Office space

DOUG  By Guest .Blogger Doug Rowat

 

I used to work at a Rogers video store. You know, the old school rental store, complete with rows of empty VHS boxes, a video return drop-box and beaded curtain for the ‘adult’ section.

And explaining recently on a FaceTime call with some of my younger relatives that renting a movie actually required getting in your car and going for a drive resulted in the same puzzled expressions that I must have given my grandmother when she explained to me that movies used to have no sound.

Institutions change, old ways get disrupted and iconoclastic shifts occur in society and businesses all the time. Covid-19 is certainly going to create some permanent shifts of its own. The most lasting of which may be a decline in commercial office space demand.

This blog has hinted at this coming change several times over the past few weeks, including highlighting this recent update for BMO employees, an update that would have been unthinkable six months ago:

This week BeeMo shocked many when the bank said it expected up to 80% of staff to stay home, post-virus. No cubicle farm. No collaborative work spaces. No elevators to floors in the sky. No gleaming bank tower. Another nail in the downtown coffin.

According to ZipRecuiter, nearly two-thirds of Americans are now working remotely. And there’s much evidence to suggest that this could become a permanent arrangement for most. Gallup research, for instance, highlights that three in five of these US workers who have been doing their jobs from home during the pandemic would prefer to continue working remotely even after the restrictions are lifted.

Surely employers are also beginning to do the math and envisioning the money that they’ll save off-loading expensive real estate and overhead costs to employees. But even when we do return to the office, social distancing requirements will probably make most of the space useless anyway. Arup, for instance, an engineering group with projects worldwide, estimates that its central London offices will only be able to accommodate 35% (at most) of pre-lockdown staff. Paying top dollar for big, wide open spaces to accommodate employees’ need for social distancing? That can’t last. Either lower rents must be offered or, alternatively, companies won’t renew leases. Neither option sounds favourable for office property owners.

Now, one might argue that an increase in work from home (WFH) will eventually result in diminished productivity and an unhappier workforce because of the increased isolation. Only time will tell. However, a 2013 study published in the Quarterly Journal of Economics, showed that WFH employees at Ctrip, a 16,000 employee, Nasdaq-listed Chinese travel agency, were 13% more productive than a control group and reported higher job satisfaction. In fact, the results of the research ultimately prompted Ctrip to offer WFH to all its employees. This certainly dovetails with the Gallup research cited above.

However, perhaps the most straightforward evidence that there’s a dramatic shift underway in the office property sector is the behavior of the office property stocks themselves. Boston Properties, for instance, the largest publicly listed office property owner and developer in the US with almost 200 properties totaling more than 50 million square feet, has seen its share price plummet. In and of itself this isn’t unusual given the overall equity market environment; however, what should be concerning to investors is that its stock price hasn’t participated at all in the market rally of the past six or seven weeks. The market is saying that the coronavirus may actually permanently damage office property demand.

Boston Properties Inc. (Blue Line) vs S&P 500 (Red Line) – One Year

Source: Yahoo Finance

Does this mean that you should abandon REIT exposure in your portfolio? Of course not. As Canadian investors, office REITs make up only about 13% of the Canadian REIT universe. My colleague Ryan has already explained why REITs offer such compelling value and such attractive yields at the moment. REITs are an essential part of any diversified portfolio, particularly if you need income.

But I do highlight specific concerns for the office property sub-sector. When we’re finally all let out of our cages and released back into the wild, we may find ourselves going right back inside. The traditional workplace may have permanently transformed itself into our own dining rooms, basements or living rooms.

For many of us, there’s as much chance that we’ll return to our old office buildings as there is that we’ll walk through a beaded curtain to get access to adult videos.

The times they are a changin’.

Doug Rowat, FCSI® is Portfolio Manager with Turner Investments and Senior Vice President, Private Client Group, Raymond James Ltd.

 

138 comments ↓

#1 TurnerNation on 05.16.20 at 12:26 pm

It’s arrived. The new global order of Corporate-Government Communism.
China was their test environment. Worked well.
Let me explain.

The top two economies by size are USA and China.
How could two supposed diametrically opposed systems of commerce and politics both rise into such prominence you ask? Same-same.

USA government stepped in and ordered the competitors closed then Amazon stepped in and bought them for pennies on the dollar. Teamwork.
Learn how the game is played boys.
Amazon reported to be buying bankrupted things like theaters and grocery stores in USA. Their purchase of Whole Foods was a precursor, years ago. How many online retailers regress into bricks and morter…

In Canada the government wants equity stakes in companies for bailout loans. ( They did a test run of this model in 2008 taking shares in GM and car companies).
Bank of Canada is pushing companies into ‘climate goals’. This is code word for: Herd everybody into Smart UN cities and off their land and limit their ability of travel and engender dependence on government.
Did you see how quickly the the masterful marketing job of Keep Your Rent was rolled out?

Today when you step outside **every move** you make is being dictated and oftentimes changed daily by the Corporate-Goverment new global order.
Where you walk. How you stand. How you relate to people. How you shop.
Rules and signs and regulations. Punishable by fines or by losing ability to transact your commerce (they’ll kick you out of the store)
This is the China social credit system.
Your neighbors might be actively snitching or shunning you.

We are under daily edicts from the government. There is no other news. All cultural events are cancelled by edict.
No debate or democracy. Whatever it takes to keep us safe! This is war, with unlimited wartime spending. We wil have safety again if and when the government and corporations tell us so
As in the post 9/11 phase it will be temporary safety mixed with outbreak alerts, shut downs. Will we be getting color coded threat levels again? Say where is ISis these days? No longer useful.

After 911 and the fear stop working on people the GFC 2008 crash hit. Followed by 10 good years whereby the new ruling technology firms got rolled out globally.
Walmart Amazon Uber Zoom Netflix Apple IPhone Siri Alexa et al. Meet your new rulers, the A.I.

#2 Sold Out on 05.16.20 at 12:34 pm

#252 BillyBob on 05.16.20 at 12:03 pm
#243 Sail Away on 05.16.20 at 10:31 am
#223 BillyBob on 05.16.20 at 5:31 am

A colleague of mine died from Covid-19. He was the Base Chief Pilot for our Barcelona base. 52, no prior risk factors. Fit, certainly to the medical standards have to meet. I didn’t know him personally.

Only one so far. Would definitely fall in the “excess morbidity” category.

But at least he won’t have to die a thousand deaths or whatever Sail Away was blathering about, so there’s that.

——————–

Most of my bird dogs die of old age. Two have died younger from other things. So 25% premature bird dog death rate. It’s risky being on the Sail Away bird dog team.

And I knew them both personally.

=================================================

American glibness: always hilarious! Y’know, I’ve got family in the Lower 48, friends too, so I try to counter some of the Yankee-hate I encounter in my global wanderings, but you sure don’t make my job any easier lol.

Sorry if I can’t quite grasp whatever point you’re trying to make about your stupid dogs. They’re to be equated to a human colleague?

Doubt their family would see it the same. But your opinion is noted.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Sail Away has his uses; every time he opens his mouth, I consciously remind myself to recall all the intelligent, thoughtful and hilarious Americans that I’ve had the pleasure to meet during my travels.

#3 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 12:37 pm

Alvin Toffler’s ” The Third Wave” in 1980 spoke of “the electronic cottage”…where people would work from home. 15 years before the internet.
Commercial real estate typically signs 5 or 10 year leases….be interesting to see what the occupancy rates are like in 5 and 10 years…compared to today.
Public transit ridership decreases, rush hour traffic improves, restaurants for work day businesses slammed…… yikes.
Even day cares will be hurting if mom’s and dad’s work from home.
The new normal.

#4 Post on 05.16.20 at 12:39 pm

How about REITs in a negative interest rate world?

#5 Save ur money for rainy Day! on 05.16.20 at 12:39 pm

My dad always told me to save my money for a rainy day, sure glad I listened, the rain sure came in fast. 46 years old and semi retired. Feels great! Full retirement no thx, I love the cash flow! Listen to Garth people !

#6 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 12:43 pm

@#253 IHCTD9
“I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on realtors and the Leafs.Like, do you think the Leafs suck, and realtors are a bunch of shysters?’
++++
Interesting.
I was just thinking Apocalypse2020 was trying a new tactic to keep people from traveling near the bunker….
Now?
I’m not so sure.

#7 the Jaguar on 05.16.20 at 12:52 pm

“For many of us, there’s as much chance that we’ll return to our old office buildings as there is that we’ll walk through a beaded curtain to get access to adult videos.”

I certainly wouldn’t mourn the loss of another glass tower devoid of beauty or soul if your speculation on their future should come to pass………….
But what do you do with the ones currently littering the landscape, Doug? Most would not lend themselves to any meaningful renovation to another purpose, and many are already surrounded by residential equivalents. Should we tear them all down and plant some grass for a park? Maybe include a few baseball diamonds, miniature golf and lawn bowling. By the way…who will pay for the demolition?

#8 WFH here to stay on 05.16.20 at 1:14 pm

Hey Doug, I work in tech and across my group the team productivity measured by the code commits to repo and amount of QA done was higher even though there were initial hiccups in remote connectivity as no expected would be these many at once. So WFH is here to stay

#9 G on 05.16.20 at 1:16 pm

This seems to be working in the lab, if it turns out to works in the body and is safe…

STI-1499, A Potent Anti-SARS-CoV-2 Antibody, Demonstrates Ability To Completely Inhibit In Vitro Virus Infection In Preclinical Studies
https://investors.sorrentotherapeutics.com/news-releases/news-release-details/sti-1499-potent-anti-sars-cov-2-antibody-demonstrates-ability

#10 Damifino on 05.16.20 at 1:23 pm

#3 crowdedelevatorfartz

Public transit ridership decreases, rush hour traffic improves, restaurants for work day businesses slammed…… yikes.
————————————-

I wonder what this means for the Broadway Skytrain extension from VCC to Arbutus which is now underway. The project is not too far along. Maybe time to suspend operations and cut losses? Any thoughts?

#11 Brian Ripley on 05.16.20 at 1:28 pm

My Bitcoin chart is up:
http://www.chpc.biz/bitcoin-gold–re.html

I added a plot of Vancouver SF detached house prices in USD to the other plots of Toronto SFD prices and Gold all in USD

The bitcoin animal spirits appear to be in sync with FOMO in real estate.

Gold appears to be in a countertrend. The Kondratieff people like gold in the “winter” period.

#12 Drunken Stupor on 05.16.20 at 1:30 pm

Well i just wonder how many of those voting for WFH now, would change after say 12months. I know for fact i prefer the office environment and am lucky to be able to continue that way even now. Whatever the ‘return’ will look like but at least the stupid idea of open shared work space for all should be killed. Even HBR got that a while ago, joining the 6sigma etc in the closet of uselessness. Apart from trading floors, couldnt we just go back to more smaller offices and larger cubicles? In other words, stop trying to squeeze too many people per square footage? Certainly quite some pricing implications….

#13 the Jaguar on 05.16.20 at 1:31 pm

Jaguar just got the preliminary robo call from Alberta Health Services for my C-19 test. Exciting. I feel like I’m in line for a free martini. I may have to tell a small fib when I show up to qualify. If they turn me away I’ll still be generous and advise them where to find ground zero of the epicenter in Calgary. Tim Horton’s, of course.

#14 Forever changing on 05.16.20 at 1:34 pm

Thanks for the post Doug.
Yes! everything is changing and changing rapidly what the new normal is anyone’s guess. Underline guess.
At the beginning we thought V shape recovery, now longer recovery, now many business will not open new businesses, seems like plexi glass! and fear is growing. Yes fear of the virus is dropping as I am sure the survey will show, fear of not going back to work will now be the biggest worry for people.

Maybe people will work from home or some form of hybrid, yes maybe the surveys now point to people liking working from home but is only been a couple of months and the thinking is Probably skewed because how else would you answer? Ya it’s great work in my shorts, have my pets and kids life is good. But give it a year or two..
people will be begging to socialize at the water cooler, ha ha do they still do that.

Also if you view REITs as a good investment then banks are a better investment. Same thinking they have not recovered like the rest of the market and pay great dividends, maybe they will cut the dividend? but again it’s fear driving the price.
Banks after all own mortgages to 700,000 who have now deferred, debt to oil companies Who are collapsing and mortgages to REITs whose office towers are empty. You still have to ask yourself why did the big banks sell all those years ago!
and based on your own opinions people want to work from home. anyone one of them can fail and then the house of cards starts to teeter.
But then again a year or two might be full steam ahead.

Personally I read allot of financial newsletters and I get so much variety from the greatest traders of all time pointing towards a depression to others saying recovery at 90 percent to the millions unemployed to the banks failing, and on and on.
Even this blog swings from empty office towers to REITs are a great buy. Confusing. It cannot be both. Why would REITs not reduce dividends? They need liquidity ?

And like I said it’s a guess what will happen but one thing for sure it’s not going to be the same. Try investing based on old thinking, and I mean old as in 3 months ago!
The only thing for sure I can predict with 100 percent accuracy is your going to die some day and your going to pay taxes and your going to be stressed about your investments.
Have a great weekend, look for to the survey.

#15 NewWest on 05.16.20 at 1:34 pm

#10 Damifino on 05.16.20 at 1:23 pm

I wonder what this means for the Broadway Skytrain extension from VCC to Arbutus which is now underway. The project is not too far along. Maybe time to suspend operations and cut losses? Any thoughts?

—————————————-

At this point in the lower mainland it looks like construction is the only thing keeping the economy alive. My guess is that all the big projects planned and announced, including replacing the Patullo bridge, will go ahead just to keep people in work.

#16 AlMac on 05.16.20 at 1:37 pm

Some jobs are suited to WFH and others require constant collaboration and teamwork in an office setting. I suspect as the pandemic fear subsides, distancing issues will disappear.

Re: yesterday’s post, I love cash. Years ago I had to sell my aging Porsche cause the GF was preggers. Two guys rolled up in a murdered out truck, and offered me fifteen five, my full asking price. Take cash? Yup. Went back to their vehicle and brought back a wad, and drove my car away. Probably more coke on it than virus. Anyway, after crib, stroller, wallpaper and carpet it was gone in a flash.

Several days a ago on here I told you Air Canada was in big trouble, so no surprise at the layoff news. Rouge will likely be gone as their profits were largely supported by full flights in old 767s. A real shame. Should AC be left to flounder along on its own, or fail, or be bailed out by the feds? I don’t know the answer to that.

#17 Sold Out on 05.16.20 at 1:38 pm

#10 Damifino on 05.16.20 at 1:23 pm
#3 crowdedelevatorfartz

Public transit ridership decreases, rush hour traffic improves, restaurants for work day businesses slammed…… yikes.
————————————-

I wonder what this means for the Broadway Skytrain extension from VCC to Arbutus which is now underway. The project is not too far along. Maybe time to suspend operations and cut losses? Any thoughts?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

If face-to-face classes are largely history @UBC, it would be absolutely unjustifiable.

#18 EG on 05.16.20 at 1:39 pm

FYI Ctrip’s Ctrp ticker is now tcom . Sold it awhile ago and reallocated into TaaS transportation as a service .

#19 DampBottomLeftCorner on 05.16.20 at 1:40 pm

Garth, in 2 year’s time we’ll all be back in our shops and offices as if nothing happened. Why? Herd immunity (60%-plus pop exposure to COVID-19) or a vaccine (maybe never). What we’re doing now is a necessary but temporary measure to protect the health care system, not prevent everyone from getting COVID-19. My better half, a dental hygienist approaching retirement age, is freaked out by a) aerosols from ultrasonic scaling, b) the free air circulation in open plan dental offices, and c) the HAZMAT-5 level of PPE required to stay safe, so she’s not going back even after Dr. Bonnie gives the all-clear. But as I insist, in 2 year’s time dental practices will back to “normal”, albeit with some overdue adjustments like face shields and CDAs providing suction assistance to hygeinists to contain aerosols, because all patients and staff will either be exposed or vaccinated – then the need for extraordinary PPE, social distancing, etc. will no longer apply. Same logic applies to offices. See you in the elevator!

#20 Sold Out on 05.16.20 at 1:41 pm

#7 the Jaguar on 05.16.20 at 12:52 pm
“For many of us, there’s as much chance that we’ll return to our old office buildings as there is that we’ll walk through a beaded curtain to get access to adult videos.”

I certainly wouldn’t mourn the loss of another glass tower devoid of beauty or soul if your speculation on their future should come to pass………….
But what do you do with the ones currently littering the landscape, Doug? Most would not lend themselves to any meaningful renovation to another purpose, and many are already surrounded by residential equivalents. Should we tear them all down and plant some grass for a park? Maybe include a few baseball diamonds, miniature golf and lawn bowling. By the way…who will pay for the demolition?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Ah, the urban equivalent of abandoned oil sands projects. I presume the same purse(taxpayer) will provide the means for remediation.

#21 Oracle of Ottawa on 05.16.20 at 1:45 pm

Canadian etf reits hold a small number of companies and have a higher than average mer. They are more risky than country wide index funds. Try as you may, I still don’t see the benefit compared to other etf’s that have a large number of holdings and pay a decent dividend with a similar or lower mer.

#22 NoOneOfConsequence on 05.16.20 at 1:47 pm

Coming soon to a dining room near you…
Mandatory, regulated and audited safety inspections of your home by your local workers compensation board.
Not a joke folks…very real and already in the regulatory pipeline.
WFH is not sustainable.

#23 Juan Sanchez on 05.16.20 at 1:50 pm

Technology is used always for their benefit not yours. Slavery equals technology. This is why they like calling people who do not approve of any new technology is a luddite.

Now enjoy your new technology and communism.

#24 Ejy on 05.16.20 at 1:51 pm

Consequences, consequences.

There is a Japanese proverb, “Ura ni wa ura ga aru”; behind every action or decision there are hidden or ignored repercussions.

This has never been more true than at present. In order to appease some terrified millenials (who think everything is about them), and some even more terrified boomers (who have had their cake without much thought of consequences for everyone else including future generations. These include some retired teachers, SW, civil servants with DB pensions etc (not all mind you)), politicians and health reps have ignored the math and ordered society to be shut down. The number of people, globally, who will suffer, die or starve (and then die) to satisfy a few wrinklies’/moister fears will vastly outnumber any benefit from this shutdown.

In addition to consequences at present–service industry jobs decimated, massive debt, erosion of the will to work for a living, and psychological terrorism, there is another.

The current group of post-millenials are p***** off, royally. This is a different group than previous generations; they see their right to work and to an education taken away from them. (In BC, for instance public schools hold no online classrooms. Teachers send out videos “We miss you”” and assign asinine work: “Sing a song to a YouTube video”). When this age group (14 to 18 year olds) get into power, watch out. There will be consequences; they know who is responsible for their massive taxes, unreachable house prices, low paying jobs, poor education, & lack of opportunities. When the tables turn, there will be consequences.

#25 Cottagers STAY THE HELL AWAY! on 05.16.20 at 2:08 pm

Lots of rain and cold coming for the rest of the weekend.

Just.

Stay.

Home.

#26 TrendIsYourFriend on 05.16.20 at 2:12 pm

Interesting behavior of XLRE vs SPY
http://schrts.co/UEHYhkGW

– I traded puts this week when it lost $32 support, one would expect it be stronger with low rates but something else in play here.

Interesting crowd psychology – most think similarly, I was in that camp during the crash too- REITs and uuuge yield on that crash, took INO-UN at $4 but exited at $7 as the whole sector suddenly lost its shine. Don’t know why but I guess crowd thinks office space not coming back anytime soon. Will see.

#27 Linda on 05.16.20 at 2:19 pm

Love the blog photo of the day. Where is that particular flat iron building? I’m presuming somewhere in Toronto but those buildings appear in many urban landscapes around the world.

Working from home isn’t all sunshine & roses. Some people thrive on social contact, which makes working from home difficult. On the plus side from the employer point of view, tracking employee productivity is much easier. I’ve worked with ‘social butterflies’ who spend so much time socializing that their work output is minimized. Such reduced output might be hidden in an office environment but would be difficult to conceal in a work from home environment.

#28 Do we have all the facts on 05.16.20 at 2:29 pm

Office Buildings – ouch!!
Hotels – ouch!!
Tourism – ouch!!
Airlines – ouch!!
Autos & Auto parts – ouch!!
Machinery – ouch!!
Oil & Gas – ouch!!
Housing – ouch!!
Immigration – ouch!!
Sporting events – ouch!!
Restaurants & Bars – ouch!!
Small businesses – ouch!!
$400 billion deficit – ouch!!
Loss of basic freedoms – ouch!!
Massive unemployment – ouch!!

Are we sure all this pain was really necessary.?

Surely there had to be alternative ways of protecting the vulnerable from Covid 19 without inflicting so much pain

Definitely time to ask world leaders to explain the rational behind their masochistic decisions.

#29 BLACK GOLD on 05.16.20 at 2:29 pm

A large Oil Company that my colleague works at made the announcement THIS week.

ALL EMPLOYEES BACK TO THE OFFICE IN A STAGGERED MANNER STARTING TUESDAY.

The work office is an institution where ideas are generated and problems are solved when employees get together in a room and become acquainted with one anothers styles, skills, strengths, and weaknesses.

He himself told me he was starting to go crazy waking up and walking in his home office then turning off the lights at 4 and walking into his living room within 5 seconds.

It sounds all good at first but like everything else it gets tired quick.

Might be time to back the truck up on BOSTON PROPERTIES.

#30 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 2:38 pm

#19 DampBottomLeftCorner on 05.16.20 at 1:40 pm

Garth, in 2 year’s time we’ll all be back in our shops and offices as if nothing happened. Why? Herd immunity (60%-plus pop exposure to COVID-19) or a vaccine (maybe never). What we’re doing now is a necessary but temporary measure…

This would be true if you assume corporations only care about employee safety and not also about saving money.

This is all a grand experiment, but you can be sure that if it turns out employees are equally or more productive working from home, then corporations aren’t going to pay high rents just so staff can socialize.

–Doug

#31 Pat on 05.16.20 at 2:52 pm

#27 Linda

Love the blog photo of the day. Where is that particular flat iron building? I’m presuming somewhere in Toronto but those buildings appear in many urban landscapes around the world.

——————–

You’re right, it is the Gooderham Building in downtown Toronto. And amazingly, given the blog topic today, the tall building in the background in the middle of the picture is where I work – or used to, before Covid. :)

#32 Waldguy on 05.16.20 at 2:52 pm

We sent three of our office employees home to work. They all hated it. Somehow they like the interaction at the office. Two are back now with easing restrictions. The third has health problems and dares not. Our office expansion last year still makes sense.

#33 Ace Goodheart on 05.16.20 at 2:52 pm

Toronto office buildings work on the “shared air” principle.

Centrally locate a large mechanical air pump. Pump the air through a heating or cooling system. Duct it through the building, and return to the pump.

The result is a large, fairly well designed virus spreading and fertilizing system that can take one sneeze and distribute it through 50 floors of office space.

Office windows are of course sealed shut with super glue. Powerful stuff that even contractors can’t remove (they break the glass to get it out). No air in, no air out.

I remember working in Europe and the first thing I noticed was that the windows in my 10th floor office all opened. I inquired about A/C and was told the building did not have it. Didn’t need it, apparently. On the 10th floor, the outside air is cooler than on the ground, and there is always a delightful breeze.

Remember an argument a condo dwelling friend of mine got into with his condo corp. They were older folks, never had children. Never intended to. There was no possibility there would ever be a child in their condo unit. They did not like kids. Would never allow it.

They removed the window limiters that did not allow their windows to open more than an inch. They craved fresh air. Condo corp said “no way”. You need to have the limiters in place. A child could fall out the window.

Friend argued till he was blue in the face practically. They have no kids. Never had a kid in their unit. Never would. They did not allow children in their condo. Lots of expensive, breakable stuff. And they didn’t like the smell and the mess.

No go. You can’t open your condo windows. Rules are rules.

#34 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 2:54 pm

#29 BLACK GOLD on 05.16.20 at 2:29 pm

A large Oil Company that my colleague works at made the announcement THIS week.

ALL EMPLOYEES BACK TO THE OFFICE IN A STAGGERED MANNER STARTING TUESDAY.

He himself told me he was starting to go crazy waking up and walking in his home office then turning off the lights at 4 and walking into his living room within 5 seconds.

Your colleague is describing perhaps the key reason people prefer working from home. A 5 second commute is infinitely better than 1-2 hours on public transport during rush hour.

–Doug

#35 majik on 05.16.20 at 3:25 pm

Majority of our firm is WFH right now. Work is being done but the remote technology for what we do is imperfect, so the quality level has dropped off.

Most of the firm reluctant to return to the office, company leadership sending out confusing mixed messages, sitting on the fence. Lots of decisions being made on the basis of the emotion. Nothing being done based on science, evidence and government guidance.

Space in the office will be reduced dramatically, much further distancing than the government 2m guidance. Capacity reduced to half. Oddly enough it will bring office occupancy back to a level not seen since the early days of the firm over 10 years ago. We had half the amount of staff back then as we do now but back then we were also twice as profitable. Go figure.

#36 Hamish on 05.16.20 at 3:25 pm

The future is flexible working, there are major drawbacks to permanently WFH. The top two are the relentless loneliness and the danger of being forgotten (no presence). Note that the full BMO announcement talked about flexible vs pure office based working. I have to observe that we have had 16 years since Skype appeared so we could have moved to WfH a long time ago.

#37 NoName on 05.16.20 at 3:26 pm

one of my all time favorite movies, Office Space

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTDWwq9_1Gk

#38 CanadIain on 05.16.20 at 3:35 pm

With the amateur Trudeau Junior in charge of our country, I am now firmly short on Canadian equity for the foreseeable future.

I just don’t see any positives on the horizon while he is in charge. Hopefully we all survive long enough to see a new dawn of prosperity and personal responsibility.

Looking overseas now to more sensible countries for equity growth.

#39 drydock on 05.16.20 at 3:46 pm

#25 Cottagers STAY THE HELL AWAY! on 05.16.20 at 2:08 pm

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Tiresome insect.

#40 Drew Ng on 05.16.20 at 3:51 pm

I’ve been able to work from home on and off over the last 20 years. After working from home for 2-3 year stretches, I can safely say, that it really starts to wear on you. Right now, we are in the ‘honeymoon’ phase because all these people have been wanting to work from home for all the perceived advantages. In the next year or two, they will start to see all the disadvantages. I was waiting in line at the grocery store and talking to a wealth manager at one of the big 5 banks who was talking about how great it was to work from home and how productive he felt, so he was in the honeymoon phase. He didn’t see the company side of the equation, that the company didn’t need him specifically, for that job. They may want to hire someone to work from home internationally as a contractor, and then they wouldn’t have to pay his CPP, EI or medical benefits. There are pros and cons to working from home, and one con is the lack of personal connection between employees and employers. If the company doesn’t need to see you at work, then they don’t need you, specifically.

#41 BrianT on 05.16.20 at 3:53 pm

#33Ace-that is why a lot of this Social Distancing is just plain stupid. Example: look at smoking-there is a reason smoking is permitted outdoors and not indoors-the open air provides automatic “Social Distancing” you do not get in an enclosed space-you would think learned Medical professionals could grasp that simple concept which a 5 year old of average intelligence understands but that would be asking too much-obviously it wasn’t taught in Medical School. So you have all this enforcement of Social Distance in the parks, nature trails, etc. as if it is the same as being in an elevator or as you state even an office. If someone was smoking a cigarette in a park and they walked by you would you expect to get the smell on your clothes? Of course not-in an elevator or even in an office-different story altogether-the whole thing was been run so stupidly by medical professionals that maybe Turner Nation is right because it just doesn’t add up.

#42 Grunt on 05.16.20 at 3:56 pm

The WHO believes Covid may stay with us like Hiv. In which case riding an elevator packed with strangers would be akin to unprotected sex.

#43 Stan Brooks on 05.16.20 at 4:02 pm

The big cities rat rate, insane wage and home price competition is over.

The future is for the flexible, adaptable.

Great house with solar panels, own (not ‘community’ ) land and water source, great organic garden, much cheaper place, with much lower taxes, much better weather.

Own business/working from home/go out to the garden when tired, never get bored.

Living on 10-15 % of net income, best quality food and drinks possible, no pesticides, no glucose-fructose syrup, no GMO shit. Stress is long gone. No subway with people packed like sardines with endless ‘technical’ issues causing delays and occasional farts that require gas masks. No cornflakes homes, high property taxes, noisy glass condos with high maintenance and property taxes and idiots mortgaged up to the hilt in order to demonstrate ‘status’ and ‘sophistication’.

Access to a doctor specialist/dentist at will, normally within a day to a week.

Being normal in a mental institution is not easy.

The movie ‘office space’ is nothing compared to the ‘reality’ of GTA.

Cheers,

#44 Newcomer (original) on 05.16.20 at 4:05 pm

Good analysis, Doug. Thank you!

I have been working from home, with employees who also work from their homes, for 20 years. I would add two things in terms of what the impact on the future may be.

First, only some types of people are good at working at home. I’ve had employees so distracted in their own homes that they could not be counted on to get any real work done. I also had an employee who, unbeknownst to me, was working some of her shifts from a minivan with a Wi-Fi repeater outside her kids daycare. That went on for a year without me knowing. That’s how good she was.

Second, (minivan examples aside), people who work from home need bigger homes. My interview process includes questions about home-office set up. I personally would not consider renting or buying a home without an ample, quiet, office.

These things may have impacts on both career paths and residential real estate.

#45 baloney Sandwitch on 05.16.20 at 4:13 pm

Think of the virus as like a tsunami that comes in. And even if the water goes away completely and we never see it again, it still will produce vast damage, the financial damage … incomes that are lost, balance sheets that are hurt, restructurings that need to take place. So that will impede the recovery. It will take time – probably the good chuck of the coming decade.

#46 Faron on 05.16.20 at 4:16 pm

#34 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 2:54 pm

#29 BLACK GOLD on 05.16.20 at 2:29 pm

Your colleague is describing perhaps the key reason people prefer working from home. A 5 second commute is infinitely better than 1-2 hours on public transport during rush hour.

–Doug

———————————————-

A short commute is nice, but time in the car or on the train or bike is good “me” time which I think was BLACK GOLD’s point. Punctuates the work day so home feels like home. Personally, a 20 minute commute by bike is optimal (live on the west coast where winter biking is much more doable than points east). Get some air, yell at some cars, exercise then return to the comfort of home rejuvinated.

#47 Faron on 05.16.20 at 4:21 pm

BTW: the chart looks like it’s from google finance, not yahoo. For what it’s worth.

#48 Stan Brooks on 05.16.20 at 4:24 pm

BTW working from home will drastically increase offshoring and speed up the transition to a jobless future.

Old habits and society structure will look like that of the American’s natives facing superior organized and with better weapons Spanish invaders, i.e. are doomed.

The expectations of a good job/career will disappear along with the justification of corresponding ‘investment’ in education and housing.

Don’t count on wages or pensions for living. The impact on government tax revenues from declining labour and wages will be horrific. Many services will disappear.
Many are already rendered practically useless.

It is hard to ask billionaire private capitalists to subsidize the increasingly becoming useless (in terms of labour capacty) general populace with their wealth.

The new plebs fed with crap food, controlled news and entertainment, virtual world and pot is already emerging.

Enjoy,

#49 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 4:28 pm

@#7 the Jaguar
“But what do you do with the ones currently littering the landscape…”
++++

Convert to vertical greenhouses?

@# 10 Damfino
“I wonder what this means for the Broadway Skytrain extension from VCC to Arbutus which is now underway. The project is not too far along….”
+++++

I fully expect multi billion dollar govt mega projects such as the GVRD Skytrain extension to be shelved…. I’m sure SNC lavalin will wail at the unfairness of it all….but GVRD transit is broke, Skytrain burns through hundreds of millions per year and the taxpayers arent going to be in a particularly “giving” mood for the next decade of so due to Trudeau’s unbelievably careless cash fandango….
Next will be the multi billion dollar “ship building” mega projects on each coast….. never under estimate the Liberals pathological loathing of all things military…….

#50 Camille on 05.16.20 at 4:32 pm

Good post.
But I must advise you that adult films and magazines are still being sold in the back of the shop. For example Dominion News on Portage in Winnipeg.
Arup is a London based engineering firm (like SNC Lavalin is soon to be – consider that a scoop). Supposedly such firms are ripe for telework, for the past decades, and it didn’t happen. It’s not productive or efficient.
Finally, the BMO story, from what I read is based on a lady HR manager describing what are some ideas, though she may not know that. And its gone from there, mostly on this blog.
You all need to get around. Office space costs will go up, not down. You’re blinded by the fog of war. But it will soon clear (notwithstanding completely unforseen circumstances).

#51 Ustabe on 05.16.20 at 4:38 pm

“For many of us, there’s as much chance that we’ll return to our old office buildings as there is that we’ll walk through a beaded curtain to get access to adult videos.”

Back in the day when Betamax and VHS were still fighting it out, if you owned a video rental store you had to carry double copies of each title.

So my friend had an issue…lack of traffic into the adult section due to embarrassment I suppose and how to get around the double inventory cost.

We brainstormed the problem and came up with placing a sign above the door to the adult video section that said Workplace Safety and Training Videos which immediately improved traffic into that section.

The second part was jacking the rental price of “training” videos by a buck but including a VHS machine rental in the deal thereby lowering the overall cost to him.

(BTW, did you know that it basically was the porn industry that killed Betamax? By releasing their product only on VHS, they drove consumers to adopt VHS. Evil, but brilliant.)

My point being, if there is one, is that human ingenuity will prevail.

As an addendum, he pivoted to online content in the early days and now lives on a lavish compound outside of Nanaimo and makes big money selling used underwear online and running three adult sites. Living the dream, I guess.

#52 Toronto_CA on 05.16.20 at 4:39 pm

I am not sure about office space; definitely think it will be different and will result in much more “flexible” work schemes where working from home as much as you want/need is allowed. This inveitably will lead to less spend on real estate in commercial centres, but leases are usually 20+ years for major offices with 5 or 10 year breaks.

It will take a while for it to filter down I imagine.

For residential real estate – personally I was looking to buy closer to the core so I had less than 25 minute commute door to door to my office. And I knew I would pay a premium for that in price and have to sacrifice square footage and a yard.

This virus has changed that completely. I now am looking at a place an hour out, knowing I can go in once a week or less if I need. I’ll have 4-5 bedrooms and turn them into home offices/man caves. Can’t wait. I may even have a view of the water.

Now what I worry is that everyone will have my idea, and the “cheap” real estate far away from the core will go for a premium above now, while flats/condos/row houses int he city will come way down.

Maybe there’s a window when the economy looks bad where I can pick up a discounted house before the world decides to put this virus in the rear view. Interesting times.

Garth, I want a real estate prediction from you soon :)

#53 Lost...but not leased on 05.16.20 at 4:44 pm

#1 TurnerNation on 05.16.20 at 12:26 pm
It’s arrived. The new global order of Corporate-Government Communism.
China was their test environment. Worked well.
Let me explain.

The top two economies by size are USA and China.
How could two supposed diametrically opposed systems of commerce and politics both rise into such prominence you ask? Same-same.

=====

Turner Nation…Another good post !

Majority of People will never get it…or else if and when they do it will be too late.

All nations and races have been under attack for centuries to create a ” One World Gov’t “.

If you are even a remote student of history, you have to realize “they” are close to victory. WAKE UP !!!

Dramatic shifts happened during WW1 and WW2…
NYC bankers funded the Bolshevik Revolution….why?…because Russia was becoming an economic powerhouse and threatened the status quo, moreso as central banks were established in competitor nations.

NOTE:
Central Banks are key part of COMMUNIST PLATFORM…and “ALL WARS ARE BANKERS WARS”

The first phase was the bloody and brutal population culling of WW1 and WW2, as well as millions murdered by Communist regimes in Russia and China established after WW1 and WW2.

So, in essence, the first phases of One World Gov’t in place…what next?…

The ongoing strategy was “rot from within”…have so called western nations tricked into believing they were “free”…but bring into schools etc various quasi- communist programs in all facets of life , reduce critical thinking, that have ultimately weakened given nations and leave their citizens primed for what we are seeing unfold ..an Orwellian nightmare. Instead of the olde Cold War facade and fear of physical invasion by armed forces…we have instead capitulated to ….a tiny….virus?!? we can’t even see ?

In other words…the end result will be still be Communism ….all the while we were sleeping oh so smugly .

#54 AlMac on 05.16.20 at 4:49 pm

#28 facts

An army of public health officials, health care workers, and politicians of every stripe around the world have already provided their rationale: the measures were necessary to save all of humanity, full stop. Except for Sweden. I repeat, there will be no completely objective post-pandemic review because the consequences for this army would be too severe if the findings supported a different approach.

#55 Linda on 05.16.20 at 4:53 pm

#31 ‘Pat’ – thanks for identifying the building in today’s blog photo:) It may be old, inefficient & costly to maintain, but those old heritage buildings have style!

#56 Jimmy Zhao on 05.16.20 at 5:13 pm

Convert the office towers into Condos.

#57 Marco on 05.16.20 at 5:16 pm

Plumbers and electricians will be replaced by robots, houses will be imported prefab from China and there will be no need for dentists because you will be able to grow your new tooth.
I got it according the steerage section. I just got it. And Justin is to blame. Well of course.

#58 Stan Brooks on 05.16.20 at 5:16 pm

#38 CanadIain on 05.16.20 at 3:35 pm

Oh, there is ‘positives’, the inflation will cause everything of value to ‘skyrocket’ as measured in the increasingly worthless currency issued by the french villa guy and his incompetent puppets at the central bank. Higher capital gain tax on stuff that actually decreases in real values. Deficits north of 100 billion for the next few years. Just wait for the next year, 200-300 billions deficit is pretty much a given (400 billions expected this year).

With interest rates at 0.25 %. All is rosy, expect free pot allowance in the next announcement by socks boy.
Why is the current central banker counting down his days at the post? Running like a scared chicken little from the results of his disastrous policies.

Cheers,

#59 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 5:28 pm

#47 Faron on 05.16.20 at 4:21 pm

BTW: the chart looks like it’s from google finance, not yahoo. For what it’s worth.

Correct, Google Finance. All that fresh air from biking cleared your head and made you a better pedant.

–Doug

#60 Sydneysider on 05.16.20 at 5:33 pm

Took my kids for a walk near Burnaby Lake early this morning. We saw 3 homeless humans in woeful condition lurking around the trails, and one busy beaver swimming with a bunch of reeds in its mouth.

If I were a shaman and that experience a vision, it would be very easy to interpret.

#61 Do we have all the facts on 05.16.20 at 5:37 pm

Got to love the optimism behind having a choice of whee to work. The way our governments are behaving lately millions of Canadians are having most choices made for them. Two of those proxy choices appear to be unemployment or a monthly government handout.

Mr. “the budget will balance itself” is fiddle faddling while our economy goes up in flames. Time for bitching about incompetence is over. Our business leaders across Canada must unite and demand a more democratic and dynamic approach to improve our future.

#62 Linda on 05.16.20 at 5:39 pm

#43/49 ‘Stan’ – exactly where is the utopia mentioned? Arable land – Toronto sits upon what was arguably the most arable land on the planet. With a waterway to get goods to/from market, which, hello, was why people settled there. Look at a map. The majority of cities/towns are usually plunked right beside a water source, by preference navigable. The cost of land, even in less expensive locales, is much higher when it possesses a viable, reliable source of water.

Then there is the issue of water security. Moving to a ‘better climate’? Check out the water security index for the country of choice before you move. A rather substantive amount of armed conflict is endemic in regions where water is scarce. Given the human propensity to settle beside reliable, potable water sources available arable land with a reliable water supply isn’t as plentiful as one might think. Most have long since been occupied.

As for living in a smaller urban area, many who think small town living is less expensive are shocked by the tax bill. Obviously the cost of providing modern amenities such as potable water, utilities, roads etc. is going to be higher if the population base supporting that expense is smaller. Off the grid, rural living is of course an alternative. Hope you enjoy the work of maintaining the property during your ‘golden years’. Which is why a lot of acreages go up for sale. People just can’t manage any longer & hiring someone to do the work isn’t cheap. That ‘increasingly becoming useless (in terms of labour capacity)’ population isn’t likely to become a source of rural labour either.

I do agree that those who have will not be willing to foot the bill for those who haven’t. Whether they will have a choice about paying the bill is another matter altogether.

#63 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 5:45 pm

#51 Ustabe on 05.16.20 at 4:38 pm
“For many of us, there’s as much chance that we’ll return to our old office buildings as there is that we’ll walk through a beaded curtain to get access to adult videos.”

So my friend had an issue…lack of traffic into the adult section due to embarrassment I suppose…

We brainstormed the problem and came up with placing a sign above the door to the adult video section that said Workplace Safety and Training Videos which immediately improved traffic into that section.

If I remember correctly, the beaded curtain (which made a lot of noise and maybe added to the customer embarrassment?) was eventually replaced by swinging saloon-style doors. Can’t remember if they helped, but they were probably even more cheesy than the curtain.

–Doug

#64 Out Of Work CEO, Will Travel on 05.16.20 at 5:48 pm

The photo of the famous flatiron building in Toronto is a walk down 1980’s memory lane where the “French Horn” diner was in the basement. The 19th century society had many workers jobbing it out from their lowly abides which they jammed in a lot of kids and farm animals. The 19th century in America was a frontier in western expansion and businesses where the individual not the government determined your future.

#65 RISE CANADA on 05.16.20 at 5:49 pm

The bulldozer should have continued running. I don’t see anything. I see a C!

https://www.reddit.com/r/toronto/comments/gkzu56/an_elementary_school_teacher_in_toronto_stands_up/

#66 islander on 05.16.20 at 5:55 pm

#40 Drew Ng
..the company you work for “may want to hire someone to work from home internationally as a contractor, and then they wouldn’t have to pay your CPP, EI or medical benefits.
There are pros and cons to working from home, and one con is the lack of personal connection between employees and employers.
If the company doesn’t need to see you at work, then they don’t need you, specifically.”

No kidding. Anyone WFH who thinks that they can’t be replaced instantly by someone in another part of the world, should give their head a shake.
Imagine the ease companies will have when it comes to firing you! No face to face confrontations, no ‘understanding of your special situation’.
Health concerns,work load, family issues, compensation etc. Forget it.
AI will hire you and AI will fire you.
The only ones meeting in the ‘office’ will be the owners and the board (and who knows – maybe not even them).

Brave new world……….
“O wonder!
How many goodly creatures are there here!
How beauteous mankind is! O brave new world,
That has such people in’t.
— William Shakespeare, The Tempest, Act V, Scene I, ll. 203–206[6]”

#67 I’m stupid on 05.16.20 at 6:06 pm

Hi Doug

What will happen to demand and small businesses if working remotely becomes a thing?

Staying at home will mean no need for a car, clothes, restaurant lunches, coffee and a million other things.

How will the economy adjusted to the new normal?

#68 Lost...but not leased on 05.16.20 at 6:25 pm

Oh COMMUNADA

https://www.richmond-news.com/trudeau-silent-on-air-canada-bailout-nationalization-1.24136391

Basic gist is Air Canada is on the ropes…Trudeau emergency funds allowed AC to hire back thousands
( Why..if there is next to zero business ??? )….guess the kitty is drying up.

Now what?

So…this may be the template for Canada going forward …as one can almost bet Trudeau can NOT let this major employer collapse…the end result is Nationalism (COMMUNISM 101) ….then other major industries line up cap in hand.

JU$T IN TIME TRUDEAU…our glorious leader .

#69 Faron on 05.16.20 at 6:35 pm

#49 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 4:28 pm

“Careless cash Fandango.”

What, in your understanding, would this economy look like without massive support? The US fed chair who leans right has a clear opinion as do most economists of all stripes. In your answer, don’t be lazy and claim “int’l conspiracy”. Think outside that box.

#70 Dougie on 05.16.20 at 6:45 pm

Off subject, but Garth, you were going to tell us what attracted you to the East Coast and why you moved there. I’m sure that the ready availability of the BMO building was an enticement, but there must have been more than that. Retirement thoughts? Balmy weather? Great dog-walking? Nice people? Tell us.

It’s coming. – Garth

#71 Michael King on 05.16.20 at 6:49 pm

The latest news re: Berkshire Hathaway’s trades.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/warren-buffett-buys-no-stocks-231340069.html

#72 WUL on 05.16.20 at 6:59 pm

I go to my office every day in The Mac. I’m not concerned about my productivity at home, nor my health.

Heading downtown is borne by of my shallowness.

I like the eye candy. Batching it (or is it widowing it?) in a one bedder apartment makes me do that.

WUL

M64CookingFriedBalognaEggs&Gravy4SupperInTheMac

#73 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 7:10 pm

@#60 Sidney Sider
“Took my kids for a walk near Burnaby Lake early this morning. We saw 3 homeless humans in woeful condition lurking around the trails.”
++++

Yep.
Lots of homeless popping up in Burnaby.
Vancouver cracks down and pushes the problem into the suburbs.
I’ve noticed lots more homeless around the various Burnaby Skytrain stations lately.
Kingsway is especially bad.
I guess Skytrain gives them quick access to their downtown drug supply.

#74 Figure it Out on 05.16.20 at 7:11 pm

“Off subject, but Garth, you were going to tell us what attracted you to the East Coast”

Garth’s all about the tax rates.

#75 Phylis on 05.16.20 at 7:23 pm

Ahem. Care to name any favourite movies, Doug?

#76 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 7:28 pm

@#69 Faron.
“In your answer, don’t be lazy and claim “int’l conspiracy”. Think outside that box.”

+++=
Gee I dunno all wise Faron.
I’m pretty sure I dont fall in the same paranoid category as Turnip Nation or Lost the Lease
Perhaps Trudeau shouldnt have immediately announced the handing out of Billions?
Perhaps the minority govt that didnt debate anything in Parliament should have waited a few weeks before handing out billions upon billions of tax dollars to people that spent every last dime of their pay cheques on tattoos and Lotto Max?
You know. Make them suffer for a few weeks and make them realize the error of their ways BEFORE announcing the great cash giveaway of 2020?
We have sent a message that the Nanny State will rescue them.
I cant wait to see how far down the fiscal rabbit hole we go in Nov. when the flu comes back with a vengeance and we are in “Lockdown Part Deux”.
Perhaps Trudeau can give everyone a $1000 Christmas bonus to make them feel better?
Would that be nice of him?
What the hell….it’s not like it’s his money he’s urinating against the Wall of Debt

Perhaps we could have isolated the 1% of the population that seem to have a terminal reaction to Covid 1984 instead of the 99% of working, healthy taxpayers that will pay for this cash fandango for decades to come?
With inexpensive self distancing and hand washing protocols in place?
Staggered work hours for commutors?
A Swedish option….. as it were.
Yes there will be blood but at least the economy wouldnt be on its knees.
Hundreds of billions given away and the mortality rate of most restaurants, pubs, theatres, stadiums etc. will still be 50%….
And we’ll still be stuck paying for it.
Well done T2, well done.

I cant wait to hear of the CERB scams and frauds that we will all pay for.

Is that far enough outside the Amazon delivery box for you?

#77 yorkville renter on 05.16.20 at 7:36 pm

I can’t wait to get back to my office.
I love my kids, but this had gone on long enough! :-)

#78 Oakville Rocks! on 05.16.20 at 7:36 pm

@ Doug R,

Rogers Video huh, I guess that makes you Randal to Ryan’s Dante. And Garth is of course Silent Bob.

#79 John in Mtl on 05.16.20 at 7:39 pm

@ #1 TurnerNation on 05.16.20 at 12:26 pm

Seriously? Get a life, man!

You remind me of this girl who works in a store nearby; at the beginning of the shutdowns she had her hair on fire: “we’re going to be like Italy, just watch! Dead bodies everywhere, people dying in the streets, it’ll be hell!”

#80 Lost...but not leased on 05.16.20 at 7:47 pm

This is how bad it is…

Guy comes up to me and says he wants to sell me not one bridge…but its 2 for 1..

( I hem ..haw..I’ve heard about this scam before.)

Anyway…I figure OK…here is my l-o-w-b-a-l-l offer.

I now, actually , have full and clear title to LIONS GATE and GRANVILLE Street bridge…with an option on IRONWORKERS ….

#81 Uncle Charlie on 05.16.20 at 8:00 pm

I’ve been working from home for over 5 years now, but it’s much easier for someone like me to stay motivated because all my home based income is 100% commission based, and I don’t have a boss as I’m self employed.

I think some industries can quite easily adapt to WFH, while others may have a harder time getting the same level of productivity from their employees. Not everyone can stay focused when there are kids and dogs around demanding their attention, unless they have a separate office with a door they can close. I guess time will tell how this works for companies.

#82 Linda on 05.16.20 at 8:19 pm

Regarding the homeless ranging out of their usual haunts. Think about the empty downtowns, the lack of commuters means a sharp dive in possible income (spare change; bottles/cans to bring to the bottle depot). I’ve noticed those folks who used to walk along at busy intersections, holding up a sign asking for change, are either absent or showing up in locations much closer to places like grocery stores, which is where the majority of possible donors are most likely to be found. Now add in the fact that many are now avoiding the use of actual cash. Can’t give what you don’t have on you. Not a few acquaintances have mentioned an increase in sightings of folks checking out recycling carts, in residential areas that are definitely convenient to any bottle depot. Mind, those folks may not be homeless – yet. Could be neighbours whose debt load makes checking out the carts a necessity.

#83 Lost...but not leased on 05.16.20 at 8:21 pm

#76 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 7:28 pm
@#69 Faron.
“In your answer, don’t be lazy and claim “int’l conspiracy”. Think outside that box.”

+++=
Gee I dunno all wise Faron.
I’m pretty sure I dont fall in the same paranoid category as Turnip Nation or Lost the Lease
==========================

Promise ???
Thank whatever higher power !!!

#84 Faron on 05.16.20 at 8:21 pm

#76 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 7:28 pm

I’m sorry I confused you with the conspiracy nutbars. I did that to Toronto_CA yesterday and now you. Sincerely, I apologize.

I don’t want to debate the response because I think anyone who reads these comments knows where I stand esp. on Sweden. Regardless, I think some level of shut-down was pretty well baked in once this thing started to rage across Hubei Province. Likely for months. So if we can semi-agree that lets a say a one-month shut down with economic activity down 30% would have happened no matter what, lets go from there.

When the economy collapses, the surest way to minimize damage is to inject money into it ASAP and your example of Lotto Max and Tattoos is a good one, especially tattoos. The very best thing that can be done with CERB dollars is having them spent in the local or at a minimum Canadian economy. In that case, those dollars don’t just disappear, they filter through and keep the economic machine running, people employed and supply chains engaged. Sure, some of those dollars get saved, some are going to get sent to banks for mortgage payments, some will get dropped in a puddle and not be spent, some will be used to buy dirt bikes or air fresheners. Bail-out dollars simply have to replace lost productivity with cash. Bail-out dollars aren’t welfare.

Should strings be attached? Ideally yes. Ideally the Gov’t would have a set of legislation on hand to get this rolling quickly with limits on how or what it’s spent on. Buy Canadian, don’t chuck it into the stock market, don’t buy crap off of Amazon. But when the economy slams shut, the only way to minimize damage is for the gov’t to dump dollars into it to keep it inching along and to do that as soon as possible.

I agree that some businesses should be allowed to fail. I’m grumpy that bailing out mortgages and propping up even multi-property owners may keep the housing bubble inflated. It would be helpful for the irresponsible to feel some heat, but Garth has repeatedly posted stats indicating that the irresponsible make up 50% plus of the households. That, unfortunately, is a number too big to fail. Cripple 50% of consumers and the economy would take many decades to come back and everyone would feel the pain.

There will be many many fraud cases. I agree with that. I’m less worried about CERB fraud than I am corporate fraud. Large businesses taking payroll support while having cash on hand and bail outs of large corporations who have spend the past decade purchasing shares and doling out dividends rather than building up cash reserves. Those programs are big bucks too and rife for exploitation. Plus corps will lawyer up much more effectively than lying citizen Joe who took CERB will bringing in 70k a year.

#85 Ballingsford on 05.16.20 at 8:26 pm

Office 2020,2021, Hotelling, or whatever name that has been applied to it now and the direction it was headed.

This needs a re-think!

Yuck, the germs of it all!

#86 Uncle Charlie on 05.16.20 at 8:27 pm

Turner Nation

Lost…but not leased

Although I have done a lot of research on many so called conspiracy theories and believe some of them are quite likely to be at least somewhat true, the “One World Government” idea seems questionable to me at best. We can barely get governments within one country to agree on anything. The idea that the entire planet could ever be run by one government seems like a bit of a stretch IMO.

Having said that, I do believe there’s much more to the response we’ve seen from COVID for example. I call it the ‘social control experiment’. As with something like Agenda 21/2030 this has clearly been in the planning stages for a long time (the response, not the virus).

It was just a matter of the right crisis to come along to test it out in the real world. Google Event 201 and you’ll find more fact checker websites trying to debunk the conspiracy angle (from one or two questionable sites) than info on the event itself. And no, (according to the fact checking sites) most people who have researched Event 201 in relation to what is going on now with COVID do not believe Bill Gates is some nefarious guy trying to take over the world. The timing and content of that event two months prior to COVID is a bit too coincidental for my liking though. I’ve never had much faith in coincidences.

#87 Russ on 05.16.20 at 8:27 pm

crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 7:10 pm

@#60 Sidney Sider
“Took my kids for a walk near Burnaby Lake early this morning. We saw 3 homeless humans in woeful condition lurking around the trails.”
++++

Yep.
Lots of homeless popping up in Burnaby.
Vancouver cracks down and pushes the problem into the suburbs.

========================

Hey Crowdie,

You really missed the point of Sidney’s comment.

It was about the beaver.

Kinda like Brenda’s beaver, a children’s story.
http://www.reacharoundbooks.com/brendas-beaver-needs-a-barber-free-ebook.php

Always glad to help.
Cheers, R

#88 BLACK GOLD on 05.16.20 at 8:30 pm

#34 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 2:54 pm

A large Oil Company that my colleague works at made the announcement THIS week.

ALL EMPLOYEES BACK TO THE OFFICE IN A STAGGERED MANNER STARTING TUESDAY.

He himself told me he was starting to go crazy waking up and walking in his home office then turning off the lights at 4 and walking into his living room within 5 seconds.

Your colleague is describing perhaps the key reason people prefer working from home. A 5 second commute is infinitely better than 1-2 hours on public transport during rush hour.

–Doug

———————————————————————————————

I guess I should clarify. It takes him 15 minutes to get to work in the morning.
Not everybody lives and works in the GTA.

-BLACK GOLD

#89 Faron on 05.16.20 at 8:31 pm

#59 Doug Rowat on 05.16.20 at 5:28 pm

Correct, Google Finance. All that fresh air from biking cleared your head and made you a better pedant.

——

Ha, I’ll take that as a compliment. And don’t get me started :-)

#90 MF on 05.16.20 at 8:31 pm

I agree with the article. I can see WFH becoming more and more prevalent.

I’ve had the chance to wfh in the past and enjoyed it. I was one of those who was more productive at home.

I don’t think it’s going to be all or none though. A lot of people wfh most of the time, but go into the office one a week or so. Reits will still have value, but the office footprint will be smaller.

MF

#91 Job#1 on 05.16.20 at 8:34 pm

#75 crowdedelevatorfartz

Nice rant. Good answers. Turns my crank.

#92 MF on 05.16.20 at 8:35 pm

#38 CanadIain on 05.16.20 at 3:35

Meh what other countries besides maybe us equities, which are near all time highs?

The rest of the world is on life support.

Besides, lots of people were saying that about the tsx over the past five years here and what happened? It made an all time high.

MF

#93 Ballingsford on 05.16.20 at 8:53 pm

Imagine all the people. John Lennon. You tube it.

#94 John in Mtl on 05.16.20 at 8:55 pm

#70 Dougie on 05.16.20 at 6:45 pm

Off subject, but Garth, you were going to tell us what attracted you to the East Coast and why you moved there.

It’s coming. – Garth

Oh I get it, you were also posting as “Apocalypse2020”? LOL

#95 Wrk.dover on 05.16.20 at 9:00 pm

#62 Linda on 05.16.20 at 5:39 pm
#43/49 ‘Stan’ – exactly where is the utopia mentioned? Arable land – Toronto sits upon what was arguably the most arable land on the planet.

——————————————————–

10% Canada’s class A farmland visible from atop CN Tower.

What about the land?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7oc_ogU2Wk

#96 Sail Away on 05.16.20 at 9:16 pm

I have no intention of ever instituting full work from home for our firm. All staff already have laptops, VPN setups, GoToMeeting access to allow work from everywhere, and cloud-based time/expense program, but having the team in the office ready to go at 8 every morning is critical.

And we’re constantly using plotters and the in-office reference library of codes, specs, past project files and (gasp) hard-cover design tomes.

So, maybe it’ll work for some, but I don’t see it for engineering. Of course we also enjoy paying our landlord… his name starts with Sail, heh…

#97 Karlhungus on 05.16.20 at 9:33 pm

Not really sure what the point of REITS are. Its just another sector. No different then medical, tech, cannabis whatever. Just stick to index funds.

#98 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 9:50 pm

@#87 Russ
“Hey Crowdie,”
++++

Sorry , only Floppie can call me Crowdie……I think its an Auzzie thing.
Everyone else usually refers to me as Fartz, Fartzy, Mr Fartz, A-hole, jerk, etc etc etc .

Beavers….crazy.
Last time I saw a beaver was after leaving a restaurant in downtown Ottawa on the river . It was sitting in a dam/ pump station configuration.
Big, fat, angry wild beaver……and when it charged us……we ran like the sensible cowards we were.

My apologies to Rural Rick for another of my endless anecdotes………

#99 Larissa Lowborne on 05.16.20 at 9:58 pm

DELETED

#100 45north on 05.16.20 at 10:01 pm

Pat You’re right, it is the Gooderham Building in downtown Toronto.

that it is

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gooderham_Building

#101 Joe on 05.16.20 at 10:55 pm

Boston Properties, the owner of Reston Town Center, says that rent collection and leasing activity in April has remained strong this month despite the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

During a quarterly earnings call yesterday (Wednesday), company representatives said that roughly 90 percent of its office and retail tenants paid rent for April 1. The company’s first-quarter revenue is up from four percent over the previous year.

The company has signed a 135,000 square foot lease with a defense contractor at RTC. Construction of a 276,000-square-foot building that will be fully occupied by Leidos is also complete.

In Northern Virginia, leases amounting to 900,000 square feet of space are in active negotiations.

CEO Owen Thomas said it is difficult to determine where market rents are today and how the pandemic will impact the overall market.

“As in past recessions and economic slowdown created uncertainty, which reduces some users need for space, business leaders can become more cautious and reluctant to invest capital in new offices.”

#102 Ronaldo on 05.16.20 at 11:20 pm

ALL EMPLOYEES BACK TO THE OFFICE IN A STAGGERED MANNER STARTING TUESDAY.
——————————————————————-
That’s funny. I envision a bunch of people coming back to work after a long weekend bender staggering their way into the office half drunk.

#103 whiplash on 05.16.20 at 11:35 pm

#1 TurnerNation

Meet your new rulers, the A.I.

How is it possible? 5G. The 4G system in place today can handle up to 10,000 connections/devices per square mile. The next step is 5G which can handle up to 3,000,000 connection/devices per square mile. A complete redesign of the internet, not for people, but machines.

#104 Moses71 on 05.16.20 at 11:38 pm

Unsure if 13% are representative of a pending future workforce looks like. And we are social creatures. Not to mention a home office in a dinky condo with kids in Toronto or Vancouver will make anyone go batty. Gray divorces are products of being home 24/7 with your chosen one.
We’re social creatures so I don’t see the wfh sticking as a majority.
Look how fast the 20’s jumped forward. Hopefully we will bounce back with the same optimism and vigour vs letting MDs run the economy.

#105 NFN_NLN on 05.17.20 at 12:16 am

#90 MF on 05.16.20 at 8:31 pm
I agree with the article. I can see WFH becoming more and more prevalent.

Which home? The one in the high cost of living Canada, or the more affordable Philippines or Vietnam?

#106 Ponzius Pilatus on 05.17.20 at 12:50 am

Hey Sailo!
Now that UBC is going on-line only, what will your 19 year old son do?
Your house must be pretty much fixed up and painted by now.

#107 Xavier Colingsworth on 05.17.20 at 1:00 am

DE

BANNED

#108 joblo on 05.17.20 at 1:09 am

#38 CanadIain on 05.16.20 at 3:35 pm

“With the amateur Trudeau Junior in charge of our country, I am now firmly short on Canadian equity for the foreseeable future.”

Trudeau is not in charge, never was. This article goes back to 2015, how much of this has actually changed?

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/terry-glavin-welcoming-back-the-liberal-old-guard

#109 Ignorance Is Bliss on 05.17.20 at 1:41 am

#67 I’m Stupid

What happens when people are working from home and aren’t spending as much?

The economy shrinks, that’s what happens.

#110 BillyBob on 05.17.20 at 5:04 am

#42 Grunt on 05.16.20 at 3:56 pm
The WHO believes Covid may stay with us like Hiv. In which case riding an elevator packed with strangers would be akin to unprotected sex.

====================================================

If you think riding an elevator is the same as unprotected sex you haven’t been doing the latter right.

—————————————————————————————

Correct, Google Finance. All that fresh air from biking cleared your head and made you a better pedant.

–Doug

==================================================

Meow! Introducing “Bitchy Doug”, this is a new look for you :-).

Who says only Garth can Turn Up The Snark?!

#111 McSteve on 05.17.20 at 5:54 am

#53

“Great population culling?” Seriously? WW1 and WW2 were a blip in the population growth curve. It’s gone from 3.9 Billion to over 7 Billion in the last 50 years. Conspiracy theorists kill me. The reality is the whole human race is one big experiment of trail and error. We are pretty much making it up as we go, hoping something works. Any plan that plays out over 100 years is doomed to fail. We are too unpredictable, as is the world we live in and on.

#112 James on 05.17.20 at 6:47 am

#227 James on 05.16.20 at 7:04 am

THiS IS VITALLY IMPORTANT TO US ALL
If you have ever worked in Canada you are about to get screwed. Especially if you have been financially responsible and have little/no debt!

Blogdogs, See yesterdays post #227 for the rest. THIS IS IMPORTANT!

Mr Turner…why are you not giving this more attention? You have had ample warning.

Stand down. The CPP is a defined-benefit pension plan whose assets belong to the beneficiaries, not the administrator. Ain’t happening. – Garth
——————-
Mr. Turner. We both know that the CPPIB was created by an Act of Parliament. An act of parliament is all it takes to change the situation.

It looks very much like the Feds intend to confiscate the $420 billion that us WORKERS have contributed over the years and use it to fund their UBI and to pay for the vote buying B.S. that they have engaged in to “save us” from Covdi-19 among other things.

Those who have been financial responsible, worked and saved for a better life will be paying for the people who screwed the pooch.

I would strongly encourage all readers to go back and read the rest of my post from yesterday

Frankly it seems to me by your response that you are brushing this off as a “nothing burger”.

#113 BrianT on 05.17.20 at 7:55 am

The reality is that even if you are a sheep buying into the whole lockdown nonsense the results would be the same if Montreal and Toronto had been locked down while the rest of the country was left running. The state of Florida had different policies for different parts of the state (using logic) was criticized for it and now even the critics are admitting they were right. Destroying the entire economy because Montreal has lousy seniors residences only makes sense to an esteemed Medical Professional-IMO we should have had accountants running this one not quacks.

#114 Doug Rowat on 05.17.20 at 8:33 am

#37 NoName on 05.16.20 at 3:26 pm

one of my all time favorite movies, Office Space

NoName, I’m going to need you to go ahead and post a comment on Sunday too.

–Doug

#115 TurnerNation on 05.17.20 at 8:34 am

Currently in Ontario in most small town the local Blood Blank is open with signs asking for donations; the ad campaign on sites like Weather Network state the same thing. Donate now.

Now, we must live in a 6-foot prison because we ‘might be sick’ FOREVER . But read what Blood services says…the put a definate timeline on that. What happens after that set time period they specify ? Presumably you are Fine and also good to give blood. So much that they WANT you coming by their office:
………..
“This is partly because the donor would have to be asymptomatic, so carrying the virus without suffering from it. Our travel-related eligibility criteria limits donation during the time when someone may have the virus but not know it.” <——
https://blood.ca/en/stories/why-you-wont-get-covid-19-from-a-blood-transfusion

#116 George Brundtland on 05.17.20 at 8:44 am

#82 Linda re: homeless in new communities. No, these homeless in BC are being moved out of Vancouver to other cities and municipalities by Social Services who transfer their files and force them to move to collect services, methadone, welfare, court etc. It’s all part of the plan to spread homelessness around. Actually it started n the lead up to the Olympics when advance teams of reporters, one particularly impatient journalist from Guardian who went on a mission to expose Vancouvers homeless issue. DTES is still a real eyesore, but the pop has been reduced by paying other communities to take on Vancouver’s homeless. It’s smoke and mirrors.

#117 Dharma Bum on 05.17.20 at 9:35 am

WFH won’t last.
Employers will figure out soon enough that:
WFH = Effing the Dee.

WFH=FTD

#118 Ronaldo on 05.17.20 at 9:40 am

#105 Moses71 on 05.16.20 at 11:38 pm
Unsure if 13% are representative of a pending future workforce looks like. And we are social creatures. Not to mention a home office in a dinky condo with kids in Toronto or Vancouver will make anyone go batty. Gray divorces are products of being home 24/7 with your chosen one.
We’re social creatures so I don’t see the wfh sticking as a majority.
Look how fast the 20’s jumped forward. Hopefully we will bounce back with the same optimism and vigour vs letting MDs run the economy.
————————————————————–
Well said. I agree toally.

#119 MF on 05.17.20 at 10:10 am

106 NFN_NLN on 05.17.20 at 12:16 am

All that glitters is not gold.

Those countries have their own problems. Rampant corruption, inequality, crime, and so on.

The low cost of living idea is also a myth. The majority of people who live there face a very high cost of living relative to wages and basically struggle their whole lives. Some ex pat living in a gated community with savings they accumulated in the west in Canadian dollars or USD lives in a bubble and should be ignored.

Plus, the idea that someone can do the work for half the price across the world is not new, and has been a threat for 30 years already. Many companies are finding it comes with its own unique challenges and is often not worth the savings.

The pandemic has hurt the whole world’s economy. My thoughts are those that think this is somehow a Canada only issue are entering this discussion with some bias right from the get go. Wfh will increase, but I also believe some manufacturing and an increased emphasis on r and d for technology will return to Canada as well, so there will be positives too.

MF

#120 Sail Away on 05.17.20 at 10:20 am

#107 Ponzius Pilatus on 05.17.20 at 12:50 am

Hey Sailo!
Now that UBC is going on-line only, what will your 19 year old son do?
Your house must be pretty much fixed up and painted by now.

—————-

I can only shake my head at the sheer idiocy of it all. Maybe we should all sail to Sweden where there is a touch of common sense.

#121 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.17.20 at 10:24 am

@#111 Billy Bob
“Who says only Garth can Turn Up The Snark?!”

++++
Grounded and getting bored?

Google Finance / Yahoo Finance.
Does it really matter where a fricken graph comes from?
Apparently it does to pedants.

#122 Do we know all the facts on 05.17.20 at 10:31 am

# 114 Brian T

For two months now I have been suggesting that actuaries should be the ones assessing the risks posed by Covid 19 not politicians or executives of non government agencies.

Clearly the general public became convinced that a worldwide lockdown was necessary to save millions of lives. Could we have done a better job of protecting the most vulnerable to Covid 19 without inflicting so must damage to the global and Canadian economies.

We have had more than three months to reassess the actual risk of death from Covid 19 faced by the general population of Canada. Actuaries perform risk assessment for a living and their input might prove enlightening.

#123 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.17.20 at 10:37 am

@#114 BrianT
“….we should have had accountants running this one not quacks….”

+++

Yep.
At least accountants would know how to add up the deficit expenditures and keep a running total for later , when we will have to “pay the piper|”.

I wonder where the money will come from this Fall when the Covid1984 flu bug comes back twice as virulent……

#124 Fused on 05.17.20 at 10:59 am

Canada Goose needs to drop $6 to be a good buy, Premium Brands had a nice little run up, out of it now.GE still being a dog.

#125 Blog Bunny on 05.17.20 at 10:59 am

“Off subject, but Garth, you were going to tell us what attracted you to the East Coast”

Garth, I am curious as well. Why the East coast ? The sea is way too cold for swimming even in the summer. And tax-wise, the best province is Alberta.

#126 G on 05.17.20 at 11:19 am

FYI
Zinc plus… seem to be working to help.
Early treatment is better! Waiting until you are in ICU less so.
Study paper review starts at 50 seconds, 12.5 min.

Coronavirus Pandemic Update 71: New Data on Adding Zinc to Hydroxychloroquine + Azithromycin May15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZq-K1wpur8

His other site to find the info in case the YouTube AI takes it down. https://www.medcram.com/

#127 Sail Away on 05.17.20 at 11:36 am

#105 Moses71 on 05.16.20 at 11:38 pm

And we are social creatures. Not to mention a home office in a dinky condo with kids in Toronto or Vancouver will make anyone go batty.

We’re social creatures so I don’t see the wfh sticking

——————-

Agreed Moses. Let my people go!

#128 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.17.20 at 11:41 am

@#126 Blog Bunny
“Garth, I am curious as well. Why the East coast ? The sea is way too cold for swimming even in the summer. ”
++++

I disagree.
I was boating and swimming off Pamure Island beach PEI last summer for an hour.
Water was absolutely beautiful and it was only August.
Its even warmer in Sept.

#129 Dr V on 05.17.20 at 12:04 pm

113 James – thank you for the link. The article is one of
the better ones in that it is thorough and highlights the potential positives as well as the difficulties.

The bar graph showing the current levels of existing income assistance is interesting. Note that welfare and OAS/GIS are the lowest. As an economic solution, as opposed to a social justice one, I feel the starting point for a UBI should be somewhere in that range, and not as generous as CERB.

I believe CPP is omitted as it is considered a pension
or savings derived from work, and the government of the day would be committing political suicide by eliminating it. However, depending on the level and cost of the UBI, it is possible that CPP premiums and benefits would be lowered, or no longer increased.

Just running the numbers, there are something like 17M contributors to the CPP. That gives $25K of assets
per contributor. Doesn’t sound like much.

#130 Phylis on 05.17.20 at 12:08 pm

Productivity of new hires must be limited given a wfh environment. How many business have launched in the last three months? Imagine trying to combine both scenarios.

#131 IHCTD9 on 05.17.20 at 12:13 pm

I like the idea of wfh, but there would be strings attached for me. If biz is slow, then I get to fill out the time card, and head on outside. My job involves a lot of dead time, if wfh I could put those to good use. I’d need a small raise too to cover home office expenses, but boss would pay less overall because there’s no way I would end up with a 40hr paycheque ever again.

Right now I am getting tons done outside, and big projects that would take a month or two of picking away on evenings and weekends to complete are getting done in a week or so. I have lots that could be done, and after that there is still fishing and ATVing that need attending to.

#132 Russ on 05.17.20 at 12:42 pm

crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.16.20 at 9:50 pm

@#87 Russ
“Hey Crowdie,”
++++

Sorry , only Floppie can call me Crowdie……I think its an Auzzie thing.
Everyone else usually refers to me as Fartz, Fartzy, Mr Fartz, A-hole, jerk, etc etc etc .
=========================

Not quite like that.

Flop annoyed you way back too.
I first replied to yew as crowdie when Boom was still alive. A few of us did.
But not to worry. I know that I’m not as annoying and posting too much, like the other guys.

Did you read the beaver story? Hilarious.

__________________________________________________
Way back machine:
crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.27.16 at 10:03 pm

@#60 Flop

i prefer to think of myself as “fartzie” but I’ll answer to just about anything as Brazil Expat already knows.

#133 jess on 05.17.20 at 12:49 pm

protection?
42 Grunt on 05.16.20 at 3:56 pm
the virus has been found in semen

“negotiating with or paying a ransom to terrorists is a violation of federal criminal law.”
Editors’ Pick|192,108 views|May 17, 2020,05:08am EDT
Hackers Publish First 169 Trump ‘Dirty Laundry’ Emails After Being Branded Cyber-Terrorists

Davey WinderSenior Contributor
Cybersecurity

https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveywinder/2020/05/17/hackers-publish-first-169-trump-dirty-laundry-emails-after-being-branded-cyber-terrorists/#2bdf75d25268

#134 To James on 05.17.20 at 12:55 pm

Actually I wrote a few weeks ago about 420 billion sitting in CPP
Your ranting about your money is useless

If the Government took the money all it means is all future CPP payments will come out of general revenues.
A non issue.
It’s only a pen stroke and you will never know.
Underline you will never know because the government will still cut a check.
Look back at your history books
Paul Martin took 30 billion out of the federal retirees pension to balance the deficit.
And why do you think the government was silent when sears went under and the corporation took all the pension money
Duh.
Wake up they will do what ever it takes
My guess is inflation.
Now ask yourself why is Number 45 rattling his sword against China? I have a super duper weapon!
Duh
He owes the China Bank 100 billion, makes Canada deficit look like trump I mean chump change.
Have a great weekend stop worrying you have no control over any outcome.
It’s a battle between federal reserve and the stock market. We are A small frog in the big pond.

#135 TurnerNation on 05.17.20 at 12:59 pm

Why is life being moved online and with such speed, and targeting the –young– first ? (All school and post-secondary moved fully online in only *2* months?)
Why not ask your smiling, likable frontman for the Globalists.
(Once again it’s all about the A.I. running our lives.)

http://www.businessinsider.com › elon-musk-neuralink-implants-link-brains…
Jul 17, 2019 – Elon Musk’s company Neuralink plans to connect people’s brains to … known as a brain-machine interface, to be implanted into the minds of …

Elon Musk wants to hook your brain directly up to computers …www.nbcnews.com › mach › tech › elon-musk-wants-hook-your-brai…
Jul 16, 2019 – Elon Musk, the futurist billionaire behind SpaceX and Tesla, outlined his plans to connect humans’ brains directly to computers on Tuesday …

#136 Garth to Nova Scotia on 05.17.20 at 1:00 pm

Garth and Dorothy and Bandit where walking in the snow, sound familiar, think back to,T1
Garth looks at Bandit who always wags his tail,
Then looks at Dorthy who always says why ?
Then he looks towards the heavens looking for a sign
God am I crazy? Remember the movie?
The wind howled down the street towards the East
And he says we are moving.
Besides the Provincial government gave him a tax break to relocate his offices from Toronto
Have a great weekend?
That’s my guess it’s as good as yours.

#137 TurnerNation on 05.17.20 at 1:09 pm

If you doubt this big reset is mainly coming for the kids can you stomach these pictures of how Distancing is being applied to children? Will your school be doing this in Sept? Ask your administrators now.

From Twitter:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EX5yom7WAAIo-je?format=jpg&name=medium

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EXveLdSXQAAdw6T?format=jpg&name=360×360

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EXveLlkWkAQSWrQ?format=jpg&name=360×360

#138 Anonymous on 05.18.20 at 4:02 am

#128 crowdedelevatorfartz on 05.17.20 at 11:41 am
@#126 Blog Bunny
“Garth, I am curious as well. Why the East coast ? The sea is way too cold for swimming even in the summer. ”
++++

I disagree.
I was boating and swimming off Pamure Island beach PEI last summer for an hour.
Water was absolutely beautiful and it was only August.
Its even warmer in Sept.

—————————————————

Yes PEI recognized the world over for its warm tropical waters.