The traitor

A passionate Twitter thread yesterday started when the wife of a federal worker sobbed about the coming termination of her husband. “We will never be vaccinated,” she wrote. “This is so unfair. They are Nazis.”

Hundreds responded. Most referenced freedom. God and Jesus, too. Several posted pictures of Crusade knights, the dudes who freely chose death over submission to infidels. I gave the iPad to Dorothy and told her to read a few dozen. That was a mistake.

This morning another anti-Garth email arrived. A daily occurrence lately. This one was signed – by Andy. From Langley, it appears.

I’m glad they stole your flag from you, even for the wrong reasons, needless to say. The way you’ve become pro big pharma and anti-freedom to choose, you no longer get zero sympathy from me.

You sir I now consider a traitor.  Perhaps you ought to read the Nuremberg Code and see its relevance here.  The mandatory vaccines violate fundamental human rights – and remarkably, you’re a goddamn cheerleader! I only wish I lived in your neighborhood so I could spit these things in your face!

On the Internet, everyone’s a knight.

A common image on anti-vax social media. Source: Twitter
.

Yesterday was a big one for Covid. The feds formalized their vaccine mandate for all public service employees, RCMP, border service offices and other agencies. The post office and the military are following. NS did the same. BC, too. Edmonton teachers have to be vaxed. MPPs in Ontario. Everybody, soon, who flies in Canada. Long-term care workers in most places, too. Quebec’s health care workers need to be inoculated to continue working. The banks have a vaccine mandate for all employees as do, increasingly, all major corporations. And while almost 80% of Canadians are fully dosed, millions are not. Nor any of the children. Unknown yet is whether schools will have a mandate and, if so, how ant-vax parents will respond. And, as you know, vaccine passports are becoming standard across the country. No QR code? No service.

The economic and financial implications of this are profound. Now the media is bristling with stories about looming terminations. This pathetic (and apparently fascist) blog told you this would be coming months ago – and that anti-vax employees would lose their battle.

That’s now being confirmed by employment lawyers across the country. Here’s a key statement from one: “We’re going to see the biggest wave of terminations we’ve seen since the pandemic started. It will be significant.”

Indeed. And the deluge will be starting with the federal government in mid-November. As workers are sent home without pay, then dismissed, for non-compliance with the vax mandate many will pay eager lawyers and try suing. What a waste that will be. Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences. When dealing with a virus that debilitates and kills, there’s no choice. Some personal rights and freedoms are overcome by the common good. This is not the Wild West. It’s not anarchy. It ain’t the Crusades.

Having said this, termination usually brings a settlement of some kind, especially for employees of large organizations. Getting vaccinated wasn’t in anyone’s employment contract before 2021, so there’s a case for wrongful dismissal. The costs will be consequential for employers, as they will be for ‘pro-choice’ employees who chose unemployment. The anti-jabbers should not look for much sympathy from the courts, where every judge will be fully dosed. In a public health emergency, all the rules change.

For investors, vaccine mandates are something Mr. Market likes. A lot. Lately financial assets have been rattled by Delta, the 4th Wave, inflation and CB tapering. Bond yields continue to spike, posing competition to equities. But a national vax rate of 80%, then 90% along with workplaces humming and productivity restored will help the reopening trade continue. Less than a third of the world’s population has seen any vaccine yet, so North America – especially Canada – is in a sweet spot to benefit from the global GDP expansion which will come over the next two years.

The jab is good for the economy and prosperity. Tonic for the markets. Essential for the health care sector. It makes all of us safer. It takes courage, selflessness and faith. We save a bunch of families from burying their loved ones, too.

Jesus would like that. Go do it, Andy.

About the picture: “Here’s a picture of our dour looking Basset named Randall. He’s 13 years old but still wakes us up each morning for his walk to the dog park and gives us
crooked tooth grins during treat time. This guy brings all kinds of joy to our lives and I think we do the same for him. He’s one of those gentle, affable creatures, like some humans (not me) that have no idea how much joy they bring to the world. But, I guess that sums up our relationships with dogs in general and why they are so prominent in our lives. Especially in our present era.”

381 comments ↓

#1 Felix on 10.07.21 at 1:13 pm

“The traitor”

So true.

All dogawful mutts are traitors to humans and the planet.

#2 Immigrant man on 10.07.21 at 1:16 pm

Mr.Turner, I think your blog is about to become a lot more popular. Its one thing to to give free financial advice… booorrring… but talk about vax – the comments section will be growing faster that GTA RE prices!

#3 mitzerboyakaQueencitykidd on 10.07.21 at 1:17 pm

Dogs are great
beer is good
some people are crazy anti vaxxerz

#4 Dave on 10.07.21 at 1:17 pm

“you no longer get zero sympathy from me”

So, you’re getting some sympathy, at least.

#5 unbalanced on 10.07.21 at 1:20 pm

One of your best write ups to date. Thanks

#6 SunShowers on 10.07.21 at 1:20 pm

“Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences”

Sounds like a great argument for more paid sick days, even when covid is history. How many people do you know have come to work with colds? Flus? Stomach bugs? Just because they can’t afford the time off.

If you make people choose between getting money and getting better, they’ll choose money every time, which puts everyone else at risk.

#7 Murray the Vet on 10.07.21 at 1:22 pm

Andy states, “you no longer get zero sympathy from me.”
Unintended mixed message as now he implies his sympathy will at least exceed zero!

#8 None on 10.07.21 at 1:23 pm

I disagree with you on a few of your world views – specifically about ‘right to generate excessive wealth at the expense of everyone else” but I agree with you 100% on the vaccine mandates. Legal and necessary.

#9 X on 10.07.21 at 1:24 pm

As a health care worker, I am surprised it has not been mandated for all health care providers.

It may help employers having difficulty filling job vacancies with warm bodies, if all receiving government subsidies had to get vaccinated to continue receiving government cheques. Although the catch being they may or may not be required to have a dose or two to work.

#10 Jesus is my vaccine on 10.07.21 at 1:24 pm

I couldn’t resist :)

#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

Prescient words, Garth.

“It takes courage, selflessness and faith.”

Now, will Erin and the Boomer Cons have these same qualities, and insist that all their right wing MPs provide proof of vaccination to enter Parliament?

Or will we see more Conservative hypocrisy and extremism at play and denial of reality.

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.

#12 RWZM on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

“Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences. When dealing with a virus that debilitates and kills, there’s no choice”

Next they’ll apply that rationale to white males with Canadian flags. You make people unsafe.

The vast majority of people who die from Covid are already at the age where you die of natural causes. And probably not working. The risk to vaccinated people of average workplace age by unvaccinated people is practically nothing.

It isn’t that there’s no possible threat that could warrant government mandates. It’s just that this obviously isn’t one. The idea that this is necessary is borne out of chronic anxiety issues, the Internet, and neuroticism.

#13 DonM on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

I agree with you Garth. But I also agree with the other side. We are being forced to take a drug without a lengthy history of its outcomes on humans. As studies are beginning to show, they create harm in many. This is only 8 months into it and so far governments, after giving many under 30 the Moderna, are now saying to restrict it to those above 30. What implications will Moderna have on those under 30 that received it prior to the announcement?

I miss being able to hit the pub (screw the sports), but I cannot bring myself to taking either until there is at least 3 years of history and research behind it. Does this make me an anit-vaxxer?

Seriously? 6.4 billion doses have been administered. – Garth

#14 Dave on 10.07.21 at 1:34 pm

A significant portion of anti-vaxx sentiment (99%?) would be eliminated if facebook was shut down.

It’s time to delete facebook and extricate ourselves from social media.

#15 Leftover on 10.07.21 at 1:35 pm

It comes down to rights and implied obligations.

For example, you have the right to free speech but that does not imply an obligation on a newspaper to publish your letter to the editor.

I have the right to my own person, and can refuse to get vaccinated, but that does not imply an obligation on society to give me access to settings where I might spread disease.

Can’t have it both ways.

#16 Mark on 10.07.21 at 1:38 pm

“this violates my personal freedoms! you are a traitor for supporting it!”

Wow. It must be so nice to have such a simplified perception of reality when it comes to this whole vaccine thing. To be able to trivialize insanely complex topics and think that you understand all of the reasoning, logic, consequences and trade-offs that ultimately led to a new public health policy, better than all of the experts, and to be so sure that you are correct, and to just dismiss all of the consequences of the entire branch of reality that deals with “what if I’m wrong and this vaccine actually is saving lives?”. All of it distilled down to one phrase: “you’re violating my freedoms!”. To be honest, I’m almost jealous that my brain doesn’t work this way.

#17 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 1:40 pm

Selfishness. Selflessness.

One embodies the 7 Deadly Sins.

The other the 7 Virtues.

From Aristotle to the Romans:

Virtus.

The quality of being morally good.

———————

Take heed Andy of Langley. If indeed there is A Maker, you will have much explaining to do.

Chin up Garth. You are morally good.

#18 Millenial Surrealist on 10.07.21 at 1:41 pm

#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

Prescient words, Garth.

“It takes courage, selflessness and faith.”

Now, will Erin and the Boomer Cons have these same qualities, and insist that all their right wing MPs provide proof of vaccination to enter Parliament?

Or will we see more Conservative hypocrisy and extremism at play and denial of reality.

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.

Only a hypocrite such as yourself would support the blackface surfer-boy….. propped up by the skateboarder… how do fall for such hypocrisy….. wow such deep intellects……

#19 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 1:42 pm

My concern Garth, since I know you’re eager to know of course, are the lipid nanoparticles.

The devil is in the details Garth.

These lipids until just recently have delivered significant side effects to the point that Modern’s trials failed preliminary stages in just 2017, and other Pharma gave up the mRNA game because they saw no ability to have it be a therapy. Vaccine use only.

Here:
https://www.statnews.com/2017/01/10/moderna-trouble-mrna/

Notice how evasive Moderna was about the issues with the lipids. Magically this was sorted out in such short time and order?

This is all due to the quantity of the lipids being injected in therapies. Some trials I read about are quite concerning too, won’t go into details because they don’t apply to how the vaccine is administered.

However, the key is this: No one knows what these lipids could do long terms. The concerns are valid. The majority is not always right.

I believe these mandates will not stand up in Supreme Court when challenged. To be seen. In the mean time the process delay in the process is being exploited.

If you listen to Trudeau on TV he say “everyone SHOULD be vaccinated. And the “testifying under oath to their religious beliefs” sweet mercy – is one’s decision not sufficient? Their faith must be declared under OATH? Sworn on what? The Bible?

We are losing our minds here. It’s fascinating that the vaccinated don’t see the implications of this going forward. The concerns are certainly not a nothingburger.

#20 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 1:45 pm

#13 DonM on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm
I cannot bring myself to taking either until there is at least 3 years of history and research behind it. Does this make me an anit-vaxxer?
*******************
So you’d be fine with a vaccine that was tested on say…50,000 people for 3 years, but not after 6 Billion doses have gone out over 1 year?
That doesn’t really make sense.
If there were serious side effects that were going to creep up after 3 years then tens of millions would already be experiencing them now.

So yes, it kinda does make you an anti-vaxxer, and that’s not even factoring in the social contract where those who can get vaccinated in order to protect those who can’t.

#21 I hope their right on 10.07.21 at 1:47 pm

Long term affects, anyone? I guess nobody wants to believe they don’t……. Michael Jackson song.

#22 Nonplused on 10.07.21 at 1:50 pm

I can’t wait for this whole vax vs. anti-vax thing to go away. Will we still be arguing about this in another year? I hope not.

Maybe we need an edict from heaven to make it go away like the “First!” thing did.

https://babylonbee.com/news/confirmed-people-who-comment-first-shall-be-last-in-kingdom-of-heaven

Andy exhibits every bit of “Loserthink” found in the book. Vitriol, vindictiveness, strawman, false framing of the narrative, false equivalencies, misapplied and false legal interpretations, hubris, and threats! And he did it in 85 words! I wish I had that gift of brevity. Well done Andy!

For those of you who are a bit hard of thinking, you do not have a right to your job. They can lay you off for just about any reason they like, the most common being “there isn’t a roll for you in our new organizational structure” followed by the equally vague “there isn’t an ideal “fit” within our workspace for you”. Both of which can be reverse translated to “you suck and we don’t like you so we’re firing you”. A bit of severance and out you go with a box containing your coffee cup, lunch bag, Rolodex, a bobble head doll, and a few Dilbert comics (maybe even a calendar). So anyone who figures the Nuremberg Code, which protects prisoners of war, applies to a voluntary work arrangement is just a plain idiot. Nobody is forcing you to work that job. Stay true to yourself, refuse the jab, bow your head and say “Amen”, and go find other employment. There will be lots of opportunities that probably never do require the vax.

There has also been lots of Loserthink regarding access to things like restaurants for the non-vaccinated. Somehow it has become a “right” to be able to enter a building that has more health restrictions than anything save a hospital and always did. Cockroaches in the kitchen? Closed. Salmonella in the salad? Closed. And don’t forget “no shirt, no shoes, no service”. Heck you can’t even smoke in the lounge anymore and I think I’ll take some second hand smoke over some second hand covid any day.

To that last point, I think it makes about as much sense to allow smoking in the hospitals as it does the unvaccinated to work there. After all you have a right to smoke. Just not any old place though. The authorities can decided where you may smoke and where you may not. Why shouldn’t they be able to decide where you may emit a cloud of viruses and where you may not? Smoking is safer than covid. At least over the short term.

#23 Chris Gallant on 10.07.21 at 1:56 pm

I’ve lost all sympathy for the anti-vaxxers. I have sympathy for front line health care workers.

I have sympathy for those of us that are, or have a loved, on waiting on life improving surgeries and/or delayed diagnosis. We’ve become second class citizens in the health care world…. taking a back seat to unvaxxed Covid patients.

I have sympathy for small business owners & employees trying to survive and put food on the table, teachers in classrooms with kids <12, those that suffer from mental health issues and loneliness that are struggling, kids and teens that struggled with online school, people who have lost loved ones, kids whose grade 12 year was not what they imagined, university students who missed out on a big part of the university experience….. I'm sure I've missed a few dozen along the way that have quietly done the right thing and are suffering because of anti-vaxxers.

#24 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 1:56 pm

#13 DonM

“As studies fare beginning to show…”

Cite some.

I can and published weekly since Dec of 2020 by the NHS:

“Coronavirus vaccine – weekly summary of Yellow Card reporting”

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting#analysis-of-data

Do some Division & Percent Math, if you are capable using the above numbers and this:

94.1M doses administered.

Oh what the heck, here let me do it for you:

1,717 deaths attributed to the vax or 0.00182465%.

————–

PS:

Awaiting your cited studies and The National Review does not count unless they administer and entire Health System for a Nation.

#25 Shawn C Allen on 10.07.21 at 1:56 pm

A Politically Incorrect Thought…

I wonder what the correlation is between income and vaccination status?

Between intelligence and vaccination status?

Between overall health and lifestyle choices and vaccination status?

Pretty sure it’s quite a positive correlation.

You can lead a horse (or I suppose a donkey) to water…

#26 Alberta Ed on 10.07.21 at 1:58 pm

Those of us of a certain age remember the polio epidemic and how grateful we were to get the Salk vaccine when we were kids. Even those who may have developed natural immunity after having Covid can benefit from getting vaccinated.

#27 enthalpy on 10.07.21 at 1:58 pm

I believe in everyones right to choose (And I chose the jab).
But this takes us into uncharted territory. I find the sweeping powers and continual division tactics to be quite scary.

If the big C is endemic(it is). These other changes won’t ever go away(when does Govt give up things they implement? ) .

It’s not looking good.

#28 Paterfamilias on 10.07.21 at 1:59 pm

You cannot reason with someone that cannot reason.

#29 Shawn Allen on 10.07.21 at 2:02 pm

Not that anyone cares but I did not mean to start posting with my middle initial.

#30 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:03 pm

#20 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 1:45 pm
*******************
So you’d be fine with a vaccine that was tested on say…50,000 people for 3 years, but not after 6 Billion doses have gone out over 1 year?
That doesn’t really make sense.
If there were serious side effects that were going to creep up after 3 years then tens of millions would already be experiencing them now.
*********

You are missing the point. There is a zero long-term history of these vaccines. It takes decades for some medicines to be passed unlike the Covid ones.

You failed to register the mistake governments made by allowing those under 30 to take Moderna. What other long-term effects will there be? I guess time will tell.

In the meantime, my dog dragging me to the liquor store where she gets offered a treat and I get my cold ones must take place of my favorite past time – socializing at the pub which will be a few years before I do so again. Sad. But, I respect everyone’s decisions on the matter.

#31 Dwilly on 10.07.21 at 2:03 pm

Good faith question, Garth, trying to engage on this: I do NOT agree with “FREEDOM! and nevermind that I live in a society / I should be able to do that I want” mindset.

Putting that aside, I want to think thru the consequences & practicality of this policy.

1) It seems to me that the “protection” granted by vaccines wanes with time. Even Lefty CNN agrees now. https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/06/health/pfizer-vaccine-waning-immunity/index.html

2) If this is true, then what will be the implications & next steps?

a) Is the hope that, if we all are forced to get it “now”, then Covid will go away and not come back? Is that realistic?

b) If not, then it seems to me that one’s vaccine passport has a time-dependent factor?

Does this mean we all need a booster every 6mo? For….ever? Do you & supporters of this policy support this? (a need to permanently periodically update?)

If not, then doesn’t this somewhat render these things a little moot?

And this is to say nothing of the negative consequences of the policy, collectively and individually, which do exist. I think a public policy ought to be “more upside than downside” and I am not sure this does that, outside the short term..?

Where is my logic flawed?

#32 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:06 pm

DELETED. Never, ever trivialize deaths. – Garth

#33 Adam Provencher on 10.07.21 at 2:09 pm

Obviously the vaccine mandates are a huge infringement on personal liberties and freedoms. The people advocating for vaccine mandates should at least admit that they are infringing on personal freedom and liberties even if they view the mandates as being for the “greater good.”

When I got jab last week they asked me to give my consent to receive the jab. I said how can I consent when I’m being coerced (plane travel, restaurants, gyms, trains, work, are off limits otherwise). I gave them my “consent” anyways.

With this coercion the medical professionals giving these jabs should at least stop pretending that people can still consent to receiving this jab.

So, how did you like the lockdowns? – Garth

#34 Mean Gene on 10.07.21 at 2:10 pm

Any unionized federal snivel servants have to utilized their unions for ANY dismissals etc and the joyous Public Sector Labour Relations Board to resolve their grievances, a slow process.

The lady from Langley needs to get a better paying job and stop practicing hypergamy… and stop chewing aluminum food wrap.

#35 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:10 pm

DELETED. Never, ever trivialize deaths. – Garth

Sorry, Garth. My bad.

#36 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 2:11 pm

#16 Mark

Too funny.

THAT was good.

—————–

#27 enthalpy*

*Entropy.

Recall:

ΔG=ΔH−TΔS

And as we all know since time immemorial and the advent of the thermometer, there is no such thing as a Free Lunch; hence, ΔH will always lose to TΔS.

Mother Nature knows this well.

#37 Soviet Capitalist on 10.07.21 at 2:14 pm

Saving some, killing others; it seems the younger one is, the higher the chances of hearth issues from the vaccine.
Some people are calling anti-vaxxers cowards and selfish because they themselves are acting afraid and selfish risking other people’s health for personal interest.
There’s also the unanswered question of why people with natural immunity still need to be forced to vaccinate.
There’s hypocrisy everywhere disguised under the umbrella of ‘science’, courage and selflessness.

#38 Dave on 10.07.21 at 2:16 pm

I have anti-vaxxer inlaws and I’ve already told my wife that I probably wouldn’t be able to go to their funeral if the worst were to happen.

How could I possibly sit there in mourning for somebody who spent months posting anti-vax nonsense on social media? Someone who, based on their stated beliefs, thinks of me as a sucker and a “sheep”?

#39 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 2:18 pm

#155 ImGonnaBeSick on 10.07.21 at 12:28 pm
#147 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 11:33 am

Re: Heloc

It seems like the timing would be perfect. You have already covered the majority of 2 years’ interest in 3 months. I’m very interested in who is using this strategy.

Whenever it’s mentioned, I find myself spending some time in front of spreadsheets. I would consider myself an above-moderate risk taker. You seem to have a balanced portfolio for this. Is the reason for overweight Canada for the dividend tax credit? I can’t say that I know what RSG is however.

Is this method a no-brainer if you have the resources?

Good fortunes ol’ boy, and I know I’ll be back to a running scenarios now…

——-

Thanks!

Anytime in the last 1 1/2 years would have been good timing… and honestly, right now is also good.

This portfolio is 40% US / 10% Intl / 50% CDN and is one we often start with for simplicity when there’s a pile of CDN $ to deploy. The single 10% stock holding varies between BRK, RSG, WM, CP/CN Rail. All solid companies with excellent historical returns. US waste management companies RSG and WM have been very good to us over many years.

Divvie tax credit factors in a bit.

I try to avoid giving advice or recommendations.

#40 yvr_lurker on 10.07.21 at 2:19 pm

Even if you are reluctant, I believe that there are times when you just need to trust STEM. Some of the world’s leading molecular biologists and scientists were involved in formulating the MNRA vaccines and providing a delivery platform. I predict that a nobel prize for this achievement will be forthcoming. It is frankly amazing that this was accomplished in such a time frame, and that Gov’ts ponied up $$ resources to undertake rather extensive trials, but over a short period.

Yes, what has gone on is an outlier in so many ways; no trials over XXXX years, there are indeed some uber-low probability but serious side-effects (mainly with Astrozenica) and certain mega Pharms have had huge profits. However, to me, these issues are more secondary.

All things considered, I was willing to trust the integrity and skill of these wordwide leading scientists, and have taken the shots. COVID can be a killer, and frankly my dog needs someone to feed him and take him on walks. Can’t do this from an ICU room.

#41 palebird on 10.07.21 at 2:20 pm

Well where to begin. It seems that there is a goalpost that keeps moving in Canada. Are we after zero covid? You do understand that this is an impossibility right? You do understand that anyone who has had covid and recovered is many times over more protected than someone who has been jabbed? Ok then. So what are we doing here people. This is full blown bureaucratic nonsense. So Canadian and so predictable. And it is not going to work. But everyone is standing around wringing their hands over the poor health care workers. I thought they signed up to work “Healthcare”. Oh well guess not. Not boasting, just saying I have travelled the world a few times in my life and have never seen a country such as this which is completely consumed by their almighty health care system. And it is really not that good. There are many other countries in the world that are far more efficient. Oh well. This is a nightmare and it will not end well.

#42 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 2:20 pm

#31 Dwilly

Your non sequitur logic ends at your (the flaw):

2) If this is true, then what will be the implications & next steps?

Answer:

Booster shot, you know just like they give for the Flu every year.

What we are doing in the UK & EU as I type.

————-

The passport remains in effect in Italia* for another year but more likely until the Pandemic is over thanks to herd immunity via vaccination and survived infection about equal to:

90% vaxd (so far with what we know about Delta).

How difficult can that be to rationalize without it ever even being a question.

* Nobody bellyaching here or in persnickety France either. Advice:

Stop watching and reading American news. It twists the mind.

#43 jal on 10.07.21 at 2:21 pm

Everything that I know come from reading.

Find a solution to minimize the bad effects, before it too late.
Your children will get vaccinated without your approval.
Making your children vomit will not work at getting rid of the poison.

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/pfizer-asks-fda-approve-covid-jab-children-young-5

“children rarely become severely ill” from COVID.

Pfizer’s submission coincides with the release of new study data which appears to confirm that the protection provided by the Pfizer jab starts to wane after a couple of months – even earlier than many experts had expected.

#44 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 2:25 pm

#30 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:03 pm
#20 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 1:45 pm
You are missing the point. There is a zero long-term history of these vaccines. It takes decades for some medicines to be passed unlike the Covid ones.
****************
That’s simply false. They absolutely did not test the polio vaccine for “decades”.

Think about it: imagine if they created these covid vaccines but no one was able to get them until 2040.
“Decades” of waiting during a pandemic? That’s not how it works.

The most illogical part about the anti-vax argument regarding long-term side effects has got to be the fact of “long-haulers” There are several extremely common terrible side effects from catching Covid and comparatively none from the vaccines.

So it’s a choice between:
1. Proven terrible side effects from Covid (including death FFS)
2. Vaccines with maybe possibly but most likely not something in 3,10,50 years

Seriously? If you haven’t yet, I really think you should search Covid Long Haulers

#45 Adam on 10.07.21 at 2:28 pm

Obviously the vaccine mandates are a huge infringement on personal liberties and freedoms. The people advocating for vaccine mandates should at least admit that they are infringing on personal freedom and liberties even if they view the mandates as being for the “greater good.”

When I got jab last week they asked me to give my consent to receive the jab. I said how can I consent when I’m being coerced (plane travel, restaurants, gyms, trains, work, are off limits otherwise). I gave them my “consent” anyways.

With this coercion the medical professionals giving these jabs should at least stop pretending that people can still consent to receiving this jab.

So, how did you like the lockdowns? – Garth

Lockdowns are are also a huge infringement to personal freedoms and liberties. I don’t support lockdowns either.

Sweden had neither lockdowns nor vaccine mandates and they made it through Covid-19 with their citizens’ rights and liberties fully intact.

Once we make it through Covid-19 how will governments look at civil rights and personal freedoms going forward. When will the next “emergency” come and take away more liberties?

Every day your liberties are contained. Try driving on the sidewalk, not wearing pants to work or fishing out of season. Society is a compromise. You surrender liberties, you receive benefits. Grow up. – Garth

#46 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:30 pm

#39 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 2:18 pm

Divvie tax credit factors in a bit.
****
US dividends do not qualify for the Div Tax Cr. I found out the hard way.

#47 Moose on 10.07.21 at 2:30 pm

There is this old joke that sort of fits for the anti vaxers:

A torrential rain, areas are being flooded, people are asked to evacuate.
The Police stopped at a house and asked the owner to leave.
The owner: “God will look after me”
Kept on raining.
The owner climbed to the second floor of his house.
A boat came by and the owner was asked to hop in to get to a safe place.
“No thanks, God will look after me”
Finally he had to climb to the roof of his house to escape that floodwaters.
Finally a helicopter spotted him, lowered a ladder and asked him to climb the rope ladder to get to safety.
“No thanks, God will look after me”
Well, the water rose even more and the home owner drowned.
Standing before God he asked why God did not help him.
God shook his head and said:” For crying out loud, I sent you the police, a boat and a helicopter to get you to safety. What else do you want me to do?”
——
Take the vaccine, the odds will be in your favor.

#48 Vaccine Cash Cow on 10.07.21 at 2:34 pm

The governments of the world say they make laws, policies, legislation, mandates, whatever you want to call them anymore and society gets getting and worse. So, being under more and more control and having less and less is not living under lockdowns. I guess people like living in delusion. They are not going to fix anything. It will get worse even after a pill, vaccine, whatever.

Oh by the way, the new covid pill that just came out costs 40 times more than they are selling it to the US government. Yes, they are really considered about health of people when they want to charge 40,000% above cost and they probably got a big wack of taxpayers money for R&D. I would not be surprised if you block my bro.

#49 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 2:37 pm

#43 jal

ZeroHedge.

My go to Conspiracy Theory web site for Child Healthcare & Vaccine Research.

And no, the vax does not wane after a couple of months.

This from the UK’s ZOE* today:

https://youtu.be/xoGqyFUoUSw?t=1007

* UK originated COVID Symptom Study a not-for-profit initiative that was launched at the end of March 2020 to support vital COVID-19 research. Realtime app. Over 4 million contributors globally, the Study is the world’s largest ongoing study of COVID-19.

Guy in the vid is Tim Spector, a ZOE Co-Founder.

———————

I wager 4 Million Likes (downloads & data inputs) vs. how many likes for your ZeroHedge article?

Is ZeroHedge a not-for-profit as well?

Caveat Emptor. American News twists the mind.

#50 Polecat on 10.07.21 at 2:37 pm

If they whipped up the vax quick why haven’t they cured cancer after decades and multi billions of dollars? Maybe the vax will lead to research on that.

#51 Dwilly on 10.07.21 at 2:38 pm

#42 Dolce Vita Thank you for reply. I notice I did not get a comment on my original post and my experience, most people who advocate strongly for this policy do not like to think through it’s implications, so thank you.

To respond, though, I guess this is where I start to have some heartburn. I personally have had my 2 doses. I did this during an emergency, to help the greater society. I didn’t “personally” like it (being a young(ish) & healthy person, but I did it because I felt on balance it was best for all.

But now you are saying that was not enough. I need a booster. Wait, is it *a* booster? Or is it multiple? Every few months… and if so for how long?

For me, this is enough to tilt the scales from “I will do this for the greater good” to “Hmm, I dunno about a lifetime subscription, man”

So what is it? We need 3 doses now? Is that enough? Or, we cannot say that for sure…?

#52 ImGonnaBeSick on 10.07.21 at 2:41 pm

#39 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 2:18 pm

Yep, I understand completely. I appreciate the insights. Practice is always more educational than theory.

#53 mj on 10.07.21 at 2:42 pm

something doesn’t make sense to me. You have to be vaccinated to dine in a restaurant. However, the person serving you does not have to be vaccinated. I feel they are making different standards. That is only one example

#54 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:44 pm

#44 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 2:25 pm

Seriously? If you haven’t yet, I really think you should search Covid Long Haulers
******
Seriously, how long do these long haulers last for? Just like the vaccines – only time will tell.

#55 Brett in Calgary on 10.07.21 at 2:45 pm

All sides of this have made their bed, and can now lie it. Both anti-vaxxers and ‘please passport us to safety’. Be careful what you wish for.

#56 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:46 pm

#53 mj on 10.07.21 at 2:42 pm

something doesn’t make sense to me. You have to be vaccinated to dine in a restaurant. However, the person serving you does not have to be vaccinated. I feel they are making different standards. That is only one example

***

If you don’t clean your room, you don’t get dessert.

#57 Soviet Capitalist on 10.07.21 at 2:46 pm

In other news, it seems that Bank of Canada is trying to establish some sort of narrative/policy change (https://www.bankofcanada.ca/2021/10/investing-in-global-progress/?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=SPTM211007). I am not sure I am able to fully decipher its meaning. Was wondering whether anyone can help me understand it.

#58 Professor Pineapple on 10.07.21 at 2:49 pm

Seriously? 6.4 billion doses have been administered. – Garth

Yet here we are still under lockdown. Clearly an effective measure so far.

What lockdown? – Garth

#59 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 2:51 pm

#46 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:30 pm
#39 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 2:18 pm

Divvie tax credit factors in a bit.

——-

US dividends do not qualify for the Div Tax Cr. I found out the hard way.

——-

Mostly correct. You’ll see in the portfolio that the high yielders are all Canadian.

#60 T on 10.07.21 at 2:53 pm

It’s pretty simple, really.

A percentage of the population is going to be left behind based on their beliefs. It’s happened all through history. This anti-covid vaccine belief system has become a religion, people actually believe they are freedom fighters. Mental illness, really.

But on the other side, this whole business of vaccinated being scared of the unvaccinated needs to stop. There’s no reason for it. Keep unvaccinated away from large gatherings so they aren’t infected en mass and become carriers and spreaders and fill up ICUs. That’s it.

#61 dj on 10.07.21 at 2:54 pm

Something else makes no sense. Please explain how an unvaxxed 11 yr old is free to dine but a 12 yr old is a health risk? Scientific explanation, not political (ex. no vax for that age group is political explanation).

#62 Andy (not that guy) on 10.07.21 at 2:56 pm

Garth, I agree with you completely, but we have a lot of dumb politicians out there who don’t. The Millenial dude may be onto something here.

O’Toole probably can’t control caucus members who don’t want vaccinations. A revolt could ensue with a dysfunctional parliament.

Don’t be surprised to see Trudeau call an ’emergency election’. Then watch Mad Max cannibalize the far right of the CPC even more, and make the Liberals a majority.

Boy, they must be rubbing their hands with glee in the Liberal war rooms, thinking of what might unfold in the weeks ahead inside the CPC!

#63 dj on 10.07.21 at 2:58 pm

Booster for life (until you die). In Israel, you are now reclassified as unvaxxed if you don’t get a third… will be coming here as well.
…so much for two weeks to flatten the curve

What I wouldn’t give to live in Sweden now, basically business as usual with a splash of common sense.

#64 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 2:58 pm

#48 Vaccine Cash Cow

Let me distill your logic:

Vaccine and pill makers ripping off Govs; hence, BAD.

Considering they are the ONLY SHOW IN TOWN that separates YOU from the GRIM REAPER and a life fulfilled is not such as bad trade-off after all.

If you think it is a bad trade-off then all the more power to you.

—————-

I will say your Comment is an Abject Poster for:

Falling upon one’s own sword – literally* and figuratively.

* If it is true what the experts are saying (as in UK Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies [SAGE]):

EVERYONE on Earth will get infected by Delta sooner than later without the VAX.

Russian Roulette. Be my guest.

#65 Editrix on 10.07.21 at 3:03 pm

I would kill for a government job.

Send job postings to Garth. He can forward them to me.

#66 Grandma Sue on 10.07.21 at 3:03 pm

“Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences. When dealing with a virus that debilitates and kills, there’s no choice”
_______

Yet it is being forced on those who telework too, if that doesn’t define a safe workspace, I don’t know what does. I’m rather confused with the message the PM is sending.

#67 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 3:05 pm

#51 Dwilly

Fanatics.

Cannot be reasoned with.

A ONCE a year booster.

1

ONE.

What part of that WHOLE NUMBER cannot you not wrap your mind around?

It’s not like Calculus you know such as an F’ = f, it’s just…

Little ‘ole ONE, 1, = 2-1, next whole number after 0, Roman Numeral: I, etc.

#68 Adam on 10.07.21 at 3:05 pm

Every day your liberties are contained. Try driving on the sidewalk, not wearing pants to work or fishing out of season. Society is a compromise. You surrender liberties, you receive benefits. Grow up. – Garth

***

I got the jab because it provides me with certain benefits (not tied to the vaccine mandates).

Like you, I think people willing to lose their jobs over this mandate are crazy. The anti-vaxxers need to admit that the battle is over and their side lost. They need to surrender and get the jab now while they still have the ability to negotiate the terms of the surrender. The remaining anti-vaxxers are in a cult and are just dragging each other down with job losses and ostracization from polite society.

Let’s just not pretend that after the vaccine mandates and passports were implemented that people are still able to consent to receiving it.

#69 SunShowers on 10.07.21 at 3:07 pm

#33 Adam Provencher on 10.07.21 at 2:09 pm
“When I got jab last week they asked me to give my consent to receive the jab. I said how can I consent when I’m being coerced (plane travel, restaurants, gyms, trains, work, are off limits otherwise). I gave them my “consent” anyways.”

Hey, now here’s some reasoning I can get behind!

Let’s say somebody doesn’t want to work because they’d rather be at home with their families. Or pursue artistic ventures. Well, they’re compelled to work anyway, aren’t they? Because if they don’t work, they starve to death. Seems awfully coercive, doesn’t it?

“Well you agreed to trade your time for money, it’s voluntary!” some might say. Well, as you put it, how can something be voluntary when you’re being coerced? And starving to death and being homeless are objectively worse than what unvaccinated people have to put up with.

So, are these methods coercive? Yes.
Does it matter? No.
Why? Because people should WANT to get the vaccine. Not wanting to get it is a moral failing. As Garth said, people are very much coerced to not drive on sidewalks, but somehow everybody is ok with that!

#70 Dogman01 on 10.07.21 at 3:08 pm

Not Anti Vax but pro freedom:

After reflecting on Sept 30th, I would have thought society would have learned the lesson that violating the rights of the individual to pursue a fashionable perceived “community good” will be seen as a poor decision.
An employer denying pay to individuals for exercising what is their right is bullying.

The huge step in making vaccines mandatory is the role of an elected legislature not an employer.

The fact that they are using the social control and nudge of your job instead of properly using Legislation is a road to a undemocratic social control.

#71 Classical Liberal Millennial on 10.07.21 at 3:12 pm

#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm
Prescient words, Garth.

“It takes courage, selflessness and faith.”

Now, will Erin and the Boomer Cons have these same qualities, and insist that all their right wing MPs provide proof of vaccination to enter Parliament?

Or will we see more Conservative hypocrisy and extremism at play and denial of reality.

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.

—–

You are mentally unstable. Boomers represent the most vaccinated demographic.

#72 the jaguar on 10.07.21 at 3:14 pm

Randall has a sweet expression that signals ‘I am resigned to my fate’,,,,,,,, Guess that’s because he lives with Faron.

#73 Charles on 10.07.21 at 3:14 pm

#23 Chris Gallant

My guess is you don’t realize the healthcare system does not consider a person fully vaxxed until TWO WEEKS AFTER the second dose. Think about that for a minute.

Charles

#74 Moh on 10.07.21 at 3:15 pm

Prayers up to you and your family Garth! God bless you!

#75 Dave on 10.07.21 at 3:16 pm

So this pinhead was vaccinated for polio right?

#76 TMac on 10.07.21 at 3:16 pm

There is a simple solution to all of this. Just leave. I am.
No anger, no frustration. Just a simple wave and a so long and thanks for all the fish.
The majority agree with something that my family doesn’t. (We are vaccinated, the passports we do not agree with) so we will part ways and go about our lives elsewhere.
I wish others would do the same.

#77 andy smith on 10.07.21 at 3:16 pm

DELETED

#78 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 3:16 pm

Hopefully the idiots in govt learned their lesson with this debacle of Vaccine refuseniks.

They should have let the Covid run its course FIRST with 12 months of vaxx promises unfulfilled…..then released it when people were really panicing and fighting for a jab…. any damn jab.
Perhaps…

Next pandemic

On the bright side Garth.
All those fired Govt employees with fat , juicy severance packages might be looking for the anti christ to invest their money for them.

#79 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 3:18 pm

#53 mj

True.

When you have 10 Provinces + 3 Territories making up their own standards, expect chaos.

Never happened here in Italia and for the most part in the EU.

ONE standard. Arrived at in conjunction with Unions and Business beforehand (the case here in Italia).

ALL WORKERS MUST BE VAXD or until mid October tested every 42 hours (Rapid Test), 72 hours (PCR), latter 2 even if you have a pathology that precludes vaxing.

Simple. Straight forward. No chaos in Italia & EU. All understand. And, enforced *.

——————-

Lost on some Cdn jurisdictions with of course predictable consequences such as in Alberta.

* Compliance at least 99.75% by Workers and Businesses here, 4 hours ago by our Interior Ministry:

https://i.imgur.com/wsEK512.png

What happens when you get it right from the word get-go.

Gov Canada needs to step in and make 1 VAX Passport Standard for ALL of Canada.

#80 Flop… on 10.07.21 at 3:23 pm

Diary of a government worker.

Well, I’m 4 months in, good as time for an update, I guess.

Through the summer the guys that had received two shots of vaccine worked mainly together, and a few guys that aren’t going to take the vax worked together.

This was by accident, not by design.

Anyway they got in an argument about a month ago and so now we have a mixture of vaxed and non-vaxed working together in tight spaces.

One guy cites religion and the another one could secretly be TurnerNation.

It looks like being vaccinated is 100% certainty to keep working in a government controlled place, so I don’t know if they will get an ultimatum to get the shot or be fired or what.

I am currently the 7,007,162 person in charge of Canada.

It looks like I could be moving up the ladder a lot quicker than I thought.

Once I break into the top 6 million of powerful people in this country things are gonna change around here…

M47BC

#81 LondON Doge on 10.07.21 at 3:26 pm

There are numerous cytotoxicity studies showing that the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein (which is what the mRNA vaccines instruct the body’s cells to produce) is cytotoxic, such as this one:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33053430/

We shouldn’t have mandates because there are still too many unknowns. Science takes time.

#82 TheDood on 10.07.21 at 3:29 pm

#6 SunShowers on 10.07.21 at 1:20 pm
“Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences”

Sounds like a great argument for more paid sick days, even when covid is history. How many people do you know have come to work with colds? Flus? Stomach bugs? Just because they can’t afford the time off.

If you make people choose between getting money and getting better, they’ll choose money every time, which puts everyone else at risk.
_________________________________

I think if there’s one major takeaway from this pandemic, it’s that showing up at the workplace while symptomatic is no longer socially acceptable. Its not safe or fair to other employees if one person shows up sick. Even with masks and distancing, there is risk of transmission.

With this in mind, there will no doubt have to be some regulatory obligation for employers to provide paid sick days – and a reasonable amount too. Half a dozen sick days a year is not enough for anyone, especially if you have young kids (snot bombs!) attending school and bringing sh!t home.

#83 the dude abides on 10.07.21 at 3:30 pm

“The anti-jabbers should not look for much sympathy from the courts, where every judge will be fully dosed”. This comment is ridiculous – implying that just because a judge is fully dosed, he will not abide to the law and make a personal biased choice in the matter. man, have you lost the plot here?

Of course not. It’s just emblematic of social class and character. – Garth

#84 Well travelled on 10.07.21 at 3:31 pm

I guess we will just have to wait and see how many public sector workers are prepared to give up their nice 9-5 jobs with full health benefits, lots of vacation and stat holidays and of course a gold plated DB pension.

#85 Ricker on 10.07.21 at 3:34 pm

Garth, time to mandate that readers must be vaccinated to be able to read your blog! :-)

90% are already. I know where the others live. – Garth

#86 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 3:35 pm

#54 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:44 pm
#44 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 2:25 pm

Seriously? If you haven’t yet, I really think you should search Covid Long Haulers
******
Seriously, how long do these long haulers last for? Just like the vaccines – only time will tell.
=================
Irrelevant to getting the shot.
Maybe vs certainly.
There are may be vaccine side effects vs Covid
certainly has side effects.

Yes, in ~2065 we will for certain exactly which is worse and by how much, but today the choice is obvious.

#87 glad You like society now on 10.07.21 at 3:35 pm

Dolce Vita, going by your logic, make it 40 trillion times for the cost of the covid pill because without them we will all die. If they are truly considered about everyone’s health, why are they charging 40 times the cost plus probably taxpayers money for R&D. They are more concerned about blockbuster profits than people. They could not charge, I don’t know 5, maybe 10 times. Is that not enough for their greedy investors, owners. The sky is falling. You all thought the show Monk was just a show. I guess people are really that afraid of everything. Don’t worry, if one thing does not get you something else will. Society is really heading in a better direction. I don’t think so.

#88 Linda on 10.07.21 at 3:37 pm

Vaccines against a virus that kills isn’t an abrogation of anyone’s ‘freedom’. It is the common sense solution to a problem that affects everyone. We are so lucky to have a means to prevent needless death. Can’t understand why anyone wouldn’t want to protect themselves or their loved ones.

#89 Trojan House on 10.07.21 at 3:38 pm

Like anything else, Garth, it is not as black and white as you make it seem.

Regardless, Spain, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Iceland and Finland have dropped all restrictions – masks, lockdowns, vaccine passports & mandates, etc. All this with less vaccine uptake than here (except Spain I think). Is covid different in those countries? Is there a Scandinavian variant that we don’t know about that affects, well, only Scandinavian countries and Spain too?

The only explanation must be the science. North American science is clearly different than Scandinavian science.

#90 Alba on 10.07.21 at 3:41 pm

#41 Palebird
If you have indeed traveled the world then you are well aware that for many countries you are required to show proof that you have had specific vaccinations to enter. When you get there do you complain to them about being forced to vaccinate and how it impinges on your personal rights and freedoms? I suspect not.
I have 8 uncles who as very young men fought in the Second World War to protect our rights and freedoms. Shortly after that they rolled up their sleeves for polio and small pox vaccines. Then we had a typhoid epidemic and they rolled up their sleeves for that. That’s what good citizens do. They do what’s necessary to protect the other members of society.
My grand daughter is 7 and I had hoped that the adults in our society would roll up their sleeves so that she wouldn’t have to. Sadly not enough of adults today have the maturity and sense of responsibility to protect the weaker members of the society in which they have the privilege to belong.

#91 Soviet Capitalist on 10.07.21 at 3:42 pm

BTW, although I disagree with Garth on this specific topic, I wish him good health.
He does not establish the narrative. It is being set from above and feeds on the fear of the masses.
The two pillars of the narrative are that: the vaccines are safe (1) and that they are efficient (2). I don’t have any definite proof of the latter being false (although there are confirmed reports about negative effects on the younger population). The challenge on my end is that official sources (CBC, Fauci, ..) have discredited themselves on multiple occasions, making it hard for me to establish whether this time they are telling the truth or lobbying someone’s interests again.

Please share your credentials. – Garth

#92 Trojan House on 10.07.21 at 3:43 pm

What lockdown? – Garth

Have you seen the news about Alberta lately???!!! Please try to keep up with the program.

AB is not in lockdown. – Garth

#93 ogdoad on 10.07.21 at 3:45 pm

Story of the duped. We will bow down and adhere to restrictions, get jabbed, accept gifts and be fed desires to get back to ‘Normal’…’Normality’…’the same’. Except for increased depression, PTSD, netflix subsciptions, and green jumpsuits.

The final remaining percentage of people will either live in their countries without being able to travel, go to the movies (big whoop), out to dinner etc…people will slowly but surely conform (after giving up a feeble fight against the masses) just like what we have been doing for millennia. Or die…

Governments are just not forcing it too strongly – yet. Loss of work??? Oh how the devil has come down upon me with such scorn!!!!! Or, they will be the next population of conspiracy theorists, move to a commune on the west coast only to emerge 20y later to realize nothing’s changed and they’re not special?? Oh, the HORROR!!

I have two shots of moderna and I’m not dead yet. Although, the commune thing certainly sounds appealing.

Og

#94 Also from Langley... on 10.07.21 at 3:52 pm

Don’t agree with Andy.

Sure, it’s historically a predominantly white, Christian, redneckish community on the outskirts of Van, but we’re not ALL insolent dolts.

You’re welcome to pop by anytime Garth. The only thing we’d be spittin’ is sound financial advice.

Preach brother!

#95 Identify as Vaxxxed on 10.07.21 at 3:52 pm

All in all it’s just another brick in the wall

#96 Dogman01 on 10.07.21 at 3:54 pm

Just want to repeat;

Why are they not simply legislating mandatory vaccines, why are they using the tactics of threatening your employment to facilitate what should be a decision by the democratically elected representative of the people of Canada.

This is scary, they are utilizing corporate non governmental social control with no democratic oversight.

This is a test of the “New System” me thinks.
Turner Nation – back me up on that!

“Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress.” –
Frederick Douglass

#97 Leichendiener on 10.07.21 at 3:55 pm

The precautionary principle (or precautionary approach) is a broad epistemological, philosophical and legal approach to innovations with potential for causing harm when extensive scientific knowledge on the matter is lacking. It emphasizes caution, pausing and review before leaping into new innovations that may prove disastrous. Critics argue that it is vague, self- cancelling, unscientific and an obstacle to progress.

#98 US Bonds on 10.07.21 at 3:55 pm

Look at this about the US bond yields,www.investing.com/analysis/bonds-are-withering-200604353. The US bond yields are higher again today, 5, 7, 10, 20, 30 year US bond yields, 0.30%, 1.02%, 1.35%, 1.57%, 2.07%, 2.13%.

#99 Trojan House on 10.07.21 at 3:55 pm

DELETED

#100 willworkforpickles on 10.07.21 at 3:55 pm

Taper-talk and doublespeak … just double talk and deception.
With the national debt (US) continuing to climb, and it will be pushed ever higher (no two ways about it)… at some point investors are going to lose confidence in the government’s ability to pay back borrowed funds. Investors will demand higher interest rates on the debt and rates could not only rise but rise sharply and suddenly with unmitigable economic backlash.
As a rule of thumb, countries whose debt-to-GDP ratios exceed 77% for prolonged periods, experience significant slowdowns in economic growth.
With the US debt to GDP ratio already in the 130% range and climbing it will keep climbing and exponentially…Fed doublespeak notwithstanding.
Global GDP expansion over the next 2 years won’t be much of factor for a NA turnaround in terms of real economic growth hampered by high unmanageable debt.
We have outgrown the days of debt creation being good for real sustained growth with the overall national debt far surpassing debt to gdp ratios within sustainable limits.

The dunderheads with mental block supplanted by Fed lies still can’t see this.

Canada in tow is going to be greatly affected by the US economic fallout to come as well.

#101 US Bonds on 10.07.21 at 3:58 pm

http://www.investing.com/analysis/bonds-are-withering-200604353

#102 peter pickles on 10.07.21 at 3:58 pm

It’s unlikely many will actually lose their jobs over this. They’ll whine like babies and then they’ll go get vaccinated. That’s the course this has taken south of the border.

There may be a very small number that stick it out. The costs will be exceedingly small.

This is just evolution playing out in real time. The unvaccinated are dying off and suffering consequences from being stupid. We are better off without.

#103 Blacksheep on 10.07.21 at 4:00 pm

Pretty tense here lately, I think a little levity is in order:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GukIoZ8d3Ew

#104 ritenote on 10.07.21 at 4:00 pm

How ’bout Kant’s definition of duty?
“The reason for acting (in this case vaccinating) is simply and only because it’s the right thing to do. Treat everyone as though they have an unlimited value, with dignity and respect.”
Old fashioned civility, where or where have you gone?

#105 MIKETHEENGINEER on 10.07.21 at 4:07 pm

Saw this today.

As for whether workers who are terminated for refusing to vaccinate are entitled to compensation, he said it depends on the work environment, how valid the need for the policy is and whether the worker was unionized or not.

Samfiru suggested terminated workers who are not paid sufficient compensation could claim wrongful dismissal.

“The employer is imposing a new rule, one that was not part of the original employment agreement,” he said. “That becomes a termination without cause and severance has to be paid. Beyond that, there could be a human rights claim as well.”

The lawyers are going to make a killing on this stuff….should have become a lawyer

#106 Roc on 10.07.21 at 4:08 pm

enthalpy on 10.07.21 at 1:58 pm
I believe in everyones right to choose (And I chose the jab).
But this takes us into uncharted territory. I find the sweeping powers and continual division tactics to be quite scary.

If the big C is endemic(it is). These other changes won’t ever go away(when does Govt give up things they implement? ) .

It’s not looking good.
——————-
Totally agree.

Will vaxx mandate be here for years to come? What’s next: You’re not considered vaxxed until you get the booster etc.

I got jabbed almost 10 months ago. I wonder what`s my immunity now vs someone unvaxxed who recently had covid. Yet, I can go to restaurants etc but that person cannot. Vaxx passport divides society. I refuse to use it so looks like it`s going to be a long, boring winter and spring ..

#107 Cristian on 10.07.21 at 4:08 pm

All those talking about personal freedom and human rights forget one fundamental thing: freedom and human rights stop when you do or threaten to do harm to those around you.
And that is what unvaccinated people do: threaten to do harm or, often, actually do harm to those around them by (potentially) infecting them.
This is in no way different from grabbing a knife or a gun and stabbing/shooting randomly around whenever you feel like. And there is no “freedom” for something like that. Therefore there should not be any freedom for anybody to harm those around them by going unvaccinated.
You don’t want to be vaccinated? Want absolute freedom? Maybe you shouldn’t live among people but in some neck of the woods with bears and wolves.
You want to live in a human society? Then there will be certain rules to obey and certain limitations to your freedom. You simply cannot live among people as if you lived in the jungle.

#108 Sail Away on 10.07.21 at 4:08 pm

An interesting dog experience:

There is a nearby undeveloped area with lots of rabbits and quail where I often take the dogs for an hour of offleash ‘hunting’. A mountain bike trail runs through and now and again there will be other dog walkers.

Anyway… yesterday I was out with the Chessie and Munsterlander and we met a nice young Golden Retriever. I saw all three dogs playing in the distance, and as I got closer, a guy came running down the path cussing a blue streak, grabbed the Golden by the scruff of the neck, threw it down and smacked it several times before hauling it away by the collar with its front paws barely touching the ground. Apparently, in the excitement, it had ignored his command to come.

So… his dog, his training and discipline methods… not my place to interfere. I did sort of wish he’d tried the same with either of my dogs (not really- I wouldn’t want the lawsuit) because they would have taken his hand off. Hunting dogs and a number of the guard breeds have a strong sense of self and will not accept that ‘domination training’ garbage.

Some of the best animal trainers are horse trainers- my aunt, for example- because proper horse training can’t be done with force, so needs to be done with consistency, repetition and understanding, which is then carried through to training other animals.

There’s a passage in a book about Delmar Smith, one of the greatest bird dog and horse trainers. When electronic collars first appeared, one of Delmar’s sons tried to use one on a horse, and ‘…the horse didn’t learn what Tom was trying to teach, but Tom learned to eat with a broken collarbone’

#109 Abuma Utanga on 10.07.21 at 4:08 pm

I will do everything the government tells me to do. I fully cooperate as they everything they do is right and take full responsibility. They will then leave me alone in peace right and then just like in the movies when I do everything the hostage taker tells me to do they still don’t leave me alone and when I refuse to do what they say or I even question them, they changed their minds and get rid of me, you, us, everyone they choose to. The future looks very bright for all of us. Look at us now, Canada, US, Europe, Asia, South America, North America, central America, World.

#110 Legal Eagle on 10.07.21 at 4:12 pm

Getting vaccinated wasn’t in anyone’s employment contract before 2021, so there’s a case for wrongful dismissal.

Common misconception. Your employer can fire you for any reason he pleases, and there’s nothing “wrongful” about it. Wrongful dismissal simply means that an employer didn’t give sufficient notice (or payment in lieu thereof) or pay severance when owed.

#111 Dwilly on 10.07.21 at 4:13 pm

#67 Dolce Vita
Thank you but I will discontinue the discussion now. I’ve said nothing fanatical at all, just asked honest and reasonable questions, which you are unwilling or unable to engage with. So there’s no point in continuing.

For the record and for others: a mandatory annual medical treatment as a condition for participation in society is not at all like pre existing flu shots, or other vaccination requirements. Again I have taken the first two, am not ‘anti science’ or whatever ugly terms are used. But if you cannot admit there is a different precedent here, you are not paying close enough attention. I think we should discuss it. It’s not simple.

#112 The Spectre on 10.07.21 at 4:15 pm

Garth’s right, Jesus never preached anarchy. Here’s the proof:

Mark 12:17:
Then Jesus said to them, “Give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s and to God what is God’s.” And they were amazed at him.

#113 Abuma Utanga on 10.07.21 at 4:16 pm

Look at us now Canada, US, Europe, Asia, Africa, South America, North America, central America, World.

#114 Kiril Peev on 10.07.21 at 4:18 pm

There are some serious errors of reasoning being made here (imo on purpose).

The main one being that unvaxxed people pose a threat to anyone but themselves. This is not true.

Both vaccinated and unvaccinated people can and do spread the virus. The rest is military and govt propaganda. My govt telling people that I am a threat to them is not acceptable.

#115 Garth Turner is...a bioethics expert on 10.07.21 at 4:20 pm

I honestly think you should be in a mental institution together with Trudeau that u admire so much..

Wait for collapse u old fart

#116 Maybe they sort of sometimes do cure cancer? on 10.07.21 at 4:20 pm

#50 Polecat on 10.07.21 at 2:37 pm

“If they whipped up the vax quick why haven’t they cured cancer after decades and multi billions of dollars? Maybe the vax will lead to research on that.”

I had cancer and I’m still alive. My sister too. I know many “cancer survivors” as they call us. Sadly, I suspect we will all die one day though, medicine or no, from cancer or something else.

So what exactly is a “cure” for cancer supposed to look like that the modern treatments do not qualify? Some sort of miracle vaccine injection? Cancer is not a virus. It happens in your own genes.

And anyway what does cancer have to do with covid? Why is a “cure” for cancer a prerequisite for a covid treatment? I don’t see how it follows.

As a cancer “survivor”, I am more than a little offended both for myself, other “survivors”, and all the good people in the medical profession who saved us. What the hell was that we went through with the surgeries, the chemo, and the radiation if not something like a cure or at least a treatment and why are we still alive?

Covid is not cancer. Cancer is not covid. But if success with cancer is how we will measure the medical profession, the number of extra days that people collectively have spent above ground due to modern cancer treatments is astounding, and the value thereof immeasurable.

Medical profession +infinity, anti-vaxxers zero.

#117 Adam on 10.07.21 at 4:23 pm

I think most of the older Canadians have alot less time on this earth to suffer from longer term side effects from vaccines so they are more willing to take them.

#118 april on 10.07.21 at 4:24 pm

#37- We don’t know yet how long “natural immunity” lasts after recovering from covid or strong the immunity is… more time and testing needed.

#119 GOLDENBOY on 10.07.21 at 4:25 pm

The picture of Randall should be framed and put on a wall. Excellent picture.

#120 The Riddler on 10.07.21 at 4:26 pm

Ten unvaxxed adults and ten unvaxxed young children in a room.

Could you point to the ones who are a health risk to society? Could you point to the ones who are a health risk to a marxist agenda?

#121 Don Guillermo on 10.07.21 at 4:29 pm

Trudeau’s revises the LBGQ acronym – probably felt guilty by going to the beach on his 1st T&C Day. Yikes!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10068243/Justin-Trudeau-mocked-using-latest-sexual-identities-acronym-2SLGBTQQIA.html

“apparently headbutting a keyboard is now a sexuality”

#122 SnakesInParliament on 10.07.21 at 4:29 pm

Recession is when your neighbour loses his job. Depression is when you lose yours. Recovery is when the PM loses his.

#123 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 4:32 pm

Does anything light up the blog like this issue Garth?

NOTHING.

Nothing lights up the blog as division. Left vs. Right. Liberal vs. Conservative. Yup…dummies don’t know the truth tends to be in the middle.

Oh, Globe and Mail has voted.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/personal-finance/article-the-debate-over-buying-a-home-versus-renting-is-done-renting-lost-and/

#124 Slim on 10.07.21 at 4:40 pm

My daughter who is a nurse at a large hospital in Edmonton, has held the hand of many a covid patients in their final moments in ICU, separated from loved ones. She would often cry before facing another shift.

Anti-vaxxers get zero sympathy from me. They should get no respect for their cowardly, selfish decision not to get vaxxed. And they will not get any from society at large.

#125 Soviet Capitalist on 10.07.21 at 4:44 pm

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-06/sweden-halts-moderna-s-covid-vaccine-for-people-aged-30-or-under

#126 Ryan on 10.07.21 at 4:47 pm

Imagine being that stupid.

#127 Stephladimir Harputin on 10.07.21 at 4:48 pm

What’s up Turner? You get to 100 comments so now you’re taking the night off!?

No wonder you never survived in my cabinet.

#128 Dragonfly 58 on 10.07.21 at 4:50 pm

Wife and I both double vaxed with almost no side effects.
Both had slightly sore arms for a couple of days. 21 year old son however had no side effect on first shot but quite severe reaction to second. 3 days of total misery. Took him in for a covid test just to be sure and almost had to carry him to the car . Emerg. would have been the next step but things started to improve on morning of the third day. Wife is a 30 + year Med / Surg. nurse and she was getting worried.
And this is a very healthy 21 year old male. Normally works as a landscaper so very fit. Someone elderly would have been in real trouble. Pfizer both shots on son. Mix with me { B.C.} , probably useless for travel despite what the Gov. is pushing for propaganda.
No regrets for wife and I but son would have not received 2nd dose if he had any idea of how it would turn out beforehand. I doubt anyone could pay him enough to get a booster after this experience .
Not anti vax, but they are far from benign in some people.

#129 Not Fooled on 10.07.21 at 4:50 pm

DELETED. Never, ever trivialize deaths. – Garth

*****************

To be clear, it appears that some deaths can be made light of here.

Wishing our ideologic opponents dead is not a sign of a healthy society. Why is OK to wish death on the unvaxxed? The unvaxxed will still cause surgical delays and take up expensive ICU beds before they expire.

Maybe we should be wishing the unvaxxed the very best of health in the near future?

#102 peter pickles on 10.07.21 at 3:58 pm

“This is just evolution playing out in real time. The unvaccinated are dying off and suffering consequences from being stupid. We are better off without.”

#130 WTF on 10.07.21 at 4:50 pm

Tinfoil hat wearing Langley (insert whatever redneck crazytown u like) lunatics. Andy is just the local village idiot.

Of course once they get covid and have a trip to the hospital the tune changes and a new religion is found. LIVING. “I was soo stupid, covid is hell”

Potential Darwin award champ.

https://darwinawards.com/

The worst part? They breed.

#131 Phylis on 10.07.21 at 4:52 pm

#78 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 3:16 pm
Hopefully the idiots in govt learned their lesson with this debacle of Vaccine refuseniks.

They should have let the Covid run its course FIRST with 12 months of vaxx promises unfulfilled…..then released it when people were really panicing and fighting for a jab…. any damn jab.
Perhaps…

Next pandemic

On the bright side Garth.
All those fired Govt employees with fat , juicy severance packages might be looking for the anti christ to invest their money for them.
Xxxxxxx
Interesting, fired with cause equals no severance, doesn’t it? Is this causal? Where’s the blog hr rep? Emma?

#132 OK, Doomer on 10.07.21 at 4:54 pm

The vax will not protect you from COVID. It’s not supposed to. It’s supposed to give your body a fighting chance to survive it when you get it.

And you will get it. All of us will eventually. It’s like the line from the movie “Casablanca” about Humphrey Bogart’s night club “Rick’s Cafe Americain”.

“Sooner or later everyone goes to Rick’s”.

And we’re all going to Rick’s. You just get to decide if you want to leave or not.

#133 GrumpyPanda on 10.07.21 at 4:54 pm

Andy from Langley reminded me of this joke:

A woman calls her husband on his cell phone:

“Honey, please be careful driving home. The news says there is a car going the wrong way on the highway.”

Husband: “Don’t worry honey. I’ll be careful. And there’s not one car going the wrong way. There’s hundreds!”

#134 High IQ Anti-Vaxxer on 10.07.21 at 4:57 pm

I always knew I was in the top 10%

#135 Baffled on 10.07.21 at 5:04 pm

Just incredible. What the hell is wrong with these fools?
I gave up on humans a long time ago. Daily they manage to exhibit why that was the right choice. As little contact as possible is the best way for me. Pretty sure the rest of humanity says feelings mutual.

#136 Woke up this morning on 10.07.21 at 5:06 pm

#31 Dwilly

Does this mean we all need a booster every 6mo? For….ever?

—-

This is where the lipid nanoparticles concern becomes even more of a question to be addressed, because the doses start getting stacked and repeated and basically a therapy.

#137 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.07.21 at 5:07 pm

Two players on my daughter’s hockey team had to withdraw because the parents did not allow them to get vaccinated for religious reasons.
Me thinks, if God was a Canadian, he would make an exception for kids who wanna play hockey.

#138 sszk on 10.07.21 at 5:08 pm

I would defintely second “Andy Go Do It” if you assume civil and legal liability if he suffers any vax injury. Will you put your money where your mouth is? Problem is everyone disappears and you are on your own if shit happens!

#139 R on 10.07.21 at 5:10 pm

I personally have absolutly no sympathy for anti vaxers. They are a self inflected weight the rest of society has to drag around in trying to survive. May they just go away, pray to their religious “god”, and go silently in the night. Maybe they will bump into some “flat earthers” along the way .

#140 Shortymac on 10.07.21 at 5:11 pm

IMHO, the whining just proves they don’t actually have conviction for their beliefs, it’s mostly a fashion choice and not a true belief.

It’s why the vast majority cave and get the vaccine after some complaining.

#141 Lid on 10.07.21 at 5:12 pm

If C19, was an alien life form ,attacking, killing people on earth.
Would we all fight to defeat, the aliens?
Antivaxer’s , would you join, the Aliens or fight the Alien’s?

#142 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 5:13 pm

#83 the dude abides on 10.07.21 at 3:30 pm
“The anti-jabbers should not look for much sympathy from the courts, where every judge will be fully dosed”. This comment is ridiculous – implying that just because a judge is fully dosed, he will not abide to the law and make a personal biased choice in the matter. man, have you lost the plot here?

Of course not. It’s just emblematic of social class and character. – Garth
*********************************
Sometimes there is a space in the law where interpretation from a judge is required. Here they will be asked to use their best… judgment. The fact that they ALL previously used their judgment to decide that getting vaccinated was acceptable might biases them, yes.

#143 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.07.21 at 5:13 pm

#100 willworkforpickles on 10.07.21 at 3:55 pm
Taper-talk and doublespeak … just double talk and deception.
With the national debt (US) continuing to climb, and it will be pushed ever higher (no two ways about it)… at some point investors are going to lose confidence in the government’s ability to pay back borrowed funds. Investors will demand higher interest rates on the debt and rates could not only rise but rise sharply and suddenly with unmitigable economic backlash.
As a rule of thumb, countries whose debt-to-GDP ratios exceed 77% for prolonged periods, experience significant slowdowns in economic growth.
With the US debt to GDP ratio already in the 130% range and climbing it will keep climbing and exponentially…Fed doublespeak notwithstanding.
Global GDP expansion over the next 2 years won’t be much of factor for a NA turnaround in terms of real economic growth hampered by high unmanageable debt.
We have outgrown the days of debt creation being good for real sustained growth with the overall national debt far surpassing debt to gdp ratios within sustainable limits.
The dunderheads with mental block supplanted by Fed lies still can’t see this.

Canada in tow is going to be greatly affected by the US economic fallout to come as well.
—————–
Agree.
I guess, we all “willworkforpickels” soon.
As usual, I’m prepared.
I grow my own cukes.

#144 pm on 10.07.21 at 5:15 pm

Here is a website from WHO. Read the special note on how to use.

http://www.vigiaccess.org/

#145 Faron on 10.07.21 at 5:22 pm

#72 the jaguar on 10.07.21 at 3:14 pm

‘I am resigned to my fate’

That’s true. His fate is dog paradise with adoring humans and whatever adventures that his little legs and 13 Y.O. spine will allow. I’m pretty sure that the olfactory adventures are a dimension no human can understand.

#146 Shirl Clarts on 10.07.21 at 5:23 pm

I’m told that Saint Peter is scanning QR codes outside the Pearly gates.

#147 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 5:23 pm

gas $164.9/ litre in the Lower Brainland today.

#148 Plus one for the VAX people on 10.07.21 at 5:27 pm

Thanks for the blog Garth
Well the vaccinated versus anti vaccinated has begun
There is a walk in clinic, cannot say where as they might get into trouble from the righteous group.

Sign in the office
If you are fully vaccinated your are welcome to book an appointment between 9am and 6pm

For everyone else please wait in the waiting room after 6

This goes to reason as anti VAX people can spread the virus in a waiting room. But it also has a clear message in between the lines.

Let’s hope anti VAX people have to wait outside hospitals for health care while they serve the others.

It’s coming!
And man there will be interesting side effects.

#149 nothintaboo on 10.07.21 at 5:30 pm

I must have been too early yesterday. Have to go back and check the blog.

The hospitals are already having anti-vexers terminated. I think they should also implement the rule that if you are unvaccinated, you can’t come into the hospital for any reason. That should free up some valuable beds so that the delayed surgeries can get started again.

#150 SmallTownSteve on 10.07.21 at 5:31 pm

Perhaps those that are willfully unvaccinated that are subsequently hospitalized with covid should be forced to pay for the full costs of their hospital stay as well.

#151 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 5:32 pm

@#71 Classic.
“You are mentally unstable. Boomers represent the most vaccinated demographic.”

+++

Shhhh.
Don’t burst his delusion.
Boomers are dying off.
Our votes and tax contributions are increasingly irrelevant.

Millennials will be aiming at Gen X next….
And then the kids will be coming for them.
And if the kids are angry like Greta….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAJsdgTPJpU

It won’t be pretty.

#152 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 5:33 pm

Garth…..I only wish I lived in your neighborhood so I could spit these things in your face!

*******

My God! What is the incredible passions !!!
Garth, you need to pass training and buy a gun to protect himself and Dorothy!!!! Also install cameras on perimeter of yours house. Dig a deep moat and fill it with water (I can help!).

Actually India experience for treatment/vaccination showing that vaccination can be done only for people who really need it. Not for everybody. India experience showing that Canada may save huge money if our health authority would be a little bit smarter.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/india-ivermectin-blackout-2/5757553

#153 yorkville renter on 10.07.21 at 5:33 pm

People are mandated to get MMR vaccine… no complaints

People are mandated to get Polio vaccine… no complaints… also, Polio was administered via “emergency authorization” too.

BILLIONS inoculated and *very* small # with side effects

Anti-vaxxers say Governments are “very inept” and also “extremely secretive and are working toward a new world order”… Suck and blow.

And injecting a computer chip? Really?

You think a chip, randomly distributed and not attributed to anyone specific, is tracking you!?!?

How about you give up your smartphone… which IS tracking you?

The mental gymnastics to make this “logic” work is pathetic.

MAN UP, GET THE VACCINE!

#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm

Garth,

You missed a key point in the coming lawsuits.

I have some experience with this, years ago refused a transfer, got fired and sued for constructive dismissal. Settled out of court for a month pay per year worked and became self employed, and have stayed that way.

In order for the government or an employer to prevail, they will need to prove the science that shows that natural immunity from having previous covid is not sufficient to produce anti-bodies to protect from future infection, in a way that the vaccine does.

That’s pretty shaky ground if you’ve been following the science in a real way, not just the political spin.

Whose scientists are these employers going to put on the stand?

When you fire a much needed ICU nurse who has been looking after covid patients for a year and half and has herself recovered, and has anti-bodies with tests to prove it, not sure that you will get a lot of sympathy from a jury (not just a Judge).

By the time these work through the court system, we will know more about what has happened, especially in other countries such as Sweden.

Just like how the global warming “scientists” have lost in court when they can’t produce hard science that can be cross examined in an adversarial setting.

I wouldn’t want to be the scientist putting my professional credentials and reputation on the line in an open court while being picked apart by real scientists.

#155 When the Whip Comes Down on 10.07.21 at 5:48 pm

This will be interesting. The seasonal flu can also debilitate and kill those who catch it and pass along to an immune compromised person. Not common but can happen. Yet in the non Healthcare workplaces mandatory flu shots are not mandated.

#156 Sheesh on 10.07.21 at 5:50 pm

30 DonM on 10.07.21 at 2:03 pm
#20 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 1:45 pm
*******************
So you’d be fine with a vaccine that was tested on say…50,000 people for 3 years, but not after 6 Billion doses have gone out over 1 year?
That doesn’t really make sense.
If there were serious side effects that were going to creep up after 3 years then tens of millions would already be experiencing them now.
*********

You are missing the point. There is a zero long-term history of these vaccines. It takes decades for some medicines to be passed unlike the Covid ones.

You failed to register the mistake governments made by allowing those under 30 to take Moderna. What other long-term effects will there be? I guess time will tell.

In the meantime, my dog dragging me to the liquor store where she gets offered a treat and I get my cold ones must take place of my favorite past time – socializing at the pub which will be a few years before I do so again. Sad. But, I respect everyone’s decisions on the matter.

…………

Don, you are more likely to have long term health effects from imbibing your ‘cold ones’ than from the covid shot.

Ingesting a known carcinogen? Doesn’t blink an eye. Risking long term consequences (known and unknown) from a nice natural covid infection? Yawn.
Asked to get a vaccination that billions already have safely received? OMG, no!!!
This makes no sense.

#157 BlogDog123 on 10.07.21 at 5:52 pm

Where were all these anti-vaxxers when schools required kids to get MMR, DTP, etc. vaccinations… ??? Well that’s not the hot-topic, so…

Well, we now have the 24/7 News/Opinion talking heads, internet and social media. Where you can be spoon-fed tripe from the likes of ‘experts’ like Jenny McCarthy, QAnon leadership, Hannity, InfoWars and other agitators.

Let there be no misunderstanding on this: Those vocal anti-vaxxers find the whole thing “intoxicating”, making them feel “empowered” fighting harder. And going to social media to feed the beast and be fueled by other “contrarians” in their echo chamber. No peer-reviewed medical study is of interest, they’re too boring to read.

And those 5 covid-dead “non-vaxxed” agitator radio hosts in the USA aren’t going to change a damn thing…

#158 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.07.21 at 5:53 pm

#139 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 5:23 pm
gas $164.9/ litre in the Lower Brainland today.
————
And?
No snark remark?
Does not affect me at all.
And, last year I installed an efficient heater and water boiler.
Gotta be prepared.

#159 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 5:56 pm

As a recent retired anesthesiologist trained in Canada and working for many years in Denver, Colorado, I am continually appalled at the beliefs of the non-vaccination populace. It is worse in the US as compared to Canada. The last six months of my practice found me increasingly irritated with non-vaxxers. I would get into these nonsense arguments with them. Somehow, it was OK for them to put me at increased risk of Covid exposure because they refused the vaccination. Anesthesiology is one of the most high risk of professions with respect to Covid exposure. Yes, I am fully vaccinated and received my third dose of Pfizer a few weeks ago. No, this would not fully protect me from Covid-19 especially the delta variant. I wanted to refuse to care for the patients who would not get vaccinated. This was not an option. I realized that while I have loved the practice of anesthesiology for over forty years now seemed like the best time to retire.

My hat is off to you Mr. Turner for being able to put up with these non-vaccination idiots. Please stay the course. I know you will.

#160 SunShowers on 10.07.21 at 5:57 pm

#96 Dogman01
Oh hey, I love Frederick Douglass! But I think you’re a bit wrong here.

Mr. Douglass wouldn’t see employers mandating vaccines as a problem. At least, not a very serious one. The bigger problem that he would take issue with is being beholden to and effectively coerced by those employers to work for them, on pain of losing your livelihood. After all, if you didn’t NEED to sell your labor to an employer to survive, who cares what they mandate? Tell them to take a hike and flip them off on your way out the door.

“Experience demonstrates that there may be a slavery of wages only a little less galling and crushing in its effects than chattel slavery, and that this slavery of wages must go down with the other.”

The guy was both a chattel slave and a wage slave, so I think he’d know what he’s talking about.

I suppose there are two major takeaways from covid. One very well put by #82 TheDood, that we are going to need more paid sick days, and the other, a whole lot of usually right-leaning people are realizing the brutal and coercive nature of capitalism.

#161 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 5:58 pm

Garth… No QR code – No service

************

Government promise provide QR code in end of October (at least here in Ontario). Now just need printed or show downloaded prove of vaccination (actually enough info about second dose). You may receive from government WEB. Better to have from government WEB instead from place where you did vaccination.

#162 bob klinck on 10.07.21 at 5:58 pm

Nobody is attending to the numerous reports that animals are reservoirs for the virus. Some zoos are vaccinating their denizens. Without giving specific advice on means, road signs in Australia counsel people to protect their pets from becoming infected. Cats, dogs and more exotic “animal friends” were cast from high-rise balconies in China when the news of this source of infection became known. I’m waiting for the believers in eradication to come to my yard to mask and inoculate the scampering squirrels.

#163 Joe Rogan's Horse Dewormer on 10.07.21 at 5:59 pm

I guess Sweden, Finland and Denmark are just backwards and full of right-wing nutjobs.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/finland-pauses-use-moderna-covid-19-vaccine-young-men-2021-10-07/

Should people be forced to take a vaccine against their will if it’s not even effective after a short period?

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/575279-study-shows-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-effectiveness-declines-after-six-months

For the record, I’m double vaxxed so you can’t tag me as an anti-vaxer. Some people have legitimate reasons for not getting the shot.

The Wuhan Insititute of Virology was built by the French and the American CDC and NIH were funding research there. The entire pandemic is evidence of the pitfalls of international science (I’m a scientist too) and evidence of corruption at every level.

#164 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 6:05 pm

DELETED

#165 facts on 10.07.21 at 6:06 pm

#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm
Garth,

You missed a key point in the coming lawsuits.

He is a propagandist, not a lawyer.

#166 Selfish on 10.07.21 at 6:11 pm

Hi,

Moderna is no longer being injected into men under 30 in certain European countries.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/scandinavians-curb-moderna-shots-for-some-younger-patients/ar-AAPcl0G

I am a 34 year old male. I have a 99.995% chance of surviving Covid. Why would I risk my life and health for a virus with less than a 1/10000 chance of mortality for my age? I also have two daughters that need a father for the future.

It is SELFISH to make me risk my health because you are in danger of Covid. Take PRECAUTIONS IF YOU ARE AT RISK:
-vaccine
-stay home
-wear masks etc
(you dont need to leave your house if you can easily die from this virus)

Coercing me into a potentially deadly and life-changing medical treatment is SELFISH.

Anyone have the long-term data on the vaccines? Anyone?
Maybe waiting another year is the smartest choice (see heart inflammation link above).

I get you are scared, but your fear ends when it jeopardizes my health.

#167 Sheesh on 10.07.21 at 6:12 pm

#81 LondON Doge on 10.07.21 at 3:26 pm
There are numerous cytotoxicity studies showing that the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein (which is what the mRNA vaccines instruct the body’s cells to produce) is cytotoxic, such as this one:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33053430/

We shouldn’t have mandates because there are still too many unknowns. Science takes time.

……..

Know what else instructs the body’s cells to manufacture the spike protein? The SARS-Cov-2 Virus!!! Only in much greater quantity and with the rest of the virus attached.
No thanks. I’ll take my minuscule allotment of lonely little spikes that the vaccine produces to prime my immune system for a stand off with the real thing. You should too.

#168 Nonplused on 10.07.21 at 6:13 pm

#137 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.07.21 at 5:07 pm
Two players on my daughter’s hockey team had to withdraw because the parents did not allow them to get vaccinated for religious reasons.
Me thinks, if God was a Canadian, he would make an exception for kids who wanna play hockey.

————————————–

Why? I read the whole bible and I never saw anything about vaccines. I did see a lot about pork though. The Jews and the Muslims are definitely on the right side of “the book” when it comes to that one but I love me some bacon.

Anyway the hockey arena is definitely one place where the anti-vaxxers don’t have a leg to stand on. There is no “right” to enter the building or go on the ice. Not only do you have to book and pay for the ice, but typically you also have to sign a big waiver and they can put whatever they want in the waiver and do. It’s worse than a ski lift ticket! They can run you down with the Zamboni and you get no justice. They’ll sue your estate for the cleanup.

And if it makes you feel better, indoor soccer is doing the same thing this winter. No vax, no entry.

#169 Wack on 10.07.21 at 6:19 pm

In BC (but not all provinces) political beliefs are a protected ground for discrimination (but political beliefs are only protected in the context of employment, not other areas).

It would be interesting to see how the Human Rights Tribunal would handle an employee with a sincerely held political belief against vaccines in an employment situation.

A coworker of mine said he was protected from being forced to recite an indigenous land acknowledgement during a meeting under the basis that it was a political statement and infringed on his political beliefs (and probably was also compelled speech in violation of the charter). I wonder if the same would be true for an anti-vaccination sentiment? Forcing vaccination is almost worse as it’s not just compelled speech, but compelling something into your body that you don’t want.

It would be interesting to see what would happen if a BC government employee went to the Human Rights Tribunal and/or sued for wrongful dismissal on this basis.

For the record I’m pro-vaccine, but I’m just pondering someones options. Maybe someone smarter in law than me would know the answer.

#170 Faron on 10.07.21 at 6:20 pm

#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm

Incorrect.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00175-5

#171 HH on 10.07.21 at 6:24 pm

Well, it’s a good thing I don’t believe in God. Wouldn’t want that getting in my way of good common sense and science. But then I have those memories
from the fifties when the polio vaccine was being administered to everyone and some who became disabled from the disease itself, my grandfather being one of them who was a United Church minister. My father reacted strongly to the vaccine. He was told he had to have had polio at one time. He remembered being isolated along with many other servicemen during WWII in England. They were told they had the flu but I think that was to avoid panic. Vaccines have been around for awhile. I’m not afraid of them.

#172 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 6:27 pm

#20 SoggyShorts

You are mixing sample size with duration of study.

These are vastly different metrics in medical studies.

#173 KLNR on 10.07.21 at 6:35 pm

going to be some choice gov jobs available soon.

Get vaxed or get axed losers.

#174 baloney Sandwitch on 10.07.21 at 6:38 pm

That is a hot unvaxed knightly maiden. We will regret the untimely beheading. Seriously, soldiers are court martialed and executed for cowardly behavior on the battlefield. Dismissal is to be expected.

#175 jerry on 10.07.21 at 6:40 pm

Having a child wear a mask is apparently less traumatizing than being in a hospital and on a ventilator.

Who knew?

#176 Annek on 10.07.21 at 6:50 pm

RWZM on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm
“Employment standards obligate employers to provide safe workplaces, or be responsible for consequences. When dealing with a virus that debilitates and kills, there’s no choice”
…………..

The vast majority of people who die from Covid are already at the age where you die of natural causes. And probably not working. The risk to vaccinated people of average workplace age by unvaccinated people is practically nothing.
…………………..
We are not just referring to people who die from Covid.
One in ten people who get Covid, get “ long Covid” where one is fatigued for months and possibly years. Do you really want that? It is not just old people who get long Covid. Plus there are other issues with catching Covid where you may not die, but have various multi-system and/ or organ damage. Plus if you chose to live in a society , you have an obligation to protect others, not just worry about yourself.
Unvaccinated people have the potential to create mutations in the Covid virus. Do we want another version of the Delta or worse?

#177 Spike on 10.07.21 at 6:52 pm

The comments are fantastic

#178 Val on 10.07.21 at 6:53 pm

First, if 80% are vaxed, then why are you affraid? You are protected, right? Or is it a lie? Ah, i forgot, vaccine protects from lethal outcome in 97%. And death rate in Canada has been… less than 2%. Duh

Second, kids do not need the vaccine. Citing public health ontario: 70000 kids got sick, hospitalization rate under 0.7%, ICU admission was less than 0.1%. 2 kids dies who had underlying conditions.
SickKids has offered to treat adults at the height of the pandemic. Because children were not getting sick.

Now, i have had covid and have natural immunity. Dr advised single dose after 6 months. Wait, but single dose means i am not fully vaxed and do not qualify for pass. I want to do the right thing based on science – and science says (Qatar Israel, US studies) that natural immunity plus single shot is way more protective than double mrna.

#179 Chris L. on 10.07.21 at 6:53 pm

DELETED

#180 Stone on 10.07.21 at 6:54 pm

Do you get the impression that the anti-vaxxers are on their last breath? I guess they get louder like little children having a temper tantrum and are about to fall over from their screaming to take a nap because they’ve exhausted themselves.

Employers are getting ready to terminate the employment of those who refuse to get vaccinated. Of course, these are trying times for the unvaccinated who refuse to take the jab. For those who are vaccinated, with all these unvaccinated losers being terminated, your opportunities for a raise, a promotion, a choice parking spot in the employee parking lot are growing by leaps and bounds. The time is good to pounce and get your piece of the goodies.

Good times are ahead. Thank you to the unvaxxed degenerate losers. The vaccinated thank you for your stupidity.

#181 Interstellar Old Yeller on 10.07.21 at 6:55 pm

6:53pm and already 156 comments… I’m guessing this will be one of those 400+ comment posts, and not many of them any kind of joy to read. As a kindness to yourself (and Dorothy), maybe you could delegate moderating the blog to someone else tonight, Garth.

#182 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 6:59 pm

Kids 12 years old are being told they can decide.

This is not anecdotal. This is factual and it happened to kids I know.

I just looked on the CDC website Garth. Pediatric Covid deaths are on par with paediatric flu deaths historical. We knew from early on young people skated with ease.

But that all really doesn’t mater.

The question is, what does it say when a minor at 12 years of age is told by our leaders that they are old enough to decide that this, well, let’s not lie to ourselves, it is an experimental vaccine is up to him to take?

Do you not see any issues with this?

You don’t see a problem with trucks pulling up to schools and telling kids to get the jab – their call, don’t worry about clearing it with your parents/guardians?

I mean…we’re getting mighty creepy here, you must admit. This is certainly crossing the line.

Let me be perfectly clear – I hope it works. I hope it turns out to be amazing and we can do other things with it that help humanity in the future. I hope they figure out the lipid thing to make it feasible as a treatment, as what I read about the potential there sounded sci-fi amazing.

But we’re not there certainly. I noted lipid nanoparticles are a serious issue, likely the cause of these clots and other serious issues, and it looks like it continues to be the boundary. mRNA is mighty delicate, lasting seconds or minutes in most cases, and it needs robust protection from production facility to destination to injection – hence lipids. And getting kids into this mess, declaring them as of-age to decide this very complex issue where the data just doesn’t justify it in the first place – well, that’s quite a step too far in my view. That ethical issue is clearly removed with older folks with shorter lifespan left and 500x higher risk of death than 0-18 year old group. In this case, if you’re in the older age group and risk it would indeed be unethical for you NOT to get the vaccine with this data statistic.

#183 Spia on 10.07.21 at 6:59 pm

From a circulating comment.

“There’s a story about people on a boat. A passenger decides to dig a hole through the floor of their cabin. Water flows in. Other passengers are pissed. But it’s the digger’s own cabin, they argue, so why should it matter?

Personal choice only goes so far when we’re all on the same boat.”

Source unknown…

#184 FriedEggs on 10.07.21 at 7:01 pm

Preach it like Governor Kathy Hochul! The greater fools are the apostles!

‘Gov. Kathy Hochul on Tuesday was pressed by a reporter about a controversial speech at a Brooklyn mega-church where she urged worshippers to act as “my apostles” and proselytize on behalf of COVID-19 vaccinations.’

https://nypost.com/2021/10/05/gov-kathy-hochul-defends-calling-nyc-churchgoers-my-apostles/

#185 Jim on 10.07.21 at 7:05 pm

Something that seems to be overlooked, what will be the result of losing all those employees? As I live in NS I’ll pick on it. According to NS Health there are about 6% of the population who won’t get vax’d. What will happen to the NS medical system if 5% walk? Isn’t there already a shortage of workers? If the positions require training or experience I doubt they would be filled quickly. I know if the company I work for lost 5% of the work force it wouldn’t be able to meet contracted requirements.

#186 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 7:09 pm

#44 SoggyShorts

Soggy, once again, you’re mixing things up.

It doesn’t matter that they didn’t test the polio vaccine for decades.

First, let’s begin with the death rate being significantly higher with Polio.

The vaccine did improve over time as well. There WERE issues with the way they made them. They DID cause issues. Those issues were found over time and eliminated and vaccines improved. The stuff we got was not same as the stuff in the 50s, 60s, etc.

But back to the key point. Many people got the Polio vaccine and many years have passed since. Therefore, the safety profile long-term can be determined.

mRNA vaccines are new on many fronts, including the mRNA itself and then the lipid nanoparticles into which the mRNA is encased for protection.

There is no replacement for time Soggy. You need time for things to manifest themselves.

I cut my cable long time ago, and watch OTA, including some US stations. Do you know how many commercials I see each month for drugs that were prescribed and have turned out to cause serious issues after 5 years or 10 years? With huge law suits in place?

Again, I’m not saying this is what we are heading for, but it is certainly not outside of realm of reasonable approach to want to wait and see more data, especially if you’re at low risk by age or contributing health issues.

#187 Shelley on 10.07.21 at 7:14 pm

OMG, …..come on folks…..another example of 1st world privilege…..I’m still laughing…..

#188 mark on 10.07.21 at 7:16 pm

I work for a city employer who in bc has said the City Of *********** will not mandate any mandatory vaccination of city employee’s. Go figure I wish we had a work vaccine mandate, currently the vax rate in the north is 50 percent, such a dichotomy of political and personnel mind sets…..

#189 fishman on 10.07.21 at 7:17 pm

I would have handled this vax like Captain James Cook got his crew to eat sauerkraut. Cook was posted to chart Labrador, the Gulf of St. Lawrence & the river below Quebec City for Wolfe’s ships. He saw the Indians didn’t get scurvy. Figured out it was the spruce needle tea they drank. By the time he was ready for his voyages of discovery, Cook had substituted barrels of sauerkraut for the crew. The crew didn’t like it & wouldn’t eat it. So Cook put the sauerkraut under lock & key. Then he’d have special dinners just with his officers at night, secretly, of sauerkraut. Soon the crew was stealing the sauerkraut.

#190 Alex the Conservative on 10.07.21 at 7:18 pm

So many people call themselves conservative and yet they are antivax. Do they know that each of these unvaxed ICU patients cost us all hundreds of thousands a pice? Money that could go to tax cuts, to business incentives, all blown up because of needle phobia

Grow a pear and get vaxed you wuss! You’re costing us all.

Libertarians is what you’ve become. That’s not conservative. That’s foolish.

#191 Dragonfly 58 on 10.07.21 at 7:19 pm

Reynolds 753. cyclist ? I have a couple of 531 bikes, but 753 came in after the era I like . { mid 1960’s – mid 1970’s }. Plus I like to do my own repairs as necessary and find 753’s metallurgy a bit beyond my brazing ability.
But I hear the 753’s ride very nicely.

#192 Alex on 10.07.21 at 7:19 pm

Rights and Freedoms?

#193 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 7:19 pm

@#176 Spike
“The comments are fantastic”

++++

Thank you!

#194 seatbelts on 10.07.21 at 7:22 pm

I’ll just put this here:

https://twitter.com/plmanseau/status/1276942827713376258

;-)

#195 david on 10.07.21 at 7:23 pm

“Jesus would like that. Go do it, Andy.”

Fetal cells from aborted fetus have been used to develop the Pfizer Covid 19 vaccine.

Think about it harder Garth…

http://publichealth.lacounty.gov/media/coronavirus/docs/vaccine/VaccineDevelopment_FetalCellLines.pdf

From the document: “The mRNA COVID-19 vaccines produced by Pfizer and Moderna do not require the use of any fetal cell
cultures in order to manufacture (produce) the vaccine.” Shame on you. – Garth

#196 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 7:23 pm

@#158 Pouting Ponzies Persnickety Ponderings

“No snark remark?”

+++

Yours are more entertaining… :)

#197 Tor on 10.07.21 at 7:24 pm

LoL at folks waiting for promotion because someone might be terminated. Get ready to work overtime, losers.
T2 will take care of unemployed. In Canada, its better to collect CRB than report to work every morning.

#198 Faron on 10.07.21 at 7:25 pm

Well, that’s what I get. Garth, if you catch that comment, cam you modify the user name please?

#199 Beagleface on 10.07.21 at 7:30 pm

Garth:
You’re a rock star. Don’t let anybody tell you otherwise.
Thanks for all you do to make our world a better place.

#200 Kevin on 10.07.21 at 7:32 pm

Thanks Garth for today’s posting, you are wise beyond your years! Don’t listen to the haters and the loud but tiny minority. Keep your chin up; the majority wants things to go back to normal. We’ll take those job openings!

All the best to you and your family. I’m thankful for this blog.

#201 Unpinned on 10.07.21 at 7:33 pm

When you consider the burden children bear in school wearing masks and how they have been totally given little consideration how much it costs kids in learning and achieving in school with a mask on in class it is more than enough motivation to get the adults or anyone over 12 to get the jab. We are not caring enough for kids and at minimum we can get the jab and know we have done our minimum for kids.

#202 DML on 10.07.21 at 7:38 pm

Thank you Andy from Langley for your reasoned insight. You are clearly a man of letters. Please post your thorough appraisal of the Nuremburg code. A cynic might say you’d never heard of it until the Fox clowns latched on. Also, spitting in someones face is an excellent tactic to convince the sheeples. Ignore the majority who think you’re an ignorant imbecile.

#203 Quintilian on 10.07.21 at 7:39 pm

Garth based on some of your posts, I think you are a kind person, so it is surprising to me that you would be less than kind to Langley Andy.

I do believe that the next Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders will likely have identified and classified the disorder which is most likely have affected those whom you refer as “anti vaxers”.

I think you need to understand that when you engage these people you are actually playing into, and reinforcing their delusion. People with mental disorders cannot be “talked out of it”.

You are unintentionally causing them mental anguish.
Now that you know, what will you do?

#204 its' all good on 10.07.21 at 7:46 pm

And while almost 80% of Canadians are fully dosed, millions are not. Nor any of the children. Unknown yet is whether schools will have a mandate and, if so, how ant-vax parents will respond.
_____________________________________

if i’m getting my kids vaccinated, sure as heck they’d better mandate every teacher/administrator/support staff vaccinated too..!!!

#205 what happened to gas prices on 10.07.21 at 7:46 pm

Gas prices in GTA/Toronto $1.43 a liter. This is just the beginning. Maybe Covid will get alot worse and we can see 59 cents a liter again. I can’t remember exactly when but I think it was in 2020 CityTv was making an issue of Doug Ford and his pointing out Trudeau, Liberal Federal carbon tax with Ontario stickers and gas prices were lower while the carbon taxes were put in. Look at the carbon taxes now way up. What happened to those low gas prices? They never stay down and gas taxes, carbon taxes, excise taxes always go way up. News(Nothing Worth Ever Seeing).

#206 Doing my Part on 10.07.21 at 7:48 pm

I would say to the 5% unvaxed that walk or get turfed, good riddance, they were the bottom of the food chain anyway. Probably better off without them working for you.

#207 Is anybody home? on 10.07.21 at 7:52 pm

Found on the NIH website as of July 8/2021. Indeed Ivermectin is an approved treatment for Covid 19. Note the side effects of Remdisivir (renal failure). Remdisivir is part of the Canadian treatment protocol. Our health care system says Ivermectin is not an approved treatment for Covid 19!

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/tables/table-2e/

#208 not when but how fast and how high interest rates will be on 10.07.21 at 7:57 pm

We will be seeing the highest paying financial institutions in Canada with GIC rates 1 to 2 years 6% to 7%, 3 to 5 years 7% to 8%, 6 to 10 years terms 8% to 9%. Count on it. This is hard to tell when this happens but my best guest is 2027 to 2030. Stick around and be amazed.

#209 Flop… on 10.07.21 at 7:58 pm

I remember a bygone time from where I’m from when the main thing guys wanted to avoid was doing the dishes…

M47BC

“Homeless man allegedly paid to get other man’s jab.

A blind, homeless Melbourne man was allegedly paid to get a Covid jab on behalf of another man — and a court heard police fear the “jab-for-cash” scheme will continue.”

#210 Frank B. on 10.07.21 at 8:08 pm

Here is a video of the FDA Vaccine and Related Biological Products Advisory Committee from 9/17/21.

It’s 8 hours long but worth watching.
Time stamp 4:20. Not good!
I’m double vaxxed. Made me sick after watching.

https://youtu.be/WFph7-6t34M

Only 17000 injuries, 4400 serious, in Canada. Not to bad in 6 months.
https://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccine-safety/

Just sucks if your one of those 4400.
At least Canada gives you money for your sacrifice of the greater good. Maybe.

https://vaccineinjurysupport.ca/en

I bought Merck (MRK) yesterday. I think their rebranding of ivermectin is genius. Short (MRNA) Long (MRK)

#211 Odif Yltsaeb on 10.07.21 at 8:09 pm

If you want to be a real traitor, start posting cat pictures!

#212 Mr Happy on 10.07.21 at 8:09 pm

Full disclosure: I am a Christian. I am fully vaxxed. I had a thought the other day….

A unvaccinated Christian dies from Covid and now stands before God.

Christian: “But God…I prayed every day for you to save me from Covid…why did you let me die?”

God: ” I sent you the vaccine…didn’t I?”

#213 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 8:12 pm

Kids vaccinated not necessary! At least next couple years. As I know too many parents, who is FULLY vaccinated – against provide vaccine for they kids. If government apply rule for mandatory kids vaccinated, they will do huge mistake and have huge opposition. Garth, this is reality and you can delete or not my message, but as honest person you probably will agree with worried parents. You should understand and agree with simple think – they are not against vaccination. They just wont to push them to do with not good tested vaccine for kids. Tested any vaccine for kids take more time and need more stronger requirement. What we have know about that now? Nothing from this.

If somebody know that some problem exist and just ignore it – it doesn’t mean that problem will disappeared by itself.

#214 Randy on 10.07.21 at 8:15 pm

Get your head out of your ass and maybe you’ll learn something. Yes and you are a traitor. Goofus.

#215 Mr. Mister on 10.07.21 at 8:20 pm

#210 Mr Happy.

I had a thought the other day too…

A vaccinated Christian dies from Covid and now stands before God.

Christian: “But God…I took the vaccine…why did you let me die?”

God: ”you should have prayed about it… I would have directed you to gab to warn you”

#216 Sean Melvin on 10.07.21 at 8:21 pm

Why no real names associated with a comment? I still do not understand this process of leaving comment with no real names…never hiding here _ been reading this website since 2006ish thank you Garth.

Sean

#217 Dogman01 on 10.07.21 at 8:23 pm

#160 SunShowers on 10.07.21 at 5:57 pm

Fredrick Douglas is a baddass.

“The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress.” – Frederick Douglass – BOOM!

Kind of explains Russia under Stalin, those Russians can endure a whole lot, stoic bunch.

—————————————-

I think I agree; it is another problem with tying Vaccine to employment.

Super Rich who do not work or do not need to work…they could skip this Vaccine.

If instead it was Legislated, as it should be in our “Democracy” then the Wage Slave and the Elite 1% are equal.

In our Service economy not only did the low paid worker have to expose themselves when un-vaccinated, they lose any right to choice due to their dependence on wages.

“Those who profess to favor freedom, and yet deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground. They want rain without thunder and lightning.” – Frederick Douglass

#218 FriedEggs on 10.07.21 at 8:27 pm

God’s word > ‘Your thoughts’

A real Christian wouldn’t ask why when its already been told.

Revelations 13:16-17

’16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name.’

‘God – I sent you the vaccine’ -Mr. Happy

(priceless)

#219 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 8:28 pm

Over 200 comments and no one reminded us about the CDC data that noted 78% of people in ICUs were obese?

What? Did you think that sugar fat fast food diet the corporations hook us on for profit has no cost to us?

At what point do we push some blame their way? They’re no different to tobacco companies.

Wonder why I don’t hear this push to get people to be healthy on the news? Would it upset all that marketing money from fast food industry showing us burgers with cheddar on the bun, bacon, onion rings and cheese on the burger itself? I guess the onion is the vegetable. Enjoy. No, it won’t do you any harm.

You are now sounding certifiable. Just shut up and go get the shot. We’re busy here. – Garth

#220 Arthur Geramnartgeram on 10.07.21 at 8:41 pm

How to square the “ Trudeau Circle”? We speak of an improving economy while the “ Super Genius” Liberal minority continues to blacken the prospects of industry, banks and raise the very real disaster of Energy Starvation among Canada’s most vulnerable. One has to wonder how Trudeau will placate his tightly controlled ‘seats’ when home heating and transportation suck off the last remaining disposable income after the egregious ratcheting up of taxes.

Does Trudeau plan an ‘ inflation break’ to those self interested groups that pulled an election fast one on the rest of Canada. Will more taxes on the ROC be needed to pander the 52 GTA seats who place Trudeaus promise of more immigration over the he health of the country ? New Liberal vote blocs will feel the cold and hunger like everyone else.

Fact: foreign direct investment in Canada has gone negative for the first time in our history. The brain drain is a broken dam in flood. The damage of Gerald Butts manipulations are historic. Even our Big Six banks have gone from great patriots to a seismic shift out of Canada. The lack of opportunity in Canada is staggering. Trudeau has taken the surplus built over generations and squandered it on friviolity. He may like the idea of a Chinese dictatorship, but the adults don’t and our debt is mounting.

http://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/buy-canadian-banks-amid-puzzling-underperformance-analyst-1.1663118

Fact: Are investors puzzled about CDN banks underperformance? No. We see Trudeaus focus on rescuing Daesh brides, killing opportunity, raising taxes, anti- energy and installing Huawei spy network another troublesome barrier to trade.

#221 Rassy on 10.07.21 at 8:45 pm

Anyone thinking they are safe because they had Covid in the past better think again.

https://news.yale.edu/2021/10/01/unvaccinated-reinfection-sars-cov-2-likely-study-finds

#222 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 8:46 pm

DELETED

#223 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 8:50 pm

DELETED

#224 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 8:50 pm

You are now sounding certifiable. Just shut up and go get the shot. We’re busy here. – Garth

I’m one of the few making sense here.

You are a wise man Garth. I’ve seen you in 3D, I know. It is on your face.

You know this is not a black and white issue.

Mothers-to-be can abort a child and yet adults can’t decide what is injected into their bodies? And I’m the weird one?

You’re vaccinated! What are you worried about me for?

You are done here. – Garth

#225 jack on 10.07.21 at 8:54 pm

I’m perfectly happy to be part of the unvaxxed…let me know in 5 years how this new mRNA technology works out in the long term.

#226 BillyBob on 10.07.21 at 9:00 pm

#184 Jim on 10.07.21 at 7:05 pm
Something that seems to be overlooked, what will be the result of losing all those employees? As I live in NS I’ll pick on it. According to NS Health there are about 6% of the population who won’t get vax’d. What will happen to the NS medical system if 5% walk? Isn’t there already a shortage of workers? If the positions require training or experience I doubt they would be filled quickly. I know if the company I work for lost 5% of the work force it wouldn’t be able to meet contracted requirements.

==================================================

Yep.

Sibling works high-up in Coastal Health in Victoria. The estimated number of anti-vax health workers there is much higher than 6%. Those Vancouver Islanders. So progressive and rational. But then, this is a culture where new nurses don’t aren’t scheduled for training on night shifts because the poor dears might get “too tired”. And others are traumatized by Covid because, apparently they didn’t realize whey they entered the medical profession they might have to deal with, y’know, serious medical problems. So very large absenteeism issues. (Unless there’s overtime to be paid, and then phones are answered.)

They’re already working at absolute max capacity. Terrified of what would happen if a vax mandate lost them another massive chunk of staff.

Me, I’d love to see them all fired. Might find life in the private sector a little different than they’re used to. Reality can be cruel but it’s an effective teacher.

#227 zxcvbnm on 10.07.21 at 9:00 pm

It’s a fact that any vaccine mandate is a reduction of liberty, right? Arguably necessary – but beside the point.

Why shouldn’t any reduction in liberty be mourned? Why ridicule those who cry outrage, or appear injured at the idea of it? No matter how misguided you believe them to be, at least they’re passionate about liberty, or are trying to be. I think that’s pretty cool

#228 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 9:05 pm

Actually I don’t understand why employers should fire not vaccinated employees. Just divide all of them in two bunch – vax and NOvax. Put them in separate area and …bingo! problem solved. If companies have separate smokers rooms why they can’t have NOvax working environment. May by for those employees wages will be less b’s they will do less paid job. That’s it!

If I agree to be served not vaccinated doctor, b’s I’m , for instance, fully vaccinated and now don’t care – it is my decision.

Garth, if you know somebody who is now in power in Conservative party an represent party as MP – tell them my idea. They can discuss in parliament this idea and pretty soon people will love cons much more

#229 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 9:06 pm

#171 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 6:27 pm
#20 SoggyShorts
You are mixing sample size with duration of study.
These are vastly different metrics in medical studies.

***********************
I’m not mixing them up, one is a very strong indicator of the other.
Allow me to explain:

If the vaccine was going to cause a side effect after 2 years people would not all get it on the 2 year anniversary of their shot. It would have a bell curve distribution so of 6 billion dosses it is extremely likely that we would see 2-year effects in tens of millions of people after just one year, and millions would have the 5-year effect, and so on.

Not every possible side effect works this way, but most of the plausible ones do.

#185 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 7:09 pm
Many people got the Polio vaccine and many years have passed since. Therefore, the safety profile long-term can be determined.
*******************
I said that already. In 30-50 years we’ll know everything about Covid and the vaccines.

That doesn’t change what the right choice is today.
When the polio vaccine first came available the long-term safety profile was not known, and people did the right thing.

#230 KLNR on 10.07.21 at 9:12 pm

@#217 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 8:28 pm
Over 200 comments and no one reminded us about the CDC data that noted 78% of people in ICUs were obese?

What? Did you think that sugar fat fast food diet the corporations hook us on for profit has no cost to us?

At what point do we push some blame their way? They’re no different to tobacco companies.

Wonder why I don’t hear this push to get people to be healthy on the news? Would it upset all that marketing money from fast food industry showing us burgers with cheddar on the bun, bacon, onion rings and cheese on the burger itself? I guess the onion is the vegetable. Enjoy. No, it won’t do you any harm.

You are now sounding certifiable. Just shut up and go get the shot. We’re busy here. – Garth

this person has always sounded like a nutter.

#231 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 9:26 pm

@#214 Sean Melvin

“Why no real names associated with a comment? ”

++++

Why do you automatically assume that isnt my real name?

#232 THE DANDADA on 10.07.21 at 9:27 pm

Were all vaxed the week were born in Canada.

So what’s the big deal on another one?

Science has come so far in 50 years that it makes it so much more efficient and safer to create a vaccine today.

Bunch of degenerates…… Fire’em ALL.

#233 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 9:30 pm

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#234 Sheesh on 10.07.21 at 9:31 pm

#202 Is anybody home? on 10.07.21 at 7:52 pm
Found on the NIH website as of July 8/2021. Indeed Ivermectin is an approved treatment for Covid 19. Note the side effects of Remdisivir (renal failure). Remdisivir is part of the Canadian treatment protocol. Our health care system says Ivermectin is not an approved treatment for Covid 19!
https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/tables/table-2e/……..

—————-
Dude, finish reading the title would ya?
Table 2e. Characteristics of Antiviral Agents That Are Approved or Under Evaluation for the Treatment of COVID-19.
Ivermectin is not approved, but is under evaluation in clinical trials.

#235 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 9:36 pm

@#224 BillyBob

“Me, I’d love to see them all fired. Might find life in the private sector a little different than they’re used to. Reality can be cruel but it’s an effective teacher.”

+++

I remember when Ronald Regan fired all the air traffic controllers when they refused “back to work” orders.
“Airmageddon” didn’t materialize and thousands of unemployed air traffic controllers were left twisting in the wind….

It surprised a lot of govt workers…..

#236 Keen Reader on 10.07.21 at 9:37 pm

@208 Frank: thanks for the link to official cdn stats. I wish more dogs used actual data when arguing. I enjoy watching science progress on origins, prevention and treatment of COVID. I’m pro-vax and my booklet is full, but… keeping options open.

I’m actively listening to both sides and love good fact-based debates. I accept that it makes me anti-vax to some, even though I may eventually join “the club”. Hopefully avoiding another delete, this time! Cheers

#237 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 9:37 pm

#169 Faron on 10.07.21 at 6:20 pm
#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm

Incorrect.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00175-5

——————————————————

There are dozens of cases of activists using courts as political weapons. It’s a different beast when the science itself gets litigated, with a scientist on the stand having his/her research findings picked apart by another scientist through their barrister.

See the “scientist” Michael Mann, inventor of the fraudulent global warming hockey stick graph. (He of course welched on paying the judgement)

https://climatecite.com/british-columbia-judgment-mann-vs-ball-defamation-suit/

The point as it relates to wrongful dismissal cases is that the science behind the decision to mass fire people will get picked apart by the plaintiffs, probably in front of a jury, given the amounts of money that will be at stake here.

The employer will need to put up a scientist who can vouch for the science, and against the science of natural immunity, as well as for the long term safety of the vaccines.

It’s a harder hill to climb than many think, and it will be interesting to watch.

Also, this is happening elsewhere and that might set precedent.

I watched a video clip from an ICU doctor in NY who got fired. Female, has had Covid and has anti-bodies and worked with covid cases since the start. Had a former patient who also had Covid who wanted to get vaxxed. She told him to wait the suggested 90 days. He did and got it the 91st day, and ended up in her ICU with a heart attack the next day.

These sorts of things are from real front line doctors who make compelling witnesses in a courtroom.

These decisions will drag on through the courts for many years, my post was simply that Garth was too dismissive of the chances of those fired to seek significant compensation for wrongful dismissal.

Agree that any employee can be fired at any time for any reason, they just need to be paid out.

#238 Faron on 10.07.21 at 9:38 pm

#225 zxcvbnm on 10.07.21 at 9:00 pm

Why shouldn’t any reduction in liberty be mourned?

Yeah bottom row, you got it. Preach it. It all started when “they” imposed traffic laws on muh liberties. I took it pretty hard. I GOTS A DANGED RIGHT TO KILL AND BE KILLED. Dad gum.

#239 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 9:40 pm

Elon had enough of the “progressives” lecturing him in Cali?

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/tesla-moving-headquarters-austin-texas-says-ceo-musk-2021-10-07/

And lower state taxes to boot.

#240 Faron on 10.07.21 at 9:45 pm

#223 jack on 10.07.21 at 8:54 pm

I’m perfectly happy to be part of the unvaxxed…let me know in 5 years

K. You might be dead though or left breathless of long COVID. Or be psychotic (also COVID). To whome should we speak then?

#241 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 9:45 pm

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#242 Jim on 10.07.21 at 9:46 pm

Less than a third of the world’s population has seen any vaccine yet, so North America – especially Canada – is in a sweet spot to benefit from the global GDP expansion which will come over the next two years.

The most selfish people are those that clamour for 2 doses,knowing 1 dose gives you 80% efficacy and soon to be three doses for everyone over 12,
Knowing the majority of the worlds population hasn’t had 1 dose.
Just saying.

#243 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 9:50 pm

@#233 Woke up this morning
DELETED

++++

Garth is merely implementing HIS right to delete someone on HIS blog.

Kinda like your right to non vaccinate and endlessly babble on about it..

Oh the irony

#244 facts on 10.07.21 at 9:52 pm

The content of this site is archived for the record for future evidence.

#245 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 10:03 pm

I wonder if the site of your co-workers being fired and then losing their homes because they can’t pay the mortgage will motivate those “untouchable” anti vaxx govt workers to ….” get the shot”.

I wont hold my breath.

#246 Vanreal on 10.07.21 at 10:03 pm

I hate anti vaxxers. They are selfish idiots who are causing harm to everyone not just their own idiotic selves. The only plus with them nothing getting vaccinated is that their chance of dying is greatly increased.

#247 T-Rev on 10.07.21 at 10:11 pm

Fully vaxxed. Happy to take the occasional booster if necessary. Fully support doing what we need to in order to preserve the health system.

Dead set against vaccine mandates. The vaxx works remarkably well at reducing the severity of illness and death. Less clear whether it does anything to reduce transmission. Therefore, there are two entities harmed by anti vaxxers: themselves and the health system capacity when they show up sick and dying at hospitals, needlessly consuming resources that are already scarce. I don’t care they harm themselves, that’s their right. As for system capacity, that’s another thing. However, we shouldn’t be forcing vaxx on them; instead we should be setting up treatment centers for unvaxxed patients that provide modest care from largely unskilled or under-skilled healthcare workers according to a flow chart designed by skilled doctors. Our system doesn’t have capacity flexibility because we’ve eliminated it’s ability to be flexible. Covid hospitals for the unvaxxed should look like a M*A*S*H* hospital. Not because I don’t think they deserve care; they do. But because the level of care our current system dictates is not available within the current protocols. So set up giant triage centers for the unvaxxed, where 2500 patients can be attended to by a dozen nurses with a flow chart and whatever equipment the system can spare, and let people reap the consequences of their actions. Easy.

I’ve got a degree Science, majoring in Math. Post-grad medical sciences dropout. I get the numbers. And the vaxx works. However, it’s not without its cautions, there’s questions around its safety for young adults, children and teens to the point it has been limited in some western countries, and no one frankly has the right in a free and open country to coerce others to inject themselves with anything. Anti vaxxers over 25 are selfish and foolish, but last time I checked that wasn’t a crime and you don’t lose your job for it. But for those under 25, the vaxx has a questionable risk:reward ratio. As mentioned above, our goal shouldn’t be to save people from themselves, but to protect the system capacity, and people in this demographic aren’t filling up hospitals and consuming capacity, so mandates for these age groups seems baffling to me. It’s not supported by the science. Yet here we are insisting 12 year olds get a shot so they can play sports or go to a restaurant. This has turned into ideology Garth, and ideologues should scare everyone.

In short- if you’re over 25, go getting vaxxed or youre a selfish coward. Someone have the balls to set up a separate triage system for unvaxxed patients offering what limited care and resources are available, and make sure we broadcast it live for all to see. Stop trying to jab young people who aren’t contributing to capacity constraints in any meaningful way and for whom natural immunity is likely better than the shot anyway. And stop coercing people at threat of job loss to get a shot, even if they’re stupid not to. I’ve wavered on this issue over the last two months between thinking maybe there should be mandates to being against. I think the biggest three things that have gotten me there are the fact that the vaxx is not slowing this pandemic down, so it ain’t going away even if everyone is jabbed, the fact that new info is coming to light continually about the risk:reward in kids and worth tapping the brakes for, and the fact we’re pursuing this like religious zealots, which always scares the hell out of me. When given the choice of freedom vs limitation of rights, always err in the side of freedom. It might not be the expedient choice, but it’s always the right one long term.

#248 canuck on 10.07.21 at 10:11 pm

#159 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 5:56 pm

As a recent retired anesthesiologist trained in Canada and working for many years in Denver, Colorado, I am continually appalled at the beliefs of the non-vaccination populace. It is worse in the US as compared to Canada. The last six months of my practice found me increasingly irritated with non-vaxxers. I would get into these nonsense arguments with them. Somehow, it was OK for them to put me at increased risk of Covid exposure because they refused the vaccination. Anesthesiology is one of the most high risk of professions with respect to Covid exposure. Yes, I am fully vaccinated and received my third dose of Pfizer a few weeks ago. No, this would not fully protect me from Covid-19 especially the delta variant. I wanted to refuse to care for the patients who would not get vaccinated. This was not an option. I realized that while I have loved the practice of anesthesiology for over forty years now seemed like the best time to retire.
____________________________________________

Patients that are vaxxed can and do transmit the virus so you’re still exposed regardless who you’re treating. How does a Doctor not know this? If you’re vaxxed, what is your concern?

This Doctor proves that there is a difference between being educated and smart. I for one am grateful you’re retired. Your comment about wanting to refuse treatment shows you were in it only for for the money.

#249 Looking up on 10.07.21 at 10:13 pm

A deadly virus descends upon humankind. Science gives us a gift, effective and safe vaccines. A disturbing number of people look this gift horse in the mouth and proclaim “it’s a violation of my rights, this has become a Nazi regime! I heard it from a guy that you grow a third eye if you take the vaccine!”

Wow, just wow.

#250 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 10:14 pm

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#251 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 10:16 pm

Dragonfly 58 #190
Reynolds 753. cyclist ? I have a couple of 531 bikes, but 753 came in after the era I like . { mid 1960’s – mid 1970’s }. Plus I like to do my own repairs as necessary and find 753’s metallurgy a bit beyond my brazing ability.
But I hear the 753’s ride very nicely.

All of you non-bicycle oriented readers should feel free to skip this posting.

Oh yes, very avid bicycle guy. I have a number of steel bikes built up with Reynolds, Columbus, Dedacciai, True Temper and Tange tube sets. I have a Vitus 971 frame that I had built for me by a frame builder named Julian Edwards who was based in Owen Sound. This would have been while I was living in Toronto around 1986. It is still a very sweet ride and built up with a Dura Ace 7400 full group set.

I have a very nice Mercian Reynolds 853 frame that is a great ride. I also have a Bob Jackson S&S quick couple Reynolds 631 full touring bike. I built up a Jackson 631 road bike for my daughter.

You are correct about 753 tubing. It was and is rather exotic. It was very light weight and difficult to work with. In the mid ‘70s to early ‘80s it was the ne plus ultra of racing frame sets and it was what we all lusted for. Reynolds demanded brazing specimens from frame builders before they would allow them to build a 753 frame. It needed low brazing temperatures and silver flux. They became brittle and prone to failure at higher temperatures. They are next to impossible to repair. I have an Ilkeston Raleigh 753 frame and I will likely never build it up. You cannot cold set the rear drop out space from 126 mm to 130 mm. Reynolds 853 made 753 obsolete. 853 allows for higher temperature TIG welding and has the light weight that 753 achieved.

Sadly, well made steel frames have become supplanted with throw away carbon fibre. Only the artisanal frame makers use high end steel.

We now return you to regular programming.

#252 Faron on 10.07.21 at 10:17 pm

#237 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 9:37 pm
#169 Faron on 10.07.21 at 6:20 pm
#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm

This is tangential to your point w/re vax cases, so I won’t keep you long although I think you are wrong there too.

Have you read the judgement you linked? Mann was the plaintiff alleging defamation by a guy writing that Mann should be jailed. The science was never on trial. Case was dismissed because Dr. Mann ignored it for a decade because he has way bigger fish to fry.

As for Mann being fraudulent. So you think Penn State is a weak school? Do you understand his work? Can you tell me what an empirical orthogonal function is without googling? How about paleo-proxy records and their strengths and weaknesses? If you are going to make those kinds of claims (about a person who is litigious) you better know his work inside and out, front to back. Take that as friendly advice. You are woefully disarmed. I’d venture that the Facebook outage crippled your sources of “research”.

“using courts as political weapons.” Then “science itself gets litigated”

You are wrong, those are the same things. The defendants will certainly attempt to discredit the science until there is sufficient precedence showing it is unassailable. They will fail at discrediting in many cases if the plaintiff’s complaint is well-posed. The dismissed case described in the Nature article wasn’t well posed, but the judge found the climate science credible.

#253 Woke up this morning... on 10.07.21 at 10:22 pm

DELETED

#254 april on 10.07.21 at 10:23 pm

#199- I’ll second that!

#255 Willem on 10.07.21 at 10:24 pm

I’m not an anti-vaccine or Covidiot, however it is occurring frequently to me lately that we are courting with disaster to put all our eggs into the one trick pony and dogmatic paradym of vaccines or bust!!
Garth would you please check out the existing and emerging treatment therapies that are available to augment recovery and survival for people that test positive.
Vaccines are a great tool, but they are not the be all and end all to the pandemic as evidenced by the high case counts despite the 80% vaccination rate in BC.
THERE IS ABSOLUTELY TOO MUCH FOCUS ONLY ON VACCINES. Check out India’s extraordinary success with their “medicine kits” that were given to anybody that had a positive test! Early response with the right therapies will knock this virus to its knees as much as vaccines will help with herd immunity!

#256 Diamond Dog on 10.07.21 at 10:25 pm

Excellent points Garth, nicely done.

I’m not sure why some folks believe everything is fake or fraud and there’s a conspiracy behind it all but I tend to think that poor education and cognitive bias has a great deal to do with it. Some folks are just easily led and this is their defense, “it’s a conspiracy, it’s a conspiracy”. Just ask Trump.

“It’s a government plot for the rich to cash in”, “a plandemic”, “a fake emergency” and “look at how smart I am to not fall for it”! The lies people tell themselves to justify what they do, stories like the one below are all too common now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_iPpFBIZgA

1 in 500 Americans are now dead from Covid19. It took the virus and tremendous amounts of misinformation a mere year and a half to do it. Covid19 lowered the life expectancy rate in the U.S. in 2020 by a full year. It’s not all that difficult to see why governments are pushing toward mandated vaccines; its killing people and jamming up ICU’s, putting off elective surgeries, it’s disruptive to put it mildly. Vaccines are here, why not use them?

#257 Faron on 10.07.21 at 10:29 pm

#226 BillyBob on 10.07.21 at 9:00 pm

Sibling works high-up in Coastal Health in Victoria… anti-vax health workers… Those Vancouver Islanders”

Doesn’t jive. Get your facts straight. Look up your HA catchments or clarify with your sib.

#258 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 10:32 pm

#247 canuck

You have absolutely no idea about Covid transmission and associated risk. You have absolutely no idea of what I have accomplished in my field. Keep your ill informed and stupid comments to yourself.

Thank you.

#259 Midnights on 10.07.21 at 10:33 pm

Part 1: A Detailed Examination of Events Leading Up to the Coronavirus Pandemic | Truth Over News
copy paste title to get the doc.

Secondly, it’s interesting that hospitals that usually do funding drives for machinery, etc. I haven’t had to partake in these with all the subsidies they have taken from the government. If you’re willing to pay institutions to say C instead of D. One would go with who’s paying for the tune. It would be interesting to look at the accounting books of these institutions over the last 24 months.

#260 Doug in London on 10.07.21 at 10:35 pm

Good, at long, long, long, long, long last more people in government and business have seen the light and got the balls to do what is morally and ethically right. Jesus would approve. At long last work places will be given a good strong laxative to purge out the idiots. It can’t come soon enough. I’m looking forward to flying and riding Via Rail again with smart vaccinated fellow passengers.

For years I’ve heard horror stories about Millennials who are unemployed or underemployed, some even working long hours at unpaid internships. IF YOU are one of those frustrated Millennials, this is your BIG CHANCE! Got your resume out there RIGHT NOW! Well, what are you waiting for?

#261 Midnights on 10.07.21 at 10:37 pm

Its somewhat Obvious

#262 Faron on 10.07.21 at 10:40 pm

#251 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 10:16 pm

Family in healthcare are having the same experience as you. With colleagues even. They are ready to bail, but the desperation is high so wages are ramping.

Nice breakdown of sweet sweet steel! Not a high end bike guy at all, but love my steeds. First was a trek 950 with Columbus tubing. Raced it fully rigid. Lasted for 24 years before someone stole it. Now riding an old Rocky Mountain Metro of the same era. Tange tubing. Essentially a 29er. Wonderful bike. Was set to put 2500kms on it touring this summer in Oregon until our trip was interrupted… Story for another time. One day I’ll step up to Reynolds steel. Great logos too FWIW.

#263 Midnights on 10.07.21 at 10:44 pm

First, two books people should read because they are hell-bent in one directional view.
a) Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell
b) Curious: The Desire to Know and Why Your…
by Ian Leslie

I’m kind of curious, why the CEO hasn’t taken His own medicine, plus why he considers himself an outlier to the Rules and regulations?

Pfizer’s CEO hasn’t gotten his Covid vaccine yet, saying he doesn’t want to cut in line
PUBLISHED MON, DEC 14 202010:02 AM ESTUPDATED WED, DEC 16 202011:26 AM EST

What do I know.

#264 kc on 10.07.21 at 10:44 pm

106 Roc on 10.07.21 at 4:08 pm

enthalpy on 10.07.21 at 1:58 pm
I believe in everyones right to choose (And I chose the jab).
But this takes us into uncharted territory. I find the sweeping powers and continual division tactics to be quite scary.

If the big C is endemic(it is). These other changes won’t ever go away(when does Govt give up things they implement? ) .

It’s not looking good.
——————-
Totally agree.

Will vaxx mandate be here for years to come? What’s next: You’re not considered vaxxed until you get the booster etc.

I got jabbed almost 10 months ago. I wonder what`s my immunity now vs someone unvaxxed who recently had covid. Yet, I can go to restaurants etc but that person cannot. Vaxx passport divides society. I refuse to use it so looks like it`s going to be a long, boring winter and spring ..

XXXXXXXXXXX

I just refuse to get the *** … when BC placed in that stupid mask horsecrap I was sitting in my favourite watering hole and said to my fav server … well this is the last time you will see me… and she said cuz of masks huh? and i said that and that other reason…

since that day I have gone out nowhere I don’t care anymore. but my bank is building by 800 a month in just by not shopping period and not spending 500 min in the pub … we will be watching a huge shutting down coming to many places soon…

lights out

#265 VladTor on 10.07.21 at 10:47 pm

Garth, in addition to the idea of dividing workers into 2 clusters. I was thinking about how this could be organized. You are assigned the main role!

You should find an accomplice who is current a member of parliament from the Conservative Party. He will throw the idea about separating employees between vax and NOT vax in different areas to the parliamentary masses and will prepare the corresponding law/bill together with you – bill # “XYZ-Garth”.
Than he will organize a hearing on the matter and invite you as an independent rapporteur (in other countries this is possible, probably in Canada too). You, in turn, will invite three people from different strata of the people to your report as co-speakers.

From high society it will be, I’d say, a professor who was recently kicked out of the university. University would like to kick him out long time ago, but doesn’t had a reason. Someone from Ryerson who signed the renaming petition would be a good fit.

The second number will be the middle class. Desirable fired nurses with long experience, single and with three children.

And finally, somebody the from low income class. Can be recently dismissed labor worker, preferably with a work injury – say, without an eye or without fingers on his arms, or even in a wheelchair.

I think all these people among the millions of unvaccinated can be easily found.

You speaking first and give figures and diagrams of financial losses from the dismissal of unvaccinated and highly experienced workers. You also talk about image losses as a result of lost lawsuits, etc.
Garth, It’s stupid for me to teach you, a member of parliament of several convocations, what to do. You will be on top. The basic idea is that all these people are NOT against the vaccine. This is MAIN point – they are NOT AGAINST- just afraid!!!! They are just afraid and they need to be given time to prepare – well, let’s say, before the next election.

After you, the professor speech – this one will say everything by himself – bla-bla-bla actually his profession.

The nurse and the laborer must be trained.
A nurse should bring a large photo of her children (the size of a newspaper), say that she has no pay for housing and no money for food for the children, and at the end of her speech (prepared by you!) she start crying bitterly.

The low income worker will read his the speech (and, of course, with errors) everything that you write to him, and at the end will add that after being fired, his not sleep well and smoke all the time. And then he will take out and start smoking cigarette with marijuana.

After all of them, you again speak with a final (closing) speech.

A curtain! Applause! It’s all on the evening news and in detail in all tomorrow’s papers!

Bill passing parliament with majority!

The Conservatives get the votes of all millions unvaccinated and win the next election. You will take part in next election and win as MP .

#266 Keen Reader on 10.07.21 at 10:51 pm

@247 T-Rev: not a bad idea, offering a lower-standard of care to those who forego the jab. In line with that, we should allow alternative treatments successfully used by the FLCC staff and in various other countries. For many’s low risk level, it’d likely be a worthwhile compromise. Also agree on vax mandates; healthy debates are much better than division & coercion. Thanks!

#267 Bagley on 10.07.21 at 10:59 pm

That dog is beautiful. My basset made to almost 16. A truly kind and gentle soul. Enjoy this time with Randall.

#268 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 10:59 pm

#247 T-Rev on 10.07.21 at 10:11 pm
To paraprase:
“Vaccine passports are bad, but creating unstaffed hospitals for them to die in is good?”
*************************
Is that really your position, or did I miss something in the above summary?
Telling people they can’t go into a building without vaccination is one thing, but your suggestion is kinda…murdery.

If I missed some sarcasm, sorry, but when it comes to covid there are so many insane positions that it’s really hard to tell.

#269 SoggyShorts on 10.07.21 at 11:04 pm

#219 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 8:28 pm
You are now sounding certifiable. Just shut up and go get the shot. We’re busy here. – Garth
#222 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 8:46 pm
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#223 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 8:50 pm
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#224 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 8:50 pm
You are done here. – Garth
#233 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 9:30 pm
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#241 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 9:45 pm
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#250 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 10:14 pm
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#253 Woke up this morning… on 10.07.21 at 10:22 pm
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Facebook is up and running again, time for you to go back.

#270 Shawn Allen on 10.07.21 at 11:06 pm

When President Reagan Fired the Air Traffic Controllers for refusing his back to work order

#235 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.07.21 at 9:36 pm
@#224 BillyBob

“Me, I’d love to see them all fired. Might find life in the private sector a little different than they’re used to. Reality can be cruel but it’s an effective teacher.”

+++

I remember when Ronald Regan fired all the air traffic controllers when they refused “back to work” orders.
“Airmageddon” didn’t materialize and thousands of unemployed air traffic controllers were left twisting in the wind….

It surprised a lot of govt workers…..

**************************************
Mr. CrowdedElevatorFartz. Oh, I remember that very well. The U.S. Air Traffic Controllers were on strike which of course caused havoc. Pretty soon President Reagan said: the strike is over, go back to work or you are fired.

Some figured that maybe when the President of the U.S. and your ultimate boss gives you an order you ought to obey. But quite a lot banded together and thought “he can’t fire is all” they need us. Whoops! He fired them and brought in the military and I guess management and overtime. I saw where some of those guys were still trying get back as Air Traffic Controllers 20 years later.

You gotta know when to hold ’em and when to fold ’em.

It’s time for anti-vaxers who value their jobs and or who value being seen as rational and upstanding members of society to “fold ’em”

#271 Dragonfly 58 on 10.07.21 at 11:09 pm

Raleigh International { early 1970’s } for longer rides, A.S. Gillott , mid 1960’s { London England area builder } for quick , spirited rides.
Sounds like you have a very nice group 753!

#272 canuck on 10.07.21 at 11:15 pm

258 Reynolds753 on 10.07.21 at 10:32 pm

#247 canuck

You have absolutely no idea about Covid transmission and associated risk. You have absolutely no idea of what I have accomplished in my field. Keep your ill informed and stupid comments to yourself.

Thank you.
____________________________________________

Tell us, better yet provide some links to show that the vaccinated do not transmit the virus. I’ll wait but won’t hold my breath, for obvious reasons.

I don’t care what your accomplishments are because they are irrelevant to the point I made. My comments speak to your character, not your education. Your response confirms my initial comments. As a Doctor, your priorities suck.

#273 Rural Rick on 10.07.21 at 11:15 pm

The only reason we have civilization at all is because we stand on the shoulders of giants. Don’t piss them off.

#274 Trojan House on 10.07.21 at 11:20 pm

Judging by the comments tonight, this post is enabling hate speech. Perhaps a human rights complaint is in order.

#275 WSJ on 10.07.21 at 11:23 pm

https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-coronavirus-breakthrough-vaccine-natural-immunity-cdc-fauci-biden-failure-11631548306

Behind paywall:

The U.S. spends lavishly on healthcare yet can’t answer basic questions about Covid-19. Some of the best research has come from Israel. American public health agencies should be producing data on breakthrough infections, boosters and natural immunity. But the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has failed to provide the information needed to inform a sound Covid strategy.

Israel began its vaccine rollout with Pfizer in December, only days after the U.S. But Israel kept good data, reported them out frequently and quickly, and used them to track subsequent Covid infections. When the White House announced its plan to recommend a booster shot for all Americans, it cited Israeli data. The World Health Organization and others criticized the plan, calling the evidence insufficient, and in what seemed like a coordinated protest, two top scientists at the Food and Drug Administration abruptly resigned.

The Biden administration recently got the supporting data it needed to justify its booster plan. But not from the CDC. Another Israeli study showed that a booster resulted in a 10-fold reduction in severe Covid illness in people over 60. The results were published mere weeks after the study’s completion, not months later as often happens in the U.S.

“There’s no doubt,” Anthony Fauci said of the findings in a press briefing, “from the dramatic data from the Israeli study that the boosts that are being now done there and contemplated here support very strongly the rationale for such an approach.” The FDA, trying to evaluate the question of boosters, scrambled to obtain the raw data from Israel.

WSJ Newsletter
Notes on the News
The news of the week in context, with Tyler Blint-Welsh.
The bigger question is: Why didn’t the CDC produce the research? The agency has 21,000 employees and a $15 billion annual budget. It has data on more than 40 million Americans who have tested positive for Covid and 200 million who have been vaccinated. The data include the vaccine type, dosing schedule and vaccination date. Calculating the rate of U.S. breakthrough infections and subsequent hospitalizations and deaths isn’t the Manhattan Project. It’s Epidemiology 101.

The CDC’s failure to report meaningful data has left policy makers flying blind. In the absence of good data to answer the basic questions Americans have been asking, political opinions have filled the vacuum. Strong data might have prevented much of the polarization over Covid.

Sound data from the CDC has been especially lacking on natural immunity from prior Covid infection. On Aug. 25, Israel published the most powerful and scientifically rigorous study on the subject to date. In a sample of more than 700,000 people, natural immunity was 27 times more effective than vaccinated immunity in preventing symptomatic infections.

Despite this evidence, U.S. public health officials continue to dismiss natural immunity, insisting that those who have recovered from Covid must still get the vaccine. Policy makers and public health leaders, and the media voices that parrot them, are inexplicably sticking to their original hypothesis that natural immunity is fleeting, even as at least 15 studies show it lasts.

Meanwhile, employers fire workers with natural immunity who won’t get vaccinated. Schools disenroll students who won’t comply.

The CDC did put out a study on natural immunity last month, forcefully concluding that vaccinated immunity was 2.3 times better than natural immunity. The CDC used these results to justify telling those with natural immunity to get vaccinated.

But the rate of infection in each group was less than 0.01%, meaning infections were exceedingly rare in the short two-month time period the agency chose to study. This is odd, given there are more than a year of data available. Moreover, despite having data on all 50 states, the CDC only reported data from Kentucky. Was Kentucky the only state that produced the desired result? Why else exclude the same data from the other 49 states?

Some public health officials are afraid to acknowledge natural immunity because they fear some will choose infection over vaccination. But leaders can encourage all Americans who aren’t immune to get vaccinated and be transparent with the data at the same time.

The CDC shouldn’t fish for data to support outdated hypotheses. Heeding the robust Israeli data on natural immunity could help restore the agency’s credibility and even help vaccination efforts.

Israel also contributed a brilliant study on vaccinating children. Researchers found that one dose of the Pfizer vaccine, instead of the normal two, was 100% effective in children ages 12 to 15. Such a finding could have significant implications for achieving broad immunity in adolescents while reducing the risk of heart complications, which have been clustered around the second dose.

These are the studies U.S. public health agencies should be doing but aren’t. By any metric, the CDC has failed in its primary task of preparing the country for a pandemic and telling us how to reduce harm from the novel Covid pathogen.

Dr. Makary is a professor at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, and the author of “The Price We Pay: What Broke American Health Care—And How To Fix It.”

#276 KLNR on 10.07.21 at 11:28 pm

So those who get canned for not doing their part and getting vaxed aren’t eligible for UI. No severance either.

#277 Barb on 10.07.21 at 11:31 pm

Andy said “…you no longer get zero sympathy .”

————————————–
Double negative, sweetie.
That means you get LOTS of sympathy from him, Garth!

#278 The West on 10.07.21 at 11:36 pm

Ya – the clamor for “authoritarian measures in the name of national security” is an age old play. Do, pray tell, alert me when the regime that now runs Canada (into the ground)
is going to walk back these measures….or will it be now, and forever, for the greater good?

#279 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 11:59 pm

#252 Faron on 10.07.21 at 10:17 pm
#237 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 9:37 pm
#169 Faron on 10.07.21 at 6:20 pm
#154 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 5:44 pm

This is tangential to your point w/re vax cases, so I won’t keep you long although I think you are wrong there too.

Have you read the judgement you linked? Mann was the plaintiff alleging defamation by a guy writing that Mann should be jailed. The science was never on trial. Case was dismissed because Dr. Mann ignored it for a decade because he has way bigger fish to fry.

——————————————————–

You’re dreaming…

I used the Mann case to point out that when it gets to Court the science matters, in intricate detail, not political generalizations.

I didn’t just read the judgement I followed the case.

Think about what you just wrote. Mann was the PLAINTIFF, he sued another scientist who called him out on his fraudulent hockey stick graph. If he had better things to do then why did he sue?

Mann dragged it out, wouldn’t provide the proof that the defendant scientist demanded to see, so the Judge eventually tossed the case and ruled Mann had to pay costs, which he then refused to do.

Penn State is as woke as many other big schools. Reasonable Electrical Engineering School, I’ve met some grads over the years, but EE isn’t about opinion, it’s a “hard science”.

Same will happen with vaxx cases.

The Government(s) all over are making the case that natural immunity for people who have had and recovered from Covid, provable by anti-body tests, is not acceptable from a safety perspective like the vax is.

They will need hard proof of this in a court of law, where there is a lot of money at stake and some big time scientists will be arguing the opposite.

With Mann and the hockey stick it never got to that point because he wouldn’t submit any science work (he could have just hit the send button on his “research”)

The plaintiffs in the vax cases will be the people who got fired, claiming wrongful dismissal based on faulty science. They will be submitting hard scientific research on natural immunity… and then the fun starts.

#280 Dirty Dan on 10.08.21 at 12:11 am

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#281 Transient Pastor on 10.08.21 at 12:15 am

#24 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 1:56 pm
#13 DonM

94.1M doses administered.

Oh what the heck, here let me do it for you:

1,717 deaths attributed to the vax or 0.00182465%.

…. And the chance of an under 50 year old dying of Covid in the same period? 0.002%

combine that with natural antibodies and the Vax becomes the bigger risk.

If you are 65+ it is well worth the odds, and I agree the vax is worth the risk.

Scarier than the virus is the censoring of the media and professionals. If you have not noticed this you have not strayed away from the mainstream.

Ontario doctors were threatened not to say anything against the narrative, thousands of doctors trying to speak out are removed from Google searches and youtube. Youtube demonetizes anyone that speaks against it. Its a scary world out there when 90% of the media is owned by the same people

#282 J'imagine on 10.08.21 at 12:47 am

If this point hasn’t gotten thru clearly yet to the general populace – MRNA technology is like injecting a computer code into,your body…it is NOT like a normal vaccine, like flu, or polio.

The code (M stands for messenger) tells your cells (hopefully) to manufacture spike proteins.

Is it unreasonable to be skeptical? Most ‘anti-vaxxers’ would not object to a regular type shot (like the Russians have, which, curiously has been banned by the USA).

I have taken the flu shot among others and I would not object to taking a normal vaccine.

I think this point is just not getting thru with all the ‘step up’ and ‘do the right thing’ talk.

Do you want your 12 year old or 5 year old to have computer codes injected into their body in order to go to school or go,on play dates?

#283 For Andy on 10.08.21 at 12:47 am

Should’ve proof read before hitting SEND. The ‘zero’ was to be removed, obviously.

Thanks for mis-quoting me though, Garth – a further (subconscious?) attempt to vilify those of us who prefer to not participate in this mass experiment. You changed my ‘say’ to ‘spit’ (these things to your face).
Oh, BTW…this post is ‘from’, not ‘for’…Andy

#284 DON on 10.08.21 at 1:16 am

#80 Flop… on 10.07.21 at 3:23 pm

The unvaxxed workers could be put on leave without pay. The big corps are biting at the bit to do the same.

The vax not lasting as long as expected may need to be considered as this all unfolds over the next few months.

#285 Dr V on 10.08.21 at 1:24 am

251 Reynolds 753

I’m at 3 carbon 2 aluminum right now. Last steel bike I gave to a casual riding buddy who loved to restore bikes. it was a Rossin but i cant recall a tubing decal.
Considered ti at one time and tested a buddies bike. Tested the first gen cannondale carbon synapse and the feel was almost identical. Cracked the synapse in a crash (cracked myself too) and got a replacement frame that felt a bit more like the “park bench” trek I had previously.

would definitely consider steel again but yes it’s a boutique thing now.

Ride long and prosper.

PS – not really a doctor.

#286 Coastal gal on 10.08.21 at 1:26 am

#247 T rev #128 dragon fly #137 pontius
#61
Making kids have double dose of vaccine to fly, play hockey, etc is wrong.

Someone please help me understand why a 12 year old that has had one shot of the adult dose of pfizer is not considered fully vaccinated when an 11 year old would get a much smaller dose (1/3 the dose)?

From pfizer website: https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-positive-topline-results ” children 5 to 11 years of age using a two-dose regimen of 10 µg administered 21 days apart, a smaller dose than the 30 µg dose used for people 12 and older. The antibody responses in the participants given 10 µg doses were comparable to those recorded in a previous Pfizer-BioNTech study in people 16 to 25 years of age immunized with 30 µg doses.”

Intresting that Britian is only authorizing one shot of pfizer covid vaccine for healthy children age 12-15. https://www.bbc.com/news/health-58547659

This is recent change when UK medical advisors did not recommend vaccine for that age group based on risk reward and potential cardio inflammation side effects. https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-advisers-decide-against-covid-vaccines-healthy-12-15-year-olds-2021-09-03/

I have a 12 year old who has had one shot of pfizer and not getting 2nd dose. I am fully vaccinated, but new rules means no travel for our family, movies or other activities. Sad….

#287 Midnight's on 10.08.21 at 1:43 am

Hello people wake up…
About a Flu/cold shot. Lmao.
https://www.theblaze.com/news/unvaccinated-nba-players-canada-quarantine-rules-criminal-charges

An analogy…
You go away a body is found in your home, with one of your steak knives in it. You say, I wasn’t even home and across the country. They say, your house your knife, guilty. That’s COVID watch or read
Fahrenheit 451. They have changed the names but the story is the same. And for all the TV watchers/read the stories that aren’t printed or televised because there are lots of Dr.’s they don’t believe in this Agenda.
One hundred thousand years plus humans have walked the planet World War, Mustard gas, Agent Orange etc etc and now another virus/bug and people say end of times. For anyone not native to Canada.They have dealt with bigger challenges. Crack your history books or read on other culteres.

#288 Chris Gallant on 10.08.21 at 1:44 am

My guess is you don’t realize the healthcare system does not consider a person fully vaxxed until TWO WEEKS AFTER the second dose. Think about that for a minute.

Charles
————–
I’m not sure what that has to do with anything I wrote?? Bizarre comment,but okay.

#289 @Doug in rural London on 10.08.21 at 1:53 am

Good, at long, long, long, long, long last more people in government and business have seen the light and got the balls to do what is morally and ethically right. Jesus would approve. At long last work places will be given a good strong laxative to purge out the idiots. It can’t come soon enough. I’m looking forward to flying and riding Via Rail again with smart vaccinated fellow passengers.

Garth, why do let certifiable mor_ons pollute this blog?

This creature is an insult to human race

#290 Chris Gallant on 10.08.21 at 1:59 am

Smalltown Steve……
Perhaps those that are willfully unvaccinated that are subsequently hospitalized with covid should be forced to pay for the full costs of their hospital stay as well.

I would say not only that, but they should be forced to seek their medical aid from the same twitter expert/facebook doctor that told them not to take the vaccine

#291 Chris Gallant on 10.08.21 at 2:14 am

Is anybody Home?

Found on the NIH website as of July 8/2021. Indeed Ivermectin is an approved treatment for Covid 19. Note the side effects of Remdisivir (renal failure). Remdisivir is part of the Canadian treatment protocol. Our health care system says Ivermectin is not an approved treatment for Covid 19!

https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/tables/table-2e/

————

More like can anybody read? Its specifically states “approved or under evaluation”… the irony is delicious… I wont take a vaccine cause I might have temporary adverse side effects and not enough is known about it, but I’ll take Ivermectin that will have adverse side effects and has no conclusive info on the efficacy.

#292 Figmund Sreud on 10.08.21 at 3:29 am

Well, … Mr. Turner, after reading your screed, The traitor, October 7th, 2021, I thought, I should – just perhaps – point you towards the website of The Association of American Physicians and Surgeons?

This one:

https://aapsonline.org/

… since this association just held its 78th Annual Meeting to “collaborate on efforts to fight for patients and doctors who are increasingly facing threats like denial of treatment and mandated COVID-19 vaccination”, … but I decided, instead, not to!

I figure such act on my part would be, simply too brazen.

Best regards,

F.S. – Calgary, Alberta.

#293 bruce on 10.08.21 at 6:37 am

Keep at it Garth. Enough is enough is enough with anti-vaxers. We have to move forward as a society. Have a brother who won’t get vaccinated . He is an idiot and we simply don’t include him in family events. Sad but safer for us.

#294 Sail Away on 10.08.21 at 6:43 am

#290 Figmund Sreud on 10.08.21 at 3:29 am

Well, … Mr. Turner, after reading your screed, The traitor, October 7th, 2021, I thought, I should – just perhaps – point you towards the website of The Association of American Physicians and Surgeons?

This one:

https://aapsonline.org/

———-

Wow, what a pack of Looneytunes on that site. Easy rule of thumb: radicals are always wrong and almost certainly crazy.

#295 Evil Shepard Bongo Bongo on 10.08.21 at 6:44 am

The Climate Religion is one of flaming pink hair and uneducated self- immolation. Hate for hates sake.

As Dr Peterson writes ” the brain loves adventure”. He means that crazy ideas become lodged in people’s minds when nothing exists to fill a void.

When Industrial Taxation was still Sustainable Development, climate wasn’t mentioned. It was only when climate was seen as a vehicle to justify taxation on industry was the idea of sustainable development being funded by ” global cooling”. The political fanatics never dreamed so many people would rush out of their homes and cry…” The sky is falling”.

Why did that happen? Because as Peterson says, the brain needs panic to exist in order for our survival instinct to remain on high alert. What better than the apocalypse in 9 years as Al Gore announced 20 years ago.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-blackouts-higher-bills-from-ontario-ending-natural-gas-by-2030-report/

#296 Keen Reader on 10.08.21 at 7:13 am

@290 Figmund Sreud:

Wow, the AAPS website is a gold mine! These COVID articles should be front-page news. Will be useful when arguing with extremists on either side of the issue, thanks!

#297 Howie on 10.08.21 at 7:37 am

By 2025, everyone will have to get 25 vaccine shots.They call it the 2525 plan. Don’t be surprised they do this. You give them an inch they take a mile.

#298 LOLoldpeople on 10.08.21 at 7:50 am

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#299 Another Deckchair on 10.08.21 at 8:01 am

Garth;

There are always those that give and those that take.

The small group of Anti-vaxers are stealing time from the majority of us who are vaccinated.

Usually, I take a live and let live approach, getting more militant against the anti-vaxers.

Fire them; lock them down and not be able to move, and let the majority of who are socially responsible get back to normal life.

#300 Jay (Not that one) on 10.08.21 at 8:23 am

You’re wrong.

My grandfather died disillusioned with the freedoms he saw deteriorate after taking bullets and watching friends die to protect our freedom in the Italian theatre of World War 2. I think he’d be sick seeing what we’re allowing right now. Don’t think that I’ve forgotten about that little Bill C-10, either.

Don’t misunderstand: I’m fully vaxxed and got vaxxed the moment it was available, so it isn’t like I’m some anti-vaxxer. You can be for the use of vaccines and for protecting people’s basic human rights at the same time.

That said, although I vigorously disagree with you on this point, I deeply respect you and am grateful for the wonderful advice you’ve provided for many years and I hope will continue to provide. Reasonable people should be able to disagree and still respect one another.

#301 KLNR on 10.08.21 at 8:28 am

@#296 Howie on 10.08.21 at 7:37 am
By 2025, everyone will have to get 25 vaccine shots.They call it the 2525 plan. Don’t be surprised they do this. You give them an inch they take a mile.

classic slippery slope fallacy lol

#302 KLNR on 10.08.21 at 8:38 am

@#281 Transient Pastor on 10.08.21 at 12:15 am
#24 Dolce Vita on 10.07.21 at 1:56 pm
#13 DonM

94.1M doses administered.

Oh what the heck, here let me do it for you:

1,717 deaths attributed to the vax or 0.00182465%.

…. And the chance of an under 50 year old dying of Covid in the same period? 0.002%

combine that with natural antibodies and the Vax becomes the bigger risk.

If you are 65+ it is well worth the odds, and I agree the vax is worth the risk.

Scarier than the virus is the censoring of the media and professionals. If you have not noticed this you have not strayed away from the mainstream.

Ontario doctors were threatened not to say anything against the narrative, thousands of doctors trying to speak out are removed from Google searches and youtube. Youtube demonetizes anyone that speaks against it. Its a scary world out there when 90% of the media is owned by the same people

surprised you’re allowing these twits to spread their misinformation on here Garth. Everybody and anybody is a doctor these days eh.

#303 Jay (Not that one) on 10.08.21 at 8:48 am

@#300 The slippery slope fallacy isn’t a logical fallacy. When we call it “Shifting the Overton Window” it’s an accepted fact of political science and a tactic used by politicians of many stripe.

If you told me a year ago that we’d be living in a “Papers, Please” society today then I would have accused you of a slippery slope argument, but here we are. Until I see a reason to believe they won’t keep taking forever, it’s fully reasonable to think they’ll keep taking forever.

#304 Israel! on 10.08.21 at 8:50 am

#275 WSJ

On Aug. 25, Israel published the most powerful and scientifically rigorous study on the subject to date. In a sample of more than 700,000 people, natural immunity was 27 times more effective than vaccinated immunity in preventing symptomatic infections.

*********

What in the actual fudgsicle?

#305 Neo on 10.08.21 at 8:50 am

#60 T on 10.07.21 at 2:53 pm

“Keep unvaccinated away from large gatherings so they aren’t infected en mass and become carriers and spreaders and fill up ICUs. That’s it.”

*******************************************

And there is the silly little propaganda war in a nutshell. Meanwhile, 25-30% of the cases a day are fully vaccinated and as of yesterday 96 unvaxxed are in the hospital with Covid and 50 fully vaxxed are in the hospital with Covid. That ratio isn’t great and goes against the narrative but this has never been about public health or science but about compliance.

So 75 unvaxxed in ICU overwhelming the health care system so we need a vax passport? We peaked at 800 overall in ICU in April with 2,300 in the hospital and 30,000 active cases not 4,700. None of this is warranted.

50 cases out of 80% of the population and 96 cases out of the remaining 30%. Math is hard, isn’t it? – Garth

#306 Toronto on 10.08.21 at 8:54 am

Let me get his right?

If I don’t get vaccinated I can’t possibly spend any money on seeking the loser Toronto Teams keep breaking my heart?

No matter how much I’m tempted, I will be stopped?

I won’t have to live through the hope hope hope, maybe, maybe, maybe – DAGGER IN THE BACK?

2021-2022 Sports Season will help my investment budget skyrocket again!

Thanks vaccine for making it easy.

#307 WK on 10.08.21 at 8:55 am

Mandatory vaccine makes it easier for companies to get rid of stupid employees.

#308 Looking Up on 10.08.21 at 8:57 am

With billions of people worldwide having safely been vaccinated against COVID the anti vax arguments become more ridiculous every day. Whenever I encounter an anti vaxxer I politely ask what their reasons are for not taking the Covid vaccine. Here are my top 5 favorite answers.

1) My friend’s cousin’s brother-in law’s nephew works for Pfizer and he’s telling people not take the vaccine.

2) I overheard a guy at FoodBasics saying his sister had ringing in her ears after taking the vaccine.

3) I found this super secret government website that lists all the vaccine side effects that the government is trying to hide.

4) 2 weeks after taking the Covid vaccine my grandmother fell and broke her hip.

5) (my personal favorite) I’m not taking the vaccine because I want to stick it to the man.

I kid you not…..

#309 I see you on 10.08.21 at 9:07 am

DELETED

#310 the Jaguar on 10.08.21 at 9:09 am

Poor Andy. Hard to know whether the MoCA Cognitive Assessment Test or the Hare Psychopathy Test would be more appropriate to diagnose his ailment. At the end of the day the real reason will boil down to someone on a religious crusade.

While I am not religious, and I would never try to take someone else’s religion away from them. But there are the ‘garden variety’ ones and then there are the non tolerant, more extreme ones. Religion has gone ‘Big Box’. Supersized. Just look at the size of some of the churches.

We have a significant number of them in Alberta. If one looks at the current cases on the interactive map by active cases per 100,000 of the population you can see that for example in Cypress County the number is 543.77, Oyen area 259.59, Grand Prairie 224.54, Frog Lake 221.73. Of course Banff blows the lid off at 700.41, but that’s due to very dense households of Australian ski bums. ( sorry Flop). It’s the big city hospitals that get plugged up from the overflow when the fecal matter hits the oscalating rotator.

Fortunately, ICU cases have dropped and I see the situation stabilizing. Time and life marches on.

While I don’t lump these anti-vax types in with a ‘Jim Jones-Jonestown, November 18, 1978’ type of aftermath, I would say the following: At some point there will be a post mortem on this whole debacle. It will conclude that those who stepped forward and did their part by getting vaccinated helped to save the world. And that sickness,death, diagnostic tests not performed, surgeries not performed, were the result of and delayed in large part by the militant un-vaxxed.

Maybe God is trying to tell you something?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Z8WRdGIZoU

#311 Neo on 10.08.21 at 9:12 am

50 cases out of 80% of the population and 96 cases out of the remaining 30%. Math is hard, isn’t it? – Garth

So what, they are BOTH still incredibly small numbers regardless because we are dealing with millions of people on both ledgers. The narrative that the remaining unvaccinated are going to overrun ICU’s and solely be responsible for outbreaks has been proven patently false even though that was and continues to be the narrative. Notice Trudeau isn’t even mentioning herd immunity at this point so what is the end goal here? What is an endemic baseline Garth? The numbers right now are endemic however you slice it.

#312 Leave nature alone on 10.08.21 at 9:13 am

No, it is not a slippery slope but we are all falling in the ditch and nobody will rescue or help you out of the ditch. Nature always wins and science will never win. The virus will go away on it’s own and many will not make it but that is life.

Unless, these viruses, diseases are being manufactured by them and it will never end. Hence, the word endgame or game over no matter what you do or what they say you have to do to go forward but not back to normal. There will never be the normal anymore. Remember just 2 weeks to flatten the curve, yeah right.

#313 Chris L. on 10.08.21 at 9:16 am

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#314 I see you on 10.08.21 at 9:26 am

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#315 Dharma Bum on 10.08.21 at 9:29 am

#50 Polecat

If they whipped up the vax quick why haven’t they cured cancer after decades and multi billions of dollars?
—————————————————————————————-

Are you serious? Or, was that a rhetorical question?

There is zero interest within the medical community or pharmaceutical industry for “curing” cancer. There’s way too much money in simply “treating” it. If the cure was revealed, trillions of dollars would be lost in pharmaceutical profits and physician billings. Hospital revenues would shrink. Nursing and support staff jobs would be lost.

Cancer is huge business. And business is good.

#316 the Jaguar on 10.08.21 at 9:31 am

This Snippet from the NP is for Dorothy:

“Meanwhile, print book sales are on the rise, fuelled by readers craving diversions during the pandemic and the rise of #Booktok, a popular channel on Tiktok for book recommendations. Between January and August, more than 500 million print books were sold in the U.S., 50 million more than a year ago, according to industry analyst NPD Books.

“Everybody was convinced the physical book was dead,” Raiton said. “But the physical book is the best it’s been since the Gutenberg Bible.”

#317 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 9:31 am

#309 the Jaguar on 10.08.21 at 9:09 am

“I would say the following: At some point there will be a post mortem on this whole debacle. It will conclude that those who stepped forward and did their part by getting vaccinated helped to save the world. And that sickness,death, diagnostic tests not performed, surgeries not performed, were the result of and delayed in large part by the militant un-vaxxed.”

I would say the following, that at some point the post mortem will find that the politicians, health care professionals and doctors set in motion the greatest public health calamity in history and needlessly killed thousands of people with their draconian policies that closed off hospitals to sick people resulting in delayed or never diagnosed ailments, with doctors to afraid to see people in person exacerbating a decline in health for many people and failing to recognize and address the declining mental health of people of all ages that will result in years of other health problems. That their policies closed down small business and threw hundreds of thousands of people unable to provide for themselves.

I think there will be a reckoning but it won’t be the one you said.

#318 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.08.21 at 9:33 am

Hmmm
Did a US submarine ruin into “something” in the South China Sea yesterday?

Initial reports
11 crew injured and no leaks.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/oct/08/us-navy-nuclear-submarine-strikes-submerged-object-in-south-china-sea-uss-connecticut

Getting crowded over there.
Above and below the water.

All as US Troops “secretly” train Taiwan’s army to prepare for an invasion.

https://www.reuters.com/world/china/us-troops-rotating-into-taiwan-training-sources-2021-10-07/

All it will take is an “accident” or a Tonkin incident and we’re at war!

And as the Millenials take great pleasure in pointing out…

I’m too old to do anything right so I guess I get to sit this one out…

#319 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 9:34 am

That should say “threw hundreds of thousands of people out of work…”

Not to mention that they killed off the elderly in long term care homes by not providing proper quarantining of those most at risk, also not to mention, frightening long term care home workers so much that they just didn’t show up to work.

#320 total crap on 10.08.21 at 9:35 am

I’m sure that probably 80% of the people that got double vaccinated are the same irresponsible Canadians that have all the mortgage, car loan, credit card, line of credit, HELOC and other trillions in consumer debt. They are debt junkies and real estate junkies. Look what mess they participated in. Yes, nobody forced you to go into deep debt.

Why are they not responsible when it comes to money and finances which can easily ruin our country and will eventually if something soon does not give. I would not be surprised 80% of them are also Liberals, progressives, s, marxists, ocialists, communists as well. When it comes to money, finances, let the other sucker pay for it.

This is of course they want things to continue the way the world in deep debt and let the suckers pay for it. The Governments, financial system and others dependent on the welfare, bailout state needs a host to live off. This is what this is really all about. Make an insult about me who cares, this is what liberals and people who don’t like the truth do, name calling. I would not be surprised if you don’t let my comments go through.

#321 Dharma Bum on 10.08.21 at 9:40 am

I’ve received 2 doses, and am scheduled for the booster pretty soon. So, I’m with the program, for reasons of pragmatism and convenience if nothing else.

The lockdowns and restrictions were worse than the virus itself, so I am for whatever it takes to keep society and the economy humming along. And restaurants.

However, I had a deep thought…….

In this enlightened age of social justice and wokeism, in which the inmates are running the asylum, I’m very surprised that the argument has not been put forth that it simply good enough if one IDENTIFIES as a vaccinated person.

I mean, it works for everything and everyone else? Gender. Race. Creed. Age. Sexual orientaion. Nationality.

Why not Vaccination Status?

The SJWs and woke freaks must be asleep at the wheel.

#322 Do we have all the facts on 10.08.21 at 9:56 am

There seems to be two distinct ways any viral infection can approached.

The first approach is therapeutic where the initial symptoms of a viral infection are treated or mitigated through the use of medicine or isolation. Therapeutic medicines and isolation slow the advance of viral infections allowing the human immune system to combat the virus.

Long before February 2020 health authorities around the world understood that the the ability of human immune systems to combat viral infections declines with age and compromising health issues. With this in mind one might have expected Canadian health authorities to have closely monitored the day to day health of all citizens with compromised immune systems.

The second approach focuses on the prevention of serious infection through the use of vaccines that improve the ability of our immune system to immediately recognize and combat a new viral threat. Vaccines slow the spread of viral infections by creating an ‘early warning’ for our immune system.

What I find curious is how slow health authorities across Canada were to consider immediate therapeutic treatments for citizens with compromised immune systems. The fact that over 60% of all deaths attributed to the Covid 19 virus in Canada involved residents living in one of the 265.000 beds in a long term care facility points to the need to improve our therapeutic approaches to future viral infections.

The recent focus on vaccines as the only solution for elimination of Covid 19 virus has completely overshadowed research related to the development of medicines that can slow the spread of a new virus if treatment begins at the first sign of infection.

I am 74 with several compromising health issues and I am still waiting to hear if any medicines exist or are being developed to assist our natural immune systems at the first sign of infection. Vaccines help our immune systems recognize a virus but I would feel more confident if more attention was being paid to finding medicines that could help compromised immune systems combat a virus.

Just one vulnerable mans opinion!

#323 Beat it! on 10.08.21 at 10:06 am

#21 I hope their right on 10.07.21 at 1:47 pm

Long term affects, anyone? I guess nobody wants to believe they don’t……. Michael Jackson song.

_________________________________________

Beat it……. Michael Jackson song.

#324 Andrey V on 10.08.21 at 10:17 am

Human rights suddenly canceled

#325 Mississauga Mel on 10.08.21 at 10:37 am

#305 Toronto

I have turned away from the Buds sans Covid in the picture. Last year was the final straw. Gave up on them for a quarter century and only started watching again when Matthews showed up on the scene. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, thrice, four times…

#326 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:38 am

#321 Do we have all the facts

I am 74 with several compromising health issues and I am still waiting to hear if any medicines exist or are being developed to assist our natural immune systems at the first sign of infection.

Of course they exist, people were treated before Big Pharma. You family doctor is most likely not trained in this field.

So find a good vet, right? – Garth

#327 the jaguar on 10.08.21 at 10:38 am

@316 Trojan Horse

I see your focus is the’ Blame Game’. A freqent ‘go to’ tactic of the indecisive and fearful.
Or you can stand up on your two hind legs and walk forward with your head held high.

#328 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:40 am

#323 Andrey V on 10.08.21 at 10:17 am
Human rights suddenly canceled

Only if you consent. You have to stand your ground.

You have posted several dozen times on this thread. Enough. Go get a job (or a jab). – Garth

#329 Doug in London on 10.08.21 at 10:47 am

@Post #289:
This creature is a sensible and rational person, unlike you. The whole concept of sensible and rational is one you don’t understand, never did, and never will. Let’s hope that, if you’re one of the unvaccinated, you’re purged out as I so eloquently described. It’s YOU that’s an insult to the human race.

#330 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 10:47 am

#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.
____

A sad possibility yes. Real conservatism is a dying ideology in Canada.

On the flip side, it’s also great news for Boomer Cons though too. The Libbie Kiddies will vote for more affordable housing which will produce policies that drive housing prices through the roof – as we’ve all seen happen clearly enough since 2015, and just recently saw again. Guess who owns all those houses? :)

Then there are regular cons like myself who own RE free and clear, make ho-hum incomes, are double vax’d, never vote lefty – yet inhale the Trudeau handouts and asset bloat like a 20 HP shop-vac. If I do a total sell out and bail when I hang the gloves, I will be run over by millions of dollars. I’ll think back and thank Trudeau for it, then I’ll be part of the change and head for southern Europe for retirement.

#331 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 10:49 am

#326 the jaguar on 10.08.21 at 10:38 am

Me focused on the ‘blame game???’ It seems you posted your comment first blaming all the unvaccinated people for your problems.

#332 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:55 am

DELETED

#333 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:56 am

DELETED

#334 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:58 am

DELETED

#335 carrot on 10.08.21 at 10:59 am

“The jab is good for the economy and prosperity. Tonic for the markets. Essential for the health care sector. It makes all of us safer. It takes courage, selflessness and faith. We save a bunch of families from burying their loved ones, too.”

Yeah, except that there is no reasonable measure in any of this. What is the vax rate sufficient for covid to get under control? A “garther” will say “all” and that will be just that. Anyone with brains will have enough arguments already to consider the current 80%+ more than enough. The very idea less than 20% unvaccinated causes a pandemic of the same proportions as previous waves (see Alberta case), it is working for the vax cult, but who really buys that?

This blog is far from being anything of common sense or smart, it embraces a one size fits all solution with very little room for any down to earth rationale or analysis. And hey, there was no official statement of ever returning to “old normal”. That’s just a carrot for all fantasizing their two shots get them anywhere else than to the third, and so on.

Kids as young as five will be required to get the mRNA shots.

#336 morris gawalko on 10.08.21 at 11:02 am

so we are in ww3!

“War what is it good for , ABSOLUTELY nothing, good only for the undertaker”

When you have money you have the power !

#337 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.08.21 at 11:04 am

#275 WSJ
Dr. Makary is a professor at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, and the author of “The Price We Pay: What Broke American Health Care—And How To Fix It.”
———————-
Easy
What broke it : Arrogance
How to fix it: eat some humble pie.

#338 Don Guillermo on 10.08.21 at 11:11 am

#329 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 10:47 am
#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.
____

A sad possibility yes. Real conservatism is a dying ideology in Canada.

On the flip side, it’s also great news for Boomer Cons though too. The Libbie Kiddies will vote for more affordable housing which will produce policies that drive housing prices through the roof – as we’ve all seen happen clearly enough since 2015, and just recently saw again. Guess who owns all those houses? :)

Then there are regular cons like myself who own RE free and clear, make ho-hum incomes, are double vax’d, never vote lefty – yet inhale the Trudeau handouts and asset bloat like a 20 HP shop-vac. If I do a total sell out and bail when I hang the gloves, I will be run over by millions of dollars. I’ll think back and thank Trudeau for it, then I’ll be part of the change and head for southern Europe for retirement.
*************************************

The few anti vax people I know are the healing crystal, energy in the room holistic types. All center right conservatives I know are double or triple vaxed.

#339 Sail Away on 10.08.21 at 11:15 am

#325 facts on 10.08.21 at 10:38 am
#321 Do we have all the facts

I am 74 with several compromising health issues and I am still waiting to hear if any medicines exist or are being developed to assist our natural immune systems at the first sign of infection.

——-

Of course they exist, people were treated before Big Pharma. You family doctor is most likely not trained in this field.

——-

Jab, schmab. Just go for a simple ayahuasca healing ceremony:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_x5p63TNOMc

#340 Dragonfly 58 on 10.08.21 at 11:20 am

IHCTD9, I am with you on the cash in and head for somewhere where rationality is still attached to RE prices.
The U.K. { Rural, Wales or perhaps Scotland } would be my obvious choice, however as a retired person I am not eligible for immigration. Lots of U.K. ancestors but all the Grandparents were born here in Canada. What English speaking Country is still affordable to Canadian retirees ?
0 interest in Mexico or anywhere much hotter than coastal British Columbia. I used to think here was a great place, but then the bubble hit. Retirees out here are financially doomed unless the nest egg is very large indeed. Still yearning for a couple of acres to call my own. Here in Langley it would take a major lottery win.

#341 ImGonnaBeSick on 10.08.21 at 11:20 am

#329 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 10:47 am

I’ve said it before, but when IHCTD9 gets roasting both the left and right at the same time, it’s absolutely hilarious. You are a master of the trade good sir!

#342 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.08.21 at 11:20 am

#334 Carrot
Carrot it’s time to meet the stick.

#343 facts on 10.08.21 at 11:22 am

DELETED

#344 Dr V on 10.08.21 at 11:25 am

Garth – I implore you. No more posts on this topic.

Pretty please.

I’d rather have the Faron battle royal.

PS – not a real doctor.

#345 the Jaguar on 10.08.21 at 11:31 am

#330 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 10:49 am
#326 the jaguar on 10.08.21 at 10:38 am

Me focused on the ‘blame game???’ It seems you posted your comment first blaming all the unvaccinated people for your problem++++++

Where did I post I had a problem? I have none because I can get on a plane, train, etc. Visit restaurants, go on vacation, etc. I am double vaccinated. I only point out what everybody knows. It’s currently a crisis of the unvaccinated. They are the ones in the ICU’s crashing the health care system. We don’t need to wait for the post analysis on that issue, it is right in front of us.

These are your words, not mine “…will find that the politicians, health care professionals and doctors set in motion the greatest public health calamity in history and needlessly killed thousands of people “.

Now buzz off.

#346 Quintilian on 10.08.21 at 11:33 am

#337 Don Guillermo
“The few anti vax people I know are the healing crystal, energy in the room holistic types. All center right conservatives I know are double or triple vaxed.”

My observation is quite different from yours. The anti vax types that show up protesting do not look like peace loving, docile, My Lord Kumbaya types.

They look like angry right wing types to me.
But, I know…. Fake news right?

#347 Don Guillermo on 10.08.21 at 11:46 am

#335 Don Guillermo on 10.08.21 at 11:11 am

The few anti vax people I know are the healing crystal, energy in the room holistic types. All center right conservatives I know are double or triple vaxed.
********************************
Almost forgot, the rest of non vaxed I know are millennials. Rather than anti they tend to be the “oh, I just haven’t around to it” types.

#348 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.08.21 at 11:47 am

@#331, 332, 333 Facts
DELETED

++++

I think the lack of a vaccine has affected your powers of observation and reasoning skills….

Time for a jab.

Or risk Covid and we’ll be seeing you later this month on the News, with a tube up yer schnoz, gasping for air, telling us “Covid’s REAL!” ……

Stubborn, pigheaded and eventually dead.

#349 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 11:50 am

#337 Don Guillermo on 10.08.21 at 11:11 am

The few anti vax people I know are the healing crystal, energy in the room holistic types. All center right conservatives I know are double or triple vaxed.
______

Aye, I know only one family who are full-on anti-vax. They used to be totally normal but have lost their marbles over the last 10 years or so. It’s not just on Covid either – it’s on everything. They don’t trust anyone or anything.

Not sure what happened – but poor reasoning is definitely a huge part of it. Not much can be done, don’t see them around much anymore. Everyone else I know left or right are double vax’d.

#350 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 11:57 am

Here’s a good RE story for you dogs. Dude at work has a neighbour a few doors down living in the county. 30 acres of field, 20 year old bungalow. Nothing too special. Guy bought 6 years ago for 425K, just sold it for 1.8 Million.

I think things are starting to fall apart.

#351 Mortgage Broker on 10.08.21 at 12:05 pm

I think Canada is going to look like Poland in 6 months maybe 9 months, April to July-2022 with bond yields as as follows, 1yr. 0.61%, 2yr.1.33%, 3yr.1.50%, 4yr. 1.73%, 5yr. 1.99%, 6yr. 2.00%, 7yr. 2.07%, 9r. 2.29%, 10yr. 2.40%.

Mortgage rates will be variable, 1.75% to 2.25% 3, 5 years, fixed rates will be 2.75% to 3.15% 3 to 5 years. Well 7 and 10 year mortgages at best 3.80% to 4.35% at best. Better renew now or pay an extra $400 to $700 a month for most mortgage balances in GTA, Toronto, Vancouver, Victoria and other major cities. Good luck.

#352 KLNR on 10.08.21 at 12:11 pm

@#337 Don Guillermo on 10.08.21 at 11:11 am
#329 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 10:47 am
#11 Millennial Realist on 10.07.21 at 1:30 pm

Expect the latter – out of touch Boomer Cons will refuse to get vaccinated, further fracturing the Right Wing of Canadian politics. Boomer Cons will become more irrelevant even faster as a result.

Great news for Justin and Jagmeet, though.

Be part of the change.

Or be run over by it.
____

A sad possibility yes. Real conservatism is a dying ideology in Canada.

On the flip side, it’s also great news for Boomer Cons though too. The Libbie Kiddies will vote for more affordable housing which will produce policies that drive housing prices through the roof – as we’ve all seen happen clearly enough since 2015, and just recently saw again. Guess who owns all those houses? :)

Then there are regular cons like myself who own RE free and clear, make ho-hum incomes, are double vax’d, never vote lefty – yet inhale the Trudeau handouts and asset bloat like a 20 HP shop-vac. If I do a total sell out and bail when I hang the gloves, I will be run over by millions of dollars. I’ll think back and thank Trudeau for it, then I’ll be part of the change and head for southern Europe for retirement.
*************************************

The few anti vax people I know are the healing crystal, energy in the room holistic types. All center right conservatives I know are double or triple vaxed.

interesting how the anti-vax crowd come from all political stripes.
the only anti-vax people I know are in the religious socon category.

#353 Suck up on 10.08.21 at 12:22 pm

#347 crowdedelevatorfartz

Perhaps the name comes from your proximity to buttocks and your urge to kiss them?

Your posts read like a groupie desperate for attention.

Forgive if this is offensive, just comes across that way in text form.

#354 FriedEggs on 10.08.21 at 12:24 pm

We went from 2 weeks – to masks, swabbing the cranium plate, lockdowns, restrictions, lockdowns, 2 more weeks, authorized vaccines, 5 doses in the vial – no 6, dont mix the vaccines, wear a mask, 2 more weeks, AstraZeneca is not good for certain age groups, this vaccine isnt internationally recognized, get a vaccine and a free hamburger, get a vaccine and a chance to win $, vaccine is voluntary, 2 more weeks, lockdowns, vaccine green card pass, mandatory vaccines, concerns about Moderna for teens, get a vaccine or lose your job, test kids at school, kids 5 to 12 next to get jabbed, 2 more weeks, terminated employees…

Whats wrong they ask? Oh, nothing really.

You want consistency and predictability from a mutating virus? – Garth

#355 Jeff M. on 10.08.21 at 12:27 pm

I happily took both doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine.

These mandates, however, have gone too far. To require young, healthy adults, some of whom already have natural immunity to take a vaccine or lose their job and lose civil liberties is a mistake.

#356 Is anybody home? on 10.08.21 at 12:29 pm

World Economic Forum
https://swprs.org/the-wef-and-the-pandemic/

Look who in Canada are on the list of members to the Young Global Leaders a WEF sponsored organization.

https://www.younggloballeaders.org/community?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=&status=&class_year=&sector=&region=a0Tb00000000DC9EAM#results

Time to wake up Canada!

#357 Faron on 10.08.21 at 12:36 pm

#263 Midnights on 10.07.21 at 10:44 pm

What do I know.

Nothing apparently.

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-pfizer-ceovaccine-idUSL1N2PD1UX

CEO is double vaxxed. And, LOL, your link was from Dec, 2020.

Fascinating that you cite the work of two people who are very good journalists, level headed and pro vaccine. But in this one narrow and backwards corner of yours, they must not know what they are talking about?

#358 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.08.21 at 12:44 pm

I don’t know any anti-vaxx types, because I don’t hang with ignorant people.

#359 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.08.21 at 12:48 pm

#356 Faron on 10.08.21 at 12:36 pm
#263 Midnights on 10.07.21 at 10:44 pm

What do I know.

Nothing apparently.

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-pfizer-ceovaccine-idUSL1N2PD1UX

CEO is double vaxxed. And, LOL, your link was from Dec, 2020.

Fascinating that you cite the work of two people who are very good journalists, level headed and pro vaccine. But in this one narrow and backwards corner of yours, they must not know what they are talking about?
——————-
Good work, Sherlock!

#360 Dog Face on 10.08.21 at 1:09 pm

Gotta laugh at the cool-aid drinkers here who believe everything the government tells them. I’m from the government and I’m here to help…

The general theme here is:
“I hate anti-vaxxers”
“I don’t hang with anti-vaxxers”
“Anti-vaxxers have lost their marbles”
“Garth is so great” (general suck-ups)

Did we make you come here? Now genuflect and run along. – Garth

#361 Barb on 10.08.21 at 1:11 pm

#127:

“What’s up Turner? You get to 100 comments so now you’re taking the night off!?”

————————————-

There’s such a thing as time zones.
Sheesh.

#362 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 1:12 pm

You want consistency and predictability from a mutating virus? – Garth

Which is exactly why a vaccine for a constantly mutating virus won’t work. It becomes like a flu vaccine that they guess at the mutation before making it. Flu vaccines are on average only about 45% effective.

Looks like 45% is better than 0%. Math is hard, though. – Garth

#363 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 1:14 pm

#345 the Jaguar on 10.08.21 at 11:31 am

So if you can do all those things why do you feel you need to harass the unvaccinated? How are they affecting you? You just sound bitter and your comments show the quality, or lack thereof, of your personality.

And your “buzz off” just confirms it.

#364 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.08.21 at 1:18 pm

@#353 Suck Up

“Forgive if this is offensive, just comes across that way in text form.”

+++

No need to apologize Sucky.

I can take it.

I’m from a different era where insults and or rigorous debate were to be expected and relished.

Not reported as bullying, harassment and a potential Human Rights Kangaroo Court verdict.

#365 Faron on 10.08.21 at 1:32 pm

#279 AM in MN on 10.07.21 at 11:59 pm

“I used the Mann case to point out that when it gets to Court the science matters, in intricate detail, not political generalizations.”

Yet the decision doesn’t, at all, go into the detail and the case was lost because it was ignored. It has absolutely no bearing on the science and makes no statement about it.

“Mann was the PLAINTIFF, he sued another scientist who called him out on his fraudulent hockey stick graph. If he had better things to do then why did he sue?”

He sued because he was being badgered and defamed by Tim Ball. As I know personally, dealing with climate-denier crackpots can suck up a ton of time. Tim Ball may have been an excellent geographer in his day, but he was a terrible climate scientist. His is a case of people using the “Ph.D.” at the end of their name to glean relevance that they don’t deserve.

There was nothing fraudulent about Mann’s work. There were mistakes and, because the original work was a somewhat controversial breakthrough, it shouldn’t be surprising that it would be challenged. THAT’S HOW SCIENCE WORKS! Now, 20+ years later, the shape of his curve stands even though the details have been refined through numerous independent datasets. A friend of mine wrote one of those papers. The estimates late Holocene temperature are and probably always will look like a “hockey stick”.

“…he then refused to do.”

He’s a US citizen living in the US. He probably feels pretty comfortable that he won’t be extradited to BC over this civil matter.

“…EE isn’t about opinion, it’s a ‘hard science'”.

One of the “E”s in EE stands for engineering. Engineering is a derivative of science(s). There’s a reason there is an “S” and an “E” in STEM.

All of this is to say that the premise of your argument about vaxx cases is very faulty. So you are probably wrong in your thinking about how those cases will shape up.

#366 carrot on 10.08.21 at 1:32 pm

#342 Ponzius Pilatus

Oh, you figure that out already…

Here’s the next one…1 AZ (or JJ) vax plus 1 mRNA vax makes what?

This is for a free trip to Mars, take your time.

#367 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.08.21 at 1:34 pm

@#356 Is anybody Home

“Look who in Canada are on the list of members to the Young Global Leaders a WEF sponsored organization.”

+++

No real surprises.
Liberal cabinet ministers ( fart catchers ?) ponying up to the trough of publicity.

Although Chrystia Freeland seems to be getting a little long in the tooth for a “Young Global Leaders” forum.

#368 Faron on 10.08.21 at 1:37 pm

#362 Trojan House on 10.08.21 at 1:12 pm

“they guess at the mutation”

“They”. I love it!

“They” don’t guess (I’m assuming you mean the epidemiologists and virologists). “They” watch the annual flu cycle and prepare vaccines that address the variants that are circulating early in the year.

Thanks for the reminder to go get my flu shot. This could be the year of both flu and COVID having an impact.

#369 KLNR on 10.08.21 at 1:37 pm

@#350 IHCTD9 on 10.08.21 at 11:57 am
Here’s a good RE story for you dogs. Dude at work has a neighbour a few doors down living in the county. 30 acres of field, 20 year old bungalow. Nothing too special. Guy bought 6 years ago for 425K, just sold it for 1.8 Million.

I think things are starting to fall apart.

out by my country abode a standard 70s ranch bungalow on 3/4 acre lot gets a cool mil these days.
If you’re lucky it comes with a heated shop.
30 acres would be multi-millions

strange days indeed.

#370 Brian Jarvis on 10.08.21 at 2:03 pm

Apparently, federal judges are exempt from the manadory vaccination orders, as are employees in the House of Commons and the Senate, and, as far as I can tell because the wording is somewhat murky, the very politicians in Ottawa who are ordering mandatory vaccinations. In all, only one third of federal employees will have to submit to mandatory vaccinations.

MPs and Senators set their own agenda and are not bound by the public service mandate. They will, of course, all be vaccinated. – Garth

#371 satori on 10.08.21 at 2:04 pm

Randy – Get your head out of your ass and maybe you’ll learn something. Yes and you are a traitor. Goofus.
—————————————–
“Goofus” – words from a weak poor me voice coming up the stairs from Mom’s basement.

#372 Barb on 10.08.21 at 2:28 pm

Just open the land border…

So we have something to do again.

#373 Satori on 10.08.21 at 2:30 pm

187 Shelley
OMG, …..come on folks…..another example of 1st world privilege…..I’m still laughing…..
——————————————–
Actually Shelley, a ‘Pandemic’ is: (of a disease) prevalent over a whole country or the world.

You may not realize this but most on here are from Canada, my sympathies if you are not from a ‘first world’… as a health care worker, this not only affects us, it affects everyone. Not really funny, when you watch another human suffer a horrid death, regardless age, race, beliefs, health, position, wealth or a number before the word: ‘world’.

#374 Doug in London on 10.08.21 at 3:25 pm

Somehow the idea of refusing to be vaccinated has become associated with being Godly. Did it ever occur to anyone that if God loves humankind anywhere near what the Bible says, then why wouldn’t he or she want us to be healthy and disease free? Using similar logic, if God loves us so much doesn’t it make sense that he or she would bless humankind with some extremely bright people who can figure out how to defeat diseases that cause so much pain, suffering, and death? Why are these ideas so hard to understand?

#375 Doug in London on 10.08.21 at 3:31 pm

In reading the comments, I see some people believe in using crystals to deal with COVID. There’s actually some logic to that idea. I used the silicon crystals in my home computer to book a vaccination appointment with the local health unit. As soon as I was finished, the health unit used the silicon crystals in their computer to schedule my second shot. You see? Crystals are quite useful in controlling this virus.

#376 Barb on 10.08.21 at 3:47 pm

Our Blue Cross health plan issued a travel insurance offer:

“FREE coverage for COVID-19 when you’re fully vaccinated. Up to $10M at no additional cost.”

You know…the $10M it’ll cost non-vaxxed people when they are trying to recover from infection in another country.

#377 espressobob on 10.08.21 at 8:25 pm

Numbers don’t lie., People do. Get Vaxxed.

#378 Steven Rowlandson on 10.08.21 at 8:26 pm

DELETED (Anti-vax)

#379 Tremblant110 on 10.08.21 at 9:59 pm

I do expect the anti-vaxxers to refuse a vaccine when they step on a rusty nail and prefer to live with lockjaw.
They just need to be consistent in their convictions !

#380 Midnights on 10.09.21 at 6:29 am

#357 Faron on 10.08.21 at 12:36 pm

https://www.ibtimes.sg/pfizer-ceos-israel-visit-postponed-due-covid-19-vaccination-related-concerns-
56019

lmbo, what’s that date posted? Lmao.
Don’t go away mad. Just go away…lol

#381 NBE on 10.10.21 at 10:18 am

Perhaps your best blog to date.

I think what people don’t understand is when they’re unvaccinated and then turn around and get cancer, etc. they won’t get the treatment they deserve. Or maybe they will!…