The disconnected

Yesterday John and his new bride were vexing over advice from their accountant. (Note: never take investment or marital guidance from an accountant.)

J bought a bung east of the 416, converted it to a duplex and moved into the basement. That was two years ago. Then Covid. Then nesting. Then WFH. Then the massive shelter inflation. The value of the property swelled. Actually it doubled. Then he got hitched and, wired with dopamine and swimming in endorphins, the kids (31) bought a honking big new-build in the hood.

The bean-counter says keep the bung for future gains and a retirement income stream. Bad advice, of course. Once they move into new digs, rental property gains will be taxable. The income stream will equal just a GIC-type return on equity. Tenants are a total PITA. And the two have no other liquid assets. No TFSAs. No savings or financial securities. No pensions, either. So having 100% exposure to one asset class, while carrying leverage on two properties at rates destined to rise is, well, dodgy thinking. But so Canadian.

Find a greater fool I said. Harvest that windfall taxless gain. Pay down the debt on the new place. Set up a diversified portfolio for the future – which will include kids. And protect yourself against the inevitable, which will include (a) interest rate escalation and (b) real estate risk.

I think the kiddos listened to the right guy. We’ll see.

Of course, most people don’t. They suffer recency bias – believing real estate gains that took place in a pandemic will go on forever – as well as FOMO. When assets go up, folks are desperate to jump on. Greed is a powerful motivator. But fear is even greater. And a new report suggests in a couple of years we’ll be feeling a lot of that.

Let’s start off with these two charts, courtesy of Macquarie Group’s David Doyle, who is a very smart cookie. Check this out. He suggests we’re pooched…

Source: Macquarie; National Post

What do these graphs tell us about Canadians and the money we hand over for houses? “Prices are totally disconnected from the fundamentals,” says Doyle. Therefore it’s neither logic nor economic basics driving real estate to the highest relative level in the industrialized world. Nah, it’s emotion. And bad advice. Clearly it’s dangerous to allow housing to represent such a big chunk of the economy. And it cannot last.

Doyle, and virtually every other economist (plus the odd blogger) believe people who bought houses during the pandemic will be facing an interest shock at renewal. Mortgages taken at 2% will double, or more. Not only will payments increase, but the amount of principal paid off monthly will crash. Debts are elongated as rates augment. You pay more and pay off less. And along the way if house prices flatline or fall – even slightly – household balance sheets takes a hit.

These days inflation is rising. Bond yields are going up. Mortgage costs have swollen three times in a month. The Bank of Canada has announced the abrupt end of its bond-buying program. And CB benchmark rates will start to climb in the spring. Tightening cycles are never short, and no reason to expect different this time. By 2024, says Doyle, things could get really uncomfortable for the leveraged among us. “By 2023, things start to get iffy,” he states. “I’m more concerned after 2024, at that point the Bank of Canada will be hiking rates and housing will be impacted.”

Meanwhile, Covid will be over. The vax rate in Canada will be 90% and the pill will be here. All those reasons why a global pandemic caused panic nesting will be gone. While some people will stay with remote employment, WFH will be over for millions of others. Those office towers are not staying empty. Human nature hasn’t changed, although technology has. People congregate to accomplish things for a reason. They shall do so again. The consequences for families who moved to the hinterland are obvious.

Most critically, we’ve rendered real estate unaffordable. The average detached house in the 905 belt around Toronto, for example, is over $1.4 million, up just under 30% y/y. Incomes have advanced 2%. Inflation is 4.4%. Folks have less money, not more. This explains $400 billion in new mortgage debt over the past year – all of which will renew at far higher levels. As a society, we’re drawing wealth from the future to finance things we cannot afford today. But that future will come.

As Doyle says, the amount being invested into residential real estate exceeds total business investment. We’re putting more into where we live than what we make. How does that possibly end well?

Time to bail, John.

About the picture: “Standing on guard for thee! I thought this would make a good picture,” writes Brian the lawyer from Toronto. “Not sure she makes the cut. Her name is Korra.  Your blog is great.” (The flags are installed on the lawn of Manulife’s head office in Toronto, in honour of 118,000 Canadian soldiers who did not return from battle. Each flag represents 10 soldiers.)

130 comments ↓

#1 HerOs! on 11.11.21 at 1:23 pm

If you’ve been holding out, your vaccine perk has arrived.

https://nationalpost.com/news/world/vienna-brothel-incentivizes-vaccination-after-losing-50-per-cent-of-its-clientele

#2 Jules Verne on 11.11.21 at 1:27 pm

Does Ottawa have a succession plan? In these days of covid continuing madness…we citizens have a right to know. What happens if JT dies,or falls ill? Or CF? Do we have a sitting LT Gov?

#3 Inflation on 11.11.21 at 1:31 pm

Could someone explain to me why we NEED inflation at all?

It’s a scam, right?

#4 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 1:34 pm

“U.S. house prices have risen but remain low relative to disposable income”.

Therefore, wealthier Canadian senior snowbirds can consider buying a place in the U.S.

#5 earthboundmisfit on 11.11.21 at 1:41 pm

Let’s talk taxes. Municipalities are broke, property tax hikes are inevitable. Chrystia is about to vandalize our wallets and tax shelters in the next federal budget. I shudder to think what DoFo has in store for Ontarians, needing to replace roughly 10% to pay for the pre-election goody of a gas tax drop, and with gazillions needed to pay for the suits lining up to take on the FNs in Northern Ontario, over the “Ring of Fire”. In totality, is bloodbath too strong a term?

#6 Faron on 11.11.21 at 1:41 pm

The flag installation is a stark display.

Thanks for your post today Garth. Those figures showing housing price to income are also stark displays.

#7 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 1:43 pm

Do We Have All the Facts about Money Printing?

#124 Do we have all the facts on 11.10.21 at 8:37 am
In September 2019 the Federal Reserve held assets valued at $3.377 trillion.

By September 2021 the Federal Reserve held assets valued at $8.35 trillion.

The funds required to purchase close to $5 trillion in assets were generated out of thin air by the Federal Reserve through an increase in M2 money supply.

The M2 money supply in the US in September 2019 was $15 trillion. By September 2021 M2 money supply in the US was approaching $21 trillion.

There was general agreement that a $6 trillion increase in M2 money supply would increase the rate of inflation.

************************************
This is interesting. And it does seem that the much larger M2 is causing inflation. But I did not think it was only the Federal Reserve causing the bigger M2. I have been trying to understand the sort of debits and credits of the increase in money supply. Here’s my summary of how money is created and how it is not:

https://www.investorsfriend.com/government-and-central-bank-money-printing/

I’d be interested in educated comments on whether my thinking is correct.

#8 TurnerNation on 11.11.21 at 1:50 pm

Ok back to Financial matters. Economic Shutdowns/War on Small Business.
Since when is eating at a restaurant ‘high risk’? Green pass? There is no evidence of this. This is a purely economic hit against Small Business.

.Ontario pauses next step of reopening plan as COVID-19 cases increase (toronto.ctvnews.ca)
“On Nov. 15, capacity limits were supposed to be lifted in remaining high-risk settings where proof of vaccination is required.”

.Two-thirds of Canadians want pandemic aid lowered or to end: NanosCanada (ctvnews.ca)

.NB: Parts of Miramichi health zone going into circuit breaker (cbc.ca)

.ON: Public Health Sudbury rolls back the COVID-19 restriction calendar to Step 3 (sudbury.com)

.More Restrictions coming Friday for Manitobans (cbc.ca)


— War on the Middle Class. And Children shall never again know normalcy.

.Deeply frustrating’: Parents struggle to balance work, COVID-19 test delays for their kids (globalnews.ca)


— Hey do you get the feeing this is PERMANENT- into a global reset?
Look they say in the “Middle of it”. So 2025 end date then?

.Edmonton mask bylaw to remain in place: ‘We are in the middle of a pandemic’ (globalnews.ca)

.Edmonton extends mask bylaw indefinitely
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/city-council-covid-19-1.6243509

.Thousands protest in New Zealand against COVID-19 rules(reuters.com)

.Ireland: Emergency Covid powers to be extended beyond February (irishexaminer.com)

.Denmark to Re-Impose Virus Restrictions After Ditching All Rules 2 Months Ago (theepochtimes.com)

#9 Don Cherry on 11.11.21 at 1:51 pm

What, another dog not wearing a poppy? Even my guinea pig and cat have a poppy on today!

You puppies that come here… whatever it is, you love our way of life, you love our milk and honey, at least you could pay a couple of bucks for a poppy!

#10 Faron on 11.11.21 at 1:53 pm

#186 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 1:14 pm
#182 Faron on 11.11.21 at 12:32 pm

So Canadians who vacation in Mexico are ‘willing to support a corrupt government’?

Also including, I assume, Canadian war heroes who vacation in Mexico?

And you have commented about your own vacations in Mexico a number of times on this site.

Interesting. Don’t let me interrupt your excavation.

That is exactly right and war heroes get no special treatment in that regard and it applies to lefties who travel to XYZ cheap nation for a yoga retreat as well as righties who lounge at a resort or go to a yoga retreat or to people like Don Gringero who live there the majority of time.

When I have travelled to Mexico or El Salvador or Nicaragua or Honduras I keep in mind where my dollars are flowing and that such travel can be a tacit condonement of the crappy government the people there are stuck with (and that makes the place cheap for North American gringos like myself). Hawaii is no different especially as a surfer where one can expect confrontation if a haole like me forgets he’s a visitor and what the price of that visiting actually is.

Fun thing about excavations that you should know. They are often done to build things — put a structure on a solid footing. Get rid of the unstable slime of the building site. And then one has lots of dirt in case one wants to bury or sling mud at an engineer. Good times.

#11 Prince Polo on 11.11.21 at 2:03 pm

Since our dear Photo-op Minister only cares about his own popularity, what is stopping him from introducing the 50yr amortization & housing “affordability” 50AH”A” plan in 2024? Economic fundamentals do not apply at the PMO’s office.

#12 espressobob on 11.11.21 at 2:05 pm

It’s hard to understand or conceive the integrity of those individuals who put their hides on the line for our freedoms we enjoy and take for granted today.

Living in today’s society that’s for self, I wonder…

What were these brave souls trying to teach us?

#13 FDA FYI on 11.11.21 at 2:11 pm

There have been 12787 drug recalls by the FDA over past decade. Meaning, 1279 drugs are recalled by FDA every year.

https://www.maylightfootlaw.com/blogs/fda-drug-recall-statistics/

#14 Sign of the Times on 11.11.21 at 2:13 pm

My son was off helping with ceremonies this morning. He’s in Scouts so they do that sort of thing. The cadets used to but there aren’t enough of them anymore. Enrollment in Scouts is also way down.

Thankfully the next war, should there be one, will be automated and over before lunch.

#15 Concerned Citizen on 11.11.21 at 2:19 pm

Yesterday’s CPI print was ~6%. Meanwhile, the Federal Reserve continues buying assets at a furious pace. In a recent interview, Macklem basically through up his hands when confronted with higher inflation, as if to say, “there’s nothing I can do about it.” And yet Garth and others keep saying rates will be rising?

These folks live in the past when central bankers actually followed their price stability mandates. We don’t live in that world any more. If real wages must fall 20% so that central banks can keep the mega bubbles inflated, then so be it. That’s clearly where their priorities lie. The only people that can afford to take some pain – the established asset holders – are the only group the central bankers are unwilling to inflict any pain upon.

As for Canadian housing, it’s over. We’ve known about money laundering and foreign buyers for decades, and done nothing (aside from sweep it under the rug). We’ve known about flipping and domestic investors and for decades, and done nothing. We’ve known about shady real estate practices for decades, and done nothing.

Watch what people do, not what they say. Ask any politician today about housing today, and they’ll give you an earful about the affordability crisis. But not a single one will say that prices need to come down. And not a single one will do anything to make prices come down.

And so, yes, it’s over. Feudalism is the future (and the present for a lot of Canadians, especially younger folk). The great exodus of young, skilled Canadians is upon us. But policymakers will just up the immigration numbers to compensate – immigrants will have no problem living 10 to a basement apartment.

I hope the powers that be are happy. A comfortable, middle class life is falling out of reach for many. But hey, Trudeau says we’re moving forward together, so there’s that…

#16 Rach on 11.11.21 at 2:21 pm

This is like the late 80s early 90s all over again but 100 times worse.

#17 TurnerNation on 11.11.21 at 2:24 pm

.U.S. Inflation Hit 30-Year High in October as Consumer Prices Jump 6.2% (wsj.com)

-Life in Kanada.
We must be kept living in fear. This is exactly from the Weather Network website.

“TOP STORY Parts of northern Ontario in line for 50 cm of snow by Friday. Travel NOT recommended. See the DANGER ZONES, here”

. Ottawa Indigenous Education Advisory Council group discusses dropping ‘O Canada’ from classrooms (ottawa.ctvnews.ca)


— Hey Crowded Elevator: The Science differs even within Kanada. BC Vs. ON.

https://barrie.ctvnews.ca/covid-19-cases-hospitalizations-rise-among-those-immunized-in-simcoe-muskoka-1.5631488
“BARRIE, ONT. – Vaccination rates across Simcoe Muskoka have risen above 80 per cent, but the number of immunized patients admitted to the hospital with COVID-19 has also increased”

– This chart is off the charts.
https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2021/11/09/massachusetts-new-breakthrough-cases-november-9/
Mass. reports 4,608 new breakthrough cases this week

#18 Billy Buoy on 11.11.21 at 2:24 pm

Thank you to all who served our country.

If the economy is not stimulated at these rates, you really think they will raise them further reducing growth?

Inflation will drop as people have even less to spend and growth will drop…follow the money.

There is no way, the Central banks will let stocks drop and put a generation with $$$ on its knees..Pity our children that will have to go to war again to pay for the Central banks actions…the real war criminals.

Let us NEVER forget those who served and those who cause the pain. EVER.

#19 Editrix on 11.11.21 at 2:26 pm

Today we had our heating man in to give us a tune-up on the furnace. He told us that the supplier cost of a new furnace has gone up 50% in a year.

How does that possibly end well?

#20 UmiouiuS on 11.11.21 at 2:37 pm

For the Fallen
BY LAURENCE BINYON

With proud thanksgiving, a mother for her children,
England mourns for her dead across the sea.
Flesh of her flesh they were, spirit of her spirit,
Fallen in the cause of the free.

Solemn the drums thrill; Death august and royal
Sings sorrow up into immortal spheres,
There is music in the midst of desolation
And a glory that shines upon our tears.

They went with songs to the battle, they were young,
Straight of limb, true of eye, steady and aglow.
They were staunch to the end against odds uncounted;
They fell with their faces to the foe.

They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.

They mingle not with their laughing comrades again;
They sit no more at familiar tables of home;
They have no lot in our labour of the day-time;
They sleep beyond England’s foam.

But where our desires are and our hopes profound,
Felt as a well-spring that is hidden from sight,
To the innermost heart of their own land they are known
As the stars are known to the Night;

As the stars that shall be bright when we are dust,
Moving in marches upon the heavenly plain;
As the stars that are starry in the time of our darkness,
To the end, to the end, they remain.

Source: The London Times (1914)

#21 Nonplused on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm

#3 Inflation on 11.11.21 at 1:31 pm

Could someone explain to me why we NEED inflation at all?

It’s a scam, right?

——————————–

“By a continuing process of inflation, government can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens.”

John Maynard Keynes

“The way to crush the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation.”

Vladimir Lenin

“Inflation is taxation without legislation.”

Milton Friedman

“I do not think it is an exaggeration to say history is largely a history of inflation, usually inflations engineered by governments for the gain of governments.”

Friedrich August von Hayek

“The advocates of public control cannot do without inflation. They need it in order to finance their policy of reckless spending and of lavishly subsidizing and bribing the voters.”

Ludwig Von Mises

“There are only three ways to meet the unpaid bills of a nation. The first is taxation. The second is repudiation. The third is inflation.”

Herbert Hoover

“In reality there is no such thing as an inflation of prices, relatively to gold. There is such a thing as a depreciated paper currency.”

Lysander Spooner

“In the absence of the gold standard, there is no way to protect savings from confiscation through inflation. There is no safe store of value.”

Alan Greenspan

“Inflation is when you pay fifteen dollars for the ten-dollar haircut you used to get for five dollars when you had hair.”

Sam Ewing

#22 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm

Faron:
‘When I have travelled to Mexico or El Salvador or Nicaragua or Honduras I keep in mind where my dollars are flowing and that such travel can be a tacit condonement of the crappy government the people there are stuck with (and that makes the place cheap for North American gringos like myself).’
….
Oh, I see. As long as we’re mindful we too can be a hypocrite. Do you even hear yourself?

#23 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.11.21 at 2:52 pm

@ Faron.
” The world according to faron…”

++++

Its right about now I pray for a massive solar flare that will take down the world wide electricity grid for about 5 years and we are reduced to cave dwelling, club carrying, meat eating, hunter gatherers……..

#24 Joseph R. on 11.11.21 at 2:59 pm

#3 Inflation on 11.11.21 at 1:31 pm
Could someone explain to me why we NEED inflation at all?

It’s a scam, right?

————————————————————-

No. asset inflation is simply a recalibration of the equilibrium price: the point where the Supply and Demand curves intersect.

It’s the “free market” in action. Is the free market a scam? I’ll let the Ayn Rand fans answer your question.

Inflation, calculation based on the Consumer Price Index (CPI), is the general increase in the price, at different parts of the country, of a basket of consumable items; products you have to use: food, rent, utilities, …

Real estate price increases aren’t considered part of the CPI because real estate is viewed as an investment, not a consumable. Statistic Canada calculates a “rental equivalent” as part of the CPI to account for the rise or drop of the cost of a mortgage of house owners due to house prices going up or down.

#25 ogdoad on 11.11.21 at 3:05 pm

Hope can be as powerful as fear…I don’t bump into people with a whole lotta that, though.

Og

#26 JSS on 11.11.21 at 3:09 pm

Thank you to our soldiers and veterans who fought courageously and valiantly, so that we could live in a nice country like Canada. Happy Remembrance Day

#27 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 3:13 pm

I liked the dog.

I liked the tribute.

Thank you Garth & Brian the lawyer from Toronto.

Hope your flag is still up Garth.

#28 CL on 11.11.21 at 3:17 pm

I have never understood the term disposable income. None of my income is disposable.

What does this mean when people say it? are people referring to net income?

#29 cramar on 11.11.21 at 3:20 pm

The local sat on his usual bar stool at the corner pub. He raised his pitcher to toast John for following the blog host’s advice. “Here’s to J.” he said. “And remember liquid is golden.”

#30 OK, Doomer on 11.11.21 at 3:20 pm

Just thinking about all my relatives who fought and served for Canada and silently giving thanks to them all.

What really struck me was that what they really gave me was a “backbone” of values that has stood the test of time. By choosing actions that hang easily up on this backbone, things seem to go pretty well for me and those around me.

When I see the younger folks experimenting with hanging their decisions on a backbone of Wokeism, all I see is them ending up with is a pile dirty clothes on the floor. While I understand their frustration, they’re approaching life from the philosophically wrong perspective. There’s just no way to properly execute on something irreparably flawed.

Thanks to all of our veterans for fighting for and teaching us values with backbone.

To the Wokesters, yeah, well good luck with your laundry.

#31 Armpit on 11.11.21 at 3:24 pm

It’s Official Folks!!!
———————-

Ontario Housing is in a BUBBLE!!!! NOVEMBER 2021.

———————-

#32 Jens on 11.11.21 at 3:25 pm

David Doyle’s charts are fascinating indeed. Even the black line alone says so much about the Canadian economy. While U.S. incomes have doubled over the last 45 years, ours have crept up a measly 60%.
(I bet the charts are NOT adjusted for inflation. I wonder if in real purchasing power we are worse off than in 1975?)
But then there’s that strange sharp uptick in disposable income just around Q1/2020. I wonder if that was the CERB kicking in?

#33 Daveyboy on 11.11.21 at 3:28 pm

I left Canada 5 years ago for the united states. So far it’s been one of the best decisions my wife and I made. Looking at those charts it’s unbelievable what is happening. Good luck to the people that have bought a home recently!

#34 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:28 pm

#182 Faron on 11.11.21 at 12:32 pm
#141 Don Guillermo on 11.10.21 at 10:32 pm
#124 Faron on 11.10.21 at 9:07 pm
#100 Don Guillermo on 11.10.21 at 6:42 pm

Taking pot-shots from meheeco

Last I heard, that is how it’s pronounced. I would never make fun of Mexico or Mexicans. But Canadians who hide out there because their homeland is a little chilly sometimes? Who are implicitly willing to support a corrupt government there because it’s cheap and tropical livin’? Who whine about a correction of record from afar on a hallowed day having chosen not to live in the country because it’s not comfy enough for them? Yeah, I’ll make fun of that in heart-beat.
———-
My sentiment too.
I can see some people need to get away to warmer climes for medical reasons , such as Sad, which I suffered from too, but made lifestyle changes, and it’s much better now.
But bragging, I just don’t like. Same goes for Sailo.
Went for my mandatory daily 10,000 steps walk on the pier in White Rock.
Wind and rain storm,  high tide, meter high waves.
Lots of people out walking.
Because that’s what True Canadians 
True story:
 I all that “nasty” weather, I saw a naked guy.
Well, at first I thought he was naked until he came closer.
He wore a tiny bathing suit.
He walked with with a Golden Retriever through the snickering crowd, oblivious to the commotion.
But the best was:
He had a Poppy attached on his chest.
True Canadian, or just crazy? No judgment from me.
Did some crazy stuff, when I wore a younger Man’s clothes, too.
BTW, The White Rock pier is claimed to be the longest pier in Canada.
True? 

#35 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 3:30 pm

#177 Satori on 11.11.21 at 11:59 am
#113 Willem and #121 Sail away

Such a beautiful post!

I am sure this is obvious to more than just me. Reading here for the past few weeks, this “need to be right”, it is very transparent we have a narcissist here. The simple solution: Ignore all of Faron’s comments. This banter feeds a narcissist’s need to be right. A narcissist engages in defensive oppositional views to sustain his/her issues. Once we stop the feeding, they might find the professional help they needs…. Elsewhere.
____

Yep, I’ve suspected NPD for a while. The give away is the complete inability to let even the slightest jab or criticism slide. Every single time it’s a long winded return-salvo often filled with some level of vitriol and/or insults.

A couple months ago I suggested the dogs use “positive reinforcement” and ignore all posts by Faron when he’s having an episode. But obviously not many picked up the challenge.

So I’ll escalate:

Remember Smoking Man used to always say “You can’t bend what you can’t offend”? What that meant is that SM controlled the buttons. No one else could push them. Therefore Smoking Man drew up the rules of engagement himself, instead of letting others do so. He was bulletproof. If you fall victim to provocation, temptation, and anger – it’s YOU who are to blame. SM had all this figured out.

So I offer the official GF “You can’t bend what you can’t offend” Challenge. If Faron is acting out and throwing himself on the floor – Ignore. 100%. I mean 100%. Not 99.99%. Not a single peep, full ghost.

Some of you will find this hard to do. Someone with NPD is very, very good at getting under peoples skin – they need your attention like a junkie needs drugs. If so, I suggest scrolling his posts. 100% not 99.99%. No peaking. Remember, YOU control your reactions, no one else. So don’t read them and open the door if you’re not yet strong – keep it shut. It’ll take some discipline, but will get easier with time and you are learning a very valuable life skill at the same time.

Good luck dogs, and I’ll leave you with this quote that SM was undoubtedly very familiar with:

“Any person capable of angering you becomes your master; he can anger you only when you permit yourself to be disturbed by him.”
― Epictetus

#36 Inflation on 11.11.21 at 3:30 pm

#21 Nonplused

Why do we participate and put up with this crap?

It’s a scam. It’s all the things you’ve said. In the very least it is a tax. I personally think it is sanctioned theft.

These inflated egos of our politicians and leaders have gotten out of control.

They work for us!

#37 Soviet Capitalist on 11.11.21 at 3:33 pm

@Jules Verne

Please don’t worry, there are plenty of politicians who can do a better job than JT, even a goat can do better…

#38 Elon Fanboy on 11.11.21 at 3:38 pm

For my fellow Canadians on Remembrance Day. For those who may not be familiar with one of the greatest British comedies of all time. BlackAdder.

This is how they chose to end their ‘comedy’.

The greatest most profound end to any TV series ever.

https://youtu.be/NgyB6lwE8E0

#39 Long time reader, first time commenter on 11.11.21 at 3:42 pm

DELETED (Anti-vax)

#40 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:45 pm

#22 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm
Faron:
‘When I have travelled to Mexico or El Salvador or Nicaragua or Honduras I keep in mind where my dollars are flowing and that such travel can be a tacit condonement of the crappy government the people there are stuck with (and that makes the place cheap for North American gringos like myself).’
….
Oh, I see. As long as we’re mindful we too can be a hypocrite. Do you even hear yourself?
—————
Buddy, I did quite a bit of travelling in my days.
Off the beaten path.
Seeing how the “natives” live.
That kind of “vacation” is quite different from the one where you’re living in a protected, isolated environment, where the natives can only dream to live.
Quite different, my Friend,
Would be an eye opener.
But I bet you’d be scared to get out of your comfort zone.

#41 Lee on 11.11.21 at 3:46 pm

You know, we’ve been hearing the same thing from guys like Doyle for 20 years.

#42 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 3:46 pm

#8 TurnerNation

Ya I was really hoping for Denmark but they are reimposing restrictions like your source said. It’s really too bad.

The Swedes are reporting 5400 more deaths than they originally reported over the Summer (I could have told you that * – they’re still clinging to “may”):

https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/a/dnGG0w/nya-varstascenariot-5-400-fler-doda-med-covid-19-till-sommaren

And soon after that article they followed up with what I call the EUROPA RED SWATH OF COVID EVIL – no, not the Commies (and who they are going to blame besides themselves for the emergency they see coming):

https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/a/k6Kd5a/fruktar-julkaos-i-okande-smittan-en-nodsituation

—————

You look at their Manhattan Skyline Flat Tops cases curve followed by two further Lazarus saw tooth jumps and in and around mid-July Sweden finally learns the art of smoothing a curve (or nobody counts on weekends there much though they still report it daily):

https://i.imgur.com/LqH8EGB.png

With the neighbors Sweden has, I’d be worried too.

Nordic Noir

#43 Cancel Canada Day on 11.11.21 at 3:47 pm

Perspective.
Numbers.

Coming Soon.

#44 willworkforpickles on 11.11.21 at 3:57 pm

I posted a comment here yesterday (as well as a year back) regarding investors, RE entrepreneurs and wannabes of this ilk who sold their paid off houses for big gains a year ago and up to the present.

Now regarding the many sitting on piles of cash not knowing what to do with it, not wanting to spend it all to buy back… that … indeed they should not spend it all and buy back.
Instead they should spend half of the money and buy a house and take out a new short term open end mortgage taking advantage of the current historical low interest rates (as they won’t last).
Next …to dump it on the open market 3 to 4 months later at an astronomical higher asking price and hope first timers, move up buyers and spec entrepreneurs such as yourselves start a FOMO frenzied bidding war over it. And they did.

Many of those bidding war participants in the GTA by the way were planted there by the sellers to drive FOMO bidding ever higher.

The window of opportunity was alive and well, the timing dead on, never seen before perfect conditions for all of that came to be in the past year… but is shrinking now due to the risk of rising rates as i knew it would.

Some buyers took advantage of the opportunity to buy and flip as many properties as they could I’m sure.
I personally didn’t take advantage of the open opportunity as much as i could have or should have with only just one transaction of my own. (believing too much of my own warnings held me back actually).

Interest rates are on the move up and will go higher for mortgages. Much higher.

The jig is up at any rate. Buying and flipping comes with big risk now that the buyers may not be there 6 months from now to accommodate your plan of FOMO gains selling into a bidding war at a greatly higher ask price than your purchase price.

These kind of spec buyers/flippers absolutely need these conditions looking ahead to stay in the game while the ponzi lasts. It won’t.
All things pass.

#45 From the newsdesk on 11.11.21 at 4:00 pm

Inflation is not happening.

Affordability is not an issue.

Unemployment is at pre-pandemic levels.

Only unvaccinated are getting infected.

People don’t want to work because they are lazy and not because they are hopelessly underpaid.

Thank you for joining us for this quick news break.

We now return you to more truth and reality from:

WWE Wrestling Thursday Night Smackdown!

#46 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 4:05 pm

That Macquarie Group’s David Doyle disposable income curve makes perfect sense to me.

Again, you look at the StatCan Boomer/Paleo Assets vs. Debts:

https://i.imgur.com/o1zv0LC.png

and Net Worth you can see more RE equity but large Mortgage Debt, whether Average or Median, and a whack more debt in Lines of Credit, Other Debt.

Disposable income went to dung for sure thanks to RE.

True, some of that money got transferred over to Junior so they could also impale themselves on RE (misery loves company):

https://i.imgur.com/asaQDWm.png
https://i.imgur.com/S3wA1KI.png

What struck me was from GenX to Boomer/Paleos how little Net Worth went up vs. how much debt increased.

Despite all the RE paper billionaire bravado you read about here in the Comments section sometimes, you know that the reality is that they’re hurting for cash…plain and simple.

In short what Doyle said with 1 chart vs. 1,000 words.

#47 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 4:23 pm

Garth it’s not just the mortgage debt that is going to hammer Cdns financially in the next few years, it’s also the other debts they have.

Boomer/Paleos that you’d think they’d it have it all paid off by then:

https://i.imgur.com/o1zv0LC.png

Look at Line of Credit Debt per person Median, Average:

$38K, $100K

or Other Debt

$23K/$102K

or Vehicle Loans

$21K/$27K

—————

$80K, $230K Median, Average per perso debt.

If CB raises rates, that’s ‘gonna hurt a lot besides Mortgage debt. And you look at their Mortgage debt there isn’t going to be a lot of leeway left for Home as ATM.

Mr. Market people in that mix, 3-14% of them only. At least they’ll have some substantial assets to draw against for the 71% Single Asset RE crowd.

#48 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 4:24 pm

#37 Soviet Capitalist on 11.11.21 at 3:33 pm
@Jules Verne

Please don’t worry, there are plenty of politicians who can do a better job than JT, even a goat can do better…
———————
Remember the Goat man, with horns and goat fur.
And an IQ of around 67 (just guessing.
He was one of the main characters in the storming of the Capitol Hill, Jan 6.
Turns out the prosecution is asking for 4 1/2 years.
With all the customary plea bargaining it will probably be less.
Deserves it, mostly for being so stupid.
Sure, Trump was calling him to serve the country.

#49 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 4:28 pm

40 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:45 pm

How very wonderful for you. However, as f-man himself says, your presence there as a tourist implicitly condones whatever government is in power. Unless you acknowledge that fact, then it’s ok. Apparently.

#50 Nonplused on 11.11.21 at 4:29 pm

#24 Joseph R. on 11.11.21 at 2:59 pm

No. asset inflation is simply a recalibration of the equilibrium price: the point where the Supply and Demand curves intersect.

———————————–

Nope. Supply and demand affect prices, and certainly affect the price of one good or service compared to others based on relative scarcity and abundance. But supply and demand can cause prices to go both up and down.

General inflation affecting most or all prices at once can only be accomplished through an increase in the money supply.

Think of it this way: If there is a fixed amount of money, it is impossible for all prices to rise at once, because there isn’t enough money to go around. Some will go up if scarce and in demand but as a result others will go down such that the total amount of money circulating equals the amount of money.

To cause all prices to rise at the same time, an increase in the money supply is necessary. The new money, being a larger amount than previously required for commerce, causes prices to rise until the amount of money and the demand for money equalize.

But they never do. They are intentionally out of balance by 2% per year, compounded.

When the amount of outright deflation there has been due to productivity increases, technological innovation, and labor offshoring is considered, that there has been any increase at all in general price levels indicates we are being scammed by an unnecessary increase in the money supply.

So there is a supply and demand fundamental at work, but it is the supply and demand for money not goods and services. Goods and services can interact at any price level.

#51 Purolator on 11.11.21 at 4:36 pm

“ Suspicious package at Remembrance Day ceremony delays arrival of prime minister, governor general”

Wonder what was in the package?

Amazon Prime order of coffee?
Actual true inflation data?
Vaccines?

#52 Tax the Socialists! on 11.11.21 at 4:37 pm

Looks like Musk does pay taxes after all:

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/elon-musk-confirms-his-tax-related-selling-sparked-tuesdays-big-tsla-tumble

Who would have known?

#53 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 4:39 pm

Seriously.. about wage increases

#32 Jens on 11.11.21 at 3:25 pm

David Doyle’s charts are fascinating indeed. Even the black line alone says so much about the Canadian economy. While U.S. incomes have doubled over the last 45 years, ours have crept up a measly 60%.
(I bet the charts are NOT adjusted for inflation. I wonder if in real purchasing power we are worse off than in 1975?)

But then there’s that strange sharp uptick in disposable income just around Q1/2020. I wonder if that was the CERB kicking in?

*******************************
First if you think a 60% gain in wages over the last 45 years since 1975 is not adjusted for inflation then it’s clear that you are young and never experienced the double digit inflation of the 1970’s.

Second the charts state in bold headlines that the data is for “real” prices and income, that is inflation adjusted.

#54 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 4:41 pm

#40 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:45 pm
#22 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm
Faron:
‘When I have travelled to Mexico or El Salvador or Nicaragua or Honduras I keep in mind where my dollars are flowing and that such travel can be a tacit condonement of the crappy government the people there are stuck with (and that makes the place cheap for North American gringos like myself).’
….
Oh, I see. As long as we’re mindful we too can be a hypocrite. Do you even hear yourself?
—————
Buddy, I did quite a bit of travelling in my days.
Off the beaten path.
Seeing how the “natives” live.
That kind of “vacation” is quite different from the one where you’re living in a protected, isolated environment, where the natives can only dream to live.
Quite different, my Friend,
Would be an eye opener.
But I bet you’d be scared to get out of your comfort zone.
****************************************
There’s only one non Mexican born (other than us) living on my street. She’s Dutch and has lived here for 40 years. She’s a Mexican citizen and fully bi lingual.

Faron believing he can travel to these countries with higher moral standards than all the other foreign travelers who are nothing more than stupid gringos is ludicrous and deep down you know this. I wonder what box my Mexican friends that travel to these “”crappy government” countries for baseball tournaments are slotted in?

– be more like Chuy, less like Faron

Let’s spend the rest of our energy remembering what today is about.

#55 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 4:41 pm

Last Salvo.

Some good news out of Europa GDP wise:

https://i.imgur.com/VCCy9Ha.png

+6% for Italia this year. Not threadbare anymore. Better than mighty Deutschland (fewer Covid cases too).

———————-

All you naysayers that took potshots at the PIIGS, whose laughing now huh?

Oh ye Schadenfreude of little faith.

Time to eat crow…mangia, mangia.

#56 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 4:49 pm

Wither Dolce Vita

The other day I once again challenged Dolce Vita on his obviously wrong claim that Canadian house prices have compounded up at only 2.32% since 1975. I said his data had to be real return as opposed to nominal as he implied.

If someone accused me of being stupid I would respond… but crickets…

Anyhow the chart here, perhaps reflecting the most recent gains shows Canadian house price going from a base of 100 in 1975 to 400 today in REAL dollars. That a compounded gain of 3.13% per year real. The gain in nominal dollars is far higher than 3.13% and certainly vastly higher than Dolce’s ridiculous 2.32% claim. This is as anyone with the very roughest of knowledge of 1975 home prices would already know.

I am not commenting that homes were a great investment. For most people a house is a place to live and a not an alternative investment. I just could not let the ridiculous 2.32% compounded gain since 1975 claim stand unchallenged.

#57 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 4:52 pm

Well, today’s ceremony finished before the rains really started. Almost as if a benevolent overseer were involved.

The old army Class A’s still fit ok after 25 years, although the waistband seems to have shrunk.

#58 David Paquette on 11.11.21 at 4:54 pm

One thing I didn’t mention about my uncle Fred. His men took wounds, some of them serious. He became a first class battlefield medic. Still he lead his men into battle. I still have a hard time with 19 year olds killing 16 year olds. He did what had to be done.

#59 NOSTRADAMUS on 11.11.21 at 4:56 pm

CAPTAIN, FRAUD-BERG DEAD AHEAD.
Before too long the escalating Canadian Mortgage fraud will reach “THE GODFATHER 111” Level Of Shadiness. The Devil himself could not devise a better Ponzi scheme to destroy the life savings of the Little People. Next up, “THE EXORCIST 111, Levels Of Darkness.” As the well known, ( REPEAT, WELL KNOWN ) epicenter of the mortgage fraud in Canada begins to implode, the catalyst to these horror sequels will turn out to be the fast approaching hike in interest rates. The issue of rising borrowing costs will spread through the financial ecosystem like a malignant unstoppable virus. Since interest rates affect, “PAYMENTS,” increases in rates quickly negatively impacts consumption and most importantly, housing for the little people. As a result of the the Real Estate correction, the rampant mortgage fraud will rear it’s ugly head. Much like an Iceberg the bulk of the fraud has hidden out of the site of the regulators, (Three blind mice) Out of site, out of mind. The escalating real estate values have understandably made the fraud go parabolic. I have taken the liberty to rename this destructive bemouth, THE FRAUD-BERG. After the correction, the little people will be wiped out financially, along with their dreams. Those responsible, the Central Banks, with interest rate suppression and their fraudulent cousins will quietly slip away in the darkness in government supported life boats. Now the truly scary part of this horror movie, the loses as a result of this Made In Canada mind boggling mortgage fraud will total well over 100 BILLION DOLLARS. Fingers will point, wanted posters will go up. But those responsible, being nimble, will close down their predatory shops and move down the hall to a new office with a new company name. Much like plastic surgery, same person, different face. I now stand accused of practicing “BITCH CRAFT” the art of pis*ing people off by telling the truth. On second thought, captain, I might be light on my prediction of the 100 BILLION. FRAUD- BERG, dead ahead. Amen Brother.

#60 cuke and tomato picker on 11.11.21 at 5:08 pm

We thank all those who fought for our freedom and especially those who lost family members it must be heart breaking. We have a lot to be thankful for living in this wonderful country CANADA as our children own there own home outright and line up to buy TESLAS. If the goal is clear the price is cheap.

#61 Flop… on 11.11.21 at 5:19 pm

#51 Purolator on 11.11.21 at 4:36 pm
“ Suspicious package at Remembrance Day ceremony delays arrival of prime minister, governor general”

Wonder what was in the package?

Amazon Prime order of coffee?
Actual true inflation data?
Vaccines?

/////////////////////////

I reckon someone sent him a package of socks with poppies printed on them.

Even being nice to someone nowadays is considered a suspicious activity…

M47BC

#62 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 5:21 pm

#56 Shawn Allen

Oh ye of little faith well not you, numerically challenged buddy.

Go here:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QCAR628BIS

Download the numbers (click Download, save as CSV [as a Notepad file], Open it, Select All, Copy, open Google Sheets, Paste, in the pop-up that appears, select Split Text to Columns).

For fun and so you can show buddy (and yourself) let’s do 1970-01-01 to 2021-01-01 CAGR, 51 years worth.

1. Search for “compound annual growth rate calculator”.

ETMoney came up first for me, so let’s use it.

Initial Investment = 37
Final Investment = 150
Duration = 51 years

CAGR = 2.8%

Since that one had a screwey currency to it, let’s do it long hand per Investopedia:

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cagr.asp#what-is-the-compound-annual-growth-rate-cagr

CAGR =[ (150/37)^(1/51) – 1 ] X 100

In Google Sheets I get (using more decimals that above):

2.79%

Try the other numbers I posted, you’ll get the same.

—————————-

Moral of the Story:

Useful to engage Brain before Mouth.

#63 Do we have all the facts on 11.11.21 at 5:29 pm

Why can’t the Government of Canada see that directing hundreds of billion of dollars into over valued assets that do not produce a single good or service does very little for the Canadian economy.

Between mania over Bitcoin and the insanity over owning real estate at any cost Canadian citizens seem to have lost the plot. Gross Domestic Product measures a countries production not a countries fascination with speculation.

David Doyle hit the nail on the head. An economy is based on production and the reluctance to invest in assets that produce a good or a service will not end well.

#64 NewWest on 11.11.21 at 5:32 pm

This is the poem that I read every Remembrance Day. Wilfred Owen was killed in action on 4 November 1918 during the crossing of the Sambre–Oise Canal, exactly one week (almost to the hour) before the signing of the Armistice. He was 25.

Dulce et Decorum Est

By Wilfred Owen

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs,
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots,
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of gas-shells dropping softly behind.

Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound’ring like a man in fire or lime.—
Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil’s sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,—
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

#65 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 5:34 pm

#56 Shawn Allen

…ooops, almost forgot S&P 500 over the same period.

Mouse over data points in chart to get the numbers:

https://www.officialdata.org/us/stocks/s-p-500/1970

1970-01 = 96.8
2021-01 = 18,358.23
51 years

CAGR = 10.83% (I’m assuming you didn’t eat the book covers in the previous example; i.e., no long hand formula calculation needed to be shown to you)

—————–

Other Morals of Story

– Mr. Market over the same period 3.9X vs Dirt.

– Now go impress all your friends, including buddy, with the Future Value equation reorganized to solve for CAGR, A.K.A., 1st Semester, 1st Week, 1st Day, Finance/Accounting course WorldWide, probably on Planet Claire too (pink air).

#66 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 5:38 pm

#10 Faron on 11.11.21 at 1:53 pm

…one can expect confrontation if a haole like me

——-

My compliments on a perfect anagram

#67 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 5:47 pm

#56 Shawn Allen

Can’t resist, did you read the title here:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QCAR628BIS

“Real Residential Property Prices for Canada”

…further to your “Real” admonition.

Where did you get your “Real” from, some Realtor database?

On indices, I’m kind of big on the US Fed as in Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis.

#68 AM in MN on 11.11.21 at 5:51 pm

#14 Sign of the Times on 11.11.21 at 2:13 pm
My son was off helping with ceremonies this morning. He’s in Scouts so they do that sort of thing. The cadets used to but there aren’t enough of them anymore. Enrollment in Scouts is also way down.

Thankfully the next war, should there be one, will be automated and over before lunch.

———————————————————

The next war will be a version of civil (internal) war, and will end in a more formal arrangement of serfs and masters.

Check out South Africa lately. A new poll out recently found that after only 25 or so years of “democracy for all”, a significant portion of the population would be willing to give up the right to vote in exchange for some basic physical and economic security.

I think the Chinese Communist Party can help them with that, probably while they get the coal mines back in operation.

So sad that so many have no idea of or appreciation for the sacrifices honoured this day.

#69 Tiffany Pontes Dover on 11.11.21 at 6:23 pm

#2 Jules Verne on 11.11.21 at 1:27 pm
Does Ottawa have a succession plan? In these days of covid continuing madness…we citizens have a right to know. What happens if JT dies,or falls ill?

One of these situations is true, I’ll let you figure it out:

1. The Liberal Party which is in control behind the scenes hired a professional drama teacher to act out the role of Prime Minister as nothing more than a name recognizable front man.

2. A drama teacher with no business experience other than his name recognition is running the primary political party of Canada.

I may be an anti-talc’r, but even I can see what’s going on.

#70 Penny Henny on 11.11.21 at 6:31 pm

#35 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 3:30 pm
Good luck dogs, and I’ll leave you with this quote that SM was undoubtedly very familiar with:

“Any person capable of angering you becomes your master; he can anger you only when you permit yourself to be disturbed by him.”
― Epictetus

/////////////

It would seem we are all Faron’s master.

You all remember ‘The Real Mark’, another bright mind that had no clue on how to interact with other humans.
I’m sure his issue was aspergers where as Faron is definitely manic depressive. Either way it’s a shame that two very bright minds cannot learn how to communicate with others of their species.
Hopefully they will both get the help they deserve.

#71 S.O on 11.11.21 at 6:44 pm

Canadian Border Agents Seized $166 Million In Undeclared Cash From Traveller’s, and its all been heading into BC and Toronto. Money laundering in Canadian real estate is still going strong.

#72 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 6:46 pm

Grampa Jim came home from the Great War in 1917 or 1018. His UK war bride Kathleen came later on a civilian ship. Trained all across Canada to Alberta. She had no idea how long that would take. They settled in Lac la Biche AB (not sure why). They had their 1st two children living in a tent while Grampa built them a log cabin nearby. Imagine 2 winters in a tent in northern Alberta having children after coming from a middle class life in Pewsey, UK. They went on to have 8 more children … my father was the 3rd. They were very poor. Sometime in the 1970,s Gramma took her 1st and last trip back to the UK to visit family. When she returned (they were living in Edmonton by then) I asked her how she liked the UK. She just shrugged and said they all speak funny over there.

#73 Faron on 11.11.21 at 6:48 pm

#54 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 4:41 pm
#40 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:45 pm
#22 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm

Hah, oh, the gov’t of El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras and Beliz aren’t total trash? They aren’t corruptly squeegeeing money out of the industry that takes place to enrich the leaders? News to me.

You trash me, my job and my work ethic and you can expect to be trashed or seen as such. You do the trashing from foreign soil to a person who serves the public in Canada in a way that’s far from gratuitous and you are a real POS.

NB: I’m online on and off today because I have work to do.

#74 Purolator on 11.11.21 at 6:55 pm

#61 Flop… on 11.11.21 at 5:19 pm
#51 Purolator on 11.11.21 at 4:36 pm
“ Suspicious package at Remembrance Day ceremony delays arrival of prime minister, governor general”

Wonder what was in the package?

Amazon Prime order of coffee?
Actual true inflation data?
Vaccines?

/////////////////////////

I reckon someone sent him a package of socks with poppies printed on them.

Even being nice to someone nowadays is considered a suspicious activity…

M47BC

///////////

I’m thinking a convenient excuse to be late and make a grand entrance was in the package.

#75 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 7:08 pm

Dolyce Vita you truley are an idiot

#62 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 5:21 pm
#56 Shawn Allen

#67 Dolce Vita on 11.11.21 at 5:47 pm
#56 Shawn Allen

Can’t resist, did you read the title here:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QCAR628BIS

“Real Residential Property Prices for Canada”

…further to your “Real” admonition.

Where did you get your “Real” from, some Realtor database?

On indices, I’m kind of big on the US Fed as in Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis.

***************************************
I got my real as I stated from the chart garth gave us at the top of this page. Canadian house price index 1975 100, today 400 clearly labeled REAL data

400/100 = 4 raise that to the power of 1/45 and get 1.0313. Subtract 1 and the real compounded gain on Canadian houses 3.13%. The nominal gain clearly far higher. Your numbers were clearly REAL all along and not nominal. By not stating they were real you implied nominal.

Reflect then come back and apologize.

Remember, I initially asked you some weeks ago and again some days ago to simply verify your numbers were REAL and not nominal.

#76 BillinBC on 11.11.21 at 7:55 pm

#54 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 4:41 pm
#40 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.11.21 at 3:45 pm
#22 Scaron on 11.11.21 at 2:41 pm

Hah, oh, the gov’t of El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras and Beliz aren’t total trash? They aren’t corruptly squeegeeing money out of the industry that takes place to enrich the leaders? News to me.

You trash me, my job and my work ethic and you can expect to be trashed or seen as such. You do the trashing from foreign soil to a person who serves the public in Canada in a way that’s far from gratuitous and you are a real POS.

NB: I’m online on and off today because I have work to do.
——————————————————————
A full time job for you would make a lot of Dogs happy

#77 jack on 11.11.21 at 8:03 pm

“Clearly it’s dangerous to allow housing to represent such a big chunk of the economy.”

*****

Of course the Bank of Canada has nothing to do with it with their sky high rates encouraging saving and they have done a fabulous job of reducing inflation to imperceptible levels. Nothing to see here…move along….thanks Tiff for doing a great job.. keep up the great work.

#78 DLT INC on 11.11.21 at 8:16 pm

It is long past time that we all looked behind the curtain. Follow the money I always say. People blame our politicians for how they are ruining the country. But I say, they are just the puppets. Ask yourself who have been making out like bandits especially since covid but long before that actually. It’s not the poor or what’s left of the middle class. People with real assets have done well, houses, stocks, even gold. Savers in fixed interest bearing accounts, not at all. There are more billionaires with far larger fortunes than ever before. Garth says they shouldn’t be taxed because they would have to drain their companies to pay a wealth tax, But aren’t they all taxed on their unrealized gains when they die? Apparently in the US that is not the case. Do the super wealthy in Canada also have a secret escape hatch not available to the rest of us so there is no requirement that their empires suffer when they die? What gives Garth? Just how do corporations continue when their major shareholder dies and supposedly there are huge taxes to pay by the estate?

#79 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 8:33 pm

#70 Penny Henny on 11.11.21 at 6:31 pm
#35 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 3:30 pm
Good luck dogs, and I’ll leave you with this quote that SM was undoubtedly very familiar with:

“Any person capable of angering you becomes your master; he can anger you only when you permit yourself to be disturbed by him.”
― Epictetus

/////////////

It would seem we are all Faron’s master.

You all remember ‘The Real Mark’, another bright mind that had no clue on how to interact with other humans.
I’m sure his issue was aspergers where as Faron is definitely manic depressive. Either way it’s a shame that two very bright minds cannot learn how to communicate with others of their species.
Hopefully they will both get the help they deserve.
— —-

I remember Mark. He was uh, robotic. Whatever the ailment is, I’ve about hit my limit for 50+ year old dudes going back and forth day after day without end.

I got no problem with a bit of $h!t slinging, but normal men eventually bury the hatchet and go for a beer.

#80 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 8:38 pm

#72 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 6:46 pm
Grampa Jim came home from the Great War in 1917 or 1018. His UK war bride Kathleen came later on a civilian ship. Trained all across Canada to Alberta. She had no idea how long that would take. They settled in Lac la Biche AB (not sure why). They had their 1st two children living in a tent while Grampa built them a log cabin nearby. Imagine 2 winters in a tent in northern Alberta having children after coming from a middle class life in Pewsey, UK. They went on to have 8 more children … my father was the 3rd. They were very poor. Sometime in the 1970,s Gramma took her 1st and last trip back to the UK to visit family. When she returned (they were living in Edmonton by then) I asked her how she liked the UK. She just shrugged and said they all speak funny over there.
—- –

Heh, my parents also went back a single time in 69 years.

I got: “They drive like idiots”

No plans for a second visit.

#81 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 8:48 pm

#73 Faron on 11.11.21 at 6:48 pm

Hah, oh, the gov’t of El Salvador, Nicaragua, Honduras and Beliz aren’t total trash?

——–

Wow, you are qualified to judge the entire governments of four entire countries? Five including Mexico?

It is becoming clear that you not only toil selflessly at your super-important day job, but also sit at the right hand of God Almighty.

Please don’t stop. Tell us more.

#82 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 8:51 pm

Faron
… you are a real POS.
NB: I’m online on and off today because I have work to do.
******””****
NB: I’m not the real Prince of Saudi but I am glad you’re working tonight. Don’t forget to remember.

#83 Dr V on 11.11.21 at 8:55 pm

75 Shawn – many of us here are waiting for Dolce to apologize for past transgressions.

Better off just to scroll baby, scroll.

#84 chalkie on 11.11.21 at 9:01 pm

Our grandparents use to tell us that there is a sucker born every second. Can you just imagine what it will look like, when we are six months into the bubble break. Millennials have no clue, what a downturn does, hold onto your britches boys, its called a fire sale and its coming.

#85 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.11.21 at 9:20 pm

@#80 IHCTD9
“Heh, my parents also went back a single time in 69 years.
I got: “They drive like idiots”

+++

Your parents are from Vancouver?

#86 CARS on 11.11.21 at 10:05 pm

What is happening to cars?

Friend has a 2016 Toyota Venza with a normal V6 268hp engine. The thing pulls 0-100km in 6.4 seconds.

We were looking at a 2021 high tech Lexus 450h V6 hybrid that claims over 300hp, and the thing is almost 8s in 0-100km time! And it has an 8 speed gear box instead of 6 speed like the old Toyota. This thing is SLOW!

I was like…how can it be? It’s got instant torque electric motors?! Turns out the thing is like 800lbs heavier than the 2016 car. These hybrids are a total nightmare! Is there no carbon emissions cost to this extra 800lbs of crap in this car?

We went to the Toyota side, 2021 Highlander hybrid is clocking in at 6000lbs!

Has anyone clued into this car obesity issue?

Government should start categorizing and taxing cars by weight to force these automakers to take out a few thousand pounds out of these things, that would make them super economical and efficient.

1990 Honda Civic was 2000lbs.
2021 Honda Civic is 3000lbs! CRAZY!

It’s the weight people! Soccer moms don’t need 6000lbs cars to drive kids to practice.

#87 the Jaguar on 11.11.21 at 11:12 pm

@#72 Don Guillermo on 11.11.21 at 6:46 pm

Amigo a mi. During these past Covid months, like many I have looked to the past to understand how our country and the world responded to the first worldwide pandemic (spanish flu) to understand what real hardship might have been. Before smartphones, Twitter/Facebook, and government safety nets like CERB., etc. Before the mid sixties there wasn’t even health care, etc. It was pretty bleak.

Part of that exercise was to read a trilogy of sorts. People of the Abysss (Jack London1902), Down and Out in Paris and London (George Orwell 1933) and I am almost finished The Road to Wigan Pier ( George Orwell 1937). Many of us have family who would have lived during these times, dependent on age/family size, etc.

As the last child of three, my mother from a family of ten, her father from a family of 13, the roots in Alberta go back in time. 1883 the first arrival. The railroad lines only went so far in those days and men walked to the Old Man River area in Southern Alberta to open the Galt Coal Mines, my great grandfather among them. There was a lot of coal mining in the southern part of the province in those days.

It’s pretty humbling to read about the coal mine period. Really, really stark. I have no doubt that anybody bored enough to read my comments in places like Nova Scotia and other parts of Canada have some inkling of what a dangerous and difficult life it was and could provide similar historical information. What is astonishing is that these generations risked everything, to set sail across the dangerous Atlantic, prospects unknown, risk everything to get here, and then ‘step up’ and return overseas in the first and second world wars to defend the countries they had left behind.

I recognize this was all along time ago. Technological advancements, innovation, etc. It ain’t 1937 anymore. I just wonder sometimes if the advances in character got lost during all those technological advancements. The headlines often seem to suggest so….. My daily observations reflect something similar…

#88 P.S. on 11.11.21 at 11:13 pm

It seems to me that having freedom to an anti-vaxer really means having no responsibilities.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/remembrance-day-vaccine-mandates-protest-kelowna-bc-1.6246356

#89 Jared Dillian on 11.12.21 at 12:25 am

Doyle’s timing is off.

You posted a chart showing investors and first timers leading the purchasing of homes in Canada.Price adjustments to rates won’t stall, especially when these two groups are in the drivers seat driving demand. They will adjust expectations immediately.

The Feds will be doing the next rounds of QE and rate cutting by 2024.

#90 Jane Finch on 11.12.21 at 12:32 am

Trudeau and the BOC are in charge of our national finances. They are directly responsible for the rampant house price inflation. They’ve falsely blamed everyone else , from climate change to Chinese nationals. Everyone except themselves. In order to borrow and spend irrationally Trudeau has kept the rates at zero. The BOC obliged. Both these parties know the damage they inflict on an entire generation . I sincerely hope that the truth gets pounded into the dense skulls of voters . When Trudeau calls Fallon and offers $50 million like it’s an afterthought and sends a billion to Senegal’s oil industry or the Clinton Foundation etc etc etc like
chump change you should understand it’s you who’ll pay not him.

#91 Sign of the Times on 11.12.21 at 12:57 am

Oh I forgot to mention, guess who showed up just as the ceremony was ending? The anti-vaxxers. You’d think they would have something better to do than harass a bunch of veterans and boy scouts but no.

#92 Faron on 11.12.21 at 1:30 am

#66 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 5:38 pm

Ah, yes. The high ground. Look forward to next time you pompously claim that you don’t sling insults. In the mean time, keep talkin’ that ethics! You’ll figure it out one day.

#70 Penny Henny on 11.11.21 at 6:31 pm

I’m actually pretty good at communicating with members of my own species — Homo sapiens. Somehow I just can’t reach the likes of you and the others I’ve engaged with since I dared to correct a factual error in yesterday’s blog. Shrug.

#79 IHCTD9 on 11.11.21 at 8:33 pm

I’ve about hit my limit for 50+ year old dudes going back and forth day after day without end.

Likewise.

#93 Bezengy on 11.12.21 at 7:00 am

We certainly are disconnected from reality. From my perspective the issue is that Trudeau has failed to grow our economy. This isn’t just a Covid issue but failed government policy. All of this new money sloshing around the economy should have government revenues exploding, instead they have flatlined at approx $300 billion, and the new money has gone directly into this black hole of housing, or other non productive activity.

Just look at this snippet I pulled from the web. Were in deep trouble. What a disaster this government has been.

“Canada gdp growth rate for 2020 was -5.40%, a 7.26% decline from 2019. Canada gdp growth rate for 2019 was 1.86%, a 0.57% decline from 2018. Canada gdp growth rate for 2018 was 2.43%, a 0.61% decline from 2017.”

#94 Wrk.dover on 11.12.21 at 7:26 am

#86 CARS on 11.11.21 at 10:05 pm
Has anyone clued into this car obesity issue?
______________________________

There is a button battery inside the electronic control unit to retain memory, the rest of the batteries used in cars weigh much more than your knowledge of battery weight does.

A classic mini weighs 1400lb. Maybe that 38hp car is what you are looking for.

#95 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 7:51 am

@#86 Roxy Music
“It’s the weight people! Soccer moms don’t need 6000lbs cars to drive kids to practice.”

+++

Cars didnt have front and side airbags.
Onboard sensors to tell you a car is beside you when a mirror worked just fine.
Onboard maps to tell you where the nearest Tim Hortons is.
Onboard computers to record everything you do so the police, the insurance, and the Garage will know what you did in the minutes before the crash.
TV’s front and back…. to keep the brats amused.
Cell phones tied to the stereo.
Heated steering wheels, heated mirrors and heated seats.
ABS brakes, pollution control, 10 speed transmissions, Environmentally friendly A/C for the front and back, plastic radiators, oil coolers, transmission coolers, on and on and on.

1000 extra pounds of crap compared to a 1976 Honda Civic that was way more fun to drive summer or winter….?
Yep.

#96 oops on 11.12.21 at 8:11 am

#66 Sail Away on 11.11.21 at 5:38 pm

HA!

Game. Set. Match.

#97 Yansong Gao on 11.12.21 at 8:19 am

My observation is housings prices are due to massive immigration , low construction rates , municipal planning and influx of money by non residents hoping it keep assets away from their foreign government is pushing Canadian middle class to extinction. You families can not afford to have or house their children.

#98 NoName on 11.12.21 at 8:37 am

@86 Fat cars

https://cdn.acidcow.com/pics/20150821/acid_picdump_97.jpg

Probably average European grew 20cm or more in last 100 yrs. Funny thing what forward facing eyes, pointy tooth protein and occasional vaccine does to people…

https://ourworldindata.org/human-height

#99 CARS on 11.12.21 at 8:49 am

#94 Wrk.dover

When two cars that are nearly identical in size, capacity and capability with the main and really key difference being one is a V6 and the other a V6 hybrid are 800lbs apart, that 800lbs of hybrid motors and batteries is not carbon free.

It’s actually funny because according to Car and Driver the Lexus RX with the fancy Hybrid V6 and nearly 1.5s slower 0-100 performance than the standard V6.

Are these hybrids a scam? A distraction?

Your example of the Mini is not inline with today, but it’s really closer to the truth of where we need to get.

Add 500lbs to it. Double the HP. Is that a bad car for nearly EVERYONE? Under 2000lbs, under 75hp – light and nimble. Are you telling me that wouldn’t be possible? Are you saying this wouldn’t be a HUGE efficiency improvement with what fuel the world uses?

How are light cars not a solution to the issue? We know electric cars are a scam and certainly not green. These hybrids are just added weight and complexity likely shortening the lifespan of the car as well.

Simple. Light. Efficient. Fun. Is this impossible?

#100 Dragonfly 58 on 11.12.21 at 9:21 am

CARS, you are right. But the modern car buyer want’s little part of simple , relatively light cars.
Most child bearing, and child raising age people want to be driving an armored personal carrier , not a econobox.
Last car I bought was a Hyundai Accent, and I had a very difficult time even finding a base model, manual trans. example.
Dealers all said no one wanted them, so they didn’t order any in. Finally found one and it has been a very good car. And as you say ,light nimble, peppy , very good on gas, easy to park, easy to live with, and easy to pay for.
They don’t even make them anymore. Pity, mine has 300,000 on the clock now and may need replacement in the next few years. Guess I will just have to hunt for a very low mile used example.

#101 Tony on 11.12.21 at 9:24 am

Re: #4 Shawn Allen on 11.11.21 at 1:34 pm

Canadians paying all cash will likely lose their shirts being in U.S. dollars instead of Canadian dollars in the coming years. In other words the house will be worth a lot less when converted back to Canadian dollars. Right idea but you have to be an American living in America.

#102 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 9:28 am

@#98 NoName.

Interesting article.

I liked the conclusions of our crappy North American diet and our declining height…..

In the 19th century, North Americans were the tallest in the world, but fell behind over the course of the 20th century. The study attributes this partly to nutrition, arguing that “there are reasons to believe that US diets are deficient to some extent as nearly a half of households’ food expenditure is spent on food outside of the home.15 This is troubling insofar as meals consumed outside of the home are less balanced than those consumed at family dinners.

I’ll ponder that statement when I stop in line at the nearest Drive Through at Tim’s for my Breakfast steak sandwich…….

#103 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 9:33 am

@#97 Wise Gao

“My observation is housings prices are due to massive immigration , low construction rates , municipal planning and influx of money by non residents hoping it keep assets away from their foreign government is pushing Canadian middle class to extinction. You families can not afford to have or house their children.”

+++++

Everything you have stated is true….. unfortunately voters are easily fooled by free money and lies.

#104 Dharma Bum on 11.12.21 at 9:38 am

Canadian flags are back!
It’s a relief to see that the wokesters, hipsters, SJWs, Trudeaus, lefties, treehuggers, LGBTQers, feminazis, dippers, BCers, kebeckers, and the rest of the Canada haters didn’t hijack Remembrance Day for their own twisted and misguided agenda.
Could it be we’re getting back on the right track?
Hope so.
Enough already.

#105 Love_The_Cottage on 11.12.21 at 9:59 am

#97 Yansong Gao on 11.12.21 at 8:19 am
My observation is housings prices are due to massive immigration , low construction rates….
_____
Agreed, I don’t understand why the discussion here focuses on demand and little on the supply side. People have to live somewhere, increase the supply of homes/condos and the price will eventually go down. Unless everything I learned while trying to stay awake during Economics 101 at UofT was wrong.

#106 Don Guillermo on 11.12.21 at 10:06 am

#87 the Jaguar on 11.11.21 at 11:12 pm

I too find this period fascinating. I read People of Abyss. I believe someone on this blog brought it up awhile back. It may have even been you. I’ll look for the other two online.

In the 1890’s when 8 or 9, Grampa Jim’s family brought him to Northern Alberta from Minnesota. They came by horse drawn wagon and homesteaded in the Lac la Biche area. As mentioned previously I have no idea why. Must have been bad at google, Ha! I watched the moon landing with Grampa Jim in ’69.

My mother’s side came around the same time from Iowa and homesteaded close to Vulcan. Better at google I guess. I have much less info on their history but I remember my mother saying that her father used to go back and forth from farming to the coal mines in southern Alberta and SE BC. I wouldn’t surprised if our families’ crossed paths.

Thanks for the book tips.

#107 CARS on 11.12.21 at 10:20 am

#98 NoName

I googled Car Obesity – I got a whole different result.
Cars make us obese apparently, and then we need more obese cars…probably. As with every product – we must stop the cycle of consumption it appears for our own good and that of the planet.

//////

A recent study of the link between driving and obesity showed a result that surprised even its lead researcher: Every 30 minutes you spend each day in a car increases your risk of being obese by 3%.

“Three percent for a half-hour is a heck of a result,” says Lawrence D. Frank, PhD, who led the Georgia Institute of Technology study involving nearly 11,000 Atlanta-area residents.

https://www.webmd.com/fitness-exercise/features/is-your-car-making-you-fat#1

#108 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 10:23 am

Gee.
I expected the next world war to start in Asia…..

Perhaps Putin has other ideas…

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/europe-is-danger-top-diplomat-propose-eu-military-doctrine-2021-11-10/

Or maybe Russia’s dictator and China’s “Leader for Life” have a bigger ideas dreamt up…

#109 IHCTD9 on 11.12.21 at 10:24 am

#95 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 7:51 am
@#86 Roxy Music
“It’s the weight people! Soccer moms don’t need 6000lbs cars to drive kids to practice.”

+++

Cars didnt have front and side airbags.
Onboard sensors to tell you a car is beside you when a mirror worked just fine.
Onboard maps to tell you where the nearest Tim Hortons is.
Onboard computers to record everything you do so the police, the insurance, and the Garage will know what you did in the minutes before the crash.
TV’s front and back…. to keep the brats amused.
Cell phones tied to the stereo.
Heated steering wheels, heated mirrors and heated seats.
ABS brakes, pollution control, 10 speed transmissions, Environmentally friendly A/C for the front and back, plastic radiators, oil coolers, transmission coolers, on and on and on.

1000 extra pounds of crap compared to a 1976 Honda Civic that was way more fun to drive summer or winter….?
Yep.
____

They are getting porky for sure. Filled with gadgets and widgets I’ll never use or even learn how to use. The new stuff is nice, but I find the old stuff more appealing. Simple, mechanical, light, cheap to run, and reliable if you pick the right ones. A popular 20-30 year old vehicle will have every possible repair and troubleshoot already figured out and neatly packaged for your education in YouTube format.

Looking at my new (old) truck – there isn’t a single new truck out there that can offer me everything this thing does on the practical front. The few downsides being lack of refinement and power. More up than down IMHO.

#110 45north on 11.12.21 at 10:35 am

What do these graphs tell us about Canadians and the money we hand over for houses? “Prices are totally disconnected from the fundamentals,” says Doyle. Therefore it’s neither logic nor economic basics driving real estate to the highest relative level in the industrialized world. Nah, it’s emotion. And bad advice. Clearly it’s dangerous to allow housing to represent such a big chunk of the economy. And it cannot last.

the Liberals promise there’ll be no consequences and the worse they look the better the promises. Which is probably the reason the Liberals were re-elected. But it’ll be like the story in the Gospel “The hired man, since he is not the shepherd and the sheep do not belong to him, abandons the sheep as soon as he sees a wolf coming, and runs away, and then the wolf attacks and scatters the sheep;”

#111 Don Guillermo on 11.12.21 at 10:38 am

#87 the Jaguar on 11.11.21 at 11:12 pm

I wouldn’t surprised if our families’ crossed paths.
************************
Jag, when I think of the family histories such as yours and mine I think of the saying that’s bantered around this blog occasionally. “Hard times create strong men”.

Our families ‘were’ these strong men and women that gave us the great life we have today and should always be remembered. I make sure to pass my stories down to younger members of my family. Thanks for your story Jag.

#112 45north on 11.12.21 at 10:54 am

CARS

How are light cars not a solution to the issue? We know electric cars are a scam and certainly not green. These hybrids are just added weight and complexity likely shortening the lifespan of the car as well.

the car industry has gone to huge efforts to make engines lighter. Huge engineering efforts to make aluminium heads and blocks. Lots of mistakes on the way. We’re talking 70 – 80 lbs! 500 lbs ain’t free.

#113 Phylis on 11.12.21 at 11:20 am

#100 Dragonfly 58 on 11.12.21 at 9:21 am
CARS, you are right. But the modern car buyer want’s little part of simple , relatively light cars.
Most child bearing, and child raising age people want to be driving an armored personal carrier , not a econobox.
Last car I bought was a Hyundai Accent, and I had a very difficult time even finding a base model, manual trans. example.
Dealers all said no one wanted them, so they didn’t order any in. Finally found one and it has been a very good car. And as you say ,light nimble, peppy , very good on gas, easy to park, easy to live with, and easy to pay for.
They don’t even make them anymore. Pity, mine has 300,000 on the clock now and may need replacement in the next few years. Guess I will just have to hunt for a very low mile used example.
Xxxxx
yep, up selling is the name of the game. It’s hard to pump a commodity. Well, unless it is oil, ha ha.

#114 Dragonfly 58 on 11.12.21 at 11:28 am

In the 1970’s I had a 1969 Lotus Europa with a alloy engine. French Renault engine that Lotus used due to its price and extremely light weight.
So even 50 years ago they were on the market.
The 1960’s versions had a few problems. But Renault developed the same basic engine into a very reliable turbo version as used in the Fuego. One of the last Renault’s sold in North America. Even that is now 40 year old tech. So nothing particularly ” new ” about alloy engines.

#115 Wrk.dover on 11.12.21 at 11:34 am

#99 CARS on 11.12.21 at 8:49 am
Add 500lbs to it. Double the HP. Is that a bad car for nearly EVERYONE? Under 2000lbs, under 75hp – light and nimble. Are you telling me that wouldn’t be possible? Are you saying this wouldn’t be a HUGE efficiency improvement with what fuel the world uses?
_____________________________

Now you are up to a Ford pinto!

Can’t pay dividends on that. Cars are sold by the pound, hence Fartz’s recipe being so popular.
#95 crowdedelevatorfartz on 11.12.21 at 7:51 am

At the height of inflation, BLM was making about 20 bucks on a $2000 retail mini. Warrantee work would have killed them, if they had actually done some of it.

Reminds me of the Tesla profit situation. Rivian will be a beaut too!

I think I’ll help pay GM’s legacy costs on my future electric car purchase, and deal with a car company, not a meme.

#116 CARS on 11.12.21 at 11:52 am

#112 45north

The industry is CLEARLY not making cars lighter.

I just showed you how in 5 years a car you could buy from Toyota added 40hp, 800lbs, fancy hybrid powertrain that slowed the car down by 25% from 0-100km, and claims to be efficient. Oh, It also costs $25,000 more

The industry is absolutely NOT making lighter cars.

I looked into it, only one car comes close. 2021 Mazda Miata MX-5. 2341lbs. Issue is of course, 2 seater.

Wait a minute…let me check something.

NOPE.

There is nothing smaller in their lineup. Mazda CX-3 68lbs shy of chubby 3000lbs as well, for such a small car.

But hey, this little 4cyl pudgy CX-3 pulls 0-60mph in same time as the fancy V6 hybrid Lexus 450h! Hilarious.

#100 Dragonfly 58

What does this tell you Dragonfly? They make this nonsense for us?

I remember going to F1 races in Montreal. 500kg V10 cars pushing crazy power.

We can’t do 1000kg 4cyl 100hp safe and fun?

Nonsense.

It would be bad for margins and bad for those expensive stupid SUVs. In Europe they still have such choices still, but even for them those choices are thinning out fast.

#117 CARS on 11.12.21 at 12:03 pm

You guys remember Colin Chapman talking about his Formula 1 cars? “Simply add lightness!”

Look at what Gordon Murray is doing today. He’s the man who gave us the McLaren F1 road car, still probably the lightest and fastest naturally aspirated car on the planet until his new thing comes out. He’s working on that new T.50, the successor to the McLaren F1.

Where as the three seater V12 McLaren F1 was an amazing 2500lbs (remember, the Mazda Miata MX-5 is 2341lbs!), the Gordon Murray T.50 will come in with 3 seats, V12 at 2174lbs! This is a man who understand how to add lightness to a car, and what that means.

For perspective:
Lamborghini Huracán comes in at 3423lbs!
Ferrari 812 Superfast comes it at 3845lbs!
Ferrari F8 comes in at 3164lbs.
McLaren 720S comes in at 3128lbs.
Chevrolet Corvette (C8) comes in at 3366lbs

Don’t these car makers think 1000-1700lbs makes a difference?

Even the Euro sports cars are going obese. Disappointing.

#118 Wrk.dover on 11.12.21 at 12:11 pm

Speaking of Rivian, valued at 100 billion, if I buy a million dollars of stock I will own a hundred thousandth of the company, so every time they earn a billion dollars, I will receive ten thousand dollars (if they decide to pay a dividend rather than buy their own share back with the profit).

That hurts my head.

Maybe I will buy a thousand dollars worth to make a quick ten dollar bill from time to time.

Seesh, no wonder that stock is in demand!

#119 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.12.21 at 12:23 pm

If you want to know how the car culture has contributed to the ever expanding waist line of Americans:
Just study the lifestyle of the Amish:
Few cancers, no heart disease and diabetes.

And the gadgets don’t make that much difference in weight.
The cars are just getting bigger, plain and simple.
Soon we’ll measure the monsters in tons not lbs.
It’s funny, they say: dogs tend to resemble their owners.
Same goes for cars.

#120 Sail Away on 11.12.21 at 12:54 pm

#119 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.12.21 at 12:23 pm

It’s funny, they say: dogs tend to resemble their owners.

——–

All my dogs are stunningly handsome, smart, skillful, pleasant to be around and the absolute epitome of fitness.

During annual vet visits, the vet often remarks, ‘What a specimen!’ and also sometimes comments on the dog’s condition.

#121 IHCTD9 on 11.12.21 at 12:55 pm

#116 CARS on 11.12.21 at 11:52 am
#112 45north

The industry is CLEARLY not making cars lighter.
___

Google up the Ariel Atom, I think you’ll like it. They make a 500 hp version that weighs 1349 lbs. That’s just a touch more than my lawnmower. It does 0-60’s in the low 2 second range – slicks would drop that solidly in the 1 second zone. It’s the braking that is really nuts: 100-0 MPH in 3.5 seconds. The 0-100-0 times are also crazy, literally in F1 car territory if spec’d out right.

Not the best for the daily grind though.

#122 WTF on 11.12.21 at 12:59 pm

The Bank Of Mom better get a lawyer. Or perhaps Chad or Karen could stand on their own like adults usually do.

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/family-disputes-over-gifted-down-payments-on-the-rise-law-firm-1.1680666

Inevitable.

#123 Dragonfly 58 on 11.12.21 at 1:02 pm

Check out this video Cars. What more does anyone need ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kat79zrVDQg

#124 IHCTD9 on 11.12.21 at 1:06 pm

#114 Dragonfly 58 on 11.12.21 at 11:28 am
In the 1970’s I had a 1969 Lotus Europa with a alloy engine. French Renault engine that Lotus used due to its price and extremely light weight.
So even 50 years ago they were on the market.
The 1960’s versions had a few problems. But Renault developed the same basic engine into a very reliable turbo version as used in the Fuego. One of the last Renault’s sold in North America. Even that is now 40 year old tech. So nothing particularly ” new ” about alloy engines.
___

Buick had an all aluminum V8 back in the 60’s too. I think aluminum is back because of modern casting techniques and coatings allows making aluminum castings accurate and cheap as you don’t need iron liners in the cylinders anymore, the pistons run directly on the coated aluminum bores. I think aluminum is also better on the emissions front, and definitely on the power front. Other benefits are light weight, easy repair, and easy recycle.

#125 IHCTD9 on 11.12.21 at 1:17 pm

#119 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.12.21 at 12:23 pm

It’s funny, they say: dogs tend to resemble their owners.
Same goes for cars.
___

Looking at my crusty, old, loud, non-emissions, bald tired spectacle of vehicular curmudgeonism – you may be right on that.

#126 Don Guillermo on 11.12.21 at 1:20 pm

#119 Ponzius Pilatus on 11.12.21 at 12:23 pm

It’s funny, they say: dogs tend to resemble their owners.
Same goes for cars.
*****************************************
I think it’s the other way around.
For example, I’m starting to look like a 3131 lb 911.

#127 Kato on 11.12.21 at 3:00 pm

I have a 2300 lb, 1984 Dodge Rampage with 96 horsepower and a 5-speed manual. It would win no races, but keeps up with city and highway traffic fine.

I don’t know about the added weight, but a modern car is a fortress compared to the Rampage. A crash you would walk away from in a modern car would land you in the hospital or the graveyard in the old Dodge.

#128 Karl Hungus on 11.12.21 at 3:17 pm

Hey, I’m an accountant…what’s wrong with our advice!? ;)

#129 Satori on 11.12.21 at 3:38 pm

#70 Penny Henry

Agreed, well said both, but as you can see from the replies from Faron, that might take at least five – six decades.

#130 Nonplused on 11.12.21 at 3:56 pm

#124 IHCTD9 on 11.12.21 at 1:06 pm

Anyone remember the Chevy Vega? These things were burning oil when they left the factory.