WFW

When Westjet pulled the plug on Atlantic Canada some days ago, I was moved to post this on a local chat board: ‘Bubbles have consequences…’

The response was predictable. “Garth doesn’t get it,” and “No, wrong. Pandemics have consequences”, were typical replies. And so the virus continues to divide us.

As a reminder, my choice has been to stay on the east coast during the last few months of Covid. (Anyway, my office in a Bay Street bank tower has been closed since March.) The four Maritime provinces created a bubble in July, sealing the borders and requiring quarantines for any interlopers. Besides the airline surprise, there have been two notable results:

(a) No virus. Well, hardly none. There are but five active cases in NS (these people travelled to some germy place like Toronto, now isolating), and no new daily cases for a while. Nobody’s really sick. Nobody’s in hospital. Nothing is closed.

(b) Real estate is nuts. Prices up 40%. Multiple bids. But most buyers aren’t locals. They’re Ontario refugees. And all the action is virtual. No showings. Nobody’s ever seen this.

So while my fancy Toronto portfolio-manager, hot-shot, master-of-the-universe financial guru colleagues have been working out of their spare bedrooms and breakfast nooks, my little band of compatriots has been ensconced where they should be. At work. In their offices. Collaborating. Fully dressed. Connected to the Big Pipe. WFW. Here’s one now…

The condo update this week on this pathetic blog led to a discussion about working from home. Seems a lot of people never want to return to the office, never commute, never be physically accountable nor forced to organize their lives the way they used to. By removing the walls between ‘work’ and ‘home’ they get to play with the dog (or kids), shop, houseclean, exercise or wash their socks in between Zoom meetings, data entry, email frenzy and working on projects. Proponents say this is the way of the future. That traditional workplaces are dead. That work-life balance is the No.1 thing people want. And finally the virus has delivered it.

Others (including crusty employers like moi) say this is bunk. WFH is a complete risk for most organizations and employees. Productivity falls. Communications falters. Synergy fizzles. Mistakes multiple. Ideas wither. Besides, any worker not needed in the workplace can eventually be replaced by either AI or some dude in Manila making one-tenth the wages who doesn’t have a giant mortgage in Surrey. Out of sight, out of mind. There’s a reason this phrase endures.

Anyway, don’t take it from a paleo like me. Look at the evidence. Covid is murdering the work ethic while turning people into stressed-out basket cases. Here’s a survey from recruitment firm Hays Canada showing many employees are reeling from the deleterious effects of WFH, including isolation, lack of support, loneliness and the feeling of an increased workload when the barriers between employment and personal time are erased.

While a majority of employers are confident about the future, 49% of their employees are seriously contemplating quitting. In Ontario that rises to 52% In Quebec, 54%. And while over eight in ten WFH folks said they were content earlier this year, that has now plunged by 20%. “COVID-19 has left everyone exhausted and while many businesses are improving, staff are waving a white flag,” says the company.

In the States, similar findings. In a survey, The Martec Group found this: “a significant decline in mental health across all industries, seniority levels, and demographics. Job satisfaction, job motivation, and company satisfaction were also negatively affected.”

A minority of 16% like WFH. The rest say they hate it, and resent the employer for shutting the workplace. Before the virus hit, two-thirds of people believed they were in good mental health. After working from home for a few months, that dipped to 28%. Job satisfaction and motivation also crashed – as here. A third said work-life balance got better The rest moaned, ‘lemme outta here’…

Well, Covid may have changed a lot of things. But it hasn’t changed human nature. People need, want and crave other people. That’s why workplaces developed, cities formed and urbanization has been the most prevalent trend of the last century. This is why the epicentre of societies has always been the downtown core, not the Wal-Mart in Richmond Hill. It’s why the gleaming towers are there. The best transit infrastructure. The bars, museums, clubs, galleries, restaurants, high-end retail, buskers, protests and shoe-shine guys.

So, WFH on a large scale will end. So will the pandemic. Both are temporary. Just like the silliness of buying a house two hours away because you’ll never commute again. Or competing for a listing four provinces away because the pictures look romantic.

Please regain your sanity. Go back to the office. And don’t move here. We’re busy working.

$     $     $

By the way, have you seen this tally of government virus spending from the economists at RBC? Yup. Pooched.

196 comments ↓

#1 X on 10.22.20 at 12:59 pm

Borders might be opening up soon: https://torontosun.com/news/national/breaking-rapid-testing-at-airports-to-replace-mandatory-quarantine-for-international-travellers

#2 GBiddy on 10.22.20 at 1:04 pm

I don’t think it’s up to people, it’s government and un-elected health officers keeping people out of their offices. Neither are willing to stop the destruction, the pain, the harm yet–all in the name of harm reduction, of course.

The human species is inflected, but with a mind virus.

On another note, when does it make sense to re-balance index funds that balance themselves? Two of my high-growth index funds are up about 25%.

Should I scrape off the profits and dump ‘n pump them into a bond fund or something, or do you just let them keep growing? I’m not too clear on the re-balancing concept…

#3 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 1:07 pm

THREADBARE Gov Canada. THREADBARE Gov Canada. THREADBARE Gov Canada. THREADBARE Gov Canada. THREADBARE Gov Canada. THREADBARE Gov Canada.

There.

Got it out of my system.

And no more THREADBARE Gov Italia – there’s new kid on the block.

Did know whether to laugh or cry when I saw that chart on Twitter today…cry was more like it.

That DAMN VIRUS it just has to end. Enough is enough.

#4 Boomersaurus Rex on 10.22.20 at 1:08 pm

Garth, WFH flexibility and lockdowns are not one in the same. I’m guessing lockdowns are negatively affecting people’s mental health, but work flexibility isn’t the scourge you’re trying to make it out to be.

The reality is, most people hate their jobs (I’ve seen statistics as high as 85%). Do you really think these underling employees are clamoring to commute daily to stuffy windowless offices with crappy fluorescent lighting so their distrusting micromanaging boss can watch their every move?

“A minority of 16% like WFH” – Wow, could you provide a source for this?

#5 Don Guillermo on 10.22.20 at 1:21 pm

The above RBC chart answers the often posted comments here that ask “who cares what T2 spends? Everyone else is doing the same.”

Jaguar, on the positive side (no pun intended) rapid testing at YYC might help you get your feet in the sand this winter.

#6 Captain Uppa on 10.22.20 at 1:28 pm

You make a compelling argument, Garth. Each industry and company will have to figure out what works and what doesn’t.

I think we are in for a mixed bag. Besides, think of the environmental relief of a slash in commuting!

#7 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 1:30 pm

I quit my job last month. The push for WFH from this scamdemic makes people like me go in overdrive getting more stuff done while most others slack off more. Life is too short.

#8 Felix on 10.22.20 at 1:32 pm

Today’s picture demonstrates what I have said before.

At their best, canines can be almost as useful as a piece of furniture, a laptop desk or even a toilet seat.

But sadly, not as bright.

#9 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 1:33 pm

One thing that did make me laugh today was this:

“EU removes Canadians from list of approved travellers because of COVID-19”

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/eu-travel-canada-1.5770782

NO MORE Berlin Bistro Brats, or Tottenham Toad in the Hole, Macron’s Macarons or Pizza alla Napoletana for you Canada.

Like the VERY LARGE POT calling the extremely small tea kettle blackened.

However you want to calculate it (cases or deaths), by population ratio, CANADA is downright NIRVANA compared to this list:

https://i.imgur.com/lNJnhYE.png

And Europe* has the NERVE to ban Canadian tourists. Unbelievable. Maybe Europe wants to protect them?

The World is getting weirder by the hour, each and every day.

————————

*L’est Europe Virus Porn

Denmark today banned everybody outside its borders, Swedes not amused esp. those living in Malmo.

Dutch BOA, not the constrictor (Buitengewoon Opsporingsambtenaar, Special Enforcement Officers a.k.a. Ruttens Goons by the locals), “arrest” more like beat up a man for refusing to wear a mask at a Rotterdam metro station.

Deutschland going POSTAL about their 11,300 cases yesterday. Their MSM save DW using really tiny text and hiding articles about this requiring much scrolling down on their home web pages (this AM early CET). Deutschers looking at places to go to where it’s safe…except for Denmark of course:

https://i.imgur.com/K9Prdd1.png

Italia meh, we’re NOT threadbare no more so life is good even though cases surging today to 16,000!! Italian MSM won’t even report the numbers on the home web pages – worse yet than the Germans. Though, happy to report this police car used to:

Transport Transplant Kidneys, molto veloce…

https://i.imgur.com/IfKXRdT.png

When Europe lets you back into Italia Canada, go to Napoli…there is usually one usually parked outside of Gran Caffè Gambrinus.

#10 just saying.... on 10.22.20 at 1:35 pm

Garth,

Lunnenburg / Bridgewater is the opposite of a large city, 401 etc…

Seems to work for you. And its a really nice place and with nice folks…

University students are online now that will have many game change effects ie enrollment may increases in top universities while 2nd and 3rd tier university suffer with lower mark students. They will graduate and take this experience with them…

by no means will cities diminish however there will be structural changes … the key is centralized control and decentralized functionality.

business will chase lowest tax, highest subsidies best labour pool.

#11 Cottagers STAY THE HELL AWAY! on 10.22.20 at 1:38 pm

“Please regain your sanity. Go back to the office. And don’t move here. We’re busy working.”

And STAY AWAY FROM COTTAGE COUNTRY!

GO BACK TO THE GTA ALL YOU INBRED SOUTHERN HILLBILLIES!

#12 Toronto_CA on 10.22.20 at 1:40 pm

Appreciate the further discussion we got into yesterday, but again, where is the middle ground discussion of WFH 2-3 days a week and WFW 2-3 days a week?

The overwhelming survey responses I’ve seen indicate this is the way forward. You’re presenting a false dichotomy here, when all indication is that it will be a hybrid approach for those who can and want to do it.

That shift to 40-60% WFH days will have serious implications for city centre real estate and businesses however, in terms of restructuring to the new normal.

There will be no discernible impact on downtown cores. That is simply illogical and unsupported by economic facts, history or human nature. Just because you like being in your jammies until 11 am… – Garth

#13 K on 10.22.20 at 1:48 pm

I’ve been back in the office since mid-July. I’ve never suffered with mental health issues, but without question I feel better overall mentally since returning to the office, interacting with co-workers, going out for work lunches, etc.

This pandemic situation has shown me the importance of human interaction. And I’m not talking with a few immediate members of your household.

#14 Dogman01 on 10.22.20 at 1:49 pm

#142 Prairieboy43 on 10.21.20 at 11:04 pm

https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/chip-wilson-opinion-mec-ndp

“Great societies provide incentives for people to build businesses that make money and tax just enough to encourage more entrepreneurs. The more entrepreneurs, the more money the government makes in taxes. And the more taxes, the more social systems can be put in place.”

“socially acceptable phrases addressed to voters who do not understand finance or what policies small businesses need to be successful.”

“As we go to the polls, I urge the undecided not to be blinded by social media headlines of unionized media writers and socialist university professors , but to vote for the reality that sustainable social programs require a strong economy.”

———————————————————-

Unfortunately the pendulum of wealth accumulation by a small minority (the 1%) while standard of living decline for everyone else (wage earners) went too far, and now I believe we are at the beginning of the inevitable pendulum swing too far the other way, the Wealthy class have overplayed their hand and now we get the “Socialist backlash”.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/06/the-pitchforks-are-coming-for-us-plutocrats-108014

For 40 years wage earners have faced:
• Competing against more labour supply, via Globalization & Immigration
• Less global demand for “workers” – via Technology
• The “Red Queen” problem of wages up against Inflation

Wealth holders have benefited and wage earners lose in all the above trends. In Canada it is becoming ever more true “pick your parents carefully”, …all Wage earners have left is the vote….

Canada will go too far left and impair wealth creation with bizarre social justice eccentricities, destroying our energy sector etc., much of the left holds a deep psychological grudge. (against the “patriarchy!” )

We do not have the wisdom to strike the correct balance, unleash the engine of true free market capitalism, while properly harnessing those benefits for broader society.

For me I see the which way the wind is blowing and move my investments out of Canada. The left needs to acknowledge that social justice is intimately dependent on increasing prosperity….but I suspect as prosperity declines, they will double down on their ideology.

#15 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 1:50 pm

#9 Cottagers STAY THE HELL AWAY!

“…ALL YOU INBRED SOUTHERN HILLBILLIES!”

————————–

Says the person living in the forest primeval (a.k.a., the sticks, topography like Southern Appalachia and the Ozarks).

Queue:

Dueling Banjos by Arthur “Guitar Boogie” Smith.

#16 Bill on 10.22.20 at 1:54 pm

Garth…its the internet thats done the damage. People are fools. A click of the button and you can buy anything and maybe destroy your life.
How stupid are people? Well when I purchase properties I crawl in the basement and attic to make sure Im not buying a piece of crap and needs $150k in repairs. I watch Home and Garden house porn for fun and just shake my head.
Winter is hell in the east so have fun with that… I love the left coast.

Winter is worse in Toronto than the South Shore, actually. New Brunswick is where all the snow goes. I’m good with that. – Garth

#17 Smartalox on 10.22.20 at 1:59 pm

In the middle of my second week of WFH.

Last night I was working until 1:30am; last week, I did one all nighter to 3am. Awfully glad that when I finally got done on these tasks, I didn’t have to commute more than a couple of flights of stairs.

In the ‘before’ times, commuting home in time to read bedtime stories to my son, or stopping for a meal break would mark the end of a days work. Once home, it would be very rare indeed for me to return to the office to complete a task. Though I might have lugged my laptop home, and attempt to answer emails in front of the TV.

Sure, I also get to squeeze in loads of laundry, or put a pot of stew on to simmer between conference calls, or tack an errand onto school drop-off or pick-up duties.

I’m not concerned about my productivity with remote work. My boss hasn’t been in his office since March, our partners are all in Europe, and my direct reports are all available online.

Is it ideal? No. Is it manageable? So far, Yes.

#18 Russ on 10.22.20 at 1:59 pm

From yesterday:

Nixter on 10.22.20 at 1:04 pm

@Turner Nation
Inquiring minds would like to know the name of the book and author from the sixties who had an inside view of what is here now.
Thanks
===============================

Hey Nix,

try Wiki: Arthur c Clarke and check out the “Futurism” section

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_C._Clarke

Asimov & Heinlein were also good writers and minds of the time.

Cheers, Russ

#19 Classical Liberal Millennial on 10.22.20 at 2:01 pm

Rapid testing at airports instead of 14 day quarantine?! About time! Time to plan our next vacay. The fearful lockdowners can stay home.

#20 Stone on 10.22.20 at 2:05 pm

A minority of 16% like WFH. The rest say they hate it, and resent the employer for shutting the workplace. Before the virus hit, two-thirds of people believed they were in good mental health. After working from home for a few months, that dipped to 28%. Job satisfaction and motivation also crashed – as here. A third said work-life balance got better The rest moaned, ‘lemme outta here’…

———

And had the survey folks dug a bit deeper, they would have uncovered that those same 16% who like WFH have interesting lives while the other 84% who despair are actually boring AF.

Those 84% are probably also those who, when they eventually retire, have no clue what to do with themselves.

#21 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 2:13 pm

“[Any] worker not needed in the workplace can eventually be replaced by either AI or some dude in Manilla making one-tenth the wages who doesn’t have a giant mortgage in Surrey.”

*******

Everyone who has ever wondered why the manufacturing jobs in the country dried up, or why China feels it can bully everyone now, remember statements like the one above.

Replacing workers with automation or people working for 1/10th the price has been happening for over 50 years. This war on the North American worker didn’t just suddenly start now because of WFH or Covid.

Our only use is to be consumers, paying inflated prices for services to keep a stock a float. Too bad being a consumer takes money earned from working. I hope for our corporate-masters’ sakes that person in Manilla is willing to pay for the same cost inflated services with 1/10th of the spending power. Maybe the AIs can pick up some of the economic slack by pulling up their bootstraps and starting a business.

*Before any of you start calling me a communist in order to dismiss my opinion outright, I actually beleive that capitalism can work fine with the right rules in place. We’ve come this far, after all.

*******

“Anyway, don’t take it from a paleo like me. Look at the evidence. Covid is murdering the work ethic while turning people into stressed-out basket cases. Here’s a survey from recruitment firm Hays Canada showing many employees are reeling from the deleterious effects of WFH, including isolation, lack of support, loneliness and the feeling of an increased workload when the barriers between employment and personal time are erased.”

*******

Right, working from home is the sole reason why everyone feels crummy. Couldn’t be threats of unemployment (see above), spiraling living costs, fear of illness, political deadlock, lack of child care, every increasing workloads and vanishing wages, oh, and a pandemic. Just WFM is the cause of employee disingagement. Got it.

Stanford Did a 2-year study PRE-virus, and found that productivity increased with WFH options available. But now that it’s declining in the pandemic era, WFH is the reason productivity decreased? I understand those studies look appealing, but they don’t speak to any reasons. “People WFH, productivity down, WFH bad” is a very myopic way to draw conclu

I’ll just get that same Standford professor who did the first WFH study to explain how WFH might have been a detriment in the current climate:

https://news.stanford.edu/2020/03/30/productivity-pitfalls-working-home-age-covid-19/

“[What’s] happening today with the coronavirus crisis is completely different thanks to four factors: children, space, privacy and choice.”

“Perhaps the most challenging aspect of working at home for parents with younger children is managing their kids. The closure of schools and transition to “distance learning” for students has forced many working parents to take on the additional job of full-time teacher. One requirement for a successful work-from-home program for any business is the requirement that children are in school or daycare, Bloom says.”

Here in the steerage section, we make fun of affordable child care, complain about teachers making too much, blame unions for making teachers greedy (not cops though?), and generally crap on anyone who points out flaws with the current corporatist laws and structures… That is, if they take time from peddling the latest conspiracy theories.

My own self-righteous indignation aside, maybe the best solution is a balance? Keeping the office, but letting people work from home every now and then? How many times per week is the ideal amount? No idea, and I hope future studies will yield better data.

#22 Love_The_Cottage on 10.22.20 at 2:20 pm

When Bob McCown was hosting prime time sports he would often argue the opposite side of his real beliefs just to make better radio.

I often wonder if Garth really believes some of this stuff or he’s just bored and looking for sparring partners.

#23 Bill on 10.22.20 at 2:22 pm

#11 Cottagers STAY THE HELL AWAY! on 10.22.20 at 1:38 pm

You own cottage country? You should stay away from the keyboard.
A waist of hydro.

#24 Toronto_CA on 10.22.20 at 2:22 pm

There will be no discernible impact on downtown cores. That is simply illogical and unsupported by economic facts, history or human nature. Just because you like being in your jammies until 11 am… – Garth
______
Interesting. Here’s my take:

Economic facts are that if 40-60% of workers like me don’t come to the city centre to their offices on any given day, you have a corresponding decline in that city centre for footfall which drives revenue in all the businesses that serve them. This is very evident in the City of London where I live at the moment, and has our local MP scared to death. Smaller towns will absorb this drop in city revenue out in the burbs (and delivery giants like Amazon).

History? I’m not sure we can go with history as an indicator on this historic pandemic, because the last pandemic and response from government on this scale was 100 years ago and the internet didn’t allow people to do jobs from home (and the service economy was a fraction of what it is now)… I’d say this qualifies as uncharted waters where history is concerned.

Human nature is interesting; I hear what you are saying that people crave the return to normal. But the surveys I’ve read indicate people want to come into the office only a few days a week (or month) to have meetings and interact in person. Very few want to give up the flexible working from home entirely. Long commutes to work is one of the biggest destructors of happiness. And the longer this pandemic endures, the more likely a permanent change is going to happen. Other human nature facts.

I do like wearing jammies though until noon! :)

Knew it. – Garth

#25 Nixter on 10.22.20 at 2:23 pm

Thanks Russ will do.
N

#26 Alberta Boy on 10.22.20 at 2:25 pm

First they will figure out a lot of jobs can be done from home. Then they will figure out a lot of those can be done from India.

#27 Brian Ripley on 10.22.20 at 2:29 pm

I have updated my Household Debt Chart with overlays of GDP, Net Trade and Foreign Direct Investment:
http://www.chpc.biz/household-debt.html

10 YEAR SPREAD CHANGE

*Mortgage Debt: UP 63%
*Total Debt: UP 53%
Negative FDI: UP 633%
Negative Net Trade: UP 322%
GDP: UP 12%

*Debt is Households Debt

#28 yvr_lurker on 10.22.20 at 2:34 pm

I am part of the 16% that enjoy WFH, despite the anxiety with having to undergo a serious upgrade in my IT skills. I don’t think I have ever been more productive (as measured objectively by the metrics in my field), and the isolation is just fine as I have always been inclined that way. The people I work with closely we still do with zoom and meeting in coffee shops nearby as needed. The only thing I think we miss as a family is taking off with our backpacks to some rather remote eco-tourism adventure as we used to do.

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm

#174 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 11:19 am
#132 n1tro on 10.21.20 at 10:05 pm

#43 SeeB on 10.21.20 at 4:06 pm

—————————————————————-

Nice use of the “bold” function. Makes you seem more qualified (not really).

First counterpoint to a discussion…make an unfounded assumption about another and belittle them. Real classy. Perhaps using bold is so to keep the original content in place while being able to highlight the response?

You know what it was called the “Novel Coronavirus”? Novel means “New”. New means: “1.
not existing before; made, introduced, or discovered recently or now for the first time.”

First, it is NOT called the “Novel Coronavirus” it name is Covid-19, a new virus in the coronavirus family. Coronavirus family being a group of RNA viruses that cause diseases in mammals and birds which include SARS and MERS with the earliest reports of coronaviruses emerging in the 1920s . You arguing the “novel” in a name dubbed at the beginning of the pandemic implies that NOTHING is known about it thus justifying the over reaction that occurred in March which is wrong.

Apparently scientists have discovered that the virus can live on human skin for up to 9 hours, but still are trying to figure out if it can transmit that way.

What does this have to do with anything? This information is about as useful as the study that showed covid-19 can survive on surfaces for 27 days in the dark. Mental note, don’t go into rooms that have been dark for 26 days and start licking the surfaces. Oh what’s that? The same study found the flu virus can survive for 17 days in the dark?? Ok. Instead of shutting the economy down by locking everyone in, how about we just literally leave the lights on and avoid licking the surfaces of tables and stuff?

****

Again – “Novel” – We still don’t know for sure if this strain causes blindness or liver failure 5 years from now or some other issue. I know, a very extreme and unlikely scenario, but it’s still better to take some precautions like masking and not spreading the virus around indiscriminately.

Your argument is based on appealing to people’s fears while minimizing the actions taken. The unlikely chance of blindness or liver failure 5 years from now in a handful of people is not a justifiable reason to shut the economy down for everyone else. The WHO has recently came out and said this while not mentioning their role in recommending everyone is locked in.

My main point is if North American society could trust denialists to wear their masks, wash their hands, and follow guidelines, we could be full open tomorrow, since we’d be doing everything WITHIN REASON.

It isn’t a denialists vs. scientists issue. I’m not going to rehash the conflicting reports by scientists on effectiveness of masks as it has been proven to have negligible benefits because masks alone doesnt do anything as per the CDC. Yeah, yeah….”some effectiveness is better than nothing” as the crybabies would say.

I do agree with you that the economy could be open tomorrow with people deciding for themselves how they want to protect themselves after understanding the options and consequences. Stop relying on governments to tell you what to do.

Also It’s not a flu, so “strong flu” makes no sense. Apples and Oranges. But I guess you want to compare raw numbers.

My apologies. covid-19 isnt the “flu”, inFLUenza A, B, and C are in the coronavirus family and depending on the years infect the population more than other strains so using the words “strong” flu is correct. Don’t like the term? Blame the doctors that coined it. And comparing the influenza to covid-19, being in the same coronavirus family is comparing Apples (Macintosh) to Apples (Grannysmith).

The previous (and still current in some circles) talking point from the extreme right back in April when the US death count was lower, was that the FLU itself is worse. But now it’s a strong flu since we have a few months behind us. Okay, sure there bud.

I guess soon once the numbers get higher, you’ll be telling us it’s like a “strong car crash”, or, heaven forbid, a “strong cancer”.

Make it political and deflect all you want but we are talking numbers and science here. What numbers are getting higher?? Deaths?

The numbers (worldometer) in April was showing 20% mortality. Now the numbers are showing 4%. With more tests and confirmed cases, I’m sure the 4% mortality will go down further. But that isn’t scary enough so the narrative has changed from “look at all the deaths” to “look at all the cases!!”

As for your dumb (sorry no better word for it here) talk around a strong car crash or strong cancer….ever heard of benign vs. malignent cancer? or how about a car crash that someone walks away from versus dying in? Cringe.

I guess the only good news this year is, no one died of old age or natural causes in 2020

****

That’s just a dumb hyperbolic analogy and you know it.

wow nothing gets passed you. Maybe I should have put “lolz” or literally write out “laudz” for you to understand that my last statement was clearly a joke.

Another blog dog wrote a good summary of 2020…

Covid-19: A disease so deadly that you need a test to confirm you have it.

#30 Old Ron on 10.22.20 at 2:43 pm

# 25 Alberta Boy

Bingo.

#31 Bill on 10.22.20 at 2:55 pm

#26 Alberta Boy

News for you I worked for the biggest cell company in the country and most engineering comes from India, sales and service comes from Manila and Central America. It started a long time ago.
Garth a correction….they make 1/20 or less. I make a $1000 a day they make 10 buks maybe $15. My wife’s from the Philippines 40 years ago and I’ve been there 3 times. Some relies work for this company. No name mention as their my biggest renter here in Kanada and that I love. Don’t care for how they roll though.

#32 MissingFlorida on 10.22.20 at 2:55 pm

My dept is just as productive at home as we were at the office but we are no longer spending hours a day sitting in traffic and have better overall home/work life balance. Almost everything we did prior to the pandemic was remote work done from a central office. Nothing has changed, we are still keeping the same critical hospital services running smoothly and it would be really apparent if we weren’t working.

Same thing with my spouse who has been working remotely since mid-March. All day conference calls and working non-stop.

I hope WFH stays and I would seek out an employer who offers it if mine ever stops. Blame the pandemic on mental health, not WFH. I workout more, sleep more, and cook more healthy meals with my saved commuting time. And if it weren’t for the pandemic and high cases where I am, I could also use my new-found time for visiting friends and family more which would surely be a mental boost.

#33 Penny Henny on 10.22.20 at 3:01 pm

Not a hard and fast rule but introverts in general like WFH. Covid or no Covid. We’ll socialize on our own time and terms.

#34 Faron on 10.22.20 at 3:01 pm

Garth, you absolutely nailed my view and experience in working from home. I think and hope you are right that by spring we’ll be trickling back to the office.

#2 GBiddy on 10.22.20 at 1:04 pm

If you are happy with your equity allocation, just rotate your growth into equal weight index or something tilted toward all of the sectors and regions that have underperformed since March. There’s some evidence that a rotation out of tech momentum is imminent and there’s a lot of catching up that can be done in other sectors once the economy opens up. Do it BEFORE everyone else does, else it will be too late and you’ll sell on the way down too low and buy too high.

Bond yields bottomed in August and aren’t likely to go back there, hopefully never. Prices will either stay flat or continue to decline and the yields are going to continue to suck for a while even as they climb. A 1% 10 year is still about as brain dead as a GIC. There’s very little additional room for bonds to cushion an equity sell off, so their balancing component is reduced for the time being. No reason to change your asset allocation is the bottom line, but seems like a good time to take profit on growth and seek greater equity balance.

#35 Penny Henny on 10.22.20 at 3:04 pm

So that’s what Emma Zaun looks like.

#36 WTF on 10.22.20 at 3:08 pm

#16 Bill “Winter is hell in the east so have fun with that”

Well coming from BC “the east” could be from Hope to St Johns.

T0 clarify, Nova Scotia while colder than the Lower Mainland but not as cold as Whistler . That Gulf Stream thingy goes a long way to keep the weather quite temperate on the East coast

https://www.plantmaps.com/interactive-nova-scotia-plant-zone-hardiness-map.php

#37 YVR Expat on 10.22.20 at 3:11 pm

In this article Klaus Schwab, Founder and Executive Chairman of World Economic Forum, argues that the long term economic consequences of the pandemic will exacerbate the climate and social crises that were already underway and this will make more urgent the “Great Reset” of our economic and social systems.

WFH is the solution to elite’s solution to climate change, no more commuting.

Just ask Klaus Schwab from the World Economic Form.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/07/klaus-schwab-nature-jobs-great-reset-podcast/

#38 FriedEggs on 10.22.20 at 3:15 pm

WFH is turning us men into lazy unmotivated soft pajama boys.

Stuck with our women and children at home is doing good for no one. Ask the mental abuse, domestic abuse and child abuse hotlines.

#39 Take me to kijimukuji seaside on 10.22.20 at 3:16 pm

Thank you Garth for being a voice of reason amongst the hysteria.

#40 Yuus bin Haad on 10.22.20 at 3:19 pm

Government meddling has consequences …

#41 jal on 10.22.20 at 3:22 pm

First they will figure out a lot of jobs can be done from home. Then they will figure out a lot of those can be done from India.
—–
Then they will figure out who is working and not working.
Then they will figure out how to keep everyone on the conference video and schedule your bathroom breaks.

#42 Doghouse Dweller on 10.22.20 at 3:23 pm

Re: But most buyers aren’t locals. They’re Ontario refugees

FYI – some of those people cannot afford to survive in Ontario anymore
priced out with rising rents ,low wages , too few hours . You either eat or
pay the rent and utilities but you can`t do both. Down east starts to look mighty attractive considering the alternatives !

#43 Mean Gene on 10.22.20 at 3:26 pm

So are the people who are panic buying housing within the Atlantic bubble Covtards or Covidiots?

#44 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 3:27 pm

The graph of Canada’s deficit spending vs 17 other countries is a warning of an economic kick in the teeth for at least a decade.

#45 jack on 10.22.20 at 3:27 pm

“While a majority of employers are confident about the future, 49% of their employees are seriously contemplating quitting”

I hope they do – that way my wife might be able to get a job! Suck it up people!

#46 David on 10.22.20 at 3:31 pm

How do you get 20 rental properties in 2 years with 70k income. This guy figured it out. https://torontolife.com/real-estate/young-investor-success/

#47 jack morgan on 10.22.20 at 3:31 pm

Re: But most buyers aren’t locals. They’re Ontario refugees

“FYI – some of those people cannot afford to survive in Ontario anymore
priced out with rising rents ,low wages , too few hours . You either eat or
pay the rent and utilities but you can`t do both. Down east starts to look mighty attractive considering the alternatives !”

For all the people moving down east – I hope you don’t like warm summers, enjoy rain, drizzle and fog (RDF) , and enjoy shovelling tons of snow. I lived in NL for the first 25 years of my life and moved to ontario 15 years ago. I would never consider moving back based on the weather alone. There are alot of other downsides – hell, even the traffic is ridiculous in St. John’s now.

“Down East” is like saying “Out West” and is a badge of ignorance. Vancouver is Out West. So is Fort St John. Do they have the same weather? Neither do St John’s and Halifax. Sheesh, people. Try harder. – Garth

#48 Sheesh on 10.22.20 at 3:35 pm

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm
covid-19 isnt the “flu”, inFLUenza A, B, and C are in the coronavirus family and depending on the years infect the population more than other strains so using the words “strong” flu is correct.
…..
Well, you got that wrong. Influenza A,B and C are, wait for it…INFLUENZA viruses. Not related to corona virus. What else are you wrong about?

#49 Millienial Surrealist on 10.22.20 at 3:42 pm

We’re #1.. keep it flowing boomers…

#50 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.20 at 3:43 pm

Toronto RE appears to be locking up again.

A lot of ridiculously priced stuff just sitting.

Amazing what a bit of cool weather and some bad virus news will do to a buying frenzy.

I now have two sellers contacting me through our agent asking if we would consider their property at a lower price.

Thanks to the wonders of the internet I am able to obtain quite a bit of info about a seller including when they bought the property and for what price (a lot of people trying to flip some piece of garbage they bought in the summer).

I can also search the title (a lot of second mortgages recently registered).

I can even find out if the sellers have recently filed for divorce (and are selling to fund their custody battle).

Lots of desperate people out there clinging to last summer’s insane pricing.

No, Toronto, a “renovated ” row house that is about as wide as a Ford Econoline van, with one bathroom, no basement and no parking, is not, and never will be, worth 1.2 million dollars.

#51 willworkforpickles on 10.22.20 at 3:45 pm

As i said here 6 months ago, WFH is a phenomenon employers will have to learn to get comfortable with before the lightbulb of canning their entire working staff comes on in their heads for an East Indo Asian workforce at a tenth of the cost.
Sure…there’s nothing new about outsourcing except for the employers pre-covid who never thought they could trust it now finding out with the current WFH reality how viable it actually is first hand.
As i said months back, many jobs could be going overseas greatly profiting employers with savings costing only a few pennies on the dollar difference in comparison to what they pay employees at home.
Employers who’ve never outsourced before just need to get experienced and comfy with it first and will.
High unemployment now coupled with higher unemployment stats to come (outsourced employment) along with Trudeau’s spending and ultra kind giving combined, can only produce a vortex of increasing inflation and rising interest rates needed to quell it.

#52 Petulant on 10.22.20 at 3:49 pm

The analysis: hammer, meet the nail’s head.

Now to ask ourselves, why has this happened?

Cui Bono?

The bodies aren’t piling up in hospitals and streets?

Brains are dying in kennels.

Cui Bono?

#53 Sheesh on 10.22.20 at 3:54 pm

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm
… And comparing the influenza to covid-19, being in the same coronavirus family is comparing Apples (Macintosh) to Apples (Grannysmith).
….
Ok, can’t let this one go either. Compare corona (virus) to influenza (virus) to herpes (virus) to Ebola (virus) to polio (virus). So yes, all (unrelated) viruses. Ever heard of Ebola, herpes or Polio referred to as just a ‘strong flu’?

#54 Captain Uppa on 10.22.20 at 3:57 pm

#32 MissingFlorida on 10.22.20 at 2:55 pm

My dept is just as productive at home as we were at the office but we are no longer spending hours a day sitting in traffic and have better overall home/work life balance. Almost everything we did prior to the pandemic was remote work done from a central office. Nothing has changed, we are still keeping the same critical hospital services running smoothly and it would be really apparent if we weren’t working.

Same thing with my spouse who has been working remotely since mid-March. All day conference calls and working non-stop.

I hope WFH stays and I would seek out an employer who offers it if mine ever stops. Blame the pandemic on mental health, not WFH. I workout more, sleep more, and cook more healthy meals with my saved commuting time. And if it weren’t for the pandemic and high cases where I am, I could also use my new-found time for visiting friends and family more which would surely be a mental boost.

—————————————————————-

Ditto.

Change is coming to the workplace. Garth does make some good points, but ultimately I think a part time WFH is the final product.

Rotating attendance. Smaller office RE. Less commuting. If you can’t be productive doing WFH, your company will find someone else.

#55 JSS on 10.22.20 at 4:06 pm

DELETED

#56 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 4:09 pm

#13 K on 10.22.20 at 1:48 pm
I’ve been back in the office since mid-July. I’ve never suffered with mental health issues, but without question I feel better overall mentally since returning to the office, interacting with co-workers, going out for work lunches, etc.

This pandemic situation has shown me the importance of human interaction. And I’m not talking with a few immediate members of your household.
———————–
Thank you for your post.
Good to see that there is actually a human on this blog.

#57 The Woosh on 10.22.20 at 4:11 pm

This is why the epicentre of societies has always been the downtown core, not the Wal-Mart in Richmond Hill. It’s why the gleaming towers are there. The best transit infrastructure. The bars, museums, clubs, galleries, restaurants, high-end retail, buskers, protests and shoe-shine guys.

——————————————

Garth – you’re using the wrong tense. “Is” no longer applies to all these things. You should be using “was”…as in the past. It usually takes 3 weeks to change a habit. How many months has this change been going on?
Saddle makers thought their business was forever until the car came along. We don’t see too many saddle makers anymore.
This goose is done!

#58 Boomersaurus Rex on 10.22.20 at 4:14 pm

There will be no discernible impact on downtown cores. That is simply illogical and unsupported by economic facts, history or human nature. Just because you like being in your jammies until 11 am… – Garth

======

Garth – I don’t think there’s anything illogical about it. We all know cities have existed for thousands of years, but they are not immune to disruptive change. Think about how automobile led to mass suburbanization a half century ago.

Now with tens of billions of data-spouting devices connected to the Internet, physical proximity is again losing it’s importance.

People increasingly interact with acquaintances or strangers in online interest-based communities (kinda like this one). The bar or club is less important when you can meet the love of your life on Tinder. You don’t need stores when Amazon will bring anything to your doorstep in a few hours. And yes, you no longer need everyone in one office when you don’t have to process huge amounts of paper. I’m not advocating for any of this, but these are facts.

Urban centres have been loosing their monopoly on the economic and cultural connections that make civilizations tick forward. Downtowns remain desirable, but pandemic is accelerating what’s already been happening, and we’re not going back to the way things were.

No discernible impact on downtown cores?

#59 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 4:17 pm

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm

#174 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 11:19 am
#132 n1tro on 10.21.20 at 10:05 pm

#43 SeeB on 10.21.20 at 4:06 pm

—————————————————————-

Nice use of the “bold” function. Makes you seem more qualified (not really).

First counterpoint to a discussion…make an unfounded assumption about another and belittle them. Real classy. Perhaps using bold is so to keep the original content in place while being able to highlight the response?

Yes, it was arrogant of me to say that. I’m sorry. Your formatting is good and readable and I’ll use it as an example on how I might improve on my own.

First, it is NOT called the “Novel Coronavirus” it name is Covid-19, a new virus in the coronavirus family…

“Novel Coronavirus” was a term that got used earlier on in the pandemic. I know it’s not the medical dictionary name, but it’s been used enough. Ok, what you said is correct that it’s in the same virus family, but you full stop there to justify ignoring it. Since you so graciously pointed out this perfect example, lets see how different are SARS and MERS are.

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/how-do-sars-and-mers-compare-with-covid-19#MERS

Same family of viruses, sure, but VERY different behaviours and outcomes. You may as well say that you, your father, and your brother, are the exact same person and behave the exact same in every way. Why didn’t we freak out more over these previous viruses at the time? Because they spread MUCH slower than Covid, but mostly, we didn’t have an entire countercultures formed around the ideas that everyone must be 100% safe all the time, or that masks = slavery.

So the lockdowns were, to some degree, of our own making due to our societal inability to seek balance (a constant theme on this blog if you’ve been here a while).

What does this have to do with anything? This information is about as useful as the study that showed covid-19 can survive on surfaces for 27 days in the dark. Mental note, don’t go into rooms that have been dark for 26 days and start licking the surfaces…

It means just that, who knows? So… maybe we should take reasonable precautions? Your hyperbolic and funny example is still useful in the sense that you’ve esentially created a set of guidelines to follow in order to avoid infection. Can you really trust all of the idiots out there to keep from licking everything in the dark? Surely the govment just wants to keep us from the secret of the tasty walls… Yes, it’s really stupid, but that’s where we are as a society; the lysol drinkers proved it.

Your argument is based on appealing to people’s fears while minimizing the actions taken. The unlikely chance of blindness or liver failure 5 years from now in a handful of people is not a justifiable reason to shut the economy down for everyone else….

How do you predict who has the later complications or how many? How do you know it’ll only be a handful? Mind sharing that data from 2025? Where have I minimized actions? Again, if you read what I was saying, I was agreeing that we can’t lockdown the economy for some future fear, but on the other hand, we should do everything WITHIN REASON to stop the spread. I refer back to my contention that the lockdowns are a result of the inability to trust western society to follow guidelines that are clearly in their best interest.

…because masks alone doesnt do anything as per the CDC…

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/diy-cloth-face-coverings.html

Try getting your news from a primary source, for once. There are also a lot of useful links on the side full of other recommendations we can use as appropriate.

I do agree with you that the economy could be open tomorrow with people deciding for themselves how they want to protect themselves after understanding the options and consequences. Stop relying on governments to tell you what to do.

Thanks, I know we’re on that page at least. However, it’s not “personal choice” to decide how to “protect yourself”, it’s preventing the spread of a disease to other people, meaning that by not wearing a mask, you are increasing the likelyhood of infecting others.

Make it political and deflect all you want but we are talking numbers and science here. What numbers are getting higher?? Deaths?

Unfortunately, it was political before we started talking yesterday, and it’s politics that keeps us from reopening. That mortality rate will drop as folks prevent further spread, and better treatments are found. Though, why spread it around on purpose in the meantime? — Wear a mask where you can, avoid big groups, add other steps as needed, and have at ‘er.

The numbers (worldometer) in April was showing 20% mortality. Now the numbers are showing 4%. With more tests and confirmed cases, I’m sure the 4% mortality will go down further. But that isn’t scary enough so the narrative has changed from “look at all the deaths” to “look at all the cases!!”

Hilarious. You said in your earlier comment that we knew plenty back in March and didn’t need to shut down. Now you’re saying there was a 20% fatality rate in April? Was being worried about the spread good or bad at that point? Or, is 20% fatality still a “wuss” number?

Don’t like the term? Blame the doctors that coined it. And comparing the influenza to covid-19, being in the same coronavirus family is comparing Apples (Macintosh) to Apples (Grannysmith).

It’s not the doctors, it’s the people that willfully misinterpret what the doctors say for their own agendas, lefty or righty. As demonstrated in an earlier link and with your father and brother, it’s not actually red apples to green apples at all. Viruses don’t work like normal species. When they mutate, it’s a way bigger swing than a simple colour change.

As for your dumb (sorry no better word for it here) talk around a strong car crash or strong cancer….ever heard of benign vs. malignent cancer? or how about a car crash that someone walks away from versus dying in? Cringe.

Using “cringe” on greaterfool. Cringe. Seriously though, you’re trying too hard to maintain this cognative dissonance. In that moment, it became impossible for you to imagine how a car crash might cause permanent damage to a person. Not everyone “walks away” even if they live. So, we should take precations like wearing a mask and washing.. sorry I meant wear a seatbelt and obey traffic laws. Also, how often do people get to walk away vs. permanent injury vs. death? To further this silly analogy into the present “debate”, are we reporting car crash numbers properly? That guy who died in a car wreck was obese, so why wasn’t that written on the death certificate? I think you get the point of what we’re up against.

wow nothing gets passed you. Maybe I should have put “lolz” or literally write out “laudz” for you to understand that my last statement was clearly a joke.

Well, you’re use the colours of apples as an analogy, and using terms like “cringe”, so why wouldn’t I take that seriously? Did your macintosh/granny smith apple analogy have an invisible “lulz” after that too?

Covid-19: A disease so deadly that you need a test to confirm you have it.

A funny joke to describe the overreaction, but irrelevant to my argument. I never described it as 100% fatal, nor did ever imply fatality was the only possible outcome. Just take it seriously enough to stop spreaking it on purpose, ok?

Anyway, thanks for the lesson on formatting.

#60 Faron on 10.22.20 at 4:19 pm

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm

–The virus’ name is SARS-CoV-2, the disease is COVID-19 akin to HIV:AIDS. It was called the novel corona virus until it had a name.
–n1tro, when a new strain of virus comes on the scene, is highly contagious, and is in the same family of diseases that has extremely lethal members (MERS and SARS1) maybe some caution is in order? Especially knowing that the only information we had about the disease early on was coming from China who isn’t known for transparency and even then was telling us the mortality was high.
–Flu is NOT a coronavirus. Common colds are. The FLU and a cold are different things.
–The Spanish flu was a strong flu, it killed millions, relating the novel coronavirus to a strong flu doesn’t make it sound less deadly.
–Are you an American Gladiator?

#61 Kona on 10.22.20 at 4:20 pm

WFH is great for people who actually work from home. They build the walls between home and work and respect them. They remember that they are employees at home. They enter a home office at 8 and leave at noon for lunch and back again for the afternoon and leave again at 4. None of the nonsense of playing with the dog, throwing in a load of laundry or putting on dinner. You didn’t do that when you went to the office so why do it now? Your location doesn’t matter. You are at work on your employer’s dime so it is time to actually act like it and do the work that you are paid to do.

Those who get that love WFH, but they are small in number. The rest need to be in the office. They aren’t any more productive in the office, but they feel better and that is all that counts.

#62 Linda on 10.22.20 at 4:33 pm

I think WFH satisfaction depends on circumstances. For the social butterflies, it is their version of hell on earth, especially if they live alone. For the misanthropes, heaven on earth, especially if they live alone:)

#63 jess on 10.22.20 at 4:39 pm

payback?

…”in November 2006, former Conservative Garth Turner claimed that McVety had once boasted to him of his influence with Prime Minister Stephen Harper, saying “I can pick up the phone and call Harper and I can get him in two minutes.” McVety flatly denied saying this, after which Turner firmly reiterated his claim.[11]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_McVety
McVety, president of the Canada Christian College and the far-right Institute for Canadian Values, called on his followers to buy PC memberships and cast votes for Ford – someone he describes as a “faithful man.”

“The leadership will be won by just a few thousand votes,” McVety told his Facebook followers this week. “You and your friends can make a difference as we see our land healed.”
https://ipolitics.ca/2020/10/21/the-real-reason-the-ford-government-wants-to-let-canada-christian-college-grant-degrees/
https://www.thestar.com/politics/provincial/2020/10/22/tories-under-fire-for-granting-university-status-to-evangelical-college.html
https://pressprogress.ca/pastors-who-preached-homophobic-and-anti-semitic-views-endorse-doug-ford-for-ontario-pc-leader/

#64 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 4:39 pm

#48 Sheesh on 10.22.20 at 3:35 pm
#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm
covid-19 isnt the “flu”, inFLUenza A, B, and C are in the coronavirus family and depending on the years infect the population more than other strains so using the words “strong” flu is correct.
…..
Well, you got that wrong. Influenza A,B and C are, wait for it…INFLUENZA viruses. Not related to corona virus. What else are you wrong about?
————
You got me! Disregard everything else I said. I’m just a Russian agent of disinformation. Thanks for adding to the discussion though.

#65 Katherine on 10.22.20 at 4:39 pm

I believe that most people who work from home do like it. The reason studies show more people are unhappy since covid is due to missing out on seeing extended family and friends, going to shows, travelling etc. The ones I hear who would love to get back to the office are the ones who don’t like being quarantined with their significant other. I’m retired so can’t speak from experience….just glad I love my husband and spending lots of time with him.

#66 mick McClean on 10.22.20 at 4:43 pm

Not so fast Alberta Boy. Having workers in India isn’t as convenient for the travelling HR person who will be inspecting your WFH office set up at any time. If she hears crying kids or is accosted by your fancy shih tzu it’s back to the 40 min commute, the $15 per day parking, the poutine and a beer lunch and 2 hour commute back home in a blizzard for you.

#67 S.O on 10.22.20 at 4:56 pm

Next month Canada’s central bank will stop flooding the market with cheap mortgage credit, interesting too see what will happen….

I have a friend who moved out of Vancouver city and now they regret it, Their look at a way too go back. I think this will be more common once people realize that the commute sucks, and like Garth said theres little social life in the suburbs …..

#68 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 4:59 pm

#59 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 4:17 pm

I won’t quote the thread. Too much text for others to scroll by. Don’t want people cramping their finger and wearing out their mouse wheels.

Lockdowns being of our own making – disagree. The lockdowns were the making of the few (governement) based on advice of a few others (government doctors).

By not wearing a mask, you are not increasing the chance of infecting others. Your logic presumes the non mask wearer is infected. Also, you leave out the fact that enough people wear masks incorrectly making them moot. And I won’t mention the studies that have been done on the effectiveness of masks. The same people who spread this nonsense about wearing a mask to stop the spread to others are the ones who think doubling up on masks gives double the protection.

20% mortality rate in April because the records just started being collected. Obviously when you test more people, the amount of positive cases would increase while the mortality would go down. But this didnt stop the media from touting “20% death rate”, “models estimate 2M deaths”, etc, etc. My point is essentially the same as yours. We didn’t know how severe the virus was at the time yet we took a severe reaction to it, crippling our economy in the process.

No one is saying the virus isnt real or doesn’t kill let alone damage others. But until the studies come out and let’s us know, we can keep killing the economy using a few examples of people who have gotten lung damage, etc. There are so many factors to how person A responds versus person B.

Let’s stop the spread indeed but acknowledge things like cancelling flights because a 2 year old won’t keep a mask on before the flight is STUPID over reaction. What’s next? If we can prove the person who gave us covid-19 wasn’t wearing a mask, we should then be able to sue them for damages?

#69 mike from mtl on 10.22.20 at 5:00 pm

Would love to WFW, thankful I made the ‘cut’ and still employed but this whole thing is making me crazy. Leaving the house to clear your mind would I imagine be good for your mental health.

That compounded with the fact, basally everything ‘people interactive’ is gone, and you can’t really go anywhere.

My employer would go back tomorrow, but with the onerous rules and elevator restrictions, doesn’t make sense. So far WFW is controlled as needed basis, only a handful of people are doing that out of normal hundreds.

#70 FreeBird on 10.22.20 at 5:05 pm

Wiley’s online medical journal info on SARS COV-2/COVID-19, ARDS and precursors:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.5694/mja2.50674

CMAJ on antibody tests:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.5694/mja2.50674

“Immunity passports based on antibody tests or tests for infection face substantial technical, legal, and ethical challenges.” Health passports now in Ireland.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30630-7/fulltext

#71 Trojan House on 10.22.20 at 5:08 pm

#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm

Don’t know who wrote that the “novel coronavirus” is called Covid-19 but that is wrong. The novel coronavirus is called SARS-coV-2. Covid-19 is the name given to the disease caused by SARS-coV-2.

#72 Not 1st on 10.22.20 at 5:09 pm

Virus doesn’t scare me in the least. It’s Trudeau that makes me want to stay in bed for the next decade.

#73 Handsome Ned on 10.22.20 at 5:13 pm

I never had to work “downtown” but I did do a 2 week jury duty stretch in downtown Vancouver. Had to say I enjoyed it, went to a different cafe everyday for lunch and my head was on a swivel for the ahem “scenery”. Pretty boring for a young person working from home in the suburbs.

#74 crossbordershopper on 10.22.20 at 5:16 pm

you can move to rural Saskatchewan and get a place for price of a car.
you can buy junk for $30K, but hey its roof, garage, small bedrooms etc.
if all you need is the internet to do your job you might as well move to where its cheaper in Canada. with same benefits.
of course your employer is one step ahead of you and is hiring anyone from around the world at a fraction of your wage.
so in the end, the pandemic makes most employees poorer, either you get paid by piece work which is more production with same wage or job loss to foreigner willing to work for a plate of rice and dal.

#75 S.Bby on 10.22.20 at 5:18 pm

DELETED

#76 Bill on 10.22.20 at 5:24 pm

#36 WTF on 10.22.20 at 3:08 pm
#16 Bill “Winter is hell in the east so have fun with that”
Well coming from BC “the east” could be from Hope to St Johns.
T0 clarify, Nova Scotia while colder than the Lower Mainland but not as cold as Whistler . That Gulf Stream thingy goes a long way to keep the weather quite temperate on the East coast.
——————————————————–
Right..
I can hit the beach with a rock from both my places. Ye interior gets cold period. We certainly get storms but they get STORMS in the east.
Whistlers a dry cold. Much easier to take.
Didn’t Halifax get 100 ft of snow last year?

#77 Dogman01 on 10.22.20 at 5:29 pm

Vancouver is Out West. So is Fort St John. Do they have the same weather? Neither do St John’s and Halifax. Sheesh, people. Try harder. – Garth

——————————————————

It looks to me that parts of NS are south of Portland and you have the influence of a large body of water to moderate things.
http://www.bytemuse.com/post/interactive-equivalent-latitude-map/

South Ontario looks good from my perspective.

Snow in Calgary and it is – 8 as a high…. I keep explaining to people that Calgary is at the same latitude as James Bay, have a look at a Map.
Only 6 months of winter to go here…..at lease we do have some nice sunny days.

#78 Doghouse Dweller on 10.22.20 at 5:29 pm

Garth,
“Down East” all the places in the “Bubble” ,Yes b`y.

#79 yorkville renter on 10.22.20 at 5:36 pm

been back in the office since May… and now more lunch spots have opened up. life is pretty good, actually

#80 Howard on 10.22.20 at 5:36 pm

#61 Kona on 10.22.20 at 4:20 pm

Those who get that love WFH, but they are small in number. The rest need to be in the office. They aren’t any more productive in the office, but they feel better and that is all that counts.

————————————

How are you privy to what other people feel?

There are plenty of WFH studies that contradict the one mentioned in today’s blog post, btw.

#81 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 5:38 pm

#68 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 4:59 pm

Yes, let’s ditch the quotes, good call.

My logic presumes that the non-mask wearer could be infected, just as a mask wearer could be infected. The mask wearer is far less likely to spread the virus. That’s all. If masking is not an option (heavy labourer?), there are additional ways to reduce the potential risk to others. Mostly it’s just being considerate of other people’s space and mindful not to stand too close all the time. It’s never going to be 100% perfect, but we should try our best within reason.

The Apr 20% number shows that it was indeed scary, at the time. I don’t want to contend that lock-downs were ever the 100% correct solution, but it was felt to be the best option at the time by leaders for good or ill. Into the late spring/summer once we were more sure about what we were dealing with, we definitely needed to move towards a better plan, but unfortunately everyone had made it political by that point. Weak leadership and misguided public opposition (be they pro or anti lock-down) has maintained the deadlock.

Yes, canceling a flight for a naughty 2-year old is just dumb. Politely ask the parent and child to disembark, or, just accept it as a one-off risk. Not everyone is capable of following guidelines, especially a 2-year old for obvious cognitive reasons. What’s the adult excuse? I’m very worried it still might be cognitive reasons for the majority. ** If a person legitimately can’t wear one for REAL medical reasons, then I apologize to them because I don’t include them in that group, and hope they can still observe other guidelines as they are able.

I would add to YOUR argument also, that there are persons with very sick family members with non-Covid conditions in the hospital who are forbidden from visting, even if they follow safety guidelines 100%. How twisted and cruel is that? We’ve all lost perspective.

We’ve all been consumed in hyperbole and overreaction that we no longer seem able to get where we need to. I honestly believe we should mandate masks indoors until the data says it’s OK not to. It’s very unfortunate we couldn’t get there by April before it became a nationwide “mask-debate”.

#82 Danger Dan on 10.22.20 at 5:46 pm

” That’s why workplaces developed, cities formed and urbanization has been the most prevalent trend of the last century.”

Recency bias! :)

#83 Sparky on 10.22.20 at 5:48 pm

“And don’t move here. We’re busy working.”

Busy working on a vaccine for Covid? Or is that a problem for the Queen’s elves?

#84 Spectacle on 10.22.20 at 5:48 pm

The relevance of the U.S politics in regard to Candians own Economic volatility & Security is important. For example, I searched the Biden, crack smoking, underaged porn scandal, and Bidens blatant Treasonous selling out the US for over 30 years. All linked to potentialy the new US (our neighbour) Presidency.

The Biden crimes , scandal & corruption will negatively effect Canada . Interesting fact though, the media is not covering it.

So as individuals we must search for facts, hidden agendas, and the real machinations put in front of us. The contents of Bidens hard drive ( underage porn, crack abuse, treasonous email trails, is just as important as is the detailed understanding of WFHome, Balanced portfolios, and Risk management & reduction. Its just a bit of work getting past Kanye for president, kardashian wardrobe fails, and Borat movie review junk!

Eg : turns out China Communist Party owns the Bidens. Search it yourself…. How far behind is Canada in that same risk? Uge…

#85 Toronto_CA on 10.22.20 at 5:55 pm

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-technology/permanently-remote-workers-seen-doubling-in-2021-due-to-pandemic-productivity-survey-idUKKBN2772P8?il=0

That’s timely…

“The survey said information technology decision-makers expect permanent remote work to double to 34.4% of their companies’ workforces in 2021, compared with 16.4% before the coronavirus outbreak, a result of positive productivity trends.

About 72% of their companies’ total global workforce is currently working remotely, according to the CIOs.

Of the more than 1,000 CIOs interviewed for the survey, 48.6% reported that productivity has improved since workers began working remotely, with only 28.7% of respondents indicating a decline in productivity.”

#86 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 6:01 pm

covid lessons:

http://www.yourdestinationnow.com/2020/10/what-covid-has-taught-us-picture.html

It is “safe for work”, whether that be at work or at home.

#87 Sheesh on 10.22.20 at 6:04 pm

#64 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 4:39 pm
You got me! Disregard everything else I said. I’m just a Russian agent of disinformation. Thanks for adding to the discussion though.
….
So, I wasn’t completely correct either. After looking into the taxonomy of viruses (because I’m a nerd) it turns out that Influenza viruses and corona viruses are classed in the same Kingdom. Although so are Rabies, Hantavirus, Ebola, polio and hepatitis and several other nasties.
Don’t worry, I do disregard most of the things you say about covid, but only because you seem to have questionable sources.

#88 Mr Canada on 10.22.20 at 6:14 pm

Pros and Cons of Working Remotely

Pros:

Access to larger labor pool
Reduced real estate expense
Employee retention
Headcount scalability
Scheduling flexibility
Carbon footprint
Work-life balance
Fewer health risks

Cons:

Security/Data risks
Distractions in home
On-boarding challenges
Management challenges
Bandwidth reliability
Equipment repair downtime
Team building
Productivity

#89 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 6:22 pm

Was looking to see if that RBC chart was accurate and UNFORTUNATELY it is.

Out today from eurostat:

https://i.imgur.com/ALqCqGX.png

“Euro area seasonally adjusted government deficit at record high of 11.5% of GDP in Q2 2020.”

Above discretionary deficit, EXCLUDES non-discretionary deficit.

Eyeballing the RBC chart (both discretionary and non-discretionary), 11.5% looks about right for Europe.

Thus, the RBC chart probably to end of Q2 or June end.

Imagine what end of Q3 or September end is going to look like?

…where’s “Apocalypse2020” when you need him/her?

——————-

Pooched.

-Garth (in a delirious moment of understatement).

#90 Reality is stark on 10.22.20 at 6:27 pm

The last chart said it all.
That is all you need to read.
Spending other people’s money does not lead to future prosperity.
Eventually other people’s money runs out. It ran out in Venezuela. It’ll run out here too.
Canadians are delusional people who get drunk on money they don’t have. Swedish tax rates have to come here very soon. When they arrive you won’t have to worry about opportunity because you will be unable to find it in this country.
If your child is in the top 10% they will be fine.
As the feminist rhetoric goes everyone deserves a partner in the top 10% as a right.
Good luck with that.

#91 Ultraman on 10.22.20 at 6:44 pm

WFH, observations from the receiver, a small retail business dealing with a tech issue on the release of a new product on a system managed jointly by BMO and RBC.

1. Talking with some of the support staff, with all the background noise, reminded me when I was young, yes I’m 65, so some of you might not relate, and there was 3 or 4 other families on the same phone line.

2. It seems that if you are at home and working customer service in your soiled underwear’s, your offering may be at par…with the soiled underwear’s, that is.

Put me in the very sceptical category for WFH concept.

#92 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 6:50 pm

#19 Classical Liberal Millennial

“Rapid testing at airports…Time to plan our next vacay.”

Where are you ‘gonna go?

‘Cause it ain’t Europe. Cdn tourists been banned from there as of today.

Well there’s always Albania, Bosnia Herzegovina etc. in that region, go watch a war in real time (Armenia, Azerbaijan, Russian tanks in Georgia assembling, Turkish war drones flying overhead) and a few Caribbean nations (fly direct, DO NOT land in the US) + Mexico (low case count).

If you are in ON or PQ unofficially, the rest of Canada probably does not want you travelling there either – and definitely NOT the Atlantic Bubble.

Lucky you.

Decisions, decisions…

#93 Penny Henny on 10.22.20 at 6:52 pm

Funniest thing I saw today was in regards to the Iranian Gov posing as proud boys trying to influence Democratic voters to stay home or pay the consequences.
I thought Iran hated Trump, you know sanctions and all.
Why would they want to help him?

#94 Jake on 10.22.20 at 6:52 pm

If WFH is the future, Apple goofed big time with Apple Park.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Park

#95 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 6:56 pm

#44 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 3:27 pm
The graph of Canada’s deficit spending vs 17 other countries is a warning of an economic kick in the teeth for at least a decade.
————
CEF,
According to the graph, Turkey is the place to be.
And they have a rightwing strongman in charge.
You’d just love it there. Time to start packing.

#96 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 7:01 pm

“Others (including crusty employers like moi) say this is bunk. WFH is a complete risk for most organizations and employees. Productivity falls. Communications falters. Synergy fizzles. Mistakes multiple. Ideas wither. Besides, any worker not needed in the workplace can eventually be replaced by either AI or some dude in Manila making one-tenth the wages who doesn’t have a giant mortgage in Surrey. Out of sight, out of mind. There’s a reason this phrase endures.”

There is a lot to unpack here but it does summarize the WFW argument pretty well. Time to play devil’s advocate.

My wife has been working from home for 4 years. It was her company’s idea. Her job is national and she might just as easily be dealing with someone in Montreal as Vancouver. No need to waste a cubical on that, they figured. She didn’t really have a choice if she wanted that job.

Her productivity is up, not down. The nature of her job is such that things need to get done in a timely manner. She disappears into her home office every day at 9 am and we don’t see her again until 6 pm. I have never once caught her playing solitaire.

Her salary is up, not down. Regular increases just like everybody else and a promotion.

She is not likely to be replaced by AI any time soon, but when the AI arrives that can do her job she will be replaced anyway. That is true of all workers whether they work from work or work from home. No worker anywhere in the world who can be replaced by a $1,000 computer and $20,000 worth of software (per license) is going to keep their job. And the computer can work 24/7.

And those dudes in Manila aren’t nearly as cheap as they seem. Anyone who has ever worked on an outsourcing knows this to be true. First of all, they are generally incompetent and the learning curve is slow and agonising. Second there is always a middle man. You don’t hire the dude in India directly, you hire Sapient. Third, the middle man always keeps staff in your office to handle any interactions that are necessary. Forth, there is a lot of wire between here and India that presents an increased reliability risk. Not good for critical functions. You want the server in the building and a second backup server at least in the same vicinity.

So what is the future going to look like? Some jobs aren’t suited to independent work so they will return to the office. I can’t for example foresee the trading floors disappearing because the traders need to communicate with each other “over the air” while they have other people “on the line”. Some jobs will move to an old bank building in Nova Scotia. Some jobs will go to split WFW/WFH arrangements. Some will go near full time WFH. Some will be replaced by AI but that is just an extension of a trend that has with us since the industrial revolution. The only difference between the mechanical dial on an old washing machine from the 60’s and a self driving car is the complexity of what the automation can do. Robots have been building cars for a long time. Every time they wheel a new robot up to the line, a few workers go home.

So there are no new trends because of covid, it just pushed things along a bit.

Oh and if AI does replace your job, it’ll replace the guy in Manila too. So don’t worry about that guy, he isn’t your real competition. He’s in the same boat as you.

PS note: Part of the reason that outsourcing has often proven to be so agonizing is that there is no “job ladder” at the outsourcing firm. Most people do not start out as VP, they start out at the lowest level in the company and gain valuable knowledge as the move up to more demanding jobs, including knowledge specific to the operations of the company. The poor outsourcing dude in Manila goes straight from university to trying to run an ETRM system, with no knowledge of the trading environment. It is painful. It is like trying to get a horse to type on a iPhone. But, as always, you get what you pay for.

#97 steve on 10.22.20 at 7:12 pm

Canada’s 3rd largest Insurance company just announced WFH at least until March 1, 2021.

The industry has a high level of MI information. Metrics are easily monitored.

Employee’s are approx 30% more productive in 2020 than in 2019.

Unfortunately that will likely mean layoffs, but to suggest an employee is less productive because they work from home is … well … in many cases simply wrong.

#98 Danny Partridge on 10.22.20 at 7:12 pm

Approximately half of working Canadians are considering quitting their job. No surprise to me. Sadly, this is a growing trend in this country: able-bodied people who are quite willing to let their government look after them while they sit at home on their PS3 or Iphone 12. It was problematic before CERB, now it is an epidemic.

Free healthcare along with a couple of grand a month and they are good to go. Who knows what is next: free dental? free bus passes? free Tim Hortons coffee and donuts?

What a country.

#99 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.20 at 7:16 pm

Re: #92 Dolce Vita on 10.22.20 at 6:50 pm

“Rapid testing at airports…Time to plan our next vacay.”

Where are you ‘gonna go?

‘Cause it ain’t Europe. Cdn tourists been banned from there as of today.

//////////////////////////////////////////

Europe?

Who would want to go there?

Cuba, Mexico and Jamaica are open, along with their all inclusive, all night long resorts.

24/7 service at the bars and clubs.

Buffet three times a day.

Rapid COVID testing at the airport.

No quarantine.

Check, check, check. Sign me up……………..

#100 Garth's Son Drake on 10.22.20 at 7:17 pm

You are on the wrong side of the trade again Garth.

If people are moving, businesses will follow. Not the other way around where as you claim the city will be waiting for people to return. Hope and prayers won’t change a thing. People are not returning to the city. That is what you call the wrong side of the trade. You have to pivot and act. Anyone who sees this will be ahead of the curve, or at least be able to cut their losses before they lose it all.

And also, you claim people working from home are less productive and being mentally punished? I don’t think so. More like more productive.

I did about 50% online shopping before the pandemic, now 100%.

I cannot tell you how awesome online shopping now is currently in Canada. Huge improvements in the past few years.

Amazon have everything I need with free returns on everything where I just get the carrier to pickup if sending something back.

Instacart, ride shares that also do deliveries, skip the dishes, Saveon Foods in house refrigerated van food delivery is awesome.

I am saving 20 hours per week that was wasted shopping before and the ability to compare products, prices, etc. is off the charts good. I have never had better access to supplies and have never had better goods at the click of a button.

And speaking click of a button, you can one click past grocery shopping carts which means it takes all of 5 seconds to do your grocery shopping. And Costco who has partnered with Instacart delivers for free, right to your door. And every time I have called about an item I was not happy with, they have said keep it and immediately issue refund. No questions asked.

I sold off the car and don’t intend to ever buy another vehicle. It is Uber moving forward once pandemic is over.

An electric vehicle in the coming years may entice me back behind the wheel again – like some awesome oversized whip like the new hummer, Rivian or Tesla. Maybe. Insurance and capital costs are still huge expense and bad allocation of money.

I would not be overlooking these changes. YUUUGE opportunity.

#101 Elon Fanboy on 10.22.20 at 7:20 pm

#92 Dolce Vita…” Where are you ‘gonna go?”

Hawaii just reopened with no quarantine period if you’re pretested.

I’m tempted….it’s been a really shitty year all round.

#102 Ronaldo on 10.22.20 at 7:25 pm

Latest from Westjet.

https://www.westjet.com/en-ca/travel-info/rapid-testing

#103 Tanya Frankel on 10.22.20 at 7:25 pm

US bond yields keep rising 10 year 0.86%, 20 year 1.44%, 30 year 1.68%. Now with Trudeau Liberals making those that spend like drunken sailors look like a joke and rising bond yields in Canada, all rates going up and 30 year rates were under 1% now 1.26%.

Debt interest costs will skyrocket and our dollar to US dollar is going to 67 to 68 cents short term, 60 to 62 cents in the next 6 to 9 months at most. Bend over and pay $1.60 to $1.65 for a US dollar pretty soon.

The Bank of Canada’s 0.5% inflation rate is understated by at least 6 to 7 times, more like 3% to 3.5% real current average inflation. It will only get worse.

#104 Dave on 10.22.20 at 7:26 pm

Wow, 84% of people need to get a life and learn how to balance it… 2-3 hrs less commuting/getting ready/etc + being able to multi-task at home tasks = so much more time for family, real friends (not work “friends”), community, recreating etc. Not sure where these stats are coming from, I don’t know anyone under 45 who wants to go back. In terms of work, never has the process of collaborating been so efficient and there’s way less distractions (water cooler, the Bobs, etc) to deal with. Being able to record meetings and processes seamlessly, share screens real time, and having meetings without going through the process of booking meetings or entering an elevator is a game changer. Al the while, decreased costs for everyone. Manila and India were tried 10+ years ago and it failed on many levels for many jobs, which maybe points to the occasional face time at the office or some hybrid model model in the end. Must be old dinosaurs lining the pockets of these surveys… or the reits, or corporations locked into long term leases lol. Been a disciple for a while Garth, and you’ve lead us down a great path, but for this one I strongly disagree. And strangely, my sister, a mental health professional, has gone from a 6 month wait list to zero… consistent elsewhere too. So perhaps mental health is just en vogue in the media, or people are just using it as an excuse… yes, of course there’s legit concern for some… or maybe it’s Just all those using CERB money for drugs to OD on skewing the surveys?

#105 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 7:31 pm

@#95 Ponzie’s Pasha
“You’d just love it there. Time to start packing.”

++++

Ah yes. Mr Erdogan.
He even has a moustache similar to Hitlers’
I partied with some people from Istanbul one night in Vancouver.
Their drinking capacity was impressive for being secular Millenials from a Muslim country.
Not sure I want to go there ( its a dry heat) but if I did I’m sure they would allow me internet access to torment Austrian ex-pats…..

#106 Gary Richardson on 10.22.20 at 7:44 pm

Get ready for a 2% 10 year and 3% 30 year treasury rates by Jan-2022. You will all see. Canada will be only 40 to 50 basis points behind them.

Your mortgage rates will be in the 2.9% to 3%+ and cost an extra $500 to $750 a month add in all increases of property taxes, utilities, condo fees, water, garbage, food, auto, home insurance, other fee increases cost of living increases and $900 to $1,000 a month more is a certainty by then. Good luck keeping up.

#107 Faron on 10.22.20 at 7:48 pm

#95 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 6:56 pm

#44 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 3:27 pm
The graph of Canada’s deficit spending vs 17 other countries is a warning of an economic kick in the teeth for at least a decade.

————

CEF,
According to the graph, Turkey is the place to be.
And they have a rightwing strongman in charge.
You’d just love it there. Time to start packing.

Hah, interesting. The Turkish currency has been crashing hard/inflation is running rampant there. Yet Canada is printing dollars and spending their hearts out and the currency continues to gain on the USD. Imagine that? Doesn’t sound like the Venezuela many of you make Canada of the future out to be. Turkey also has managed to reduce it’s deficit during the pandemic?

Good chart BTW Garth. Way more informative than the one showing the 400% growth in debt or what have you.

#108 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 7:49 pm

#14 Dogman01 on 10.22.20 at 1:49 pm

Unfortunately the pendulum of wealth accumulation by a small minority (the 1%) while standard of living decline for everyone else (wage earners) went too far, and now I believe we are at the beginning of the inevitable pendulum swing too far the other way, the Wealthy class have overplayed their hand and now we get the “Socialist backlash”.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/06/the-pitchforks-are-coming-for-us-plutocrats-108014

—————————

Who’s standard of living declined where over the last 100 years?

We have to stop comparing the notional wealth of certain business owners to the money it takes to lead a decent life and decrying the “wealth gap”. Bezos only gained so called billions of net worth from covid because Robinhood traders bid his stock through the roof. He still owns roughly the same amount of Amazon. It could be said that the event was totally out of his control. And extremely hard for him to convert to actual cash. To do that he would have to sell. But to who? If he put just a small portion of his holdings up for sale “no limit” the Robinhoods would be absolutely creamed and his covid wealth would be gone that day.

These numbers are all notional people. They exist only in our minds. There is some “fundamental” value a company like Amazon has, but with interest rates at near zero it is anybody’s guess what it is because there are no reasonable comparatives.

Steve Jobs got incredibly wealthy after Apple released the iPhone, but I got a computer, phone, internet, GPS, music library, calendar, camera, video camera, video conferencing, and countless silly video games in my pocket. I think we both ended up ahead.

Zuckerberg got extremely wealthy of his Facebook thingy but I am not sure why you people use it. But for those who insist on sharing pictures of what they are having for dinner or letting the maximum number of people possible know that they are having a better vacation than you did I suppose they find it valuable. And Robinhood bid up the stock price.

The wealth gap is real. If you are Bill Gates and you found Microsoft you’ll get really rich selling software for $109 a copy to billions of people. But everybody gets that software for only $109. I’m running this computer on Windows 10 right now and I paid $0 to upgrade from Windows 7. (You can still do that if you have a Windows 7 or 8 licence, they just don’t advertise it anymore.)

We have to stop calculating “wealth” using dollars, which aren’t real. They are simply a notional accounting system and subject to mark to market errors. Especially as interest rates approach zero. If interest rates went to 10%, or even 5%, all that wealth that Bezos and Gates supposedly have becomes a much lower number, while the rest of us might be able to get some cash flow out of a GIC.

And you don’t see any home owners in YVR complaining about the wealth they got notionally penciled in because of low rates. Nope. Every one of them is just hoping like crazy that the music keeps going or when it stops they find a chair.

Remember folks, “wealth” is not “money”. “Wealth” is a mark to market fabrication. It is not until the asset is sold and the accounting department has settled the trades that the mark to market becomes real. And it can often be a lot different than where the traders were marking the book, but never higher. The surprise is always to the downside. Sometimes disastrously.

#109 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 7:51 pm

Right now, people are just happy to have a job.
At the office or from home. Just do what the boss says.
Wait until this is over.
Invest in commercial RE, because it’s gonna fill up fast again.
And the bars and the restaurants.
All the fun in downtown.
Just listen to Petula Clark.
Just stay away from grouchy CEF and his anecdotes.

#110 Stephen on 10.22.20 at 8:02 pm

Actually, there are only 3 provinces in the Maritimes. When you include Newfoundland and Labrador, then you have the Atlantic Provinces. Yes, there is probably a history lesson there somewhere. No, I don’t know what it is. I’m still digging out of all that snow in New Brunswick.

#111 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 8:04 pm

@#109 Ponzie’s Pout
“Just stay away from grouchy CEF and his anecdotes.”

+++

Admit it.
Ponzie is Pig Latin for Curmudgeon…..and you live life vicariously through my anecdotes….
Speaking of curmudgeons….where’s your wife Sara?

#112 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 8:09 pm

#43 Mean Gene on 10.22.20 at 3:26 pm
So are the people who are panic buying housing within the Atlantic bubble Covtards or Covidiots?

————————–

My guess is they were planning to retire there anyway. What’s not to like? And even with the big jump in prices you are still well ahead if you sold out of YYZ. So, covid comes along and it looks like “Freedom 65” now became a forced “Freedom 55” but your YYZ house is actually up in price. Cash out.

They have had this problem in Victoria for years. Prices were and are largely supported by people who want to retire there.

#113 Faron on 10.22.20 at 8:13 pm

#111 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 8:04 pm

….where’s your wife Sara?

Awww, I though she was betrothed to me… I paid good cattle.

#114 KLNR on 10.22.20 at 8:13 pm

@#104 Dave on 10.22.20 at 7:26 pm
Wow, 84% of people need to get a life and learn how to balance it… 2-3 hrs less commuting/getting ready/etc + being able to multi-task at home tasks = so much more time for family, real friends (not work “friends”), community, recreating etc. Not sure where these stats are coming from, I don’t know anyone under 45 who wants to go back. In terms of work, never has the process of collaborating been so efficient and there’s way less distractions (water cooler, the Bobs, etc) to deal with. Being able to record meetings and processes seamlessly, share screens real time, and having meetings without going through the process of booking meetings or entering an elevator is a game changer. Al the while, decreased costs for everyone. Manila and India were tried 10+ years ago and it failed on many levels for many jobs, which maybe points to the occasional face time at the office or some hybrid model model in the end. Must be old dinosaurs lining the pockets of these surveys… or the reits, or corporations locked into long term leases lol. Been a disciple for a while Garth, and you’ve lead us down a great path, but for this one I strongly disagree. And strangely, my sister, a mental health professional, has gone from a 6 month wait list to zero… consistent elsewhere too. So perhaps mental health is just en vogue in the media, or people are just using it as an excuse… yes, of course there’s legit concern for some… or maybe it’s Just all those using CERB money for drugs to OD on skewing the surveys?

maybe you’re just too privileged to see the forest for the trees Dave?

#115 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 8:14 pm

@#110 Stephen
“Actually, there are only 3 provinces in the Maritimes.”
+++

Let me guess. University of Victoria grad?
Bachelor of Arts? A minor in math?

Newfoundland( and Labrador)
Prince Edward Island
Nova Scotia
New Brunswick.

I count four toes….. so four provinces….. Doh!

#116 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.20 at 8:16 pm

Re: Cottagers stay away:

Your village called.

They want their idiot back.

#117 George S on 10.22.20 at 8:19 pm

WFH, it all depends on your situation as to whether you like it or not. My sons and their wives are working from home since March. Their jobs are such that they can do it. they go to work when necessary for meetings and since only 30% occupancy is allowed they are staying WFH so that the people that have crappy home offices or need to work in the office can do it. They both have Really Nice home offices though, lots of sun, windows, back yard, like working in a paradise. However they say that going back to the office will be fine, they miss the interpersonal interactions and things that you just can’t do at home.
They probably aren’t typical because they have about a 12 minute commute to a beautiful building. with plug in parking included.
If there are things that you need to do at work, like lab work, this enforced WFH is driving people crazy.
There is also a problem with hiring people or replacing workers that quit. HR work must be a nightmare.

In the news today is that the CDC has determined that compared to other recent years there have been 300,000 excess deaths so far this year in the US. That is the number I have been waiting for. That means that C19 has killed lots of people that would not have died anyway. It is not just some sort of bad cold and people fussing about it are not whining babies. Whether it is worth destroying the economy of your country? People seem to be willing to destroy the economy of their country for other, less sensible reasons so I guess we will have to see.

#118 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 8:29 pm

#116 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.20 at 8:16 pm
Re: Cottagers stay away:

Your village called.

They want their idiot back.

————————-

Hah! Good one. But why would they? She’s probably Karen to them too.

#119 bullwinkle on 10.22.20 at 8:33 pm

@#115,

You may want to check out Wikipedia on that.

No point in me informing you.

#120 Flop... on 10.22.20 at 8:34 pm

“When Westjet pulled the plug on Atlantic Canada some days ago, I was moved to post this on a local chat board: ‘Bubbles have consequences…’”-Garth.

//////////////////

Are you two-timing us…

M46BC

#121 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 8:38 pm

#101 Elon Fanboy on 10.22.20 at 7:20 pm
#92 Dolce Vita…” Where are you ‘gonna go?”

Hawaii just reopened with no quarantine period if you’re pretested.

I’m tempted….it’s been a really shitty year all round.
————-
Going there may not be problem.
But coming home maybe. Remember in spring when people got stranded by local lockdowns.
Hawaii is expensive. And, of course, don’t get sick?
I spent 20 minutes in ER in Honolulu. Just a checkup.
1,600 Greenback dollars.
And why go to Hawaii anyway?
All the sand is shipped in from California.

#122 Bill on 10.22.20 at 8:39 pm

Let the games begin!
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/politics/trump-to-call-hunters-business-partner-to-the-debate-tonight/

#123 Flop... on 10.22.20 at 8:44 pm

I better spread the misery equally.

Do I have a B.C Green Party election joke in me?

It’s hard to joke about something that’s largely invisible.

Will always be in the shadow of the big two, that being the NDP and the B.C Liberals.

Got one!

B.C Green Party leader Sonia Furstenau is about to become Sonia Thirdenau…

M46BC

#124 Stone on 10.22.20 at 8:46 pm

#109 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 7:51 pm
Right now, people are just happy to have a job.
At the office or from home. Just do what the boss says.
Wait until this is over.
Invest in commercial RE, because it’s gonna fill up fast again.
And the bars and the restaurants.
All the fun in downtown.
Just listen to Petula Clark.
Just stay away from grouchy CEF and his anecdotes.

———

I can never stop laughing every time someone mentions “people are just happy to have a job”.

Because life is so bland without one.

#125 Gogo on 10.22.20 at 8:46 pm

Wfh started before Covid in most of the big six. Office layout were changed so that we can work 2-3 days from hom and when you are in the office you take any seat that is free. We were called to collect whatever we have in office, the bank is vacating the floors. Only 20% at any time will be at offices (back office) not branches. This is reality. Decisions were made and executing on them. Of everything you said about wfh you are right only about mental health. Efficiency is definitely up.

#126 Barb on 10.22.20 at 8:47 pm

#66 “…the travelling HR person who will be inspecting your WFH office set up at any time.”

——————————————-
Other than an IT person’s initial visit to coordinate all the computer/data stuff, why on earth would an HR person ‘inspect your WFH office set up…’ ??

HR?
Gawd…

#127 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 8:47 pm

#113 Faron on 10.22.20 at 8:13 pm
#111 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 8:04 pm

….where’s your wife Sara?

Awww, I though she was betrothed to me… I paid good cattle.
————
No she actually had it for Sailo.
But he’s into other birds right now.
End of thread.

#128 BayArea on 10.22.20 at 8:49 pm

Garth I think its a bit more nuanced than that.

People are not suffering mentally because of WFH. They are suffering for lack of human connection as a result of the lockdowns, social distancing etc. When you work from home in a typical world, you go out for dinner, for drinks, you go hiking, to the gym, to church to barbecues and birthdays and weddings. It is the lack of all these things that is causing the melancholia.

My husband works with Google. He is desperate to get back to the office where they have finely catered meals throughout the day, gyms on site, basketball and tennis courts and can pop in for a scheduled massage. OFCOURSE he wants to go back.

I don’t ever want to work in an office again. Spending 1 hour in traffic both ways is a special kind of hell, never mind not having time to do anything of worth once the slave labor is finished for the day.

What we had before was hell made acceptable. It shouldn’t be. We should find a way to fix work while we can.

#129 zoey on 10.22.20 at 8:51 pm

“go back to the office, don’t move here” … LOL

I have family where you live, its soooooo boring, almost as boring as Mississauga but your getting on so I get it…. yes, the people are nicer but please , don’t be so smug the east coast is not all that.

#130 Stone on 10.22.20 at 8:55 pm

While a majority of employers are confident about the future, 49% of their employees are seriously contemplating quitting. In Ontario that rises to 52% In Quebec, 54%.

———

1 – They still have the quad, RV, Audi, motorcycle, and other toys to pay for that they have on credit. Get real! Lots of whining. Not a lot of actual doing.
2 – Why quit? That’s so dumb. Much better to get laid off and receive a severance package. Why ever would these fools quit and abandon all that free money? It really shows the abysmal financial literacy rate. At least engineer your layoff.

#131 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 8:55 pm

Shutting up for tonite.
Watching de deebate.
Go Joe, Go.

#132 Looking up on 10.22.20 at 8:59 pm

crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 8:14 pm
@#110 Stephen
“Actually, there are only 3 provinces in the Maritimes.”
+++

Let me guess. University of Victoria grad?
Bachelor of Arts? A minor in math?

Newfoundland( and Labrador)
Prince Edward Island
Nova Scotia
New Brunswick.

I count four toes….. so four provinces….. Doh!

——————

No he’s right. Only Nova Scotia, PEI, New Brunswick are considered the maritimes

#133 Sparky on 10.22.20 at 9:03 pm

The Atlantic Bubble should partner with New Zealand and have hot steamy covid-free orgies – fund the plane rides with an Onlyfans account. #envy

#134 zoey on 10.22.20 at 9:06 pm

#100

“I sold off the car and don’t intend to ever buy another vehicle.”

This is the saddest comment I have ever read …your car is freedom..go for a road trip and see the world around you.

#135 Flop... on 10.22.20 at 9:07 pm

Been some pharma talk on here lately.

I’ve tried a few of their products.

Mixed results.

I try to stay away from the stuff as much as possible.

Nothing works like a big bowl of ice-cream…

M46BC

“Which Countries Buy & Sell the Most Drugs?
The pharmaceutical industry is incredibly valuable and is continuing to grow. But just how much of the world’s imports and exports involve pharmaceuticals? To understand the impact of the pharmaceutical industry on the world’s economy, we created two visualizations to demonstrate pharmaceutical imports and exports by country in 2018.”

The pharmaceutical industry accounts for tens of billions of dollars in international trade each year, much of which comes from Europe and the United States

As the opioid crisis in the United States continues to rage on, it might not come as a surprise to see that the United States leads the world in pharmaceutical imports. While local and state governments are trying to hold Big Pharma responsible for its role in the opioid crisis, pharmaceutical companies aren’t concerned about U.S. drug regulations. Big Pharma is a massive industry and has plans to grow even more by targeting growing opioid markets in countries like India.”

World’s Largest Pharmaceutical Exporters

1. Germany: $84.7 billion
2. Switzerland: $71.7 billion
3. United States: $49.7 billion
4. Belgium: $45.7 billion
5. Ireland: $40 billion

Canada’s number 6.3 billion

World’s Largest Pharmaceutical Importers

1. United States: $99.7 billion
2. Germany: $53.7 billion
3. Belgium: $36.7 billion
4. United Kingdom: $33.8 billion
5. Switzerland: $29.3 billion

Canada’s number 12.9 billion

https://howmuch.net/articles/pharmaceutical-trade-around-the-world

#136 Delbert Grady on 10.22.20 at 9:07 pm

I agree with Garth that WFH is crap. When you perform your work at work it separates it from home. When you come home from an honest day’s work it is your oasis and it belongs to you only not to your company. I will bet that many of the WFH crowd now starting to crack feel that their home oasis has been violated because now it’s also their work place. The separation between the two environments is now gone and they no longer feel at ease.

#137 the Jaguar on 10.22.20 at 9:10 pm

@ #5 Don Guillermo on 10.22.20 at 1:21 pm
Thanks for the tip on the new post arrival quickie tests. Just read the press release. I tried to apply for a quarantine exemption a few weeks ago just to see how they would turf me. I argued I was trying to save WestJet’s life. This was the reply:
“”Thank you for contacting Biz Connect.
‘There is an order under the federal Quarantine Act as well as a provincial order under Alberta’s Public Health Act that both require a 14 day quarantine period for those entering Alberta from outside of Canada.”’
Bugger off, more or less.

But we don’t raise quitters in this province, so I wrote to WestJet and the Alberta Government telling them it wasn’t fear of flying but the onerous quarantine that was killing bums in seats on airplanes. Maybe a lot of other people did as well. Once again, Alberta leads the nation. Amen.
I could comment on provinces that seal themselves off from the rest of the country, but I haven’t forgiven them for voting Liberal to secure traditional hand outs while sending their young to Alberta for jobs. We’ll see how that ‘Bubble Strategy’ works out in the long run. Goodwill and the lack of it create memories like elephants. Enough said.

About this WFH debate. My choice always was and is to work from the office, even though the option to work from home was available for all in my work group for the past 5 or more years. Most liked it for the obvious savings on time, transportation, lunches and other expenses, being there for a pet, etc. I understand completely. I think it’s also fair to say that while some are experiencing issues with the addition of other family members in the household, etc. at home during Covid, in normal times it is nice to have ‘options’.

I agree with our host that ‘It hasn’t changed human nature. People need, want and crave other people.’ And it’s obvious that ‘bars, museums, clubs, galleries, restaurants, high-end retail, buskers, protests and shoe-shine guys’ need us too. Culture, sport and leisure require the support of the general public to survive. There are no free rides. Those business thrive on the peeps who work in downtown cores.

This WFH debate reminds me of the scenario where one walks into a restaurant and sees a table full of people occupied with ‘scrolling on their cellphones.’ Not interacting or being engaged with one another. Most of us think of that as kind of pathetic. Work is such a big part of our lives. I like sharing its experiences with other people. Zoom is a tool but not a replacement. Think Jeffrey Tobin. Or maybe don’t.

Life isn’t supposed to be easy. The challenges, frustrations, annoyances keep us in touch with the world, build character and compassion, and especially connect us with the great human struggle. When I walk through the inner city streets of Calgary I see some human suffering. The usual suspects….drugs, homelessness, loneliness, and other conditions of the human experience. I don’t always like it, but I don’t want to be removed from it because I need to understand it. It’s my connection to my community of other peeps.

#138 weiners on 10.22.20 at 9:11 pm

My office in a King St Toronto tower is also closed. Fob works though, to get into the main lobby and also works to get into my office suite. Lots of room, and I must say, the bathrooms have never been cleaner.

#139 Doghouse Dweller on 10.22.20 at 9:13 pm

#112 Nonplused

What’s not to like?
———————–
Those forced “Freedom 55ers” Will have a shock come tax time 12% more minimum , Bubble governance by the sea is expensive !

#140 45north on 10.22.20 at 9:19 pm

Ace Goodheart

Thanks to the wonders of the internet I am able to obtain quite a bit of info about a seller including when they bought the property and for what price (a lot of people trying to flip some piece of garbage they bought in the summer).
I can also search the title (a lot of second mortgages recently registered).
I can even find out if the sellers have recently filed for divorce.
Lots of desperate people out there clinging to last summer’s insane pricing.

that got my attention

Re: Cottagers stay away:
Your village called.
They want their idiot back.

pretty funny

#141 Russ on 10.22.20 at 9:40 pm

Bill on 10.22.20 at 5:24 pm

#36 WTF on 10.22.20 at 3:08 pm
#16 Bill “Winter is hell in the east so have fun with that”
Well coming from BC “the east” could be from Hope to St Johns.
T0 clarify, Nova Scotia while colder than the Lower Mainland but not as cold as Whistler . That Gulf Stream thingy goes a long way to keep the weather quite temperate on the East coast.
——————————————————–
Right..
I can hit the beach with a rock from both my places. Ye interior gets cold period. We certainly get storms but they get STORMS in the east.
Whistlers a dry cold. Much easier to take.
Didn’t Halifax get 100 ft of snow last year?
==============================

Hey Bill,

Let’s review.
From my Vancouver Island perspective, anything 100 miles east of the Horseshoe Bay ferry terminal is beyond Hope. I mean that in the most sincere manner.

As for that silly “Down East” thread, if ya ain’t livin in o’ Acadia ya ain’t Down East until ya hit the America. Maine maybe.

Cheers, R

#142 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 9:45 pm

#81 SeeB on 10.22.20 at 5:38 pm
#68 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 4:59 pm

So we are in agreement, the actions taken whether it be in April or now were/are an over-reaction. Made by clueless, spineless politicians justifying their decisions as “lean on the side of caution” without any real science backing things up at the time. I guess these people can make these willy nilly decisions since their jobs/salaries were/are 100% secured while the masses suffer and businesses shutter down.

Mandatory masks indoors? Sure, I’m down with that. The general public was already starting to do that in April until they were told point blank that masks were ineffective. We later find out, we were lied to because they wanted to save the masks for first responders. Some lives matter more than others I guess.

Lying makes baby Jesus cry I’ve been told. Shame on these people who tell us one thing while doing the opposite.

#71 Trojan House on 10.22.20 at 5:08 pm
#29 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 2:40 pm

Don’t know who wrote that the “novel coronavirus” is called Covid-19 but that is wrong. The novel coronavirus is called SARS-coV-2. Covid-19 is the name given to the disease caused by SARS-coV-2.

Noted. Thanks for the correction!

#143 The Woosh on 10.22.20 at 9:47 pm

#124 Stone on 10.22.20 at 8:46 pm
#109 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.22.20 at 7:51 pm
Right now, people are just happy to have a job.
At the office or from home. Just do what the boss says.
Wait until this is over.
Invest in commercial RE, because it’s gonna fill up fast again.
And the bars and the restaurants.
All the fun in downtown.
Just listen to Petula Clark.
Just stay away from grouchy CEF and his anecdotes.

———

I can never stop laughing every time someone mentions “people are just happy to have a job”.

Because life is so bland without one.

————————————————

Sounds more like someone trying to convince any greater fool to buy his worthless commercial real estate that he just can’t offload. Kind of like REITs.

Example: The only way BPY.UN was able to bring up their stock price was to repurchase a bundle of their own stocks using cash reserves.

What happens to commercial real estate after a year or two of what’s currently going on now? Sounds like a ponzi scheme to me!

But, but, but. Canada signed a whole bunch of deals to get a vaccine when it becomes available. Sure, but where are we in the line to get it. That’s right…last in line. Watch as commercial real estate and related REITs circle the bowl and get flushed down the drain.

#144 TurnerNation on 10.22.20 at 9:52 pm

Luv working from home. I’m self directed, this allows me more. No more office politics or gab fests.
Plus I’m not a morning person. Or an afternoon person.
I don’t want to see anyone let alone co-workers until 5pm. Let’s get his party started.

Head’s up – Air Canada and American Airlines stock powerful moves today with Double the normal volumes traded.

#145 n1tro on 10.22.20 at 9:55 pm

#87 Sheesh on 10.22.20 at 6:04 pm

I dishonored my university microbiology teacher for sure. The questionable source all came from (faded memories) in my head.

😷

#146 TurnerNation on 10.22.20 at 10:05 pm

Watch Seattle. Stuff going on. Over a year ago I hear that Seattle would be the seat of the New Global Order.
Crazy stuff like that you file away. Almost. Until, early in the New System rollout this year it was the very place selected for street theatre and chaos, Chaz zones whatever.
Now they took the 911 phone system down – more chaos.
Oh that number again, 9/11. Nothing to see here.
Gill Bates and Beff Jezos are linked to there too per its Wikipedia entry. Hey if the elites like it…

#147 Bill on 10.22.20 at 10:12 pm

#141 Russ on 10.22.20 at 9:40 pm
—————————————-
LOL I was going to run the RV out there gobble up some burnt lobster. Beauty in the summer. Id prolly fall asleep at the wheel SASK and MAN.

#148 NSNG on 10.22.20 at 10:23 pm

Why is your employee smiling? This is an anomaly. Are you sure your ‘boss’ card is in good standing?

#149 Dave on 10.22.20 at 10:36 pm

#114 KLNR

maybe you’re just too privileged to see the forest for the trees Dave?

—————-

Your reply is a proverbial cliche! Yikes. So you’re implying I’m too involved in the details of a problem to look at the situation as a whole? Because of my privilege? Maybe the problem as a whole gets solved if we actually look back to the individuals, or the details if you will, that are making up the problem. In this case, the people, perhaps someone like yourself, blaming someone or something, when all the while, probably don’t realize they’re the ones to blame. If you want to get on the right side of privilege, perhaps start by holding yourself and only yourself accountable. How about that, a cliche rebuttal! Almost like our politicians! In the end, sorry if I offended you or have pegged you wrong. Wasn’t this a WFH discussion, WTF lol!

#150 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 10:44 pm

@#123 Floppie
“B.C Green Party leader Sonia Furstenau is about to become Sonia Thirdenau…”
++++

Good one. :)

#151 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 10:46 pm

Trump compared himself to Abraham Lincoln regarding race relations in America……

Wow….. just wow…..

Biden…..looks old.
Kamala may be President sooner than everyone thinks.

#152 Nonplused on 10.22.20 at 10:51 pm

Well, not sure what to think about that debate. Trump did much better than last time, but so did Biden. The moderator clearly favored Biden again but this time Trump was more inclined to just wait for his 2 minutes and then address whatever topic he wanted while ignoring the moderator’s questions. He called Biden out on criminal reform, who built the cages, the laptop, the green new deal, pretty much the big six. All Biden could say was “that’s a lie” or “that’s a Russian smear campaign”.

Joe did ok cognitively but you couldn’t watch him speak without thinking he was drunk.

Trump failed to drive the nail home on the 535 kids thing, in that the problem is the parents haven’t claimed them and they can’t find them. He did clear up the cages though.

Overall I would say Trump won this round, despite the moderator being heavily against him again. The 2 minute format silenced the moderator as well.

Still tough to call and it is hard to say how the American voter will respond, if anyone was even watching. I’m still calling trump to win uncontested and will will be known on election day due to exit polling. However what happens the following weeks will be interesting.

Sometimes I think this is all just reality TV and the real decisions are made by a bunch of bankers in a smoky room.

#153 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.20 at 10:58 pm

@#132 Looking Up
“No he’s right. Only Nova Scotia, PEI, New Brunswick are considered the maritimes”

++++
You may want to “look up” again.

Newfoundland’s 1st Premier Joey Smallwood back in 1949 (when they finally joined Canada’s Confederation) was the first person to coin the phrase “The Maritimes” (which means “of the sea”) in reference to the Atlantic Provinces.
He regularly asked school children who the first person was to “name” the region “The Maritimes”.

Joey Smallwood.

A name a porn star will never use.
( Sorry Garth….I couldnt resist)
.

#154 Toronto_IT on 10.22.20 at 11:01 pm

@24 Toronto_CA

I tend to agree with these conclusions. As a manager of staff of 24 we discussed this recently in an online scrum and the result was overwhelmingly in favour of 80-20 split in favour of WFH.

Empirically speaking our productivity measured as delivered project results and timelines etc. Point to no discernible degradation.

And 100 year old historical truths don’t have the same ring in the days of 5G and power apps.

Garth maybe it is different this time. Eh?

#155 mike from mtl on 10.22.20 at 11:18 pm

#137 the Jaguar on 10.22.20 at 9:10 pm

But we don’t raise quitters in this province, so I wrote to WestJet and the Alberta Government telling them it wasn’t fear of flying but the onerous quarantine that was killing bums in seats on airplanes..
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Exactly, I’d fly out no issues just thing is either we’re not welcome with the outright visitor visa bans, 14 day quarantine, or the reality like at home everything is also closed. I have more of a risk getting to the airport than the virus.

Until this is cleared up, free travel and casual tourism is dead.

Honestly I’d like to see the return of expensive airfare like it used to be – weed out the cattle class. $10k+ airfare but it’s truly customer oriented and a luxury. Those discount airlines can finally die of natural causes when airfares are less than a train ticket finally meet reality.

#156 cramar on 10.22.20 at 11:27 pm

So the question remains are these refugees from Ontario that are buying up NS RE retirees who can live anywhere or millennials who will be working from home? What is the demographic of those buyers?

#157 morrey on 10.22.20 at 11:38 pm

I read the comments, they seem to be written in English, but they are not, the most part, parsable.

What are these folks talking about? They seem trapped in some kind of cognitive hell.

Cf. #146 TurnerNation

good gawd!

#158 Cheeky Greene on 10.22.20 at 11:54 pm

I don’t see why WFH should end. I always hated other people anyway. I’m married, kids gone, not lonely, left the country, cut the COL to near nothing because sunshine and sand are free.

I feel like Trudeau must have done when he bailed on the most important job in the country and went to Costa Rica to build sand castles, grow a stupid beard and get drunk. No one cares anymore. Let’s all sink into a morass, let our thinking be done for us.

Trudeau is showing us the way, do nothing, fake it. Why answer to any of the hard work when an American campaign advisor works my advisor and my speeches come ready made from an office of carpet baggers in the UN.

If you’ve got yours, then to hell with the other guy. Be a Bronfman and settle the matter by shipping your wealth out of Canada. Trudeau now has an income guaranteed for life from proceeds out of the Billion Dollar Trudeau Foundation. It’s like a WE Charity pay out on steroids. Why should he care. Get with the program.

Canada is back. We’re the number one country for debt and deficit. Who cares. Look, I’ve got mine. You can sit on it and spin. That’s the Canadian way. I wish Trudeau had given me this example long ago. I wouldn’t have worked so hard. Give up, get lost, adjust to the new replacement program.

You didn’t build that. It isn’t yours. You don’t deserve it. Your great grandparents were privelaged. Imagine building sod houses and living like animals to build a country when all they had to do was borrow spend and spin.

https://financialpost.com/opinion/jack-m-mintz-in-government-spending-and-deficits-were-now-no-1-in-the-world

#159 Canuck on 10.23.20 at 12:35 am

2 weeks after the maritime bubble is lifted, they will get nailed with COVID19

#160 NSNG on 10.23.20 at 12:43 am

There Is A Solution To Big Tech Censorship – But No Politician Will Touch it

https://alt-market.us/there-is-a-solution-to-big-tech-censorship-but-no-politician-will-touch-it/

#161 majik on 10.23.20 at 1:16 am

Working from home, it’s more like living at work.

#162 willworkforpickles on 10.23.20 at 3:12 am

116 – Ace Goodheart
“Re: Cottagers stay away:

Your village called.

They want their idiot back.”

How much accordion can they stand.
He plays the spoons when things get a little slow in the off season and the washboard too.

#163 TurnerNation on 10.23.20 at 7:52 am

#1 X on 10.22.20 at 12:59 pm that the incrementalism toward the end goal. Always controlling our movements, reducing travel. This is basically the New Green Deal.
Too many climate skeptics out there earlier this year but not so with CV.

Say getting a manual test and waiting days is cumbersome no? Wouldn’t it be easier, if everyone had an electronic certificate, oh I don’t know a COV-ID (Certificate of Vax ID?). In order to buy or sell or travel.
Catch-y name.
It’s all right here, https://id2020.org/#
Yes Microsoft is under the Partner page.
2020, that would be year 2020 no, like now?
My that would take some planning.
And to be stored in the Cloud or Blockchain along with our DNA (which is the point of the testing and 23andMe and Ancestry.com. Those tests were fun right?

Now we see, once our rights are taken away they never are given back in the same fashion. A hard lesson for some. If this really is about health why not offer cancer pre-screening at airports…

#164 TurnerNation on 10.23.20 at 7:56 am

Suggesting Ace Goodheart as the next guest blogger ;)
Dolce went off the deep end, now struggling backwards.

#165 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.23.20 at 8:04 am

Covidiots losing it on a Vancouver bus.

https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/vancouver-news/unmasked-translink-passenger-seen-spitting-on-male-passenger-who-calls-her-disgusting-video-2814512

Vancouver is “awesome”.

#166 Steerage on 10.23.20 at 8:21 am

Trump compared himself to Abraham Lincoln regarding race relations in America……

Wow….. just wow…..

Biden…..looks old.
Kamala may be President sooner than everyone thinks.
……..

11 days til Melania divorces him!

#167 Captain Uppa on 10.23.20 at 8:53 am

I have written on here a few times how the younger members in my extended family are not into city amenities, they want nature. This was the sentiment before Covid.

In talking to younger co-workers recently, they are tired of the politics, protests, crime and cement jungle. Usually this type of talk comes from those who are starting families, but all of these co-workers are single and well educated.

Toronto isn’t “finished”, but you will notice a substantial change even when covid is under wraps.

#168 Captain Uppa on 10.23.20 at 8:59 am

I should have been more specific with younger people not wanting “city amenities”. I meant BIG city draws like the ones Garth described in his post (museums, bars, etc.)

All of what I am saying is described in a NY Times article from earlier this year.

America’s Biggest Cities Were Already Losing Their Allure:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/19/us/coronavirus-moving-city-future.html

#169 Guelph Guru on 10.23.20 at 9:08 am

The pandemic is blown out of proportion in the media. Yes there is problem. So we have to take precautions and be careful. Dont need to close down the world.
We have chosen a bunch of wusses to make decisions for us. It’s time for a change. Unfortunately I cannot vote for 2 more years. And even then, my vote may not matter. Majority loves freebies these days.
On another note. How much would it have cost us to build the pipeline in AB? We would have a pipeline by now if we had chosen a sane person to lead Canada and we would be exporting tons of oil to the world when the world opens up again.
Maybe we should paint the pipeline green and then it would qualify as env friendly green project:)

#170 Dharma Bum on 10.23.20 at 9:08 am

“By removing the walls between ‘work’ and ‘home’ they get to play with the dog (or kids), shop, houseclean, exercise or wash their socks in between Zoom meetings, data entry, email frenzy and working on projects.” – GT
——————————————————————–

For the record, I’m going on day 5 without an underwear change.

Things are getting a little spicy.

#171 Dharma Bum on 10.23.20 at 9:15 am

“While a majority of employers are confident about the future, 49% of their employees are seriously contemplating quitting. ” – GT
——————————————————————–

I’ll betchya that statistic would hold true regardless of COVID.

Employees fantasize about quitting all the time.

That’s why the lottery is so popular.

Most people work because they have no other choice.

If they can get money without working, they won’t work.

That’s why Canadians love Mr. Socks. he’s the candy man.

#172 not 1st on 10.23.20 at 9:36 am

Biden just said he would shut down oil and gas. Does he know that PA produces more than 800k bbls a day and TX almost 5M, along with ancillary production in NM, MI, and OH?

Maybe he thought he was in Canada where one dictator can try to do that pandering to a know nothing urban crowd, but the US has the electoral college to prevent that.

He just threw the election big time.

#173 not 1st on 10.23.20 at 9:39 am

Garth your new hummer is here, starting at just $80k US.

Ahh electric vehicles, when half the population will no longer afford to drive, then we will hit our emissions targets.

https://www.caranddriver.com/gmc/hummer-ev

#174 Dharma Bum on 10.23.20 at 9:40 am

#144 Turner Nation

Plus I’m not a morning person. Or an afternoon person.
——————————————————————–

Me neither.

Every time I got caught yawning or dozing off during a morning meeting at work, one of my colleagues would say: “Guess yer notta mornin’ person, eh?”.
I’d say: “Nope.”
They’d say: “So, I guess yer prolly a nightowl then, eh?”
I’d say: “Nope.”
They’d say: “So whattar ya then?”
I’d say: “I’m an 11-3 person.”
And that, dogs, is what I am.

#175 Mattl on 10.23.20 at 9:51 am

By removing the walls between ‘work’ and ‘home’ they get to play with the dog (or kids), shop, houseclean, exercise or wash their socks in between Zoom meetings, data entry, email frenzy and working on projects.

—————————————————————-

This may shock you, but people in WFW situations have also figured out ways to be unproductive for most of the work day. These include long lunches, coffee break, never-ending hallway talk, smoke breaks, the commute, arrive late / leave early, phone time with friends and family, surfing the net, etc. Offices can be a drain on productivity.

And we have tools to monitor what our people are doing remote. I couldn’t care less if they walk their dog 3x a day as long as they deliver on their tasks. 2 hour commute save = lots of time to walk the dog. WFH allows for significantly more time in a 12 hour period to deliver 8 hours of work.

I respect your position on this but it comes from an old school management style that says “if I can’t see you, I don’t believe you are working”. Thankfully management style change – wfh and the hybrid versions of it are here to stay.

#176 Fly on the wall on 10.23.20 at 9:56 am

170 Dharma Bum

“By removing the walls between ‘work’ and ‘home’ they get to play with the dog (or kids), shop, houseclean, exercise or wash their socks in between Zoom meetings, data entry, email frenzy and working on projects.” – GT
——————————————————————–

For the record, I’m going on day 5 without an underwear change.

Things are getting a little spicy.

__________________________

Me too. Same underwear for the whole week. No baths. No shaving.

Some days no toilet paper usage either -who cares? (the wifey has smelling loss)

Quite the life, WFH :)

#177 Nixter on 10.23.20 at 9:58 am

http://www.tathasta.com/2020/10/italian-restaurant-owners-who-said-we_21.html

This is exactly what all businesses in Ontario should be doing.
Give the finger to a stupid spineless politician and brain dead public health.

#178 CHERRY BLOSSOM on 10.23.20 at 10:01 am

I watched a documentary yesterday on Amazon which showed how Amazon is the biggest polluter in the world. All those trucks and airplanes going non stop. Over half of their returns end up in the dump and the trash is piling up towards the sky

#179 Chad on 10.23.20 at 10:08 am

Surprised your not talking about the economics of the Lobster situation out east? People have issues regardless of Covid.

Not a lobster blog. – Garth

#180 Brett in Calgary on 10.23.20 at 10:15 am

Please tell me this is fake…

https://buyandsell.gc.ca/procurement-data/tender-notice/PW-ZL-105-38463

#181 Tom from Mississauga on 10.23.20 at 10:17 am

We need to restart the Inter’l Student industry. Ontario was suppose to have 160,000. That’s no tuition, rent, grocery, travel and so on. As important as auto sector.

#182 IHCTD9 on 10.23.20 at 10:24 am

#167 Captain Uppa on 10.23.20 at 8:53 am
I have written on here a few times how the younger members in my extended family are not into city amenities, they want nature. This was the sentiment before Covid.

In talking to younger co-workers recently, they are tired of the politics, protests, crime and cement jungle. Usually this type of talk comes from those who are starting families, but all of these co-workers are single and well educated.

Toronto isn’t “finished”, but you will notice a substantial change even when covid is under wraps.
____

I have a soon to be 36 year old Sister, her story was much the same. She went all the way with it though. North of 7, living in a beautiful Timber framed house on the edge of a small lake with hubby and 2 kids.

She likes photography, so we get some awesome pics. The last one was of a young Moose standing just off the side of their deck. It’s a literal paradise up there, cost of living for them is dirt cheap outside groceries. Daughter #2 was just born this spring – I finally get to meet her this weekend, I’m even looking forward to the drive – hopefully still some leaves on the trees.

#183 dosouth on 10.23.20 at 10:28 am

It is AMAZING how many WFH’ers relate here on your blog how much more productive they are than at the office.

They should contact job posters who are looking for such people, as they, for sure are not in the majority and must be huddled around your blog, between productive times of course…….

#184 The Totally Unbiased, Highly Intelligent, Rational Observer on 10.23.20 at 10:37 am

“People need, want and crave other people.” — Garth

That is why there are really YUGE cities like New York. All those people want to be with each other. It must be one of the friendliest places on earth.

New York city produced some really sociable types like President Donald J. Trump, who loves all Americans so much that he always puts them first. He even built super-duper deluxe skyscrapers for them to live in because he understands their basic human needs. He built gorgeous golf courses because he knows about playing hard as well as working hard. He is currently building a wonderful wall of defence (about 371 miles completed so far) because he cares about protecting his beloved American citizens from violent MS-13 gang members who rob and rape and murder and do not know how to be nice.

President Trump’s Obvious Destiny (since Manifest Destiny has already been used before) might be just getting started. People from all nations love and respect him. The Sanhedrin in Israel has asked President Trump (and V. Putin) to help rebuild the Temple of the Lord in Jerusalem to cater to the spiritual needs and pilgrimage requirements of the average American tourist.

Perhaps President Trump could agree to do this in exchange for the COVID-19 plague going away. That would be rather amazing, but somehow not at all surprising. The Donald knows the Art of the Deal. He would most likely get some other benefits for the American people thrown into the deal too in order to sweeten it even more. He is a great benefit to all humanity and such a swell guy.

#185 Fly on the wall on 10.23.20 at 10:40 am

170 Dharma Bum

“By removing the walls between ‘work’ and ‘home’ they get to play with the dog (or kids), shop, houseclean, exercise or wash their socks in between Zoom meetings, data entry, email frenzy and working on projects.” – GT
——————————————————————–

For the record, I’m going on day 5 without an underwear change.

Things are getting a little spicy.

__________________________

Me too. Same underwear for the whole week. No baths. No shaving.

Some days no toilet paper usage either -who cares? (the wifey has smelling loss and my dog loves having me to sniff!)

Quite the life, WFH :)

#186 Halifax Fish Fry on 10.23.20 at 11:55 am

Yes Garth, keep them away! There’s nothing to do here, the only form of entertainment is the weekly Chase the Ace which is currently on hold due to COVID. Nothing to see, horrible place to live – Stay the Blazes Away!

#187 TurnerNation on 10.23.20 at 12:07 pm

#173 not 1st that by all account I’ve heard is the goal. Restricting travel.
Unaffordable electrical car – recall last year ON’s govt ended consumer subsidies. Add, the lack of charging stations.
We are in the normalization phase. #stayhome they sold us on from day one right?
Airline routes shut down.
Soon to be on your ticket Sept 11th tax, Covid testing tax, Carbon tax #1, Carbon tax #2. Plus HST (soon to be raised? ) natch.

We were the last generation to know freedom, into Agenda 2030 it’s all downhill. World will remain shut down to get us ready. So fast now
But you are free to leave at any time!

#188 Faron on 10.23.20 at 12:09 pm

#59 avocado on 10.21.20 at 5:06 pm

“buy low, not high”, 2016 looked rather low for oil, guess we were wrong about that one. Now Suncor is a buck away from it’s all time low. I dare not enough look to see what Husky is at.

So, did you buy? Up 10% off that bottom… These companies will rally once jet fuel demand comes back as jet fuels are the biggest laggard in oil demand at the moment. A weak Canadian dollar will help offset the price premium of tar sands oil. Rising interest rates will be headwinds of course and headwinds to O+G will affect banks exposed to their debt. Long term, these companies will dwindle as the globe transitions away from fossil fuels.

#189 Emma Zaun - GreaterFool Unpaid Intern #007 on 10.23.20 at 12:12 pm

No, that picture is not me. And I would not be smiling if it was.

And in spite of Garth’s failure as pictured to provide us all with PPE, we are continuing to perform virtual nasal, oral and urethral/rectal examinations (and more) of all deplorables coming to this blog. Results are being uploaded to the cloud for future reference and delivery to the Premiers and Prime Minister.

Emma Zaun
Shop Steward – CUPE
(Canadian Union of Peelers and Exhibitionists)

#190 tkid on 10.23.20 at 12:17 pm

I had a 3 hour one-way commute (Niagara Falls to Toronto) every other business day. I never, ever thought I’d say this, but I miss the commute.

I miss seeing all the other people, even if I never talked to them. I missed the shops, even if it was window shopping. I missed the change in scenery. I missed the General Tao chicken out of the cafeteria at the bottom of the Eaton’s Centre. That Szechuan Express was the absolute best with its spicy heat.

The General Tao in the ‘burbs is too sweet.

#191 Love_The_Cottage on 10.23.20 at 12:24 pm

#26 Alberta Boy on 10.22.20 at 2:25 pm
First they will figure out a lot of jobs can be done from home. Then they will figure out a lot of those can be done from India.
______________
I’ve been working with offshore teams on IT projects for 20 years. Great, hard working people. But between the time zone difference, the communication issues and the lack of real work business experience I can tell you I’m not worried about anyone taking my job. Not in the least.

#192 Shirl Clarts on 10.23.20 at 12:32 pm

#178 CHERRY BLOSSOM on 10.23.20 at 10:01 am
I watched a documentary yesterday on Amazon which showed how Amazon is the biggest polluter in the world. All those trucks and airplanes going non stop. Over half of their returns end up in the dump and the trash is piling up towards the sky
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

We just returned a few Amazon items. Dropped off the packages at the post office in the morning. Later that night, we got the ‘received’ email from Amazon.

I joked, “Wow! That made it to the landfill fast!”

It’s incredible how fast and efficient they have become. Totally immune to the pandemic, actually feeding off it. Amazon is an essential service. Who would have thought.

#193 Mattl on 10.23.20 at 1:52 pm

#183 dosouth on 10.23.20 at 10:28 am
It is AMAZING how many WFH’ers relate here on your blog how much more productive they are than at the office.

They should contact job posters who are looking for such people, as they, for sure are not in the majority and must be huddled around your blog, between productive times of course…….

—————————————————————

Commuting to and from work, trying to avoid all the office chatter, how does that make you more productive? You may not be able to avoid watching TV or playing with the kids but lots of us solved WFH a long time ago.

There are lots of issues with WFH for certain people – lack of appropriate space, poor internet / phone lines. But anyone that can’t figure out how to stay focused from home is likely not very productive in an office.

#194 Old Ron on 10.23.20 at 2:36 pm

People who do not want to WFH are probably having an
“Office Affair”

#195 mark on 10.24.20 at 3:09 am

Of course it’s dueling interests, but who can you really believe?

All the surveys I’ve seen from the recruitment firms and real estate leasing and service types say WFH is bad. Went to an online conference organised by a major telecommunications company this week, wouldn’t you know all their WFH metrics were showing increased happiness and productivity!

#196 Jack morgan on 10.25.20 at 9:34 pm

Yes, I’m aware Halifax doesn’t have the same weather as St. John’s, but it’s still much worse than Toronto!

Says someone who’s never lived in both. – Garth