If you didn’t have to pay your property taxes, would you?
Nah. Didn’t think so. Neither do more than six thousand families living in Vancouver who’ve decided to take advantage of a plan cooked up by the myopic muppets that voters choose as leaders. Astonishingly, citizens over the age of 55 can elect to not pay their taxes, instead just handing over interest on the outstanding amount – at the rate of 0.7%. Ahem. Yes. That’s less than 1%.
So why would you pay $6,000 a year when instead you can pay $42, deferring the entire amount until you sell your house for a windfall profit to a greater fool? In fact this pogey-for-geezers program was even extended to families of all ages in 2010. So long as they can find 2.7% interest ($162 on a six grand bill), no tax.
This is not a new thing. But the explosive use of the program is – up 500% in the last decade. Yes, during the greatest bubble in Canadian history, when 90% of the homeowning population of Vancouver became paper millionaires. And it also comes (as we told you yesterday) when the province has decided to send tax rebate cheques to everyone living in a house worth less than $1.6 million. That’s the new BC poverty line.
The two plans together will cost taxpayers about a quarter billion dollars, which makes the kids go crazy. “It seems counterintuitive because the very group that reaps the most benefit from the escalation of home values are those who have been in the housing market for longer and very often it is those who are 55 or older,” says the dude in charge of Generation Squeeze, being weirdly polite.
Well, remember that revolution I spoke of yesterday? Bay Street may be beating you to it.
Analysts Jason Bilodeau and David Doyle (Macquarie Capital) are calling out one major bank and two serious mortgage lenders because real estate is headed for a wall. The downgrades involve CIBC, Home Capital and Genworth – major players in the residential mortgage business that Macquarie thinks will be whacked as housing loses a potential 30% of its value. Investors are being warned to trim their exposure to these giants – while everyone’s being cautioned about the economic ripples that would ensue.
You know why. Households are leveraged up the wazoo. Mortgage debt is epic. Wages are flat. And real estate now accounts for way too much of the overall economy. Warns Macquarie: “Many key metrics are at or above levels seen in the U.S. prior to its most recent housing crisis and are growing worse.” And add in the Moister Street Test, new restrictions on loans to the self-employed and landlords plus the coming premiums lenders will have to pay to insure the loans they make, and the whole sector looks unsustainable. Plus, interest rates are going up. Maybe way faster than most people expect.
About half the loans Home Capital now has on the books would not qualify to be made under the new rules. Genworth’s business is mostly high-ratio, high-risk stuff. And the Bank of Commerce has more domestic exposure than most other banks, who enjoy a big revenue stream from foreign ops.
“If a housing correction unfolds, we believe that there is likely to be material downside to the current operating outlook for domestic lenders,” Macquarie says in its report. “A true correction in Canadian housing activity would likely have material negative implications for economic activity and employment, mortgage industry loan growth and consumer credit performance.”
There’s more.
News agency Reuters blew the whistle this week on bundled loans – which are right up there with the Bank of Mom in getting around federal mortgage-tightening guidelines. The net result is to lever people into houses who actually (according to the rules) can’t afford them.
With a bundled loan, borrowers combine funds coming from a subprime lender (there are lots of them around, and growing) with more cash emanating from a Mortgage Investment Corporation, which is unregulated. It allows buyers to have down payments of only 10% and still avoid having to obtain (or qualify for) mortgage insurance.
By the way, the share of the entire $1.6 trillion mortgage market now occupied by unregulated, subprime lenders has doubled (to almost 13%) in the past 10 years – just as real estate values and household debt have exploded. Says housing bear economist David Madani, “This is what happens at the late stage of a housing bubble — the quality of lending goes down.” Along with parental lending, these shadowy bundled loans are a growing way young buyers are skating around stricter lending standards, plus loan-to-value rules.
So what?
So, if and when a housing correction sweeps over us, more and more people will be in personal financial trouble. More lenders will feel it. More economic damage will occur. And the more you’ll wish (a) you never pushed your poor daughter to buy that condo and (b) that you’d sold the house for big bucks last year, rented for a while, then vultched like a vicious Viking.
195 comments ↓
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I was working on a huge new build out near UBC a couple of years ago.
There was a lot of guys working there and therefore a lot of vehicles.
The realtor from the house next door ,which she was trying to sell ,cited our trucks and vans out front as a reason for poor showings and no offers.
I told her perhaps it was the fact that she was trying to get 7.5 million for a 1954 knockdown rancher.
Never did speak to me again…
M42BC
I asked people in BC why they don’t cash in their shoe box bungalow for 1.5 million and live like a king in a rental somewhere else… they say that unless you live here.. you wouldn’t understand.”
They’re right. I don’t understand and I don’t understand why the Province subsidizes their net worth with tax deferral and tax credits.
Bubble Bubble Toil and Trouble
I anticipate a Credit Union in the GTA will be going down the tubes when she blows and its a big one.
It’s coming… very very soon, Folks, Be prepare!!
Looks like it’s time to watch the Big Short again or may be even bring it back to the screens at some Cineplex theatres across the GTA for a short while…
I’m baffled. If fewer people are paying property taxes, then where does Vancouver get money to provide city services? Is the provincial government paying the difference to the municipalities?
Christy Clark lost her own Vancouver riding but somehow is still the premier. Some democracy.
Trump scares the crap out of me. I see him, and his moronic opaque “Leadership Style” as the biggest threat to the markets. Who cares if you are in bonds or equities if the world economies are seizing up due to knee jerk conflicting “140 character policy diplomacy” from a guy who acts like a 5 year old boy ,with ADHD on a sugar high.
Your alliterative powers are brilliant – “vultched like a vicious Viking.”
There, that is my suck- holing done for the day.
Garth, policies like this make me seriously consider voting for the BC NDP in May. Please help.
May I add the coming tsunami of bankrupt property owners will indeed be stunning and a prime opportunity for the financially competent.
Feeling sorry for myself. Landlord just booted us out after years of being good tenants. People look at us with such sympathy, thinking we just cannot afford to buy our own property. Fact is we can pay cash, but prefer to rent while waiting for a realistic buying price.
Funny that the ones who look down at us for being renters, cannot even afford to maintain the expensive, overpriced homes they inhabit. Worse, they’ll probably bid those homes bon voyage when interest rates rise, as they are mortgaged to the max!
“There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth” coming soon to a theatre near you.
Warren Buffett quote
“You need to divorce your mind from the crowd. The herd mentality causes all these IQ’s to become paralyzed. I don’t think investors are now acting more intelligently, despite the intelligence. Smart doesn’t always equal rational. To be a successful investor you must divorce yourself from the fears and greed of the people around you, although it is almost impossible.”
I don’t think this housing situation will end well. It’s happened everywhere else. Why are we so special.
I received my Alberta carbon tax rebate in the mail today, of $100. Problem is, the carbon tax will increase my natural gas heating bill this year by at least $200, depending on how cold the winters are. Carbon tax is $1.011 per gigajoule. Last year my house used 200 gigajoules for one of the mildest winters in Calgary’s history.
It is a 1956 bungalow, but at least I paid it off in 1997. Many huge infills in Cowtown with big natural gas bills and over-mortgaged Millennials. They’ll have to eat a lot of Kraft Dinner.
Gasoline up 15 cents a litre. Calgary Transit is not exempt, so they’ll be jacking up fares. Everything you eat, wear, or possess was delivered by truck, so the increased freight rates will add to inflation. The Dippers have no understanding of real-world economics.
Excuse me if Ive heard this before.
A story not included nwas that a mortgage expert said not to worry because jobs are what matter, not interest rates and the last jobs report was rosy.
Either way another month with little change. When is the next important date to watch? Next predicted Fed increase?
Almost sold 15 months ago – thank god I didnt :)
I cannot understand why young people, heck even old people, would leverage themselves up to their eyeballs for some cruddy house that took 3 months to build. A life time of debt salvery to the banks, with zero mobility? It’s crazy, I thought these young Millenials were all about freedom, but I guess I was wrong. Why more people have not just opted out of selling their futures for some slanty semi or mass produced cookie cuter house is beyond me. People need to wake up, the rooster always comes home to roost. Sure we may not know the exact day, but he will come home to roost. The older I get, the more I just don’t understand people anymore. I guess they no longer teach common sense in school.
We back tested all our mortgages we did in 2016 prior to the new rules, 80% of them wouldn’t qualify under the new rules, and these were all prime deals.
It is way easier to get an uninsured mortgage than genworth or cmhc mortgage
I don’t know about interest rates rising causing defaults, I think it would be job losses that will spur a crash, however looks like economy will be growing again?
will wait and see
Gta down by 30% in 2018
Patiently waiting
I have a question to all these people pickled in debt, aren’t you scared? Doesn’t it keep you up at night, wondering when the other shoe will drop? Are you so naive to think that things can only go up? The law of gravity guarantees you, that what’s going up will eventually come down. The Millenials are going to get slaughtered when this housing fiasco comes down. They don’t know hardship, but they will. They think they have had it bad, they don’t know bad, but they will. Terrible, this will just end so badly.
The north GTA between the 404 and 400 is doing better than ever and it will continue even more.
GREENBELT, safe, good schools and the Loonie is so cheap now (and will likely drop even more.)
Vancouver would be way up if not for the 15% tax. It’s actually “insulting” people and getting them to look elsewhere instead of dumping money down the drain just so Christie can fend off NDP whining.
Alberta real estate is all about oil. Two years ago landlords were charging applicants $50 just TO VIEW THE RENTAL with no guarantee of being accepted.
Just like stocks, you need to pick the winners/winning areas.
“Looks like it’s time to watch the Big Short again or may be even bring it back to the screens at some Cineplex theatres across the GTA for a short while…”
US market at that time is nothing like the GTA market is now.
We don’t have strippers buying 5 houses. We have wealthy newcomers coming to the GTA North who are putting down roots and live and work here.
BC along with much of the policies in place are designed to protect and help the over 55 group at the expense of the young ones
Intergenerational inequality is a much bigger problem than income inequality.
The interest charges on the government debt will eventually consume the majority of tax dollars and they will keep protecting the seniors at the expense of the young
Time for a major revolution
All the best Revolutions start with ordinary people making small changes in the way that they do things.
Revolutions get ‘leaders’ only after critical mass has been achieved, and the bandwagon-jumping begins.
The ‘leader’ is not usually the one who initiated the change first, but instead the one who yelled ‘Get on the bandwagon! Over Here!’ the loudest.
Visiting my parents in their fancy neighbourhood, noticed a mansion down the street, with a big Power of Sale sign attached. Yes, in the GTA. . .looks like fun times are ahead, even for those pretending to be rich. Anyone who thinks the GTA is immune to a crash, is going to be in for a wake up call soon, when their paper equity soon goes poof!
Funny news in the U.S. media, today. It makes you wonder if the CIA vet any of their sources.
Garth just gave you a hot tip, Limited Sage.
I just wanted to thank everyone for their responses to my comment in last night’s post.
Being (almost) 28, I know I have a ton of knowledge still to learn about life – and particularly finances – but at least I can say I’m open to learning and listening.
While last night was my first post – although a long time reader – I look forward to more in depth discussions from Garth and from you, the commentors.
I realize I still have a long way to go along my own path. However, with all the advice posted daily here, the rocky passageway is just a little bit smoother for a successful life.
Property Tax Deferral: City of Ottawa allows deferral of property taxes:
http://ottawa.ca/en/city-hall/budget-and-taxes/property-taxes/tax-mitigation-programs#tax-deferral-program
you must apply every year
interest is 5%
you can defer up to 40% of the assessed value
since property taxes take precedent over mortgages – I don’t think you can get a mortgage or line-of-credit against your house if you have taxes outstanding.
so the City of Vancouver has gone into the mortgage business
So, if and when a housing correction sweeps over us, more and more people will be in personal financial trouble.
it sounds like there’s no if and the when is now
That’s why housing won’t crash, any decrease in prices will bring out the ‘Vulchers’ looking to snap up houses, fix them up and flip them.
@Dale from Calgary:
You may not have heard about Vancouver’s recent snow collection fails. On Sunday, my wife and I saw the same snow plow three times, in three different neighbourhoods, as we criss-crossed the city running errands.
At no time was this snow plow actually plowing anything. Instead, we surmised, it was part of a ‘charm offensive’ putting the vehicles in the public eye, so that the politicos could show the masses that they’re ‘doing something’.
THIS is what property tax deferral does for the city.
Yes, you are right ……….’delusional YVR land’ ………..
As the decades inch forward the government does everything it can to protect the interests of the ‘real estate industry’. It is and will remain the only game in town.
No one will step up to kill the golden goose in BC. Tax reductions, tax credits, tax defferals, government loans, bundled mortgages, lax building codes – the list is limited only by one’s imagination.
We used to be afraid/embarrased by the thought of debt or bankruptcy, but that is obviously an out of date mindset.
Party on!
Money money everywhere and not a drop for us.
It does seem there’s a plan underfoot to BK the Have provinces. AB is done under carbon taxes; and this; and ON will be Yours To Recover.
Herded into cities as rural services will be cut. Into all those Agenda 21 condos frantically being built.
(Under the cutesy term ‘densification’.).
A global plan – get them off their land. Don’t take my work for it, look. Hey we could have gotten the Syria treatment, chin up. Our ruthless elites.
Deposits held by CIBC and Home Capital banks are CDIC insured. Some credit unions will be hit harder and their deposits are not CDIC insured.
All the banks and CU’s continue to lend to anybody for anything as far as I can see.
Its gonna get fugly out there in realtor land…..I…..cant……wait.
There’s still some money left in the Canadian real estate piñata.These buyers just keep on hitting and the lenders just keep on lending whatever falls out . http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/mortgage-lenders-bundled-debt-1.3930774
You know what they are going to say in Vancouver?
Just like they did in every other city…
“But no one saw a housing correcting coming”, “Why didn’t the media warn us?”, “How come the friendly Realtor didn’t say anything?”, “But the Bank said I was richer than I think!”
Bundled loans? Sounds suspiciously like the collateralized home loans that distributed garbage US subprime mortgages and sold them to suckers around the world. That crashed the world economy in 2008 and gutted the US middle class. Canada skated by due to high oil and commodity prices driven by China and India. No such luck this time.
Ouch….
In addition of course to people flat out lying on their mortgage application.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?playlistId=1.3237519
I remember a Vancouver based credit union rep tried to encourage me to do this several years ago. He said that my income would not let me afford a condo in Vancouver so he would “say I made $30,000 a year in extra ‘bonus income'” and then I would qualify for the loan……
Of course my ethics got me (but I didn’t realize it was flat out mortgage fraud) so I declined and rented ever since.
Now my income can’t even afford me a condo in Chilliwack. Who’s the sucker now I wonder?
Well, why wouldn’t people defer their taxes for 0.7%? They are paying a lot more than that on their consumer credit.
The really savvy who aren’t up to their ears in 19% credit cards would take the tax deferral, call up Turner Investments, and make 6-8% on the money. The math is pretty simple. Borrow the tax money for 0.7%, get a return of 6% (5% after fees), and vola! That’s better than a 7 times return on your money every single freaking year!!! Everyone who can SHOULD (sorry to yell) take advantage of this program, I am surprised it is only 6,316 people who figured it out. Then again it is Vancouver.
Even the guy who isn’t savvy should take the deferral and pay down credit cards and and what have you. 0.7% is a way better deal than 19%.
Even at 2.7% this deal looks compelling. You are almost doubling your money.
And what if you have credit card debt? What’s 19/0.7 or even 2.7? I don’t know but those are big numbers. Anyone who has credit card debt and can qualify for the deferral would be a fool not to defer.
(*Comparisons are done on interest expenses vs. expected gains, not principle. You would only make the given returns on the expended interest. Individual results may vary.)
Oops I forgot to deduct the interest expense out, but it’s still free money. So instead of 7 times the return you actually have to pay the original interest bringing it down to something like 6 times but it still means for every $42 you spend you get about $268 in profit.
The whole thing is crazy political bullshit, but if I qualified for the program I probably wouldn’t ever pay property taxes again! Not at 0.7% anyway, that’s less than inflation so even if you spend all the money you are better off to keep it now and not pay the tax as long as you can.
My property tax last year, with the old guy discount, was around $2,000.
I back onto a salmon stream with close to an acre of woodland directly behind.
MY smokehouse in the back yard has few rules, you bring me your salmon and I’ll smoke it and give you most of what you brought back. I can do a lox style, cold smoke or a First Nation style air dried and hot smoked.
A friend drops by periodically with pork bellies. I sit, drink his beer and supervise as he preps them, brines and cures them. Then, a few days later I again supervise while he sets the smokehouse up and hangs the bellies and proceeds to make bacon.
Again, he gets almost all of his bacon back.
Oh, and I get door to door mail delivery.
All that for $2,000 a year.
Most of you live in the wrong place.
Life is good.
Yup. Read both those articles today but we’re already very used to the everyday stories of debt financed expenditure all round. BC is one sick market and economy, with leaders alarmingly reminiscent of a corrupt banana republic. Sadly not so ‘world class’, Canada. No houses for sale on our street, not far from Victoria, and for the first time in seven years. The reason? Fear of being unable to get back in, as Garth wrote a few days ago. As people celebrate increased assessments, we will very soon see even more vacations, new cars and renovations all around. Set your sights on your desired lifestyle and then borrow your brains out, seems to be the way. Meantime, I have just read Alex Avery’s The Wealthy Renter and passed it on to my own Millenial and partner . Great book and I do wonder if he’s been talking to Garth! No debt here meantime and all TFSAs are maxed… and invested. No one in our family will be buying …or borrowing…. although we could do both, tomorrow. In the meantime, keep going and well done VREU. Ignore the pumpers and know that the smart money agrees with you.
Talk about the “blind leading the blind ”
Great opportunity in the making!
Enjoy the ride there is $$$ to be made
It almost feels like the silence before the storm, so quiet. Do you feel it? If there is a heaven and hell this is it folks, people make it and some leaders should not be leaders. We might as well have robots as leaders if that is the best they come up with, lol.
Just printed out The Progressive Economics Forum by Jim Stanford and others. Read NAFTA: Suddenly, Everything’s on the Table, January 9th, 2017. It will ease your mind.
Also read about Tommy Douglas was a “macroeconomist,” not a “provincialist!” by Wenonah Bradshaw. YouTube on Douglas’s farewell speech. Second paragraph last sentence “It is more important to strengthen the balance sheet of private households in times of recession than to seek an elusive budgetary balance for the public sector.”
People of a nation are important to that nation.
@329 The Limited Sage
Well, if you’re willing to listen….thats half the battle won.
Not my battle but unsurprised to see rural New Zealanders apparently being poisoned off their land via years of mass spraying.
(“They’ll stone you just like they said they would”)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080_usage_in_New_Zealand
“New Zealand is the largest user of biodegradable 1080 poison,[5] using about 80% of the world’s supply.[6] ”
…
“Poisoning Paradise – Ecocide New Zealand –
This New Zealand film has won 4 international environmental awards – but here in NZ, TV channels refuse to play it. Why?”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQRuOj96CRs
#15 DaleFromCalgary
The carbon tax is such a scam. And it’s egregious too, over a dollar on something that only costs $2-3 right now? ($2.58 as of today so the tax rate is currently 39%! Yikes! Nutley must go.)
The current tax rates Albertans are now paying to heat their homes are similar to what used to be the top tax bracket for combined federal and provincial taxes. Disgusting. Poor people have to pay it to (the rebates are just PR.) I expect sales of wood burning fireplaces to go way up, and I won’t be recycling my cardboard anymore it’s going up the chimney!
And then when you count how much of the current natural gas price is already royalties, corporate taxes, and then personal taxes and payroll items like CPI leveled against energy industry employees, the carbon tax is truly an outrage.
And to do what? It isn’t going to slow down global warming 1 iota because China is just going to say “thanks for all the cheap fuel”. (The invisible hand will just redirect carbon fuels from here to there as we freeze in the dark.)
We’ve already done all the things that make sense, including better insulation, high efficiency furnaces, better more efficient cars, heck I even got one of those thermostats that lowers the temperature at night. I switched out mostly from incandescent ($1 each) to florescent ($5 each) and now I’m replacing those as they burn out with LED’s ($10 each). What more do they want me to do???
It’s simply a tax, it isn’t intended to do anything to save the world.
But, but, but CBC radio just ran a story that Calgary real estate has bottomed and will make gains this year.
Source for the story?…A Calgary [email protected] selling condos.
CBC starting to pimp and pump for Spring?
God , I wish I could wash my brain….
Glenmorangie will suffice.
Pass me my fiddle
“If and when a housing correction sweeps over us”…you’re kidding. Right?
#9 Gentle ,Loving Kindness
Trump scares the crap out of me. I see him, and his moronic opaque “Leadership Style” as the biggest threat to the markets. Who cares if you are in bonds or equities if the world economies are seizing up due to knee jerk conflicting “140 character policy diplomacy” from a guy who acts like a 5 year old boy ,with ADHD on a sugar high.
—
Go with the flow…
Despite his age Trump has mastered what the latest technology is offering to get his message to the public, not relying on the mercy of the traditional press, which has been trying to bury him from day 1, making bigger and bigger fool itself as days go by.
The era of a few talking heads from a handful of news networks letting the world what to know is over.
Pick up the pace, it’s a fast world.
#3 AJ
..they say that unless you live here.. you wouldn’t understand.
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I live here, and I still don’t understand.
I told my daughter and son in law not to buy their first home (in Portland, OR) until next year, prices are at 2008 peak levels right now. Did they listen? Nope. Deal closed Dec 27. I told the blog dogs a month ago a really big, bad market correction is coming, and soon. Put your portfolio into cash, then buy 15% GG and 15% NGD. Are you listening?
Conrad Black on “election deniers”:
“He is elected to be a president. What a president does is what is presidential.”
Right on.
#23 & 24 kevin li.
#############
BEGGARS CAN’T BE CHOOSERS. YOU SEEM TO FIT THAT MOLD.
1 will the TSX suffer? on 01.11.17 at 5:54 pm
?
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Question is, which will suffer first? Whichever takes a dive 1st, the other will suffer along with it. IMHO
#30 45north,
you neglected to point out para 6 of the City of Ottawa’s deferral policy:
Kind of limits property tax deferrals, doesn’t it.
#24 Kevin Li
”We don’t have strippers buying 5 houses. We have wealthy newcomers coming to the GTA North who are putting down roots and live and work here.”
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In Vancouver we have realturds buying 20 houses. I am now convinced from what I have observed in certain areas that realtors or a consortium of realtors own many of the vacant or rented houses thereby enabling them to control parts of the market. If I am correct and the prices start to seriously correct downwards, there is going to be a flurry of listings come onto the market. The realtor flippers will be running for the exits. I also believe the the very persons that have been targeted as the reason for rising prices in the lower mainland have also been seriously shafted by these people. It’s a ruthless business.
#31 The Greater Cauliflower on 01.11.17 at 6:56 pm
That’s why housing won’t crash, any decrease in prices will bring out the ‘Vulchers’ looking to snap up houses, fix them up and flip them.
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That only works until the banks cut off the credit. Then you watch the plywood sales increase as developments get boarded up. Saw this in the 90’s in the Okanagan. Projects half complete boarded up. Half sold. The other half taking 4 years or more to sell out at basically cost. Not pretty.
At long last the 15 year RE bull run is over in soggy YVR. So a healthy correction finally? Wait! Not us! Nope, we’re special and different. The BC government, directly engaged in the RE market, flip flops from a 15% foreign tax and back to creative lending and tax deferrals to keep it from correcting? Wow. This should be your Ah Ha moment. The muppets – Clark, De jong and company are only looking after their self interests and those of the local RE business. It’s incredible.
Speaking of corrupt – the mortgage business. But it’s Canada! Let’s be real. There are so many different ways to approve a mortgage – always a different lending option, angle or back door. Much like in the big short ” if they don’t get approved, then I’m not doing my job”
Garth – It would be interesting to hear from someone that works on the “inside” at Home Capital. That would be one interesting read.
Great weblog again today – it might take more time but the truth always wins in the end. Even if we are special.
Front line stuff. I am a service advisor at well established and still successful import car dealership in Calgary. This morning a mid-thirtys guy drove into our service drivethru reception. It was approximately -20C at that time. He got out shaking and said the heater wasn’t working. He was booked for two recalls which are warranty of course. I quoted him diagnostic for the heater problem. He said no as he was hoping one of the recalls would fix his heater. I assured him that they wouldn’t. Later, after we had performed the recalls, I called him on completion and told him the heater was still inop. ” I got no money, man” was his reply. —20C ! But I guess when you’ve got no money—you got NO money. Yikes!
Second is a short conversation with a very well established and respected tile-setter that I have dealt with for over 20 years. He said he got by in 2016 not bad. He had contracts and he kept reasonably steady through the year. He is worried about 2017 though. He says that he generally deals with two major builders and they have nothing at all for him coming up so far for this year.
Christy will do absolutely anything to get re-elected. That she is propping up the hugely inflated housing market in the Lower Mainland, at least until next May, is no great surprise (also makes her realtor buddies a little happier after the 15% foreign buyer tax hit). Broke home owners don’t make happy voters.
I really can’t vote for the No Development Party (they have no economic sense at all), so will have to vote for her – just saying, she is a consummate politician.
Re: #31 The Greater Cauliflower on 01.11.17 at 6:56 pm
The Canadian housing market will likely crash and flat-line for several decades. Only a total idiot would buy on the initial price drop.
#40 Chaddywack on 01.11.17 at 7:18 pm
In addition of course to people flat out lying on their mortgage application.
—————————————————-
One of the hosts on BNN mentioned something like that on the air yesterday.
He lives in Brampton, just west of Toronto, and said that people where he lives said that lying on your application about your income, etc is called getting a mortgage “the Brampton way”.
It’s nothing but our own delusions that keep us from seeing how history is constantly repeating itself.
The BC Government website states it very clearly: deferred property tax means a lien on your property. So one must repay what’s owed BEFORE the said property can be sold.
Where are you going to get the money to discharge the lien? Your Mom?
Liens are routinely discharged with sale proceeds as title changes hands. — Garth
Houses are going much much higher……Fiat currencies are going much much lower….there will be no deflation….USD is going lower….rates can not go higher….inflation will sky rocket…..best to be in Stocks..Real Estate…Gold and Collectibles….there is only one way out of this mess for the world…inflation
Some comments about the new carbon taxes.
Did nobody notice that what Kathleen Wynn did with some of the new carbon tax that she confiscated from you?
She gave over $40 million of it to Toyota, a Japanese billion dollar multinational to produce cars in Ontario that will spew out even more carbon and continue to create the very climate change that she is taxing the rest of us for.
What a hyprocrite.
Man this is like a replay of the “BIG SHORT”
we have the same situation as the US, except we rename everything differently as a facade to hide or disguise our housing bubble
Only differences is – borrowers cannot walk away meaning their life would be screwed along with bank of mom and dad.
and would debt ratio is way higher than the USA
If it weren’t for the bozos, there’d be no one to trade against.
I would like to defer my rent……na just kidding, but wouldn’t it be the same? Homeowners are becoming so classless.
#59 Ronaldo
Realtor landlords like this?
https://vancouver.craigslist.ca/bnc/apa/5955594346.html
Putting down roots, please! You realtors, you are all the same, sunshine and roses, nothing to see here folks, please keep buying because Canadian’s are rich. You must be friends with the other realtor, “rich Mike.”
#31 The Greater Cauliflower on 01.11.17 at 6:56 pm
That’s why housing won’t crash, any decrease in prices will bring out the ‘Vulchers’ looking to snap up houses, fix them up and flip them.
………………………………………………
This is true. This is because a larger crowd believes houses always go up. But it interest rates go up, then no one can flip those houses for gains. Add in a mild recession and things get a bit worse. If rates continue to rise and job cuts get deeper, then sentiment among the middle class changes from Bull to Bear. Momentum swings the other way, and once it gets going it’s hard to reverse back the other way.
The Alberta seniors residential property tax deferral program is usurious and discriminatory to 55 year olds!!
You have to be 65 and the interest rate (simple) is 2.70%. I’m calling my Calgary MLA. What is the point of having an NDP gub’t if they are so punitive to 60 year olds?
“And add in the Moister Street Test, new restrictions on loans to the self-employed and landlords plus the coming premiums lenders will have to pay to insure the loans they make, and the whole sector looks unsustainable.” – Garth
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It looks unsustainable, but it’s looked that way for years and ….. it’s only gone up. There are forces at work to keep housing prices up. FIRE economy.
Conrad Black on being Presidential
#55 Presidential on 01.11.17 at 8:42 pm
Conrad Black on “election deniers”:
“He is elected to be a president. What a president does is what is presidential.”
Right on.
*****************************
I’m okay with Conrad. He was sentenced harshly and did his time. He is smart. Also arrogant.
He will fawn over Trump in part because he will ask him for a Pardon to clear his name. He won’t get it but he will ask.
A friend of mine, real estate lawyer, runs a private 8 figure MIC. They’re rolling in it. Huge demand at both ends.
Wonder when the music stops.
Well, I wrote a post this morning about how I expect Richmond to be the messiest city in a Vancouver correction currently underway.
There are a lot of people in that city that are more attached to their money than their house.
The news tonight that the city council is going to ban Air Bnb is another nail in the Richmond coffin.
The rush to the exits is on…
M42BC
So Trump looks like he just got out of bed for his meeting with the press today. That, or he was just briefed on, Smoking Man’s book.
I think Trump needs to put more orange in his hair. Markets go up when he does that.
Just Curious……
Does any one here have a flip phone?
Shop at Value Village?
Drive a 25 yr old Toyota
Bag their lunch
Shop at the Restore
Buy used furniture
Make coffee at home
Use a mortgage broker
Rent out part of their house
Do all your home repairs and fix their car
Being Frugal and putting your money into non depreciating assets can go a long way
A simple home buyers plan in 2000 20K has been turned into 2M of real estate holdings……
Stop the complaining and get to work
#2 For those about to flop… on 01.11.17 at 5:54 pm
I was working on a huge new build out near UBC a couple of years ago.
There was a lot of guys working there and therefore a lot of vehicles.
The realtor from the house next door ,which she was trying to sell ,cited our trucks and vans out front as a reason for poor showings and no offers.
I told her perhaps it was the fact that she was trying to get 7.5 million for a 1954 knockdown rancher.
Never did speak to me again…
M42BC
***************************
It must have felt good saying that. I can only imagine the cold hard stare she gave you and of course the look of how dare you. lol
@ #41 Nonplused
Local multimillionaire architect Michael Geller discusses your strategy and seems surprised that people are unhappy that he is legally obtaining a below market loan for investment purposes.
http://gellersworldtravel.blogspot.ca/2016/01/bc-property-tax-deferral-program.html
#9 Gentle
Don’t worry little snowflake, the 140 characters won’t hurt you.
Just go to your nearest University, they have safe spaces there for people like you.
#59 Ronaldo
——————-
Vancouver and GTA markets are very different.
Chinese people are buying in the north GTA to live here, send kids to the best schools, and enjoy the GREENBELT and space and nature. People are putting their money here for a LONG TERM investment.
The Vancouver market has always looked unstable to me. GTA is very stable.
#73 Kevin Li is a realtor on 01.11.17 at 9:50 pm
Putting down roots, please! You realtors, you are all the same, sunshine and roses, nothing to see here folks, please keep buying because Canadian’s are rich. You must be friends with the other realtor, “rich Mike.”
——————————-
No I’m not a Realtor. The fees in Ontario are ridiculous to be licensed and it’s far easier and cheaper for me to simply use a Realtor to sell/buy. Time is precious.
Newcomers are putting down roots in the north GTA. That’s reality. And it’s why school ratings are so important here.
Herb: Kind of limits property tax deferrals, doesn’t it?
yeah it does
Lefties, deciples of pure evil. Too stupid to see it.
Says housing bear economist David Madani, “This is what happens at the late stage of a housing bubble — the quality of lending goes down.”
—————————————————-
Yeah, Yeah. How many years has David Madani been talking about a housing correction? I have lost track. Eventually he will be correct, but wonder what his clients think of his forecasts all these years.
Full disclosure, I have been dead wrong about the housing market for years – difference is I don’t get paid for my predictions, and so far I have only hurt myself.
I would also like to say many of the developers here are pushing for an end to the Greenbelt.
They are short-sighted and missing the point of what is getting them all their sales.
Many wealthy newcomers aren’t exactly happy with Toronto/GTA winters, taxes, traffic jams once you hit Toronto, etc.
What makes this place attractive is the GREENBELT. And good schools, shopping, low loonie, etc.
But the GREENBELT is important for buyers. Many large urban areas around the world have cut everything down and paved.
The GREENBELT is what makes the north GTA attractive for people who can invest their money and put down their roots in many other places.
GTA is not like Vancouver (where the super rich like to park money).
GTA is where newcomers are putting down roots and have a long term ‘investment.’
People like living here, and taking their kids to safe parks, forests, etc.
Liberals did this right.
#83 Keith
Well, I don’t know what to say other than Geller said it a lot better than me and also put his money where his mouth is.
Sub prime lending….music to my ears. Why buy real estate when I can lend top up and seconds to the unwashed? This paper can be bought for returns of 10 to 20 % returns…depending on the corcumstances and risk profile of the goat. This keeps getting better and better.
This is deja but for me as I was lending money at 20% on seconds and consolidations back in the late eighties and nineties before Bernadette created ’emergency rates’ through ZIRP to bail out the politicians and the techs.
The market is a pendulum ….a living thing…
breathing in and out….a human concoction of rational paranoia. Canadians are not ready for what’s coming ….those with short memories or no experience ain’t seen nothing yet. The sixties and seventies werent just quixotic times of bad music and drunk sex….theses were times of intense poverty and high unemployment….we’re going back to that in Canada. Trump is already changing everything….the world has shifted hard to the rational….globalism is faltering…and our Trudeau princelings aren’t at all suited for the rough and tumble that’s kicking at the door.
Should have murdered Shlong Zumanga when I had a chance.
Now I got to bleed out another book.
#49 Nonplused
We’ve already done all the things that make sense, including better insulation, high efficiency furnaces, better more efficient cars, heck I even got one of those thermostats that lowers the temperature at night. I switched out mostly from incandescent ($1 each) to florescent ($5 each) and now I’m replacing those as they burn out with LED’s ($10 each). What more do they want me to do???
It’s simply a tax, it isn’t intended to do anything to save the world.
—-
Of course.
How can you save a world where the entire economic system, including compensation, incentives, jobs is based on continuous “growth” that can’t possibly stop without going into recession, depression?
Energy consumption tax in this system is the most cynical mockery for brainwashed, ideologue politicians to collect more money from tax payers.
#43 Metaxa on 01.11.17 at 7:30 pm
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Nice rules. What are friends for, right? You sound very… thrifty.
#15 DaleFromCalgary
You got something for being a resident.
Take it.
As for your heating cost.
I live in a far more colder weather and we keep our heat at 17c max.
We got a mail, from a Utility, saying we are pretty much the best in the neighborhood.
Stop whining.
Are you?
It will be a great day when the Canuck banks are sweating their held real estate portfolios exponentially more than the beleaguered note-hosers.
Consider that after more than 7 years of progressive real estate torture in Greece, many inheritors of properties from deceased relatives are now legally refusing transfer these properties granting them to the State because the obligations and taxes far exceed their current let alone future value.
Don’t think it can’t happen here, and it may not be all that far off.
I’m bringing my popcorn for that horror movie.
#81 Leinad on 01.11.17 at 10:09 pm
………………………………………………….
Yes, I do all of these things! It’s natural for me.
I’m a huge believer in making smart purchase decisions from day one. Don’t buy it unless you need it. If it’s worth fixing, don’t throw it out. Fix it! Anything that can be repaired is worth keeping (sign of quality). its broke beyond repair, re-purpose it, or use it for parts.
Buy whole organic coffee beans. Grind first thing in the morning. Use a simple $25 percolator. Voila! Better than Starbucks!
#63 PGer on 01.11.17 at 9:32 pm
Christy will do absolutely anything to get re-elected. That she is propping up the hugely inflated housing market in the Lower Mainland, at least until next May, is no great surprise (also makes her realtor buddies a little happier after the 15% foreign buyer tax hit). Broke home owners don’t make happy voters.
I really can’t vote for the No Development Party (they have no economic sense at all), so will have to vote for her – just saying, she is a consummate politician.
*********************
Yikes…! Asking for more abuse. This is also an angle a troll would use. Where did all the mills go in PG?
Believe it or not some Vancouver financial advisors doing workshops on property tax deferral to attract clients.
#59 Ronaldo on 01.11.17 at 9:13 pm
In Vancouver we have realturds buying 20 houses.
————-
If true it makes my case they are way over paid.
I have noted that the Ft. Mac real estate board takes about 12 days to add up the dollar value of about 109 home sales and divide by 109 to promulgate an average price figure. December numbers ain’t out yet.
Neurons don’t fire as fast up here as they do in the balmy climes of YYZ and YVR.
The fine burghers of the Taiga are cranky about the – 41 degree blizzard conditions today. It is with glee that I take it over a + 3000 degree firestorm.
#15 DaleFromCalgary on 01.11.17 at 6:23 pm
You are thinking the wrong way round. Your 1950s house, which is probably leaky as hell and barely, if at all, insulated is the problem. Plug the holes and insulate your attic and walls and you will stop wasting so much natural gas in heating and cut your carbon emissions dramatically. That’s the point of the carbon tax – to change behaviour towards energy conservation and lower emissions – by making profligate use expensive. Next, sell the truck and get something more fuel efficient.
The BC tax deferment program does not impact the tax collected in the related municipality.
Please read carefully. The BC government pays your municipal tax bill if you agree to pay the government back at a later date, and if you meet a short list of qualifications and follow a shorter list of rules.
Google is great…
http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/taxes/property-taxes/annual-property-tax/pay/defer-taxes
Great program for those that are eligible: why would an old timer not choose to do this (free money, then invest it!). Too bad people ‘need’ this program to make ends meet. The consequences of this deferment will be oldies stay in their homes longer, and pass along less money to their estate when they die…BC will get their money, and they can play with their accounting to show the ‘debt’ as secured. AND BC gov boosts ‘spending’ by giving oldies money directly…stimulus!
Panties-in-a-bunch the lot of ya’ll.
No way this is offered in 20yrs when I can make use of it. Boo.
and some think re will go up indefinetly, in 42s that he talked on a topic total pull back of 4% or 24.B USD in next 20 min. i hope he alrady forgot about snow mexicans…
https://goo.gl/cEQ515
http://imgur.com/Id42hIA
#54 Ex Pat on 01.11.17 at 8:28 pm
I told my daughter and son in law not to buy their first home (in Portland, OR) until next year, prices are at 2008 peak levels right now. Did they listen? Nope. Deal closed Dec 27. I told the blog dogs a month ago a really big, bad market correction is coming, and soon. Put your portfolio into cash, then buy 15% GG and 15% NGD. Are you listening?
………………………………………………….
Looks like investors are already taking positions in GG and NGD in anticipation of POTUS inauguration.
If you’re right about a dip in the DJIA, the buying opportunity in bullion was in November!
43 homes on the same Vancouver street just went up for sale – Read at Business Insider: http://www.businessinsider.com/cashing-out-of-vancouver-real-estate-2017-1?&platform=bi-androidapp
#84 traderJim
I can trade the “Trump Rally” as good as the next guy. That’s not my problem. My problem with Trump is, to me, he is a discontinuous function. He is unpredictable, and as a president, that makes him dangerous. The possibility of an unattended military accident goes up with conflicting or unskillful policy communications. BTW, I wish I was a “Snowflake”, that would mean I was about 40-50 years younger than I am now. It is my grandchildren that I worry about with this mean spirited narcissists in charge.
It makes great sense to take the property tax deferral option if at all possible. The low interest rates is just one consideration. They could conceivably forgive the unpaid taxes at some future date.
David Madani is predicting a housing correction. Well, talk about deja vu. Since he first started talking about a coming correction (2010?), houses have gone up a lot. Maybe threefold in some cases. So, who cares about a 10 to 20% correction?
“found on Quora”
With Texas’ new open carry law effective today, how will people be able to tell who is a responsible gun owner and who is someone to take cover from?
Tim Furgerson
Tim Furgerson, lived in Tombstone, AZ
Written Dec 18 · Upvoted by Bob Yates, 15+ years NRA member an former Army Ordnance Officer and Joe Sigmon, 25 Years in Law Enforcement and competition shooter
Here’s a little secret that the really best cops use to identify threat risks from armed citizens.
If you see someone carrying a gun, and it’s in one of those special pocket/holder that is often known as a “holster”: They are “Responsible Gun Owners”.
If you see someone carrying a gun, and that gun is pointed at YOU, or some other innocent victims: They are NOT “Responsible Gun Owners”.
56.8k Views · View Upvotes
This is what happens when you have a drama teacher running a complex economy and muppets running provinces. HOUSE RICH, CASH POOR. The fact is that 100% people in BC could not purchase the home at the crappy assessed value, let alone pay the tax. If they don’t pay, will I don’t think the government has an issue as they will just take the home and the taxes will have to paid, so they have security…6000 people in 2.5M population is nothing. The loan to help is nothing. No need to put a spotlight on those figures. Focus on what happens when demand runs out at these high prices and people cannot sell, prices will get lower and lower and find a new level..nothing to do with all the fancy graphs, jobs, etc….Affordability is not available in Canada. The avg family cannot afford the average home. Can’t decrease rates because it makes loonie crap and food folks bark, up would be pure chaos….so imagine you will see more schemes such as you mentioned….at the end, supply and demand, local areas will rule.
Re: #73 Kevin Li is a realtor on 01.11.17 at 9:50 pm
They just come here to get free schooling then if the government changes things they all go back home to China. Put down roots… hilarious!!
“Poisoning Paradise – Ecocide New Zealand –
This New Zealand film has won 4 international environmental awards – but here in NZ, TV channels refuse to play it. Why?”
—————————————–
Do you really need to ask why?
Do they air the films FIAT EMPIRE, or America: Freedom to Fascism?
Are any non-nonsence 9/11 films ever shown, or just disinfo ones such as the ‘documentary’ done by The Passionate Eye?
Do you know who William Cooper was?
Have you ever heard of Jim Stone?
#97 Self Directed on 01.11.17 at 11:17 pm
#81 Leinad on 01.11.17 at 10:09 pm
………………………………………………….
Yes, I do all of these things! It’s natural for me.I’m a huge believer in making smart purchase decisions from day one. Don’t buy it unless you need it. If it’s worth fixing, don’t throw it out. Fix it! Anything that can be repaired is worth keeping (sign of quality). its broke beyond repair, re-purpose it, or use it for parts.Buy whole organic coffee beans. Grind first thing in the morning. Use a simple $25 percolator. Voila! Better than Starbucks
———————————————————-
Ditto to above comments. We also do all the same. The 93 Eurovan is a talking piece everywhere I go. No debt, no risk of losing equity and we go to the Okanagan whenver we want,subsidized by gracious landlord,bless her heart and may she prosper ;) Plenty of mention of staying warm today. Even here in Portland, OR a good foot of snow on the ground. Last time I saw this here I was knee high to a grasshopper. Keep us all tied up trying to stay warm as Jan 21 fastly approaching, hard to know what to think. Paul Craig Roberts on civil rights. Whats the future to bring. Zipping back to other home country North looks less appealing as reading here daily reveals a coming reckoning. Stay here in soft police state or slog thru the white stuff to freeze up in Commee-north. We’re all in for it either way. Fun fact from a relly: Russian “companies” have bought up large pcs of land in Finland. Theres lots of soldiers hanging around that border, actually that was a few monthes ago so old news but have fun with it anyway. If I can find the link I’ll post it. Thanks all this is the only “news” I read anymore. Stay warm and Peace.
#1 will the TSX suffer?
Yes. The TSX will have a correction. Maybe bigger than people think. I re-balanced for it recently to my satisfaction. Keep in mind for Maple I buy sector ETF’s, while for the rest of the world I buy International/Country ETF’s only.
I am invested but very underweight a Canadian Utilities ETF right now, and overweight cash. Haven’t been this overweight cash across the board since the GFC. And I was right then too. Just 1 year early.
I believe things are worse than they appear.
But hey, that’s just me. I am in the catbird seat.
Also. Canadian RE is in big big big trouble. Very Big. If not for the unforeseen insane antics of our politicians juicing the RE market since the GFC regarding RE, the dump would already have happened. All that has happened is a delay of a more severe $hit$torm. It will be in the history books.
Definitley curious how vanouver and the lower mainland will go.
I work in car industry and the amount of foreigners from Asia constantly buying new cars and leasing new cars still has me thinking they are still here buying property up. its amazing how many students are here working minimum wage jobs driving 50-200 grand cars and living in brand new condos. Hell I’ve seen cars delivered out to empty homes the kid had a bedroom and a tv and the rest of it was empty yet the garage had 2 cars worth 200 grand.
If the market settled down I definitley see all the rich East Indians and Asians / loading up on property renting and sub dividing . These people have so much money they can sit on it and wait for it to go up again.
I travelled through Europe recently and many of your classic cities the condos and townhomes were priced crazy high and this was in dumpy spots and I didn’t see anything special about the way they lived there. Vancouver was way nicer then those places. We just need to get a night life to match major us cities and Asia and it’s game over here
Btw…..Viking was what my people did….not the name we went by. We referred to ourselves as closely related tribesman first with distinct affiliations in a general population of Russe… (where the name Russia comes from) the distinctive peoples (white blond hair, sharp facial features and ice blue eyes) of northern Scandinavia in the west across to the Korean Penninsula.
I for example with distinct Nordic features have an epicanthic flap making my eyes slightly oriental….typical…if you go to northern latitudes in this region everyone looks exactly the same….like I have a lot of brothers and sisters. We are not Caucasian. Does that qualify me for a tax free card in Canada?
I have read where we were referred to as ‘White Wolves’ by Europeans , in the lands we took by force over thousands of years. In fact Scandinavians are an indigenous people….unlike all other indigenous people we adapted , evolved , organized and went on to conquer the known world as Norman’s and Vandals.
To go viking ( to loot ) was what a group of ‘Valutamen’ ( organized contract traders…literally men seeking things of value….meat, slaves, metal ) would seek to ‘ransack’ (funny how Nordic words have insinuated themselves into the language of the people we conquered from north to south) settlements.
‘Ran’ is the Norse word for house…’sack’ is literally sack….to ransack was to literally take the contents of your house and put them in my bag…and take them away…..ergo… Viking meant …..enterprise.
I often have dreams about paddling over to virgin lands with my Viking pals and ransacking along the coast….it’s likely genetic memory of the good old days I suppose.
“If a housing correction unfolds, we believe that there is likely to be material downside to the current operating outlook for domestic lenders,” Macquarie says in its report. “A true correction in Canadian housing activity would likely have material negative implications for economic activity and employment, mortgage industry loan growth and consumer credit performance.”
No shit, Macquarie.
“likely have Material negative implications”? I think “bloodbath” would be a more accurate description.
#24 Kevin Li on 01.11.17 at 6:43 pm
“Looks like it’s time to watch the Big Short again or may be even bring it back to the screens at some Cineplex theatres across the GTA for a short while…”
US market at that time is nothing like the GTA market is now.
We don’t have strippers buying 5 houses. We have wealthy newcomers coming to the GTA North who are putting down roots and live and work here.
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If they have to work they are not wealthy.
This is a myth, as I wrote the only relatively well financially immigration group were the immigrants from Honk Kong from over 20 years ago. Even they work so they are not wealthy, just relative well, not even rich.
No rich people in their right mind will come to live in GTA from abroad.
As for the strippers from the movie the Big Short – they were cash rich, just lover-leveraged. And definitely not the typical buyer in the US housing bubble.
As I wrote, our/GTA housing bubble is probably 1.5 – 2.0 times bigger than the Irish one and 2.5-3 times bigger than the US one and the Canadians are much more over-leveraged compared to anything ever seen in US.
Reading you posts I understand why. Canada was supposed to bring in smart immigrants. Apparently that is not the case.
Cost of living going up.
https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/canadian-families-could-face-1600-increase-in-cost-of-living-in-2017-185948281.html
This does not include the CPP increases, not sure about the carbon taxes.
Judging by this and the last few winters I think we need carbon incentives, not taxes.
New forecast says Vancouver home prices to drop in 2017 while Toronto still on the rise
http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/news/blog.html?b=business.financialpost.com/personal-finance/mortgages-real-estate/new-forecast-says-vancouver-home-prices-to-drop-in-2017-while-toronto-still-on-the-rise&pubdate=2017-01-12
‘Scary’ economic conditions spur rise in Calgary business closings
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/small-business/sb-managing/scary-economic-conditions-spur-rise-in-calgary-business-closings/article33583417/?ref=http://www.theglobeandmail.com&service=mobile
As rotten as she is what is the alternative to Christy Clark?
More wingnut lefties.
So there you go…
Whoa.
Almost sounds like a CHIP reverse mortgage of sorts… work towards zero home equity as you approach the final years. Allow another creditor to stake a claim against your proceeds.
What is frightening is if RE crashes, who gets first dibs on the equity upon the sale, the bank or the property tax man? talk about chasing bad ideas with worse ideas…
🎶 I see a bad moon a risin’, I see trouble on the way …
We don’t have strippers buying 5 houses. We have wealthy newcomers coming to the GTA North who are putting down roots and live and work here. – #24 Kevin Li
Wealthy newcomers really? Stats show most immigrants are poor and much more likely to be unemployed or under-employed.
BTW I know a computer technician (Chinese origin) who owns 3 condos in Montreal, any stripper probably earn 5 times what she does…
Mr. Li, likes the cornfields.
North GTA, Markham, Richmond Hill, York Region…Yuk!
They’re taking productive farmland and green zones, churning it up like “No Mans Land” and building oversize garbage cornflake shacks, shoe-horned into 33ft wide lots, surrounded by the beautiful view of cattle corn fields, and smell of cow sh*t.
I have see many ugly subdivisions that are already 20 years old, and still look like a manufactured hell!…made of cheap materials and workmanship.
Please, is there anyone on this blog who is a building inspector or construction inspector in these regions?
Tell us how the workmanship is on these over priced McMansions?
Every day these north GTA people pour onto crowded freeways to take hellish commute to somewhere in Toronto to work.
Yaaaa! what a lifestyle!
the word “glut” appears more often in rentals
http://thehousingbubbleblog.com/index.html
@#117 Stock Picker
“funny how Nordic words have insinuated themselves into the language of the people we conquered from north to south) settlements.”
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Actually its the other way around.
The English language is constantly adjusting, growing with new words adopted from foreign languages. Unlike say Quebec French which is constantly “en gard” for the infiltration of non french words).
As for the “glory days” of the Viking rape , murder and pillage of “civilized” Europe over 1000 years ago.
Lets not forget what happened to them when they arrived in L’Anse Meadows in northern Labrador…..and met with the indigenous population that hadnt even discovered metal tools…..they had their asses kicked.
One wonders if they learned any new words while in jolly old Newfoundland like….”bye jayzus! retreat!”.
@#86 &90 Kevin Li the almostRealtor
Stuff the sales pitch Kev.
Wrong audience.
http://reason.com/blog/2016/10/28/nightmare-in-deep-ellum-how-pension-obli
pension obligation bonds
https://projects.propublica.org/graphics/pension_bonds
Give or take we are 5 years behind the U.S. in an almost photocopy of real estate failures, bank bailouts and investment fiascoes. The acts of the guilty like the banks and the investment firms won’t be the exact same, but the results will be…..
#55 Presidential on 01.11.17 at 8:42 pm
Conrad Black on “election deniers”:
“He is elected to be a president. What a president does is what is presidential.”
Right on.
—————-
Hey Conrad, I Have a question for you:
If a man is selected as CEO of a company does that mean everything he does is ethical?
#88 Smoking Man on 01.11.17 at 10:44 pm
Lefties, deciples of pure evil. Too stupid to see it.
—
That doesn’t make them disciples does it? It makes them ignorant.
#20 Rick Fast on 01.11.17 at 6:33 pm
Gta down by 30% in 2018
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That’s wishful thinking. GTA market will probably peak this Spring at 15-20% above last Spring. If the wrongly-predicted-for-so-long correction ensues after that, the prices in Spring 2018 will be probably off by 10%-15% the most, which will bring it back to 2016 levels. Still very expensive.
I actually see a 30% GTA correction but it probably be choppy and take 3-5 years to fully unfold. I don’t think single detached houses in 416 will go down much during this correction.
For some reason the average Canadian thinks that they HAVE TO be able to afford a detached house, as if it’s their birth right. The fact is that in major G8 cities the average family cannot even afford a 2-bed condo/apartment in the city proper. In contrast there are still 2-bed condos (900-100 sqf) in midtown Toronto that could be had for about $550K. For that you get great public schools, transit, low-crime, etc. If you have the 20% down, then your mortgage is less than $2,100, and when you add taxes and maintenance it’s less than $3K. Still very doable for many families across GTA, but no, they HAVE TO have a house. Draw your own conclusions.
Canada is a Ponzi scheme. Millennials are screwed. Wait until CPP collapses under its own wait. We’ll be begging to immigrate to China within 25 years.
As predicted: http://www.repmag.ca/news/brokerage-releases-annual-real-estate-report-219479.aspx
Toronto has a ways to go up (this is quite obvious, we have a way better economy than Vancouver, more jobs, higher wages, way more people and there are less houses available per inhabitant). Vancouver is on the way down back to more normal price territory, and Alberta is, in the words of this famous blogger, “pooched”.
Have fun with your real estate speculation in 2017.
If you want to play the market against some mortgage companies, good bets are CIBC, Home Capital and Genworth.
As absurd as this market may appear to you it all comes down to Supply and Demand. Until Supply increases and Demand decreases… there is no end in sight.
This is Canada not Germany.
Real estate is the only way to go…………DUH
Dear renters….enjoy your eviction/rent increases notices as we the landlords get wealthy beyond compare……….
Damn, you people are stupid!!
In Kelowna residential inventory hasn’t been this low in the past 10 years.
Kelowna sales volume for 2017 broke all previous records.
The world has discovered Canada and Kelowna in particular.
Kelowna’s high tech sector is growing in leaps and bounds.
Kelowna’s medical services are top notch.
Kelowna’s University (UBC-O) is a big draw.
We have an International Airport (YLW).
Kelowna IS a Four Seasons Playground.
A city that used to be “newly weds and nearly deads” Kelowna has changed dramatically as Mellinnials become the biggest cohort and move to Kelowna for the lifestyle and affordability and JOBS.
Kelowna Real Estate is a relative bargain… for now, but that is changing FAST.
*** CORRECTION ***
Kelowna sales volume for 2016 (NOT 2017) broke all previous records.
I’ve mentioned Home Capital Group (HCG) and it’s role in the shadow mortgage market before. Bundled loans are nothing new but the real problem are the Mortgage Investment Corporations (MIC). Not only are MICs unregulated but they are also privately held. This allows HCG to enter into dubious agreements which further increases the costs to the borrowers while being extremely profitable for the MICs (HCG just takes a cut for facilitation). HCG can also restructure the credit agreements with the MICs to protect them from borrower default and incentivize them to increase their loan books. Again a questionable practice for an OFSI regulated company.
Jason and David have probably been on this trade for a while and are now just talking up their position. Feb 8th will tell us how HCG prospered last quarter. I suspect the results will work in Macquarie’s favour.
https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/bundles-debt-lenders-sidestep-canadas-120001295.html
https://www.valueinvestorsclub.com/idea/HOME_CAPITAL_GROUP_INC_-CL_B/136982
I am by no means fully versed in financial and taxing knowledge but all I see in the current policies is nothing but a wealth trap. The so called policy-privileged rich-elders will eventually kill over and doubt the majority will be donating the bulk of their nest eggs to charities. I think the bet here is that is not the bank of mom but grandma the one coming to the rescue. Never underestimate the love for the offspring. Its coded in our DNA. Looks like CREA and the tax man have been sending their policy advisers to the local colleges to add some extra biology credits to their resumes.
Mmmm, definately fear out there right now.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/4036189-vix-flirting-pre-gfc-lows-uncertainty-time-highs-huh
It’s crazy out there, selling yourself in debt servitude has become as commonplace as coffee at breakfast. Banks and governments keep on stoking the fire. Here take more, more, more… be good little consumers. EVERYBODY can be a Rock Star.
It’s so sad to see where this is obviously headed.
https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/u-trade-policy-drag-canadian-141103217.html
The s..t storm is coming. Take cover.
———————
Reuters) – The possibility that U.S. President-elect Donald Trump will follow through on his protectionist campaign promises has dented the outlook for Canada’s economy, with nearly half of economists polled paring back growth forecasts.
A majority of analysts who answered an extra question in the poll said they were concerned Trump’s expected trade agenda will have a serious impact on Canada’s economic growth over the near- to medium-term.
The Bank of Canada is therefore predicted to hold rates steady at 0.50 percent for much longer than had been anticipated, with analysts pushing out expectations for a hike to the third quarter of 2018, versus the first quarter just a month ago.
Although, in its recent Business Outlook Survey, the bank indicated improved business prospects, economists in the poll said there was too much uncertainty emanating from Trump’s threat to scrap the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA).
No housing crash coming according to this guy. Get out there and buy. No problem. Everything will be just fine.
http://news.buzzbuzzhome.com/2017/01/canadian-housing-crash-not-coming.html
#107 gentle
Ah it was just such an easy set up I couldn’t resist.
Trump is in some ways unpredictable, not so much if you understand him. For example, people who don’t have a clue think Trump’s tweets are poorly thought out, when in reality they are usually very strategic, and deliberately politically incorrect.
People who cry ‘why does he keep doing that?’ are clueless. They also ‘can’t understand’ how Trump won, and they tend to believe he is a lousy businessman, because a few of his hundreds of businesses went under, while many more succeeded, making him extraordinarily wealthy.
A multi-billionaire that’s a lousy businessman, talk about denying reality.
These people are living in an echo chamber and can’t see what’s happening right in front of them. Probably due to their never having started a business themselves, clinging to their cushy (and life sucking) bureaucrat job.
The world is changing rapidly, and Trump was elected precisely because he is NOT like any other President. His supporters LOVE that he is upsetting the apple cart, that’s why many held their noses at some aspects of his personality and voted for him anyway.
BTW, tweets are not instantly ‘policy’. Get a grip. There are these things called checks and balances in the US political system. Maybe you are so old you have forgotten?
The idea of a ‘military accident’ (can you name one that ever happened? In all of human history?) is nonsense. But feel free to worry about it.
Hillary promised war with Russia in Syria, and was hell bent on it, I suppose to prove she was tough. No worries there though, huh?
Trump has made it exceedingly clear he would much rather get along with other countries and not invade them.
Fake news has you believing otherwise.
Name a country that you think Trump would have the US go to war with. I mean one they haven’t already invaded.
You might want to consider the fact that US special forces are currently in more than 100 different countries around the world. The number of ongoing wars with US involvement is something like 15, iirc.
So lots for you to worry about until Trump gets in. Then you can keep worrying but your kids should be be able to relax. (Unless the Dem and neo Con war mongers really go insane)
I no longer worry about my relatives in the military.
#102 Longterm
”That’s the point of the carbon tax – to change behaviour towards energy conservation and lower emissions – by making profligate use expensive. Next, sell the truck and get something more fuel efficient.”
—————————————————————–
I see, so if someone does all of this stuff you mention, they will remove the carbon tax for these people. Not likely, it’s simply an excuse to get more tax from everyone.
I just bought some USD @ .7635 – only time will tell if this was a good time of if the CAD is going higher.
Now back to your regular schedule about how the poster is smarter than everyone else…
Koshy Alex: from your link: All 13 homes have a combined assessment value just over $20 million, but the 11 listed have a combined ask $36 million. That’s an 80% premium in case you were just going to do the math.
as the article says this will be an interesting benchmark of Vancouver real estate.
We will be carbon taxed even after we go ‘toes up’.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/go-public-cremation-carbon-tax-funeral-home-1.3929133
Oh, goody, goody!
Free smiles, selfies, hugs and laying on of hands all across the nation! Caring, loving connection to the people who will never spend xmas helicoptered to a private island.
Making amazing changes for Canada’s “middle class”, debt, deficit and the future fiscal health of Canada be damned.
The magical mystery tour is underway!
Wheeeeeeeeeeee!!!!
#149 Trader Jim
Great post. Exactly my thoughts on this.
The idea of a ‘military accident’ (can you name one that ever happened? In all of human history?) is nonsense. But feel free to worry about it.
—-
TWA 800
http://tkelly6785757.podomatic.com/
#128 CrowdedEF….Modern English is certainly evolving into the most dynamic language ever spoken….
The findings of archeologists who dug several sites on Newfie shores concluded that no signs of warfare existed…there would have had to be more arrow heads and bones etc….as it was the dwellings and boathouses collapsed with no sign of destruction or fire .,,indicates that the Viking simply left after finding nothing they could use that wasn’t found elsewhere. The Spanish came to the same conclusion and marked their sea charts …. Aca Nada….meaning ‘there’s nothing here’. When the charts fell into the hands of the English Admiralty it was bastardized into Canada….because they obviously blundered the Spanish translation. I laugh whenever I remember that Liberal commercial about the dead indigenous language that meant Canada was ‘a village’…how politically correct is that.
The next proposal of government is the Fat Tax as we will all have to be weighed like a side of beef. They will tax those who have too much and place those on a diet plan controlled by a government agency for a fee payable in advance. Next will come the Pet Tax as only one per family will be permitted by the government, so you will be taxed on the others. This will be executed in the name of the Global Warming Project.
If you want to see people’s reaction to worries about the housing market (and become depressed), have a read of the comments on this Vice article:
https://www.facebook.com/vicecanada/posts/1424491784238047?comment_id=1426374390716453¬if_t=like¬if_id=1484240535189399
#19 Mortgagebrokeron on 01.11.17 at 6:30 pm
“We back tested all our mortgages we did in 2016 prior to the new rules, 80% of them wouldn’t qualify under the new rules, and these were all prime deals.
It is way easier to get an uninsured mortgage than genworth or cmhc mortgage
I don’t know about interest rates rising causing defaults, I think it would be job losses that will spur a crash, however looks like economy will be growing again?”
Tptb via msm will carry on stirring the sludgy, Canadian economic muck in order to (so we’ve been told ad nauseum) “preserve” the status quo. The status quo, however, is most definitely not being protected and much less, preserved. A big, ugly, egg-laying fly hit the ointment, which has decimated jobs as a result of rapidly dwindling spending in retail and services. And NAFTA hasn’t even hit the oval office.
Money is TOO CHEAP (our US neighbours know this) and government WASTE relentlessly swells, and on sickening amounts of pampering!
Too many find almost no incentive to save, no desire to plan for the future and “now” is the desperate compartment most money has been forced into.
As long as tptb can keep our little heads spinning ’round and ’round, looking for a safe place to land, this broken scenario will continue to damage the economy. People will continue to inhale debt like the addicts they are, far too few will save and government will increasingly foam at the mouth about the wonderful, working backbone that is the “middle class”.
So pukingly obvious that the average wheel barrow just got splattered in mud by the limo speeding by to catch a helicopter.
Our favourite realturd is so far ahead of his time he’s already “breaking records” in the future. LOL!
Pathetic, DA, even for you.
Yes, the “world” wants to come to our neck of the woods, where thermal inversion means half the year under clouds and a moribund job means Millennials will go red in tooth and claw to get a position at Starbucks.
The mind of a lowercase realtor is a wondrous thing to behold.
#44 Mrs Hubris on 01.11.17 at 7:31 pm
Does sound like a good read….makes me wonder how many millionaire renters are actually out there. My gut tells me that the number is growing- if only because most who’ve achieved independent wealth are fully cognizant of the protection against unbridled, unpredictable and often senseless rate increases. Plus, and this is a biggie, the ability to move whenever and wherever you want.
#134 Samantha on 01.12.17 at 9:44 am
#20 Rick Fast on 01.11.17 at 6:33 pm
Gta down by 30% in 2018
—————————————–
Let’s debunk all the myths and untrue in your post.
—
For some reason the average Canadian thinks that they HAVE TO be able to afford a detached house, as if it’s their birth right.
……..
And why Canadians should not expect to be able to afford a a single detached house in Canada?
Because there is a shortage of lang or building materials here? (lmfao)
Let’s not compare GTA to Tokyo, London, New York, Paris PLEASE.
In each one of these truly metropolitan world class cities, centers of big economies, cultures and tradition, there is number of very rich people who live or want to move there so that justifies the relatively high prices for those markets. We have non of these.
—————————–
The fact is that in major G8 cities the average family cannot even afford a 2-bed condo/apartment in the city proper.
……
This is an absolute lie.
Berlin, Frankfurt, Vienna, Rome, Milan, Barcelona, Madrid are far cheaper and much better cities to live than GTA with house prices much lower than GTA with price to income ration much lower than GTA.
HAVE YOU EVEN BEEN THERE, IN ANY OF THESE CITIES?
To compare GTA with Barcelona or Madrid should be capitally punished crime.
—————————-
In contrast there are still 2-bed condos (900-100 sqf) in midtown Toronto that could be had for about $550K.
Go ahead and buy them.
To compare a cheapo glass and steel, small, cold, noisy condo with huge maintenance with a really nice European apartment THAT HAS NO MAINTENANCE WHATSOEVER is an idiocy.
————————–
For that you get great public schools, transit, low-crime, etc. If you have the 20% down, then your mortgage is less than $2,100, and when you add taxes and maintenance it’s less than $3K. Still very doable for many families across GTA, but no, they HAVE TO have a house. Draw your own conclusions.
Great public schools? Great transit? Are you nuts or high? You are truly living in another world here.
GTA was the city with the worst traffic in NA 10 years ago.
And by 3 k I assume you meant per month (maintenance and fees for a condo)
—————————
Only a delusional real estate agent can post such non-sense. I guess you are getting pretty hungry these days, Eh?
off to a good start for 2017, :)….this following a banner year in 2016
a crash in housing/tsx would help my % of precious metals
#46 Entrepreneur on 01.11.17 at 7:39 pm
“It almost feels like the silence before the storm, so quiet. Do you feel it? If there is a heaven and hell this is it folks, people make it and some leaders should not be leaders. We might as well have robots as leaders if that is the best they come up with, lol.”…..
…..”People of a nation are important to that nation.”
Well, well. We now have intuitive computing capability of all kinds, why not robotic government? No more need for selfie budgets, outrageous redecorating budgets, insane travel and limo allowances, no cases of wine hidden in the back room for those high-level monthly meetings, no $12 per glass OJ, no more waste….and no, I’m not talking about re-purposing the bozos handling Phoenix contract….no, no, robots can handle that too.
What a superlative idea. Pan-societal, continuous input on all issues that matter in a, for example, Blockchain database. Wild idea or a truly democratic, highly advanced society? No lobbying, no partisanship, no waste.
If we are indeed facing a jobless future, money wasted on government must be eliminated.
“#35 Ret on 01.11.17 at 7:08 pm
Deposits held by CIBC and Home Capital banks are CDIC insured. Some credit unions will be hit harder and their deposits are not CDIC insured.
All the banks and CU’s continue to lend to anybody for anything as far as I can see.”
I just want to point out that this is incorrect. Credit Unions in Ontario have the same deposit insurance as the big banks and it is provided by DICO (deposit insurance corporation of Ontario). Credit Unions in Alberta actually have a 100% deposit guarantee not just $100k.
Real Estate is local. Some areas of Canada it will go up, some areas it will go down. It will always be in demand. There will always be a pool of responsible, qualified buyers that want to purchase real estate. Not every millennial is borrowing from Mom for a down payment, just the ones that affirm your bias are.
Would it amaze you to learn that there are members of my generation that have jobs, save money and live within our means? I mean it is boring news and doesn’t affirm the bias of the wrinklies so it is understandable that it is not common knowledge. Unfortunately the millenials tweeting their gripes via twitter and the small percentage of us that occupied Wall Street get more attention than those of us that just go about our lives. It may actually be more common then you think!
Meanwhile, in Vancouver…
http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/british-columbia/royal-lepage-report-q4-2016-1.3932424
#157 Stock Picker:- There were signs of warfare in Canada long ago as described in old newspapers from Canada. Right here in Ontario by archeologist digs they found the weapons and body bones buried in good condition. This historical knowledge was not for us to know because they were giants of great stature up to nine feet tall.
Hey Garth, are you smarter than a housing analyst? http://news.buzzbuzzhome.com/2017/01/big-data-with-big-ben-smarter-than-housing-analyst-2017.html
Silly question. — Garth
#43 Metaxa on 01.11.17 at 7:30 pm
My property tax last year, with the old guy discount, was around $2,000.
I back onto a salmon stream with close to an acre of woodland directly behind.
MY smokehouse in the back yard has few rules, you bring me your salmon and I’ll smoke it and give you most of what you brought back. I can do a lox style, cold smoke or a First Nation style air dried and hot smoked.
A friend drops by periodically with pork bellies. I sit, drink his beer and supervise as he preps them, brines and cures them. Then, a few days later I again supervise while he sets the smokehouse up and hangs the bellies and proceeds to make bacon.
Again, he gets almost all of his bacon back.
Oh, and I get door to door mail delivery.
All that for $2,000 a year.
Most of you live in the wrong place.
Life is good.
—
It sounds good! Although I believe you are older than me. As a younger fellow living in the city, something similar would be a goal of mine for the future.
#156 Ron
What Gentle is worrying about and apparently believes is possible is a war being started by accident.
But thanks for your effort.
#151 CJBob
I think that’s a great trade, but of course I am on record as being a loonie bear.
Very things (other than Vancouver crack shacks) go up in a straight line forever, so the US buck is going to have setbacks here and there.
I’m not 100% confident in my forecast for a lower loonie (hence I hedged and covered almost 1/3 of my short position a while back), but it seems to me that rate hikes by the Fed in 2017 will NOT be matched by the BoC.
Or at least there will be a delay by the BoC responding.
That sounds to me like a huge headwind for the loonie.
And then there’s the trade protectionism movement…that is never good for a small player like Canada.
But you never know, maybe I am suffering from confirmation bias?
@Content, post #158:
My body mass index is well within normal, (23.5) and I have no pets so bring it on! My only request to governments who would bring in such taxes is stop using the proceeds to subsidise wealthy home owners who need no financial help. There are far better places to spend a quarter billion dollars.
#149 Trader Jim ‘People who cry ‘why does he keep doing that?’ are clueless. ‘
Agreed…..The guy is not an idiot. He’s a billionaire who just got elected President. He knows EXACTLY what he is doing…he’s playing 5 dimensional chess while everyone is playing chequers.
He choose to do this to save the American Republic which has been totally corrupted over the last 40 or so years. Read his Gettysburg speech for the low down.
The machine is fighting back, witness the ridiculous last gasp smearing/leaks from the Intelligence community. Not too mention vote recounts/riots/etc..
Came across this website a few months ago…..and suddenly it all made sense.
https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/01/11/tripwire-alert-the-intelligence-shadow-war-final-act/
Stop complaining and invest some money in your country.
Buy a house. Things are different here on the North. Nobody comes here except refugees and we make our own rules. Nobody can figure us because people knows we are here but is cold and nobody cares.
———————————————–
#164 Euro observer on 01.12.17 at 1:18 pm
Only a delusional real estate agent can post such non-sense. I guess you are getting pretty hungry these days, Eh?
————————————————
Sure, anybody that has different opinion than yours is a real estate agent, whatever.
—————————–
… Berlin, Frankfurt, Vienna, Rome, Milan, Barcelona, Madrid are far cheaper…
—————————–
Before you make more ignorant comments, just try to educate yourself and maybe get out of Canada once in a while. I challenge you to find a 90 sqm apartment in either Barcelona or Madrid for example in a great neighbourhood that are less expensive than the examples I gave in Toronto. Good luck :)
As a matter of fact I’ve been to all cities you listed (and many other European cities) with the exception of Berlin, and I have lived in Europe for many years as well. The simple fact is that when you consider standard of living, prime housing in large European cities is much more unaffordable compared to TO.
Toronto cannot compete with old, world class European cities (lifestyle and infrastructure wise), however Toronto has one thing going that most big European cities don’t – better job market. It’s a simple fact that most of the money and jobs in Canada are concentrated in Toronto, and if you don’t agree you are beyond help.
Let’s see your cheapo Euro apartments then?
43 Metaxa
I back onto a salmon stream with close to an acre of woodland directly behind.
All that for $2,000 a year.
Most of you live in the wrong place.
Life is good.
=========================
Metaxa, what is the name of this magical place?!
Hey Ogopogo,it seems strange to me if things are so good up in Kelowna that this generous person would take 155k off their asking price.
Now trying to sell it 173k below assessment.
There has been 17 listed price reductions in Kelowna in 2017.
Hey D.A…Cabbage Patch Clark says Vancouver is a world class city and to prove it we have internet now…
M42BC
309 Tanager DR, Kelowna
Dec 23:$1,050,000.00
Jan 7: $895,000.00
Change: – 155000.00 -15%
https://evaluebc.bcassessment.ca/property.aspx?_oa=RDAwMDBOMUcxVg==
#138 YOU PEOPLE ARE SOOO STUPID on 01.12.17 at 9:54 am
“Dear renters….enjoy your eviction/rent increases notices as we the landlords get wealthy beyond compare……….
Damn, you people are stupid!!”
It’s amazing how quickly you can learn the rules and regulations of the Residential Tenancy Act (where applicable) and things you discover while fighting illegal rent increases or illegal evictions. How quickly you become familiar with phone numbers of municipal building departments when you discover that the addition the landlord built was done without permit. How quickly you make friends at the municipal bylaws/complaints & enforcements when the landlord runs an illegal secondary suites. But one that beats them all is the CRA “snitch line”, just in case the landlord “forgot” to report all that rental income, or claimed expenses not related to the rental suite or if evicted tenants for the favourite “personal use of property” would need to comply with new rules for “change of use” that will have tax implications. Greed …… sometimes can lead to a life of headache.
#141 };-) aka Devil’s Advocate on 01.12.17 at 10:12 am
“The world has discovered Canada and Kelowna in particular” – lol I have never seen OK’s beaches so empty in the past two summers. Hotels could be head for a heavy discounted prices even within a week of long weekends. So much celebration in the mids of summer that the only Kokanee you could see was the dead ones washing up on the shores of Lake Country, Kelowna, Peachland… all the way to Penticton.
“Kelowna’s medical services are top notch.” – you mean 5 days spent in bed in a hallway of Kelowna’s hospital, subjected to constant annoying buzzing sounds while waiting for crucial operation? Situation only remedied when patient took a video of this conditions to local media?
“Kelowna IS a Four Seasons Playground.
A city that used to be “newly weds and nearly deads” Kelowna has changed dramatically as Mellinnials become the biggest cohort and move to Kelowna for the lifestyle and affordability and JOBS.”
You referring to the dreadlocked hair millennials that will come out of nowhere and surrounds you while you take a small nap on a beach, only to find out later that you wallet is gone? Jobs? – picking grapes for min wage or cleaning hotel bathrooms?
“Kelowna Real Estate is a relative bargain… for now, but that is changing FAST.” – yes it is changing fast. The OK’s RE has been slow since 2011, at least. Got worse in the past couple of yrs due to AB downturn. The only thing that went up was this year’s assessments. Yet properties that been sitting on the mrkt for months (some for yrs), still sitting at the same or lower prices. Some keep re-appearing after the listings expired.
‘Canada is a Ponzi scheme. Millennials are screwed. Wait until CPP collapses under its own wait. We’ll be begging to immigrate to China within 25 years’
——————————————
The whole FIAT CURRENCY system is a worldwide ponzi scheme.
”That’s the point of the carbon tax – to change behaviour towards energy conservation and lower emissions – by making profligate use expensive. Next, sell the truck and get something more fuel efficient.”
—————————————————————–
I see, so if someone does all of this stuff you mention, they will remove the carbon tax for these people. Not likely, it’s simply an excuse to get more tax from everyone.
—————————————–
You got that right. remember in the early 1990’s when cheap little cars like the 3-cyl GEO Metro became so popular. The powers-that-be had hollywood move quickly to squash their appeal and came up with the SUV as the next must-have thing. Can’t let people actually cut their fuel consumption.
#123 pBrasseur on 01.12.17 at 7:41 am
As rotten as she is what is the alternative to Christy Clark?
More wingnut lefties.
So there you go…
…………………………………………………..
Chrisy Clark has filled her pockets with hard earned Middle class pay cheques.
You don’t reward that by extending her term. You give the job to a wingnut. There is not bigger insult. Besides the wingnuts now have a very low bar… it will be easy for them to do a better job. Goodbye Marvin K. Christy…. would you please GO NOW!
”This is an absolute lie.
Berlin, Frankfurt, Vienna, Rome, Milan, Barcelona, Madrid are far cheaper and much better cities to live than GTA with house prices much lower than GTA with price to income ration much lower than GTA.
HAVE YOU EVEN BEEN THERE, IN ANY OF THESE CITIES?
To compare GTA with Barcelona or Madrid should be capitally punished crime.”
i have been to 3 of those cities and they ARE NOT ‘far better cities’ to live in than the GTA. In fact, I would never live in Berlin, Rome or Madrid
just because you think something ‘is better’ doesnt make it so
About time…Too many speculators in the GTA local and foreign! A Toronto councillor is renewing calls to implement a foreign buyers tax to cool down the city’s red-hot real estate market. Hope its a 20% ….
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/toronto-councillor-wants-foreign-buyers-tax-1.3932456
Re: #167 Guy in Calgary on 01.12.17 at 1:38 pm
Credit unions in British Columbia will be among the first ones to declare bankruptcy. Then we’ll see what the depositors get back if anything. Deposit guarantees mean nothing. CDIC insured also means nothing but the first ones will probably get repaid the latter ones not so lucky.
I’ve been trying to refinance a commercial property — which is profitable, fully tenanted, and has a 50% debt:equity and I’m having a HELLUVA time getting approvals (and they want a personal guarantee!)
Mind you, it’s not a 7 figure deal, which may be the reason why no one is jumping, but how are home owners getting mortgages for 90% debt and horrendous debt service ratios and I can’t?!!
#178 Prince Polo
43 Metaxa
I back onto a salmon stream with close to an acre of woodland directly behind.
All that for $2,000 a year.
Most of you live in the wrong place.
Life is good.
=========================
Metaxa, what is the name of this magical place?!
A town on north Vancouver Island.
3 Stop lights. Rush hour means waiting maybe a light cycle.
But, could be anywhere…I engage with my community, my neighbours. I be helpful when I can. In turn its not uncommon for me to arrive home to find a bucket of fresh prawns on my doorstep.
I don’ care how they vote or what they earn or if they save or not.
Lady across the street loves my beef stew and can’t/won’t make it despite my giving her the recipe. So I make double batches and lay some on her. My payback is she makes killer dill pickles and she keeps us in supply year round.
I subscribe to the Louis CK philosophy…the only reason to worry about what is in someone else’s bowl is to worry if they have enough.
here is the thing…a bottle of booze here costs exactly what it does in Vancouver, a house about 1/4.
Wages on the other hand trail Vancouver by maybe 10-20%.
I no longer work but if I was I’d be making 90% of a Vancouver resident, pay the same for my booze and one quarter the housing costs.
I’ve got another neighbour, the other side. You know how you have young families? And you end up with either a Yummy Mommy or a Mommy with a Tummy?
Well, I have the Yummy Mommy.
All that and free pickles.
I can’t get over how great life is.
#150 Ronaldo on 01.12.17 at 10:53 am
———————————–
Actually if you change your behaviour you ARE taxed less.
My opinion, Bank of Canada spoils the consumer by giving low rate borrowing cost. This low interest rate is intended to make easier during the 2007- 2009 years and when we get back to the speed of economy they waited to long to rise and now it too late to rise because its time to hit that recession cycle again. What are they thinking, teaching consumer and new generation to borrow money and live all the time ?? Bank love this because its volume increased @ low cost gives them massive profit.
By the rule, one should spend 30-35% on this earning to mortgage payment, based on this market lots of them are paying over 40-50% of earning, so no room to move and chance to fall in higher rate, big time.
Greed of Hungry investor and bank make new generation cry for long time. Its time to change some basic rule for borrowing money for owing the home and living and Higher rate for investor then this will be better for all.
#182 Pete
”You got that right. remember in the early 1990’s when cheap little cars like the 3-cyl GEO Metro became so popular. The powers-that-be had hollywood move quickly to squash their appeal and came up with the SUV as the next must-have thing. Can’t let people actually cut their fuel consumption.”
——————————————————————
I remember well. Since that time my wife and I have owned 1 Sprint, 1 Geo, 1 S15, and 2 S10s. Awesome little vehicles. We did our part for the environment and didn’t get any rebates as a result. Change behaviour and you will be taxed less. Yea right?
@Pete, post #182:
Since when did Hollywood come up with the SUV as the next must-have thing? I don’t recall that happening, those people who chose SUVs did so on their own. They obviously weren’t bothered by the higher operating costs. I’m 56 years old and in my life have seen fuel prices go up and down like a yo yo since the energy crisis of 1973-74. Ultimately I figure your best defence is a cheap to run car, like the fuel sipping 4 cylinder compact and subcompact cars I’ve owned. It’s mainly driven by economics, but if it’s environmentally better that’s an added bonus.
This can’t be good in regard to deferred payment of property taxes. BC is crazy. I was wondering what happens should the house be underwater when they sell.
I just read the following who gets paid first in BC should there be a shortfall and house goes to foreclosure.
1) realestate commission
2) unpaid property taxes
3) any other monies before foreclosing lenders
4) court costs
5) money owed to foreclosing lender
How long can those unpaid taxes keep piling on before some of these loans are underwater… then it’s not in their best interest to foreclose and who pays for the mess should the lender collapse? Seems like the BC government has put everyone at risk by kicking the can down the road.
Hope I got this all wrong.
#187 Yorkville Renter:
“I’ve been trying to refinance a commercial property — which is profitable, fully tenanted, and has a 50% debt:equity and I’m having a HELLUVA time getting approvals (and they want a personal guarantee!)
Mind you, it’s not a 7 figure deal, which may be the reason why no one is jumping, but how are home owners getting mortgages for 90% debt and horrendous debt service ratios and I can’t?!!”
Weird. I just got mine refinanced a few weeks ago. Not even fully tenanted (basement is cleared out right now while I do some renos). Bank called and said do you want a good deal on a five year fixed? I said ya and we did the paperwork. Wasn’t even my suggestion. Original mortgage was variable and had two years left, they waived all the early break fees and put me into a five year fixed at a discount rate. A week later the rates went up. No one can get the rate I got, anymore.