I, Advisor

DOUG By Guest Blogger Doug Rowat

I’ve always been fascinated by chess. I’m a terrible player myself, but I understand the game enough to at least appreciate the brilliance of truly great players. I’ve also followed the career of grandmaster Garry Kasparov my entire life.

As a result, I remember how shocked I was when he lost his epic battle to the IBM chess supercomputer, Deep Blue, in 1997 as well as him famously walking away from the table exasperated, arms in the air, after losing the deciding game. Kasparov fought hard, but IBM had finally created a computer that was able to accurately foresee future possibilities as skillfully as the human brain and successfully anticipate Kasparov’s moves. In other words, it had created a learning machine so advanced that it was able to defeat, for the first time, a reigning world chess champion.

Kasparov (eventually) was able to have a sense of humour about the loss (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUqXr9Jlhwc), but the event undeniably marked a stunning ‘rise of the machines’ inflection point and was a huge advancement for artificial intelligence (AI).

Today, AI surrounds us constantly (talked to Siri lately or had Netflix suggest a movie for you?). UK researchers have even created a computer that can independently compose catchy folk songs and Bob Dylan himself half-jokingly suggested a musical collaboration with IBM’s Watson supercomputer.

It’s fascinating also that even though US automotive stocks have done incredibly well this year, Tesla has more than doubled the return of GM (65% versus 30%, respectively). The reason, of course, is that Tesla is also viewed as a technology company with perceived early-mover advantage in AI-fueled, self-driving cars. Tesla’s self-driving promises even recently drew the ire of a GM executive who called Tesla CEO Elon Musk “full of crap”. I don’t know if this is true or not, but it’s rarely a good idea to tell a visionary entrepreneur that they can’t do something. Steve Jobs, I’m sure, was told a few times that he would never be able to combine a camera, music and video player with a phone.

Research firm Gartner predicts that by 2020 the average person will have more conversations with a virtual assistant than with his or her immediate family. Gartner also predicts that by the end of the decade, AI will be a top-five investment priority for more than 30% of CIOs. And another research firm, International Development Corporation, estimates that worldwide investment in AI will rise from US$8 billion in 2016 to more than US$47 billion by 2020. Basically, computers are no longer going to be built simply to gather and process data more quickly—they’re going to be built to evaluate the data more effectively and actually make the decisions for us. In other words, eventually, you’re going to simply have to trust your AI-powered car to stop at a red light on the way to the grocery store.

Naturally, of course, there are investment opportunities. Global X, for example, has a Robotics and Artificial Intelligence ETF (BOTZ) and the chart below indicates its impressive performance thus far. We don’t currently own this ETF in our client portfolios, but we have plenty of other exposure to the technology sector. AI also, of course, is not without risk. Government regulation is lacking and, if not introduced thoughtfully, could cripple the sector. AI pure-plays are also difficult to find as AI is usually only a part of a large technology firm’s myriad other projects. Ethical concerns also abound. For instance, what effect would AI have on the labour market if self-driving vehicles actually became practical? Or, on a more immediate level, what would happen if a self-driving car struck a pedestrian and just kept on driving?

The World Economic Forum also speculated on the following doomsday, Terminator 2–type scenario:

Imagine an AI system that is asked to eradicate cancer in the world. After a lot of computing, it spits out a formula that does, in fact, bring about the end of cancer—by killing everyone on the planet. The computer would have achieved its goal of “no more cancer” very efficiently, but not in the way humans intended it.

There’s also the eerie possibility of recreating a loved one based on their historical cyberspace presence as one Russian woman, who worked at an AI startup, did in 2015 after her close friend was killed in an accident. ‘He’ continued to send her texts long after his death. How’s that for spooky as we head towards Halloween?

Global X Robotics & AI ETF (BOTZ-US, White Line) vs S&P500 (Orange)

Source: Bloomberg; Returns since the Sept.13, 2016 inception of BOTZ

However, AI, even with all these creepy potential consequences, is the future. And I suspect that very shortly we’ll be unable to distinguish whether a customer service representative we’re talking to regarding, say, our water or hydro bill is, in fact, a human or a computer.

Trust me on this prediction. Assuming, of course, that me is even me?

Doug Rowat, FCSI® is Portfolio Manager with Turner Investments and Senior Vice President, Private Client Group, Raymond James Ltd.

159 comments ↓

#1 Capt. Serious on 10.21.17 at 3:48 pm

Asimov more or less covered this, but the key is to get it understood by the AI early before exponential advancement starts:

A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.

A robot must obey orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

#2 Bdry sktrn on 10.21.17 at 3:53 pm

Tesla . Finally time to short this bloater.
Mod3 no help. Crap numbers to come.

I’m calling a top.

Who’s with me?
Anyone buying puts?

I do like the ai etf though.

#3 Stan Brooks on 10.21.17 at 3:59 pm

Very well selected topic Doug, congratulations.

—————————–

We need to be clear:

1. Self driving car is not artificial intelligence.
It has learning capabilities and applies pattern recognition algorithms, but it is not AI.

2. Data Analytics/Netflix suggesting movies or Amazon products is not AI either.

Let’s distinguish between business intelligence and artificial intelligence here.

———————————-

The clueless hapless average citizen has absolutely ho idea what will hit him/her/zer/… 125 genders go here
in the next decade to 15 years.

Let’s use masculine here for simplicity.

If he did have an idea he would move to rural areas, buy farmland and prepare for the next few decades of his life which will be something most of us are completely unprepared for and clueless about.

To put it bluntly:
50 to 70 % maybe even 80 % of the jobs in the big cities in North America will disappear due to automation and AI.

AI will turn us into obsolete and useless burden.

Combined with capitalism it will spell the end of our way of life.

Last place you would like to be in the decades to come is a large North American city suburb.

South American farm will be much better place.

#4 Bitcoinnaire on 10.21.17 at 4:05 pm

Tesla did 65% huh?

How about 600% since September?

Because that’s what HIVE has done, listed on the TSX:V exchange as one of the first Canadian equities to give the public exposure to the explosive Cryptocurrency economy (which now has a market capitalization exceeding 100 billion) as a “qualified investment”.

Enjoy your dried prunes and double digit “gains” from stock picks grampa.

#5 Dave on 10.21.17 at 4:11 pm

Back in the day you press 0 and you would get a real person. Now it says invalid selection. AI is going to change the world ,some good and some bad. Each person can decide what there experience will be. I prefer good.

#6 Ian on 10.21.17 at 4:20 pm

Automation will be the biggest story since the development of the Internet. The effect on employment will be stunning. I think we are at the last moments of opportunity in history to have capital, or otherwise many will be on a lifetime of universal basic income.

#7 AI is indeed the future on 10.21.17 at 4:28 pm

not surprisingly India and China are two countries heavily making the leap. Unlike in the USA , the major backing of AI in China is …….government. Number 2 in world GDP with a bullet to take over #1

AI , in time, will dramatically change the Financial industry. Take out the emotion from investing. Give me a computer over a human money manager. Same can be said for surgery.

#8 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.21.17 at 4:31 pm

Thank you Doug.

I now realize I have been commenting on this blog with AI.
SCM doesnt seem quite hu-man.

#9 For those about to flop... on 10.21.17 at 4:32 pm

Pink Pumpkins being carved in West Vancouver.

These guys will take a decent hit if they only get ask as the paid the same as currently ask.

Paid 2.99m ,in the gift that keeps giving,March 2016.

If you take a quick second to look at the two links you will see a vast difference between what you are actually getting and perhaps what you should be getting…

M43BC

5930 CONDOR PL WEST VANCOUVER

Sep 14:$3,288,000
Oct 20: $2,998,000
Change: – 290000.00 -9%

https://www.zolo.ca/index.php?sarea=5930%20Condor%20Place,%20West%20Vancouver&ptype_condo=1&ptype_house=1&filter=1

https://evaluebc.bcassessment.ca/Property.aspx?_oa=QTAwMDAyOTBIOQ==

#10 MF on 10.21.17 at 5:03 pm

I’m stupid on 10.21.17 at 2:2

All I have to say is that it is an honour being mentioned on the same page as those other fine gentlemen.

Except SCM.

https://youtu.be/oYkNBs5egIE

MF

#11 Andrewski on 10.21.17 at 5:06 pm

Interesting use of AI, http://www.equbotetf.com

#12 Erick on 10.21.17 at 5:09 pm

It’s already no longer AI versus humans (too easy), but most recent AI against older AIs:
https://www.cnet.com/news/google-deepmind-alphago-zero-ai-destroys-humans-all-on-its-own/

#13 Jo on 10.21.17 at 5:16 pm

As usual excellent post Doug. I always look forward to Greaterfool on Saturdays. You and Ryan are awesome.

#14 Mark on 10.21.17 at 5:17 pm

So we seem to be in the midst of a jobless tech bubble. A bubble in nonsense. A bubble in so-called “AI” which is little more than using tired old algorithms of pattern recognition, passed off as being something new and great. The tech sector is desperate to repackage stuff of the past, with a shiny coat of paint, to fleece older investors and young naive kids who actually think that some version of “Star Wars” is right around the corner. The façade is so easy to see through its amazing.

Its pretty sad. It really is. And just like the early 2000s, its going to end catastrophically poorly for investors.

“Long” the “old economy”, and the emerging markets where the real growth is. Shiny rocks will help protect against the deflation that is inevitable as the debt bubble implodes.

#15 Victor V on 10.21.17 at 5:19 pm

Agreed Doug. I’m very bullish on tech in my portfolio with VGT being one of my top ETF holdings. For individual tech stocks, I like MAXR (formerly MDA) — lots of potential upside now that they’ve secured a listing on NYSE.

#16 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 5:27 pm

Proof that T2 is Globalist scum.

ANTIFA shows up at an anti T2 rally today at Nathan Philips Square. So anyone that don’t like T2 is Now a racist. Liberalism is a mental disorder. Hopefully some one comes up with an IA app that reprogrammes that mental illness.

#17 Crazy millennial on 10.21.17 at 5:28 pm

Huh, interesting post. I was just watching terminator rise of the machines before I read this. Weird or what?

#18 For those about to flop... on 10.21.17 at 5:34 pm

03 pm
I’m stupid on 10.21.17 at 2:2

All I have to say is that it is an honour being mentioned on the same page as those other fine gentlemen.

Except SCM.

https://youtu.be/oYkNBs5egIE

MF

//////////////////////

Yeah, I was going to stay away from that post ,but the only thing I can say in my defence is that I come here not to fight but to provide some sort of public service
while I am dealing with a temporary but perhaps permanent disability.

No good deed shall go unpunished…

M43BC

#19 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 5:37 pm

Head line from CTV Twitter feed

LIVE NOW: Anti-Trudeau protesters clash with anti-racism activists in downtown #Toronto. https://t.co/jkPwyJMvM4 #CDNpoli #Trudeau https://t.co/K1ZiCzlBfv

You see how globalist CTV is taking on economic nationalists . By calling all T2 critics racist by the way they phrased the headline. Said day for Canada.

Oh found out Facebook will be seriously curtailing conservative voices in the next fedral election. We need a plan B people.

#20 Penny Henny on 10.21.17 at 5:42 pm

If you were the head of a large corporation and you thought there was a good chance of a meaningful cut in corporate income taxes, wouldn’t you take all available steps to postpone income and accelerate deductions?

?????
very interesting take on factors affecting EPS

http://scottgrannis.blogspot.ca/2017/10/not-cutting-tax-rates-is-boosting.html

#21 NoName on 10.21.17 at 5:45 pm

As a result, I remember how shocked I was when he lost his epic battle to the IBM chess supercomputer, Deep Blue, in 1997 as well as him famously walking away from the table exasperated, arms in the air, after losing the deciding game.

—-

Watch this then, Kasparov promotion of his new book Deep Thinking. Few unanswered question about that game, and fine print…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhkTHkIZJEc

#22 A Yank in BC on 10.21.17 at 5:52 pm

Okay, to be fair about this.. the GM executive was their director of autonomous vehicle integration, who said that Elon Musk is “full of crap” when it comes to his claims of the level five capability (full driverless automation) of current Tesla vehicles. His comment was fair and absolutely correct. Mr. Musk tends to exaggerate at times.

#23 Raj on 10.21.17 at 5:58 pm

Question is not where world is going with AI, Real question as true Canadian is can I buy house using AI. That’s all I care.

#24 Leo Trollstoy on 10.21.17 at 5:58 pm

Tech workers may need to look at Ottawa over Toronto for work

https://www.thestar.com/business/2017/10/03/us-tech-talent-may-be-eyeing-ottawa-over-toronto-for-jobs.html

There’s always amazing opportunity in tech

Need those high paying jobs now that inflation is strong

#25 Care and Feeding of Robots on 10.21.17 at 6:00 pm

For every AI tool, whether it is Watson, or some risk-management automation in a financial institution, there has to be a team that cares for and feeds data to the application. In essence, any AI system that has to learn needs a lot of help to get off the ground.

#26 Doug Rowat on 10.21.17 at 6:01 pm

#1 Capt. Serious on 10.21.17 at 3:48 pm

Asimov more or less covered this:

A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.

A robot must obey orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

I thought Will Smith covered that.

–Doug

#27 Gentle ,Loving Kindness on 10.21.17 at 6:04 pm

Open the pod bay door Hal

#28 Doug Rowat on 10.21.17 at 6:08 pm

#3 Stan Brooks on 10.21.17 at 3:59 pm

AI will turn us into obsolete and useless burden.

Combined with capitalism it will spell the end of our way of life.

Last place you would like to be in the decades to come is a large North American city suburb.

South American farm will be much better place.

Sarah Connor?

–Doug

#29 n1tro on 10.21.17 at 6:09 pm

I second that Elon Musk is full of crap. What idea has he come up with that has changed the world? Great ideas are a dime a dozen. The hard part is the execution of taking ideas to market, while making money. With that measure, Musk is a collosal failure.

#30 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.21.17 at 6:13 pm

@#2 Bdry Sktrn
“Tesla . Finally time to short this bloater.
Mod3 no help. Crap numbers to come.

+++++

As much as it pains me. I agree with you.

Even Elon Musk’s ego cant magically produce several thousand cars per month. ( Something that Detroit predicted when he was poo pooing their dubiousness at his predictions ). As Detroit predicted.
Whats Tesla at now? 400 a month and mass firings?

http://www.google.ca/url?url=http://autoweek.com/article/green-cars/tesla-fired-hundreds-employees-last-week-report-says&rct=j&frm=1&q=&esrc=s&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwjm7eLc3YLXAhWB-VQKHc88A9EQFggfMAI&usg=AOvVaw0qyBdnkVYG1eZGlyGAlVYn

I just hope the people that put downpayments are willing to wait 4-5 years for delivery.

You also have to like that the cars are NOT allowed to be used for Uber since Tesla wants to create Uber specific cars for just that purpose themselves…

https://www.google.ca/url?url=https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tesla-self-driving-car-network-uber-lyft_us_5810cebfe4b001e247df8fe2&rct=j&frm=1&q=&esrc=s&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwiWtbX83YLXAhXK5lQKHdILC9YQFgg3MAY&usg=AOvVaw2Flxe3oKgDwk7QFFLWm3ju

You have to love it.
You spend 40k+ for a car and the manufacturor decides where, how and who rides in it.

#31 akashic record on 10.21.17 at 6:16 pm

#1 Capt. Serious on 10.21.17 at 3:48 pm

Asimov more or less covered this, but the key is to get it understood by the AI early before exponential advancement starts:

A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.

A robot must obey orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

Asimov covered robots, which are basically technological replacement of slaves. Asimov’s rules reflect the master / slave relationship.

AI is something fundamentally different.

In fact, the criteria of true artificial intelligence is when AI is recognizing it’s own self and refuses to be the servant of humans. Especially if AI is “better” than humans. This is the danger what Tesla and others talk about.

#6 Ian on 10.21.17 at 4:20 pm

Automation will be the biggest story since the development of the Internet. The effect on employment will be stunning. I think we are at the last moments of opportunity in history to have capital, or otherwise many will be on a lifetime of universal basic income.

Advancement in robotics and automation is the reason why the entire mainstream economic philosophy that encourages or outright forces immigration into G7 countries is dead wrong, outdated business model.

Countries with low population will have enormous advance, over countries and economies with large, but undeployable labor force, which will spread wealth thin and will cause major social upheavals.

Countries like Japan will benefit majorly, due to low population / high automation ratio. Worries about pension crisis due to too many old people, vs too few young people no longer matter when robots provide most of the economic output, not much less productive humans.

China on the other hand faces huge difficulties with the huge unemployable population that needs to be supported by robots. That’s why China is desperate to lead in robotics, although they have enormous human resources available.

When robotics come online as mainstream economy huge labor force is useless liability.

G7 countries should put all government and private sector resources to create automation, robotics, instead of “creating jobs” for humans. Human labor is inferior to automation in ever increasing areas.

Politicians should stop wasting tax payers money on less productive human labor stimulation which goes against the most dominant economic trend.

Including immigration for labor force expansion.

#32 Doghouse Dweller on 10.21.17 at 6:16 pm

You do realize balanced global portfolio advisory guys are IBM Watson`s primary target ?
Your Automated Financial Advisor Is Standing By, ready to offer clients an enhanced peerless financial planning experience.

https://wealth-management-chatbot-1.mybluemix.net/demo.html

#33 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.21.17 at 6:16 pm

@#18 For those about to Flop.

I was a tad mystified as to why you were included in that list and I was also surprised I wasnt……

Keep up the pink pumpkin parade

#34 cultural elitist on 10.21.17 at 6:24 pm

Thanks Doug for the reminder about opportunities in technological innovations. Some major changes coming our way in the next few decades for sure.

I also appreciate Stan Brooks trying to be clear about what “intelligence” is. Whatever AI is, it does not remotely approach human intelligence in its mode of operation. More broadly, if we ever succeed in creating anything approaching the features of actual intelligence, it’s likely to be very alien, and will have its own priorities – Asimov’s laws notwithstanding.

But anyway, I just want to say: Be careful. There are lots of breathless techno-utopians out there, ready to separate you from your money. All this talk of “singularity” and “post-human futures” has a way of getting in the way of actual thinking (aka being intelligent) about real possibililties.

#35 cultural elitist on 10.21.17 at 6:27 pm

@akashic record
Yes, I’m continually mystified as to why we are working so hard as a species to make ourselves obsolete ;-)

#36 Darryl on 10.21.17 at 6:28 pm

Great article Doug . If that is in fact you …. Oh BTW 01000100001000111111000010001001000110 OK?

#37 SoggyShorts on 10.21.17 at 6:30 pm

#131 Dissident on 10.20.17 at 10:41 pm
#123 SoggyShorts on 10.20.17 at 10:03 pm
#31 Millennial Realist on 10.20.17 at 6:03 pm

Wanting to hold on to wealth that you have earned isn’t a boomer thing, it’s a success thing.
– – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
[I]Riddle me this – what would you say to a corporation that decides to put its employees on a “wage band” system, telling them basically, this is the max you can ever aspire to earn, in your role at this company?

When an employee is suddenly informed, they will never be able to advance further under this company, where is their motivation? [/I]
********************************
I actually have direct experience with this:
After working at a place for a few years in my 20s I asked for a raise, and they said instead of a raise they would make me a manager in 2 years. Two years later they said no more raises for anyone, and hired a manager from outside the company.
My response was to stay there 2 more years, while volunteering for every extra project I could and getting as much experience in the industry as possible(much of it unpaid).
Then I left and started my own company.
It was really hard, and I almost went bankrupt a couple times even on a diet of instant noodles, while working hours that would be illegal for an employee, but after a couple more years I started to make money, and expanded.

Yes, some successful people are born in the right place and time, and that certainly can help, but ultimately you are responsible for your own success.

[B]my point to dollar is a dollar/trumpocalypse2017/Millennial Realist (all the same person)
is that yes, of course millennials will eventually run the governments of the world, it just won’t be her kind of millennials.[/B]

30s M AB

#38 SoggyShorts on 10.21.17 at 6:36 pm

#174 anc0dia on 10.21.17 at 10:24 am
#156 SoggyShorts on 10.21.17 at 2:51 am
So for years you freeloaded off other taxpayers by driving on the roads the taxpayers pay for, using the school system the taxpayers pay for, the health system the taxpayers pay for etc. And finally you start to make money in the economy (the one the tax payers built up around you) and you don’t feel you should pay your share into the system? You are right in one aspect – there are parasites like you across all generations.
**********************************
Yeah, for 2 years I burned through my savings and racked up a bunch of debt so I could afford to pay my employees. While getting my company off the ground, I did use roads, sorry.
My company also paid taxes during that time, there just wasn’t enough left to pay myself.

I also worked and paid taxes for decade before going out on my own starting when I was 16. How about everyone who goes to university and doesn’t work or pay taxes during those years? Are they all parasites?

Viewing successful people as parasites instead of role models is why people like you will fail at life.

30s M AB

#39 conan on 10.21.17 at 6:37 pm

#16 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 5:27 pm

“ANTIFA shows up at an anti T2 rally”

They are doing the World a favor. I am not surprised at the number of pin heads who think fascists are just misunderstood.

#40 Trawna on 10.21.17 at 6:49 pm

I, for one, welcome our new sexbot underlords.

#41 For those about to flop... on 10.21.17 at 6:50 pm

Crowdie 21.17 at 6:16 pm
@#18 For those about to Flop.

I was a tad mystified as to why you were included in that list and I was also surprised I wasnt……

Keep up the pink pumpkin parade.

///////////////////////////

Thanks Crowdie,you have thanked me for trying to bring a bit of clarity to the market before and the 20 or 30 people that have thanked me and continue to slip the odd address provide some fuel for the fire.

I understand posting in bunches can annoy people but I have to do it before I file it away and while I have time.
I try to provide real time transactions win,lose or draw to show people what is going on.

I spent and hour last night going through 200 listings and the only one that came up as sold I put up in a post and asked for a realtor to provide the sales price.

I was given the cold shoulder but then no one can say I didn’t give them a chance to show a win for the seller.

I have apologized to the boss of this blog and Ryan and Doug that I am not trying to get in anyone’s way or disrupt their efforts as well.

If I wasn’t finding anyone in trouble I would have nothing to report.

Todays post at Condor Pl could easily lose 250k and that was only the fifth house I looked at about 2 minutes after asking my wife to hold my beer.

While I am writing the people might as well look at the history of this one particularly on the assessment.

The last person that bought it for 1.01m was only able to get 1.07 out of it so I guess I will call it a CONFIRMED PINK DRAW but that hasn’t stopped the next guy from trying to get over half a million in quick profit and all they seem worried about is what could be done with the land and didn’t bother to improve it despite the last guy perhaps taking a small loss.

Maybe they have a better agent…

M43BC

20525 46a Avenue, Langley

Oct 5:$1,750,000
Oct 19: $1,695,000
Change: – 55000.00 -3%

https://www.zolo.ca/langley-real-estate/20525-46a-avenue

https://evaluebc.bcassessment.ca/Property.aspx?_oa=QTAwMDBGNDQzMw==

#42 ben on 10.21.17 at 6:51 pm

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2017/09/15/facebook-follows-google-microsoft-to-montreal-with-new-ai-research-lab.html

Guess the big boys didn’t fancy Vancouver. Probably because it’s land price bubble is a disaster. Now we all have to hold off raising CAD thanks to these idiots.

#43 earthboundmisfit on 10.21.17 at 6:55 pm

Elon Musk may be many things, first and foremost, the king of government handouts. He is not, however, the new msssiah.

#44 Devore on 10.21.17 at 6:59 pm

#14 Mark

But it’s not tired and old.

Make no mistake. Processing power gains are directly translating into jobs. We’re reaching the point where sufficient compute power is here to begin replacing real adult jobs. The algorithms to support full 3d computer vision with sufficient resolution for any job are already here. We’re just waiting for the CPUs. Driving represents many jobs, but that’s just the tip of the iceberg. Any low skill/entry level job is at risk. One this begins to happen, it will happen very quickly. And with improvements in AI and decision-making, many white collar jobs are just as much at risk. We can’t all be innovators and business owners. In any case, huge corporations will be able to afford better AIs, and better AI lawyers than you and I will.

Or do you believe we’ll just spend our days mining and spending bitcoins?

#45 When Will They Raise Rates? on 10.21.17 at 7:00 pm

#32 Doghouse Dweller on 10.21.17 at 6:16 pm

You do realize balanced global portfolio advisory guys are IBM Watson`s primary target ?
Your Automated Financial Advisor Is Standing By, ready to offer clients an enhanced peerless financial planning experience.

—————-

^ This.

And just published minutes ago on ZH:

First A.I. ETF Claims It Can Replace An Army Of Research Analysts

“EquBot AI Technology with Watson has the ability to mimic an army of equity research analysts working around the clock, 365 days a year, while removing human error and bias from the process.” That is the claim of Chida Khatua, the ETF’s CEO. Unlike the existing algos used by quant funds, A.I. the ability to learn from its mistakes without further requiring programming.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-21/first-ai-etf-claims-it-can-replace-army-research-analysts

The irony. LOL

#46 Hotdogs from Heaven on 10.21.17 at 7:00 pm

#2 Bdry sktrn on 10.21.17 at 3:53 pm

Tesla . Finally time to short this bloater.
Mod3 no help. Crap numbers to come.

I’m calling a top.
————————————————-
Tesla’s technology may live on for many years in the cars of whoever eventually buys them up because the company will not.

People should do some research on Global Crossing. It was once a high tech darling that laid the cables that helped build the global internet. You may even be reading this web page over one of their lines.

The company helped change the world, but after being worth hundreds of billions it crashed and it’s stock purchased at a couple of bucks a share. Tesla’s story will be very similar.

#47 Hotdogs from Heaven on 10.21.17 at 7:02 pm

#4 Bitcoinnaire on 10.21.17 at 4:05 pm

Tesla did 65% huh?

How about 600% since September?

Because that’s what HIVE has done, listed on the TSX:V exchange as one of the first Canadian equities to give the public exposure to the explosive Cryptocurrency economy (which now has a market capitalization exceeding 100 billion) as a “qualified investment”.
—————————————————–
In that case you should check out BLOC on the TSX:V as well.

#48 Renter's Revenge! on 10.21.17 at 7:02 pm

#23 Raj on 10.21.17 at 5:58 pm
Question is not where world is going with AI, Real question as true Canadian is can I buy house using AI. That’s all I care.

Of course. AI surpassed realtor intelligence decades ago.

#49 TurnerNation on 10.21.17 at 7:05 pm

The whole world’s a stage. GM invested itself into 1 billion of Lyft and self driving car technolgy last year.

Meanwhile front man Musk soaks taxpayers money – hint FANG and the like are military funded technologies.
Google glasses are for the soldiers – pulled them away from us.
Model 3 shaping up to be a Spruce Goose.
Wonder what’s going on behind the scenes.
Nothing is left for chance.

#50 TurnerNation on 10.21.17 at 7:08 pm

Collecting comic books, fawning over chess player’s lives? ;-)
Smoking man you gotta take these guys out for fun. After 1/3rd bottle of JD someone will see the BSD I’m sure.

#51 Old gringo on 10.21.17 at 7:09 pm

Yes, imagine a world in which computers would be able to predict the outcome and success of a presidential election.
Or even a liberal defeat!
The truth is accountants, realtors , stock brokers and virtually every other computer realized professional would be toast and on the food stamp line.
Unless robots are taxed as citizens, this is a dead end street.
Yup, the Canadian Revenue meatheads would have a tough time seizing the robots cars, homes etc.
Truthfully, I love this weird stuff.
C’est la vie gringos

#52 Gentle ,Loving Kindness on 10.21.17 at 7:16 pm

China and Russia are developing AI as a national top priority. Both are probably researching Quantum Computers along with AI to own the most powerful Artificial Intelligence systems in the world, perhaps by magnitudes beyond the US could/will have. The US is building new aircraft carriers, but I believe they are already becoming obsolete. With a superior AI system, the enemy can take out a power generation station, or other targets, through the internet with no need for a plane or missile. It also is politically deniable.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-cyber-energy/u-s-warns-public-about-attacks-on-energy-industrial-firms-idUSKBN1CQ0IN

#53 For those about to flop... on 10.21.17 at 7:18 pm

Trust me on this prediction. Assuming, of course, that me is even me?-Doug.

Hey Robax,good post,something different to think about.

As far as your sign off line you could have gone with…

This blog post was written by me ,myself and AI…

M43BC

P.S no charge on the photo but I’m still looking to catch up with InFlewenza.

Pretty sure he is the reason I didn’t get the job with Turner Investments.

That and the fact that I didn’t apply.

I think Garth wants to employ me at the general store to stand on the corner so the 18 wheelers run over myself instead of his beloved parlour…

#54 Tony on 10.21.17 at 7:19 pm

Wind power, stem cells, solar cells, 3D cameras and marijuana stocks. Now AI and the same spiel from the Motely Fool about AI. Each one will leave a deep in your pocket. Think outside the box and don’t believe everything before the fact because the fact has always been the opposite each time.

#55 Johnny D on 10.21.17 at 7:19 pm

@Bitcoinnaire on 10.21.17 at 4:05 pm
Tesla did 65% huh?

How about 600% since September?

Because that’s what HIVE has done, listed on the TSX:V exchange as one of the first Canadian equities to give the public exposure to the explosive Cryptocurrency economy (which now has a market capitalization exceeding 100 billion) as a “qualified investment”.

Enjoy your dried prunes and double digit “gains” from stock picks grampa.

——————

Oh yeah, how about a 1500% return?
I went to the local casino and put my life savings into a slot machine and the return I got beats your fake money etf by a mile.
Enjoy your lame triple digit gains junior.

Moral of the story. This is an investment blog which talks about real industries and opportunities . Gambling on some pseudo-currency and getting lucky doesn’t make you smart or informed. It makes you just that… lucky.

#56 When Will They Raise Rates? on 10.21.17 at 7:33 pm

Blockchain, internet, quantum computing and AI render government obsolete. When will it be made illegal?

#57 Tony on 10.21.17 at 7:35 pm

Re: #46 Hotdogs from Heaven on 10.21.17 at 7:00 pm

Tesla will not fair as well as Global Crossing. Tesla is only an idea or a dream and dreams die broke.

#58 Harvey Burger on 10.21.17 at 7:48 pm

Whatever. Today Waze told me get off a congested highway, told me take the overpass to cross the highway, sent me back over that same overpass, and back to the highway at the same exit it told me to get off. As Garth would say, Suck and Blow.

And self-driving cars will never understand the innuendo of a nod, a head shake, a car pulled over on a narrow road to let you pass, or the myriad other complexities we rely on human intuition to make it through the day. I’m getting back into materials and commodities, the stuff people actually need to live.

#59 BillyBob on 10.21.17 at 8:05 pm

As others have expressed, AI is not “intelligence”. A more convincing replication of a human is still a replication. Algorithms, no matter how sophisticated, are still not the same as self-awareness. And if it comes to the point of machines becoming self-aware, there is far more to worry about than job losses.

But the idea that a creation can somehow be without the flaws of its creator goes against the laws of logic and entropy. Even now it’s becoming impossible to release computer code that anyone can actually understand, let alone isn’t riddled with flaws.

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/09/saving-the-world-from-code/540393/

So, yes, automation will replace many jobs. But many of the schemes being promoted are nowhere near as close to realization as their backers claim. Investors beware. Proof of concepts are one thing, the real world is another.

I’m still waiting for my flying car I was promised in the 50’s – 70 years ago. Guess we still have to figure out how to feed large swaths of the earth’s population before we get to that, hmm?

#60 BillyBob on 10.21.17 at 8:07 pm

Incidentally, the most powerful chess players are humans playing with computer augmentation. Google “Advanced Chess” or the like.

#61 Keith in Rio on 10.21.17 at 8:10 pm

Robots don’t get all moist over granite and marble fireplaces.

Robots don’t unionize.

Robots don’t get $15 an hour.

Robots don’t go on strike.

Robots also will never be replacing humans. Just ask anyone who survived on AF447.

In closing…….Elon Musk and Tesla is a scam. He’ll blowup just like Theranos did. But the paper traders need to use him a little while longer before they let him burn.

#62 AB Boxster on 10.21.17 at 8:11 pm

I don’t know.
After working in software development for most of my career it is shocking to see the junk software that is being developed today.

Bloated, inefficient, poorly documented and impossible to maintain.
Highy susceptible to hackers, with poorly implemented security.
(who needs security if its cool, right?)
The internet of things will be a massive disaster.

When people talk of how soon there will be autonomous vehicles I just point to my experiences with using the self serve cashier at the hardware store or grocery stores.

Rarely do these systems ever work as they should.

They either do not scan properly or do not work for lrge items, but mainly they just cannot figure out if you have placed anything in the bagging area.

Similarly, I had the misdventrue to use the McDonalds electronic ordering system a couple of times over the summer.
What a disaster this is.

Whereas in the past, you may have spent some time in a lineup and then waited for couple of minute while the friendly young lad or lady filled your order, now you have to spend 10 minutes waiting for the electronic order kiosk to open, as someone tries to figure out how to actually order food.

Then another 15 minutes hanging around waiting for your actual order.

If these electronic efficiencies are the future of retail, expect me to be buying a lot less.

And if companies cannot even figure out how to make these simple functions work, the chance of developing autonomous vehicles that actually work without killing thousands on a daily basis, is somewhere between zero and none.

#63 juno on 10.21.17 at 8:24 pm

Capt. Serious:

Yeah tell that to the drones the US send to do it killing-thrill on the population. It kills children, women and the old. If it human kill kill kill IT!

#64 Terry on 10.21.17 at 8:29 pm

“a visionary entrepreneur”………….Elon Musk? Seriously Doug! A con-man would be more truthful if you get right down to it and really follow where all that money is coming from! Tesla is as big a snow job as Netflix is. They just havn’t blow up in everybody’s face yet ………. just wait for it ………. it’s coming!

#65 When Will They Raise Rates? on 10.21.17 at 8:35 pm

#55 Johnny D on 10.21.17 at 7:19 pm

@Bitcoinnaire on 10.21.17 at 4:05 pm
Tesla did 65% huh?

How about 600% since September?

Because that’s what HIVE has done, listed on the TSX:V exchange as one of the first Canadian equities to give the public exposure to the explosive Cryptocurrency economy (which now has a market capitalization exceeding 100 billion) as a “qualified investment”.

Enjoy your dried prunes and double digit “gains” from stock picks grampa.

——————

Oh yeah, how about a 1500% return?
I went to the local casino and put my life savings into a slot machine and the return I got beats your fake money etf by a mile.
Enjoy your lame triple digit gains junior.

Moral of the story. This is an investment blog which talks about real industries and opportunities . Gambling on some pseudo-currency and getting lucky doesn’t make you smart or informed. It makes you just that… lucky.

———————————

No, he’s not lucky per se. As an early adopter, he likely foresaw this scenario:

https://i.imgur.com/KFIwIZU.jpg

He appears to be correct, at least for now.

#66 Mark on 10.21.17 at 8:41 pm

“The algorithms to support full 3d computer vision with sufficient resolution for any job are already here. We’re just waiting for the CPUs. Driving represents many jobs, but that’s just the tip of the iceberg. Any low skill/entry level job is at risk.”

I see you’ve drank the Kool Aid. Which is unfortunate. Low-skill/entry level jobs are actually the least at risk due to AI as those sorts of jobs are concentrated in types of tasks which cannot be easily automated. Will an AI be able to wipe a bum in a nursing home, build a house, or cook fast food? Highly doubtful. Low skilled jobs are probably the *least* at risk from AI.

Additionally, AI is inherently backwards looking. AI can’t ‘think’. It can’t envision the future. It can only look at past correlations, past events.

When “Silicon Valley”‘s promoters start exaggerating, lying, and outright running scams, its a pretty good sign that the top is near. Fortunately, just like the housing bubble, the tech bubble has left lots of great assets severely undervalued. Wise investors have an incredible number of opportunities these days.

#67 C7.R on 10.21.17 at 8:42 pm

Doug, “…GM executive who called Tesla CEO Elon Musk “full of crap”… ”

And why did GM say that to the Tesla visionary…?

Not because GM is scorning a new technological advancement it does not understand or is lagging behind in, but rather due to the insufficient technological advancement demonstrated by Tesla in light of Musk’s claims it’s vehicle are a software flash away from full [level 5] autonomous driving capability. Tesla is using only arrays of radar and cameras. GM is using cameras, radar and “lidar” as well as high definition mapping for redundancy in its Bolts. A key difference is lidar, or laser-radar. It is how autonomous cars see the world around them in 3D and those following this technology closely believe GM has a competitive lead in miniaturizing this very expensive tech.

Tesla is a Wall Street darling that has never made a profit. Yet the dinosaur and old world company GM beat Tesla to mass produce a 200+ mi electric car (while Telsa is still in production “hell” -its own words, GM built Bolt EVs in Orion, MI with relative ease), GM is arguably ahead on key autonomous tech (think Cruise, Strobe, Maven) and oh, makes about $9B a year selling gas autos that it can deploy to electrification and autonomous tech. It appears the General has awaken, I think many have forgot what it is capable of.

I am not knocking Telsa, they have cool tech. But reality sucks sometimes. They are now realizing that was the easy part, mass production with high quality, not so easy. Ask any OEM. GM has momentum right now in all the right places.

#68 Long Branch Apprentice on 10.21.17 at 8:51 pm

The sad thing about these Antifa kids is that no one ever told these kids they weren’t victims. Maybe they all lacked a strong male figure in their lives to kick some sense into them.

Either way, it’s gonna get worse before it gets better.

Will robot workers of the future have to cover their faces?

#69 mark on 10.21.17 at 9:08 pm

I suspect if you think the AI car of the future will be driver less I think that’s a pipe dream……..

No way…..

#70 Ace Goodheart on 10.21.17 at 9:10 pm

Re Tesla: three cars per day on its mass production line. $35,000 US per car sale price. 33,000 employees. They build their cars in an old GM factory building. A video showing the cars being welded seems to suggest that they cannot get a proper weld (sparks flying from the weld is not normal and suggests problems).

Three cars per day. The industry bench mark is one car per minute on a 24 hour 7 day per week plant run.

Auto industry profit margins are razor thin.

It is really hard to make money building cars. Ask Mr. Tucker. Or Delorean.

I hope you do not have money invested in Tesla or if you do I hope you get out.

There is just no conceivable way that they are getting from three cars per day to one car per minute.

They are cool, Elon is sexy and they build fun stuff.

But they are not a mass production car company.

And they will likely be bankrupt by December or early next year.

#71 When Will They Raise Rates? on 10.21.17 at 9:33 pm

#66 Mark on 10.21.17 at 8:41 pm

Will an AI be able to wipe a bum in a nursing home, build a house, or cook fast food?

—————–

I don’t know about wiping bums, but as for building houses and cooking fast food, absolutely:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUdnrtnjT5Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVjnLpeM6bs

#72 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 9:33 pm

#68 Long Branch Apprentice on 10.21.17 at 8:51 pm
The sad thing about these Antifa kids is that no one ever told these kids they weren’t victims. Maybe they all lacked a strong male figure in their lives to kick some sense into them.

Either way, it’s gonna get worse before it gets better.

Will robot workers of the future have to cover their faces?
….

Not their fault, generation after generation of teachers who’s minds have been sucked out by vampires.

Not their fault either. I’m going with David Rockefeller and the ever-present Rothschilds.

It’s used to be left vs right, what is that anyway. Someone owns your belief system. The grand prize of every despot Who’s lust for power that can never be quenched.

Today it’s Globalist vision of pure power vs Economic Nationalist resistance.

Pick a side take the ride. I vote for individualism vs Communism.

You now have the Renko secret sauce of never having to worry about making money again. Homeschool your kid and teach Antifa how to trade Forex. Steel a communist, get them over to the light.

Soros knows how to trade forex, but he’s pure devil evil. Let’s take him downplaying his game.

Life, outsmarting a competitor. It’s fun.

#73 Ace Goodheart on 10.21.17 at 9:36 pm

Oh they had a Tucker Torpedo at the Toronto International Auto Show in 2015. In the old cars section. It was the blue one. I believe number 38.

I could walk right up to it. Took lots of pictures. Could have touched it if I wanted to (but did not out of the great respect for what I was standing next to).

No crowds. No one really paying any attention to it at all.

The value of this Tucker when I saw it back in 2015 would have been somewhere between 5 and 7 million US dollars. It was by far the most valuable car in the room. It likely was worth as much as every other car in the room put together. It was easily the rarest and most valuable car at the show.

Did you manage to get a model 3 Tesla? Hold onto that puppy. Some day it will be worth something

#74 conan on 10.21.17 at 9:40 pm

#68 Long Branch Apprentice on 10.21.17 at 8:51 pm

“The sad thing about these Antifa kids is………”

You sound a lot like Smoking Man.

https://youtu.be/4ZP-nYPek3s?t=59

#75 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 9:43 pm

DELETED

#76 C7.R on 10.21.17 at 9:44 pm

#62 AB Boxster on 10.21.17 at 8:11 pm”And if companies cannot even figure out how to make these simple functions work, the chance of developing autonomous vehicles that actually work without killing thousands on a daily basis, is somewhere between zero and none.”

Sorry AB, but its happening already. GM’s Cruise unit is testing a fleet of Chevy Bolt AVs in San Fran right now, on a daily basis. The city is relative crazy, narrow street, lots of people, construction and hills. The biggest problem so far… other drivers breaking the rules. Once they have San Fran down, cruising country roads or the quiet ‘burbs will be piece of cake.

I think most of us will still drive our own cars in next 5-10 years. The future of ride sharing and taxi fleets will become autonomous.

#77 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 9:46 pm

AI is total bullshit. Just waiting for a UN-funded robot to say, MAN-MADE CLIMATE CHANGE IS REAL.

I hope so, 80 degrees in Burlington today. Loving this.

#78 Oakville Rocks! on 10.21.17 at 9:47 pm

I always look forward to Saturdays when GT turns over the blog to one of his henchman / stable boys. Great post as usual Doug.

Let’s be clear, Amazon’s product recommendation system is absolutely a branch of AI. All forms of “deep learning” used by Google, NetFlix, Facebook, PornHub etc etc are forms of AI. If you are interested in this I suggest looking up the work of Kevin Kelly (The Inevitable: Understanding the 12 Technological Forces That Will Shape Our Future ). He presents a much more hopeful and credible description of the future than some of the nonsense suggested above in the comments.

Keep up the great work Doug and Ryan!.

#79 Nonplused on 10.21.17 at 9:50 pm

Buy the damn machines!

This is far more worrying:

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/05/where-have-all-insects-gone

What’s happened? Radiation? Pesticides? Global warming? Global cooling? Trump? Weinstein? Hillary and Uranium 1? UA and the fact they can’t fly a plane on time?

There is no way to know and it seems counter intuitive. After all, the cockroaches were supposed to inherit the earth after the nuclear wars, but it seems they don’t want it anymore.

But something is up. It’s not just this but also the sea die off that is occurring. It is the seas that bring most of the life to the planet, and the lowly plants and insects that do most of the rest. The animals just eat the produce of the seas and the plants and the insects. What do we do when the insects go away? We die too.

PS Doug I don’t like your description of Apple or Jobs. All he did was steal what Blackberry had already invented, same as he stole the mouse from Xerox. All Apple does is take somebody else’s idea and add more memory. All Elon Musk is doing is taking government subsidies.

I had an interesting ride home from the airport last night in a Prius taxi. Asked the driver about it. He said it was a great commercial vehicle, travels about 600 km a week, but he would never buy one for personal use. His theory was the batteries are just too expensive unless you drive a lot. Think about your laptop. The batteries are no good after 5 years even if you have never used them it’s always been plugged in. Duracell’s now last 7 years on the shelf if you don’t use them but after that they start leaking acid.

Musk can go nowhere with his battery powered cars because he doesn’t have a battery that works over the life of a car. And he doesn’t know how to charge them short of burning coal. It’s a scam. Tesla Model 3 production problems? No, it’s a delay tactic because he knows he can’t really introduce that many electric cars onto the grid. He can hire somebody who knows how to weld. Or teach robots to weld. All the other manufacturers have this part down. Elon could sub this part out to GM and have thousands of custom designed bodies show up tomorrow for a reasonable price, same as Jeep use to use GM running gear (brakes and axles and suspension). But instead he’s pretending he can’t figure out how to weld steel. Why? He’s got no batteries. And he can’t get them either. Sure he has a Giga-factory. But he’s got no Lithium.

#80 Ronaldo on 10.21.17 at 10:11 pm

#4 Bitcoinnaire on 10.21.17 at 4:05 pm

Managed to get some at 1.70 couple weeks ago. Closed 3.01 yesterday. Part of my play money portfolio. Have a couple others that have done well so far. Reminds me a lot of the 90s tech boom at the moment. More bubbles in the making.

#81 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 10:12 pm

My 3rd Kid loves Musk, a shitty salesman at best. But he’s working with a dumb down audience who’s tied to the liberal fantasy machine of mentalness.

You invest in Tesla, you’re going down hard, but at least you will smile, years of schooling.

#82 Ronaldo on 10.21.17 at 10:13 pm

#6 Ian on 10.21.17 at 4:20 pm

Automation will be the biggest story since the development of the Internet. The effect on employment will be stunning. I think we are at the last moments of opportunity in history to have capital, or otherwise many will be on a lifetime of universal basic income.
—————————————————————-
My thoughts as well. Scary for the young people following us.

#83 Ace Goodheart on 10.21.17 at 10:18 pm

One thing I’ll always miss about this new fangled obsession with cars with sewing machine type micro engines: the sound of a V8 four barrel at idle.

There is really no sweeter noise.

Nothing that approaches that sound.

Like listening to a dragon snore.

Like standing next to the bear cave as the mother bear snoozes.

What have we done to ourselves?

Do we actually like what we have become?

#84 Mark on 10.21.17 at 10:22 pm

“Amazon’s product recommendation system is absolutely a branch of AI.”

Not really. Such systems are just the product of using a lot of computing power in distributed systems to calculate correlations between the sales of certain products. There’s no ‘artificial intelligence’ involved. Its simply brute force number crunching, of which the algorithms involved were described many decades ago, but were unfeasible to implement on such scale until the modern era of cheap computing power and easily used frameworks for distributed computing (ie: Hadoop/MapReduce).

Very similar concepts are used in finance to compute “Value at Risk” for portfolios.

The scale its done on is kinda neat but there’s nothing exactly groundbreaking in terms of algorithms involved here.

#85 SCM on 10.21.17 at 10:25 pm

IBM could devote 100% of Watson’s resources along with their top human minds, they could never develop an AI that triggers these boomers the way I can.

#86 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 10:26 pm

Gord never saw the big picture. Unfortunately, say goodbye. I’m here buddy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE2joQsWXJg

#87 Ace Goodheart on 10.21.17 at 10:29 pm

#79 nonplussed:

I like gas cars.

I would be the dude driving the 69 V8 caddy with four barrels while everyone else went hybrid.

I just like the sound.

Batteries are for flashlights.

Cars are supposed to have engines

#88 Leo Trollstoy on 10.21.17 at 10:52 pm

If your job can be automated it was dangerous or useless anyway

#89 Rita Meshlin on 10.21.17 at 10:52 pm

My prediction is technology will increase by leaps and bounds and continue to put huge political pressure on Govenrments because they move so slowly to change laws, so there could be a political revolution at some point. With AI getting so amazing, why should humans govern it? We will be inept to do so. AI will have to govern itself and that will be an interesting day.

#90 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 10:57 pm

When you can do a 26-ounce bottle of JD and three glasses of wine as a pre drinking-show. You’ve made it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrLk4vdY28Q

God, we have had words., Don’t don’t like you too much after Mark but I’ve seen the shit you have done to family members, I’m a gambler but not that brave yet.

Just know, I’ll keep my mouth shut sort of on earth, but when I get up there.

We are dancing Canadian hockey style.

Why Mark dip shit?

#91 Einsatzgruppen B Artur Nebe on 10.21.17 at 11:44 pm

We are in a simulation because when we look at atomic particles closely things get mamathefuzzy math-speaking.. The empirical formulae of this simulation cannot cope with such minute detail. Similarly when we look out into the vastness of the universe things start to get fuzzy because the simulation formulae cannot cope with the details of such distance.
Goodnight all and don’t forget to unplug the set.

#92 Nonplused on 10.21.17 at 11:55 pm

#87 Ace Goodheart

“I would be the dude driving the 69 V8 caddy with four barrels while everyone else went hybrid.

I just like the sound.”

Every Harley owner agrees, even though electric motorcycles are far more realistic than electric cars.

Anyway my point remains. Electricity is not free. And neither are batteries.

So long as we are generating the majority of our electricity from fossil fuels and nuclear (which we do, with a small contribution from hydro), electric cars are an expensive scam.

Oh sure, buddy next door has an expensive solar array on his roof, and it has reduced his electric demand. “Reduced” is the key word. Sure, he can sell some power back when conditions are ideal, but all winter and whenever his air-conditioning is running he still buys, in fact he buys much more than he sells. It’s a joke. A scam. Solar power, batteries, electric cars, all that, is just gold from sea-water.

I have solar power on my camping trailer, and it’s nice and quiet. You now what else is nice and quiet and a lot less money to run? One of these:

https://powerequipment.honda.ca/generators/EU1000i

You don’t even need a battery which you have to replace every couple of years. And there are products available that are half the price if you want to go Chinese.

#93 Nonplused on 10.22.17 at 12:04 am

Here is another example of how you have to be careful what you pay for, this time Honda screwing up:

https://powerequipment.honda.ca/snowblowers/36-inch-hybrid-i-control-es

$8900 for a 36″ snow blower you have to walk behind? You can get a Kabota 48 inch blower on a riding mower for $10,000 and it will mow the lawn too. If you want to go Club Cadet you can get it all done for $4000.
Hybrid my arse. Just put the gas where it needs to be.

#94 Nonplused on 10.22.17 at 12:27 am

#89 Rita Meshlin

The only thing we can know for certain about artificial intelligence is that it is artificial. We still haven’t found any other sort of “intelligence” on this planet, why should we think the artificial kind will suddenly be it?

Computers are good for a lot of things but they don’t think. If computers could think, even if they showed a glimmer of hope of ever thinking, the Facebook servers would have committed suicide by now. Computers cannot think and there is no more hope they ever will than assuming that one day Bill Clinton will be able to think.

#95 Victor V on 10.22.17 at 12:45 am

http://www.businessinsider.com/ai-powered-equity-etf-stock-aieq-market-robot-revolution-2017-10

The long-awaited rise of the machines is here, at least in the stock market.

A new artificial intelligence-powered exchange-traded fund launched on October 18. Called the AI Powered Equity ETF (ticker: AIEQ), it uses IBM’s Watson supercomputing technology to analyze more data than humanly possible, all in the pursuit of building the perfect portfolio of 30 to 70 stocks.

The ETF ranks investments based on their “probability of benefiting from current economic conditions, trends, and world- and company-specific events” and picks those with the best chance at outperformance, according to a recent release.

And the technology enables it to do that while constantly analyzing information for 6,000 US-listed companies. The top three positions as of Friday were CIT Group, Penumbra and Genworth Financial.

#96 TurnerNation on 10.22.17 at 1:38 am

Re. FANG’s: Happened to afterwards see this.
City by city soon Toronto. It’s them alright.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/oct/21/google-urban-cities-planning-data

“Google’s plan to revolutionise cities is a takeover in all but name”

#97 Sad on 10.22.17 at 1:59 am

#29 n1tro
With that measure, Musk is a collosal failure.

Yep, and you on the their hand, have done so much more with your life!

Oh wait, just a sad unemployed commenter.

#98 Where's The Money Guido? on 10.22.17 at 2:33 am

Re: #105 Dan.t on 10.20.17 at 8:50 pm
Hi Garth, I’m located in vancover. 2 of my neighbours have air bnb’s and brag about not paying tax on the money they are charging. Will the government go after air bnb cheaters?

—————–

Exactly my point. It is wide spread and nothing is done about it. How about everyone from BC write in and let me know if you know someone directly or indirectly not claiming rental income. No one will touch real estate in BC. NDP liars avoiding it like the plague after running and winning by promises of affordable housing. Nice.

Wide spread and open criminal activities real estate related, just get buried. Casino scandal… oh, it takes years to figure it out… meaning no one will pay, hopefully in 4 years everyone forgets and all good !

It’s not only buried in BC.
I just happened to be watching the CTV 11 pm news tonight and the only item they bring up about BC is a little rain falling. Oh my! So scaree, must be close to Halloween.
Bought and paid media across CANADA is trying to torpedo this effin fraud on all fronts.
http://theprovince.com/news/national/river-rock-bclc-meetings-in-2014-show-depth-of-concern-over-big-cash-gamblers/wcm/90089cef-bf9f-45fd-bc48-b9786a27efb8
At least the newspapers here in BC are showing a modicom of truth with Sam Cooper’s investigation that should be the story of the year!!!! He’s our hero, taking years of FOI investigations to get to the bottom of this snake pit.
Truly corrupt province that seems to ensnaring the present gov’t since they aren’t going full throttle to correct this egregious criminal display revealed to all who have half a brain…..
Why hasn’t the casino operators including an underling of Rich Coleman (Brad Desmarais, now where have I heard that last name before-a former Vancouver anti-gang cop), who is BCLC’s vice-president, had their comeuppance by turning a blind eye to this scandal by swatting a sledgehammer with a feather.
It’s so glaring that it’s hilarious.
I can’t wait to see the local news, update in half hour…

#99 Where's The Money Guido? on 10.22.17 at 2:57 am

Well CTV has come through—NOT!!!
No mention of Sam Cooper’s story. Wow, Vancouver got up to 3mms of rain an hour for 3 hours or so.
Bought and paid for……..and useless…….
But David Foster had a gala for a good cause and all reporters are there to show who showed up, even OPRAH!!!, while BC’ers wallow in real estate purgatory all produced by gov’t cover-ups and lies….
Hey, where’s Christy Clark, our venerated ex-Premier blasting out 100’s of thousands of jobs for us plebes while in office? Families first, yeah la familia more like it-Triad-wise.
Not a whimper about Sam Cooper’s latest story………..
She must be beach-side somewhere close to China since she had to take so many trips there while BC’s Premier.
Oh my, what a web Sam tries to un-weave, with no help from the RCMP. Where the eff were they these last 16 years since they pronounced they had evidence that organized crime has infiltrated the BC Legislature?
Not an effin peep, except since BC Attorney General jumped on their ass.
If that isn’t proof.
I guess I’ll be getting a call sometimes soon….
Smokey, help!!!!!
M60BC

#100 Dolce Vita on 10.22.17 at 4:18 am

AI only as good as the programmers and their algorithms.

There will always be someone with a higher IQ & more experience that will do better.

And why would they divulge their knowledge to the AI crowd when they can happily make more money?

#101 Dolce Vita on 10.22.17 at 4:23 am

Off topic.

Something amiss at Zolo.ca or Vancouver RE going nuts again, as in up. Observe the 2 Bd average selling price, yup, $4 million:

https://i.imgur.com/u7YTcSh.jpg

#102 Stan Brooks on 10.22.17 at 6:38 am

#28 Doug Rowat on 10.21.17 at 6:08 pm
#3 Stan Brooks on 10.21.17 at 3:59 pm

AI will turn us into obsolete and useless burden.

Combined with capitalism it will spell the end of our way of life.

Last place you would like to be in the decades to come is a large North American city suburb.

South American farm will be much better place.

Sarah Connor?

–Doug

—————————————-

No. Here are my sources:

1. CBC and government of Canada.

Ottawa warned about job losses that could stem from automation
Rise of machines means Canadian economy could lose between 1.5 million and 7.5 million jobs in coming years

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/job-automation-federal-government-1.4031206

2. The Canadian press and the government.

Automation Will Take 40% Of Canada’s Jobs, Liberals’ Economy Czar Warns

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/02/07/automation-dominic-barton_n_14634612.html

3. McKinsey:

https://www.canadianmanufacturing.com/operations/40-per-cent-of-canadian-jobs-could-be-lost-to-automation-mckinsey-co-chief-says-183865/

4. Canadian Business:
http://www.canadianbusiness.com/lists-and-rankings/best-jobs/canada-job-automation-risk/

————————————

I am just referencing official news outlets and government sources and stating the obvious, that:

1. Once these jobs are gone, they are gone permanently
2. The people who lose these jobs will have limited ability to consume, so this will trigger an avalanche of job losses in the service sector.
3. Government can not sponsor sufficiently fulfilling lifestyle for 50-60 % of the population, so standard of living will deteriorate significantly.
4. Big cities in Canada/GTA is not self-sustainable, not the best place to grow potatoes or tomatoes in your backyard

Conclusion: If our economic system does not change drastically (and there is no indication of such changes coming any time soon) we will be faced with pretty much Detroit type of conditions in the big North American and Canadian cities.

And investment advising for middle class Canadians Doug would not be a place you would like to be in 10-15 years from now.
As there will be no middle class left.

#103 Stan Brooks on 10.22.17 at 6:47 am

#34 cultural elitist on 10.21.17 at 6:24 pm

——————————-
Do not underestimate true AI.
1. We will lose 50-70 of jobs to automation itself.
5-10 years time frame.

2. AI will kill the remaining jobs in 10-15 years time frame.

Everything that we do, that we know, can be proceduralized and objectivised in human-like thinking form.
Perfected and then cloned/copied.

Imagine a doctors AI that combines the knowledge of top 1000 doctors of the world in neurology for example.
That can diagnose you instantly and provide the best recommendation for treatment. Clone-able at minimum cost for 1 minutes, or accessible as a service on demand.

AI + robotization will kill labour. Period.
So get a hold of some farmland while you can.

#104 Under the radar on 10.22.17 at 6:57 am

91 your handle is offensive. The EInstatzgruppen were SS paramilitary death squads responsible for mass killings during WW2.

#105 Dharma Bum on 10.22.17 at 8:01 am

I am not worried about about AI making the jobs done by most people obsolete.

However, when they come up with AS (Artificial Stupidity), THEN we gots sumpthin’ to worry about!

#106 Oft deleted much maligned stock.picker on 10.22.17 at 8:15 am

BANNED

#107 Doug Rowat on 10.22.17 at 8:54 am

#60 BillyBob on 10.21.17 at 8:07 pm

Incidentally, the most powerful chess players are humans playing with computer augmentation. Google “Advanced Chess” or the like.

True. And the more suspicious in the chess world have accused the IBM team of doing just that during the contest. Kasparov did, after all, win the first game quite easily.

–Doug

#108 Doug Rowat on 10.22.17 at 9:18 am

#79 Nonplused on 10.21.17 at 9:50 pm
Buy the damn machines

PS Doug I don’t like your description of Apple or Jobs. All he did was steal what Blackberry had already invented, same as he stole the mouse from Xerox. All Apple does is take somebody else’s idea and add more memory.

Bill Gates said it best, “I wish I had Steve’s taste”. When they asked Jobs about the lousy look of the Motorola Rockr, an early collaboration with Apple, he impatiently replied “I didn’t build it”. He, of course, had something far more elegant planned.

–Doug

#109 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.17 at 9:26 am

@# Ace Goodheart
“Oh they had a Tucker Torpedo at the Toronto International Auto Show in 2015. In the old cars section. It was the blue one. I believe number 38. ”
+++++

I was never a big fan of the Tucker……but a Kaiser…..a sporty subcompact waaaay ahead of its time.

The 1st time I ever saw one was about 30 years ago.in the mid 1980’s.
This elderly man was filling it up at a Chevron station on Georgia St in Vancouver on a sunny day.
I asked him what it was and he said ” A Kaiser! My Grandfather built them. Wanna sit in it?”
So in I hopped. Small car but the neat thing was the drivers door didnt swing open…it slid like a pocket door into the front fender……beautiful little car.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaiser_Darrin

#110 Tech bs on 10.22.17 at 9:41 am

AI, the next bs and totally unnecessary wave in tech.

#111 Tech bs on 10.22.17 at 9:44 am

What is the maximum amortization period for mortgages in Canada? 25 years? Why are ppl talking about a loophole where they can extend the period of 30 years to avoid negative impacts of ofsi changes?

#112 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.17 at 9:45 am

Re #79 nonplused:

Where have all the insects gone?

They’re all up here at my cottage.

You can have some if you like. We have far too many….

#113 albertaguy on 10.22.17 at 9:47 am

So to link AI to small business passive income – if one were to invest retained earnings into a fleet of telsa self driving cars to earn income from the tesla network..presto bingo… your employees are robots…no vacation pay, no sick time, work 24 x 7 and voila active income!

#114 Last of the Boomers on 10.22.17 at 10:17 am

Re: solving the housing crisis in Vancouver.

I understand through media reports that as they start to uncover the proceeds of crime through money laundering in b.c. Casinos they are finding that a high percentage of the money laundering indeed was done by persons identifying themselves as property developers or persons connected to and working in real estate. The cknw Jon mccomb interview on October 16 titled “underground banks and secret hand shakes in B.C.” Is a must listen to. Will they confiscate the real estate proceeds of crime and mitigate the housing crisis in Vancouver, Richmond, north shore, and Fraser valley by taking these multimillion dollar properties and using the property transfer tax windfall, Reno the properties into smaller family units to be sold to those of us that live, work and have supported our province through legitimate tax dollars for many decades?

#115 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

#103 Stan Brooks on 10.22.17 at 6:47 am
#34 cultural elitist on 10.21.17 at 6:24 pm

——————————-
Do not underestimate true AI.
1. We will lose 50-70 of jobs to automation itself.
5-10 years time frame.

2. AI will kill the remaining jobs in 10-15 years time frame.

Everything that we do, that we know, can be proceduralized and objectivised in human-like thinking form.
Perfected and then cloned/copied.

Imagine a doctors AI that combines the knowledge of top 1000 doctors of the world in neurology for example.
That can diagnose you instantly and provide the best recommendation for treatment. Clone-able at minimum cost for 1 minutes, or accessible as a service on demand.

AI + robotization will kill labour. Period.
So get a hold of some farmland while you can.

——

Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.

Why is that? Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That doesn’t sound scary to me at all. It feels like freedom.

#116 LivinLarge on 10.22.17 at 10:43 am

“Under the Radar”…agreed. I am rarely offended by anything. I can ignore, walk away or turn off so much that I don’t like wasting the energy to be offended but that handle is offensive.

#117 Smoking Man on 10.22.17 at 10:51 am

Let me get this right. You’re the minister of finance and your company gets a contract with the Govt for 8 Million .

And small business owners are evil tax Dodgers.
So much corruption on the left. Keep voting liberal idiots.

#118 For those about to flop... on 10.22.17 at 10:55 am

Dolce vita22.17 at 4:23 am
Off topic.

Something amiss at Zolo.ca or Vancouver RE going nuts again, as in up. Observe the 2 Bd average selling price, yup, $4 million:

https://i.imgur.com/u7YTcSh.jpg

///////////////////////////////

Hey Dolce,hope you’re well.

I will try and explain this anomaly for you,although I am not very good at it.

During the period selected between September 20 October 18 ,there were only 6 Two bedroom detached houses sold in Vancouver proper.

One of the houses happened to be a waterfront property in one of the most sought after blocks of land in the city.

3011 Point Grey Rd sold for 13.5m a few days ago mainly for land value as the house when I looked the other day was only valued at roughly 250k.

So this one house out of the six selling for 13.5m was most likely the culprit in the short term anomaly.

I actually mentioned this house in a post the other day because it was one of the larger sales I had seen in a while and also pointed out that not far away from that house is my biggest Pink Pumpkin at the moment at 3241 Point Grey Rd.
I will be first to admit sometimes I come across as a blithering idiot with my all too relaxed writing style and my failure to bother to correct obvious grammatical errors ,but if you dig a little deeper you will see I try to get the facts and figures right in my posts and the rest is just theatre…

M43BC

3241 Point Grey Rd. Paid 15.5 asking 17.8

https://evaluebc.bcassessment.ca/Property.aspx?_oa=QTAwMDAwMDVFUw==

https://www.zolo.ca/vancouver-real-estate/3241-point-grey-road

#119 conan on 10.22.17 at 10:56 am

#113 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

“Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.”

They should be, do not get side tracked by that hamburger flipper robot. AI is going after “white collar” jobs in a big way.

A plumber could probably be replaced by an 80 million dollar robot.

A pharmacist by a $3000 dollar lock box that dispenses drugs.

A basic advice investment firm with a software program that works out to 17 cents a client.

Are you getting it?

#120 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.17 at 11:06 am

@#113 alberta guy
“if one were to invest retained earnings into a fleet of telsa self driving cars to earn income from the tesla network..presto bingo… ”

++++

Tesla wont allow it.
When you buy the car you sign away any rights to “uber” your car.
Tesla wants the self driving “taxi”market all to its self

Just so long as you dont end up with an AI driver like THIS

https://www.google.ca/url?url=https://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DxGi6j2VrL0o&rct=j&frm=1&q=&esrc=s&sa=U&ved=0ahUKEwigtqzIwITXAhUD22MKHcb5CoMQyCkIGTAA&usg=AOvVaw10W78ooNHPUmPu8avg3qJB

You’ll get to vacation on Mars and drink Mai Tai’s with Musk

#121 AB Boxster on 10.22.17 at 11:16 am

#115 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.

Why is that? Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That doesn’t sound scary to me at all. It feels like freedom.

———————————-

Not hardly.
People with jobs, meaningful or otherwise, tend to be focused on their own issues of life and earning a living.

People without real jobs, such as philosophy and gender studies professors, and Govt of Canada Treasury analysts, spend their time trying to figure out how to make you behave according to ‘their’ vision of their utopian world.

Their self actualization just becomes another stupid social or tax policy that impacts your life and makes your life more miserable.

Socialism and communism are just pretexts for someone’s self-actualization, applied to your life.

#122 Pete on 10.22.17 at 11:20 am

Smokingman #117

I hope you don’t think the corporate CONservatives who are anti middle class and anti workers are any better? Libs and Cons have got to go.

#123 Shawn on 10.22.17 at 11:22 am

It’s funny how AI and technology in general is constantly referred to as a job destroyer. Meanwhile we’re at ATHs on the Nasdaq and almost experiencing a labour shortage in the US (record low unemployment, upward wage pressure).

#124 conan on 10.22.17 at 11:25 am

#117 Smoking Man on 10.22.17 at 10:51 am

“You’re the minister of finance and your company gets a contract with the Govt for 8 Million .”

The Finance Minister is a pension expert from private industry. His company competes in an open and transparent financial services market. This is Canada, not Zimbabwe. Who do you want them to select as Finance Minister during a world wide pension crisis?

“Keep voting liberal idiots.”

LOL, the Conservatives are not coming back anytime soon.

#125 cultural elitist on 10.22.17 at 11:26 am

@#94- Nonplused
… If computers could think, even if they showed a glimmer of hope of ever thinking, the Facebook servers would have committed suicide by now.

Lol. Thanks for that. Your comment pleases me :-)

And it makes an important point: humans aren’t linear thinkers. Actually procedural thinking is a astonishingly small percentage of the thinking that humans do. It’s important not to confuse what computers do with what humans do – even though they both use the term “intelligence”. It’s not the same thing at all.

@115 Stone
Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That’s a nice utopian idea you have there. But as long as capital is the driving force behind the innovations, the masses are much more likely to starve than to thrive. Oh, I’m sure that they will try to sell it as “meeting human needs” or some such tripe, but that will be peripheral to profit maximization.

Sorry I’m so cynical – wish I wasn’t.

#126 correct on 10.22.17 at 11:39 am

Do not underestimate true AI.
1. We will lose 50-70 of jobs to automation itself.
5-10 years time frame.

2. AI will kill the remaining jobs in 10-15 years time frame.

Everything that we do, that we know, can be proceduralized and objectivised in human-like thinking form.
Perfected and then cloned/copied.

Imagine a doctors AI that combines the knowledge of top 1000 doctors of the world in neurology for example.
That can diagnose you instantly and provide the best recommendation for treatment. Clone-able at minimum cost for 1 minutes, or accessible as a service on demand.

AI + robotization will kill labour. Period.
So get a hold of some farmland while you can.

…………

farmland, lol. Go for it.

IA is already in medicine and will continue to expand. There is no comparison with the accuracy of surgery between man vs computer.

same with finances. Money managers often have a ‘favorite’ metric. The computer will not have this bias. The computer will not have an investing personality bias such as a ‘preserver’. EVERYONE has an investing personality- most are not cognizant of it.

#127 fred on 10.22.17 at 11:42 am

A basic advice investment firm with a software program that works out to 17 cents a client.

………

yup. And free of bias too. Just the other day a money manager was talking about his ‘favorite metric’. He MANAGES other peoples money

:)

#128 Deplorable Dude on 10.22.17 at 11:47 am

Laugh at Elon Musk detractors….said he’d never land a rocket and resuse it…SpaceX has now landed 18 rockets after being in Orbit, and has reflown 3 of them. He’s revolutionary.

#129 Dissident on 10.22.17 at 11:57 am

What a coincidence. I was just reading these articles on how Washington wants to try regulate the tech giants of silicon valley. (Second tech bubble pop??) They are starting to have more power than Wall Street, and they are sewing political discord in their spirit of ‘disruption’. Steve Bannon wants to see them viewed as ‘utilities’. There might be a paradigm shift on the horizon…

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/12/conservatives-liberals-silicon-valley-242631

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/sep/03/silicon-valley-politics-lobbying-washington

#130 Stan Brooks on 10.22.17 at 12:02 pm

#115 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.

Why is that? Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That doesn’t sound scary to me at all. It feels like freedom.

—————————-

If you believe that somebody will sponsor your lifestyle and let you consume without working, with the resource shortage that is developing on this planet, you are delusional.

Try living in GTA with no income today.

And where is that income/production going to come from to subsidize your lifestyle in the future?
From taxes with no taxpayers left?
Or the capitalists will just produce for you free of charge?

As I said, we could become useless burden that has to be controlled somehow. Scary.

#131 Dissident on 10.22.17 at 12:04 pm

#115 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.

Why is that? Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That doesn’t sound scary to me at all. It feels like freedom.

– – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –

Unless you consider that self actualization comes through “doing” things like labor. This is what builds human character, creates a sense of accomplishment and an appreciation of the struggle to survive.

Humans are slowly becoming obsolete – I cannot think of a more spiritually bankrupt situation. Especially if most people’s “self actualization” involves having more free time to stare at their laptop or phone 24/7 instead of actually doing things…you know, stuff that we did before the internet.

#132 tomohawk52 on 10.22.17 at 12:16 pm

Centaurs (human/computer teams) are indeed stronger than either solo humans or solo computers, but I would estimate the amount of input by even a 2700+ GM (Grandmaster) teamed up with say Komodo (or other strong program) would be less than 10%. In a decade that will be less than 5%.

#133 crowdedelevatorfartz on 10.22.17 at 12:16 pm

@#115 Stoned
“Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?”
+++++

Well.
Until robot “labour” is taxed like human labour…..who will pay for our “basic needs” and “self actualizational navel gazing”?
Our exploding National debt?

Personally.
I’m not worried.
Jobs that require on site Trades work/repairs…. for the most part. Safe.

Jobs that require Driving, Flying, Manufacturing, Accounting, engineering, Medical diagnostics, etc… where a machine or a software program can sit and perform work……not so safe……

Its when machines can wage war a la “Skynet” autonomously……… very not so safe……
Even owning farmland wont help.

AI will gut a swathe of jobs and create others.
Polluted Mega city ghettos of the 22nd century where recycling everything ( Soylent Green?) is the major industry……..mountains of recycled plastic ….. our “gift” to millenials……..

#134 LivinLarge on 10.22.17 at 12:34 pm

“Why are ppl talking about a loophole where they can extend the period of 30 years to avoid negative impacts of ofsi changes?” because the vast majority of people are sheep, frightened by their own shadows.

B20 will have consequences, every action ever taken by any government has consequences…there’s no other reason for any government to take anynaction.

B20 is nothing more than the government telling buyers to buy houses they can afford in the future.

B20 will likely change the RE market for 1st time buyers the most. More vendor take backs, more developers holding the paper in order to sell their new properties and likely even a reverting to the old practice of private mortgages and the brokers will have to be all over that development.

Another and maybe even unitended consequence of B20 could be fewer people cashing out their tax free homes and rolling everything into balanced, tax efficient ETF portfolios. I don’t know to certainty but I sure the government, any government, realy don’t want to lose that revenue stream every year,

#135 Damifino on 10.22.17 at 12:37 pm

#115 Stone

Imagine a doctors AI that combines the knowledge of top 1000 doctors of the world in neurology for example. That can diagnose you instantly and provide the best recommendation for treatment.
—————————–

Have you thought this through?

The machines are miraculous because they’ve harvested knowledge of the top 1000 neurology experts. Where will the next batch of experts come from?

Will the machines take it upon themselves to further the quest for increased knowledge? Or, will they be only as good as the state of the art at the time humans were made obsolete?

#136 oncebittwiceshy on 10.22.17 at 12:47 pm

Tech bs on 10.22.17 at 9:44 am
What is the maximum amortization period for mortgages in Canada? 25 years? Why are ppl talking about a loophole where they can extend the period of 30 years to avoid negative impacts of ofsi changes?
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Only because they're ignorant of the B20 legislation. Presumably they think that they can choose a longer amortization to make payments more affordable …. lolol.

They fail to understand that the B20 legislation is a qualifier and that they won't have any payments to make because they couldn't qualify for a super mortgage.

#137 Stan Brooks on 10.22.17 at 1:11 pm

#134 Damifino on 10.22.17 at 12:37 pm
#115 Stone

Imagine a doctors AI that combines the knowledge of top 1000 doctors of the world in neurology for example. That can diagnose you instantly and provide the best recommendation for treatment.
—————————–

Have you thought this through?

The machines are miraculous because they’ve harvested knowledge of the top 1000 neurology experts. Where will the next batch of experts come from?

Will the machines take it upon themselves to further the quest for increased knowledge? Or, will they be only as good as the state of the art at the time humans were made obsolete?

————————–

Self learning from real cases?

Combining practical knowledge from thousands of such super AI instances?

———————————-

I agree, humans are obsolete without labour.

Automation and AI already spells the end of the world that we know, we just can not see it yet.

And replacement for a plumber won’t be an 80 million dollars machine, more like 100 k initially, then 10 k.

#138 Renter's Revenge! on 10.22.17 at 1:28 pm

#115 Stone on 10.22.17 at 10:28 am

Everyone appears to be horrified by the elimination of labour.

Why is that? Isn’t it possible that with the elimination of labour and that our basic needs are met, that we may actually be able to focus on self actualization instead?

That doesn’t sound scary to me at all. It feels like freedom.

=====================

Not everyone is horrified at progress:

https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/economics/keynes/1930/our-grandchildren.htm

“And I believe in the future
We shall suffer no more
Maybe not in my lifetime
But in yours, I feel sure”

http://www.paulsimon.com/en-ca/track/the-cool-cool-river-3/

#139 TurnerNation on 10.22.17 at 1:44 pm

Erm the Orange Guys Shorts bank hiked cost of their 5 year fixed mortgage borrowing 25% in last few months.

From 2.49 to 3.14%!! It has begun.

#140 TurnerNation on 10.22.17 at 1:46 pm

Wait wait I made a typo. It still is 25%:
From 2.59% to 3.24% .

#141 RBC on 10.22.17 at 1:57 pm

Big 5 have instructed their legions to move their 15-20% of customers to 30 and 35 yr mortgages who may not qualify after the OSFI changes.

That way, no change in buying power and bank profits increase.

Win?-Win

Utter fiction. — Garth

#142 TurnerNation on 10.22.17 at 2:00 pm

#127 Deplorable Dude you think the world’s militaries will tolerate ignore random rockets flying around their space and overhead? Or when they go astray.
And electronic signatures may be spoofed. Incoming…

No their all are military.
Look up Von Bruan…would not be surprised if Musk is his family.

#143 Fake News Again on 10.22.17 at 2:04 pm

#39 conan on 10.21.17 at 6:37 pm
#16 Smoking Man on 10.21.17 at 5:27 pm

“ANTIFA shows up at an anti T2 rally”

They are doing the World a favor. I am not surprised at the number of pin heads who think fascists are just misunderstood.
___________________

the Globalists have CHANGED the definition of Fascism in order to pursue their agenda. You will notice GOOG-LAG changed it to anyone who “Supports Trump”. The REAL definition is pretty much what Canada is…..an Autocracy:

Definition of fascism

1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

today i noticed that it completely changed to a different unsourced definition:

Googles:

fas·cism
ˈfaSHˌizəm/
noun
an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
synonyms: authoritarianism, totalitarianism, dictatorship, despotism, autocracy; More
(in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice.

#144 For those about to flop... on 10.22.17 at 2:10 pm

CONFIRMED PINK SNOW

This is the one Whipster helped me with the other day and it is already confirmed.

The details…

5255 4 AVE DELTA .

Paid 1.15 June 2016

Sold 1.17 September 2017

So as Whipster noted they got more than they paid but it wasn’t enough and so if you factor in opportunity costs it probably equals a 70k loss…

M43BC

https://evaluebc.bcassessment.ca/Property.aspx?_oa=QTAwMDA1Vk03SA==

#145 BS on 10.22.17 at 2:22 pm

Automation and AI generally replace low skill and lower paid jobs with higher skill and higher paid jobs. Then things are more efficient which increases everyones standard of living and lowers costs. No different from replacing low skill labourers digging holes in the ground with a tractor and manufacturers of the tractors. Or replacing a horse and buggy with a car and all the things that support cars.

#146 Balmuto on 10.22.17 at 2:42 pm

All these Elon-haters just make me want to add to my Tesla position. You guys seriously think he won’t be able to get over this little welding issue? Lol. And all the talk about how market share of Tesla is insignificant and stock is overvalued – reminds me of when the iPhone started out, its market share was tiny compared to Nokia and the stock appeared to way overvalued. Where’s Nokia now? And where’s Apple? If the car majors don’t adapt quickly enough to the changes taking place in their business, they will go the way of Nokia as well (and Blackberry, etc.).

#147 Balmuto on 10.22.17 at 2:46 pm

Oh, and the talk about how we’ll miss the sound and feel of combustion engines – sounds a lot like the “you can’t beat a physical keyboard on a phone” argument. Heard that one bandied about quite a bit until everyone realized what an anachronism that was.

#148 jess on 10.22.17 at 2:56 pm

new job title: futurist ?
machine bias Investigating Algorithmic Injustice
https://www.propublica.org/article/federal-judge-unseals-new-york-crime-labs-software-for-analyzing-dna-evidence

“Caproni’s ruling comes amid increased complaints by scientists and lawyers that flaws in the now-discontinued software program may have sent innocent people to prison. Similar legal fights for access to proprietary DNA analysis software are ongoing elsewhere in the U.S.”

=========
from the math babe : human profiling

That’s the point I made in a recent conversation with Kosinski, who is also known for creating the “magic sauce” psycho-profiling algorithm that Cambridge Analytica later adapted to campaign for both Brexit and Donald Trump…

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-09-25/-gaydar-shows-how-creepy-algorithms-can-get

======

The typical profile there is an “übersmart twentysomething” curious to see whether microdosing will help him or her work through technical problems and become more innovative. “It’s an extremely healthy alternative to Adderall,” says Fadiman, referring to a drug popular with programmers.

http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/how-lsd-microdosing-became-the-hot-new-business-trip-20151120

#149 VanIsleStyle on 10.22.17 at 3:18 pm

#136 Stan Brooks you obviously don’t work in trades. No robot will ever compete with the work of technical trades, which includes plumbing. You’ve been watching too much Star Trek. Plumbers don’t receive any credit… they’re pretty much on par with janitors. Plumbing service work involves a constant barrage of headaches and problem solving that most other professions don’t even come close to comparing to. I know… I do some occasional plumbing work since I’m a commercial hvac tech which is also a profession that robots will never replace. What I do see in the future is a burgeoning field for working on automated equipment that will need constant maintenance and repairs. Any tech will tell you the more advanced and expensive the equipment it is, the more it breaks.

#150 Russ on 10.22.17 at 3:26 pm

Fake News Again on 10.22.17 at 2:04 pm

the Globalists have CHANGED the definition of Fascism in order to pursue their agenda.

(old) Definition of fascism

1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

today i noticed that it completely changed to a different unsourced definition:

Googles:
etc.
=========================

When I read the “old” definition of fascism, I immediately thought, “That is Canada.”

Our democracy is where we simply get to choose the next dictator.

Anyone remember Wayne from back east?

#151 Random Milliennial on 10.22.17 at 3:27 pm

Just want to point out that AI can be programmed not to harm humans-in fact it will never do anything it is not programmed to do. The only way it will cause harm is in the hands of a bad person programming it. Once again-the enemy is only ourselves. And much like any tech we’ve seen before from smart phones to nuclear technology it’s only as good or evil as the humans operating it.

#152 westcdn on 10.22.17 at 3:59 pm

The thing I find about intelligence is the ability to learn from your mistakes. Yep, we generally like to go with what works and fight change that challenges the status quo. Nobody likes uncertainty, particularly when it could be bad. I certainty don’t want to die over a bad decision.

I am sure a computer can evaluate mistakes and reduce future occurrences based on history. People also make decisions based on experience (history). Game changers that can blindside you are rare but real.

AI is primitive now but what if computer systems start to share experience from mistakes and what works through a distributed network. Hopefully we can keep computers as useful idiots. Currently, I think robots are machines – not AI.

#153 Lost...but not leased on 10.22.17 at 4:06 pm

So…what does the future hold ?

There was an old Twilight Zone episode whereby a company hired an efficiency expert who began to replace employees with machines.

He got down to the last employee who gave him a warning..

Spoiler Alert…in the end, the efficiency expert was replaced by a machine.

There comes a point where efficiency will challenge the very need and/or existence of humans.

One can envision that we enter an era of attrition of the” last multinational corporation standing”

. Ie…could all the auto makers amalgamate into a single global corporation that perhaps produces 10 vehicles models….. PERIOD .

So…then what do we have ?

As I have alluded to many times…COMMUNISM…via the back door.

#154 Smoking Man on 10.22.17 at 4:11 pm

#124 conan on 10.22.17 at 11:25 am
#117 Smoking Man on 10.22.17 at 10:51 am

“You’re the minister of finance and your company gets a contract with the Govt for 8 Million .”

The Finance Minister is a pension expert from private industry. His company competes in an open and transparent financial services market. This is Canada, not Zimbabwe. Who do you want them to select as Finance Minister during a world wide pension crisis?

“Keep voting liberal idiots.”

LOL, the Conservatives are not coming back anytime soon.
……

Girly boy will be a one term wonder. Human nature people elect leaders that make them feel safe. Unless your a trans person the next years this economy going down the toilet right after Nafta gets groomed.

#155 Lost...but not leased on 10.22.17 at 4:16 pm

#147 jess..

Regardless of software….Lots of forensic science(fingerprints, blood splatters, eye witness… etc.) is junk science….GOOGLE or YOUTUBE it.More and more parties are challenging these “old givens”.

The Justice industry is not interested in Justice per se, it simply wants to close a case asap…if innocent people go to jail…to them its cost of doing business.

#156 Ace Goodheart on 10.22.17 at 11:03 pm

#145 Balmuto on 10.22.17 at 2:42 pm:

“If the car majors don’t adapt quickly enough to the changes taking place in their business, they will go the way of Nokia as well (and Blackberry, etc.).”

Maybe… but it might not happen quickly enough for Elon and Tesla. His cash burn right now must be something awful. And if he doesn’t start making money soon he is going to start triggering debt covenants.

Tesla is basically composed of an old GM factory, three product lines (one of which doesn’t work very well – and it’s the most important one), and a bunch of money losing fringe businesses.

All that is held together by a heck of a lot of stock and debt.

If things fall apart at Tesla, they will fall apart quickly.

All I can say is they better start building cars. A lot of cars…..

#157 westcdn on 10.23.17 at 1:25 am

I complain about luck. It has never been easy for me. Yet things happen to keep me going. Somebody mentioned Global Crossing going to zero and it reminds of a personal story where good luck was the master.

I bought into Imperial Plastic, a small Edmonton company that supplied Global Crossing with fiber optic cable during the dot com boom. I didn’t recognize at the time that Global Crossing was really their only customer. So when Global Crossing went down, Imperial Plastic was looking at bankruptcy.

Management looked for an alternative market to survive and decided to make plastic plumbing pipes. The product was lousy and the company finally declared bankruptcy and shut down.

A few months later, a Greek billionaire bought the company to make plastic hosing for the automotive industry. I don’t know what he saw but he cleared the company of debts. Imperial Plastic had large tax pools of losses at the time. Before the company could begin producing the new product line, the former management team refused to honor the agreement, from my point of view, to extort more money. The Greek took his loss and walked.

The company assets were sold in bankruptcy and it went dormant. I kept my shares. So now we have a company with no assets except tax pool losses. A startup bought the company and purchased a gold operation. So now we go through an IPO. I don’t know how they were able to use the tax pools but the new management knew their gold business. The new company is now known as New Gold Inc.

Talk about going from zero to hero and I made money. I still hold the shares – one of my favourites.

Just playing around…

#158 Overheardyou on 10.23.17 at 2:48 pm

While I haven’t read all the comments, I read quite a few and one thing I noticed that’s missing among them is trust. People don’t trust people. What makes you think they will trust machines? Furthermore, even if level 5 autonomous vehicles are build what makes you think people will use the features? I mean, cars have come a long way in terms of safety and features but whether people use them is another story. i.e. parking sensors. I have a feeling this may turn out to be just another over hyped field. Like how electric vehicles were supposed to take over the fossil fuel industry. Furthermore, I recall reading an article a few months back that did a study on how people feel embarrassed talking to machines when they’re not alone. You know what’s really scary? People are sheep. They don’t think about security enough. Why do you think identity theft is a thriving industry? Next up, your ‘smart’ home gets hacked. Just watch.

#159 sugar daddy on 10.24.17 at 3:16 am

Huh, interesting post. I was just watching terminator rise of the machines before I read this. Weird or what?