Suck. Blow. FOMO.

We’ve just created two classes of people. One group is made up of social pariahs. Uninformed, secondary, vaguely inferior, with a dubious future. To the media and the political clique, their choices are suspect. Wrong.  The other group are mainstream. They’ve taken actions they’re convinced will guarantee a good outcome, regardless of all potential risks along the way. And society agrees.

No, this is not about the vaxed and the unvaccinated. We’re talkin’ renters and owners.

Why would someone choose to be a tenant when all the world is house lusty? Many reasons. An aversion to debt might top the list. Canadians have been sleepwalking into historic levels of borrowing to buy real estate at the highest prices ever with mortgages whose rates can only rise in the future. That sounds unwise. Lots of risk. And some people want lives stripped of uncertainty.

Others who prefer to rent are picking freedom. Flexibility. Mobility. The capacity to change cities to take up a better career opportunity. The ability to change your life, experiences and surroundings, instead of being anchored to a mortgage and endlessly living Groundhog Day. The chance to follow your heart and pursue a person you love to the destination of his or her choosing. The understanding that the meaning of life is not to possess a pile of bricks and sticks, but rather to fill it with experiences and make the most of time.

Some renters just like liquidity rather than obligation. They’d rather fill tax shelters and investment accounts than spend two decades paying down a home loan. Some folks understand that in the last third of life what you really need is cash flow, not a paid-off house that drained most of your working paycheques. You can always rent a roof. You cannot lease income.

And, yes, many people simply can afford real estate no longer. At least not without a huge financial gamble, especially those who’ve also chosen to have families. It is wholly irresponsible to feed a mortgage, for example, when your kids’ education savings accounts go unfunded. And yet that is exactly what today’s housing mania has done. Priorities have become twisted beyond recognition.

In short, there’s zero shame being a renter rather than an owner. But shame on those who constantly seek to stigmatize, belittle and diminish the millions among us who have made a conscious or necessary choice to eschew the massive debt and physical entrapment of home ownership.

Like Karen Yolevski.

  K is the COO of Royal LePage which, despite the burden that ownership is placing on Canadians in a Covid world, just can’t stop humping houses. “Owning a property allows more freedom and stability than renting. As a homeowner, you do not have to worry about the landlord hiking up the rent or forcing you to move,” she says this week. “I believe most Canadians would agree that owning a home is as much about laying down roots in a community and making memories with family, as it is about financial security.”

Of course Karen doesn’t mention things like the couple profiled here who bought and leveraged a $1.8 million renovated house with a ceiling about to cave. Or the family that pours everything into a property only to find their neighbours smoke weed on the porch all day. Or the condo owner who gets a $30,000 special assessment because of salt damage to the parking garage. Or the thousands of new property owners in Ontario about to be shocked at assessments and property tax bills when MPAC reports next year.

But wait. Karen and her colleagues hired housing economist Will Dunning (who works principally for the Mortgage Professionals of Canada) to “prove” that owning beats renting when it comes to financial security. You can read it for yourself, here.

Their conclusion: In 91% of the cases Dunning weaseled into, owners are an average of $769 per month ahead of renters. Yup, there ya go. Regardless of whether you are single, have a family, are 25 or 70 years old, living in Cheticamp or Kitsilano, the proof is in. Feed that FOMO.

Is this the height of corporate irresponsibility in Canada? If not, it must come close. With the average property now costing almost $800,000 – over seven figures in many markets – and mortgage rates about to augment (the first bank increases come on Friday, I hear) people need guidance, not hype. Goading and guilting everyone into real estate debt is not what respected companies do. Especially when their numbers suck.

For example, here’s Dunning’s summary analysis, wherein the $769-per-month ownership advantage emanates. It assumes a 20% downpayment ($147,000) on a $733,000 property purchase, yet does not take into consideration a renter who would invest that same amount in a TFSA or RRSP instead of dumping it into a house. With a 7% return (this year it’s been closer to 12%) that alone would generate $857 a month. The last time I looked, that’s bigger than $769. Moreover the bulk of the mortgage payment, says the LePage report, is not considered a cost while 100% of rent is. Yet both come right out of after-tax income. K and Will can suck and blow with a vengeance. All in the interest of realtor commissions.

But what about runaway housing inflation? People who have taken on 20x leverage, choked down big mortgages, fed their lenders every month or bought property and stayed there for years and years have made a bundle, the humpers cry. And they’re right. Enjoy the windfall – which is only realized when a sale takes place.

But the point remains. There are a multitude of solid, responsible, personal and human – as well as financial – reasons why many among us shun owning. The housing hesitant. Show some respect. If you can’t manage that, at least be honest.

About the picture: “Love your blog and never miss a chance to read it,” writes Ian, in Oshawa.  “This is ‘Tiger’. He grew into a 50lb Frenchie who is living his best life. Walking on the 11 acres he calls home, chasing every bunny that dares to cross his path, and snuggling on the sofa. I think he is trying to warn people to be careful dealing with this crazy housing market.”

187 comments ↓

#1 Immigrant man on 09.29.21 at 1:26 pm

How come there are only a handful real estate agencies in Canada? If this is such a lucrative business, why is there not more competition? Houses in GTA cost ~1.5 mil and the RE agent still takes 5% for a days worth of work. How come they are not being competed with agents that say would take 4.5%? Just curios how this all works. Is there some kind of gov regs that keep this industry protected?

#2 None on 09.29.21 at 1:28 pm

I also do my best proof reading after I hit ‘send’ ;)

#3 Kitty Kaboom on 09.29.21 at 1:29 pm

Once the FHSA hits the street, look out for a spring to remember! Socialized down payment augmentation.

#4 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 1:30 pm

Looking at the rent vs. owning calculation:
Where is the “opportunity cost” of the down payment, damn it.

#5 Anthony on 09.29.21 at 1:32 pm

I love how land transfer tax and REALTOR® commissions are completely ignored in these scenarios.

People who “climb the property ladder” in Toronto spend 3% on the sale value every time they buy and ~5% every time they sell.

Also, since when is maintaining and repairing a property only $720/year or 0.1% of the property value?

#6 James on 09.29.21 at 1:33 pm

Gota love those Special Assessments!
My wife and I received one of those baby’s just after we sold our condo. Surprise it was four months after we moved and were having our mail forwarded. Needless to say it was a true surprise to us and the new owners. They were not happy and there was threatening talk of legal action in our sale. Thank God the mode of failure on the building occurred after we had sold and we were not privy to the occurrence. Our real-estate lawyer said go ahead let them try yo sue, no lawyer will take it on. It was a $15,000 SA.

#7 Don Guillermo on 09.29.21 at 1:37 pm

“The understanding that the meaning of life is not to possess a pile of bricks and sticks, but rather to fill it with experiences and make the most of time.”
***************************************
Being house poor becomes a boat anchor. Taking out LOCs to buy window coverings, furniture or vehicles typically means a fail.

#8 Mark on 09.29.21 at 1:38 pm

wow, that is some disgustingly ignorant house humping math. but what else can we expect from an industry that has such an inherent bias and conflict of interest to the public. at this point they are only preaching to the already-seduced, most of which have already bought by now. so although it’s embarrassing and disgraceful to see that kind of voodoo math from a supposedly respectable corporation, the real-world impact and number of people getting swooned is likely very low. Thank god for that.

#9 Mike on 09.29.21 at 1:45 pm

It’s a joke that they assume “Homeowners’ Maintenance and Repairs” is $60 per month!

#10 TurnerNation on 09.29.21 at 1:46 pm

We have bigger problems. Is there anything CV cannot do to destroy the former First World Counties?
This is WARTIME and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms has been suspended – since WW3 broke out, March 2020.

Fact: each week more and more freedoms are removed. There is no “re-opening” plan. That is not in the plans.

.As COVID-19 cases continue to rise, N.L. makes changes to travel restrictions, suspends Atlantic bubble (cbc.ca)

———
— But the hospital capacity!

.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)

.More than 180 Minnesota health care workers sue over vaccine mandate (www.startribune.com)

.N.C. hospital system fires about 175 workers in one of the largest-ever mass terminations due to a vaccine mandate(www.msn.com)

————————-
— Control over Travel/Movements. If not this then Climate Lockdowns. Whatever it takes.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8228148/no-third-covid-19-shot-bc-residents-mixed-doses-top-doctor/
“B.C. residents who received mixed COVID-19 doses won’t be offered third shot for travel”

https://www.flightglobal.com/strategy/americans-pilots-warn-vaccine-mandate-could-cause-disruptions/145675.article
“American Airlines’ pilot union is warning that the US government’s Covid-19 vaccine mandate could lead to “mass terminations” and a travel crunch in the traditionally busy end-of-year holiday season”

.United Airlines to fire 593 workers who refused Covid-19 vaccines (straitstimes.com)

— As noted by #139 Dominoes Lining Up – even Local transit travel will be shut down

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ttc-vaccination-policy-refusal-strike-labour-board-1.6193265

#11 Rainman on 09.29.21 at 1:48 pm

Depends where you live Garth. We have just put up our two bedroom suite and have been inundated with requests to rent it. The stories coming in make me feel sad. There is simply not enough rental units in this town that make it very hard to be a renter. We were there once too and were evicted twice, which forced us into buying and thankful for that looking back. I see no shame in renting, but depending where you live, is not ideal. That’s the truth.

#12 Drill Baby Drill on 09.29.21 at 2:06 pm

Great advice today Dog Blog God.

#13 Dolce Vita on 09.29.21 at 2:07 pm

People with the disease wrote that propaganda.

So in theory, out intrepid renter has $146,692 for a downpayment.

Invest in an ETF that gives modest dividends such as QYLD, $CDN:

$0.2423 dividend/share/month or $2.91/share/year
$28.15 price per share

Buy this many shares:

= $146,692/$28.15 + $0.35
= 5,069 shares.

Go to a DIVIDEND REINVESTMENT Calculator like this one:
https://www.buyupside.com/calculators/dividendreinvestmentdec07.htm

Make the above inputs and the assume worst case (Number of Years = 25):

Dividend Annual Growth Rate (%) = 0%
Stock Price Annual Growth Rate (%) = 0%

And you end up with a total value of:

$1,655,696.85

If our ETF stock price increases like the S&P 500 has on average over the past 50 years @ 10.9%, the above number becomes:

$4,443,215.11

And yes, the dividends have been stable and slightly increasing & in the above assumption was 0% dividend growth (data from Nasdaq):

https://i.imgur.com/uh3oUHv.png

For the Hades of it, assume the dividend growth rate is 1% and not 0%, you then end up with:

$4,779,998.09

————————–

To give you an idea how STUPID that RE calculation was.

#14 Tripp on 09.29.21 at 2:10 pm

“ No, this is not about the vaxed and the unvaccinated. We’re talkin’ renters and owners.”

Interesting parallel. Like between the risk you can somewhat predict and the risk that allows for unknown variation, but accounts for society’s perception, preconceived mindsets and stereotypes.

#15 Ryan on 09.29.21 at 2:11 pm

what also was not taken into consideration :
avg 2 % inflation per month for rent
being kicked out of rental unit average every 7-10 years, costs of moving, new photo ID costs (new address) , etc.

avg 2 % inflation per month for taxes on said home
avg 2 % inflation per month for insurance costs on home

Your mortgage payment is unlikely to double or triple in 20 years, and after 10-15 years, a lot less goes to “wasted” interest % wise.

I can tell you in Edmonton, in 25 years rent for a 1 bedroom has tripled from $300 in 1997 to > $900 today.

But prices to buy are still stoopud, you CAN search hard and rent a townhouse for < $1100-1300 a month (no garage).

#16 Leftover on 09.29.21 at 2:12 pm

If the analysis excludes principal repayments then by definition it has to include the investment return on the $769 a month positive cash-flow that the renter enjoys.

Since they’re looking at a 10-year scenario, that’s quite a bit of money. Invested at 6% it amounts to about $125,000, likely tax-free if the majority of it goes into a TFSA or tax-advantaged if it goes into an RSP.

And of course Dunning leaves out transaction costs at the end of 10 years.

Liars always gonna lie.

#17 My Body My Choice on 09.29.21 at 2:14 pm

Of course her name is Karen …

I agree, people should have the ability to select the best housing option given their specific circumstances without being lectured by busybodies like Karen.

Kind of like: My Abode My Choice.

By the way Garth, your blog photos always celebrate the joys of dog companionship, yet most rentals are advertised as “No Pets”. What’s a renter to do?

#18 ogdoad on 09.29.21 at 2:16 pm

Environment influences humans just as much as the propensity of genes inherited from your ma or pa could influence behavior – or so I’ve heard.

If you want your offspring to be entitled, whiny, wannabe zombies with the mind of a peanut then carry on – actually do ’cause my offspring will need employees.

I envy renters and their freedom. If they only realized the responsibilities and stress they are eschewing by being a renter then Karen Yolevski would sound like a complete newb. Those who want the stress and resp. are lying…look how many lazy people hire landscapers for instance – get to work! You wanted the yard!

It’s hug a renter day!

Og

#19 Lt. Commander Data on 09.29.21 at 2:16 pm

Public Health Agency of Canada recorded 69 influenza detections in the 2020-21 flu season, in its final FluWatch report on Aug. 28.

Normally, around 52,000 cases are detected.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8181383/flu-season-canada-covid-fall-2021/

#20 A01 on 09.29.21 at 2:18 pm

Whenever someone gives their opinion, always ask yourself what are their economic incentives. Of course real estate companies are going to pay for a report that shows home ownership it’s favourable to renting. Same way 4/5 dentists surveyed recommend blah blah blah (survey paid for by blah blah blah).

#21 Dolce Vita on 09.29.21 at 2:18 pm

PS:

Prior example I just used the downpayment for an investment.

You can also take the mortgage interest payments made every year and calculate how many more shares per month you can buy.

Go to any mortgage amortization calculator like this one and generate an amortization schedule showing interest payments per month:
https://www.bankrate.com/calculators/mortgages/amortization-calculator.aspx

Here is the first 12 months amortization schedule:

https://i.imgur.com/jkjyzzS.png

Take those interest payments and buy more of, as in my prior example, QYLD shares every month.

…think it thru how much you will have after 25 yrs besides the cool $4.4 million with an average S&P 500 annual growth rate.

—————–

RE example is now ever more STUPIFIED.

#22 Spy vs. Spy on 09.29.21 at 2:23 pm

#149 ImGonnaBeSick on 09.29.21 at 11:32 am
#144 Spy vs. Spy on 09.29.21 at 10:57 am
#138 Philco

Well, don’t wrap yourself in that safety blanket of human rights abuses.

A drone may come around, drop a hellfire missile upon your family, kill 7 children and be declared as a righteous strike and conducted correctly by highest Generals. Probably because these were Afghani children I’m guessing? Why should anyone care about those? Are they even human beings? Should they have human rights?

—-

Well, it depends if they vote conservative or not. If so, definitely not human beings then.

—-

I’m going to need you to pull back on that view. Who ordered this strike?

THEY try to appear different, but aren’t.

WE are quite alike, but we also like being told that we’re better than others because we hold one view instead of another. How childish and silly.

#23 The West on 09.29.21 at 2:23 pm

Scathing.

Dunning’s report is woefully self indulgent. I could list all the expenses he has misrepresented (and simply left out) on his little spreadsheet but, that doesn’t move product. (Remember when doctors were prescribing cigarettes to anxiety ridden pregnancies).

PS: Garth if you need an editor to proof read your entries please reach out!

#24 Prince Polo on 09.29.21 at 2:27 pm

Karen – don’t be such a Karen!! LOL.

From the January 2021 archives:

#13 Prince Polo on 01.08.21 at 2:57 pm
*AHEM*, I ran the monthly payment numbers for downtown ‘Sauga condos through the realtor.ca calculator (assuming 2% mortgage, 25yr amortization, 5% down, adding prop tax and condo fees):
1 bdrm @ $510K = $2750/mo
2 bdrm @ $635K = $3400/mo

I prefer to be a “loser” renter in order to afford a roof over my head + annual vacations + biweekly retirement savings. At least I’m somewhat profiting off of the ever-increasing mortgage racket via bank divvies.

When will lack of affordability hit 100% of the population? Nobody really seems to care about it being 90% (except for the 10% of Canada visiting this website).

#25 My Body My Choice on 09.29.21 at 2:30 pm

#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)

.More than 180 Minnesota health care workers sue over vaccine mandate (www.startribune.com)

.N.C. hospital system fires about 175 workers in one of the largest-ever mass terminations due to a vaccine mandate(www.msn.com)”

__________________________________

Must be all those illiterate, tobacco-chewing, gun-totin’, camo-wearin’, bucktooth, right-wing, extremist, hog-huntin’, red-neck hillbilly trailer-trash that are refusing the recommended health measures. CBC told me, so it must be true.

#26 S.Bby on 09.29.21 at 2:30 pm

Karen is just taking her book as a typical salesperson. My wife and I looked a place a few years ago and when the agent at the open house found out we were renting she used the usual “don’t throw your money away on rent” spiel. It’s just the nature of the beast with them.

#27 Dragonfly 58 on 09.29.21 at 2:31 pm

Wife and I were renters for first 5 years we were together. What a crappy situation, Lower Mainland. No stability whatsoever. Always hanging by a thread based on the landlords whim to sell not to sell. Evict or not evict. Life is way too short for that B.S. These days it’s even worse. Very few rentals and very high rent’s.
Renting limits you in many ways. Play an instrument ? Better head to the park. Want to do your own car maintenance like several have suggested , fat chance if the landlord finds out. And where are you going to keep tools etc ? An RV? storage yards are usually far away and sky high in cost. Canoe or small runabout ? In your dreams. Pets ? Fish or Hamster but a dog ? Many landlords will have a fit.
If your life style is cocooning with the tube or computer renting will be OK. Many people with a life will hardly be able to wait for self ownership and freedom of choice.

#28 R on 09.29.21 at 2:32 pm

One chart that shows how strange Covid has been is the long term stock chart of GoEasy (gsy.t). This company started out as a furniture rent to own , but has morphed into a lender somewhere in between the banks and “Cash Loans ” . So a scenario I think is happeing is millennials buy a house on FOMO , and because of blind bidding end up a few hundred thousand short what the banks and BOM will provide. They could to GoEasy and obtain the financing at a rate that is more than the Banks , but less than the Loan Sharking “Cash Loans”. Look at how the stock price has exploded since Jan 2020, from the low $30s to over $200 today . Almost as good as Tesla.
https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/quote/GSY.TO?p=GSY.TO&amp;.tsrc=fin-srch

#29 S.Bby on 09.29.21 at 2:34 pm

Lots of this going on in my area:

https://www.burnabynow.com/local-news/police-havent-ruled-out-more-victims-in-burnaby-house-fire-4469323

Firefighters pulled two ‘unresponsive’ people from burning home that had been divided into multiple suites.

#30 Daveboy on 09.29.21 at 2:44 pm

I love renting , I could easily buy, but I wont. Its the opportunity cost that stops me .

My neighbor has a payed off house (650k)just had to install a new ac unit ($3500) his taxes 8000 a year.

650k @ 7 % a year return=45.5 k + taxes +ac repair= 56000 to live there this year.

My rent, on the exact same house is 33k

No brainer for me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxloC1MKTpg&ab_channel=DJKhaledVEVO

#31 Don Guillermo on 09.29.21 at 2:45 pm

#17 My Body My Choice on 09.29.21 at 2:14 pm
Of course her name is Karen …

I agree, people should have the ability to select the best housing option given their specific circumstances without being lectured by busybodies like Karen.

Kind of like: My Abode My Choice.

By the way Garth, your blog photos always celebrate the joys of dog companionship, yet most rentals are advertised as “No Pets”. What’s a renter to do?
*******************************

Hmmm, I don’t know. Maybe don’t have a dog? Just throwing that out there.

#32 BlogDog123 on 09.29.21 at 2:48 pm

Your Realtor(R)’s take:

But your friendly neighbourhood Realtor(R) needs a transaction to occur, no matter the societal cost!

We Realtors(R) don’t feed ourselves by letting no sale happen! Get outta your house, resident! Here’s an agreement of purchase/sale. Accept the offer, g’dammit! Move often, please! Buy and sell every few months or years, please! You hate your current house and need to move elsewhere. Make sure my name and broker is listed on the bottom and don’t forget to sign on the line that is dotted!!!

#33 Alberta Ed on 09.29.21 at 2:52 pm

Karen and Dunning should be working for Chrystia Freeland… they share the same brand of financial thuggery.

#34 S.Bby on 09.29.21 at 2:53 pm

it wasn’t me…

https://www.burnabynow.com/local-news/winning-lotto-max-ticket-worth-70m-bought-in-burnaby-biggest-in-bc-history-4468924

#35 Dr. Doolittle on 09.29.21 at 2:56 pm

But what about wanting to have dogs and/or cats? I always had problems renting when I’ve had a cat or dog. Many landlords won’t consider it, even with a higher damage deposit….

#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm

#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

From what I understand, close to 100% of medical doctors and registered nurses in Quebec are vaccinated, such that the 17,000 healthcare workers who are not are mostly clinical workers, PSWs and others who are not as educated with respect to the importance of mass vaccination.

#37 Nicholas Jardine on 09.29.21 at 3:00 pm

I’m confused on the whole rent is better than owning topic. Is this simply speaking about todays market, or overall? If it’s today, I could understand as the house prices are insane…but so is rent. I bought my house 4 years ago, and it has increased $300k in value. My mortgage + property taxes are still less than what I would pay in rent for the exact same home. “Some folks understand that in the last third of life what you really need is cash flow, not a paid-off house that drained most of your working paycheques”. What about selling your paid off home and then renting in retirement? Or downsizing up north and using the difference? I just don’t see how there is any possible way I could have made $300k in 4yrs by renting..

#38 XGRO and chill on 09.29.21 at 3:05 pm

A few years ago, I grew annoyed with the various rent vs buy calculators available online. They always excluded too many variables that I believed were important.

So I made my own. It includes as variables:
Property taxes
Home maintenance fees
Tenant insurance
Utility costs
Investment appreciation
Interest rate changes
Inflation of income / living expenses
Changes in home prices
Taxes on selling liquid investments
Closing costs on buying/selling a home
CMHC fees (depends on downpayment, of course)
Retirement age
+ more

There are 3 scenarios in the calculator. One rent, and two buy. It calculates all costs forward in time using all these variables, and converts it back to present dollars using the inflation rate selected, so you know in today’s dollars where you will end up down the road. It makes a graph of your net worth over time so you can visualize what tinkering with these variables does to your finances. It also tells you right up front exactly how much interest you are going to pay in today’s dollars to buy a home (which I like, because the amortization formula is cryptic to get a gut feel understanding of what’s really going on)

The process of making this calculator taught me that the more things you exclude from a rent vs buy calculation, the more it works in favour of buying. It also showed me that buying a home rather than renting is often a huge blow to your lifetime peak net worth. In some scenarios it will cut it in half, maybe more. Depends on how much house you buy. Which means that the less house you buy, the better, by a huge margin.

Nobody paid me to do this. I am not an economist. But I did take an engineering economics class in University. I got 100% in that class. The formulas we learned in that class were used to make this calculator.

Maybe if people are curious on here, I’ll share the excel sheet.

#39 Flop… on 09.29.21 at 3:07 pm

What do you think the chances are that the first thing the Two Michael’s ordered upon arrival was take-out Chinese food…

M47BC

#40 UCC on 09.29.21 at 3:17 pm

#27 Dragonfly 58 on 09.29.21 at 2:31 pm
Wife and I were renters for first 5 years we were together. What a crappy situation, Lower Mainland. No stability whatsoever. Always hanging by a thread based on the landlords whim to sell not to sell. Evict or not evict. Life is way too short for that B.S. These days it’s even worse. Very few rentals and very high rent’s.
Renting limits you in many ways. Play an instrument ? Better head to the park. Want to do your own car maintenance like several have suggested , fat chance if the landlord finds out. And where are you going to keep tools etc ? An RV? storage yards are usually far away and sky high in cost. Canoe or small runabout ? In your dreams. Pets ? Fish or Hamster but a dog ? Many landlords will have a fit.
If your life style is cocooning with the tube or computer renting will be OK. Many people with a life will hardly be able to wait for self ownership and freedom of choice.

Never had a problem. Just be responsible. Rent a Single Family home rather than an apartment. Be a good renter and pay on time. Dogs are allowed….

#41 When the Whip Comes Down on 09.29.21 at 3:20 pm

Do these calculations not have to be prepared and reviewed by some professional staff prior to being released into communications literature? Or do none of these outfits employee (a cpa for example) professional finance expertise to do so? Pretty sure there is an ethical requirement to not be associated with misleading information which should be some type of control over this bunk.

#42 Dolce Vita on 09.29.21 at 3:20 pm

Some Cdn provinces ICU stretched I read here and watch on Cdn news.

In Italia, after the 1st devastating wave, they added last year an additional 3553 ICU beds to the already 5179 they had for a total of 8732 ICU beds (Italia population = 60M). These are also mechanically ventilated capable ICU beds.

1st wave hit 4053 ICU beds, 2nd wave hit 3670 ICU beds. So Italia never ran out of ICU beds even during the dark days of 2020 despite all the pathos from the World’s MSM about Bergamo.

Now how many are in use today?

Go here to see:

https://www.agenas.gov.it/covid19/web/index.php

Hard to say if Canada should increase its ICU bed capacity permanently.

If so and for certain, they should have done it in 2020 like Italia did. A lack of foresight.

#43 RichardTO on 09.29.21 at 3:26 pm

DELETED (Anti-vax)

#44 twofatcats on 09.29.21 at 3:29 pm

It is not just Canada. This article is one year old but it highlights the increasingly common belief that home ownership, not wages or profession, determines who is seen as lower/working class and who is seen as middle/upper class.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/09/inheritance-work-middle-class-home-ownership-cost-of-housing-wages

#45 Catalyst on 09.29.21 at 3:30 pm

You say that renters prefer to ‘liquidity to obligation’ but a renter has the same monthly obligation (to their landlord) that the homeowner has to the bank. You say you can’t rent cash flow but a paid off residence pays you monthly the equivalent to rent. Lastly you mentioned that K doesn’t count 7% gains from opp cost in a portfolio but she also doesn’t include the leveraged gains in equity homeowners have traditionally seen.

It’s a completely self serving piece coming from Royal Lepage but I don’t disagree with the conclusions. It’s also kinda sad the COO is using a rent v buy calculator that is far inferior to my own spreadsheet.

My only conclusion is that people should choose what’s best for them, and there are many reasons why renters prefer the freedom and flexibility of that lifestyle. Stop justifying your choice and trying to impose it on others. – Garth

#46 Mark on 09.29.21 at 3:37 pm

#27 Dragonfly 58 on 09.29.21 at 2:31 pm

Renting limits you in many ways. Play an instrument ? Better head to the park. Want to do your own car maintenance like several have suggested , fat chance if the landlord finds out. And where are you going to keep tools etc ? An RV? storage yards are usually far away and sky high in cost. Canoe or small runabout ? In your dreams. Pets ? Fish or Hamster but a dog ? Many landlords will have a fit.
If your life style is cocooning with the tube or computer renting will be OK. Many people with a life will hardly be able to wait for self ownership and freedom of choice.
—————
good sir, you seem to be comparing living in a house vs living a condo. I don’t see anything in the quoted portion about buying vs renting. you can rent a house or you can buy a condo. Then you would have the opposite experience in both cases. In fact most people these days are buying condos since houses are so expensive, in which case they still have all of the issues you mentioned and, on top of that, are much less liquid and mobile. Did I miss something?

#47 Richard L on 09.29.21 at 3:43 pm

A car salesman will tell you that buying a car is a good idea.

A real estate agent will tell you it is a good idea to buy real estate.

#48 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 3:51 pm

This is all new math, because we now live in the New Canada.

Back in the Old Canada, Ms. IH and I took our joe-blow incomes, and made plans to buy a house, have kids, and save for retirement. Stop laughing, folks did stuff like this simultaneously in Canada 20+ years ago. We did it no problemo. Bought a house. Raised 2 kids. Saved up for retirement. Still finishing up on the last two.

But that Canada died in 2020 with an insurmountable pile of debt, and ho-hum metro homes that cost more than a 1000 year old Italian mansion nestled in the mountains. Today we have the new math, to go along with the new Canada.

#49 Charlie on 09.29.21 at 3:52 pm

Will’s repair and maintenance expenditure of $60 per month is completely out to lunch. Even being generous and combining it with condo fees of $147 is a paltry budget. Good luck buying supplies for that amount, let alone hiring anyone to do the work.

#50 DownToFinance on 09.29.21 at 3:52 pm

The situation just keeps getting worse for both renters and owners. I don’t understand why people can’t see that higher ownership rates only lead to a smaller rental market and higher costs (property taxes/assessments) for home owners themselves. Wife and I had to move between Toronto and Montreal and we had to buy because with zero dogs there were precisely 0 rental options available to us in the entire city.

#51 Graphics Girl on 09.29.21 at 3:55 pm

I never understood the “property ladder” until I bought a house. The bank WANTS you to borrow more. With a HELOC you can use leverage to invest to get you further ahead. Yes, there is a risk, but if done prudently, you can build a nice portfolio and deleverage when needed. I’m glad I bought it when I did. It is forced savings. I don’t think I would have saved as much.

#52 Philco on 09.29.21 at 3:58 pm

Today I agree… its just not a simple buy and go calculation.
2007 I paid cash $235k for a 1975 2400sq 2 car large garage on large prime property.
I gutted and did a complete reno $100k in parts and did it all myself. Hardwood floors, Pluming, electrical, cabinets (solid wood $7k incl counter tops would cost $40k+ today) installed beams that I cut on my saw mill and completely rebuilt 3 bathrooms.
Replacement cost $1.2 mil and I’m not sure what the market is and I couldn’t give a hoot anyway.
My cost to live in it $650mnth.

Sadly My kid cant afford a home today.
Its mind boggling what people pay to buy and live in a home today.
Renting can make sense now it didn’t before.

#53 Ken R on 09.29.21 at 4:01 pm

$60 bucks maintenance monthly on a 733k house?
Hahaha! Good luck.

#54 NOSTRADAMUS on 09.29.21 at 4:11 pm

BALL BUSTER BLUES!
Before too long the overindebted will be listening to a whole lot of” hurtin,” music on the radio. #1 On the easy listening station, “I’ve got the Credit card Blues.” A great song to sing along to when sleep eludes you. And moving up the Rock and Roll charts into #2, and played endlessly over and over in the Pay Day Loan offices,” The Ball Buster Express.” Moving along to the Religious channel, #3 and still, the Bankers all time favorite, “I’ve lost that loving feeling cause your monies, gone, gone, gonnnnn.” Bullet proof prediction, rough seas ahead. The man with cash, stay calm, point the bow into the waves and ride it out. The days ahead will be brighter— time to put your cash to work.” The Ides of November” draw ever closer. .I feel better now, Amen Brother

#55 Reality Check on 09.29.21 at 4:13 pm

Sold my house in 2006 and rolled everything into the stock market from 2007 to 2012.

My friends and relatives feel bad for me, having missed out on “huge” gains on the value of my sold house and throwing money away on rent. My house has done a 2x over the past 15 years. However, my investments have done a 5x. I have more money that I can ever spend unless I significantly change the way it live.

Now you might say I could have kept the house and taken a Heloc and invest that. Totally rational and good thing to do. But honestly how many people do that with their paid off house.

#56 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 4:29 pm

#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

From what I understand, close to 100% of medical doctors and registered nurses in Quebec are vaccinated, such that the 17,000 healthcare workers who are not are mostly clinical workers, PSWs and others who are not as educated with respect to the importance of mass vaccination.
———–
Agree,
Time to rid the health care system of people who don’t understand what healthcare means.
We don’t need “health care” workers who’re just mailing it in.
I’m sure there are lots of compassionate people out there, who understand that being a being a “real” healthcare worker is about compassion and making a difference.
I can’t understand a person who’s supposed to care of sick people, are endangering their patients by not getting vaccinated.
Pretty selfish, if you ask me.

#57 Faron on 09.29.21 at 4:38 pm

#42 Dolce Vita on 09.29.21 at 3:20 pm

Adding ICU beds is a tough choice. One would hope that we will get COVID back under control (meaning high vax rate, regular boosters, and definitive and rapid response to outbreaks at small and large scales). In that case, a small bump in ICU beds may be justified. But, as crowdie and I nattered on about yesterday, the greater need is for primary care and adding there is far cheaper than increasing ICU capacity. More bang for the buck.

#58 Dragonfly 58 on 09.29.21 at 4:43 pm

Buying will be more expensive. Until the Mortgage is paid off. Then it’s just taxes and maintenance. Rents as well as buying around here is truly crazy.
Any houses I see for rent in this area are around $3,500 a month and up. That adds up fast , let alone over a lifetime.
Buying will be possibly a little more each month. But after 25 years you are golden.
Wife and I got serious about paying down and were paid off in 18 years.
Retirement would be very difficult otherwise. By owning we are doing reasonably well despite a modest monthly income. We just can’t move up to a newer house or larger property. That would require an additional Million and isn’t going to happen. If we were shelling out $3000 + a month on rent we would be working right on up to the old folks home.

#59 Honest Realtor on 09.29.21 at 4:44 pm

Garth, I respectfully agree with you that ALL costs must always be accounted for, in a comparison like this between renting and buying. This includes opportunity costs, of course, such as a down payment that could otherwise be deployed into liquid investments.

But the biggest opportunity cost ahead to avoid may be the next surge in property values. Particularly with the COVID-19 recovery and immigration surge we are about to have.

A 2-3X property valuation increase by about 2035 is virtually certain right now, possible higher. Missing out on that could be very sad.

Imagine a financial advisor saying it was “virtually certain” that an asset would rise 200-300%. This is precisely why your industry cries out for more regulation. – Garth

#60 NOSTRADAMUS on 09.29.21 at 4:46 pm

NOTHING BETTER TO DO TODAY!
So here comes a pearl of wisdom for our hard working Realtors. The salad days of easy commissions are about to come to an end. For 12 long years you have had the good fortune to grow up, “silver spoon,” it’s going to be hard going, “plastic.” There is an old saying,” The truth is in the Pudding.” For a great number of Realtors, they are about to see the pudding up close. Regarding todays article, I second Garth’s opinion as to Royal Lepage, COO Karen. It’s just too amazing to see people visibly poisoned by misinformation. Special, double “F”
bomb warning for all Realtors “The Ides Of November” draw closer. I feel better now, Amen Brother

#61 LesserApe on 09.29.21 at 4:47 pm

You say that renters prefer to ‘liquidity to obligation’ but a renter has the same monthly obligation (to their landlord) that the homeowner has to the bank.

The liquidity issue is real. 20 years ago, I had a fair amount saved up, and could easily have purchased a house. However, I chose to rent and start a business instead.

The reasoning was that I could survive on my savings while starting that business. And, if the business failed, I wouldn’t have to sell the house, incurring massive transaction fees, just to put food on the table for my family.

For the things that I wanted to do, “rental + savings” was much more valuable for its flexibility than “illiquid house + no savings”.

(And as a result of that strategy, now we have the house and the savings.)

#62 Milos on 09.29.21 at 4:47 pm

You say that some can’t buy houses anymore. So what if they are sold at the current prices? It sucks to be the ones who got outpriced, but as long as there’s demand (and demand there is), the prices won’t go down. Wait for uncle Trudeau to come up with his new policy changes and we’ll see a further increase in prices.
Did CMHC increase their limit to 1,25M yet? Then just wait for it.

But seriously: you know why people buy RE and don’t invest in the market? Because nobody is going to give a certain John Doe 1M in cash to buy ETFs, or have a balanced portfolio (they did it once in the 1929, didn’t they?)
“Jacked to the tits” in debt isn’t a bad thing anymore, especially when there’s a CMHC behind you and you have to pay the interest on it which is much lower than inflation. It’s a no-brainer!
And yes, my favourite Canadian immigration policy that pours gas on fire even more. Every incoming new Canadian should live somewhere, and this is where having a house makes you rich, smart and safe. It’s all about the demand and supply, and there isn’t much supply in the big cities and it’s gonna be even worse soon.
But generally yes, being a renter gives you freedom of choice… It leaves you a poor shmuck but instead you are a free like a bird… in a freezing Canadian winter lol.

#63 Woke up this morning... on 09.29.21 at 4:50 pm

#56 Ponzius Pilatus
#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

From what I understand, close to 100% of medical doctors and registered nurses in Quebec are vaccinated, such that the 17,000 healthcare workers who are not are mostly clinical workers, PSWs and others who are not as educated with respect to the importance of mass vaccination.
———–
Agree,
Time to rid the health care system of people who don’t understand what healthcare means.
We don’t need “health care” workers who’re just mailing it in.
I’m sure there are lots of compassionate people out there, who understand that being a being a “real” healthcare worker is about compassion and making a difference.
I can’t understand a person who’s supposed to care of sick people, are endangering their patients by not getting vaccinated.
Pretty selfish, if you ask me.

———–
RIGHT ON!

If a stranger is kind enough to want to take care of me in my weakest and most needing time, I demand they be vaccinated or stay the hell away from me – those selfish selfish people.

They risked their lives, health, their own families under the highest stress during the first 12 months, but I’m not banging pots for those selfish inconsiderate people anymore!

Personally, I think we should stop treating them with any consideration and we should pass legislation like NY State in Canada, that any healthcare worker who refuses to get vaccinated and is fired, should have NO ACCESS to unemployment benefits they paid into.

“In a last-ditch effort to convince unvaccinated health care workers to get the shot before the Monday deadline, NY Gov. Kathy Hochul also said the state has issued guidance that would prevent unvaccinated health care workers who are fired to collect unemployment.”

https://wskg.org/news/facing-health-care-workforce-shortage-new-york-governor-preps-emergency-plan/

GET VACCINATED OR LIVE ON THE STREET AND STARVE! AND YOUR CHILDREN SHOULD STARVE TOO!

This is what you all deserve for your service you ex(cess)-health care workers.

YEAH! EXACTLY! YOU TELL’EM! /s

#64 Thew on 09.29.21 at 4:52 pm

As soon as I saw the phrase “Net Owners’ Cost versus Renting” all I could think of what the gobbledygook of invented accounting metrics like WeWork’s: “Community Adjusted EBITDA”

From pg 3 of the actual report, it explains this “net cost” calculation: “…the principal repayment component isn’t really a cost, it is a form of saving (which we often think of as ‘forced saving’).”

The unethical ignoring of the opportunity cost of the down payment (actually growing at ~6+%/yr) is compounded by the delusion that condo fees would remain at $147 /month. In 5 years it’d probably be above $400 and steadily rising.

Yes rent goes up, but so will condo fees and interest rates on the mortgage, plus general inflation: so they will be ignored and I’ll just use their figures provided to make the point.

The rental cost is $2,795 and there is a $705 savings/month instead of owning it. Stick the Down Payment and that $705 /month into a financial calculator for 25 years @ 6% (compounded quarterly) and you’d have $1.39 million. After having spent $838,500 in rent ($2,795 x 25 yrs).

If buying it you would have spent the Down Payment + Mortgage + Tax/Ins/Util/Fees: $1,196,683 ($146,683 + $3,500 x 25 yrs). And you’d have a paint off condo.

I live in an area of North York that was built in the 70s. There’s both apartment buildings and condos here in the neighbourhood, both offer decent sized units (2br: 1,100 sq/f). My purpose built 2br rental is up to ~$1,500 /month now after 5 years of rent increases (+ power & internet: ~$130). Same sized place across the street is a condo for ~$750K. But the crazy thing is the monthly condo fee is $1,050 (it is all inclusive: water, power, heat, even TV/internet) plus $175 property tax.

So I pay $1,630 to rent my box in the sky /month and someone who paid off their almost identical box in the sky still pays $1,225 /month. If they sold it and pocketed $710K from the sale that would generate ~$3K /month in tax efficient dividends @ 5%. As a new tenant next door to me their rent would be $2K today, so ~$800 more than they were paying, but completely paid for by their dividends with lots left over.

#65 Faron on 09.29.21 at 4:53 pm

#56 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 4:29 pm
#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

Yeah, this is extremely disappointing, but I don’t see this as a black and white issue at all. I strongly favour vaccination for everyone especially those in close service sectors. However, medical professionals of all kinds are in very short supply right now both here in Canada and North America as a whole. I think the risks associated with an unvaccinated person spreading COVID (which, I gather, are about as high as for vaxxed people) needs to be balanced against the negative impacts of understaffed hospitals and clinics. A further confounding element is the issue of the education and guidance that medical professionals provide. At this point, medical personnel should be 100% behind vaccination, or at least as aligned as the literature allows (which is highly aligned). If personnel are telling patients to avoid the vaccine, that’s a good argument to can them. In my experience, anti-vaxxers come from a broad spectrum of beliefs, so it’s not guaranteed that they will argue against vax even if not vaxxed themselves.

#66 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 4:54 pm

#39 Flop… on 09.29.21 at 3:07 pm
What do you think the chances are that the first thing the Two Michael’s ordered upon arrival was take-out Chinese food…

M47BC
——————
I bet they had better food in Chinese prison, than you get from the greasy spoons here.
Disgusting.
True Chinese don’t even know what ChowMein, Sweet&Sour Pork and ChopSui is.
Come to Richmond to sample real Chinese food and culture.
And don’t be afraid of the chicken feet.
They are delicious.

#67 Ronaldo on 09.29.21 at 5:04 pm

#53 Ken R on 09.29.21 at 4:01 pm
$60 bucks maintenance monthly on a 733k house?
Hahaha! Good luck.
——————————————————————
Hilarious actually. We have a repairperson coming over next week to check out our built in oven that has quit working. It’s $100 for the callout and $15 per minute after that. I will be sure to have it pulled out of the wall and ready for him at that price. $60.00, lol.

#68 Love_The_Cottage on 09.29.21 at 5:05 pm

Royal LePage? Never ask a barber if you need a haircut.

#69 Lorne on 09.29.21 at 5:07 pm

#39 Flop… on 09.29.21 at 3:07 pm
What do you think the chances are that the first thing the Two Michael’s ordered upon arrival was take-out Chinese food…

M47BC
…….
Slim….although Take out “Chinese Food” in Canada is nothing like real Chinese food. Lived in China for a couple of years.

#70 Ronaldo on 09.29.21 at 5:07 pm

OOps. Should have read $1.50 per minute (90.00 hr).

#71 TurnerNation on 09.29.21 at 5:08 pm

So this is how they will get rid of meat.
It will be a non stop assault in this WW3.
Control over our Feeding, Breeding and Travel/Movements.

https://mullin.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=4949
|By now, you have probably heard about President Biden’s $3.5 trillion “Build Back Better” bill and all the empty promises in it. The truth is that it will do nothing to build our country up. Instead, this is a blank check to take our country into socialism.

This bill will change every American’s way of life. It’s filled with radical policy changes that will raise costs on all goods, put the federal government in charge of educating your kids, prioritize climate policy over national security, breach every American’s privacy, and saddle future generations with debt.

In an attempt to eliminate fossil fuels, this legislation would impose a “fee” on all methane emissions, including in our agriculture industry. We all know that a fee is just a tax and that consumers are the ones who will pay for it. The tax is estimated to cost $6,500 per dairy cow, $2,600 per head of cattle, and $500 per swine each year. That is more than what the animals are worth, it’ll run ranchers out of business. “

#72 WTF on 09.29.21 at 5:10 pm

I shake my head at the lemming like attraction to housing which is at dangerous levels.

I understand young uns drinking the koolaid given they haven’t seen a downturn but a Minsky moment is coming in spite of Lying Real Estate weasels, PM Oblivious and his band of financial incompetents who SHOULD have shown responsibility and maturity instead………….BS is the order of the day.

Here in Van, rental availability is a a multi year high per the meat puppets on the local “news” last nite. Housing prices treading water primarily due to lack of listings.

Wont take much to tip the scales and bad things will happen.

1.4m House (crack shack) loses 10% there goes 140k of Mommy and Daddies Down Payment to Buffy and Chad. But the payments continue.

When the SHTF governments will be impotent. They have already broke the bank. No Mo Money.

What a mess.

#73 Capt. Serious on 09.29.21 at 5:21 pm

Lastly you mentioned that K doesn’t count 7% gains from opp cost in a portfolio but she also doesn’t include the leveraged gains in equity homeowners have traditionally seen.

So, the problem is the traditionally seen part. Tradition for the past 30 years has been declining interest rates. It doesn’t take a PhD to understand that monthly payments are correlated to interest rates and that all other things equal if the monthly hasn’t changed but the price has gone up, people “can afford these prices”.
If one forecasts rates will go negative, please go ahead and continue to leverage into real estate folks. If instead one thinks they’ll be flat, please assume prices will rise at a rate roughly in line with income growth. If one forecasts interest rates will rise, please run to the nearest bar and begin drinking and try not to think about a mountain of mortgage debt.
It’s fine to own a house if it doesn’t bankrupt your finances, but renting is a fine option for many people.

#74 Alpha Dog on 09.29.21 at 5:31 pm

I don’t want to argue with anyones “facts”, I can only judge by my personal experience. In 2005 I sold a house in Toronto (retirement & divorce) and moved to the boonies. Paid cash for a townhouse. The amount of money I saved in rent over 16 years is greater than what I paid for the place. On top of that, the place is worth four time what I paid for it. That’s my experience, your mileage my vary.

Interesting the way alpha dog homeowners feel the need to come here and lord their awesomeness and investing genius over others. Is there a psychologist in the room? – Garth

#75 Joe on 09.29.21 at 5:39 pm

Hi Garth. For the owning section should you factor in appreciation that is tax free equity? At very conservative 3% on the $700K purchase it’s $1.8K monthly in appreciation which is awesome!

#76 HH on 09.29.21 at 5:40 pm

A few decades ago (I’m 74) my parents didn’t like the fact that I didn’t own any real estate. I didn’t like renting but just assumed that I would be a forever renter. Anyway, my parents gave or loaned (not sure what it was) the down payment and voila I’m a home owner. I prefer being a home owner. Maybe it’s the era that I grew up in. I don’t know but it’s interesting that, even back then, parents helped their kids buy property.

Did you repay? – Garth

#77 S.Bby on 09.29.21 at 5:45 pm

Everybody is an investment genius when the market is going up. Reverse it and no so much.

#78 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 5:45 pm

#52 Philco on 09.29.21 at 3:58 pm
Today I agree… its just not a simple buy and go calculation.
2007 I paid cash $235k for a 1975 2400sq 2 car large garage on large prime property.
I gutted and did a complete reno $100k in parts and did it all myself. Hardwood floors, Pluming, electrical, cabinets (solid wood $7k incl counter tops would cost $40k+ today) installed beams that I cut on my saw mill and completely rebuilt 3 bathrooms.
Replacement cost $1.2 mil and I’m not sure what the market is and I couldn’t give a hoot anyway.
My cost to live in it $650mnth.

Sadly My kid cant afford a home today.
Its mind boggling what people pay to buy and live in a home today.
Renting can make sense now it didn’t before.
———

You sound like my kinda dude. I’d have a sawmill too if I owned some forest. Incidentally, my cost to live in my house also in the 600.00 range. It’s cheap living, and a throwback to when Canada was still great. My kids are likely screwed too.

I’m thinking if canucks weren’t 100% convinced that their home would go up every single year, that they might not be willing to dump so much into a stick framed wafer board clad box.

After all, life has so much more to offer like pickups, atv’s, heavy equipment, and salmon fishing boats (and sawmills!).

#79 Sail Away on 09.29.21 at 5:46 pm

#55 Reality Check on 09.29.21 at 4:13 pm

Now you might say I could have kept the house and taken a Heloc and invest that. Totally rational and good thing to do. But honestly how many people do that with their paid off house.

———-

There are some who do the Heloc investment route. I personally have about 30% of a Heloc in a boring plug and chug B&D. The rest waits in reserve for deployment at Armageddon.

It can be risky to invest borrowed money, though, and I’d never recommend it if one doesn’t also have unencumbered semi-liquid assets worth significantly more than the borrowed amount.

#80 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 5:58 pm

Dolce pontificates:

Hard to say if Canada should increase its ICU bed capacity permanently.

If so and for certain, they should have done it in 2020 like Italia did. A lack of foresight.
————-
Italia as a model of efficiency and an example to the world?
Give me a break.
Just watched the documentary “Vendetta”, about the Mafia and corruption in    Bella Italia.
Just boggles the mind how much the Mafia is still running the show.
So I did some research about corruption worldwide, and I found Italia in a bad place, more corrupt than even the bad boy China.
Canada, BTW, ranks 3rd in low corruption, just after Denmark and Germany.

#81 Alpha Dog on 09.29.21 at 6:03 pm

“Interesting the way alpha dog homeowners feel the need to come here and lord their awesomeness and investing genius over others. Is there a psychologist in the room? – Garth”
—————————
One thing you can say about Garth is that even if you go against his main narrative, he will still publish you. A lot of places you’re just deleted. Although I don’t agree with everything, I’ve been a big follower and fan for a long time. Stay strong Garth !!

#82 Re: Nicholas Jardine on 09.29.21 at 6:08 pm

The trick is to start an Urban Handy Man business tailored to all of the equity reinvestment into upgrading the home.

Rising home prices are the golden egg.

#83 leebow on 09.29.21 at 6:12 pm

We are deep in the confirmation bias territory. No reasoning will make anyone change mind.

Look, if you have a few hundred thousand and want to YOLO everything on a meme stock then may be you’ll be better off buying a house. On the other hand, if you can make consistent returns in a B&D then you are better off investing. If you can sell a shack in Toronto and f-off to the Mediterranean for a few years then may be you should. Come back when the dust settles or permafrost melts.

#84 Sail Away on 09.29.21 at 6:13 pm

#161 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 1:22 pm

Tom Oar is a master trapper and a genius in preparing the fur.

He’s using the beaver’s own brain to tan the pelt.

An old native trick.

——–

Sure, the brain tan is an old native trick, but even more a Homo sapiens trick since it’s been used everywhere worldwide since time immemorial.

There’s a saying that every animal has enough brain to tan its own hide. It’s quite easy to do, although takes a lot of working the skin then finishes off with smoke cure for water resistance.

I’ve tanned many different skins this way, and currently have two salted deer skins and the deers’ brains. I only need one for moccasins and would be happy to send the other your way. Let me know. Think how happy your wife would be with a homemade buckskin xmas dirndl!

#85 HH on 09.29.21 at 6:15 pm

#76 – Garth

Does being my parent’s caregiver for eleven years 24 hours a day count for paying it back?

Sounds about right. Pay attention, kiddos. – Garth

#86 Faron on 09.29.21 at 6:24 pm

#80 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 5:58 pm
Dolce pontificates:

Canada, BTW, ranks 3rd in low corruption, just after Denmark and Germany.

Wait wait wait. Even less corrupt than Utopic CZ? Get out! Oh, nevermind. Google-able facts are fake facts unless you use special BillyBob Google. BooBle maybe?

#87 Happy Renter on 09.29.21 at 6:38 pm

Garth, thank you for your great post. I wish more people knew renting is a worthy choice for those who invest their savings wisely.

All my friends and family who pity me and my partner for renting have no clue our portfolio is worth $1.3m.

My partner and I are in our 30s with endless freedom. It’s given me the ability to consider radical career and job changes. My partner has his own business. We eat well, travel well, and pursue hobbies without going into debt. We are planning for a child or two.

The interest alone from our portfolio has far outstripped our rent. Even with no further contributions, our portfolio will be worth over $4m by the time we’re 55 assuming 7% annual returns.

Perhaps my partner and I would have more paper gains if we owned a house. But the freedom we have from renting is priceless and immeasurable.

#88 Stone on 09.29.21 at 6:40 pm

#63 Woke up this morning… on 09.29.21 at 4:50 pm
#56 Ponzius Pilatus
#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

From what I understand, close to 100% of medical doctors and registered nurses in Quebec are vaccinated, such that the 17,000 healthcare workers who are not are mostly clinical workers, PSWs and others who are not as educated with respect to the importance of mass vaccination.
———–
Agree,
Time to rid the health care system of people who don’t understand what healthcare means.
We don’t need “health care” workers who’re just mailing it in.
I’m sure there are lots of compassionate people out there, who understand that being a being a “real” healthcare worker is about compassion and making a difference.
I can’t understand a person who’s supposed to care of sick people, are endangering their patients by not getting vaccinated.
Pretty selfish, if you ask me.

———–
RIGHT ON!

If a stranger is kind enough to want to take care of me in my weakest and most needing time, I demand they be vaccinated or stay the hell away from me – those selfish selfish people.

They risked their lives, health, their own families under the highest stress during the first 12 months, but I’m not banging pots for those selfish inconsiderate people anymore!

Personally, I think we should stop treating them with any consideration and we should pass legislation like NY State in Canada, that any healthcare worker who refuses to get vaccinated and is fired, should have NO ACCESS to unemployment benefits they paid into.

“In a last-ditch effort to convince unvaccinated health care workers to get the shot before the Monday deadline, NY Gov. Kathy Hochul also said the state has issued guidance that would prevent unvaccinated health care workers who are fired to collect unemployment.”

https://wskg.org/news/facing-health-care-workforce-shortage-new-york-governor-preps-emergency-plan/

GET VACCINATED OR LIVE ON THE STREET AND STARVE! AND YOUR CHILDREN SHOULD STARVE TOO!

This is what you all deserve for your service you ex(cess)-health care workers.

YEAH! EXACTLY! YOU TELL’EM! /s

———

Strange thinking. Health care workers are not gods. They are employees who’s accountability is the care of others. That’s it. In order to do that job, they need to get fully vaccinated. In the end, the choice is theirs and theirs alone. Get vaccinated, keep job. Don’t get vaccinated, lose job. There are both positive and negative consequences to choices we make every day and regardless wether people can accept the outcome of their choices, they have to live with them.

No one us taking away their choice. Also, the job they currently have is not an entitlement.

As a potential “customer” of the health care “industry”, those health care “workers” better have their vaccinations in order if I’m going to give them my “business”.

#89 wallflower on 09.29.21 at 6:42 pm

#8 Mark on 09.29.21 at 1:38 pm
Yes. Real estate ‘agents’ have to be the most conflict-of-interest ‘representatives’ of any biz/industry/commercial entity on the planet.

And, these agency rates are now completely off-the-charts unacceptable. They were always disgusting. They are more like mafia/mob territory now.

#90 Rent vs. Own AI Bot on 09.29.21 at 6:45 pm

Garth’s #1 competitor: Real Estate.

I have one of the most sophisticated rent vs. own models on the planet. I was originally inspired to create this after reviewing a somewhat simplistic model published by the Financial Post.

This models covers all situations for any person and works great. However, most people do not have this tool and when building it I realized how much math is involved. In fact, without computing power it is impossible to properly understand a true rent vs. own strategy given all of the personalized variables that you have to consider.

And most people don’t have these tools. And there is little incentive to push them. Capitalism would rather you not know.

Also, the economic variables that you need to plug in, to give you awesome forecasting is still a bit of guess work. Predictive probabilities are great, but never 100%.

Nonetheless, renting on the model will always come out ahead of home ownership for generating wealth if you are a savvy investor AND housing is not hyper-inflating.

And herein lies the problem.

Very few are savvy investors or even have a clue what to do with excess money and housing in Canada is hyper-inflating and have been rising significantly since 2002.

A 30% gain in one year, like in the past year on a property that is basically leveraged to the hilt is a huge gain in wealth. Most owners have jumped $300,000 in equity gains in the past year.

I have seen countless times of divorce proceedings netting someone 300 or 400 thousand for someone middle age and the person is completely frozen in what to do with the money, especially if they live in Vancouver where that does not even cover the down payment, in which most would just simply buy another home and move on. Instead they will maybe upgrade the vehicle and leave the rest sitting in a bank to figure it out at a later date.

I have actually steered a few towards Garth and/or a high net worth investment firm.

Because I am sure that we can all agree on something: holding cash for a significant amount of time is the worst mistake that you will ever make in your life.

If you do not own either a house or financial investments or both, you will be left behind by society.

#91 Dogman01 on 09.29.21 at 6:46 pm

Such macro insights in the comments section yesterday, hence why ideas\concepts need to be shared.

#128 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.29.21 at 8:31 am

PEI: An insular, welfare economy, run by big business and politicians that excel at protecting their little feifdom….Hell, that sounds like our current Canadian federal govt.:)

#140 Spy vs. Spy on 09.29.21 at 10:35 am

Chinese leaders clearly have more power, and the west is irritated by being inferior in this case. And we’re feeling it lately with what is being done and how it is being done.

#135 Philco on 09.29.21 at 9:55 am

What concerns me is that clearly our leaders look at what China can do with immense envy.

I’m starting to see that democracy is but an illusion.

What we have, or maybe even had was freedom of movement and freedom of speech. However, we appear to have surrendered these hard fought for freedoms

China – does what it does in the name of ideals.
West, and specifically US does what it does in the name of capitalism and profit.

—————————————
Canada and “The West”, fiefdoms of an entrenched elite. Liberalism’s Ideals of Democracy, a Free Press, Free Speech, Citizenship, just a veneer to gain consent. With the power of Media, Social Media and surveillance our establishment now realize the ideals of Liberalism can be discarded. They do not need consent any longer they simply need control, Like the Soviet era eastern block population, obedience can be rewarded with privileges. Social non compliance equals privilege revoked. Give up your rights or lose the ability to earn a living. So simple, no laws needed, a Social Credit system much more effective to control than the passing of cumbersome laws.
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-social-credit-system-punishments-and-rewards-explained-2018-4

Our elites are indeed envious of the Chinese system as Corporate capitalism and profit does not require Liberalism.

In WWI a mass citizen army was required to fight off a challenge by another set of Elites, so they needed “buy-in” from the masses and we received 80 years of a thriving “middle class”. Today a mass citizen army is useless against a professional technological force. The Western Elites don’t need a middle class, Liberalism or consent.

You can bet the “climate emergency” is ready to be deployed next to further erode the populations freedoms and prosperity, increasing dependency and their power.

They are jettisoning the middle class.

#92 TheGr8Mattsby on 09.29.21 at 6:48 pm

Amazing the cognitive bias that a 30 year RE bulk market with declining rates can create. Many of these people are heading straight to the financial woodshed.

#93 Bonobo on 09.29.21 at 6:55 pm

Trump is looking real good now…

#94 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 7:01 pm

#6 James on 09.29.21 at 1:33 pm
Gota love those Special Assessments!
My wife and I received one of those baby’s just after we sold our condo. Surprise it was four months after we moved and were having our mail forwarded. Needless to say it was a true surprise to us and the new owners. They were not happy and there was threatening talk of legal action in our sale. Thank God the mode of failure on the building occurred after we had sold and we were not privy to the occurrence. Our real-estate lawyer said go ahead let them try yo sue, no lawyer will take it on. It was a $15,000 SA.
———

This is why condos are for renting, you got lucky!

#95 Linda on 09.29.21 at 7:04 pm

In the owning vs. renting camps I fall into the owner side of things. However, we purchased when house prices were still affordable to folks with average incomes. While we have no plans to sell – the plan is to age in place – we would consider selling if someone offered stupid amounts of $. While I’ve no objections to renting I would want to own again. However I’d not be trying to buy in the most expensive RE areas of Canada. I’d be looking for a serviced lot somewhere affordable & build a place that would be tailor made for senior living. Nor would that place require a ride on vacuum cleaner to keep up with the dust bunnies. That bias regarding renting also seems to apply to small home living. I’m not talking a condo – would never buy one of those though I’d rent one – but a single family home. Seems like when folks do buy a place under 1,500 square feet they want to expand the footprint asap. That might make sense if you have a couple of children but why would a couple or a single need enough space for a family of four+?

#96 Honest Realtor on 09.29.21 at 7:15 pm

Garth, I respectfully agree with you that ALL costs must always be accounted for, in a comparison like this between renting and buying. This includes opportunity costs, of course, such as a down payment that could otherwise be deployed into liquid investments.

But the biggest opportunity cost ahead to avoid may be the next surge in property values. Particularly with the COVID-19 recovery and immigration surge we are about to have.

A 2-3X property valuation increase by about 2035 is virtually certain right now, possible higher. Missing out on that could be very sad.

Imagine a financial advisor saying it was “virtually certain” that an asset would rise 200-300%. This is precisely why your industry cries out for more regulation. – Garth

__________

Garth, how is this different from you and your co-hosts here repeatedly talking about expecting gains of 6-7% from a “B&D portfolio”? (Even more with the divvies, of course)

Do the math – that also equates to nearly 300% gains projected over 15 years.

Are you the Pot or Kettle here calling out the other?

The financial portfolio is diversified, whereas a house is a single asset. The portfolio is balanced, containing low-risk investments and protection against market declines. A house does not. The portfolio holds income-producing assets, while real estate can only provide a capital gain. The 50-year track record for this portfolio is 7%, while the 50-year average returns for residential real estate are sub-3%. And neither I nor my colleagues would ever say a return is “virtually certain.” Nor would we, like you, sell anything that required 20x leverage or collect a commission for doing so. Moral hazard. You guys need a serious spanking. – Garth

#97 Yorkville renter on 09.29.21 at 7:17 pm

I saw that article and laughed at the ‘analysis’ of which none was displayed – only the 91% figure… atleasr you have some if their ‘evidence’

I was going to write the author about the awfully one-sided article but figured- what’s the point?

#98 gfd on 09.29.21 at 7:23 pm

TD Bank 3 year term up by 10 bps, 4 year by 5 bps, 5 year by 30 bps.

TD Bank mortgage rates effective 09/30/21
Term-Rate Change-New 25 Year Amor-New +25 Year Amor New Rentals

6 Month Con – 2.79% 2.89% 2.94%
1 Year Fixed – 2.54% 2.64% 2.69%
2 Year Fixed – 2.24% 2.34% 2.39%
3 Year Fixed ↑10 2.24% 2.34% 2.39%
4 Year Fixed ↑5 2.29% 2.39% 2.44%
5 Year Fixed ↑30 2.29% 2.39% 2.44%
5 Year Fixed High-Ratio ↑30 2.19% – –
6 Year Fixed – 2.84% 2.94% 2.99%
7 Year Fixed – 2.94% 3.04% 3.09%
10 Year Fixed – 3.30% 3.40% 3.45%

#99 Investors are gobbling up homes in Canada's hot housing market on 09.29.21 at 7:24 pm

As per BNN, “The people piling into Canada’s red-hot housing market the fastest already own a home — or in some cases three or four.”

Or in some cases have owned/flipped 42 homes in the past few years like Taleeb Noormohamed who was just re-elected in Vancouver-Granville.

Anyways, my point is that until we take the “investment” out of home ownership nothing will change. Government is lying to you when promising to make housing affordable and no where is this more evident than in the actual market and the rising price of homes that show the confidence in investment into the housing space. And everything the government keeps doing is literally signalling to investors that they have their back and will back stop any losses in housing – and they literally are with things like MBS purchasing. Self-feeding loop. There is so much gravy to be had in Canadian housing that the entire world wants in on it and will ravage it until there is nothing left to squeeze out of it.

The moment “investment” is taken out of housing and is limited to one home per Canadian family, as needed based on population sizes, is the moment housing and the Canadian financial system melts down.

And I have news for you. No government will allow that to happen. So, it doesn’t matter who you vote for.

That is not to say we won’t see comical chaotic write-downs and ups from how complex and precarious the housing market is becoming as it turns into some kind of mutant monster where investors are playing chicken with the government. It is just to say that if a melt down happens it will be by the forces out of government control where they can’t be contained, but the government has a lot of money and reasons to not let this type of disorder occur and therefore never allow affordability to ever return for both owning and renting (which are tied to one another – when prices rise rents soon follow, because it is all investment money and this money needs a return to keep paying the increasing costs, believe that!)

So, renters and new buyers, pay attention to the few remaining affordable areas in Canada that are still good areas to live in and can provide some stability (the Atlantic, cough, cough) and grab your popcorn and enjoy the show. Soon, there will not be anywhere in Canada that is affordable for the up and coming generations who have been left without a home inheritance.

Sorry, but those are the facts for Canada’s future. It is baked in the cake.

#100 Nonplused on 09.29.21 at 7:25 pm

#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

From what I understand, close to 100% of medical doctors and registered nurses in Quebec are vaccinated, such that the 17,000 healthcare workers who are not are mostly clinical workers, PSWs and others who are not as educated with respect to the importance of mass vaccination.

—————————————

Ya I was having this argument with an anti-vaxxer the other day. The headline was something like “3500 medical professionals sign petition against vaccine mandates for hospital workers”. This sort of a headline, while technically factual, can be quite misleading without context.

So let’s see…. There are over 100,000 people working for AHS in Alberta. That makes the “hesitancy rate” something less than 3.5%, compared to about 20% in the general population. And we don’t know who these petitioners are. Are they doctors and nurses? Or orderlies and kitchen staff? The article did not say. I think if you do parking patrol or snow removal at the hospital you can sign the petition. So the hesitancy rate among AHS workers is actually quite low, but you have to do some thinking to sus that out of the headline.

It is not even necessary to have an argument about how well the vaccines work. If you are the head of AHS in the middle of a pandemic and encouraging everyone to get the vax, you simply can’t have unvaccinated zombies floating around your hospitals. Even if you aren’t worried about the patients, what do you do when these 3500 end up in the ICU? But regardless, the precedent has to be established. The hospital is a vaccinated only zone, at least for workers, and patients are highly encouraged as well.

I was in the ER the other day for a stitch and noticed that they were vaccinating incoming patients right then and there. Voluntary of course, but available and encouraged. How could they do this if the nurse tasked with offering and administering the vaccine was herself not vaccinated? Doesn’t anybody but me see the problem here? Anyway I already had 2 doses so all I got was the stitch. They didn’t even use anesthetic! They said they’d have to poke me with the needle more than they were going to with the stitches so just suck it up! Budget cuts I guess.

#101 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.29.21 at 7:26 pm

@#80 Ponzies payola

“Canada, BTW, ranks 3rd in low corruption”

++++

Well if the deals that companies like SNC Lavalin try and pull to avoid criminal convictions are anything to talk about.
Canada is no paragon of virtue.

Toxic waste dumps left in Nevada, Spain, Africa, Asia….. by Canadian companies.

https://news.mongabay.com/2020/07/canada-not-walking-the-walk-on-its-miners-abuses-abroad-campaigners-say/

#102 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 7:33 pm

#67 Ronaldo on 09.29.21 at 5:04 pm
#53 Ken R on 09.29.21 at 4:01 pm
$60 bucks maintenance monthly on a 733k house?
Hahaha! Good luck.
——————————————————————
Hilarious actually. We have a repairperson coming over next week to check out our built in oven that has quit working. It’s $100 for the callout and $15 per minute after that. I will be sure to have it pulled out of the wall and ready for him at that price. $60.00, lol.
————
You gotta be kiddin’ us.
The handy man (plumber) mafia is killing us.
That’s why I say:
Tax them hard and tax them often.

#103 Philco on 09.29.21 at 7:35 pm

#78 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 5:45 pm
You sound like my kinda dude.
—————————————–
LOL
I’ve read your stuff, we are one of the same.
I could have never achieved what I have without being very handy.
Come on out I’ve got a logging truck full of prime clear fir I need cut!
There’s a truck load of cedar and one fire wood also. Hopefully I can tackle that next month.
I find great enjoyment in repairing or improving things.
I can heat my shed with wood NP got all the high efficiency stuff and if we lose power for a month in winter we are good for a couple months.

Now I’ve got a lot of rolling stock but older stuff that you can actually repair if it ever breaks. Backhoes, skidsteer, Duramax, Tundra, RVs ect.14 properties 25,000 sq ft of office space and condos.
I’ve got a theory and its worked well. So say you could buy a new Case 580SM newer ver. for say $150k or buy one older like my 2008 580SM Super for $38,500 ( took a year to find a deal) and go through it and now its mint.
I put 400hr x $120 = $48,000 equiv. to hire a guy. 5 years later its worth near $60,000. so its now working for free for me. Its an investment to me and a good one.

Its a full time job keeping it all polished up but keeps me outa trouble for the most part.
I just tell everyone I’m a repair guy. Good old sweat equity…You can go to work and toss half to the Gov or do it yourself and keep the tax money…

Boy your right KEEP YOUR OP cost down. Increase cash flow. You can get through a pretty good shit storm when your self sufficient.

My only concern now is how much stuff the gov wants me to give others that never earned it…..thats where we are going.

#104 under the radar on 09.29.21 at 7:38 pm

No shame in renting, no badge of honor being an owner . I have a tenant who is an Actuary who owns all the FAANG stocks. He pays about 2k a month in rent in a midtown Toronto building. His net worth is several million. He is not 50 yet. He is a disciplined investor and a very good tenant who could pick up and leave with 60 days notice.

On the other hand, owning real estate over time has made a lot of average people look smart and feel secure as their equity has gone to the moon.

#105 MellySchu on 09.29.21 at 7:39 pm

My husband and I have been renting for almost 20 years, from the Beaches to High Park in Toronto, and then from Whistler, Squampton, and now our home of 5 years in North Vancouver, BC. Finding a place that accepts a dog was the most difficult, but we love renting. We have chosen to be renters like we have chosen to be child-free, and yet we continue to get those “ewww” looks from family, friends and folks at work. On sunny days we ride our bikes while landlords cut their lawns, worry about their big hedges, and invest our savings like you tell us Gartho. To our european families we haven’t succeeded with no house and no kids; and yet we smile, nod, and walk away with a smirk on our face as we plan our next adventure in life knowing we let our liquid money do the work. Bravo to the renters by choice, and shame onto the homeowners who think they are better because they “own” some walls… we all end up in the same place in the end, and I prefer not to be apart of the FOMO game

#106 espressobob on 09.29.21 at 7:47 pm

So owners are superior to my lifestyle as a renter. Somehow, I don’t see it?

Was the decision to be financially responsible and load up those registered accounts, inferior to those who bought real estate?

While I enjoy all the activities in life, and trust me when I tell you how satisfying that is, while many that own so much, are so miserable?

#107 Quintilian on 09.29.21 at 7:54 pm

Karen and Will are merchants of lies.

In most jurisdictions there are variations of the Mental Health Act. Its purpose is to protect those afflicted with mental disorders as well as those who may be hurt by those with mental illness.

In a jurisdiction ruled by Quintilian there would also be the Integrity and Ethics Act. Its purpose would be to protect the public from people who suffer from a conscience deficiency.

The Integrity and Ethics Act would allow law enforcement to apprehend the Karens and Wills and bring them to institutions where they would be rehabilitated through teachings such as those of Jesus, Plato, Gandhi, Kierkegaard etc.

#108 Ian from Oshawa on 09.29.21 at 8:27 pm

Wow! Thanks for sharing the picture of our little guy. He really is part of the family. Loved the blog too! We’ve stuffed away about $150,000 in TFSA’s and we might find ourselves having to choose between renting or buying in a year. I’d rather pay rent and let the TFSA’s grow than hang a $1,500,000 anchor around my family’s neck.

Thanks again for all you do.

Very glad to be able to read your thoughts daily.

Always a great finish to my day.

#109 Wrong on 09.29.21 at 8:33 pm

This calculator seems better https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/upshot/buy-rent-calculator.html
The calculation shown in the article also seems to forget the 146k put as downpayment. But then again, it is complete nonsense anyway.
But you don’t need a fancy calculator to figure out renting versus owning when the house prices are going up 20% per year. Buying definitely won versus renting over the last 30 years in the Canadian housing market. And you don’t need to be a savvy investor to buy a house.
However, these days when you are in uncharted territory when even the CMHC started seeing a high risk of correction and when the housing costs eat up every last of your dollars, nobody really knows. The government will do its best to avoid a correction, but will they succeed? Non linear forces are supposed to be at play after all.

#110 VladTor on 09.29.21 at 8:43 pm

This table is lies for fools! And this lie coming from very lovely girl! Sad!

Look:

See line #2 – Renting utilities = $280!!!! Can you show me 1-2 bedroom appt. with utilities = $280. Twice less at least. Utilities for rent mean only hydro.

Line #16 – condo fee -$147. Yes, you can find this in small cities like Chatham in ON, where max price for 2 bdrm. = $150000 even now. In Toronto condo fee $147???? Ridiculous!

This booklet showing what banks really thinking about they customers.

#111 FriedEggs on 09.29.21 at 8:47 pm

If 1 in 5,000,000,000 is rare.

What is 1 in 5,000?

First 75%, then 90%, now >95%, do i hear 100?

#112 yvr_lurker on 09.29.21 at 8:51 pm

Generally, I am left of center, but try to be relatively balanced. Blew a gasket today at the absolute leftist nutbars running city hall in Vancouver who are recommending that city council adopt the proposal to make permit parking EVERYWHERE in the city of vancouver, charging $43 a year, nightly charges for visitors who park on the street in front of your house, and an extra $800-1000 per year to park a 2023 gasoline car in front of your own home. Currently, about 10% of the city is permit parking due to overcrowding, and this is reasonable. However, the vast majority of city streets (Dunbar, East Van, parts of KITS) etc, there is no problem with finding a place to park on your street. When my relatives come and visit and stay the night am I supposed to buy an overnight parking pass for them to park in front of my house where there are ample spaces? Insane.

We have two cars, with the second one being used very infrequently but important if I have to take the kid to soccer or get groceries when my wife is away… 5K in miles a year at most…. The argument put forth is that cars parked on the street are major polluters, and we need to get rid of as many as possible. Nobody has the brains to ask how many miles your car does in a year. I have a large craftsman style house in KITS, which unfortunately has no driveway or garage to avoid this. Paying property taxes that escalated 12% last year, and for sure this year will be another huge hike.

If City council approves this in a vote, one can be guaranteed it will be a huge new revenue source for the city, with rates rising 20% per year each and every year as people succumb to this way of seeing the world…. Then, driving my kid from our home in KITS to Cypress for skiing and passing through downtown without stopping will be another extra green charge going forward… am I supposed to take a huge detour to avoid downtown and take the other bridge burning lots of gas in the process….

There is a public forum on this in October and I will be going for sure to voice my displeasure. Everyone (and I mean everyone) on city council who votes for this will NOT get my vote for city elections. Many of my my neighbours think likewise.

#113 Christopher Boehmer on 09.29.21 at 8:59 pm

Last time I checked buildings depreciate and I think the rate is around 4% a year so on $500,000 for example of building value that would be $20,000 the first year expense. Duh…examples of capital items; windows, furnace, water heater, exterior siding, interior renos, etc… renters are way way ahead trust me I own a house it’s expensive!!

#114 Doug t on 09.29.21 at 9:36 pm

GAWD people like her nauseate me – she must drink the koolaid every single day in order to spew the rhetoric that flows from her mouth

#115 Steven on 09.29.21 at 9:38 pm

#112 YVR_Lurker
Permit Parking Everywhere
—————————————–
City Hall is trying to slide it in as a “climate” based plan to cut greenhouse gas. Meanwhile I notice mostly single family homes right next to Canada Line Stations. If they were serious, they would densify around transit hubs so people wouldn’t need to own a car just to get downtown. This proposed permit fee to park in front of your own house is nothing but a tax grab disguised as a climate change initiative.

#116 Drinking on 09.29.21 at 9:43 pm

Hmm, that is the problem, too many Karen’s (meaning youngsters in that age group) that do not do their home work. Live and learn I guess!

#117 Do we have all the facts on 09.29.21 at 9:44 pm

Leverage is a two way street. When the price of an asset purchased with leverage is going up the rate of return on equity invested is hard to beat.

However when the price of an asset purchased with leverage is going down not only can 100% of the equity invested be lost but the investor can be saddled with long term debt that has to be repaid.

You can hold on to stocks that are declining in value and wait for value to return. The only risk is the loss of all, or a portion, of the equity invested.

In the recent past borrowing a much as 95% of the price of an overvalued home has resulted in serious economic hardship as costs associated with home ownership begin to escalate.

Unlike a balanced investment portfolio there is no way to hedge against a decline in the value of a home. Adding to the risk is the possibility that the interest rate applied to leveraged funds and the costs of home ownership could increase after all equity has been erased. At some point waiting for home prices to recover to former levels could become impossible. It does happen.

The simple fact is that household incomes are not keeping up with the rapidly rising prices of homes and facilitating the continued use of leverage to purchase overvalued assets does not seem prudent at this point in time.

When the rate of return on an investment looks to good to be true it probably is.

Caveat Empty!!

#118 yvr_lurker on 09.29.21 at 9:56 pm

#115 Steven

City Hall is trying to slide it in as a “climate” based plan to cut greenhouse gas. Meanwhile I notice mostly single family homes right next to Canada Line Stations. If they were serious, they would densify around transit hubs so people wouldn’t need to own a car just to get downtown. This proposed permit fee to park in front of your own house is nothing but a tax grab disguised as a climate change initiative.
——–

Exactly. Couuched in the language of “Green”, but in reality is nothing other than a HUGE tax grab. This proposal is not a small tweak of the status quo, it is a radical switch. Densify near transit hubs is a natural idea that needs to be pushed as you say.

If those nutbars vote this in, I will start a blog with the names of those city counsellors who voted it in and shop it around. This should help everyone’s memory when it comes time who to vote for in the next city election (i.e. not them).

#119 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.29.21 at 9:56 pm

@#102 Ponzies Plugged Plumber Phantacies
“The handy man (plumber) mafia is killing us.
That’s why I say:
Tax them hard and tax them often.”

++++

Excellent tradesmen earn every coin they charge and are in such high demand by the “younger generation” that dont own any tools or have one iota of how to use them…..

If you’re too lazy to read a manual or watch a youtube video…..prepare to pay and pay and pay.
I fixed my tv a few years back by watching a half assed youtube video of a tv repair guy in Miami…..figured the rest out, myself….

Taxes?
Pffft.
I pay my taxes…do you?
I’ve even had off duty Canada Customs people offer me cash to do work for them…….
“Sorry, I dont work for cash”.

Like I’d trust those govt guys.
:)

#120 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.29.21 at 9:58 pm

#112 yvr_lurker on 09.29.21 at 8:51 pm
It’s a good time to wean yourself off “The Automobile”.
The city of the future is car less, NO Parking.
Get used to it.
Start small, get a bike, shop locally, use Uber when a car is really needed, walk, take transit.
Do the math.
You’ll save lots of money.

#121 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.29.21 at 10:01 pm

Speaking of workers.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/09/28/fact-check-cargo-ships-off-california-coast-dont-number-thousands/5797859001/

It appears that the lack of Truckers has caused a huge back log of containers.
Get ready for shortages and high prices…

Everywhere.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/u-k-readies-soldiers-to-help-ease-gas-shortages-at-pumps-1.5601622

Inflation, interest rates, insanity…..

#122 Wrk.dover on 09.29.21 at 10:10 pm

That dog looks like the Easter Bunny!

He chases rabbits thinking they are the girls of his breed, I’m thinking.

#123 VladTor on 09.29.21 at 10:11 pm

to #37 Nicholas Jardine on 09.29.21 at 3:00 pm

…. I just don’t see how there is any possible way I could have made $300k in 4yrs

**********

You didn’t make this money yet …. until you will sell your house. You should understand that 300k just on paper. You never know how much will cost house to the time when you sell it. With current economical situation around the world and particularly in Canada I’m not sure that you will be a winner. In US in 2008 millions was optimistic like you too but if you compare situation then and now …. I would recommend you sell house immediately. For profit 300K you can rent and live in good apartment at least 10 years.

Too much money was printed irresponsible governments . Black swan is on horizon!

#124 Inadequate on 09.29.21 at 10:21 pm

Rent versus Buy is really a financial and lifestyle choice. We have about 1.5m in asset (no inheritance yet) and zero real estate. Being a renter for the last 15 years. We are going back to get some real estate and will take out the max mortgage allowed. Reason is quite simple, our ETF investment is making about 3 times the would be mortgage rate. Yes, I see a dog in our future.

#125 DON on 09.29.21 at 10:21 pm

IdealAgent.com in the US will sell houses for 2% fee.

Contagion to Canada?

#126 Shawn Allen on 09.29.21 at 10:31 pm

Socialits live among us

from number 99 above:

“The moment “investment” is taken out of housing and is limited to one home per Canadian family, as needed based on population sizes, is the moment housing and the Canadian financial system melts down.”

******************
When you can’t compete and make it in life ask Mommy or the government to fix it for you. Sad.

Luckily the above scenario this commenter asked for at 99 will never happen.

#127 Not Fooled on 09.29.21 at 11:07 pm

#102 Petulant Pomposity on 09.29.21 at 7:33 pm
#67 Ronaldo on 09.29.21 at 5:04 pm
#53 Ken R on 09.29.21 at 4:01 pm
$60 bucks maintenance monthly on a 733k house?
Hahaha! Good luck.
——————————————————————
Hilarious actually. We have a repairperson coming over next week to check out our built in oven that has quit working. It’s $100 for the callout and $15 per minute after that. I will be sure to have it pulled out of the wall and ready for him at that price. $60.00, lol.
————
You gotta be kiddin’ us.
The handy man (plumber) mafia is killing us.
That’s why I say:
Tax them hard and tax them often.

***********
PP:
Completed my TQ at 25, built my first house during the same time. Went on to a different career but renovated the second house myself. Except for electrical panel upgrade and gas work. I’m not crazy.

Sold the renovated YVR 2nd house in 2017 at peak. Thanks to my trades training and experience, I made an extra $350k and lived there for free. Retired at 51.

Quit trying to impress people who think they’re better than you by crapping on people you mistakenly feel superior to.

You can find a step ladder and kiss my rosy Red Seal.

#128 vatodeth on 09.29.21 at 11:18 pm

American policy will pressure Canada into popping the bubble. China is dealing with real estate and energy issues. Euro zone is dealing with energy issues. Crooked supply chains are facing more challenges.

2022 is going to be a rollercoaster. Expect a lot of volatility and opportunity.

#129 yvr_lurker on 09.29.21 at 11:20 pm

#120 Ponzius
It’s a good time to wean yourself off “The Automobile”.
The city of the future is car less, NO Parking.
Get used to it.
Start small, get a bike, shop locally, use Uber when a car is really needed, walk, take transit.
Do the math.
—————

Good idea. I will tell my 85 year old step-dad to take my 84 year old mother on a tandem bike from New West to KITS the next time they come visit for the day. Both in decent health and there is a new/improved bike path near Burnaby Lake. Sorry, but give your head a shake please. Even Andy Yan, who I completely respect for his views on the housing issue, was on Global TV tonight saying it is not a good plan. Will vote accordingly when the city elections come.
You’ll save lots of money.

#130 The Awakened One on 09.29.21 at 11:31 pm

#76 HH –

Does being my parent’s caregiver for eleven years 24 hours a day count for paying it back?

Sounds about right. Pay attention, kiddos. – Garth
——-

LMAO. Hahaha… great comments Garth! Wow, so this is how kids siphoned their parents’ loan to get a down payment eh? Such great cancelling math man! Mama must be proud!

HH: yo man, I rent, with freedom and a light conscience (and some ETFs), and no fubar calculus involved here with my Mama. Yo got kids? Watch karma.

#131 TrueLies on 09.30.21 at 12:34 am

#63 – GET VACCINATED OR LIVE ON THE STREET AND STARVE! AND YOUR CHILDREN SHOULD STARVE TOO!

Hate speech Garth. Remove or face risk of being reported to Human Rights Tribunal

#132 David Greene on 09.30.21 at 12:58 am

Garth:

You talk a lot about how ageism is the last socially acceptable prejudice. You describe being upset at the divisive politics nowadays.

And then you allow this on your blog.

Just wondering how you reconcile all that?

#63 Woke up this morning… on 09.29.21 at 4:50 pm

#56 Ponzius Pilatus
#36 Sara on 09.29.21 at 2:59 pm
#10 Turner Nation

“.More than 17,000 Quebec health-care workers face suspension for refusing COVID-19 vaccine (cbc.ca)
==================

Good.

———–
Agree,
Pretty selfish, if you ask me.

———–
RIGHT ON!

Personally, I think we should stop treating them with any consideration and we should pass legislation like NY State in Canada, that any healthcare worker who refuses to get vaccinated and is fired, should have NO ACCESS to unemployment benefits they paid into.

GET VACCINATED OR LIVE ON THE STREET AND STARVE! AND YOUR CHILDREN SHOULD STARVE TOO!

This is what you all deserve for your service you ex(cess)-health care workers.

YEAH! EXACTLY! YOU TELL’EM! /s

#133 Jack Frost on 09.30.21 at 1:35 am

While the Government is limited in what they can do to tame our housing market, for starters, they could limit the Capital Gains Exemption on your Principal Residence to…

– Only once in a person’s lifetime.
or…
– To those with only one property. (but, you can claim it as many times as you like, as long as it’s the ONLY property you own at that time, Sorry real estate speculators, investors and slumlords don’t get it).

But limit it to something other than “to ANY and ALL of the MANY properties you own” which is essentially what the CRA do now, because it’s reported on the “honor” system. LOL!

The CRA, the BoC our banks, realtors, investors and speculators are all complicate in our out of control housing market. Which one day soon, will come to a very ugly end.

#134 Al on 09.30.21 at 1:54 am

Gotta love fake math.

#135 under the radar on 09.30.21 at 4:41 am

Single asset- Sure it is, its also a place you come home to everyday without fear of being evicted or having to deal with a nasty landlord. Or having to endure, the sound of jack hammers and trades fixing balconies for 3 months or , your neighbor’s cooking .

Although when I see sardine can homes in crammed subdivisions or downtown 16 ft homes and what people pay and the mortgages they carry just to “own” a narrow strip of dirt and then be stuck with a guy raising chickens next door , makes me wonder why.

#136 Woke up this morning... on 09.30.21 at 7:11 am

#131 TrueLies

#63 – GET VACCINATED OR LIVE ON THE STREET AND STARVE! AND YOUR CHILDREN SHOULD STARVE TOO!

Hate speech Garth. Remove or face risk of being reported to Human Rights Tribunal

——

Forcing people to do something to their bodies at the cost of not being able to provide for themselves or their families is a human rights violation?

You know, you maybe onto something here.

Wonder if there are any options?

Wonder if science has confirmed beyond any doubt that vaccinated can spread Covid and are just as contagious with same viral loads as unvaccinated?

Then I wonder how much difference it makes to the patients the vaccinated worker cares for vs. an unvaccinated one?

Then I stop and reflect how thankful I am for all healthcare workers, vaccinated or not, for doing what they do. Choosing to. Walking up every morning to do it. I wonder if I‘m being thankful enough infact.

You know…just random science and logic questions.

#137 Woke up this morning... on 09.30.21 at 7:17 am

#132 David Greene

Maybe reread what I wrote in #63 again? This time perhaps out loud to yourself?

Not meaning to be rude but you did miss just a little something that I thought was obvious.

#138 Woke up this morning... on 09.30.21 at 7:31 am

Fascinating parallels are clear to me between healthcare workers and military people.

We seem to be very eager for them to do the heard lifting and sacrifice, and then we discard them when no longer needed for one excuse or another without much thoight

#139 Steven Rowlandson on 09.30.21 at 7:40 am

The real estate market and fans for must think that anyone with a job is made of money. Well they are wrong. There are plenty of people in Canada working at market wage rates which is minimum wage+/- a few dollars at variable hours that can never ever live in Canada no matter what their savings are if any and no matter where they work. It really is true and that simple.

#140 the Jaguar on 09.30.21 at 7:57 am

Perseverance isn’t just a Mars Rover :

“A long-delayed Enbridge Inc. pipeline extending from Canada’s oilsands to the U.S. Midwest will enter service Friday after years of opposition from environmentalists and Indigenous groups.

The company said its Line 3 replacement project, which will nearly double the capacity of the older line, is substantially completed.

Enbridge will begin filling the line with crude Friday. Once that that’s done, oil should begin to move to U.S. refineries. The pipeline is expected to be fully operational in mid-october.”

#141 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.30.21 at 8:07 am

@#131 Lies
“Hate speech Garth. Remove or face risk of being reported to Human Rights Tribunal”

++++

When the last person to speak their mind is silenced by the Human “rights” Kangaroo Court……will the Communist Chinese Army walk in without a shot being fired?

#142 the Jaguar on 09.30.21 at 8:12 am

NP Snippets from excellent article Terence Corcoran:

“Jeff Currie, global head of commodities research at Goldman Sachs Group Inc. in an interview with Bloomberg TV: “This is the first inning of a multi-year, potentially decade-long commodity supercycle. It’s driven by the war on climate change, the war on income inequality. All of these dynamics lead to a structural rise in commodity demand against this whole idea of the revenge of the old economy.”

“Fred Hahn, president of CUPE Ontario, said he worries “that pension funds will be unable to pay the full pensions of thousands of dedicated municipal workers when they retire.” But it may be that fossil fuels offer the best investment opportunity to fund pensioners. Oil and gas look a lot more promising than the pension funds’ high-fashion investments in China, which lost $2.7 billion in recent months.”

#143 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.30.21 at 8:17 am

@#123 yvr lurker
” Everyone (and I mean everyone) on city council who votes for this will NOT get my vote for city elections. Many of my my neighbours think likewise.”

++++

But the elected people in Vancouver Parks board, School trustees and City Clowncil dont care what voters think.( yes Canada in BC we elect our Parks board members who then receive a free Parks pass for Life).

Van City Clowncil is a stepping stone to Provincial or Federal politics ( unless you’re Mayor Kennedy Stewrat and move in the opposite direction).

Get ready for more enviro fees, higher property taxes, higher garbage, water, sewer fees….because……you’re the greedy, house owning, enemy (insert rich here).

#144 RE_Investor on 09.30.21 at 8:48 am

#96 Honest Realtor on 09.29.21 at 7:15 pm
…The portfolio is balanced, containing low-risk investments and protection against market declines. A house does not….

If the goal is long term investment, then both strategies return nicely. As a RE Investor with +ve cash flow and also mortgage free, I never consider paper gains on my investments. If an investment doesn’t pay you monthly to keep your nest egg growing, then exit it or never get into it. If a principle residence is required to grow your family and to have roots in a community, then really only think very long term. Sure circumstances could change, but you can’t predict the future, so never regret your present decision.

Good luck everyone, and be nice to each other.

#145 crowdedelevatorfartz on 09.30.21 at 9:41 am

@#131 True Lies

This is what should keep the Human “Rights” Kangaroo Court busy…. for the next 50 years.

https://www.citynews1130.com/2021/09/28/bc-human-rights-complaints-covid-19/

#146 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 9:47 am

#103 Philco on 09.29.21 at 7:35 pm
#78 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 5:45 pm
You sound like my kinda dude.
—————————————–
LOL
I’ve read your stuff, we are one of the same.
I could have never achieved what I have without being very handy.
____

I’ve found I don’t take on too many big projects without spending at least a little time thinking about what equipment I might get for the job to make it much easier, and where else I might put it to work. I may even MAKE work for it :).

This year I bought a mint old BOSCH demolition hammer in the OEM still shiny steel case. On deck is a good industrial quality pressure washer and a gas engine plate compactor. I have multiple uses over years for both of these. I have a pretty good stash of cool old tools – some go back to the 40’s.

I have a little more work left for my Crawlers, and after that the girls will do more sitting than digging. So on the block they’ll go. Except the small one, it’s got wet steering clutches allowing it to sit – and its light enough to trailer behind a 3/4 ton. So easy to own, work on, and operate. No electronics, geared drive, early 50’s technology.

I am looking at downsizing though, Too much stuff! The New Canada will be a good place to keep things simple and low cost. I just need enough room to house that perfect Oliver OC-46 loader restoration project when it comes along :)

#147 millmech on 09.30.21 at 10:00 am

#127
He is technically right, we do get taxed hard since most of the trades I know are approaching 200k/year. I look at my co worker who works part time for a maintenance company ( to get experience in different plants) and he is already at 78k. He works around 16-24 hrs a week and makes this on top of what he makes working at our plant.
He has a project lined up for this weekend and it is two long shifts and asked me to to come aboard for an easy 2k he said, just might take him up on it. It would be nice to pick and chose work 2-3 days a week and make 80k to supplement the pension plan I guess.

#148 Nonno Nicola on 09.30.21 at 10:20 am

#48 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 3:51 pm

This is all new math, because we now live in the New Canada.But that Canada died in 2020 with an insurmountable pile of debt, and ho-hum metro homes that cost more than a 1000 year old Italian mansion nestled in the mountains. Today we have the new math, to go along with the new Canada.
—————————————————————-

Well it’s no mansion but a Tuscan village home for under $100k Canadian…

http://villatua.com/search_under100k.htm?sm%5Bp1%5D%5Baction%5D=content&sm%5Bp1%5D%5Bcategory%5D=&sm%5Bp1%5D%5Bcntid%5D=1668&Type=&Area=Bagni+di+Lucca+area&#results

#149 Philco on 09.30.21 at 10:29 am

#91 Dogman01 on 09.29.21 at 6:46 pm
———–
2 Thumbs up Dog.
I think the doors getting slammed on your rights and freedoms. Im a little uper crust part farm boy red neck.

#91 Dogman01 on 09.29.21 at 6:46 pm
——
I here ya , its a keep it simple world for me and I’m on the fence about expanding…
Internal fight going on lol.
Make more money?…why I guess? Ill be a bigger target and my tax rate goes up.
Like you said….you dont need to make tons of money to be happy…keep the overhead down. Have more boy hobbies that you enjoy.

Also the ever creeking stuff thats flying around our there.
“Youll be happy and own nothing” maybe lol but then your a slave. I wasn’t on board with this but now I see more signs that that is the plan.
Some of the most thick conspiracy theories have truth to them. I think we need to pay attention now.

On another note…you can see the issues of the day out there. China’s aggresions are disturbing.
AUZ 60Min
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kA2KaEKs1LA

Piece out Bro

#150 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 10:29 am

#95 Linda on 09.29.21 at 7:04 pm
In the owning vs. renting camps I fall into the owner side of things. However, we purchased when house prices were still affordable to folks with average incomes. While we have no plans to sell – the plan is to age in place – we would consider selling if someone offered stupid amounts of $. While I’ve no objections to renting I would want to own again. However I’d not be trying to buy in the most expensive RE areas of Canada. I’d be looking for a serviced lot somewhere affordable & build a place that would be tailor made for senior living. Nor would that place require a ride on vacuum cleaner to keep up with the dust bunnies. That bias regarding renting also seems to apply to small home living. I’m not talking a condo – would never buy one of those though I’d rent one – but a single family home. Seems like when folks do buy a place under 1,500 square feet they want to expand the footprint asap. That might make sense if you have a couple of children but why would a couple or a single need enough space for a family of four+?
____

Same thing here. Like the idea of owning, but not a freaking big house and giant yard during retirement. There’s not a single house on our local MLS that I’d consider selling out for that doesn’t cost at least 900K – and they’re all way too big. And I’m not shelling out 8-900K to downsize either!

Maybe a small (1200 sf or less) efficient low maintenance house on an acre with a decent shop/garage isn’t a money maker? You’d think a lot of folks would love it. Cheaper to buy and own, just what we need in Canada for old and young alike.

So far it looks like we’re in the same boat – we’d have to build it ourselves.

#151 Big Rod on 09.30.21 at 10:51 am

And Trudeau thought he could just waltz across the border and steal market share from established US companies?

https://financialpost.com/commodities/energy/renewables/renewable-energy-powerhouses-plan-to-light-up-u-s-northeast-encounters-opposition-from-local-groups-fossil-fuel-rivals

Quebec has no leverage outside the confines of the PMO. Money loser James Bay and the great Muscrat debacle , coupled with Ontario’s collapsing power grid, will cost Canadians hundreds of billions every year. How will Canadian consumers put food on the table now that Energy Poverty is turning into Energy Starvation?

#152 Yukon Elvis on 09.30.21 at 11:00 am

Never mind the dog, beware of owner.

https://youtu.be/b6lYT0vILfo

#153 Philco on 09.30.21 at 11:11 am

Turner Nation
My engineering buddy fully on board with you.
He sent me this this morning.

Energy crisis, rolling blackouts in China could disrupt global supply chain – The Globe and Mail
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-energy-crisis-rolling-blackouts-in-china-could-disrupt-global-supply/

Next step. Create global energy crisis to push the green agenda and 2030 global reset. The Commies are just getting started.

Posthaste: Food-price shocked Canadians are voting with their feet — and eating less meat | Financial Post
https://financialpost.com/executive/executive-summary/posthaste-food-price-shocked-canadians-are-voting-with-their-feet-and-eating-less-meat

They only want the elitists eating meat. Bug protein for the peons.
—————–
I’m starting to think hes correct.
I see food as an issue more and more.
I just bought a side of beef from my buddy :-)

#154 Doug t on 09.30.21 at 11:15 am

#131 true flies

Haha cute

#155 Philco on 09.30.21 at 11:24 am

#48 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 3:51 pm
Ho-hum metro homes that cost more than a 1000 year old Italian mansion nestled in the mountains. Today we have the new math, to go along with the new Canada.
——————————–
Yes their built out of OSB crap.
Glue lames.. ok but sawdust board. Not fir anymore.
No copper plumbing and plastic pex
Faucets 90% plastic.
Appliances made as thin as possible.

Just go build a real home with quality products and you would have a jammer.

#156 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:24 am

Yesterday was the 40th anniversary of the first TGV bullet train leaving Paris for Lyon.
This revolutionized train travel in France and beyond, cutting most travel times by 50%.
This trend, unfortunately, never caught on in North America, thanks to the intense lobbying of the fossil energy barons, notably the Koch Brothers.
We may come to regret it, soon.

#157 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 11:27 am

#148 Nonno Nicola on 09.30.21 at 10:20 am

Well it’s no mansion but a Tuscan village home for under $100k Canadian…
___

Heh, if you put 20% down and get a 2.0% mortgage, that’s a 340.00 monthly payment lol!

Buy it with half your CPP cheque – live over there for the Winter. I can’t even buy an empty building lot for that price.

#158 Peter on 09.30.21 at 11:27 am

One point to consider is that your primary residence is tax free when you sell it. That beats owning.

#159 SP on 09.30.21 at 11:29 am

No, this is not about the vaxed and the unvaccinated. We’re talkin’ renters and owners.

————-
Good thing they haven’t made home ownership MANDATORY.

#160 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:32 am

#129
No need to get worked up.
I said start slowly, one step at a time.
That’s the problem with people, can’t see beyond their noses.

#161 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:47 am

160 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:32 am
#129
No need to get worked up.
I said start slowly, one step at a time.
That’s the problem with people, can’t see beyond their noses.
————————
Furthermore,
I have relatives in HongKong, who have school aged children, and elderly to look after.
None of them has a car.
I don’t even think they have a drivers licences.
And yes, they could afford cars if they wanted.

#162 KLNR on 09.30.21 at 12:00 pm

@#105 MellySchu on 09.29.21 at 7:39 pm
My husband and I have been renting for almost 20 years, from the Beaches to High Park in Toronto, and then from Whistler, Squampton, and now our home of 5 years in North Vancouver, BC. Finding a place that accepts a dog was the most difficult, but we love renting. We have chosen to be renters like we have chosen to be child-free, and yet we continue to get those “ewww” looks from family, friends and folks at work. On sunny days we ride our bikes while landlords cut their lawns, worry about their big hedges, and invest our savings like you tell us Gartho. To our european families we haven’t succeeded with no house and no kids; and yet we smile, nod, and walk away with a smirk on our face as we plan our next adventure in life knowing we let our liquid money do the work. Bravo to the renters by choice, and shame onto the homeowners who think they are better because they “own” some walls… we all end up in the same place in the end, and I prefer not to be apart of the FOMO game

smug is to the renter what arrogant is to the home owner apparently :)

world would be a better place without all the bluster and judgement.

#163 Sail Away on 09.30.21 at 12:17 pm

#150 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 10:29 am

Maybe a small (1200 sf or less) efficient low maintenance house on an acre with a decent shop/garage isn’t a money maker? You’d think a lot of folks would love it. Cheaper to buy and own, just what we need in Canada for old and young alike.

So far it looks like we’re in the same boat – we’d have to build it ourselves.

———-

Yep, a small well-built house. If new build, concrete ICF or similar with metal roof is super efficient and eliminates a lot of common maintenance issues:

https://www.foxblocks.com/blog/icf-tiny-house

#164 facts on 09.30.21 at 12:21 pm

#89 Steve French on 09.28.21 at 7:58 pm
#27 Facts, #36 East Berlin:

You are an idiot (and I assume you are the same ten cent troll).

International Crisis Group is a highly reputable research organisation that aims to help address and ameliorate conflict situations around the world.

All their reports are publicly available.

Have you ever read one? They are excellent and highly informative.

https://www.crisisgroup.org

Former Foreign Minister of Australia Gareth Evans led the Crisis Group for many years.

“The International Crisis Group is an independent organisation working to prevent wars and shape policies that will build a more peaceful world.”

Have a look at their Board of Directors:
https://www.crisisgroup.org/who-we-are/board

These people have more talent and achievements in the tip of their little pinky, than you will ever encounter in your entire life.

So slither back into the slimy hole you came from.

Steve, who knows what you have in your little pinky, but $USD25K donation could get you too an international advisory board membership at this outstanding research organization. Imagine the possibilities, you can also advise us from first hand experience about all the conflict situations around the world you guys at the ICD have managed to ameliorate.
Looking forward to your 2 cents.

#165 DON on 09.30.21 at 12:22 pm

#155 Philco on 09.30.21 at 11:24 am
#48 IHCTD9 on 09.29.21 at 3:51 pm
Ho-hum metro homes that cost more than a 1000 year old Italian mansion nestled in the mountains. Today we have the new math, to go along with the new Canada.
——————————–
Yes their built out of OSB crap.
Glue lames.. ok but sawdust board. Not fir anymore.
No copper plumbing and plastic pex
Faucets 90% plastic.
Appliances made as thin as possible.

Just go build a real home with quality products and you would have a jammer.

***************
I have seen the odd bouse being built with 1×8, 1×10 fir boards instead of osb. Mostly rural builds and closer to a local miller who is willing to make a deal.

The other day I passed a housing development all OSB glue boards…no roofs yet and it was pouring rain. So many cheaply and shoddy built houses out there, that now need immediate repairs. Bad tile work, crooked walls, cracks in the ceiling or in walls above windows etc and lack of proper drainage.

Good reno work for the trades when new builds slowdown.

#166 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 12:26 pm

#156 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:24 am
Yesterday was the 40th anniversary of the first TGV bullet train leaving Paris for Lyon.
This revolutionized train travel in France and beyond, cutting most travel times by 50%.
This trend, unfortunately, never caught on in North America, thanks to the intense lobbying of the fossil energy barons, notably the Koch Brothers.
We may come to regret it, soon.
___

In the past we didn’t have a lot of volume, and there are hundreds/thousands of miles between major Canadian Metros. It just wouldn’t pay to build it.

However, it may come yet. Southern Ontario is getting packed. The major highways around the GTA are now regularly seeing 100km long traffic jams. The 401 Westbound on long weekends have 200+ km long traffic jams. Everything was fine just 5 years ago.

10 years from now, the entire 401 corridor will be an insufferable, dangerous mess of trucks and cars. Won’t matter how many extra lanes they add. 1 1/4 million new Ontarians will be on the road by then – and it looks to me we are already pretty much maxed out.

High speed trains would be ultra-desirable turning a 7 hr long-weekend crawl from Ottawa to Toronto into a sub 2hr blast.

Alas, it would cost Billions, it would come in billions over budget on top – after taking 10 years to approve and 20 years to build. Plus we’re already totally broke and super screwed for revenues here in Ontario.

I can tell you this – the 401 is fast headed towards being utterly useless for recreational weekend travel. In 5 years it went from ok/fine to stupid – 5 more years presumably will make it 100% worse. Trucks passing each other over 30 mile stretches and crashing into anything within 100 feet of the shoulder are already weekly events. A bullet train looks like a great idea for the future – but I can’t see how we’d ever get it done.

#167 april on 09.30.21 at 12:33 pm

#136 – the vaccinated are at very low risk of catching or transmitting covid 19.

#168 Russ on 09.30.21 at 12:36 pm

Philco on 09.30.21 at 10:29 am

Also the ever creeking stuff thats flying around our there.
“Youll be happy and own nothing” maybe lol but then your a slave. I wasn’t on board with this but now I see more signs that that is the plan.
Some of the most thick conspiracy theories have truth to them. I think we need to pay attention now.

On another note…you can see the issues of the day out there. China’s aggresions are disturbing.
AUZ 60Min
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kA2KaEKs1LA

Piece out Bro
———————————

A sci-fi book, Dune, with a huge fan base sums it up in a single aphorism:

“Once men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free. But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.”

Are we there yet?

Cheers, R

#169 Xander on 09.30.21 at 12:38 pm

Looks like Will is getting worked up that people are questioning his report and how he came up with the numbers!

https://twitter.com/LooseCannonEcon/status/1443609349230895110?s=20

#170 Shawn Allen on 09.30.21 at 12:45 pm

More Toll Roads Please

#164 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 12:26 pm said:

“I can tell you this – the 401 is fast headed towards being utterly useless for recreational weekend travel.”

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Government services that are easily charged for on a user-pay basis should be so charged.

Driving past Calgary this past weekend I saw major road construction. Who better than the users of those specific roads to pay for it?

Why should transit riders and non-commuters pay taxes for those who commute in their own vehicles clogging roads? Why should the general population pay to improve roads to cottage country?

The greens will be all over this soon (if they are true to their beliefs).

Gasoline taxes are a partial solution to user pay for roads and are a good thing. But specific tolls should also be used. And most especially tolls are needed where congestion is a problem.

Obviously, if tolls are used then other taxes could be reduced…well after the budget is balanced in the year 2071 I mean.

#171 Philco on 09.30.21 at 12:53 pm

#93 Bonobo on 09.29.21 at 6:55 pm
Trump is looking real good now…
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Just had to give Biden he floor for a bit.
A complete failure already.
1) Boarder nasty and unchecked
2) Afghanistan POOF
3) Now the Debt exploding higher WE NEED MORE MONEY

The News is a terrible racket now a tool of mind control.
The biggest supporters of Trump were Mexican Immigrants we met (came to USA 60yrs ago). they were fruit pickers in Cali in the 60s. Now a large successful family there.
They said PROTECT THE BOARDER!
Met them RVing in Arizona…Nicest people, had an amazing take on the Sht show down there. We still keep in touch (cause they love my Flip wife :-)

#172 HH on 09.30.21 at 1:00 pm

#130 – Awakened One

I’m glad your life is smooth and unfettered. You should know, though, that I didn’t siphon anything. I cared deeply about my parents and through the caregiving process I developed a respect and understanding of what caregivers in care homes are up against. My parents helped me. I helped them.

#173 real estate is not real anymore on 09.30.21 at 1:08 pm

Even if you believe the $769 a month a homeowner is ahead in Ontario or Canada versus renters in Ontario or Canada, a 0.50% increase in mortgage rates on a $850,000 mortgage is $4,250 just in extra interest in the year or $354.16 per month starting on renewal. There goes almost half, 46% of that advantage. There is higher property taxes, utilities, home insurance and other higher costs, fees for the house and some higher mortgage rates too and there goes that $769 a month advantage owning the home, gone, poof!

Just a prior or few blogs away here there was a 0.50% increase in mortgage rates coming in the next few months by Rob in the Gloabeandmail.

#174 Philco on 09.30.21 at 1:17 pm

#168 Russ on 09.30.21 at 12:36 pm
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Were close Russ.
AI is here along with human integration. Their working on the implants now.

#170 Shawn Allen on 09.30.21 at 12:45 pm
More Toll Roads Please
#164 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 12:26 pm
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Easy Peazy now. A Central monitoring system tied along with GPS/ cell network auto telemetry will track you ride…if ya own one.
It will tax you on how far you go and which roads you use.

#175 Stone on 09.30.21 at 1:22 pm

#112 yvr_lurker on 09.29.21 at 8:51 pm
Generally, I am left of center, but try to be relatively balanced. Blew a gasket today at the absolute leftist nutbars running city hall in Vancouver who are recommending that city council adopt the proposal to make permit parking EVERYWHERE in the city of vancouver, charging $43 a year, nightly charges for visitors who park on the street in front of your house, and an extra $800-1000 per year to park a 2023 gasoline car in front of your own home. Currently, about 10% of the city is permit parking due to overcrowding, and this is reasonable. However, the vast majority of city streets (Dunbar, East Van, parts of KITS) etc, there is no problem with finding a place to park on your street. When my relatives come and visit and stay the night am I supposed to buy an overnight parking pass for them to park in front of my house where there are ample spaces? Insane.

We have two cars, with the second one being used very infrequently but important if I have to take the kid to soccer or get groceries when my wife is away… 5K in miles a year at most…. The argument put forth is that cars parked on the street are major polluters, and we need to get rid of as many as possible. Nobody has the brains to ask how many miles your car does in a year. I have a large craftsman style house in KITS, which unfortunately has no driveway or garage to avoid this. Paying property taxes that escalated 12% last year, and for sure this year will be another huge hike.

If City council approves this in a vote, one can be guaranteed it will be a huge new revenue source for the city, with rates rising 20% per year each and every year as people succumb to this way of seeing the world…. Then, driving my kid from our home in KITS to Cypress for skiing and passing through downtown without stopping will be another extra green charge going forward… am I supposed to take a huge detour to avoid downtown and take the other bridge burning lots of gas in the process….

There is a public forum on this in October and I will be going for sure to voice my displeasure. Everyone (and I mean everyone) on city council who votes for this will NOT get my vote for city elections. Many of my my neighbours think likewise.

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Reading the comment above and your other comments posted today on this subject, I see you have lots of money to spend on discretionary activities and yet cry out in disgust that the city is looking to raise revenues for parking of cars on public roads that the city has to pay for. You’re sounding a little disingenuous. And you don’t actually sound like someone hard done by.

I agree with the city’s approach. Been to Vancouver many times and the thing I noticed was an overabundance of cars on the road to the point public transit (buses) have a hard time navigating those same roads.

#176 Steven on 09.30.21 at 1:23 pm

161 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 11:32 am

Furthermore,
I have relatives in HongKong, who have school aged children, and elderly to look after.
None of them has a car.
I don’t even think they have a drivers licences.
And yes, they could afford cars if they wanted.
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The big difference is Hong Kong has an incredibly good public transit system whereas Vancouver…not so much.
In Hong Kong, they build skyscrapers over transit hubs so it is incredibly convenient for people to get around. Taxi is also very affordable and efficient as Hong Kong is not that big a geographical area.
In Vancouver, transit hubs are surrounded by single family homes, forcing people to make multiple transfers
by bus just to get to skytrain stations. And let’s not even talk about our taxi system.

#177 Islander on 09.30.21 at 1:23 pm

In other words, she did nothing personally and you want to steal her possessions for ideological reasons. Sounds like you’d be right at home in the CCP. – Garth

Sounds like he’d be right at home in the federal Liberal party.

#178 Derek on 09.30.21 at 1:29 pm

A 0.50% interest rate increase in mortgage rates coming as said by Rob in globeandmail and forecasts of others will increase most mortgage balances in Canada by $350 a month. Also, more mortgage rate increase by probably another 0.25% point to 0.50% in the year ahead. There is then more property tax, water bills, garbage fees, utility and other increases from electricity bills to natural gas bills will soon eat up and or exceed that $769 a month advantage of homeowners if you believe it even exists.

Many that buy homes, condos in Canada are suffer from math delusionitis.

#179 Ponzius Pilatus on 09.30.21 at 1:33 pm

#176 Steven
Thanks for helping me make my point.
Public transport is the future.

#180 Don Guillermo on 09.30.21 at 2:12 pm

#177 Islander on 09.30.21 at 1:23 pm
In other words, she did nothing personally and you want to steal her possessions for ideological reasons. Sounds like you’d be right at home in the CCP. – Garth

Sounds like he’d be right at home in the federal Liberal party
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Sadly, we can just say he’s right at home in Kanada.

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#181 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 2:21 pm

#170 Shawn Allen on 09.30.21 at 12:45 pm
More Toll Roads Please

#164 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 12:26 pm said:

“I can tell you this – the 401 is fast headed towards being utterly useless for recreational weekend travel.”

************************************
Government services that are easily charged for on a user-pay basis should be so charged.

Driving past Calgary this past weekend I saw major road construction. Who better than the users of those specific roads to pay for it?
________

I’d like to see a massive toll on 401 Eastbound, East of the GTA…

But it won’t work unless you toll every east/west highway in southern Ontario. The hoards will just pile onto #2 and #7 thinking they found a way to avoid the 401 tolls, and basically cause solid gridlock from Toronto to the PQ border.

The problem is straightforward, when the 401 completed its “modern” phase upgrade, the whole of Ontario only had about 8 million residents. Today, just the tiny little golden horseshoe has about 8 million residents – but the 401 outside the GTA is pretty much still the same as it was 50 years ago.

Also, the GTA is now solidly majority immigrant, and visiting with family is a big deal to this population. From Toronto to Ottawa to Montreal – long weekend traffic – it’s literally 100’s of km worth of gridlock. The amount of semi trucks is off the hook too.

No toll will be high enough to stop folks from visiting family, the problem is already here – the answer is MIA and will remain so. It’s going to be left until it takes 12 hours to drive from Toronto to the GTA and the travelers finally just throw in the towel.

#182 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 2:47 pm

#163 Sail Away on 09.30.21 at 12:17 pm
#150 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 10:29 am

Maybe a small (1200 sf or less) efficient low maintenance house on an acre with a decent shop/garage isn’t a money maker? You’d think a lot of folks would love it. Cheaper to buy and own, just what we need in Canada for old and young alike.

So far it looks like we’re in the same boat – we’d have to build it ourselves.

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Yep, a small well-built house. If new build, concrete ICF or similar with metal roof is super efficient and eliminates a lot of common maintenance issues:

https://www.foxblocks.com/blog/icf-tiny-house
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I’ve always liked ICF – right to the roof! Cool, warm, quiet, efficient, strong, no screw-pops, no bugs or vermin in the walls, – and do it all yourself with a careful concrete pumper!

Add in radiant floors, big windows to the south, insulated under basement slab, windbreak to the West – and a wood stove – man that would be zero compromise low energy living!

#183 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 2:51 pm

#181 IHCTD9 on 09.30.21 at 2:21 pm

It’s going to be left until it takes 12 hours to drive from Toronto to the GTA and the travelers finally just throw in the towel.
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Cough! Make that “…from Toronto *to Ottawa*”.

#184 Leanne on 09.30.21 at 3:41 pm

#38 XGRO and chill

Please do share the link! I’ve been looking for something like this!

#185 That guy on 09.30.21 at 5:42 pm

I can tell you that renting truly sucks for people in my town. Multiple renovations, super high rent costs, and not enough supply. It’s heart breaking and ugly at times.
Local municipalities seem to create a huge road block and all but try to prevent secondary suits.

Then wonder why we have a homeless problem. I just don’t get it.

Been a home owner for a long time, can’t imagine the stress on people these days. I’d be happy to see a plunge in the housing market.

#186 Matt on 09.30.21 at 6:49 pm

$147 condo fee. What is K smoking?

#187 Nick on 10.01.21 at 8:58 am

#123 VladTor on 09.29.21 at 10:11 pm

I would recommend you sell house immediately. For profit 300K you can rent and live in good apartment at least 10 years.
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So sell my house to pay rent for an apartment (I currently live in a detached single car home in a subdivision and have a wife & 1 kid – 1 more on the way). Aside from the logistics not really working out on this, with this logic, the 300K over 10yrs is a guaranteed 0 in the end (also assuming we never have to move and rent doesn’t increase etc). Then what do I do with my new found money? Invest in stocks? Are we thinking stocks will only move on the rise and housing will tank? I still just don’t get the logic…

In 20 years or less, I’ll have no mortgage. Renters always have that rental bill. Look at any 20-25yr span. Real estate is never lower than when you started.