What it does

Toronto condo sales have dropped, listings have increased but prices haven’t declined. Just the opposite. The average high-rise concrete box now costs about $570,000 and comes with condo fees, property taxes, utility and insurance overhead, no dirt and little privacy.

At the same time RBC is telling us Mills have flooded into Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver – almost a hundred thousand of the bearded, tattooed creatures in just one year. In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world.

So why would sales be down for the only affordable type of real estate left?

Price, of course. The stress test reduced credit, kicked a lot of buyers out of the market, made the purchase of a detached house an impossibility and increased demand for condo units. So, fewer buyers means fewer sales but those in the market are competing. Until inventory surges much higher, values will likely hold.

There’s little question that a whole generation of moister-buyers in places like the GTA and YVR are being slaughtered by price. Zoocasa said this week only the top 10% of income-earners can afford to buy a house there. In Vancouver 97.5% of people are too poor. And yet folks still strive to do so, taking on Herculean debt loads and giving scant thought to the consequences. Society continues to be victimized by our own cultural bias against the most logical, rational, prudent path for young couples, which is to rent.

Now, for more insight into the Millennial angst consuming the country’s largest cohort, here’s Lindy:

I just started reading your blog, and my most important question is – where do you go to start getting a better understanding of finances if you have no background in it, and no people in your network who understand it?

I’m 34 and my Husband is 36. We live in Vancouver, and all of our family and friends are located here as well so we feel strongly about staying here. About two years we inherited some money from a death in the family. We thought we wanted to buy a place and so we put our inheritance of about $250,000 in a term deposit so we could access it easily if we needed to. As housing prices are starting to go down in Van we’ve been waiting. In the meantime we live with my parents where we don’t pay rent. This has allowed for me to go back to school and for us to do two rounds of in vitro fertilization. We hope to have children in the next year or two and I have about two years of school left. This means we’ll likely rely on just my husband’s income for years – about $80,000 after bonus and we both don’t expect to have access to pension plans in our future careers. We have $35,000 in our RRSPs and $5000 in a TFSA both of which are invested in index funds.

We want to move out from my parent’s house so that my brother can move in but if we rent it would be about $2000-$2500 a month. If we buy, we can get a 2 bedroom condo in the (closer) burbs with about a $300-350,000 mortgage plus our savings. Do you think buying is the right path to take given that we don’t expect pensions (beyond CPP and OAS)? Are we totally screwing up? We don’t have financial knowledge and we also don’t know who to consult, do you have advice here? Where do people go when they don’t know anything?

Lindy & squeeze are considering buying a condo outside YVR for about $600,000, consuming all their savings plus inheritance and increasing debt from zero to $350,000. Why would they do such a thing after being gifted more money than they can save in an entire adulthood? Why, when they’re engineering a family, expect no pensions and face living on a meagre income consumed by mortgage payments, strata fees and Huggies?

The condo cost will be $1,700 for the mortgage, at least $600 for fees and taxes plus the loss of $250,000 which could be invested. Far more, in other words, than renting the same unit. Meanwhile the inheritance, if invested wisely should sit around $2 million at age 65, throwing off enough income for them to retire comfortably.

This is what real estate does. It addles the brain. Muddles decisions. Leads stray. How can these moisters seriously consider squandering a great gift and a head start on something they can have without debt and for less expense? Why would they sacrifice and risk so much to own an apartment their family will likely outgrow? If children materialize, should they not come first? And why are 35-year-olds living with their parents? Did real estate prices do that? Or our shifting cultural norms?

But Lindy’s main question was where to gain financial knowledge when those about you have none?

Well, you’re here. It’s a start.

Some advice: move out. Rent. Live within your means. Save. Get some help, invest the money and forget about it. Forever. Ignore anyone telling you to buy a condo. Stay out of debt. And did I mention moving out? You don’t want family pressure. Or strata fees. You need freedom, independence and space. Soon, trust me, you’ll see through a new lens.

And, for the love of God, ignore the comment section.

104 comments ↓

#1 NoName on 04.26.19 at 4:33 pm

And, for the love of God, ignore the comment section. – GT

Comment section 2nd most important part of this blog!

#2 The Real Mark on 04.26.19 at 4:40 pm

And listen to my hero, Ross Kay.

#3 Mike on 04.26.19 at 4:46 pm

.
Lindy

BUY now or miss forever.

Those who didnt buy missed it by big in last 5 years, and future is same.

Worst case we will elect a Kristy Clark and government will bail everyone out. They will……B20 is already on way out.

#4 Numpty Dumpty on 04.26.19 at 4:49 pm

Good advice on here. Been reading it since dec 2009, when my realtor told me about it!
He’s a good guy, steered me into thinking about renting instead of buying a bigger place.
So I invested and rented and am happy.

#5 GreaterFool on 04.26.19 at 4:50 pm

Don’t ignore the comment section, we complain about real estate and help each other to continue renting a basement suite and investing.
When this market crashes we will all buy a house and retire the next day! :)

#6 TalkingPie on 04.26.19 at 4:54 pm

I guess I’m a little different. If I were living in my parents’ house rent-free in my mid-thirties and foresaw a scarcity of family income, I don’t think I’d take that as a cue to spend tens of thousands of dollars trying to reproduce, and presumably a similar sum to go back to school.

If having kids is such a priority that you’d go through the trouble of in vitro, wouldn’t you want to prepare for them as best as you can? How does spending money on school when you plan on not working achieve that? Why would you go through such a concerted effort to add mouths to feed, when unsure as to how you’ll feed them?

#7 NotLegalAdvice on 04.26.19 at 4:57 pm

Some advice: move out. Rent. Live within your means. Save. Get some help, invest the money and forget about it. Forever. Ignore anyone telling you to buy a condo. Stay out of debt. And did I mention moving out? You don’t want family pressure. Or strata fees. You need freedom, independence and space. Soon, trust me, you’ll see through a new lens. – GT

You mean give up a RENT FREE place. That’s money that could be invested into their TFSA’s! Why would they want to give that up, if it were working?? This brother seems to have ruined their plans to live rent free.

#8 Brian Ripley on 04.26.19 at 4:57 pm

In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world. Garth

Toronto (and Ontario) remains attractive for the not employed, chart:
http://www.chpc.biz/earnings-employment.html#Rate

Toronto residential sales are signaling that FOMO is over, chart: http://www.chpc.biz/toronto-housing.html

There is no rush anymore, there is lots of housing for sale if you have the income, if not, renting is the alternative

#9 Randy Marsh on 04.26.19 at 4:58 pm

In Canada you should be able to do anything, especially when you’re standing up for yourself. That means it’s totally fine to go to your son’s Little League baseball game belligerently drunk, pick a fight with another parent, and end up bloodied and in your underwear. Unfortunately, the authoritarian police sometimes take issue with this.

#10 Smoking Man on 04.26.19 at 5:00 pm

Markets at all time highs.

Trumponomics.

#11 Dave on 04.26.19 at 5:04 pm

Stay with your parents rent free as long as possible. This gift will never come again, Maximize it.

#12 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.26.19 at 5:05 pm

Lindy.
You know the market is falling.
Your soon to be botrrn kids wont care where they live or if you rent until there are in their teens.
Invest and save.
No mortgage debt.
No stress.
If hubby loses his job.
You have a minimun of 250,000 reasons not to freak out.
Watch the investments go up over the long term.
Chill.
Renting isnt a sin.

#13 Stan Brooks on 04.26.19 at 5:10 pm

the most logical, rational, prudent path for young couples, which is to rent

In a country like Canada all it takes is proper planning and good infrastructure.

Build satellite cities with good train system, improve the density and you can have very cheap affordable living with brick houses around 350 k, condo apartments with little maintenance/European style at 200 k.

The logical thing for every young couple is to own a cheap house/apartment and focus on being productive and enjoy life which is very much achievable and affordable.

But then that requires decent politicians, the banks and oligopolies would be worth less and the the gentlemen at the Empire club would be 50 % poorer.

Canada/the elite has made its choice and that is to become a cheap labour camp with no living condition for the sheeple. So the capable have moved out.

For the rest there is the requiem in D minor from Mozart:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPlhKP0nZII

and the funeral march from Chopin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kyFyAqLtHq8

#14 Asterix1 on 04.26.19 at 5:10 pm

Condo prices in the city are still going up, but barely, nothing to write home about. Party is over, some people are still dancing, but the music stopped.

Average price: City of Toronto
April 2017 @ 578K, March 2019 @ 604K

Prices went up for a total of 4.5% in 2 years, not great!

Price gains year over year on condos have plunged south for a while. Less sales, less overseas money, less local “investors”, less money to borrow from banks and stagnant wages

And on top of that, historical peak pricing on those cheaply build units.

#15 not 1st on 04.26.19 at 5:14 pm

This thing about having kids is just another divisive identity politics play painting people who have kids as evil and those who don’t as virtuous.

The only way people will care about this planet and fight for the future is if they have a stake in it. If you are just going to live, consume and die, then what do you care about anything. Just like how people don’t care about the legacy debt this govt has saddled our young people with.

Maybe a couple of little faces staring back at you every night might be the needed kick in the head for some to see how utterly destructive of a path we have been set on by this govt.

#16 FreeBird on 04.26.19 at 5:14 pm

Lidy, if you and DH are reading comments anyway (you prob are) here’s my tips KISS (keep it simple…) and don’t over complicate. Not just with money but life. The later will do that enough on its own as you get older ; )
Second, use this like a book. Just search key words/subjects using field in upper right and or internet. Many past posts have key/practical info on investing, money mgmt for couples even cost of dog food (expensive). Good luck with IVF. It’s a tough process mind and body but worth it for you guys I’m sure. Oh and rent (feel free to eye roll).

#17 Pete on 04.26.19 at 5:17 pm

Too many are waiting for the housing market to crash. That ain’t gonna happen as long as we have unemployment at record lows and markets at record highs. And as long as mil’s flock to the city for those record jobs, RE will stay where it is (price wise) due to rental, sale, or otherwise. RE prices will drop when people don’t have jobs and/or can’t service debts due to cost of borrowing. Everything is still in balance – although barely.

#18 FreeBird on 04.26.19 at 5:19 pm

#12 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.26.19
———————-
This too 100%. Wish I’d been told the same when much younger. Oh wait…

#19 Chris on 04.26.19 at 5:33 pm

Go Child free. Kids are expensive. College tuitions alone will be over $300K in 20 years. Add in day care, toys, hockey, soccer, after school programs etc you are conservatively spending over $3-5 million raising kids. And delaying your retirement by 15-20 years.

#20 Stan Brooks on 04.26.19 at 5:33 pm

#15 not 1st on 04.26.19 at 5:14 pm

Having kids is a personal choice.

When the elite/the owners need cheap labour, they promote that through policies. Now they don’t need us or our kids, they can import cheap labour and soon most of the jobs will be automated/many are already outsourced.

So now the message is clear: Don’t have kids, we/the elite/ don’t need them.

So they introduce the corresponding policies and voila, it is done.

The average sheeple is inconsequential in the big scheme of things, just a noise in the life of the elites.

#21 Is there a style guide? on 04.26.19 at 5:34 pm

Sometimes I post stuff. Not racist, insightful, links to relevant data. Never shows up, nothing. No ‘DELETED’, no nothing. If I try to repost, it is recognized as a duplicate.

So?

Also, there’s this Eks Di Ciple (sp?) guy who’s comments shows up in an alternate colour, as the blog seems to recognize him (her?) as a mod, not just a regular dude. Bug? Wife? Alter ego?

#22 Christina on 04.26.19 at 5:37 pm

Bwahahahaha! at this line: “…almost a hundred thousand of the bearded, tattooed creatures in just one year.”

I almost laugh-snorted my latte out my nose. Which makes things terribly awkward, of course.

#23 Ho(m/p)eless on 04.26.19 at 5:40 pm

Invest your inheritance through Garth, you won’t be disappointed. They have a great team! And yes, live within your means, as hard as that is in Vancouver.

#24 Sail away on 04.26.19 at 5:41 pm

Forget the in vitro and keep practicing the old-fashioned way. Invest the freed cash wisely.

#25 Linda on 04.26.19 at 5:47 pm

Lifestyles come in cycles. It used to be normal for families to continue living together even when the children had reached adulthood. Of course, there was an expectation that any funds earned by the grown up children contributed to the household expenses AND ‘the kids’ were also expected to do their share of the household chores. This wasn’t just a cultural thing. Families who lived together were able to pool resources & improve their overall standard of living because it cost so much to do it ‘on their own’.

Renting has its issues. Availability, affordability, cleanliness, location, lease conditions – no parties, no pets, no children, no smoking etc. Purchasing appeals because it represents independence, success & the ability to live your life your way. It isn’t a question of ‘shame’ when it comes to renting – its a question of having the choice to have a pet, or a party, or paint your walls hot pink with lime green polkadots if that is what you want to look at when you walk through the door. That is the reason why buying is an ‘addiction’. Human nature – people want what they can’t have & will go to extraordinary lengths to get their drug of choice – even when they know it is financial suicide.

#26 Bezengy on 04.26.19 at 5:50 pm

Why wouldn’t the kids move to Toronto? Government just promised 1300 million to repair subsidized housing. There are plenty of doctors with every subsidized service available at your disposal. Subsidized Subway paid for with the sale of Ontario Hydro, get a Presto card and you can actually ride both ways and pay one fee, what a deal! Property taxes are 75% less than northern towns. They even call in the military if it snows more than four inches. I want to move there too….not.

Before the last election I remember the mayors from Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal, and Calgary sitting down and carefully explaining to the federal candidates that if they wanted their millions of votes, they wanted to see the money, basic extortion in my opinion. I felt sorry for them, not exactly visionaries. Now we even have a premier obsessed with city politics, what’s up with that?

My point is why are we subsidizing people to live in the most expensive real estate in the country? It doesn’t make sense to me.

#27 Captain Uppa on 04.26.19 at 5:56 pm

>>And, for the love of God, ignore the comment section.>>

And here I thought we were friends.

#28 Captain Uppa on 04.26.19 at 6:00 pm

Garth, to answer your undying question about why people, especially monsters, love to own real estate, it’s because people want to live now.

It doesn’t mean renting is not living, but most envision a certain life for themselves where their home is theirs…they can change it, they can grow old in it and it holds a family’s memories. All that and the best forced savings program known to man.

No one is thinking about having 2 million liquid at 65, they just aren’t.

This will not change.

Nobody will live their lives then grow old in a condo. This is a bad choice. – Garth

#29 VanMan on 04.26.19 at 6:10 pm

I’m confused. For a long while, there was talk that once the flood of condos under construction in the big 3 hit the market (many have), there will be a reckoning for all of the speckers and others that have their hands full of units.

Now the message is that there isn’t enough supply?

What gives? I understand the masses of mill’s heading to the city… but many of us have been saying this all along – thus refuting the argument that once the deluge of units under cons’t hit the market a reckoning would occur. This seems like cherry picking to me…

A supply gush remains in the pipeline. Good luck with the confusion. – Garth

#30 just a dude on 04.26.19 at 6:27 pm

Garth, I swear sometimes you make up some of these posts or, I’m completely disconnected from some of my fellow Canadians. This one really had my head shaking.

Mid 30’s and still living with the parents? Fixated on buying a box in the sky when rent makes so much more financial sense? Wondering about finances when so much great information is available on the internet (with your site being the best source imho, and all for free – you are a good man, Sir).

I’m trying hard not to judge but regardless, good on you, Garth, for repeating the great advice you’ve shared for years all while not ripping these people to shreds. I sincerely hope they will heed your advice but somehow, I doubt they will. That nesting instinct is powerful and messes with one’s ability to reason.

#31 MF on 04.26.19 at 6:30 pm

My age (36) and living at home?

Pfft.

MF

#32 Dolce Vita on 04.26.19 at 6:36 pm

#22 Christina

Bwahahahaha! at this line: “…almost a hundred thousand of the bearded, tattooed creatures in just one year.”

————————————————–

Ditto (caffè lungo for me). Garth I think those “CREATURES” are called HIPSTERS. Just Google Image’d it…yup, that’s what they’re called.

One thing is for certain, they’re going to REGRET those tats. Yesiree. At a certain age your skin sags, I mean, IT SAGS (not just wrinkles).

SAG as in Scream’s: Ghostface.

Or like in Edvard Munch’s painting: The Scream.

= TAT SAG.

Enjoy doofus Millennials.

Note I resisted the above meme for what happens to women with tats up front when they get old, ’cause it’s about the tats and not the…

————————————————–

Yes Garth I hear you, time for Buonanotte e Ciao d’Italia.

#33 AGuyInVancouver on 04.26.19 at 6:39 pm

And why are Vancouver price so high? A very good lesson on how money laundering can move the distort the price of real estate. Should be required reading for some here:

https://betterdwelling.com/how-a-little-money-laundering-can-have-a-big-impact-on-real-estate-prices/

#34 MF on 04.26.19 at 6:43 pm

#29 VanMan on 04.26.19 at 6:10 pm

“What gives? I understand the masses of mill’s heading to the city… but many of us have been saying this all along ”

-The stress test herded all potential buyers downward into the arms of condos, which then rose in price. This is in addition to accelerating urbanization, seniors who are downsizing, the increasing preference of living alone, more and more people on the sidelines, unaffordable rents etc.

Even with the so called glut don’t expect condos to drop in price any time soon. If you enjoy condo living, and can afford it, then buy.

MF

#35 EastVanForever on 04.26.19 at 6:46 pm

My kid and their spouse are the same ages as Lindy. They bought 2 years ago in Surrey for 800k after looking for 10 months and being continually outbid by FMO ers. Down payment of $200 k. Combined income of about $200 k/year, and generous benefits. Now have a 2 year old and daycare is tres expensive. They are frugal, max out TFSA’s and RRSP’s but taxes, cars, groceries, and home repairs do not leave a lot left over for saving. That $250k Liddy inherited will not go far in real estate. They should calculate all the expenses of what life and home ownership will cost them and try to put that much aside monthly for the next three months to get a feel for how life with a mortgage will be.

#36 Ronaldo on 04.26.19 at 6:49 pm

XIU up 20.7% since Xmas Eve. What a gift that was. Probably time to take some off the table.

#37 Dolce Vita on 04.26.19 at 6:51 pm

#32 AGuyInVancouver

MY HEART BE STILL.

No rebuttal Garth?

You let AGuyInVancouver get away with that little zinger about which Asian nation is responsible for all the high priced homes in YVR?

Come on, where’s that “walkin’ on water spirit” gone to, as in the Unsinkable Garth?

Detente Day.

#38 Dolce Vita on 04.26.19 at 6:56 pm

#36 Ronaldo

Your only saying that after shitting your pants at about 10 AM, like the rest of us with an indexed ETF.

#39 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.26.19 at 7:05 pm

This is a good reason to handcuff yourself with multi year mortgage…..

https://www.vancourier.com/real-estate/have-your-condo-and-eat-avocado-toast-too-1.23803781

#40 will on 04.26.19 at 7:10 pm

Lindy, take the Canadian Securities Course. I think it’s around a thousand dollars now. Or check out your local library, there might be a copy of it there.

#41 Asterix1 on 04.26.19 at 7:11 pm

#28 Captain Uppa
« best forced savings program known to man »
——————————————————————————-

Every time I hear that, I have to laugh!

The best savings « program » is the one where you place money and someone pays you interest. Not the other way around!

#42 WDL on 04.26.19 at 7:14 pm

I don’t disagree with Garth about renting at the moment. However, Garth is a real estate perma-bear who has likely owned numerous properties in his life. I guess everyone should rent except Garth. Regarding living in your parents home, it all depends. We OWN a house, and our daughter and son in law (and two grand children) live in our basement apartment with 4 bedrooms, a kitchen and bathroom. They have their own entrance. Why should they move? We rent to them for $900 a month (all utilities included). Garth says ignore the comment section because, as we all know (especially Garth), Garth is ALWAYS RIGHT! LOL

I have oft said to buy a home if you need it and can afford to do so without jeopardizing your financial future or that of your family. As for adult children living in your basement, they rent, no? – Garth

#43 IHCTD9 on 04.26.19 at 7:18 pm

Mid thirties and handed a 250k tax free gift? Lindy and hubs don’t understand the gravity of their good fortune.

A giant slice of the Canadian public CAN NOT, WILL NOT EVER get this kind of coin together by 34/36. You two can retire with a great income if you play your cards right. DON’T BLOW IT! Do what Garth says and invest it. Then forget you ever had it.

You won’t appreciate this move for another 10 years or so, but you will be uber glad to have made it when you get there. Even more come 55, and downright elated by 65.

See a Pro, get that cash invested and out of sight quick, then carry on as you were.

#44 Sierts on 04.26.19 at 7:19 pm

To the pic:

Looks like Tiria Lannister and The Hound.

#45 yvr_lurker on 04.26.19 at 7:25 pm

First of all, I do not believe for a minute the report about masses of millenials flocking to YVR and GTA. Hyped up by people with a vested interest in claiming so. However, what is clear to me is that YVR and GTA are the landing spots for most of the (so many) immigrants Canada takes in and this causes much pressure on renting and prices in our two large cities. My advice is to get the hell out of YVR. Move to Edmonton, Ottawa, Halifax, etc.. where locals with an average salary can still have a decent life. It will be super-frustrating to be long-term renter in YVR, raising a kid, being booted out of your digs every few years or so for bogus renovictions etc… having to change schools, and competing with the masses of newcomers for digs. The long-term trend is for YVR to more closely resemble Hong Kong, with towers and towers of apartments, people squeezed into tiny places and paying mega $$ for the privillige of this. If I was not fortunate to enter the market 20 years ago in YVR there is no way I would try to scratch out a living here now.

Poor governance for 15 years by the BC liberals with no controls exacerbated this mess. Now the idiot Wilkinson wants controls on gas prices (but not a peep from him when he was in power about money laundering and rampant housing speculation by foreigners). As he said in an interview “Renting was just a whacky time…” Get lost and go give your dumb-ass speeches at formal dinners with the your yacht club buddies. Leave the rest of us alone.

#46 Ustabe on 04.26.19 at 7:29 pm

#21 Is there a style guide? on 04.26.19 at 5:34 pm

Sometimes I post stuff. Not racist, insightful, links to relevant data. Never shows up, nothing. No ‘DELETED’, no nothing. If I try to repost, it is recognized as a duplicate.
So?
Also, there’s this Eks Di Ciple (sp?) guy who’s comments shows up in an alternate colour, as the blog seems to recognize him (her?) as a mod, not just a regular dude. Bug? Wife? Alter ego?

Well, this post showed up.
Simple isn’t a mod, he just knows a little JavaScript, css and html.
Here is the code:

#page {
background: none repeat scroll 0 0 #FFFFFF;
border: 1px solid #BBBBBB;

Stop being paranoid.

#47 Basil Farty on 04.26.19 at 7:38 pm

Smoking Man on 04.26.19 at 5:00 pm

“Markets at all time highs.

Trumponomics.”

More like Printonomics.

#48 Ye of little faith on 04.26.19 at 7:41 pm

#34 MF on 04.26.19 at 6:43 pm
#29 VanMan on 04.26.19 at 6:10 pm

“What gives? I understand the masses of mill’s heading to the city… but many of us have been saying this all along ”

-The stress test herded all potential buyers downward into the arms of condos, which then rose in price. This is in addition to accelerating urbanization, seniors who are downsizing, the increasing preference of living alone, more and more people on the sidelines, unaffordable rents etc.

Even with the so called glut don’t expect condos to drop in price any time soon. If you enjoy condo living, and can afford it, then buy.

——–

And you base this on what experience or real knowledge?

Exactly, none but you few years in the GTA.

When there is inventory and it doesn’t move, price does. Always, forever, how it is.

Watch young MF. Condo price re-evaluation is upon us, the floor is about to give way.

#49 Captain Uppa on 04.26.19 at 8:03 pm

>>Nobody will live their lives then grow old in a condo. This is a bad choice. – Garth>>

Oh I totally agree. Personally I loathe condos. I staved off buying until I could get a single detached on some decent sized terra firma.

#50 Captain Uppa on 04.26.19 at 8:09 pm

#41 Asterix1 on 04.26.19 at 7:11 pm
#28 Captain Uppa
« best forced savings program known to man »
——————————————————————————-

>>Every time I hear that, I have to laugh!

The best savings « program » is the one where you place money and someone pays you interest. Not the other way around!>>

I don’t disagree that balanced portfolios are great investments that pay glorious dividends.

What I meant by “best forced savings plan known to man” is that hands are forced to save, I.e. pay the mortgage. Yes that entails interest, but without a mortgage, a lot of people don’t have the discipline to stock away their money. Not everyone, but a lot.

#51 Smiling and Investing on 04.26.19 at 8:10 pm

@ #28 Captain Uppa
“No one is thinking about having 2 million liquid at age 65”

You are right! I am aiming for 60.

#52 Kurt on 04.26.19 at 8:23 pm

For god’s sake rent, Lindy! Invest that $250K. Your children need your love and attention much more than they need real estate, and you’ll be much better able to provide both with the flexibility and security of renting and investing. Buying a place in the circumstances you describe is a formula for stress and misery.

#53 J. Canuck on 04.26.19 at 8:24 pm

#6 Talking Pie
I guess I’m a little different. If I were living in my parents’ house rent-free in my mid-thirties and foresaw a scarcity of family income, I don’t think I’d take that as a cue to spend tens of thousands of dollars trying to reproduce, and presumably a similar sum to go back to school.
********************
Bravo Mr. (or Ms. or Zir or whatever species/sex you think you are). Took the words right out of my computer.

I’ve never thought that my genes were special enough to be wasted in producing another generation. Yet, in spite of all the “green” talk about reducing carbon emissions (etc, etc ad nauseum), people are hell bent on producing yet more carbon footprints.

Save your money. Put your middle-class aspirations on hold and act like an adult.

#54 Nonplused on 04.26.19 at 8:32 pm

Never ever ever buy a condo. I don’t even recommend duplexes. Good fences make good neighbors.

#55 ShadyLady on 04.26.19 at 8:52 pm

Or.. You could do what I did 15 years ago… Ignore Garth’s advice and buy a house, then after your done playing parents and you are ready to leave your nest, sell it at the peak of the market.. And then trade it in for a McMansion (in a retirement community of your choosing) and a huge wad of cash to buy all the toys you didn’t have time for.

Life is all about decisions. Make the right ones or miss out on the life you always dreamed about.

But since you took Garth’s advice, you’re not going to read this anyway!

News flash: it’s not 15 years ago. – Garth

#56 Finally nailed it on 04.26.19 at 8:56 pm

Seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the the world. Correct.

New documentary: sold out. Greed in Canada runs supreme.

Sunny ways plan in action. If you don’t want to take on that big mortgage we have big money imports who can fill the void.

Time for millennials to take a hit from the bong and vote out T2 come fall.

The correct quote was seven to 12 have urbanized from elsewhere in Canada or the world. – Garth

#57 Smartalox on 04.26.19 at 9:04 pm

@ A Guy in Vancouver (#33):
That was a great article that you linked to in your post.
I’m usually suspicious of articles that cite self-referential sources, but some of the source material that was linked in the article – the law review article about money laundering in stock exchanges, for example, was very good.

With financial regulations improving (or at least becoming so complex that it becomes too difficult to figure out how to game the system), it is easy to see how a poorly-regulated industry like residential real estate – is ripe for money launderers.

Especially for something like condo pre-sales, where (as has been discussed here, previously) pre-construction units are flogged by retailers and not licensed Realtors. Those pre-construction contracts are then assigned, or flipped multiple times as ‘legitimate’ deals, which can be seen as the ‘integration’ step of the laundry cycle, eventually flipping to a greater fool, who has to complete the contract, and ends up with a condo unit that they can no longer flip or sell.

Those urban legends of ‘wealthy, offshore investors’ buying multiple pre-construction condos like penny candy, paying people to stand in line for them… if that demand is being drive by the need to launder illicit money, the scale is truly mind-boggling.

Of course, patterns tend to repeat themselves. These unregulated pre-sales, assignment flips and pre-purchase manias were not limited to one condo project, one city, or one condo developer.

It’s one thing for money launderers to boost residential real estate prices for neighbourhoods by flipping properties and bidding up the values of ‘comparables’, but if the global demand for money laundering is so extensive, and the market for unregulated condo pre-sales makes it so prevalent, at some point it makes one wonder if those ever more massive condo towers – composed of barely livable (and difficult to resell) 600-square-foot shoeboxes weren’t really being built for shelter, but instead were built and promoted as vehicles for laundering money.

Makes you wonder about some of those condo developers, though, because they’re the ones that pocket all the profits from pre-sales. Net of construction costs, of course. But in hot market, demand drives prices higher, while the costs of the goods sold remains pretty constant. There certainly was a lot of profit in those building booms. They looked like Rock Stars, the ‘smartest people of a generation’. Like really, really smart.

And then, those very profitable builders with their advertisements and ‘phony math’ inflating the return on investments – that’s analogous to a stock-swindle ‘pump and dump’ scheme. Of course, those kinds of promotions have already been discussed. and how if similar math were to be used to promote the sale of securities, the regulators would be all over the sellers. But not for Real Estate transactions. Funny, that.

#58 Tried to save my buddy on 04.26.19 at 9:06 pm

Sold the condo off in the Lower Brainland. It was paid off Has about a 600 in cash now.

Now house hunting in the Valley. Complete dives listed at 900k. Laughable.

Going back into a mortgage position of about 300k.

I can’t describe how idiotic this is. You don’t even need a calculator to understand the poor choice of capital allocation here. Your rent is 2200 per month? Big deal. Still cheaper and less risky than owning.

Rent isn’t just a short term option. I highly recommend everyone rent forever. Unless ownership numbers prove otherwise there is not one single location in British Columbia where owning a home that requires a mortgage of over 300k is more beneficial than renting.

And for younger people wanting to make the highest possible income during their prime years: renting and being mobile is where you want to be so you have the flexibility to switch up locations easily.

#59 young & foolish on 04.26.19 at 10:21 pm

Renting is becoming more and more of a challenge in large cities:

https://nowtoronto.com/movies/features/hot-docs-leilani-farha-push-housing/

#60 BC Renovator on 04.26.19 at 10:28 pm

#28 Captain Uppa
Garth, to answer your undying question about why people, especially monsters, love to own real estate, it’s because people want to live now.

It doesn’t mean renting is not living, but most envision a certain life for themselves where their home is theirs…they can change it, they can grow old in it and it holds a family’s memories. All that and the best forced savings program known to man.

No one is thinking about having 2 million liquid at 65, they just aren’t.

This will not change.

*********************

I totally agree with you here! Its the Best forced saving known to man, and it protects people from themselves. Investing takes skill, emotional skill, to ride things out when they look or are getting ugly and to invest wisely. This in my opinion is a skill not many have.

Lindy do yourself a huge favour and get yourself an Advisor you trust, don’t invest on your own. Read some books for F sakes- Lots of great books on Finance and Money

Do both in my opinion! Invest, Max out the reg accounts, and any others you are comfortable with. And, own Real Estate! Ive made more money in Real Estate then the market, but I do believe that, that time has passed in Real Estate…temporarily.

My parents neighbour sold 18months ago on the North Shore of YVR for 3.3 Mill, same house sold again last week for 2.2MIll. Thats a big hit in 18months

#61 Doug in London on 04.26.19 at 10:39 pm

And, for the love of God, ignore the comment section.
——————————————————–
Not a bad idea except for one thing. When a lot of commenters here are bellyaching about how something has dropped in price, like stocks and equity ETFs last December, it’s a sure signal that it’s time to buy. It’s called reading between the lines.

#62 AACI Homedog on 04.26.19 at 10:56 pm

Real estate is tangible…you can live in it. I find young people do not know much about investing, and do not trust the stock market. Shame, really.

#63 Christina on 04.26.19 at 11:02 pm

Hi Dolce,

I agree – the word creatures was absolutely what made it so hilarious. It’s an effective insult, while still being sort of charming!

And…I feel for Lindy. It must be heart wrenching to have to dish out $10,000’s in fertility treatments. I’m pretty content with my fur baby, but I know that certainly isn’t the case for everyone.

#64 Millmech on 04.26.19 at 11:25 pm

Another bad thing with condos or townhouses is bed bugs as once they get established they are very hard to eradicate.
A co worker has had infestations twice so far this year in his building and when new tenants come in they tend to bring them with them or bnb clients have been known to port them around.

#65 LP on 04.26.19 at 11:42 pm

Okay, I’m just going to say it! For the love of Pete, grow up you two. If you’re old enough to be married, and it seems you’re in your early 30s, act like grown-ups and move out. Rent an apartment, a small house or town house or even a trailer, anything that isn’t owned by a relative. Then stop listening to anyone, ANYONE, who tells you to buy a house or condo. In this market that’s just stupid.

And while I’m blurting out some home truths here, I’ll just add, “What’s with the in vitro?” Has it never occurred to you that you’re not meant to have children? That you aren’t destined to be biological parents? Maybe you’ll have to content yourselves with being the very best, most cool, auntie and uncle. Or honorary aunt and uncle to your friends’ kids. Just because it’s scientifically possible to force the issue, doesn’t mean it’s a good idea.

#66 Ponzius Pilatus on 04.27.19 at 12:06 am

#54 Nonplused on 04.26.19 at 8:32 pm
Never ever ever buy a condo. I don’t even recommend duplexes. Good fences make good neighbors.
———
The emphasis is on “good fences”.
Once they rotten and need to be replaced, the good neighbors are not so good anymore.

#67 Long-Time Lurker on 04.27.19 at 12:09 am

>Here, Smokey.

How Angry Pilots Got The Navy To Stop Dismissing UFO Sightings

By Deanna Paul
April 25

A recent uptick in sightings of unidentified flying objects — or as the military calls them, “unexplained aerial phenomena” — prompted the Navy to draft formal procedures for pilots to document encounters, a corrective measure that former officials say is long overdue.

As first reported by POLITICO, these intrusions have been happening on a regular basis since 2014. Recently, unidentified aircraft have entered military-designated airspace as often as multiple times per month, Joseph Gradisher, spokesman for office of the deputy chief of naval operations for information warfare, told The Washington Post on Wednesday….

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2019/04/24/how-angry-pilots-got-navy-stop-dismissing-ufo-sightings/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.dd7072b79417

#68 The Real Mark on 04.27.19 at 12:30 am

“#2 The Real Mark on 04.26.19 at 4:40 pm “

Don’t you ever get tired of impostering??

#69 Stahom on 04.27.19 at 12:53 am

These testimonials are akin to watching a young couple feed a Coke to a toddler in a stroller, just watch and shake your head. Nieces and nephews going through the house lust, and subsequent purchase despite some subtle counsel to pile up the investments in one’s 20s and live modestly and rent. Nope. Just cover your own business with the experience acquired over the years and watch from the sidelines while living your best life. My “Just shut the hell up, they aren’t interested” muscle is Olympian in strength.

#70 Smoking Man on 04.27.19 at 1:23 am

When you get to my point in life, you after 60 its a painful ride down to death’s door.

Why not have crazy fun. If I eat right , sacrifice good booze I may earn another painfull day in dialers.

Fk that. Running for the exit screaming God let’s dance. , with JD courage.

https://youtu.be/5_e-Hvg57cA

#71 Dolce Vita on 04.27.19 at 1:23 am

On a recent topic of “something afoot” in Canada’s voting pattern and of the fate of Justin Trudeau and his “Liberals” come October, I had read a Comment by someone on Twitter to the effect:

You should read the responses to his Tweets…

So today I decided to do that starting with an @JustinTrudeau Tweet with a huffingtonpost.ca article link with regards to getting money back from Carbon Taxes:

https://twitter.com/JustinTrudeau/status/1121869523605512192

678 Replies to that Tweet. I thought some Reply’s were disrespectful, down right brazen. I have to admit, some of the Animated GIFs were funny – there’s some real talent out there in Canada for the sublime.

Tough to find a positive Tweet. A lot of noxious negativity out there to say the least. I was taken aback.

#72 Smoking Man on 04.27.19 at 2:06 am

No words

https://youtu.be/8xysVNigCsU

#73 Anon3mouse on 04.27.19 at 4:51 am

I suggest subscribe / watch FIRE (financial independence and retire early) or FI podcasts and vlogs. A lot are american but there are canadian ones as well. Concepts are the same. Theres a wealth of knowledge and examples of folks living w/o house ownership being center of universe.

#74 Anon3mouse on 04.27.19 at 5:11 am

https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/books/the-global-expatriates-guide-to/9781119020981-item.html

#75 leanne on 04.27.19 at 5:54 am

My own humble thoughts on your situation, Lindey:

– brilliant opportunity to live rent-free for a while – save like mad, set a date to move out and work toward so that you don’t feel dependent
– IVF – having gone through this myself, I can honestly say that this was the best thing we ever did (getting help to become parents). If it doesn’t work then at least you won’t live with regret that you never tried. Kids don’t need to be as expensive as everyone says, and life is so much richer and meaningful with a little person in your life. Plus they’re the greatest motivation to be the best person you can be and to leave the world a better place. Maybe just have one instead of 2 if your finances are stretched.
– Re. The studying, not for me to judge without more info, but if you’re not planning to work after kids then this could be a poor *financial* decision. There are more and more opportunities to work remotely with flexible hours. Maybe this is something you could check out.
– $250k – invest it for the long-term! Don’t dump it into a house. And you definitely don’t need a house – apartments are just fine for small families (just ask anyone who lives one Europe…)
– Learn what “enough” is for your family, and don’t waste your life trying to keep up with the Joneses. Studies suggest that happiness does not increase beyond household incomes of $75k.
Good luck :)

#76 under the radar on 04.27.19 at 6:05 am

Very few people have the fortitude to put their entire windfall in the “stock market”” forever” . Owning a detached home with two cars in the driveway and a backyard is so ingrained that people do crazy things, when prices are astronomically high relative to incomes, like mortgaging themselves to a life of servitude so that nothing is left when things go sideways.

Never has this blog (or any rational advisor) suggested all net worth be in stocks. The amount of personal wealth you should have in individual equities: zero. – Garth

#77 Y. Knott on 04.27.19 at 6:15 am

#166 Gravy Train on 04.25.19 at 3:17 pm
#125 Y. Knott on 04.25.19 at 9:20 am
#147 IHCTD9 on 04.25.19 at 11:42 am
#151 Y. Knott on 04.25.19 at 12:43 pm
#157 IHCTD9 on 04.25.19 at 1:59 pm

Neither of you two clever yahoos have children or grandchildren, do you?

Both. Why?

In case it was because you were contemplating a long “We must SAAAVE THE EARTH!!! – for the children…” screed, you needn’t. NOT ONE prediction made by the Global-Warming crowd (and the global-cooling crowd that predated them), has come true in the last fifty years. Not one.

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/04/22/earth-day-not-a-single-environmental-prediction-of-the-last-50-years-has-come-true/

– and I clearly remember that the alarmists’ve all been replying “Oh but they WILL – just you wait…” the whole time, so you needn’t bother saying that either.

Oh—and to you, Y. Knott—there’s no need to hyphenate verbs to adverbs; it’s just not done in civil society.

Yes it is – I do it all the time. Your point?

#78 Captain Uppa on 04.27.19 at 6:44 am

There is one thing that no renter, nor homeowner, can escape…the crazy high price of groceries!

I mean holy hell in a handbasket.

#79 DavidW2 on 04.27.19 at 7:19 am

Everyone’s path in life is different. I moved out at 17 and am now in my early 30s and married. Financial literacy wasn’t common in my circle either but still managed to put myself through university and get a professional designation, land a good career and save up a nice little nest egg. Purchased a home this year at about 3x gross household income with a mortgage less than 2x gross income. This brings me to this blog where we try to soak up knowledge to wisely invest and gain financial freedom in approx 20 yrs. Keep up the awesome work!

#80 YUP on 04.27.19 at 7:47 am

@#55 ShadyLady on 04.26.19 at 8:52 pm
Or.. You could do what I did 15 years ago… Ignore Garth’s advice and buy a house, then after your done playing parents and you are ready to leave your nest, sell it at the peak of the market.. And then trade it in for a McMansion (in a retirement community of your choosing) and a huge wad of cash to buy all the toys you didn’t have time for.

Life is all about decisions. Make the right ones or miss out on the life you always dreamed about.

But since you took Garth’s advice, you’re not going to read this anyway!

News flash: it’s not 15 years ago. – Garth
______________________

If you bought even 5 years ago you could sell for a healthy profit right now. Toronto proper at least.

After double land transfer tax, carrying costs and selling commission, the return is less than a garden-variety balanced portfolio. – Garth

#81 Momof3 on 04.27.19 at 8:01 am

One more thing to keep in mind – if the inheritance money goes into a house it will belong to both of you in case of divorce. If whoever inherited it (post says “we” but is that truly the case?) invests it only in their name I believe it remains theirs after a divorce. Just something to consider when making a decision. You should check into that.

#82 baloney Sandwitch on 04.27.19 at 8:35 am

Garth – maybe in a future column you can teach the moist doggies about capitalization rates. (much more important lesson than the birds and the bees).

Basically for hog town, I would aim for at least 5% cap-rate. For a $600,000 condo multiply by 5% (0.05). You get $30,000. Divide by 12. You get $2500. If your rental cost for a similar apartment is below $2500 per month then rent – if its above buy.

#83 not 1st on 04.27.19 at 8:39 am

Garth, no comments on the US vs Canada GDP numbers? US economy growing 2.5 times as fast as ours.
1.2% vs 3.2% Canada in technical recession now without the US. First time that’s ever happened.

#84 Justin S on 04.27.19 at 9:10 am

“In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world.”

As a millennial living in Toronto, this doesn’t surprise me at all. What a city. What a spot to live. This is where the big job opportunities are (and the big $$), and everything else about the city is amazing. It consistently ranks among the most livable cities in the world. No wonder everyone wants to live here. Love this city!

A Leafs cup next year would undoubtedly make this the best city in the world!!!

#85 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.27.19 at 9:19 am

@#55 ShysterLady
“Make the right ones or miss out on the life you always dreamed about….”

+++++

Where did you plagerize that catchy line?
One of your real estate course manuals?

#86 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.27.19 at 9:24 am

@#71 Doug in Londinium
“When a lot of commenters here are bellyaching about how something has dropped in price, like stocks and equity ETFs last December, it’s a sure signal that it’s time to buy. It’s called reading between the lines.”

*****

So I should sell the gas in my tank?

#87 dharma bum on 04.27.19 at 9:31 am

“Where do people go when they don’t know anything?”
——————————————————————–

Here’s a unique idea:

Books.

The Internet.

It makes sense why these people still live with their parents in their mid-30’s.

Really?
C’MON!!!

#88 dharma bum on 04.27.19 at 9:39 am

#67 Long Time Lurker

A recent uptick in sightings of unidentified flying objects — or as the military calls them, “unexplained aerial phenomena” —
——————————————————————–

That’s just Smoking Man in his alien heliocopter!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXUrC7XQDKs

#89 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.27.19 at 9:45 am

@#71 Dolce Vita

Yep.
Not one pro Trudeau comment on that feed.

The wind will blow cold for the Libs in October…

#90 Bytor the Snow Dog on 04.27.19 at 9:48 am

Garth sez:

“… almost a hundred thousand of the bearded, tattooed creatures in just one year”.
—————————————————————
Yeah but what about the men?

#91 Bytor the Snow Dog on 04.27.19 at 9:49 am

Lindy’s situation reminds me of a country song gone wrong. Bad decision after bad decision. What the hell is with the delayed adulthood these days?

#92 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.27.19 at 9:54 am

@#80 Yup
“If you bought even 5 years ago you could sell for a healthy profit right now. Toronto proper at least.”

+++++

As Garth commented earlier.
We arent talking 5 years ago.
The people are thinking about buying now.
In a falling RE market.
Why catch a knife on the way down.
Invest the money in a balance and diversified portfolio.
Keep renting.
Wait until these ridiculous housing prices are lower.
Or rent forever.
No shame in that.
Unless, of course, you’re a commission based realtor looking for the next rube to suck money out of.

#93 Basil Fawlty on 04.27.19 at 9:59 am

from Y. Knott

“In case it was because you were contemplating a long “We must SAAAVE THE EARTH!!! – for the children…” screed, you needn’t. NOT ONE prediction made by the Global-Warming crowd (and the global-cooling crowd that predated them), has come true in the last fifty years. Not one.”

How about the receding glaciers? How about ocean acidification? How many more do you need before wake up time?

#94 Chris on 04.27.19 at 10:25 am

Forget about saving the earth by not having children. You will save yourself from working a decade or two more by not having children. You don’t have to worry about child care costs, college tuition and hundreds of other expenses. Retire early, travel and enjoy your life.

#95 Ronaldo on 04.27.19 at 10:29 am

#93 Basil Fawlty on 04.27.19 at 9:59 am

Check this out.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/greenland-jakobshavn-glacier-1.5071628

#96 Y. Knott on 04.27.19 at 10:51 am

#93 Basil Fawlty on 04.27.19 at 9:59 am
from Y. Knott

How about the receding glaciers? How about ocean acidification? How many more do you need before wake up time?

Yeah – Those are the ones I’m talking about.

WHAT ocean acidification? All those bleached corals? – growing back just fine. You can read about James Cook University firing Peter Ridd when he pointed-out their published data on how the Great Barrier Reef was dying-out, was cherrypicked – and whose side the judge came down on.

WHAT receding glaciers? Antarctica has grown every year we’ve measured it, except the years when big ice shelves calved – and receding glaciers don’t calve. Unless you’re talking about the Western Peninsula, of course. There the ice IS receding – something to do with the rift fault and the 60+ active volcanoes they’ve found under it, I reckon. And that west Greenland glacier that receded so much? – it’s growing again; they just announced that.

Get your facts straight; I did.

#97 oh bouy on 04.27.19 at 10:53 am

#84 Justin S on 04.27.19 at 9:10 am
“In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world.”

As a millennial living in Toronto, this doesn’t surprise me at all. What a city. What a spot to live. This is where the big job opportunities are (and the big $$), and everything else about the city is amazing. It consistently ranks among the most livable cities in the world. No wonder everyone wants to live here. Love this city!

A Leafs cup next year would undoubtedly make this the best city in the world!!!
_____________________________

can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or just trolling the resident curmudgeons on here .

#98 Travel More on 04.27.19 at 10:58 am

#84 Justin S on 04.27.19 at 9:10 am
“In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world.”

As a millennial living in Toronto, this doesn’t surprise me at all. What a city. What a spot to live. This is where the big job opportunities are (and the big $$), and everything else about the city is amazing. It consistently ranks among the most livable cities in the world. No wonder everyone wants to live here. Love this city!

——-

You need to travel more. Toronto is a disgusting hole compared to almost any other city.

The only people who believe Toronto is amongst the most livable cities in the world are those whom have never left it.

#99 Bonhomme Carnaval on 04.27.19 at 11:58 am

The Real Estate Market are on fire in La Belle Province!

From January to March, 23 667 transactions

Median Prices :

SFH 255 000 $ (+ 3 %)
Strata 231 000 $ (+ 1 %)
Multi-Unit 385 000 $ (no change)

19th straight quarter increase.

Source : https://www.lapresse.ca/maison/immobilier/201904/26/01-5223661-des-ventes-de-proprietes-toujours-en-hausse.php

#100 Money Coach on 04.27.19 at 12:51 pm

Lindy – a small but respectful plug. You may want to think about going to see a Money Coach. A good Financial planner can help you to think through the options you have and the pros and cons of the choices you have to make. There is lots of information out there and wading through it all to get to the stuff that is accurate and also relevant to your situation can be overwhelming. Sometimes it just makes sense to pay for some help.

#101 Justin S on 04.27.19 at 12:59 pm

#97 oh bouy on 04.27.19 at 10:53 am

Not being sarcastic or trolling – just a proud Torontonian

#98 Travel More on 04.27.19 at 10:58 am

I’ve travelled around the world – to hundreds of cities and to every continent except Antarctica and most of Africa. No city in the world I’ve visited compares to Toronto. Paris and New York are pretty cool, but I still prefer Toronto.

#102 oh bouy on 04.27.19 at 2:00 pm

@#98 Travel More on 04.27.19 at 10:58 am
#84 Justin S on 04.27.19 at 9:10 am
“In fact, for every young person leaving the Big Smokes, seven to 12 new ones have swept in from elsewhere in the country or the world.”

As a millennial living in Toronto, this doesn’t surprise me at all. What a city. What a spot to live. This is where the big job opportunities are (and the big $$), and everything else about the city is amazing. It consistently ranks among the most livable cities in the world. No wonder everyone wants to live here. Love this city!

——-

You need to travel more. Toronto is a disgusting hole compared to almost any other city.

The only people who believe Toronto is amongst the most livable cities in the world are those whom have never left it.
___________________________

this loser obviously hasnt been to toronto.

#103 What I think I might know on 04.27.19 at 8:34 pm

Anyone who talks down GTA RE is an idiot. GTA RE can only go up over the long term. The reasons are numerous and don’t really matter. People have been predicting a GTA RE debacle for years and they have been monumentally wrong. Why does this silly debate continue? The massive influx of immigrants is just one reason GTA RE will continue to climb in value.

#104 Ron Dwyer on 04.28.19 at 8:36 am

Best advice – use common sense. Renters are going to be so vulnerable to skyrocketing rents. Just buy – if properties go down 10 or so % that’s ok and a lot better than risking an inflationary housing blowout. Also if you rent you will be moving a lot – and we all hate moving.
Good luck