. I am more than happy to contribute taxation wise to that.

#120 Truth Hurts Us All on 10.25.22 at 10:19 pm

Seniors could enjoy free winter in Florida if not for Trudeau killing energy revenue in Canada, spending billions on oil and gas development and infrastructure ( and a lot gets stolen) in places like Ghana, Senegal and Pan Africa. Then there’s Trudeau blowing a trillion on himself pandering to his self aggrandizement. If not for Trudeaus incompetance and anti Canada economics the country would have streets paved with gold instead of tearful lineups in food bank parking lots. It all adds up, the bizarre frivolity of Justin calling live to Jimmy Fallon giving away $ 50 million, and the thousand other ways were mystifying and now very painful. Just ask those of us in NFLD whose heating bills got tripled if the OAS is enough.

#121 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 10:23 pm

Us camo-clad bunker dwelling hillbillies retiring on dual RRSP’s, dual TFSA’s, dual CPP’s, dual OAS’s and a DBP – could have a 6 figure household retirement income. Should we be getting free OAS? The way it is now, we will. With the advent of ubiquitous decent dual incomes, the system should change. At least start considering singles and couples differently. Singles are on the rise. It won’t happen though, that kind of change in Canada will see you booted from power at the very next election.

#122 Dr V on 10.25.22 at 10:45 pm

Wow lots of good (and some bad) comments tonight.

Thought I would try to calculate a commuted value for full OAS at age 65 (used $650 per mo as per earlier this year and ignored the increase at 75).

Used 85 as life expectancy (just has to be average as OAP covers so much of the population) with Garth’s historical 7% average and a 3% inflation rate. Used the following calculator which someone else here on the GF had supplied some time ago.

https://financialmentor.com/calculator/best-retirement-calculator

I got very close to $110000. As full CPP at 65 is almost
double OAS say $200000 for that.

Feel free to have some fun and change the inputs.

#123 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 10:47 pm

#116 Quintilian on 10.25.22 at 10:04 pm
As a country we therefore send millionaire property-owners $685 a month so they can survive because of poverty-level incomes. Seems messed up.

And that’s not all; they also, in addition to the unfair Homeowner Grant, they get an additional over 65 Grant, resulting in almost no property tax.

Yes, you curmudgeon love eating your young.
————

Us crusties can’t write policy. We can only vote – just like you.

Who’d you vote for again? In 2022, Trudeau’s power base is the curmudgeon gang. Wanna guess why? I’ll give you 1 attempt, since I’ve been beating this over your head since you showed up here. You should have an idea by now. A sizeable chunk of your generation has got wise since 2015. PP’s power base is young Canadians.

Just a tip for the future – don’t tell your buds that you voted Trudeau.

#124 Ronaldo on 10.25.22 at 10:47 pm

#116 Steven on 10.25.22 at 10:02 pm
I will be working past 65 anyway. Like what am I going to do sit on a lawn chair and rot?
—————————————————————–
If that’s what you think retirement is going to be for you, it is better that you keep on working. Been retired now for 22 years come November. Hiked and climbed many peaks in most of the national parks in BC and Alberta, Ireland, Switzerland and Newfoundland coast, and many other places right here in our back yard on Vancouver Island. And not to forget skiing, bowling, table tennis. There never seems to be enough time for all the things I want to do. And do you know what? The cost is minimal. You don’t have to be a millionaire. I’ve never regretted 1 day since retiring at 54. I wish you all the best.

#125 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.25.22 at 10:51 pm

“The nation has gathered more new debt in the space of one prime minister’s tenure than that of every PM who went before, combined. ”

+++++

This needs to be repeated again and again and again until it sinks in to voters tiny brains…….

The Liberal leadership is destroying Canada.

#126 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.25.22 at 10:54 pm

@#116 Steve-o
“Like what am I going to do sit on a lawn chair and rot?”

++++

Nah.
Apparently
Tim Horton’s chairs are much easier on the old folks butts.

#127 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.25.22 at 10:57 pm

@#114 Ponzies Paycheck Predicament.
“OAS and GIS should be subject to some need testing.”

+++
Really?
We have to spell it out for you?
Did you miss Economics101?
It’s called income tax.
My parents essentially gave all their CPP and OAS back to the govt plus a bit more each year due to their annual income from investments, pensions, and CPP/OAS
The more you earn the more you pay.
Yeesh

#128 Dr V on 10.25.22 at 10:59 pm

117 Q

“And that’s not all; they also, in addition to the unfair Homeowner Grant, they get an additional over 65 Grant, resulting in almost no property tax.”
—————————————————-

Bad Q, Very bad.

First of all the homeowner grant is not a preferred rate. As near 70% of homes are owner occupied it is the benchmark. The landlords are actually unfairly penalized.

And the senior grant is only a few hundred bucks.

So our property tax is still thousands of dollars.

What may be interesting is the ability to defer the tax esp with the higher interest rates.

Got house Q?

#129 SoggyShorts on 10.25.22 at 11:21 pm

#30 Reality Check on 10.25.22 at 4:54 pm
There is one important point about OAS, it is fully taxable. This means it is not $108 billion in the future, it is more like $80 to $83 billion a year by 2030. Also, I am sick and tired of governments always saying I am the problem. What is never pointed out is all the taxes after 40 to 50 years paying to all governments the amount of taxes probably $500,000 to $1,000,000 per taxpayer on average. This does not include the interest accumulating on that total taxes, so really $1,000,000 to $1,250,000 with interest. Just the interest alone is $50,000 to $62,500 a year each old taxpayer is losing due to all the taxes paid. Even if it was half that, $25,000 to $37,500 a year lost interest and hundreds of thousands of dollars not in their pocket in their retirement years.
***********************
The government doesn’t earn interest on the taxes you pay, that’s not a thing. It’s money spent, often before you’ve even paid, so it OWES interest and doesn’t earn any.
Also, during those 40-50 years you used roads, hospitals, cops, and all the rest too.
I get where you were going with this, but the path you took was nonsense.

#130 Investx on 10.25.22 at 11:26 pm

Communist Canada

#131 wackedBc on 10.25.22 at 11:31 pm

I get a puzzled look from most when I say I plan to work into my 70s.. just turned 60. Not for financial reasons, but because I love what I do and as long as my brain hangs on, I can go on indefinitely.

All my clients are USA, and a good chunk are in 70s today, none have plans to retire in the next few years. All are entrepreneurs that have built successful companies and like me, wouldn’t know what to do with our time if we retired.

Canada needs more entrepreneurs, and the handouts are doing the opposite. Have no idea how to change that.

#132 DON on 10.26.22 at 12:09 am

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/striking-reversal-renters-finally-hit-breaking-point-forcing-landlords-slash-prices

Trouble in paradise?

#133 Diharv on 10.26.22 at 12:36 am

#6 GINO on 10.25.22 at 4:15 pm
I make $165,000 a year with few tax deductions and have $300,000 in RSP which is growing. I am in my early 40s. I have a bank paid defined pension (the legacy kind). Should I continue contributing to RSP? I’ve also maxed our TFSA FYI. My principle residence is paid off and I have other cash savings/investments and no debts. I will also receive an inheritance in the future. I’m worried if I continue to contribute to RSP it will claw back my OAS.

You’re in your early forties and you’re worried? I’d be doing cartwheels if my retirement income was such that OAS was clawed back 100%. It’s chump change at that income level.

#134 Jennifer on 10.26.22 at 12:40 am

Okay, let’s get some facts. Oas is taxpayer financed.
Before we start taking cash out of old people, let us
look and start counting all those corporate tax breaks, wage subsidies……

Let us not forget, income/corporate taxes have been going down for decades. So, if we are going to pick on
old folks, let us evaluate everything else at the same time.

#135 David Greene on 10.26.22 at 12:49 am

I thought that was an honest and striking video too. Until I looked around and noticed from her other videos that Lauren is likely a white supremacist. She makes the OK symbol in the exact same way as Aryan organizations in a number of her videos and photos and seems to feel white people are superior. Blech.

=====================================
#42 Nonplused on 10.25.22 at 5:23 pm

Here is a good rant from one of Canada’s more famous Millennials. They aren’t all lefties.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS0_uIOFHVM&ab_channel=LaurenSouthern

This is gold, even if you don’t like some of her other stuff.

My favorite quote: “But the sad part is when I talk to people, especially young people, there not like “OMG a disaster is coming I’m terrified!” It’s like “finally, I’m going to be able to buy a house.” …..I cannot emphasis enough how f’ed up your civilization has to be for your young people to see the only opportunity for them to be in the collapse of your civilization.”

That bit starts about 10:26 but the whole video is golden.

#136 Gulf Breeze on 10.26.22 at 2:04 am

At this point in history, where so many people are struggling, OAP should be reserved for the destitute. I care about the country and am seriously freaked out at the level of poverty working people have to endure. Universality under current circumstances resembles criminality–theft from the young to prop up the wealthier senior class.

#137 Wrk.dover on 10.26.22 at 6:15 am

#103 Wrk.dover on 10.25.22 at 8:51 pm
OAS should begin claw back at peak poverty level reaching all gone at median retired income level.

GIS is a worse curse. In-laws of mine get GIS and GIC rebates, which elevate them to a level similar ours, which has a DBP.

What is the use of contributing to a DBP, if GIS almost will match it if you don’t contribute?
_______________________________

Worth repeat reading while I correct the mistake;
Should read GST rebate, not GIC rebate.

Imagine, refunding about the only federal tax poor peeps pay!!!

Harper reducing it was dumb enough, refunding it is lunacy.

The GST rebate should go to high income over taxed payers, not system free riders like my unbiased self.

#138 habitt on 10.26.22 at 8:03 am

Perhaps the government started paying benefits to seniors in 1927 because they brought in income tax during WW1 as a temporary measure to pay for the war effort. Coincidence? I think not. So, the government shoulders some of the blame for the mess. And the empire builders in government were off and running. Sheesh…

#139 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.26.22 at 8:24 am

“The nation has gathered more new debt in the space of one prime minister’s tenure than that of every PM who went before, combined. ”

Repeat this again and again and again this to every voter that thinks Trudeau is wonderful and then ask them who they think is going to pay for all this…..

Also ask the next guy how spending will be reduced. Otherwise, it is a pointless process. – Garth

#140 Dharma Bum on 10.26.22 at 8:27 am

How, exactly, does one “top up” a RRIF?

I thought RRSPs were converted to RRIFs after age 71 for the sole purpose of making compulsory government mandated minimum withdrawals from them.

Once a RRIF is opened, I didn’t think that they could be topped up, just drained.

Please explain.

Thanks.

#141 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.26.22 at 8:30 am

@#135 Ustabe
“Here is a good rant from one of Canada’s more famous Millennials.”

+++
Never heard of her.
What did she do to become famous?
Invent penicillin?
Build a better lightbulb?
Or post videos?

#142 Randy on 10.26.22 at 8:36 am

Every government spending program is just another money-laundering scheme.

#143 Don Guillermo on 10.26.22 at 9:51 am

116 Steven on 10.25.22 at 10:02 pm
I will be working past 65 anyway. Like what am I going to do sit on a lawn chair and rot?

@@@@@@@@@@

Where have you been Steven. Pickleball is all the rage. Especially in retirement communities.

http://seniorlivingconsultants.com/the-pickleball-craze/

#144 Calgary on 10.26.22 at 10:15 am

https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/bank-of-canada-surprises-smaller-hike-50-basis-points-key-rate-140852514.html

Surprise?

#145 Quintilian on 10.26.22 at 10:17 am

#123 IHCTD9 on 10.25.22 at 10:47 pm
Just a tip for the future – don’t tell your buds that you voted Trudeau.

IH, told you many times, I was mad at JT for needlessly calling an expensive early election so I did not vote for him.

But I did stick to my Hippocratic voter oath, which is to vote for the least of the evil, given the absence of good.

You are right though about most of my friends, they have bought into the big lie Pepe is peddling.

Most of them have a diminished moral stature.
It’s the result the dog eat dog world the curmudgeons have created.

#146 SunShowers on 10.26.22 at 10:22 am

#9 LG on 10.25.22 at 4:18 pm
“That, but mostly it creates a dependency. The government takes responsibility, and control.”

Why is being dependent on the government any worse than being dependent on a private corporation? I can at least vote who represents me in government, I can’t vote out my boss if I don’t like them.

#147 Rod on 10.26.22 at 10:32 am

Garth, the Bank of Canada wimped out. They only raise the Bank of Canada rate by 50 basis points or half a percentage point. Watch now inflation will be higher in the next 12 to 18 months. It will look like it is under control shorter term but it will not be. Trudeau, Singh Liberal, NDP team up on Canada partnership now have a message to keep increasing their government spending, debt binge again for years. After all, the Bank of Canada will not raise interest enough to really keep down inflation. It is going to get bad.

#148 Shawn on 10.26.22 at 10:45 am

#146 SunShowers on 10.26.22 at 10:22 am
#9 LG on 10.25.22 at 4:18 pm
“That, but mostly it creates a dependency. The government takes responsibility, and control.”

Why is being dependent on the government any worse than being dependent on a private corporation? I can at least vote who represents me in government, I can’t vote out my boss if I don’t like them.

***************************************
Sad that you don’t even think of “being dependent on yourself”. Your future is largely up to you.

#149 BOC on 10.26.22 at 11:12 am

Interest rates are still too low. A 3.75% Bank of Canada rate is at least 100 to 150 basis points too low. It should be 4.75% to 5.25% today. The only thing that can bring down inflation for a longer period of time is higher growth and productivity which looks less likely everyday.

#150 jess on 10.26.22 at 11:37 am

someone posting under my name?

#151 Mr. T on 10.26.22 at 1:05 pm

The real deficit is in the Liberals economic policies and mentalities.

#152 Linda on 10.26.22 at 4:35 pm

#74 ‘Shawn’ – actually, Air Canada employees did get a haircut – more like a complete slaughter – vis a vis their pension plan. The deal was this: any AC employee with 25 or more years of paid pensionable service received $0.36 cents on the dollar for all contributions made up to that point in time. Any AC employee with less than 25 years of paid pensionable service received zero, zip, not one cent in compensation for any & all contributions made up to that point. Any existing AC retirees may not have seen a pension reduction, but the still working employees sure as heck did. My coworker whose partner was an AC employee ended working another 5 years to offset the impact of the gutting of her partner’s pension plan benefits. It wasn’t enough to mitigate all the financial hit, but at least allowed them to retire with adequate income, albeit later in life than they had hoped.

Yes, CPP deductions have increased to permit greater benefits down the road, but said benefits are expected to replace approximately 1/3 of working income upon retirement in place of the former 1/4 under the old rates. So unless the younger generations suddenly begin to save/invest en masse I expect 40 years or so from now there will still be large segments of older Canadians without adequate retirement incomes trying to live on CPP/OAS/GIS. This presuming the government is still financially able to hand out OAS/GIS to anyone by then.

#153 Steven Rowlandson on 10.26.22 at 8:39 pm

I think the government has found a solution to its fiscal problems.

#154 Jay on 10.27.22 at 8:42 am

“Today the old age pogey takes more cash than the child benefit and our armed forces combined.”

The amount needed for CAF continues to decline as the number of soldiers continue to decline.

“Instead of being at 70,000 people, the Canadian Forces are operating probably somewhere at about 45,000 people — and out of that, there are a significant percentage of them who are not operationally deployable or capable,” Hillier said.

https://globalnews.ca/news/9217070/military-recruitment-canada-armed-forces-hillier/