Mr. Market spanks

heavy1

Before we get to today’s really good house porn, be brave. Mortgages are going up.

Yup, all that technical claptrap and bond market gibberish I’ve been throwing at you for the last few weeks is having the predicted result. Starting Monday, five-year closed home loans at trendsetting RBC will cost 3.29% – which is still cheap, but also represents a 9% increase from the 2.99% the bank offered a few weeks ago. Funding costs for the bankers have been swelling lately as bond yields tick higher, and this is a taste of what’s to come.

Yup. So much for that phoney little housing renaissance. It lasted a week.

In fact, there is far more hurt than horny in the real estate market across the land. Let’s jump from one coast to the other for some evidence. In the east, poor Halifax is sinking faster than one of those idiot submarines the Brits pawned off on we colonials. Sales are down by about 30%, and prices continue to slag – but not enough to counter a collapse in demand.

“There is no spring market,” according to one long-time broker, who’s seeing near-empty open houses and properties sitting on the market for months, not weeks (90 days is now the average). Long forgotten is the federal frigate-building contract which was supposed to revive the harbour and send house prices soaring. All it did was sucker in some fools who went down with the ship.

Wails realtor Jeremiah Wallace on his blog:

“Our inflated inventory and lack of buyers is making the selling process a complicated one for many people in the HRM. Now I could sit here and fluff over the reasons why, or what you can do differently if you happen to be trying to sell your home with no luck, but I would be the broken record and the “obvious” point which you may be aware of…PRICE! I briefly touched on some facts a few weeks ago with regards to this topic but it’s one that I address on a daily basis. While enhancements, renovations, staging and every other trick in the book makes your home more marketable (professionally done that is) and it may help sell you listing sooner and for more money, or at least that’s the theory. No amount of staging is going to sell a home that is $30,000 over priced. Many people have a figure in mind or “what they need” to get out of their home to break even or turn a profit, but as I mentioned before its market condition and the consumers that drive the price. And unfortunately, we are in a buyers market…”

BTW, the average Halifax house sells for $282,000. Meanwhile in Victoria, it costs $515,000, also waterlogged and sinking. Considering the average household income in this damp city is $76,600, no wonder a major correction is underway – but painfully.

Reports our correspondent:

There are over 250 houses currently listed at over $1,000,000 in Victoria and Saanich Peninsula. Clearly there is a huge correction and a huge amount of hurt still to come here. Any listing over $800,000, outside the main core or with acreage is just not selling. We are also seeing an increasing number of houses being shown unoccupied – completely empty or staged with rented furnishings. Fairly major clue there.

Could what’s happening in Victoria set a pattern for other places where people have created trophy houses in order to show how business acumen, guts, success and pure talent can lead to mental defect? Let’s hope not. Who would be around then to feed the rest of us our property porn?

Here are three homes of note, now suffering Mr. Market’s spanking.

  • Eagles Landing.” 3275 Campion Rd . Originally listed at $10.8 million. Now $6.7 million.
  • Ardmore Hall.” 9344 Ardmore Drive. First listed at $13 million, then reduced to $8.4 million, then $7.99 million, and (this week) $6,188,000.
  • Villa Madrona.” 660 Lands End Road. It hit the market at $19.2 million, became $18.7 million, then $9.9 million, and (this week) $6,998,000

The total dollar reduction for these three homes is almost $27 million, for an average decline of 57.5%. Says our correspondent: “Suspect bankruptcy trustees are circling like vultures.”

Ardmore Hall - 38% off!

ARDMORE1

Eagles Landing - 53% saving!

EAGLES LANDING

Villa Madrona - 64% reduction! Hurry!

174 comments ↓

#1 Jobs Report on 06.07.13 at 8:11 pm

Garth,

Why no mention of today’s jobs report?

The report showed a strong growth in employment in the construction sector.

How can this be, when housing starts and home sales are supposed to be down?

Not trying to mock you, I’d actually appreciate your insight on this.

Have a great weekend!

More construction jobs in the spring. What a shock. — Garth

#2 first on 06.07.13 at 8:11 pm

first suckerrrrrrs

#3 T.O. & GTA bidding wars debunked June 07 on 06.07.13 at 8:15 pm

http://recharts.blogspot.ca/2013/06/to-sfh-bidding-wars-debunked-jun-07.html

http://recharts.blogspot.ca/2013/06/gta-sfh-bidding-wars-debunked-jun-07.html

#4 wow on 06.07.13 at 8:16 pm

wow

#5 PokerCat on 06.07.13 at 8:17 pm

Looking at these homes, I can’t relate. This is a different world from the one I live in. I have no sympathy for people this rich.

#6 visorman30 on 06.07.13 at 8:19 pm

It’s really a shame what’s happening in Halifax. Maritimes haven’t always had the most prosperous times and to have a bunch of “equity” lost in the home must be a tough pill to swallow.

#7 City that smells like it sounds on 06.07.13 at 8:19 pm

Oh to be furst. It would be a wonderful thing!

#8 AK on 06.07.13 at 8:22 pm

Wow. So who is the owener of Villa Madrona?

#9 jaguar on 06.07.13 at 8:22 pm

Mercy!

#10 TurnerNation on 06.07.13 at 8:22 pm

Attn. new blog dogs. The following usernames are still available; reserve yours today.

Fancy Coloured Kias

Sticky Figures

Garth said Gold

Ad hominem ad infinitum

Ingot we Trust

Pied Paper Brigade

REITa MacNeil

Chancellor Rebalancer

McGarthyism

Otto B. VanDelusional

Stephen who?

Burn your BRAs

Reserved:
Blog Dog Poloz

#11 jaguar on 06.07.13 at 8:23 pm

Love you, Garth…

#12 The T shirt shoud read "I am not Real Estate smart.." on 06.07.13 at 8:27 pm

or perhaps Real Estate Agent :-)) smart…

#13 William Bell on 06.07.13 at 8:28 pm

First (?) and thanks !!

Is Keystone XL going to give Albertans RE immunity ? So would my friend boldly claims , more oil = more job = more money = more RE value.

#14 LJ on 06.07.13 at 8:29 pm

Just yesterday, [email protected] was trying to get me to move my money at the bank from a “high interest e-savings account” paying a generous 1.2% over to a “better” rate over at the Mortgage Arm of the institution that is paying a whopping 1.25%. She said that I would be much better off in the long run with this switch.

I asked if the funds would still be liquid. She said yes, I would just have to set up an appointment with one of their “investment councillors” to make the change and whenever I wanted to take some money out I would just have to make another appointment and it would just take a couple of days after that.

Now, 0.05% is nothing to sneeze at…

Ah, who are we kidding, they must be desperate for funding the mortgage portfolios if they are telling customers at the wicket that this is a good idea.

I asked her if I could take out the cash currently in the account so that I could move it to another bank that was not quite so desperate and she said that it would take a couple of days after I transferred the money to my chequing account… And, this is not a massive sum.

Something’s up.

#15 Freedom First on 06.07.13 at 8:31 pm

See……how much $$$$$ one had, has nothing to do with
financial literacy. Even the moneyed can be living beyond their means, meaning house hornyness is an illness affecting all people no matter their net worth at their time of house horny buying spree. Many Canadians are not only not diversified and liquid, they are also unbalanced.

#16 AK on 06.07.13 at 8:31 pm

#2 first on 06.07.13 at 8:11 pm
first suckerrrrrrs
——————————————————————-
#7 City that smells like it sounds on 06.07.13 at 8:19 pm
Oh to be furst. It would be a wonderful thing!
——————————————————————–

Two pathetic deadbeats………….

#17 TD & RBC drop advertised 5yr rates to a new low just b4 today's jobs report on 06.07.13 at 8:32 pm

Garth

This does not fit well with what you are saying above about rates going up next week

https://twitter.com/CdnMortgageNews/status/343151457660436480

Interesting timing: TD & RBC drop advertised 5yr rates to a new low just b4 today’s jobs report, which compels them to raise rates next week

#18 45north on 06.07.13 at 8:37 pm

PokerCat: Looking at these homes, I can’t relate. This is a different world from the one I live in. I have no sympathy for people this rich.

they’re not!

sort of like Kettleby Ontario with the descant

#19 Mr. Market spanks — Greater Fool – Authored by Garth Turner – The Troubled Future of Real Estate | The Affluent Boomer on 06.07.13 at 8:43 pm

[…] via Mr. Market spanks — Greater Fool – Authored by Garth Turner – The Troubled Future of Real Esta…. […]

#20 Wilbur on 06.07.13 at 8:47 pm

Garth,
what are your thoughts about the impact interest rates will have on the stock market when Housing prices return to normal and interest rates return to normal levels?
Do we need to be concerned about our investments in the Canada/USA, when interest rates return to normal?

Worry about it in two years. — Garth

#21 T.O. Bubble Boy on 06.07.13 at 8:49 pm

Time.com describes “The New Retirement” in the U.S., where you still have a mortgage, but get all kinds of hidden benefits from the “financial flexibility”.
(hmmm – sounds like it was written by a mortgage broker!)

http://business.time.com/2013/05/28/the-new-retirement-why-you-dont-have-to-pay-off-your-mortgage/?xid=rss-topstories

#22 Saint Herb on 06.07.13 at 8:52 pm

On Lang and Oleary they were talking RE and Lang sounded like she reads your blog Garth. She was suggesting that prices would drop after sales and they were talking bonds moving the mortgage rate up.

Its good to see some of this stuff on MSM. Strange thing, when MSM says prices are still going up, my wife says we should buy now. When they finally say prices could come down, she says, “and you believe them”. I can’t win.

You really need to be a saint to weather this RE market.

http://www.cbc.ca/player/News/TV+Shows/Lang+%26+O%27Leary+Exchange/ID/2390190576/

#23 Halifax Observer on 06.07.13 at 9:04 pm

Glad to see you included Jeremiah Wallace’s take on the Halifax market in your post tonight Garth. I follow his blog weekly for market updates. I appreciate his honesty and totally agree with his take on the market. I am afraid that the future is not very bright for this province. Tough times ahead.

#24 Ronaldo on 06.07.13 at 9:06 pm

Quite a video indeed. Seems the more people have the more they waste. What’s it all about really? Ego? Yep, even the rich are not immune to real estate lust. Sure signs of things to come.

#25 valleyrenter on 06.07.13 at 9:07 pm

From the trenches on the Wet Coast. Buddy of mine got laid off today from his construction job. They were building concrete boxes in the sky downtown. Eight months ago , things were booming with this company, he was even offered to work for them in Australia if he wanted (go figure, ride another Commonwealth bubble). Sucks that he is out of work, luckily he rents and is mobile. Their target market downtown? Specuvesters and Asians (he never heard of HAM till I mentioned it to him, hat tip to this blog for teaching me that one). So much for the “growth in construction jobs”!

#26 observer on 06.07.13 at 9:09 pm

These so much BS in the media, you don’t know what to believe anymore.

Micheal Levy from CKNW yesterday was pumping hard. He mention it would take a huge rise in interest rates to crack the market. We’ll Mr. Levy a 1% increase is a 33% rise in your mortgage payments. a 2% is 66% . EG on a 800,000 mortgage @ 2.99% = 1993% per month.

A 1% rise to 3.99 = 2660 which is a rise of 667 per month. If the average canadians are barely scraping from paycheck to paycheck I’m sure this will cause major problems.

Also Cameron Muir has been saying no bubble, this are going up up and up. Just this week he comes out and says we are now at the bottom. Hello how can we be at the bottom when he’s been pumping everything is up up and up. What a BS’er , he is Canada’s Number 1 terrorist!

#27 Halifax Observer on 06.07.13 at 9:13 pm

BTW Garth, after five years of following your blog, I finally had the chance to meet you…….two weeks ago I was in the bathroom at the Halifax airport and you walked in. I said “Hello,” but decided the setting wasn’t the best place to get my copy of Moneyroad autographed. I would have met up with you in the terminal after but your entourage was a little too intimidating. Maybe next time.

#28 waiting on 06.07.13 at 9:13 pm

“Eagles Landing” oh where to begin.
For only 6.7 million you can be a chicken farmer.
“The property is zoned agricultural so “one” may have animals, chickens etc.” That’s alway been my dream, to have chickens. Oh wait, I think I can do that in my backyard in East Van.

#29 Tom Vu on 06.07.13 at 9:16 pm

Obviously many people with useless degrees and/or work for Gov’t and/or can’t get date posting ahead of me.

#30 Julia on 06.07.13 at 9:17 pm

You could either buy Villa Madrona or, for just a cool million more and $2700 mnth in condo fees, you can have an ugly 2 bedroom glass and concrete box near Yorkville.

http://www.realtor.ca/PropertyDetails.aspx?PropertyID=13090293

#31 What about CMHC? on 06.07.13 at 9:21 pm

Villa Madrona – the music sound tragic than classic to me!

Was F going to fold CMHC in a couple of years? I remember seeing something like that on Globe and Mail. I could be wrong.

#32 East Van on 06.07.13 at 9:23 pm

No Problems in Greater Van re market. Lots of constuction jobs, and everybody is a re millionaire.

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/commercial-real-estate/Sears+applies+build+seven+towers/8490662/story.html

#33 Editor on 06.07.13 at 9:24 pm

In a part of the 905 that has a lot of newish construction that’s listing these days for $800K to $1M, there are a surprising number of well-appointed 4-5 BR houses to rent — asking healthy rents, too. As in, too high/are you high? Where are all the well-off renters going to come from? What kind of math lies behind the asking rents? Are all these amateur landlords trying to close the price-to-rent gap by raising rents instead of lowering prices? The strangeness of this market…

#34 Nemesis on 06.07.13 at 9:31 pm

…”…sinking faster than one of those idiot submarines the Brits pawned off on we colonials.” – Hon. GT

OldPol, I am reliably informed that the RCN’s submersible ProcurementCommittee was unduly swayed (or should that be SWAGGED) by a particularly GoodShowing on the DemonstrationCruise.

http://tinyurl.com/nqhsykd

Oh yes, and just between the two of us… their new ones are no better….

[UK Telegraph] – HMS Astute: nuclear submarine beset by design problems and construction failures

http://tinyurl.com/d8qo34v

#35 East Van on 06.07.13 at 9:39 pm

Interesting site for Vancouver and Fraser Valley stats.

http://dreamhomehub.com/stats/

#36 Saint Herb on 06.07.13 at 9:54 pm

#33 Editor

That is exactly where I am looking for a rental, and it seems the rentals have risen 2-500$ in just a month. Some of those houses are for sale and rent at the same time on MLS. They want $3,000 and up. I asked myself the same question. WHO is going to rent these houses?

I am having a lot of trouble justifying such high rent. How much should my income be to afford $3000 rent. I’m not sure but I don’t think many people can afford that rate comfortable and if they could they would probably buy a house or already own one. Rent is based on income, not mortgage rates. Seems they are charging according to there mortgage payment.

I read on this blog once that your rent should be 25% of your net income. I would need to make $300,000/year to afford $3,000.

#37 will on 06.07.13 at 10:11 pm

My theory on Villa Madrona: It’s probably never been lived in. Someone built this nonsense not realizing how bad it is. Like really bad poetry. Bad art. So many unrelated parts glued together. Each part has its own meaning but all together it has no meaning. It’s a pastiche of someone’s idea of the best real estate ideas all put together on one acreage. And the result is ridiculous. I suspect a personality disorder of some sort caused this agglomeration of rooms. A form of schizophrenia perhaps. How many people would inhabit such a place? What was the vision? An extended family?

Probably the creator of it had some grand vision. Or maybe it was just a vulgar plan to sell it to HAM. The whole thing should be bulldozed into the sea.

#38 Tkid on 06.07.13 at 10:48 pm

#35 Saint Herb, overpriced rentals and my last experience with an amateur landlord drove me out to Burlington. Yeah, the commute is tiresome, but the landlord is a professional company and the rent for a 3 year old rental building is half what anywhere comparable in Toronto wants.

I will wait it out in the burbs until Toronto regains some sense of sanity.

#39 A Nightmare on Bay Street on 06.07.13 at 10:54 pm

Villa Madrona is one the most hilarious display of grandiloquent bad taste I saw in my life. lolol Im serious.

Man, it looks like an old spy movie “rich vilain” from the 70s lolol. The score should be wawa electric guitar instead.

Thx Garth for this. Man, I cant stop laughing.

#40 Canadian Watchdog on 06.07.13 at 10:55 pm

#26 observer

These so much BS in the media, you don’t know what to believe anymore.

Chris Hedges at University of Western Ontario – The State of Journalism

Now it used to be that newspapers had a monopoly connecting sellers with buyers. That monopoly is now broken through the internet. It's far easier for sellers to target buyers through particular websites, or.. I mean, they don't need newsprint anymore.

Indeed. They don't need newsprint anymore, which is why the Toronto Star, Globe and Mail et al will pretty much print (or not print) whatever their big five real estate broker clients want. Who by the way, have a total monopoly of 80% of all transactions within the GTA. Add one stat-manipulating RE board along with another developer owned presale board and you've got a supreme real estate oligarchy.

There is no interest to provide buyers with useful resources and data. Buyers are own their own.

#41 45north on 06.07.13 at 11:04 pm

will: My theory on Villa Madrona: Someone built this nonsense not realizing how bad it is.

that was my feeling – totally pretentious – I’m thinking that the mortgage is not standard – more like a personal guarantee with somebody’s downtown Vancouver house and entire business on the line – as well as Villa Madrona

#42 Frank Dean on 06.07.13 at 11:18 pm

“Starting Monday, five-year closed home loans at trendsetting RBC will cost 3.29% – which is still cheap, but also represents a 9% increase from the 2.99% the bank offered a few weeks ago.”

Why just say 9%?

0.29% / 2.99% = 9.7%, which you should round up to 10%! That’s an extra percentage point of drama!

Interest rates will rise significantly if and when the economy starts growing faster than its current anemic pace. If Garth is right about the housing sector slowdown, and there’s every reason to believe he is, growth will continue to be sluggish.

Note that while the 5-year GofC bond yield is up from last month, it’s at the same level it was in January, a level it was at back in Feb. 2012 as well. Every time it ticks up a bit, Garth gets all excited about interest rates showing a sustained increase. The subsequent ticks down don’t seem to provoke the same volume of commentary.

#43 The Man From Nantucket on 06.07.13 at 11:28 pm

More construction jobs in the spring. What a shock. — Garth
Two seasons in most Canadian cities – Winter, and Construction

Best snappy answer in a long time, Garth. Can’t wait to finish reading the peanut gallery

#44 Victor V on 06.07.13 at 11:28 pm

Bridle Path price drop from $13,495,000 to $10,198,888: http://themashcanada.blogspot.ca/2013/06/and-it-went-for_9655.html

#45 KommyKim on 06.07.13 at 11:32 pm

Re: #20 Wilbur on 06.07.13 at 8:47 pm
Garth,
what are your thoughts about the impact interest rates will have on the stock market when……

Look at what has happened to REIT and Bond prices in the last month after the US Fed reminded us that QE will eventually end. Equities were all over the map. Shadows of things to come.

Not exactly. Just what was expected. How is that people on this blog cannot differentiate between a correction (as we had in 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2012) and a crash? — Garth

#46 earlybird on 06.07.13 at 11:36 pm

I haven’t Thanked you in awhile! Great Post! I have a few clients in the ‘have to’ sell position as costs have creeped up….a little special assessment here, a little extra property tax there, utilities higher here and there….HELOC madness has eaten up equity and disposable income even for people that bought in 03/04! House poor is hellish! No thanks, I’d rather rent!!

#47 Devore on 06.07.13 at 11:39 pm

The total dollar reduction for these three homes is almost $27 million, for an average decline of 57.5%. Says our correspondent: “Suspect bankruptcy trustees are circling like vultures.”

According to the list vancouverpricedrop keeps, the top 20 reduced listings total nearly $100,000,000 in price drops. Let that sink is for a while.

#48 george on 06.08.13 at 12:29 am

Twenty-Year Anniversary of Market Backstops

#49 Shawn on 06.08.13 at 12:30 am

WHO NEEDS THE SYMPATHY

Number 5 Poker cat saiz:

I have no sympathy for people this rich.

************************************

If they are actually that rich they don’t need your sympathy.

Ardmore hall is nice… could host some nice parties there…

#50 Gregor Samsa on 06.08.13 at 12:34 am

While Rome burns, Stephen Harper is busy re-painting the national airplane red, white, and CPC blue:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2013/06/07/pol-pm-plane-paint-job.html

#51 BC BRING CASH on 06.08.13 at 12:34 am

What exactly does Wallace mean by the comment, break even or turn a profit? Maybe selling for more than you paid is the big profit. of course not taking into account a down payment now not earning capital gains, principal and interest payments,property taxes, utilities, maintenance, homeowner insurance etc… doesn’t count as expenses. What profit?
I had a house for sale in Winnipeg years ago and the agent presented a lousy offer. Way below the price I had paid 6 years earlier and not to mention expensive improvements. I complained the offer was lousy and he said well your going to make a profit of $6000. What do you mean a profit I asked? He replied that since the the offer was $6000 more than the mortgage I had on the property it was a profit. WTF. A profit. Yea right, I lost my ass and this A hole is calling it a profit. I had no choice but to accept the offer and cash in those pretend profits. The RE industry is full scam artists like this clown.

#52 johnny d on 06.08.13 at 12:39 am

Garth,

Gotta bug you about it again… Currency… Saw a CIBC economist on BNN saying the Canadian dollar will be 80-85 cents compared to USD in a couple years. Also Poloz dropped some hints about Canada ramping up exports to support the economy (consumers are tapped out). Best way to do that is to kill our currency. Maybe these guys that say interest rates could go lower might be right on this one.

Seriously, where do you see our dollar going in the next few years? Should we be running to the bank to open USD accounts? Or shall I say, get our ETF’s, REIT’s, and Preferred banks shares in USD?

#53 happy renter on 06.08.13 at 12:45 am

Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.Govt,Navy and many professionals make this city this an expensive city to live because everyone makes good wages.West hills a new housing development is selling out.$400,000 to $550,000 for a house and lots of young families moving in.Nothing but prosperty here in Victoria ,thats for sure.

#54 Andrew Woburn on 06.08.13 at 12:49 am

Info from a Richmond BC agent about the practice of relisting to hide price drops

http://www.shuchatgroup.com/Blog.php/largest-price-declines-for-homes-for-sale-in-richmond-1

#55 This is Wonderland on 06.08.13 at 1:02 am

Opuvomit.

#56 robert on 06.08.13 at 1:14 am

Finally someone who sees through all the half baked realtors,mortgage brokers,bankers,flippers and pimps.WITH A VARIETY OF R/E EXPERIENCE IN RES.AND REC. PROPERTIES and left on my own terms and even left 63 listings behind in Whistler Mtn.
BY 2020 IT WILL BE AN UTTER DISASTER SO GET OUT NOW IF YOU CAN.RENT OR MOVE FAR AWAY.

#57 VanPerfecto on 06.08.13 at 1:23 am

Garth, What are your thoughts on small cap funds for US and Canada. Although some have ridiculously high MER’s some funds like Bisset Micro Cap are showing over 15% return for over 15 years. Seems like a safer bet than a home in Vancouver

#58 MEANWHILE IN EUROPA on 06.08.13 at 1:27 am

Reading all these comments about rates made me curious about European banks. Looks similar. When I called the Banker, he told me these rates are negotiable still, he can get me in for less than three points for ten years.

WohnPlus-Kredit

Zinssatzvereinbarung variabel oder fix möglich

Variabler Zinssatz ab: 2 % p.a.

Fixer Zinssatz

6 Monate fix: 1,750 % p.a.

1 Jahr fix: 1,900 % p.a.

2 Jahre fix: 2,250 % p.a.

3 Jahre fix: 2,375 p.a. %

4 Jahre fix: 2,500 p.a. %

5 Jahre fix: 2,625 p.a. %

10 Jahre fix: 3,250 p.a. %

#59 To The Owners of Villa Madrona on 06.08.13 at 1:38 am

I am absolutely flabbergasted!

You guys tried to sell this over bloated pompous 18th century styled elitist piece of anachronistic real estate for $18.7 million, and the damn place has only 1 bedroom (At least in the video it only shows one bedroom), only 1 bathroom, and NO garage?

What about an office/library/study?

You can try and sell this piece of junk for $699,800, instead of the $6,998,000 you are trying to sell it for now, and it still wouldn’t be worth it.

You’d need a house staff of at least six people to look after this place. And for what? A building that has more in common with a museum than a 21st century home.

OMG, there are not only people out there who are financial morons, but who also have utter bad taste for a realistic home.

Not even Louis XVI wasn’t this out of touch with reality!

Burn the place down, and build something realistic. Its 2013, not 1713!

#60 Mocha on 06.08.13 at 1:41 am

Big G wrote : ” Halifax is sinking faster than one of those idiot submarines the Brits pawned off on we colonials…”

I was p^ssed about that for quite some time. We’re still suckers for that type of scam.

#61 Ted54 on 06.08.13 at 1:46 am

“The total dollar reduction for these three homes is almost $27 million, for an average decline of 57.5%. Says our correspondent: “Suspect bankruptcy trustees are circling like vultures.”

I expect the values of these properties was excessive to begin with so the reduction of 27 million isn’t worth the paper it’s written on. There’s no loss as it was only perceived value. Why dramatize it, OH! I forgot, its GARTH frankenumbers.

The difference between listed prices and lower prices is called a ‘reduction.’ I did not invent the term. — Garth

#62 Mocha on 06.08.13 at 1:47 am

@# 16 AK:

I hear ya! I usually skip the first ten posts in the comments section in order to avoid being annoyed by those taunts. Sometimes I miss some good posts as well unfortunately but it’s still worth it. It’s easy to skip them if you are reading from your phone. Maybe not so easy if on PC or tablet.

#63 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 06.08.13 at 1:53 am

In a few decades, if not a few years, people will write articles/thesis on WTF were people thinking building all these gaudy overpriced homes anywhere and everywhere.

Talk about the herd mentality MEETS irrational exuberance MEETS banksters MEETS……

#64 The Man from Victoria on 06.08.13 at 2:11 am

Read more about Villa Madrona, and its owners, here: http://www.canada.com/story_print.html?id=8344388e-4378-4e5f-a0f6-acb6eb8d45e0&sponsor=

#65 David McDonald on 06.08.13 at 2:13 am

I guess I live in another world. I can’t imagine living there but it’s nice to know there are Canadian craftsmen capable of constructing the villa Madrona.

It is certainly crunch time. A disributed war is going on. Small battles are being waged over real estate prices right across the country. What we see is the fog of war.

#66 Need Sleep on 06.08.13 at 2:28 am

In Winnipeg, http://www.winnipegrealestatenews.com/Resources is reporting that ‘Year-to-date MLS® sales are down 9% ( 4,951/5,434) while dollar volume has decreased 4% ($1.28 billion/$1.33 billion) in comparison to the same period last year.’

Meanwhile, the headline on this article and the headline that the Winnipeg Free Press is going to run is: HIGHEST MONTHLY MLS® DOLLAR VOLUME EVER – A New Monthly Dollar Volume Record Set at $412 Million

#67 Ballingsford on 06.08.13 at 3:49 am

Who built Villa Madrona and why did they build it? They paid a lot of attention to detail.

Did they think they were going to live for a thousand years?

I’m shaking my head in amazement. That place looks haunted!

#68 Julie on 06.08.13 at 4:02 am

Garth,

Why no mention of today’s jobs report?

The report showed a strong growth in employment in the construction sector.

How can this be, when housing starts and home sales are supposed to be down?

Not trying to mock you, I’d actually appreciate your insight on this.

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I’d be curious as to the jobs. If they are mostly bridges and roads they don’t count because govt jobs are funded by tax dollars and not real wealth creating dollars.

#69 Captian and Mrs Slow (tool lazy to insert a link properly on 06.08.13 at 4:05 am

Andrew Hallman does a great job of explaining how to rebalance a portfolio (aka Garth Style)

How to Rebalance

I hope it worked

#70 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 5:26 am

Villa Madrona!?!?!?!?!!!! A THREE!!!! bedroom monument to the horrific taste of (much of) the rich. What a deal!

A teardown. DOESN’T EVEN HAVE CENTRAL AIR. Imagine the cost of THAT retrofit on a place that [email protected]%&#!!

Truly, anyone who can afford 7 mil will rightly BUILD THEIR OWN rather than go for some other nouveau riche gauche idea of taste.

Won’t sell until it hits 2 mil. And then you can spend the 1 mil to AC it and reno all the faux opulence to the recycler to pull it into, say maybe, the 20th century. At least.

Please. Oh all right, for 2 mil, I’ll THINK about it. But it had better come with honorary citizenship!

#71 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 5:34 am

RE: #47 Villa Madrona

P.S. I wouldn’t call the north coast of the Saanich peninsula the heart of ANYTHING. Well, maybe the tip of the big toe of Vancouver Island…. but that’s a bad analogy with all those feet washing ashore.

P.P.S. Can you even GET tsunami insurance?

P.P.P.S. You KNOW you’re in trouble when they don’t even show you the house until a full MINUTE into the vid… did someone DIE in that opera sountrack or what.

Hey… just imagine the wild bikini parties around THAT pool, eh? Rrrrrrrrrrrrrrright.

#72 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 5:38 am

RE: #47 Villa Madrona

I think you can buy a plot at Forest Lawn in LA a LOT cheaper. If you really want to “live” in a mausoleum THAT much.

#73 drydock on 06.08.13 at 6:07 am

Ancient Rome meets the west coast, i think Villa Madrona is kind of cool.
You better have a lot of loot for the upkeep though.

#74 AK on 06.08.13 at 7:46 am

#67 Captian and Mrs Slow (tool lazy to insert a link properly on 06.08.13 at 4:05 am
“Andrew Hallman does a great job of explaining how to rebalance a portfolio (aka Garth Style)”
——————————————————————–

“Benign neglect, bordering on sloth, remains the hallmark of our investment process.” —Warren Buffett

#75 housedoc on 06.08.13 at 8:17 am

That’s not porn.
That’s just nasty.

#76 Ralph Cramdown on 06.08.13 at 8:29 am

#52 happy renter — “Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.”

Not according to StatsCan. Luckily for the delusional, such evidence will soon be a thing of the past. The Stephen Harper Government™* took an axe to StatsCan, because evidence based anything is so passé.

* Please contact the PMO Press Office for information about officially approved Pantone colours, but it ain’t RAF Blue.

#77 World Traveller on 06.08.13 at 8:32 am

I hope buying a house is worth it all for young property virgins.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2014503/The-burnt-generation-They-push-limit-work-AND-home.html

#78 Derek R on 06.08.13 at 8:51 am

#59 Mocha on 06.08.13 at 1:41 am wrote
Big G wrote : ” Halifax is sinking faster than one of those idiot submarines the Brits pawned off on we colonials…”

I was p^ssed about that for quite some time. We’re still suckers for that type of scam.

You’re p^ssed! How do you think I feel? You only had to pay for those turkeys once. I had to pay for them twice: first as a British taxpayer then as a Canadian taxpayer!

I must have been real bad in a previous life to get that much bad karma.

#79 craig on 06.08.13 at 8:52 am

Seems to me like an inordinate amount of time is spent here on interest rates for mortgages, when the real monster in the closet is the rates Banks are allowed to charge on debt!!

Debt, as in Visa rates.

Why are Banks are allowed to pay 1% on savings YET CHARGE 20% on Visa balances and 22% on cash advances??

That is criminal, yet never gets any attention. Maybe if those rates were in line with everything else then folks would be able to manage their debt better and the debt ratio would be much lower.

Yet the F sticks their nose in and tells Manulife it can’t lower its mortgage rate by .2% to 2.6%

But Visa is OK at 20%

Hmmmmmmmmm

Food for thought

http://www.scotiabank.com/ca/en/0,,1113,00.html

#80 craig on 06.08.13 at 8:56 am

http://www.scotiabank.com/ca/en/0,,1113,00.html

#81 Steven on 06.08.13 at 9:41 am

Home ownership, what a privilege for lottery winners, yuppies and government employees. Yes indeed!
When all their housing needs are satisfied who is going to buy their house and at what price?

#82 Billy wild on 06.08.13 at 9:42 am

To the person that posted the Villa Madrona would need to have an air conditioning retrofit. In Victoria??? Lol

#83 TEMPLE on 06.08.13 at 9:51 am

#66 Julie

I’d be curious as to the jobs. If they are mostly bridges and roads they don’t count because govt jobs are funded by tax dollars and not real wealth creating dollars.

I know, right? Can’t do anything useful with roads and bridges. And we all know how tight-fisted people are with pay from “tax dollars”. They never spend any of it!

TEMPLE

#84 Canadian Watchdog on 06.08.13 at 10:01 am

#76 Ralph Cramdown

“Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.”

Actually Ralph, happy renter is correct according to StatsCan's average market income.

Ten thosuand, pre-tax, is not exactly ‘way over’ $90,000 for two employed individuals. The average household income remains south of $80,000. — Garth

#85 Daisy Mae on 06.08.13 at 10:05 am

#5 PokerCat: “Looking at these homes, I can’t relate. This is a different world from the one I live in. I have no sympathy for people this rich.”

******************

I’m not impressed, either. Absolute stupidity.

#86 Ronaldo on 06.08.13 at 10:08 am

#68 Julie –

”I’d be curious as to the jobs. If they are mostly bridges and roads they don’t count because govt jobs are funded by tax dollars and not real wealth creating dollars.”

I havn’t seen too many gov’t workers building roads and bridges here in BC since the gov’t privatized these functions back in the 80’s. So what about building bridges and roads doesn’t count as wealth creation for those contractors and workers who are conracted to build them? And they will all be paying taxes back to the government as well.

#87 Grantmi on 06.08.13 at 10:12 am

Please.. Some one that has access to real estate inside info. stats. Please tell me the name of the idiot that owns Villa Madona. Me,s got to knows.

ONE WORD!! D’Oh!!!

That information was provided in a previous comment. Read everything. There’s a test later. — Garth

#88 Spiltbongwater on 06.08.13 at 10:16 am

That is criminal, yet never gets any attention. Maybe if those rates were in line with everything else then folks would be able to manage their debt better and the debt ratio would be much lower.

#79 craig on 06.08.13 at 8:52 am

Carrying a balance on a credit card and paying 20% or more interest is the epitome of debt management isn’t it Craig?

#89 daystar on 06.08.13 at 10:20 am

One thing worth contemplating while we have been smartly talking about rate movement in the bond markets as equities continue their roll south of the line is just how far rates will move up in the bond markets and what the widening spreads will be between the BoC and 5 year term mortgages before the BoC begins its own ascent, say… in mid to late 2014… early 2015?

I’m thinking the spread will be 3% or more by 2015, maybe a little higher. Thoughts anyone?

#90 Grantmi on 06.08.13 at 10:29 am

Yup sorry Gartho. Had started then missed it. Found it above. Ralph Bodine. Ex sunkist. CEO

Money to burn level. These guys don’t care if they lose millions.. It’s a tax right off for them.

I wonder if he’s related to Jethro Bodine….

#91 Canadian Watchdog on 06.08.13 at 10:42 am

Ten thosuand, pre-tax, is not exactly ‘way over’ $90,000 for two employed individuals. The average household income remains south of $80,000. — Garth

True, however, average market income includes, investment income (including rental income), dividends, pension income etc. Also those numbers are from 2010 (surveyed in 2009) so it wouldn't include the great reflation run we had since that period.

#92 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 06.08.13 at 11:04 am

Re Villa Madrona article posted above( it was from 2005)..

Says it was built on 4 pre existing lots.
Maybe the new owner may but it at “lot value” would re subdivide , demolish and then back to 4 homes.

#93 Taxila on 06.08.13 at 11:07 am

Totally unrelated examples. you are doing the same thing what Realtor companies have been doing.

talk about common man’s homes …. we don’t see a bit of price reduction.

#94 James on 06.08.13 at 11:17 am

The CMHC is the biggest contributor by far to the bubble. It has no logical place in a healthy market, it is toxic to a long term sustainable housing situation in Canada. It needs to be privatized or removed. Then watch house prices fall in half.

#95 Craig on 06.08.13 at 11:29 am

#88 Spiltbongwater

Carrying a balance on a credit card and paying 20% or more interest is the epitome of debt management isn’t it Craig?

You missed the point by a country mile. Interest rates took off during the ’80’s as did the charges for credit cards and rightfully so.

Rates are now at historic lows, yet credit card charges remained untouched for 30 years, @ 20%

People would rather slam hard working home owners and call them names and leave the banks untouched.

Odd, IMO.

#96 Canadian Watchdog on 06.08.13 at 11:45 am

#54 Andrew Woburn

Info from a Richmond BC agent about the practice of relisting to hide price drops.

I've been looking at this relisting problem for a while and have come up with a way to measure its affect. In the following chart you see a three month sum of new listings vs active listings at quarterly-end (GTA). Below is a ratio.

As can be seen, during the late 90s and early 2000s, the ratio was roughly 1:1, meaning for every active listing listed within a quarter period, there was one new listing. Fast forward to today and you can see the ratio has increased to 2:1, implying that for every active listing during a quarter period, there were two new listings. The size and number of new listings over active listings implies that at the end of every month, more listings are purged or expiring that do not show up in month-end inventory, but are likely to be relisted again with a new MLS number.

I believe this was a trending technique amongst realtors that grew over time. Obviously, hiding the original list price and resetting days on the market to zero can benefit a seller and realtor's bottom line.

#97 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 06.08.13 at 11:58 am

Interesting new tactic:

NEW lipstick on s-a-m-e pig

http://whispersfromtheedgeoftherainforest.blogspot.ca/

QUOTE:

In an attempt to hide seller desperation, property listings are pulled and re-listed with a new MLS number. It helps hide the number of days a property has been on the market, not to mention some of the price drops a property has had. Because let’s face it, when buyer’s sell desperation, the lowballing intensifies.

==================================

QUOTE:

Interestingly realtor Arnold Shuchat also touched on this phenomenon in a post on his blog today charting this week’s biggest price declines in Richmond.

Publishing these price reduction blogs on a regular basis is time consuming. But this week’s Price Reduction report was even more so. I have observed that for almost every week that the price reductions are published, the average reduction is between 4-5% regardless of property type, give or take 1%. Under a hypothesis that those averages do not really tell the whole story, I conducted a search of every price reduction listing to review the price history from the time it was first listed. The results yield a completely different story as I suspected. I am not going to undertake this every week, but as an eye opener and to make a point of what’s really going on I did it this week. The numbers speak for themselves and here is the summary:

The average price reduction since originally listed is 11% instead of the most recent 5%. But, if we take the top 10 price reductions since listed, the average is approximately 20%! And, the properties are not yet sold!

The real estate industry official line is that price reductions are minimal and that sellers are holding firm with their prices. The industry insists any price declines are only minimal.

But anyone conducting a proper, detailed analysis is uncovering quite a different story.

Surprised?

===================================

Desperate times call for……

#98 The Man From Nantucket on 06.08.13 at 12:01 pm

@ 83 Temple, RE Roads and Bridges,

Yeah, despite the goverment paying the bill, they are injecting a bunch of money directly into the economy, (perhaps) increasing productivity, and recovering some of it back in taxes.

God knows, I’d rather fix intersections, and replace bridges than pay fat tribute to some arsehole senators to not live in his “hometown”.

#99 Craig on 06.08.13 at 12:02 pm

So the DOW is 10% higher today then it was in 2008 before the crash. In fact it now at all time highs and people are saying sell your home and invest in the market.

Their logic is house prices are too high and that housing is a bubble, etc. ??!!

Why do folks here not apply that same logic to the stock market?

The US debt has doubled in 5 years and folks say that’s the place to put your money, not Canada?

In 2008 / 09 the DOW lost 50% of its value in a few months and its higher now and their economy is seriously struggling once again!

You know what’s next.

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=%5Edji+interactive#symbol=%5Edji;range=20060608,20130603;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=undefined;

#100 The Man From Nantucket on 06.08.13 at 12:03 pm

As for the roads and bridges – I can think of a few near home that would have been perfect candidates for the emergency stimulus that they rushed out the door following the GFC of 2008.

Pity that much of that money was squandered on projects that already had funding by other lower-tier government proponents. With several, the project was already a “go” so not a single job was saved.

#101 Herb on 06.08.13 at 12:03 pm

Smoking Man,

here is an interesting disection of your hero Ford. Look in the mirror …

… the man has zero self-control. From reading while driving himself to work, drinking to excess at official functions, going to KFC while on a much-publicized diet or allegedly smoking crack and hanging out with drug dealers, it is clear that Ford is simply incapable of resisting temptation or delaying gratification.

And — it is crazy that this needs pointing out — there is nothing politically or morally praiseworthy about this. From Plato to Freud and everyone in between and since, self-mastery of the passions by our capacity for reason has been recognized as the key to being a proper-functioning adult and to the proper functioning of the city. No one has seriously made the case that rule by the passions, the id, the animal instincts, is a viable way to run a polity of any size. More to the point, no one has credibly argued that this is any way for a grown-up to behave.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Ford+Winehouse+Canadian+politics/8495530/story.html#ixzz2VdnXEUd1

#102 Shawn on 06.08.13 at 12:12 pm

FREE MARKETS ARE BEST

Why are Banks are allowed to pay 1% on savings YET CHARGE 20% on Visa balances and 22% on cash advances??

*******************************************

Well, it’s because we allow relatively free markets in this country.

It’s also because of supply and demand factors. Apparently people with money can’t find deposit rates much above 1% despite dozens of banks and deposit taking institutions to choose from in this country (and there ARE dozens). And apparently no one is willing to offer cash advances to the type of people that need those at much less than 22%.

What is the alternative. The government controlling all prices in the markets? Welcome to Cuba. No thanks.

If you don’t like it, don’t save, invest instead. And don’t take credit card advances.

Buy bank shares.

Or take your savings and go down town outside a cash advance store or just on the street and make some loans yourself at say 10%. Let us know how THAT works out.

#103 Spiltbongwater on 06.08.13 at 12:13 pm

#95 Craig on 06.08.13 at 11:29 am

From what I view, the people who can least afford to pay interest to credit cards, are the same ones who gorge on the debt. They use Canadian Tire cards at 28.75%, go furniture shopping at the Brick for pay no interest for a year promotions and then are surprised that when not paid in full they are charged the interest for the entire year. They are either illiterate, or very poor at managing their money as the terms and conditions on the debt they choose to take is clearly spelled out to them.

Craig, if you don’t like 20% credit card interest rates, you have choices to make where you do not have to apply for the credit offered. Should the government have legislation to lower interest rates by credit card companies? Sure, why not, but hopefully the first legislation is to give every Canadian citizen a crash helmet as we live in a dangerous world and people might get hurt.

#104 Old Man on 06.08.13 at 12:14 pm

CMHC under the National Housing Act was a positive element in history for families to buy a home, and it made Canada great; the unions were a positive force as well during a time period. So what went wrong? It worked for many years to benefit all of society in one way or another, but times have changed, and adjustments to face the new reality did not. What we have before us in 2013 is a challenge, as the world has changed into a new order, and Canada must adjust, but unfortunately we are stuck with Caesar which is a loss cause going forward. We must toss this idiot out along with the rest of these clowns in government, and take a new path with dignity, respect, and intelligence to get the job done for all Canadians working together for the common good of all.

#105 Roial1 on 06.08.13 at 12:44 pm

#37 will on 06.07.13 at 10:11 pm

Probably the creator of it had some grand vision. Or maybe it was just a vulgar plan to sell it to HAM. The whole thing should be bulldozed into the sea.

ABSOLUTLY NOT!

There is already too much waste going into the sea as it is.

Besides, do you want a sea full of fish puke from to sight of all that ostentation being dumped on their floor.
Mind you, those statues will make great octopus play things. Can’t you just see them swinging on that mom and child?

#106 Angie on 06.08.13 at 1:13 pm

One thing my husband and I learned a while ago is that just because someone has a huge house, luxury cars, or toys doesn’t mean they can actually afford to have those things. It just means they have a lot more debt than you. The bigger they re he harder they fall.

#107 Suede on 06.08.13 at 1:14 pm

http://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/interest-rates/canadian-bonds/

resistances broken in longer duration bonds

#108 Old Man on 06.08.13 at 1:19 pm

My memory is going south, and who was it that told all to buy Canada Bonds? Well a Bond has fixed coupon so if the cost of money spins a higher yield the banks will follow with mortgage costs, and the capital value of a Bond will go down which equates to a loss of capital, not to mention that interest earned is fully taxable. I loved the old system, whereby, a match would be made with a spread between a GIC, and a mortgage rate, but that is all history.

#109 Shawn on 06.08.13 at 1:21 pm

STOCKS AT RECORD HIGHS? WHAT OF IT?

Craig at 98 says:

So the DOW is 10% higher today then it was in 2008 before the crash. In fact it now at all time highs and people are saying sell your home and invest in the market.

*******************************************
Craig, I have no comment on houses, but I do know the DOW. The fact that the DOW is up 10% since 2008 to a record high in NO WAY indicates it is a bad investment. That is not the way to judge the DOW.

To judge the DOW look at the P/E ratio (it’s 16.4 based on trailing earnings, which is right around the historic average). And consider the outlook for profit growth and also very importantly consider that the alternative of long-term government bonds pay 2.2% 10 year and 3.3% 30 year. The DOW has a cash dividend yield of 2.5%. It has a non-cash total earnings yield of (1/16.4) = 6.1% and earnings will grow in the long term. It has an ROE of (a remarkable 18%) but costs you 2.9 times book value to buy.

http://www.djindexes.com/mdsidx/downloads/fact_info/Dow_Jones_Industrial_Average_Fact_Sheet.pdf

So, is the DOW which is earning 6.1% on your investment cost and with earnings likely to grow likely to be a better bet than bonds at 2 to 4% and where the bond interest (on existing bonds) will NEVER grow? I’d suggest it is obvious that the DOW should handily beat today’s bonds over the next 10 and 20 years. BUT the DOW could also crash hard at any time and equity investors have to be able to withstand that.

Do not let the last 13 years fool you. In that time the DOW did not do well mostly because it had been bid up to insane levels in 1999. That’s not the DOW’s fault or the companies’ or the economy’s. That was idiot investors at work.

The DOW has relentlessly made new all times highs very regularly since it was introduced over a 100 years ago. It will do so in future.

Consider if companies make 6.1% on market value (P/E 16.4) and if they RETAIN 60% of earnings (all but the 2.5% paid out) then their book values must grow at 3.7 per year. And if P/B is constant then stock prices must rise over time. Now, P/B does not stay constant but if book values grows then eventually price will grow.

Short-term volatility confuses people and obscures the long term trend which is relentlessly higher.

Again the fact that the DOW is at a record high is basically of little use in predicting whether you should invest. That is simply NOT the way to judge the DOW. All time highs on the DOW are often (but not always) revisited but eventually they are always left in the dust never to be seen again.

On top of all that if you invest in the DOW and it falls then that gives the chance to invest new money at lower prices. Isn’t it all grand? You really can’t lose in the long term except by jumping in and out.

#110 Tom Vu on 06.08.13 at 1:52 pm

#101 Herb on 06.08.13 at 12:03 pm

Rob Ford is the everyman’s man….

Not like some Freedom 55 Public Pension parasite.

#111 Patient in Richmond on 06.08.13 at 1:54 pm

@ happy renter # 53

you must be a realtor , there is not that many good jobs in Victoria ……

#112 Jim on 06.08.13 at 2:37 pm

This is what I thought with the TD bank and their Galaxy give away. I think all the banks will be offering toasters or something ? #14

#113 JimmyAAA on 06.08.13 at 2:47 pm

#40 Canadian Watchdog on 06.07.13 at 10:55 pm

Indeed. They don’t need newsprint anymore, which is why the Toronto Star, Globe and Mail et al will pretty much print (or not print) whatever their big five real estate broker clients want.
———————————————————-

You must not read G&M much. They have been far from a pumper rag for months going on years. Rob Carrick has written extensively about the possibility of a housing crash, renting versus buying, etc. I don’t see nearly as much realty advertising in it as I do in my local paper (Edmonton). I actually find it one of the most balanced papers out there. Which means it pisses off liberals and conservatives equally.

#114 James on 06.08.13 at 2:48 pm

#104 Old Man on 06.08.13 at 12:14 pm

The CMHC was a very short lived positive force. Today it’s scope has expanded beyond what is remotely resonable. The CMHC should have absolutely no role in housing beyond regulator. It should be in the business of making the rules, not acting as a player in the game. It is killing Canada today because it is now serves as nothing more than a gigantic government-sanctioned workshop making time 10-15 year time bombs for new homebuyers to strap on, which are dressed up to look like shiny medals.

CMHC profits 1.5 – 2 billion per year. They hold 600 billion in potential liabilities. That’s 0.25%. Somewhere around 0.35% of Canadian mortgages are in arrears, 70% of mortgages are CMHC-backed. Equally distributed, that means 0.25% of Canadian mortgages are in arrears and also CMHC-backed. That number is likely higher since people with mortgages in arrears are also the kind who would be using CMHC in higher proportions. Now how many of those needs to go into foreclosure for the CMHC to operate in the red, and be covered by your and my tax dollars? The answer is not many.

Removing the current ‘clowns’ will not the stop the problem. The alternative clowns, will if anything be more likely to pressure for lower rates, printing money, more handouts and more subsidies for those ‘suffering’ because of the expensive housing market. In other words just make everything worse.

Getting rid of, or privatizing the CMHC so that the incredibly foolish risks it takes are no longer baked by you and me, is the solution. Do I think this will happen? No, my fear is most likely people will just vote in whatever government promises to save them from their own bad decisions and hand out more free candy. Most likely through lots and lots of money printing.

#115 Herb on 06.08.13 at 3:03 pm

#110 Tom Vu,

if you and SM are “everyman”, I suppose so. Remainder of your comment: invincible ignorance.

#116 AK on 06.08.13 at 3:08 pm

Welcome Home, ‘Made in USA.’ on the Rise

‘Made in USA.

#117 Tom Vu on 06.08.13 at 3:44 pm

Freedom 55 for Public Service Math/Questionnaire

Take IQ

Add 100

Multiply by Nepotism quotient(NOTE: if less than 10 relatives, please explain below)
___________________________________________

Are you Bilingual? (if answer YES please explain below)
__________________________________________

How much do you think you are worth ?
(Take above answer and divide by 10)

_______________________________________

How much vacation time do you deserve ?(Note besides being at work)
_______________________________________

How many sick days do you feel you should have?
_______________________________________

NOTE Answer YES or NO to this question…if you pass away, is that simply long term illness and feel still deserve pay?

If you can answer any of the above YOU ARE HIRED.

#118 TurnerNation on 06.08.13 at 3:52 pm

Due South.

http://news.investors.com/business-industry-snapshot/060713-659218-will-homebuilder-stocks-withstand-rising-mortgage-rates.htm

Homebuilder Stocks Confront Rising Mortgage Rates
By REINHARDT KRAUSE, INVESTOR’S BUSINESS DAILY
Posted 06/07/2013 05:02 PM ET

Interest rates on fixed 30-year mortgages recently started to climb as the market factored in possible changes pending in the Federal Reserve’s monetary strategy

#119 Old Man on 06.08.13 at 4:13 pm

#114 James – take is easy as agree with your rant, as we have no issues lol. But the song is still singing in my mind, and it is not the Fat Lady singing, but Carole King – “Its Too Late.”. Or can we as Canadians change it all?

#120 Ralph Cramdown on 06.08.13 at 4:17 pm

The original claim was “Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.”

I posted median income for couples’ households. Responding with average (a.k.a mean) income won’t advance the argument. As an aside, I’d like to point out that the bloodbath some of these couples take in selling their primary residences at a loss won’t show up in household income statistics, unless some of them have too-clever-by-half accountants and big capital gains to offset against.

#121 Mwerk on 06.08.13 at 4:28 pm

XL approval would be a political suicidal for the democrats (majority), so AB dont count on a pipeline to save the province economy.

#122 -=jwk=- on 06.08.13 at 4:32 pm

Eagles landing sits on a high(unscalable) cliff making water access impossible. Luckliy there is a trailer park/rv camground right next door that is at water level. Yes, your neighbours in trailers have the same view and beach access!

#123 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 4:38 pm

#82 Sorry to be the bearer of reality, but there are very few multi million plus houses anywhere in the world without A/C. It might be used only a handful of days out of the year, but when you want it it’s a must-have. Offices with computers on 24/7 and home theater electronics rooms get mighty hot in any climate.

#124 Piccaso on 06.08.13 at 4:41 pm

“Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.”

To funny, most couples are kaput and the one left living is retired.

#125 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 4:50 pm

#64 Read the article. $20,000 a year hydro bill and NO A/C!!! The owners are not just insane, they’re CERTIFIABLE:

“‘They’ once asked if the Queen could stay there, and we decided against it”.

Now we know what kind of fantasy world they live in. Even THINKING that anyone would believe that crap.

Hey, Dubyah wanted to stay at my condo, I told him he could have the poolhouse bathroom. He passed.

No, by no mistake was one family name of “The Beverly Hillbillies” Bodine. As in Jethro.

#126 FutureExpatriate on 06.08.13 at 4:55 pm

More on #64: “With the children getting older, we just need a BIGGER place”.

What they need is five minutes apiece in the body of a third world toddler.

Make that centuries.

#127 Canadian Watchdog on 06.08.13 at 5:04 pm

#113 JimmyAAA

"I actually find it one of the most balanced papers out there."

Centrepoint home on a large lot sells quickly

191 PATRICIA AVE., TORONTO

ASKING PRICE $1,170,000

SELLING PRICE $1,147,000

PREVIOUS SELLING PRICE $820,000 (2007)

TAXES $6,370 (2012)

DAYS ON THE MARKET Three

LISTING AGENT Lena Preje, Re/Max Ultimate Realty Inc.

A wonderful and well-balanced story. Now let's look over to MLS data.

2012/06 C2391661 191 PATRICIA AVE   $1,460,000
2012/07 C2391661 191 PATRICIA AVE   $1,428,800
2012/08 C2433490 191 PATRICIA AVE   $1,388,800
2012/09 C2452958 191 PATRICIA AVE   $1,250,000
2012/09 C2452958 191 PATRICIA AVE   $1,170,000
2012/10 C2482535  191 PATRICIA AVE  $1,170,000
2013/03 C2586352  191 PATRICIA AVE  $1,170,000

—-

That's almost one year on the market with a 20% price drop, NOT THREE DAYS SOLD 2% BELOW ASKING. I see these one and after another, yet the general public seems to believe all is well in GTA's market. Why? Because when those whose only source of information is from those they believe to be more credible then some anon on some blog posting actual data, then their perception of the market can easily be influenced by the very same people who seek to profit from them.

There is a lot of money invested by the big brokerages to keep the public's optimism and expectations high. They know real estate is emotional and exactly who to target. It's worked for many many years, but like all bubbles, this tactic eventually wears off as the buyer pool shrinks, and that's when big problems start.

There is no interest to supply buyers with proper information in a city that has a 76% homeownership rate. Just ask yourself what kind of G&M story that would be if it included the MLS data posted above, or if Canada had a Zillow where buyers could reference prices. It would never fly.

#128 Not Whisperer on 06.08.13 at 5:36 pm

Read the latest Whisperer post about sellers changing MLS numbers to avoid visibility on desperation. The official stats and summary are completely false it seems. Any chance we’ll see you take this into a post here?

.http://whispersfromtheedgeoftherainforest.blogspot.ca/2013/06/re-listing-and-hiding-price-reductions.html#comment-form

#129 espressobob on 06.08.13 at 5:48 pm

#103, #95

Yeah, credit cards are a bitch! But if you pay the monthly balance owing each month ‘in full’ guess what? Yup, no interest charges. Actually the vendor takes the hit, but who cares?

For certain purchases like from the US, credit cards can be quite useful, whether it is personal or business related. Just pay the damn thing off!!!!

#130 Gunboat denier on 06.08.13 at 6:06 pm

129 e-bob – and how do you think the vendors seek to recover that cost?

#131 Smoking Man on 06.08.13 at 7:03 pm

Herb

Inappropriate behavior is what defines a man.

Appropriate behavior is a characteristic of a slave

#132 Devore on 06.08.13 at 7:09 pm

http://vancouvercondo.info/2013/06/battlemap-my-god-its-full-of-blue.html#comment-206893

Live Mortgage FREE for 24 months!”

“Stop paying your mortgage! We do it for you…for 2 years! Tell your banker, your landlord, your friends, your mom…”I’m buying at Elliot Street…because the developer pays the first 24 months mortgage payments, not me.” That’s 24 months of living mortgage free while the developer makes every one of your mortgage payments for you!”

But that’s ok, no price drops yet, hmm? Here’s one for almost 10%. And how about those low low condo fees*.

(*offer valid only while developer own most units)

#133 Ralph Cramdown on 06.08.13 at 7:58 pm

#95 Craig — “Rates are now at historic lows, yet credit card charges remained untouched for 30 years, @ 20%”

What’s in your wallet? Most banks and many other institutions offer a low rate card at 10%-12% for people who carry balances. People who are too dumb to take advantage can’t be helped, and people who don’t qualify are being sent a none-too-subtle message by the market. I don’t think 10% is unreasonable for unsecured revolving credit.

Oh, looky here… Your friendly Federal government even has a tool to help you with your choices:
http://www.fcac-acfc.gc.ca/iTools-iOutils/creditcardselector/CreditCard-eng.aspx

#134 Ralph Cramdown on 06.08.13 at 8:04 pm

…And even Americans, who get screwed on rates and fees to a degree that your average Canadian bank customer would hardly believe, seem to have figured out that if you carry a balance you should do it on a low rate card:
http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-card-data/historical-credit-card-interest-rates/

Why are rates higher than mortgages or car loans? Just look at Total flow, annual rate, revolving in 2009 and 2010 on the following chart, and realize that it wasn’t people paying off their cards:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/g19/Current/

#135 Alex K on 06.08.13 at 8:17 pm

to #68 Julie,
those job reports are not factual #’s only a survey!
Am I right Garth?

#136 espressobob on 06.08.13 at 8:24 pm

#130 Gunboat denier

Vendors don’t recover the cost of credit card charges.
They factor that in with regard to retail and wholesale prices. For them its the cost of doing business and is a write off tax wise. I forgot to mention as a consumer you do get dinged on US exchange, but its not the end of the world!
Paying 18 to 30% interest on the outstanding balance is the end of most who are unaware!

#137 Daisy Mae on 06.08.13 at 8:38 pm

126 FutureExpatriate: “More on #64: “With the children getting older, we just need a BIGGER place”.

What they need is five minutes apiece in the body of a third world toddler. Make that centuries.”

******************

“…We need a BIGGER place.” These people are disgusting. You are absolutely correct…

#138 Devore on 06.08.13 at 8:52 pm

#53 happy renter

Most couples earn way over $90,000 in Victoria.Govt,Navy and many professionals make this city this an expensive city to live because everyone makes good wages.

Yes, that’s why total median family household income in Victoria is $77,800 and $84,400 for “couple families”. I’m gonna take Stats Canada over your made up anecdotes.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil107a-eng.htm
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil107b-eng.htm

#139 ONE OBSERVATION on 06.08.13 at 9:01 pm

It seems that everyone is trying to get exact timing of the RE bubble burst. It’s like with many other things in life, the knowledge about the danger is there but most of the people are not interested or don’t get it for various reasons. Then, there is a pop and most are surprised and blame whoever for their pain. Greed is the real reason bubbles grow and fear is the reason why they pop. Everything else is just circumstances.

#140 AK on 06.08.13 at 9:43 pm

Okay, how many of you carry these bills in your wallet?

5 High-Denomination Bills Not Being Printed

High-Denomination Bills

#141 Sebee on 06.08.13 at 9:54 pm

#127 Canadian Watchdog

I don’t see how this example matters. $350k ahead. Nearly 50% on 2007 buy price. I am sure whoever sold it made out OK unless there was a huge reno.

#142 James on 06.08.13 at 10:50 pm

#119 Old Man on 06.08.13 at 4:13 pm

Sorry I’m a very passionate CMHC anti-fan!

#143 Mike T on 06.09.13 at 12:21 am

Hey just a reply to the question about the jobs report. I am sorry to that they are mostly useless, and Stats Can says as much so…..

Source is WSJ Canada online blog

‘Economists have been skeptical at each stage.

That skepticism is based on the methods Statistics Canada uses to arrive at its employment numbers. The LFS, also called the “household” survey, is based on a poll of a relatively small number of households — around 56,000.

There’s no guarantee the sample will accurately capture employment trends on a monthly basis, as StatsCan acknowledges.’

http://blogs.wsj.com/canadarealtime/2013/05/09/perplexed-by-canadas-jobs-data-youre-not-alone/

like Mr Turner said, construction jobs in the spring? Quelle surprise, snore.

#144 meslippery on 06.09.13 at 12:43 am

I think its all funny.
I mean dose a stainless fridge somehow make your
beer colder ?
Let not even talk about hardwood,ceramic tile and granite floors.
New kitchen cupboards.
Well as Kevin(Amanda fame) would say he talked to
the dishes and they like where are.

#145 The Man From Nantucket on 06.09.13 at 12:48 am

#133 Ralph Cramdown on 06.08.13 at 7:58 pm
……….. I don’t think 10% is unreasonable for unsecured revolving credit.

It isn’t……and if you shop, you can do a fair bit better still.

I’ve seen 7% for unsecured LOCs that come with a Visa card as one of the ways you can access funds

My Mastercard has been with me since college. It is from one of the jokester outfits that’ll give a low limit card to anyone who can fog a mirror, but it has a great rate not to far above 7%.

If you prefer the DIY solution, you can take cash from a conventional unsecured LOC (~5%) and pay off your own Visa card.

Revolving credit is still cheap if you’re smart about it.

#146 Gunboat denier on 06.09.13 at 1:16 am

136 espressobob – yes they factor it in. That’s how they
recover it. I run a small business. If my costs go up 2%,
I seek to gain it back somewhere. And making it a write-
off doesnt get the money back.

#147 Julia on 06.09.13 at 1:20 am

#131 Smoking Man on 06.08.13 at 7:03 pm

Inappropriate behavior is what defines a man.
Appropriate behavior is a characteristic of a slave
————————————————————
I never thought I would say this, but I just may quote you some time Smoking Man!

#148 JimmyAAA on 06.09.13 at 2:36 am

#127 Canadian Watchdog on 06.08.13 at 5:04 pm
———————————————————
#113 JimmyAAA

“I actually find it one of the most balanced papers out there.”

A wonderful and well-balanced story. Now let’s look over to MLS data.

2012/06 C2391661 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,460,000
2012/07 C2391661 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,428,800
2012/08 C2433490 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,388,800
2012/09 C2452958 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,250,000
2012/09 C2452958 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,170,000
2012/10 C2482535 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,170,000
2013/03 C2586352 191 PATRICIA AVE $1,170,000

—-

That’s almost one year on the market with a 20% price drop, NOT THREE DAYS SOLD 2% BELOW ASKING. I see these one and after another, yet the general public seems to believe all is well in GTA’s market. Why? Because when those whose only source of information is from those they believe to be more credible then some anon on some blog posting actual data, then their perception of the market can easily be influenced by the very same people who seek to profit from them.

There is a lot of money invested by the big brokerages to keep the public’s optimism and expectations high. They know real estate is emotional and exactly who to target. It’s worked for many many years, but like all bubbles, this tactic eventually wears off as the buyer pool shrinks, and that’s when big problems start.

There is no interest to supply buyers with proper information in a city that has a 76% homeownership rate. Just ask yourself what kind of G&M story that would be if it included the MLS data posted above, or if Canada had a Zillow where buyers could reference prices. It would never fly.

———————————————————-

You’re serious? They aren’t allowed to print anything except investigative journalism? I’m already pretty aware of what your idea of balanced is. I think to be balanced most things will need to adhere to your worldview. I wasn’t trying to imply that G&M wasn’t willing to do some puff pieces. Which by the way, I couldn’t even find the above link in my hard copy of Friday’s paper. However a 5 minute search of just Rob Carrick turned up these.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/worried-about-the-housing-market-five-strategies-for-peace-of-mind/article12248198

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/homeowners-dont-be-caught-flat-footed-when-interest-rates-rise/article12076749

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/would-you-be-better-off-financially-renting-or-buying-a-home/article11952313

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/home-buying/renewal-risk-the-case-for-the-10-year-mortgage/article11795326

Most of these articles have hell of a lot more comments than 2 (you and someone else?), that shows that they are being read.

Now I don’t doubt that the Toronto edition may have more RE advertising than the national edition, but I simply don’t get the pumping vibe from the Globe. I seriously find them attempting to be balanced.

#149 Julie on 06.09.13 at 4:50 am

#86 Ronaldo on 06.08.13 at 10:08 am
#68 Julie –

”I’d be curious as to the jobs. If they are mostly bridges and roads they don’t count because govt jobs are funded by tax dollars and not real wealth creating dollars.”

I havn’t seen too many gov’t workers building roads and bridges here in BC since the gov’t privatized these functions back in the 80′s. So what about building bridges and roads doesn’t count as wealth creation for those contractors and workers who are conracted to build them? And they will all be paying taxes back to the government as well.
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Bro……private companies building overpasses in Bring Cash where i live that take three times longer to build than anywhere else in the world……are FUNDED by TAX DOLLARS. So they are private govt workers……..and you can’t pay taxes with money that comes from taxes. That’s called a circle jerk. My company makes stuff that private industry buys. That’s real wealth creation…..

#150 Stickler on 06.09.13 at 8:29 am

@ #135 Alex K on 06.08.13 at 8:17 pm

to #68 Julie,
those job reports are not factual #’s only a survey!
Am I right Garth?
————————————————

As I understand it…most gains were construction / trades (over 40,000) & student (over 40,000).

Net job losses were in professional, finance & manufacturing.

#151 Johan on 06.09.13 at 9:31 am

Apologies, all, if you’ve already come across this, but if not, it makes for interesting reading:
http://www.iie.com/publications/wp/wp13-3.pdf
(based on US research).

Apparently, high home ownership can be bad for employment, for all the reasons already mentioned elsewhere on Garth’s pathetic blog: For example, it lowers levels of labour mobility, increases commuting times, and results in fewer new businesses being formed.

We’ve got a similar problem here in Australia, where home ownership is a tad higher even than in Canada. (If, for some weird reason, you’re interested in the figures, see: http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/[email protected]/Lookup/by%20Subject/1301.0~2012~Main%20Features~Home%20Owners%20and%20Renters~129. )

Like Canada, Australia missed out on a house price collapse, post the GFC. Australia may be the last man standing. Things must be different here … .

Thanks for a great blog, Garth.

#152 jess on 06.09.13 at 9:44 am

interesting….

Playing Monopolis Monopoly: An inquiry into why we are making ourselves so miserable
By J. D. Alt

….”A sovereign government is never revenue constrained when it is the Monopoly issuer of its own pure fiat currency; it has all the money that’s needed to put its citizens to work building anything—and providing any service—that is desired by the public (provided the real resources are available). Even more remarkable, sovereign “deficits” in the fiat currency are just the accounting record of the surpluses that have been injected into the private economy. Eliminating the sovereign currency deficit by imposing austerity will not make the economy healthier; it will, in effect, bankrupt the citizens!”

http://neweconomicperspectives.org/2012/05/playing-monopolis-monopoly-an-inquiry-into-why-we-are-making-ourselves-so-miserable.html

#153 NoName on 06.09.13 at 9:50 am

#149 Julie

Julie you hit the nail right on on the head. I know for few clean energy startups that had a gov, grant, and short few yrs later went bust, gov. was happy that few people were employed, and it managed to recoup some of the money thru income tax, have no ownership in newly developed technology, and its out of the pocket millions… nice
it was never better time than now, to buy big yellow backhoe or start alternative fuel R&D…

older article (2012), it shows grants distribution
http://goo.gl/FcyaX
where to look for handouts
http://goo.gl/cWmLJ

#154 Silver on 06.09.13 at 10:18 am

#149 Julie
I know a lot of people who make their key living from Government subsidized contracts.
you should see their faces when they talk about how much they made parking some piece of equipment on the bridge site…

I know many of the jobs I see out there are Plan Canada and/or some other public funding for and of private jobs and profits.
The bridges are a great example of Private Profits Guaranteed by Public wealth.
I know Private Industry owners who have built whole companies based on these government funded builds, and the idea they will not go away. And they are not Cheep to use either.
Refurbish the old Port Mann then tear it down for a new bridge right away.
Good way to Junk up the economy with Tax dollar jobs.
As you say no Public Job pays a useful Tax… It just recycles existing tax dollars, removing a good percentage of the tax dollars useful function.
Public jobs do not add to wealth creation.
They extract from it.
Private Company’s can’t compete fairly with the generous Public payroll… scheme.

Silver

#155 Canadian Watchdog on 06.09.13 at 10:35 am

#148 JimmyAAA

Most of these articles have hell of a lot more comments than 2 (you and someone else?), that shows that they are being read.

Newsprint is a dying breed. If G&M and other MSM want to increase their readership, they better start by translating articles to dozens of different languages, because that's where new Canadians are going.

#156 Tom Vu on 06.09.13 at 11:33 am

DELETED

#157 JimmyAAA on 06.09.13 at 12:52 pm

#155 Canadian Watchdog on 06.09.13 at 10:35 am
#148 JimmyAAA

Most of these articles have hell of a lot more comments than 2 (you and someone else?), that shows that they are being read.

Newsprint is a dying breed. If G&M and other MSM want to increase their readership, they better start by translating articles to dozens of different languages, because that’s where new Canadians are going.
———————————————————-
Which isn’t exactly what the debate was about. I’m well aware of why most papers are essentially whoring themselves to Remax. I just feel that G&M is trying harder to resist than most. In the end, it may be fruitless.

Sad to say, but most newspaper readers today are definitely older and most likely conservative leaning. They may actually find the lack of Ezra Levant a detriment. It’s too bad Neil Reynolds died.

#158 Dr. Hoof-Hearted on 06.09.13 at 1:16 pm

Gov’t is a perpetual motion machine of job justification.
Policy wonks and paper shufflers.

From an insider, that latest GREEN inititiative is ” NET + “, ie buildings will move to put more back into the system than they use.

Example: water used, even collected from roof, will be treated and sent back into the municipal infrastructure.

Or the building will send more power back into the grid than it uses.

I think its a pipe dream, but this is the latest one.

#159 TEMPLE on 06.09.13 at 1:21 pm

#149 Julie on 06.09.13 at 4:50 am

My company makes stuff that private industry buys. That’s real wealth creation…..

And,

#154 Silver on 06.09.13 at 10:18 am

Public jobs do not add to wealth creation.

I suspect that you two are just trolling, but just in case you truly are mental nubtarts, I am going to challenge you point to any form of “real wealth creation” that doesn’t depend partly on public spending. That means you have to point to a private sector that has somehow created wealth without depending on any public infrastructure, institutions or research.

TEMPLE

#160 Old Man on 06.09.13 at 1:44 pm

#131 Smoking Man – I do not know anymore what is appropriate or inappropriate in life, as this was not my day. I was walking out of Shoppers Drugmart to hoop me some bargains, and they even had Durcell AA rechargables on sale 4 for $9.99. This young woman was walking outside with a t-shirt that said guess, so I did, and she called me a dirty old man. :)

#161 Shawn on 06.09.13 at 1:45 pm

GOVERNMENT AND REAL WEALTH CREATION AND TAXES

Actually, real wealth creation occurs anytime inputs such as labour and materials are combined to create some service or product of more value than the inputs .

I would argue that a private company that is losing money (especially pre-tax) is not creating real wealth. Especially if its workers could obtain other jobs at the same pay at a company that makes money.

A government paid doctor that saves the life of a 30 year old welder is most assuredly creating real wealth.

A group of government workers who mow the grass in a park to allow everyone to enjoy it are creating real wealth.

Government workers who build a valuable road are creating real wealth.

In the creation of real wealth it does not matter at all who pays the cost of the inputs (labour and material). It does not matter if the inputs were paid by tax dollars. It only matters that the inputs create something of greater value than the amount paid.

Logic wins you see and rhetoric and clichés lose.

#162 Dr. Hoof-Hearted on 06.09.13 at 1:52 pm

Re Gov’t:

When the times are good….its often bad re: Gov’t spending. aka they find all sorts of ways to piss it away.

A friend of mine in HAMville was telling me about our unionized City workers pressure washing the asphalt near a Bus Stop. He inquired and was told Translink contracts out to the City to pressure wash its “property” .

The next day I drove by and saw the City crews pressure washing the paved area (median) between the traffic lanes. WTF? WHO cares

Overpaid by us and underworked…pathetic.

In other words, you were driving and they were working. — Garth

#163 Mister Obvious on 06.09.13 at 1:52 pm

Page A4 of Vancouver’s Friday, Jun 7th Province Newspaper is a full-age ad for a hot tub company located up the Fraser Valley.

It reminds us Father’s Day will be here in one week and its time to start thinking about a gift for dad.

They offer the ‘Swim Spa’ for $14,480 ($174/month). Or how about that ‘Gourmet Outdoor Kitchen’ for $10,980 ($132/month)? If that’s too rich there’s the ‘Barbecue Island’ for a mere $4999 ($65/month).

What happened? I recall when a typical gift for dad would be a Craftsman electric drill from Sears or maybe new driver for his golf bag. A good winter wool cardigan perhaps? A necktie?

Where is the money coming from to celebrate Father’s day with such high-end, high-maintenance ‘surpass-the-Joneses’ opulence?

Its certainly not still being squeezed out of HELOCs.

Or is it?

#164 Ogopogo on 06.09.13 at 2:25 pm

Wails realtor Jeremiah Wallace on his blog:

“[…] And unfortunately, we are in a buyers market…”

This bolded bit is precisely what’s wrong with this filthy, vile industry. Realtors care nothing for housing affordability for Canadians. These predatory shills are de facto enemies of the Canadian middle and lower classes, though no friend of the higher ups either.

I’d sooner be a brothel janitor in Thailand than a realtor. Rant over.

#165 Canadian Watchdog on 06.09.13 at 2:44 pm

It appears MAC Marketing Solutions has given up writing its featured MAC Scoop report and is now attempting to lure buyers with a real estate crossword puzzle contest that is offering a chance to win a $50 Home Depot Giftcard.

Just another example of how surreal our housing market has become.

#166 housedoc on 06.09.13 at 2:57 pm

Temple
“I suspect that you two are just trolling, but just in case you truly are mental nubtarts, I am going to challenge you point to any form of “real wealth creation” that doesn’t depend partly on public spending. That means you have to point to a private sector that has somehow created wealth without depending on any public infrastructure, institutions or research.”

—————————————————————-

Sounds like “You didn’t build that.”

#167 willworkforpickles on 06.09.13 at 3:52 pm

The delusional rich – those aren’t even grand mansions.

#168 Ann on 06.09.13 at 4:19 pm

re-164 Ogopogo on 06.09.13 at 2:25 pm
Wails realtor Jeremiah Wallace on his blog:

“[…] And unfortunately, we are in a buyers market…”

This bolded bit is precisely what’s wrong with this filthy, vile industry. Realtors care nothing for housing affordability for Canadians. These predatory shills are de facto enemies of the Canadian middle and lower classes, though no friend of the higher ups either.

I’d sooner be a brothel janitor in Thailand than a realtor. Rant over.
——————————————————————–If you think it’s the agent that pushes prices you are delusional

#169 Waterloo Resident on 06.09.13 at 4:29 pm

if the jobs report shows that construction employment has picked up, then that means in a few months we will see SIGNIFICANT pickup in house / Condo / and other residential construction activity.

I don’t know what that will do to prices, probably nothing as it is the mortgage market that determines prices, but at least people will still have jobs to keep buying things that they don’t need, things like 85 inch big-screen TVs and things like that. So retail jobs will be safe as well, at least for now.

When the construction jobs go, then a few months later the retail jobs will go also, and that is when Canada will be a ton of pain. But for now everything is rosy on the jobs picture. Housing picture; Flat, at least for now.

#170 James on 06.09.13 at 4:53 pm

#164 Ogopogo on 06.09.13 at 2:25 pm

“This bolded bit is precisely what’s wrong with this filthy, vile industry. Realtors care nothing for housing affordability for Canadians. These predatory shills are de facto enemies of the Canadian middle and lower classes, though no friend of the higher ups either.”
——————————————————-
There’s no sense demonizing them, just understand their incentives and act accordingly. They have no incentive to tell the truth right now, and so they do not. Standard behavior of a rational human actor given the circumstances.

#161 Shawn on 06.09.13 at 1:45 pm

Actually, real wealth creation occurs anytime inputs such as labour and materials are combined to create some service or product of more value than the inputs .
——————————————————–
Rant:
Right, and gov almost never accomplishes this. You mentioned a failing company – that is the whole point, it’s failing. It then gets removed from the market and does not cost you or I money. That same company in government does not get removed, and continues to cost us a net loss. That’s the difference, and it’s the only difference that matters.

We need roads and bridges, and if gov stuck with building what we need that would be great. Of course, they never do. The point of government work is to provide a service to the taxpayer, it is not to provide a paycheck and security to the worker. That security comes at the comes of all the rest of us.

Full disclosure: I live on a government paycheck myself (provincial, via the health region), this is because they are the only entity legally allowed to employ me.

I previously got a summer job working road maintenance for the city. I have never, NEVER worked with more lazy, unproductive and systemically abusive workers. The stereotypes are absolutely true. I wouldn’t even call it a job, it was more of a continuum of coffee breaks and naps interspersed with occasional shoveling of various materials. Even the shoveling had no consistent, clear end purpose most of the time.

#171 Devore on 06.09.13 at 6:36 pm

#170 James
The residents of the sleepy part of West End in downtown Vancouver have been subjected for the last 18 months or so to daily ruckus, with loud generators, heavy machinery and general earthquake-level pounding greeting them in the morning, and variously through the day. It looked like your typical city crew tearing up the streets, perhaps to work on the water main, or sewer, you know, upgrading the common infrastructure. But all was not as it seemed. As work progressed, it became obvious; it’s a bike lane. Now, regardless of how you feel about bike lanes, over a year of work and who knows how many dozens of individuals later, we have a few blocks of segregated bike lanes and a “new” intersection. Because getting around west end is too easy now, we just needed a couple more confusing one way streets.

This is such a colossal waste of taxpayer money, at a time when so many local services are underfunded and cutting back, and ever more costs and responsibilities are being downloaded from the federal government on down.

On the other hand, property taxes are going up this year, and the next. Get used to it.

#172 Julie on 06.10.13 at 8:37 am

Whose the troll Mr Temple the pension till you die govt worker. Canada has the worst managed govt for our populations size in the G20…….read a book man…..

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ down the drain…..

#149 Julie on 06.09.13 at 4:50 am

My company makes stuff that private industry buys. That’s real wealth creation…..

And,

#154 Silver on 06.09.13 at 10:18 am

Public jobs do not add to wealth creation.

I suspect that you two are just trolling, but just in case you truly are mental nubtarts, I am going to challenge you point to any form of “real wealth creation” that doesn’t depend partly on public spending. That means you have to point to a private sector that has somehow created wealth without depending on any public infrastructure, institutions or research.

TEMPLE

#173 Sunny on 06.10.13 at 12:54 pm

The latest employment record was just playing catch up with a longer term dismal trend. Expect the next employment report to suck and for interest rates to buckle. This economy ain’t going nowhere. Neither are record low interest rates.

In the meantime, Garth seems to be reduced to picking on smaller cities like Halifax and Victoria. Toronto defies his expectations.

Toronto is boring, and right on track. — Garth

#174 RichHill - RichVale girl on 06.10.13 at 4:02 pm

#96 Canadian Watchdog

“I believe this was a trending technique amongst realtors that grew over time. Obviously, hiding the original list price and resetting days on the market to zero can benefit a seller and realtor’s bottom line.”

Could you please explain how hiding the original list price benefits a seller?

Thank you.