Lessons from Anon

The real estate establishment’s in high gear. CREA says sales and sentiment have returned to normal. Re/Max issued a media release stating cannabis has been good for housing prices (at least in the weedopolis of Smiths Falls). Realtor boards in Toronto and Vancouver are pumping ‘balanced’ markets. And apparently there’s an election on, with politicians promising joy to every moister making an offer.

But here at GreaterFool we’re no rubes. This ain’t our first rodeo. We’ve been around the block.

Residential real estate is no financial panacea. It’s not a retirement strategy. Not even a financial plan. Putting all your eggs in the housing basket can yield losses as quickly as it can profits. There’s a reason this pathetic blog is always yammering on about diversification and balance – it works. Here are two blog dogs to give you their stories…

“Please leave me anonymous,” says Mr. Anon, who now lives in Ontario. ”No suck up, either.

Between 2001 and 2007 he owned a house in Fort McMurray, Alberta, the jewel of the oil sands and scene of a typical property boom and bust.

“Here are some specs from my experience.

1. 1983 Sold new $110,000.00
2. 1992 Sold $130,000.00
3. 1996 Sold $130,000.00
4. 2001 Sold $220,000.00 to me (scared shitless).
5. 2007 Sold $549,900.00 Bought by a nice couple with no money down, a 40 year mortgage insured by the CHMC. It cost them $50,000.00 in insurance. He had to replace a fence all around the property with vinyl ($$) and a 100’ x 5’ wood retaining wall with brick ($$).
6. 2013 Sold $638,000.00 Very fortunate to get their principal back after all costs.
7. 2019 October Sold $400,000.00

“Just thought I would share this…”

Hmm. Reminds me of the motto of this blog – the fool who follows is the greater fool. Real estate valuations are determined primarily by demand, which is often based on buyers’ flimsy grasp of economic and financial realities, sautéed in emotion and sprinkled with spousal angst. This must be the only commodity (other than gold) which people crave more as it rises in price. Bubbles breed buyers. Busts are lonely. And never think the Fort Mac experience is unique, with no lessons for other places, like the LM or 905. It’s not.

Now, speaking of the centre of civilization, here’s a blogger with a lesson from 416. “Thought you might find this exercise interesting,” he says. “If you choose to write about it, anonymity is requested.”

What is it with this secrecy thing? Sheesh. Anyway, here’s the report…

“My wife and I were considering buying a co-op or condo for my mother-in-law, mostly to give her some stability and a break from the vagaries of the private rental market in Toronto. I sat down over the weekend and crunched the numbers.

“Current rent: $1,470 / month for a one-bed in a central area of Toronto, where she is away from the downtown chaos, but has easy access to subway and streetcar.

Assumed cost of the condo: $500k
Downpayment: $125k (we have the cash to buy outright, but could not see the logic in even contemplating this in the current interest rate environment)
Amortization: 20 years
Mortgage rate: 2.8%, assuming increases of 0.5% at each five-year renewal. Might be pessimistic, but who knows, we’d still be in a pretty low rate environment at year 20 under this assumption.
Assumed annual 3% increase in real estate values (again, who knows…)
Assumed 4.5% investment return net of fees
Assumed 27% capital gains rate / average 30% tax on investment portfolio (likely flawed, since I accrued the tax liability on the portfolio annually, whereas much of the tax would be deferred as capital gains, but still…)
2.5% annual increases in property tax and condo fees
2% annual increase in rent
15% upcharge on condo fees to assume some kind of special assessment over the 20 years

“Long story short, owning under this scenario is an absolute train wreck horror show.

“Factoring in interest, principal, condo fees, taxes, opportunity cost of the money not invested (both downpayment and the delta between monthly carrying costs), capital gains on the sale of the condo, land transfer tax, real estate commissions, the full picture, there is a $600k shortfall between owning and renting, in favour of renting.

“Yes, at year 20 the condo is mortgage free, but there is no scenario in which that $600k hole reasonably gets filled back in.

“We’re happy to own our house in Toronto, even though it’s now even clearer that it makes no financial sense to do so (we have an approx. $3.5 million house in Toronto, with a $750k mortgage that we could pay off tomorrow but feel that would be irrational when those funds can stay invested). Our house is significantly less than half of our total assets, so we are lucky enough to be able to afford irrationality, but for those who can’t I was really struck by just how toxic real estate is to financial health.”

And that about sums it up. (a) If you won the birth lottery and got into real estate ownership a few decades ago, be thankful. (b) If you managed to buy property on the cheap before mortgage rates crashed and the hormones erupted, fall to your knees in gratitude. (c) If you think this experience will be repeated, give your head a shake. There are times when it makes sense to borrow a bundle and shoulder the huge costs of buying and keeping a home. This is not one of them.

No matter what the realtors tell you or the politicians fabricate – and even with mortgage rates in the ditch – buying a first home in a major market is a dodgy proposition. Do it because you’re smitten, emotional, nesting or pushed into it. Just don’t call it a plan.

113 comments ↓

#1 The Wet One on 10.16.19 at 4:27 pm

My! My! My!

“No suck up, either.”

The hoi polloi sure are getting uppity aren’t they Garth?

The nerve of these people!

;-)

#2 Flop... on 10.16.19 at 4:29 pm

I haven’t had a contract hit my desk for a month now, so I have been trying to live on $2 a day.

It’s not working out too well.

Spent $10 on toilet paper yesterday.

2-ply is not better than 1-ply, as it doesn’t taste any better…

M45BC

“Charting Extreme Poverty: Population Living on Less than $1.90 a Day.

Poverty presses at the core of humanity. We often judge the best of us by the least of us. Most of us already know that much of the world’s population lives in extreme poverty. But just how prevalent is this issue? Using data from 2018, we created an easy-to-read visualization to chart the total number of people living in extreme poverty in countries around the world.

The U.S. poverty rate has fallen for the fourth consecutive year.

The U.S. metric for measuring poverty is considered misleading as it undercounts people suffering from economic deprivation.

International poverty rates are already high and may be worsened by the trade war.

In the United States, people of color are disproportionately affected by poverty compared to white people.

Countries With The Highest Extreme Poverty Rates

1. Somalia: 99.2%
2. Central African Republic: 80.92%
3. Burundi: 77.72%
4. North Korea: 70.58%
5. Madagascar: 69.77%
6. Democratic Republic of Congo: 68.84%
7. Malawi: 67.56%
8. Yemen: 64.51%
9. Sierra Leone: 59.55%
10. Guinea-Bissau: 53.88%

By analyzing this data, we can see how many people across the globe are living under the international poverty line ($1.90/day). While several countries have an estimated extreme poverty rate of 0%, poverty is a much larger issue in other countries, such as Somalia, in which the majority of the population lives in extreme poverty.

The United States also has a considerably low extreme poverty rate at 0.97%. However, though the U.S. poverty rate is declining, many suggest that these numbers are misleading and don’t represent the true number of people living in poverty in the country.”

https://howmuch.net/articles/charting-extreme-poverty-around-world

#3 Yukon Elvis on 10.16.19 at 4:34 pm

Looks like demand will stay strong, keeping prices high:

One in five homes in Canada are purchased by newcomers to the country, according to a study commissioned by Royal LePage released Wednesday.
The online survey conducted by Leger, which polled 1,500 people who arrived in Canada within the past 10 years, found a majority of respondents (54 per cent) chose to move to Canada because they see the country as a good place to live and work. When asked why they chose Canada over the United States, most respondents said they feel more welcomed as an immigrant in Canada (31 per cent), while others said they believe Canada is a safer place to live (26 per cent).
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/one-fifth-of-homes-in-canada-bought-by-newcomers-royal-lepage-survey-finds-1.1332342

#4 Leo Trollstoy on 10.16.19 at 4:37 pm

Dumb man rationalizes renting over owning RE

Next paragraph rationalizes owning his RE

Dumb man is dumb

You can’t make this up

#5 Bad Hombre on 10.16.19 at 4:37 pm

Does anyone know if Trump is impeached and removed from office, does Putin still run the Whitehouse?

#6 The Wet One on 10.16.19 at 4:43 pm

@#2,

Huh, that’s very interesting.

I never would have guessed that Russia (Russia of all places!!!!) has an extreme poverty rate as low as it does, with less than 1,000 people living in extreme poverty (i.e. living on less than $1.90 / day).

That’s way better than Canada (104,000 people living on less than $1.90 / day).

That’s remarkable.

I wonder how that happened?

Huh.

Good link. Thanks for that.

#7 NotLegalAdvice on 10.16.19 at 4:44 pm

6. 2013 Sold $638,000.00.

7. 2019 October Sold $400,000.00

__________________________

Apparently a similar situation occurred in the GTA in the early 90’s. I always hear the old folks talking about how houses went from $600k to $250k “overnight”.

Will it happen again though? Will we see those kinds of drops here in the GTA in the near future?

The rental market needs to correct as well. Landlords feel they can charge what ever they want these days!

#8 Flop... on 10.16.19 at 4:45 pm

I keep telling you guys that there is nothing holding up the bottom of the Vancouver market except people’s attachment to the governments recommended retail price.

Let’s look at this case at the very bottom of the detached market in the city proper.

Paid 890k in August 2018

Asking 888k with the already baked in costs of partial development that they are bailing on and could even be on the hook for plans, permits etc. although nothing is mentioned.

Orange death mesh ain’t free.

Where is the bottom?

Without speculation, it is somewhere around what locals can afford without over extending themselves, and that means there is a long way to go…

M45BC

https://www.zolo.ca/vancouver-real-estate/1245-east-king-edward-avenue

#9 I’m stupid on 10.16.19 at 4:48 pm

New housing in the gta is a disaster. Don’t let anyone else tell you otherwise. I’ve don’t Hvac on over 15000 new houses in the last 20 years. Average about 750 houses as year. It’s a complete and utter disaster this year. I’ve done roughly 300 houses this year and I’m completely out of work now. Zero houses going up for all the builders I deal with. Zero not even one and I don’t know when the next site will come. Definitely not this year. I’m hoping for spring but who knows. I’m fortunate because I’ve been preparing for this since 2009 so I think I can weather this slow down. One thing is for sure, I’m not going to be making any large or extravagant purchases.

How long before before we see this mess spilling into the broader economy?

#10 RWZM on 10.16.19 at 4:51 pm

“(a) If you won the birth lottery and got into real estate ownership a few decades ago, be thankful.”

Or like, one decade.

#11 JJ on 10.16.19 at 4:52 pm

In Edmonton and Calgary, you can get $1700 rent on a $300K investment, where vacancies are shrinking and rents are creeping higher. As an investment with all the tax benefits I think RE still makes sense with leverage in some markets. Not TO or Van though.

#12 FreeBird on 10.16.19 at 4:55 pm

US poverty rate by state. As of 2017 was in 5th year of decline.
http://worldpopulationreview.com/states/poverty-rate-by-state/

https://www.npr.org/2019/09/10/759512938/u-s-census-bureau-reports-poverty-rate-down-but-millions-still-poor

#13 The Wet One on 10.16.19 at 4:58 pm

So after reading #2’s links, I suggest we all go to this website: http://www.globalrichlist.com , plug in our numbers and feel good about just how well off we are.

I’m in the top 0.11% income earners in the world (i.e. I make more than 99.89% of income earners on Earth. How ridiculous is that?) and I’m ranked ~#187,475,000 in wealth, which isn’t great, but beats the wealth of 7,550,008,000 people on Earth putting me in the top 2.42% of people by net worth. So yeah, it’s actually really, really, really good.

Dang.

I have it pretty darned good don’t I?

Yay me!

#14 Mossy on 10.16.19 at 4:59 pm

These guys are definitely not Asian lol! More than 7 million dollars in assets and they won’t help her ageing mother buy a 500K condo? Some things are more important than money.

#15 Where's Our Money Going Canada? on 10.16.19 at 5:00 pm

Any truth to this from the Buffalo Chronicle, anyone verify? And please no Trudy-groupies calling the Chronicle BS, prove it didn’t happen then.
https://buffalochronicle.com/2019/10/16/snc-lavalin-ceo-fled-canada-36-hours-before-he-was-to-be-arrested/
Says he was tipped off by the PMO.
Also read that Sara Bronfman, cousin to Trudope’s bud, is married to Basit Igtet, who had nearly been installed as President of Lybia following a US military-backed ouster of Moummar Gadaffi.
“Former SNC Lavalin CEO Neil Bruce fled Canada just three days before he was expected to be arrested on bribery charges relating to a series of meetings that he and an attorney, Frank Iaccobucci, engaged in late last year to discuss the Trans Mountain Pipeline expansion with a handful of key counterparties.”
What a 3rd world sleaze pit Canada has become, mostly coming out of Quebec it seems.

#16 Damifino on 10.16.19 at 5:13 pm

News Item: Obama endorses Trudeau

If that isn’t foreign interference in our election, what is?

#17 oh bouy on 10.16.19 at 5:16 pm

2#16 Damifino on 10.16.19 at 5:13 pm
News Item: Obama endorses Trudeau

If that isn’t foreign interference in our election, what is?
_________________________

You sure it wasnt just JT in blackface?

#18 Kitsilano Kid on 10.16.19 at 5:17 pm

Stop using the demographic lottery winners as an example to point out how insane it is to buy real estate today. Try renting in Vancouver under $3K per month – if you can buy and still save go for it. Otherwise be doomed.

#19 Penny Henny on 10.16.19 at 5:25 pm

And here are the September real estate numbers for the Niagara Region.

https://www.niagararealtor.ca/sites/default/files/September%20Stats%20%28Complete%29.pdf

#20 Blacksheep on 10.16.19 at 5:25 pm

Shawn responds to Nomad’s quote @ # 153,

Shawn, we have done the chartered bank, money creation dance a dozen times, so I’m sure everyone knows how it works.

But the very important point that Nomad reminds us about here, is the counter to that action, that’s rarely discussed in decent company.

The detail most don’t take into account, is the ‘destruction of chartered bank created monies’ via taxation / repayemnt, in attempt to control growth / inflation at desired rate.
———————————–
Nomad abbreviated:

“In theory, the federal government can create infinite money, and taxes are collected to destroy money, thus combating inflation.”

“The lender keeps some of the interest for their profit, while the portion paid to the central bank is destroyed.”
———————————–
People holding gold, are not going to like reading this….

#21 AGuyInVancouver on 10.16.19 at 5:27 pm

#3 Yukon Elvis on 10.16.19 at 4:34 pm
Looks like demand will stay strong, keeping prices high:

One in five homes in Canada are purchased by newcomers to the country, according to a study commissioned by Royal LePage released Wednesday.
The online survey conducted by Leger, which polled 1,500 people who arrived in Canada within the past 10 years, found a majority of respondents (54 per cent) chose to move to Canada because they see the country as a good place to live and work. When asked why they chose Canada over the United States, most respondents said they feel more welcomed as an immigrant in Canada (31 per cent), while others said they believe Canada is a safer place to live (26 per cent).
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/one-fifth-of-homes-in-canada-bought-by-newcomers-royal-lepage-survey-finds-1.1332342
_ _ _
Of course, it’s an open secret Trudeau took a leaf out of Christy Clark’s playbook and to create the illusion of proepserity with an “ESL Economy”.
https://betterdwelling.com/canadas-heavy-immigration-is-the-last-pillar-preventing-a-recession/

#22 YUL renter on 10.16.19 at 5:39 pm

Since selling the house in 2012, been renting just barely half decent place in MTL, today $1600. But the REIT that owns it, and the office staff who work for them are easily some of the rudest, most dishonest and morally corrupt entities I’ve had to deal with in the last 45years. It makes renting feel like wading through a pool of toxic sludge.

#23 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.16.19 at 5:41 pm

#2
Flop, as usual, official stats are useless.
Gotta dig down to the nitty gritty.
Medina, Washington. Home of Gates and Bozo is facing bankruptcy.
Richmond, B.C. officially one of the poorest municipalities in Canada. Yet average house value around 2 Mill.
That’s why we need a wealth tax.

#24 It's Secret on 10.16.19 at 5:51 pm

1961 my parents bought a not finished yet new build semi-detached four bedroom house at what was then the extreme west of what would be amalgamated to form Mississauga years later, $13,000. In recent years these houses have pushed very close to a half million in listings. What kind of shape do you think these places a in now a days? What could actually and reasonably explain and justify that kind of increase in “value”? I’ll tell you this much it is not that the money people are making as compared to what they are now exploded that much.

#25 BlogDog123 on 10.16.19 at 5:53 pm

Trudeau probably called his buddy Obama and said over the phone:

“Those conservatives are lying, unethical, two-faced, pandering, sneaky, showy, gropey, smarmy, over-promising, harming our future taxpayers with debt kind of people. I’m a Laurentian Elite and all these sycophants around me say I need your endorsement.”

Little did Obama know that Trudeau was describing T2’s 4 years in office.

#26 Isuckless on 10.16.19 at 5:56 pm

Meanwhile in 613 centre of government world – bidding wars

#27 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.16.19 at 5:57 pm

@#18 Kits Kid
“Try renting in Vancouver under $3K per month.”
++++

Easy, move to Burnaby and rent for $1500/month

#28 akashic records on 10.16.19 at 5:57 pm

Of course, it’s an open secret Trudeau took a leaf out of Christy Clark’s playbook and to create the illusion of proepserity with an “ESL Economy”.
https://betterdwelling.com/canadas-heavy-immigration-is-the-last-pillar-preventing-a-recession/

Plus the election playbook…

CBC reported that last Friday, Syrian refugees, who were the first business of the then newly elected Trudeau government, got their citizenship, just in time to cast vote at this election… guess who is their favoured candidate?

#29 yvr_lurker on 10.16.19 at 6:07 pm

#18 Kitsilano Kid

———
In my view there is some truth to what you say. Now that prices are down somewhat in Vancouver and are heading still down with a lower gradient, one perhaps needs to take a little more risk in YVR to purchase something if you can afford it and it looks like you are in a good position with your job growth. My worry, is that is that if Hong Kong goes south with respect to Beijing and if Beijing does take more control of HK, there are 300,000 people there with Canadian passports, many of whom will want to leave. This group is not heading to Regina, Winnipeg, or Moose Jaw, and from all my past experience (world fair in YVR–first big wave…. 2005 start of big-wave from mainland China etc….), it will drive prices in YVR up. These people will not be paying the housing spec taxes since they have Canadian passports. To live in HK and have a (non-gov’t subsidized ) apartment one needs big $$$. Many of this group will be coming with lots of cash; they will not be looking for jobs shoe-shining at the airport. My prediction is that if the screws are turned up in HK over the next year, it could precipitate a rather large exodus. This was the whole point of many people in HK having a Canadian passport in the first place. My view is the current slowdown could change rather significantly with these world events. Politicians worked for years to make local housing globalized. This will be just another manifestation of that.

For me, I have 8 more or so years to work. I plan on selling out and moving either to the Sunshine Coast or the Gulf islands where I can have a much simpler life. What I used to like about YVR has been eroding dramatically over the past decade.

#30 yorkville renter on 10.16.19 at 6:10 pm

#21 – the rate of immigration peaked in 1993… but has been steady at 0.7% of total population. So, not sure why you think JT jacked it up.

my source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_Canada

#31 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.16.19 at 6:13 pm

#28 akashic records on 10.16.19 at 5:57 pm
Of course, it’s an open secret Trudeau took a leaf out of Christy Clark’s playbook and to create the illusion of proepserity with an “ESL Economy”.
https://betterdwelling.com/canadas-heavy-immigration-is-the-last-pillar-preventing-a-recession/

Plus the election playbook…

CBC reported that last Friday, Syrian refugees, who were the first business of the then newly elected Trudeau government, got their citizenship, just in time to cast vote at this election… guess who is their favoured candidate?
———–
That’s a tough one.
But I’ll give it a shot.
Max?

#32 Mattl on 10.16.19 at 6:16 pm

#14 Mossy on 10.16.19 at 4:59 pm
These guys are definitely not Asian lol! More than 7 million dollars in assets and they won’t help her ageing mother buy a 500K condo? Some things are more important than money.

—————————————————————–
Exactly what I was thinking. Good on them for accumulating assets but god forbid Mom has a stable place to live that she can play out the string in. Nothing a 77 year old likes more then a cheap timber frame building, transient neighbors and moving every few years. Sorry about your luck Grandma, Anon is busy making bank.

Renting sucks, I am glad I never will need to live in someone else’s home, god forbid their basement suite, at their whim. I’ve heard enough upstairs bathtub farts to last a lifetime.

I don’t care if it costs me more to own a home. It would be cheaper for us to eat cat food and drive a 1982 Corolla but that would also suck.

If you need mobility, lack job security, have no investments, can’t do the most basic maintenance, you need to rent. No shame in that game. If you can afford to own, are stable (like Anon’s MOM ffs), owning a home has a lot to offer. It doesn’t have to be profitable, or offer the best ROI, to make the most sense.

#33 Gravy Train on 10.16.19 at 6:16 pm

#5 Bad Hombre on 10.16.19 at 4:37 pm
“Does anyone know if Trump is impeached and removed from office, does Putin still run the Whitehouse?” It all depends on whether Pence is impeached and removed from office as well; if he is, Pelosi takes over as POTUS. :)

#34 Bezengy on 10.16.19 at 6:20 pm

So a 3.5 million dollar house in Toronto pays 21k in property tax, and yet Torontonians can’t afford to pay for their own TTC upgrades, so the rest of the country’s taxpayers have to pony up 30 Billion?, but let’s be honest, he’s really not paying 21k in taxes is he?

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2019/10/16/mayor-john-tory-throws-support-behind-ontario-line-in-deal-with-province-that-would-avoid-subway-upload.html

https://www.toronto.ca/services-payments/property-taxes-utilities/property-tax/property-tax-calculator/property-tax-calculator/

btw…a 3.5 million dollar house in Goldtown pays 65 K on the same house, 300% more.

https://www.timmins.ca/our_services/finance/municipal_property_tax_calculator

If we stop subsidizing Torontonians housing costs will correct themselves. Unfortunately a lot of people will be forced to move to less expensive areas.

#35 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.16.19 at 6:22 pm

Talking about poverty.
Former NHLer Donald Brashear works at Timmies.
Remember, many Canadians are just a paycheque away from homelessness.

#36 Leo Trollstoy on 10.16.19 at 6:23 pm

Impeachment won’t happen

No House vote and it’s all going through House Intelligence Committee instead of Judiciary Committee

Liberals posturing and blowing hot air as per usual

Trump’s base already knows that impeachment talk is #fakenews

#37 Entrepreneur on 10.16.19 at 6:31 pm

I also found it troubling about Quebec is a business is “not allow to say Hi in English” in Quebec” or about to be law. Really and what and why not?!? I say a business should be able to talk any language they want to. You do not want to discourage business, you want to encourage it, inflow of cash. And there are other ways to keep a culture alive but with other avenues.

And at the Federal Election Debates the Bloc leader talked about Quebec but only Quebec. This sounds more provincially than federally and what about the rest of us, left out. And why would a BC person or any other province vote for Quebec when excluded?

So my conclusion: The Bloc is gaining votes because of the NDP decline, but I wonder if later on, secretly, they will form a coalition with the Liberals. They said they would not but I question it.

The Nanos Polls said that Quebecers liked Trudeau.

As for the NDP, Singh, who finally had a voice, talked a lot of racism, big promises and would join forces with the Liberals if the Conservatives win the majority. So what is the point of voting NDP?

A lot of voters are turning away from the smaller groups and voting for Scheer, the voting fight is on.

But people here on the coast of BC many youth are not in that fight, are left behind in the housing market, jobs, forgotten and are standing by the scientist in that we have little time left and want to stand by the party that will go forward on the green renewable energy, the Green Party.

The youth here are fighting for their lives and for the planet. More power to them.

#38 SoggyShorts on 10.16.19 at 6:32 pm

Anon #2
Using his own 4.5% investment return number should be making over 300K per year after taxes after liquidating and investing.

For $25,000 a month his whole extended family could rent literal castles around the world. Like 2-4 castles at the same time.

#39 Slim on 10.16.19 at 6:37 pm

Speaking of Fort McMurray, these condo owners could be on the hook for the full loss of their building. The former insurance company won’t renew their policy. And other companies so far won’t either.

Similar to Fort Mac is what happened during the 2003 Kelowna wildfires. Good luck getting financing if your home is not insurable.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/fort-mcmurray-condominium-insurance-1.5318750

#40 akashic records on 10.16.19 at 6:44 pm

#31 Ponzius Pilatus on 10.16.19 at 6:13 pm
#28 akashic records on 10.16.19 at 5:57 pm

Plus the election playbook…

CBC reported that last Friday, Syrian refugees, who were the first business of the then newly elected Trudeau government, got their citizenship, just in time to cast vote at this election… guess who is their favoured candidate?
———–
That’s a tough one.
But I’ll give it a shot.
Max?

Max comes only after they realize that they were rescued to become tax slaves of liberal debt creators.

#41 Russ on 10.16.19 at 6:49 pm

conan on 10.16.19 at 3:00 pm
Nail biter election………Obama just endorsed Trudeau.
===================

Does this qualify as the USA meddling in our election?

Cheers, R

#42 Deplorable Dude on 10.16.19 at 6:50 pm

You will all be happy to know today is Trump’s 1000th day as President.

I voted Conservative this past weekend. Apparently our candidate might actually have a chance to beat the incumbent Greenie. Sooo wanted to vote Mad Max…but thats a wasted vote. The Conservatives had better keep their promise of erasing the Carbon tax.

In local news another Academic expert gets defrocked by academia…in this case UVic….after pointing out the politically incorrect fact Polar Bears (supposed bell weather of Climate change)…..are actually thriving….

https://business.financialpost.com/opinion/was-this-zoologist-punished-for-telling-school-kids-politically-incorrect-facts-about-polar-bears

#43 akashic records on 10.16.19 at 7:01 pm

#30 yorkville renter on 10.16.19 at 6:10 pm
#21 – the rate of immigration peaked in 1993… but has been steady at 0.7% of total population. So, not sure why you think JT jacked it up.

Why don’t you go to the source?

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/corporate/publications-manuals/departmental-plan-2019-2020/departmental-plan.html

“In 2018, Canada admitted 321,121 permanent residents. This was a significant increase from the 286,479 admitted in 2017. ”

And much more increase to come:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-immigration-increase-350000-1.4886546

The beauty of setting immigration target at the percentage of the population is in this graph.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_of_Canada#/media/File:Population_Canada_ver_4.png

It guarantees the ever increasing headcount.

#44 Long-Time Lurker on 10.16.19 at 7:03 pm

Nasa found life on Mars over 40 years ago but ignored it, former scientist claims

The senior scientist said there were early indications of alien life

BRONWEN WEATHERBY

A former Nasa scientist claims evidence of life was found on Mars in the 1970s but was ignored.

Viking landers, a pair of space probes, were sent to the Martian surface more than 40 years ago to explore the planet.

One of the tests they ran was known as Labeled Release, or LR, which was intended to look for signs of life.

Back in the lab, the results seemed to indicate something was happening on the surface.

The principal investigator on the experiment, Gilbert V Levin, has now written an article arguing those findings were indications of alien life on Mars. Signs, he says, were ignored by Nasa.

It was back as far as July 30, 1976, when the team Levin was heading up got the initial results from the LR. “Amazingly, they were positive,” he writes in the Scientific American.

“As the experiment progressed, a total of four positive results, supported by five varied controls, streamed down from the twin Viking spacecraft landed some 4,000 miles apart.

“The data curves signaled the detection of microbial respiration on the Red Planet. The curves from Mars were similar to those produced by LR tests of soils on Earth.

“It seemed we had answered that ultimate question.”….

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/nasa-found-life-on-mars-in-the-1970s-but-ignored-it-scientist-claims-a4261631.html

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/im-convinced-we-found-evidence-of-life-on-mars-in-the-1970s/

#45 the Jaguar on 10.16.19 at 7:09 pm

It’s incredible the way we are lied to everyday by the mainstream media who owe their souls to the real estate cartel. Of course it also extends to politics as well. If one just looks around at the increasing numbers of homeless people, the drug crisis, the impacts of globalization on future job prospects and our present way of life it should be obvious the party cannot go on much longer. The link below is an interesting podcast. 48 minutes or so. Interview with a Cornell University professor that covers lots of bases. The bit about financial markets starts at approx 24 minutes into the cast if you prefer to skip the preliminary conspiracy theories. It’s amusing even if you find fault with the analysis.

http://traffic.libsyn.com/kunstlercast/KunstlerCast_320.mp3

#46 Deplorable Dude on 10.16.19 at 7:23 pm

#41 Russ…”Does this qualify as the USA meddling in our election?”

No….only counts when Republicans do it.

#47 conan on 10.16.19 at 7:25 pm

#41 Russ on 10.16.19 at 6:49 p

Its a fine line but I would say no.
We know who it is.
It’s a positive statement about someone.
It’s not an attack.

#48 Joseph R. on 10.16.19 at 7:28 pm

#16 Damifino on 10.16.19 at 5:13 pm
News Item: Obama endorses Trudeau

If that isn’t foreign interference in our election, what is?

———————————————————–

Well, by your question, you are telling everyone on this board that you don’t know the difference between an endorsement from a private person and one done by a government.

Barack Obama is a private person. Donald Trump won the election in 2016.

Obama speaks for himself, not a government, unlike the events that occurred between Trump and the Russians when there is evidence of the Russian GOVERNMENT helping out candidate Donald Trump.

#49 John in Mtl on 10.16.19 at 7:45 pm

#37 Entrepreneur on 10.16.19 at 6:31 pm

I also found it troubling about Quebec is a business is “not allow to say Hi in English” in Quebec” or about to be law.

Don’t worry, there will be NO such law in Quebec. It has already been decided that, 1 – it is a very very ridiculous proposition and 2 – it cannot possibly be enforced.

#50 TurnerNation on 10.16.19 at 7:47 pm

#9 I’m stupid a sign of the times, SIR COrp which owns a ton of branded restaurants eg Jack Astors today cut down its payout, stock plunged 20%

They had this to say. But why are so many paying $10-15 in extra delivery fees – for your meal to by bumped along miles and cold from some person’s back pack or car seat?!

“SIR’s management believes that its sales performance and the overall performance in the full-service restaurant industry has been impacted by changing consumer behaviour. Consumer spending at full-service restaurants in Ontario, where the majority of SIR’s restaurants are located, has been restrained by a number of factors, including the impact of a minimum wage increase on menu pricing and an increasing number of consumers choosing to order through meal delivery services instead of in-restaurant dining, which has impacted beverage sales and resulted in SIR incurring selling commission obligations, among other things.”

“SIR’s Concept brands include: Jack Astor’s Bar and Grill, with 38 locations; Scaddabush Italian Kitchen & Bar with nine locations; and Canyon Creek, with five locations. SIR also operates one-of-a-kind “Signature” brands including Reds Wine Tavern, Redstrademark Midtown Tavern, Reds Square One and The Loose Moose. “”

#51 45north on 10.16.19 at 7:51 pm

I’m stupid: New housing in the GTA is a disaster. Don’t let anyone else tell you otherwise. I’ve done HVAC on over 15000 new houses in the last 20 years. Average about 750 houses as year. It’s a complete and utter disaster this year. I’ve done roughly 300 houses this year and I’m completely out of work now.

the housing market is tanking. Politicians are trying to prop it up but it’s still tanking.

I think I can weather this slow down. One thing is for sure, I’m not going to be making any large or extravagant purchases.

doesn’t sound so stupid

#52 Armpit on 10.16.19 at 7:55 pm

Renters are not as mobile as one thinks…. especially in the Hammer. if you rented for 5 years and want to move out because your daily pot smoking, party all night neighbour just moved in…it will cost you an extra 40% in rent to another apartment.

Same as owning a condo box.

Glad I won the birth lottery and own outright. Still, I would trade my age/net worth with a 20yr old…on condition I keep my knowledge!

#53 yorkville renter on 10.16.19 at 8:13 pm

#34 – you think comparing Toronto tax rates to Timmins is fair? really?

Does Timmins have close to the same density?
Does Timmins have condos?
What about commercial properties? Office towers?

my commercial property is listed at $700k and the taxes are north of $12k a year.

Density matters for mill rates! wake up man!

#43 – good point, and reliably sourced. I concede the growth is large

#54 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.16.19 at 8:37 pm

“My advice to Millennials…..work longer.”

https://business.financialpost.com/personal-finance/young-money/americas-youth-are-waking-up-to-their-grim-financial-future.

5 more days until the Millennial Messiah is leading a minority govt……bring on the zombie apocalypse…..

#55 Neo on 10.16.19 at 8:52 pm

#9 I’m stupid

I have a buddy who is a gas fitter for several builders in the GTA and he said the same thing.

#56 Neo on 10.16.19 at 8:55 pm

#51 45north

No. Politicians are trying to suck and blow their way to a soft landing. That’s never worked in the history of mankind.

#57 april on 10.16.19 at 9:11 pm

#3 Elvis… I clicked on your link for Royal Lepage… and up came a window saying my iMac was being scammed… couldn’t get rid of it… had to close out.
Re Royal Lepage article… I wouldn’t trust those people as far as I could throw them.

#58 NoName on 10.16.19 at 9:13 pm

Hely FLOP what say u???

The Tasmanian tiger, a large striped carnivore, is believed to have gone extinct over 80 years ago — but newly released Australian government documents show sightings have been reported as recently as two months ago.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/16/australia/tasmanian-tiger-intl-hnk-scli/index.html

#59 Millennial Realist on 10.16.19 at 9:38 pm

Paleo Boomers become irrelevant in:

6 Days and Counting………..

#60 Ace Goodheart on 10.16.19 at 9:40 pm

What do a socialist and a bookie have in common?

Answer: they’re both in the business of giving false hope to the poor.

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm

Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!

#62 Dr V on 10.16.19 at 9:47 pm

35 Ponzie – my very first thought was which “hockey buddy” owns the timmies? From wiki

“In October 2019, it was reported that Brashear was working at a Tim Hortons restaurant in Québec City owned by Pierre Sévigny.”

Timmies are big in the NHL frat. Former NHLer described them to me as “cash machines”. Can’t remember the last time I got food at one, though I’ll grab an iced cap over the summer. I heard they switched coffee supplier for which people are not happy.

#63 Sail Away on 10.16.19 at 9:58 pm

#59 Millennial Realist on 10.16.19 at 9:38 pm
Paleo Boomers become irrelevant in:

6 Days and Counting………..

———————————

You’re late today MR. I’ll have a pint of lager and a bowl of peanuts, thanks.

#64 Axehead on 10.16.19 at 10:14 pm

Friend has a house in Fort Mac. What is a pre-fab trauler like tiny house on a tiny lot with no garage used to be valued at close to 600k, now will be lucky to fetch half that. Total free fall.

#65 Flop... on 10.16.19 at 10:15 pm

NoName
Hely FLOP what say u???

The Tasmanian tiger, a large striped carnivore, is believed to have gone extinct over 80 years ago — but newly released Australian government documents show sightings have been reported as recently as two months ago.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/16/australia/tasmanian-tiger-intl-hnk-scli/index.html

////////////////////

Hey NoName, I’ve personally never seen a Tasmanian Tiger.

Growing up, a small percentage of people would claim to have seen one while out hiking or hunting.

I do remember some grainy footage been shown on the news of one maybe in the early 80’s

It gets linked with other mythical creatures but it did exist until it supposedly went extinct.

I don’t mind the publicity as it might help convince WULLY to accept my previous offer to open up a trading post in Fort Mac named The Tasmanian Taiga.

I have however come face to face with a Tasmanian Devil.

My wife has to face one every night…

M45BC

M45BC

#66 PastThePeak on 10.16.19 at 10:19 pm

#20 Blacksheep on 10.16.19 at 5:25 pm
Shawn responds to Nomad’s quote @ # 153,
———————————–
Nomad abbreviated:

“In theory, the federal government can create infinite money, and taxes are collected to destroy money, thus combating inflation.”

“The lender keeps some of the interest for their profit, while the portion paid to the central bank is destroyed.”
———————————–
People holding gold, are not going to like reading this….

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Not too worried about what might happen as a potential 2nd order side effect with a completely untested (ludicrous) theory that might as well be called Magic Money Tree.

Any country that embarks upon MMT as monetary policy will see the price of gold (relative to that currency) soar immediately. No need to wait to see if inflation will be contained.

You should ask any of the countries in the last 100 years that thought they could start the printing presses but “control the inflation” how well that went…

#67 NoName on 10.16.19 at 10:33 pm

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm
Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!


ryan tell wifi to loose p and you get another job, one that pays ot, not one that gives you days of in liue. OK

#68 PastThePeak on 10.16.19 at 10:35 pm

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm
Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

No comment on nursing – I don’t think it has ever paid well in Canada. About the engineering though…perhaps do you work for the Feds or other civil service / crown corp? Might explain the difference.

At our telecom company in Kanata the going rate for new grad (electrical / computer) engineers is generally over $70K.

I live in Stittsville (next suburb over) and housing costs aren’t too bad. Here is a nice 4-bdrm on a good sized lot that recently sold (they were asking $648, was on market for about 6 weeks, so believe it went under asking). Not saying anyone buys this as their starter, but gives an idea of the market. Towns under $400K are around.

http://www.orlenecampbell.ca/idx/3501301/Stittsville/19-morningsun-crescent.html#property-info2

#69 Yukon Elvis on 10.16.19 at 10:38 pm

#57 april on 10.16.19 at 9:11 pm
#3 Elvis… I clicked on your link for Royal Lepage… and up came a window saying my iMac was being scammed… couldn’t get rid of it… had to close out.
Re Royal Lepage article… I wouldn’t trust those people as far as I could throw them.
……………….

Sorry to hear that. The link was ok on my Ipad. I don’t trust Royal Lepage either but the poll was done by Leger which has a decent reputation.

#70 Pete on 10.16.19 at 10:41 pm

You talk to any sane person, and they will agree with the reality that RE has started back into outer space trajectory. If you wanted to buy in as a newbie, it’s too late. All this means is at some point, the crash will be catastrophic when it comes. It just might not happen for a very long time though. I have bought several rentals in the past 3 years, and sold a few. There’s still money to be made. I just need to time it well for total cashout. Probably in a year.

#71 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.16.19 at 10:54 pm

@#63 Sail Away
“You’re late today MR. I’ll have a pint of lager and a bowl of peanuts, thanks.”

+++++

ahahahahahahahaha
In 6 Days……
I’m gonna say,”Waiter! Another beer please! Oh and we need more pretzels”

#72 Coastal Zapper on 10.16.19 at 11:19 pm

#29 YVR_LURKER

For me, I have 8 more or so years to work. I plan on selling out and moving either to the Sunshine Coast or the Gulf islands where I can have a much simpler life. What I used to like about YVR has been eroding dramatically over the past decade.

——————————————————————–

Give some thought to your plan on where your going to retire. I sold my property to someone from Gambier Isl. since he had some health scare and wanted to be closer to a hospital. I live in Gibsons (yes, home to the Beachcombers) and we do have a hospital. That said, most people get flown or transferred by ambulance to Vancouver with anything serious. St. Mary’s has been updated but is still known as St. Scarries to many locals. Same with the Gulf Islands, not good enough health care for someone aging. Many who moved here to retire were forced to leave as the local facilities were not able to meet their health needs.

On a more positive note, fishing out front my rented cabin is pretty good right now.

#73 Dumb Wealth on 10.16.19 at 11:19 pm

If you’re compelled to drop $$ at the peak of the housing market at least get the other major financial decisions in your life right

#74 Ustabe on 10.16.19 at 11:20 pm

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm

Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions…

…It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!

Ryan, I am associated with folks who run a group of small, intimate assisted living spaces…we are out in the boonies according to many on this blog (some of whom, I suspect, are not nearly as rich as they might like you to believe) but this smallish company out in the boonies employs 2 NPs and 3 RNs. The Nurse Practitioners are knocking on $100K and the RNs are mid $80s…this plus medical, holidays, human schedules, proper staffing levels.

I have no knowledge about engineers except to say Google tells me that overall billings in BC went up 12% last year and in my town of 13,000 +/- we have three thriving firms. All the big boys are here as well, McElhanney Consulting and SNC-Lav among them.

So I suspect both of you could vastly improve your income by moving out to my boonies at least.

You can still buy a livable home here for $300,000, $450,000 gets you better of course. $2,000 a month rents you a 3B, 2Ba rancher.

#75 [email protected] on 10.16.19 at 11:22 pm

My condolences.

Defintely a Cheshire Cat…

#76 AACI Homedog on 10.16.19 at 11:30 pm

Those aren’t specs are they ? Isn’t that just market data ? What are specs, anyhoo, specifications ?

#77 AACI Homedog on 10.16.19 at 11:36 pm

Sorry, cancel that. Just being a curmudgeon.

#78 Dr V on 10.17.19 at 12:25 am

Ryan 61 you’re about average for Ont. Try Manitoba for $10k more.

https://neuvoo.ca/salary/?job=mechanical+engineer

Looks like wife could do much better

http://neuvoo.ca/salary/?job=Rpn

Keep at it. I think you’re in the sweet spot.

#79 Damifino on 10.17.19 at 12:37 am

#48 Joseph R.

Well, by your question, you are telling everyone on this board that you don’t know the difference between an endorsement from a private person and one done by a government.
———————————-

I know the difference. But what I don’t know is who asked for his two cents? And why does he chose now to speak when the election is days away and dark clouds are swirling around the Liberal campaign?

This has exceedingly suspicious timing. A man of Barack Obama’s supposed integrity should know better than to pipe up just now. Especially after seeing how Russian meddling perverted the electoral process in his own country.

What was his incentive? Just wondering.

#80 DON on 10.17.19 at 1:21 am

#3 Yukon Elvis on 10.16.19 at 4:34 pm

Looks like demand will stay strong, keeping prices high:

One in five homes in Canada are purchased by newcomers to the country, according to a study commissioned by Royal LePage released Wednesday.
The online survey conducted by Leger, which polled 1,500 people who arrived in Canada within the past 10 years, found a majority of respondents (54 per cent) chose to move to Canada because they see the country as a good place to live and work. When asked why they chose Canada over the United States, most respondents said they feel more welcomed as an immigrant in Canada (31 per cent), while others said they believe Canada is a safer place to live (26 per cent).
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/one-fifth-of-homes-in-canada-bought-by-newcomers-royal-lepage-survey-finds-1.1332342
****************

Hmmm ‘royal lepage survey’ no self interest there.

So based on the recent past of immigrants who have bought into a crazy upward market they are determining that more will buy in the future. Today even Bloomberg news had an article on how Housing in Canada has rebounded and is now balanced and seemingly affordable. Next article on how indebted Canadians are compared to the other G20 countries, both consumer and mortgage debt. I think the media has lost the narrative and even the will to go the distance and connect the dots.

#81 DON on 10.17.19 at 2:07 am

#27 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.16.19 at 5:57 pm

@#18 Kits Kid
“Try renting in Vancouver under $3K per month.”
++++

Easy, move to Burnaby and rent for $1500/month
***************

Hard to move away from the trendy Kitsilano scene. Ah the memories.

Then again beer was $5-6 a pint and rent was affordable. But it’s all about the trendy scene until you grow out of it.

#82 DON on 10.17.19 at 2:14 am

#14 Mossy on 10.16.19 at 4:59 pm
These guys are definitely not Asian lol! More than 7 million dollars in assets and they won’t help her ageing mother buy a 500K condo? Some things are more important than money.

*****************

What evidence leads you to believe that helping his mother-in-law stopped right there at that point in time. Perhaps they did something else for his wife’s mother. They looked into the whole idea in the first place, and that says something…no wonder he wanted to remain anonymous.

#83 Midnights on 10.17.19 at 3:34 am

Bank of America declares ‘the end of the 60-40’ standard portfolio

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/bank-of-america-declares-the-end-of-the-60-40-standard-portfolio-2019-10-15

#84 The Real Mark on 10.17.19 at 3:44 am

So even at the latest sales price, the “market” gave the owners $300k+ in equity. Without doing anything other than living in the house, and perhaps contributing a small chunk of the imputed rent towards a new roof or something like that.

Sounds awfully generous to me. Boomers who participated in RE (or any sort of interest rate sensitive assets) have made out like bandits.

The gold miners, over the same interval, were absolutely and utterly decimated.

Is this indefinitely sustainable? Of course not. Everyone knows that no one asset class can perpetually have its day in the sun (or remain perpetually in depression).

A lot of Canadians that hitched their fortunes to RE are going to be awfully disappointed in years to come. But there might actually be some brightness for others who have been invested, whether financially, or in their careers, with exposure to sectors that have been disadvantaged by the past 40 years of falling long-term interest rates.

#85 NoName on 10.17.19 at 6:51 am

I’ll just leave a link to it, and level it there…

https://detroit.cbslocal.com/2019/10/16/rage-yoga-releases-negative-energy-with-alcohol-profanity-and-obscene-gestures/

#86 Another Deckchair on 10.17.19 at 6:52 am

@61 Ryan;

Living in Ottawa, I have no idea how younger people do it. But, you are doing it.

There’s a wreck of a house near me that had a hoarder in it and no maintenance for decades, $530,000. It’s on a 50×100 foot lot, it’ll get torn down, and a 2 mil boxy glass house built on the lot.

If you want a house, you’ll have to scout out an older rundown area and purchase there. That’s what I did, not planned, but it worked out. The trick is finding an area that is still under-priced.

Good luck!

#87 Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 6:55 am

Article today in The Star about a TTC driver who amassed 15 Million in assets through real estate.

Sure you can call it birth lottery, but credit to this guy for making moves and outsmarting most.

Link:

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2019/10/17/how-a-ttc-driver-quietly-bought-up-a-corner-of-the-city.html

#88 B on 10.17.19 at 7:29 am

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm
Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Ryan dude companies are killing themselves to hire these days for Mechanical Engineering. Check the PEOs salary survey, then take it to your boss and tell him you’re getting hosed. Start looking for new jobs ASAP, don’t be a fraidycat chump. Get on it and pound the pavement, 80K is no problem for you.

If you’re wife is an RPN, then tell her to get moving and get her RN then she’ll be pulling in 80k too plus OT.

Stop bitching about house prices and start working SMARTER. Know your worth and don’t take no for an answer. Good luck.

#89 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.17.19 at 8:02 am

@#41 John in Mtl
“Don’t worry, there will be NO such law in Quebec. It has already been decided that, 1 – it is a very very ridiculous proposition and 2 – it cannot possibly be enforced.”
+++++

I used to work for an international company with its Canadian headquarters in Quebec.
ALL the internal memos from Europe arrived in English to the Montreal HQ. They were then translated and re-issued, French first , then English to the rest of Canada.
I asked about this and was told.
The Quebec Language Laws state, “Any bilingual notices sent out by a Quebec company MUST be sent out French first, English second.
So, you would have 200 people in Quebec’s HQ satisfying the language Laws while 8000 people in the RoC wasting time scrolling past the french version….
Now multiply that by all email announcements from an HQ executive and you begin to realize why the international company HQ eventually moved the Canuck HQ out of Quebec.
Tired of the Language Nazi’s I suppose…..

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/from-hashtag-to-grilled-cheese-quebec-language-police-ok-some-english-words-1.3596547

#90 MF on 10.17.19 at 8:11 am

Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 6

“Outsmarting”?

No.

Getting lucky through Artificial Low interest rates kept artificially low way longer than needed yes.

If rates were where they are “supposed” to be, you know, I know, and everyone else knows real estate would be half of what it is. If not less.

Outsmarted… sure.

MF

#91 jess on 10.17.19 at 8:20 am

Peter Navarro -Trump’s top China adviser appears to have made up expert he regularly quoted

quoted a China hawk named “Ron Vara” to prove his point on the threat posed by Beijing to the American economy.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/16/politics/peter-navarro-ron-vara-trump-china-intl-hnk/index.html

#92 Tater on 10.17.19 at 8:23 am

LOL at all the boomers taunting the mills. Guess what boomers, those mills are the consumers that power those precious stocks you own, they’re the future tax payers to keep your gravy flowing, they’re the buyer of your home.

And those mills are soaked in debt, both public and private, to try to have a decent life. The boomers have profited handsomely from demographics. But, those demographics will now start working against them.

#93 Re .post 4 by Lro on 10.17.19 at 8:41 am

Actually , he did a good job of providing numbers . In addition, he stated that his home in Toronto is a fraction of his net worth. He likely values his house,location etc etc

In my experience people who calls others ‘dumb’ usually have issues of their own . Stay well

#94 Dharma Bum on 10.17.19 at 9:13 am

And that about sums it up. (a) If you won the birth lottery and got into real estate ownership a few decades ago, be thankful. (b) If you managed to buy property on the cheap before mortgage rates crashed and the hormones erupted, fall to your knees in gratitude. – Garth
——————————————————————–

Another scenario in which one can thank their lucky stars is being highly educated in a well paid profession and finding work in their field of expertise in a place other than Toronto or Vancouver. That’s called having your cake and eating it too.

Making big bucks, relatively reasonable house prices ( I mean, like a quarter or a third of Toronto prices – for really nice places).

Those folks are the lucky ones (well, they worked hard to get where they are, but they had to have been born with the smarts in the first place and had to have financial assistance from their folks so as not to be saddled with massive loans to pay back. Professional schools are expensive as all get out).

Bob’s your uncle, eh?

#95 milly on 10.17.19 at 9:39 am

#61 Ryan on 10.16.19 at 9:44 pm
Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Ryan, as a fellow engineer I agree, money can be low in a lot of places (it’s shocking really.. should have been an accountant) But I agree with other posters. Get OSPE’s salary survey and start negotiating or look elsewhere. 61K in your mid 30s is way too low.

#96 Sail Away on 10.17.19 at 9:44 am

#92 Tater on 10.17.19 at 8:23 am

LOL at all the boomers taunting the mills

——————————–

I’d say the taunting is even on both sides, although the mills should have more respect for their elders.

#97 squished18 on 10.17.19 at 9:45 am

Thought I’d check out house prices in Winnipeg and Fredricton. Is it just me or are people just dreaming with their prices their too?

#98 Leo Trollstoy on 10.17.19 at 9:47 am

Transparent humble brag shows weak poster emailed Garth about the follies of owning RE just to talk about their own real estate – a giant expense generating liability that takes up half their assets lol

What a tool

#99 IHCTD9 on 10.17.19 at 10:14 am

#88 B on 10.17.19 at 7:29 am

Ryan dude companies are killing themselves to hire these days for Mechanical Engineering.
___

They are?

Mech. Eng’s are a dime a dozen in Ontario. Many immigrants have this degree. When one quits, a new butt is warming the seat in 24-48 hours. The province seems to be absolutely loaded with them, half the purchasing folks I deal with have have some kind of mech eng degree.

About 15 years ago I worked with a couple Chinese dudes who were driving out of the GTA 2 hours each way for 45K/yr – how much worse was the pay in the GTA? Obviously quite a bit worse unless these guys just love driving their cars.

Mech Eng sucks – it went down starting in the late 90’s (as the www got better and CAD took over) and is now a low pay position that has to compete with foreign/domestic Indian and Chinese companies who pay their guys 2.00/day. No one I worked with that did ME is still doing it unless they have started their own business.

#100 Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 10:57 am

#90 MF on 10.17.19 at 8:11 am
Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 6

“Outsmarting”?

No.

Getting lucky through Artificial Low interest rates kept artificially low way longer than needed yes.

If rates were where they are “supposed” to be, you know, I know, and everyone else knows real estate would be half of what it is. If not less.

Outsmarted… sure.

MF

————————————————————–

Someone is jealous!

Also, I believe Mr. Gomes bought through the 60s, 70s 80s, etc… When rates were not low to say the least. Further, he “survived” the great housing crash of the late 80s.

Just be happy for the guy and stop hatin’

#101 oh bouy on 10.17.19 at 11:20 am

@#100 Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 10:57 am
#90 MF on 10.17.19 at 8:11 am
Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 6

“Outsmarting”?

No.

Getting lucky through Artificial Low interest rates kept artificially low way longer than needed yes.

If rates were where they are “supposed” to be, you know, I know, and everyone else knows real estate would be half of what it is. If not less.

Outsmarted… sure.

MF

————————————————————–

Someone is jealous!

Also, I believe Mr. Gomes bought through the 60s, 70s 80s, etc… When rates were not low to say the least. Further, he “survived” the great housing crash of the late 80s.

Just be happy for the guy and stop hatin’
______________________________

I’d be a little jaded to if i missed that boat

#102 oh bouy on 10.17.19 at 11:21 am

@#96 Sail Away on 10.17.19 at 9:44 am
#92 Tater on 10.17.19 at 8:23 am

LOL at all the boomers taunting the mills

——————————–

I’d say the taunting is even on both sides, although the mills should have more respect for their elders.
_________________________________________

petulant children VS belligerent curmudgeons

#103 Steven Rowlandson on 10.17.19 at 12:21 pm

Since employers won’t be giving out triple digit raises anytime soon it is extremely doubtful that this real estate market in Canada has any chance in hell of remaining at its stratospheric heights. A nickel on the dollar is the most the working class can afford and that is reality.

#104 IHCTD9 on 10.17.19 at 1:22 pm

When you read all these stories about Mils having trouble, it’s not too long before the actual issue rears its ugly head: They live in some big city where wages are nothing special but where houses/condo prices have gone bonkers.

Ryan and squeeze could make near the same in a smaller 50K pop. centre. Should be 90-100K combined.

We’ve gone from ~73K combined to 125-130/yr depending on hours worked in small town positions since marriage. They’re good jobs, both with benefits, and wife has a DB pension too (yes, a govy job).

I could buy my current house right now for 350-400K, it was paid off years ago, we have a decent nest egg on the go built over 2+ decades. Between 2016-2018 we shelled out almost 100K on toys, vehicles, braces, and tuition. We STILL had room to give quite a bit every year, and have shelled out 5 figures in tuition annually since 2006 on top. All done (outside the mortgage) with cash, savings and a plan. The point being we had the cash flow to make it happen.

We bought our house at 29/30 years old, our ability to spend without taking on debt is 90% due to decent incomes earned where low mortgage payments are made. The exact opposite of places like YVR and the GTA.

I know I’m beating a dead horse here – but at some point we’re going to have to acknowledge that if folks will not leave a metropolis to avoid financial destruction, then the RE located therein is in fact NOT over priced, and they should probably stop complaining about how expensive it is.

IMHO, Ryan and squeeze have the foundation to win – but not in Ottawa. The clock is ticking though…

#105 The Wet One on 10.17.19 at 1:30 pm

Lordy.

I read all the comments here from top to bottom for once.

My god.

What a mistake that was!!!

MY EYES!!! MY EYES!!!

I NEED TO BLEACH MY BRAIN NOW!!!!!

Yikes!

#106 IHCTD9 on 10.17.19 at 1:38 pm

#101 oh bouy on 10.17.19 at 11:20 am
@#100 Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 10:57 am
#90 MF on 10.17.19 at 8:11 am
Captain Uppa on 10.17.19 at 6

“Outsmarting”?

No.

————————————————————–

Someone is jealous!
___

I’d be a little jaded to if i missed that boat
___

I feel bad for the guy actually – he’s dead.

Looks like he never cashed out either.

#107 Tony on 10.17.19 at 1:49 pm

In Edmonton Alberta all the resale apartments (except the one bedroom ones) and all the resale townhouses today sell for 50 percent or less than than what they sold for way back in October 2007 non-inflation adjusted. Check any sale from 2007 with any sale in 2019 on the exact same unit in Edmonton.

#108 Tony on 10.17.19 at 1:57 pm

In Alberta real estate fees are 7 percent on the first $100,000 so anything that sells at $100,000 or less is subject to the full 7 percent. No haggling on fees on today’s market or you won’t even get a listing.

#109 Joseph R. on 10.17.19 at 3:55 pm

Damifino on 10.17.19 at 12:37 am
#48 Joseph R.

Well, by your question, you are telling everyone on this board that you don’t know the difference between an endorsement from a private person and one done by a government.
———————————-

I know the difference. But what I don’t know is who asked for his two cents? And why does he chose now to speak when the election is days away and dark clouds are swirling around the Liberal campaign?

This has exceedingly suspicious timing. A man of Barack Obama’s supposed integrity should know better than to pipe up just now. Especially after seeing how Russian meddling perverted the electoral process in his own country.

What was his incentive? Just wondering.

————————————————————-

Do you believe he is part of a conspiracy?

#110 JonBoy on 10.17.19 at 6:00 pm

#61 Ryan
Wow, the wealth on this blog amazes me. My wife and I, she’s an RPN, works herself hard everyday brings home about 45k a year, myself a P.Eng mechanical engineer around 65k. Mid 30s, no pensions. After taxes, transit passes $250, rent $1,900 and our landlord wants to raise to $2,100. Groceries, and saving 20% a dog and his bills, working 50 hrs plus a week. It’s tough. It’s so expensive in Ottawa home ownership is out of the question. We just hope we are not priced out of rental market. We have our health and will need it. My advice don’t waste your time studying Engineering or Nursing!!!

—–

If you’re only making $65K as an engineer after 10 years out of university, something is wrong. I was making that within two years of graduating. Heck, I’m paying a co-op student $42K a year (effectively) and drafters with a few years of good experience are starting at $60K. Most of the drafters on my team are making more than you so you’re either under-valuing your services or you’re not standing out from the crowd at all.

Get a new employer or get some training to make you stand out a bit and able to do specialized work. You’re significantly underpaid if you have 10 years of experience (give or take)!

#111 eugene on 10.17.19 at 6:19 pm

Where do i get this calculator to check the cost between owning and renting?

#112 Doug Ford in Hiding on 10.17.19 at 6:52 pm

Nope, that’s not me hiding behind that curtain :)

#113 Another Deckchair on 10.18.19 at 8:02 am

It’ll be interesting to see how JWR and Philpott do.

Will it be “morals beats the beast”, or “steamrolled by the monster”?

I hope the former, but expect the latter. :-|