Dear England


(Canadian Watchdog illustration)

In 2005 Stephen Harper won an election, in part, because he promised never to goose the taxes on high-paying, popular income trusts. On Halloween night the next year he did just that. Poor F was pushed in front of the TV cameras and fed live to the voracious media. He claimed the feds would lose “billions” in taxes if trusts weren’t spanked, but never proved it.

Behind the scenes was a smart but stealthy civil servant at the Department of Finance who was responsible for this shocking reversal – a dude named Mark Carney. Within months the Conservative government rewarded him with an appointment to head the Bank of Canada, promoting the tender 42-year-old over the heir apparent at the Bank, Paul Jenkins. It soon became clear on Parliament Hill that Carney was a close confidant of F’s, and the guy was untouchable.

At the meeting of the Parliamentary Finance Committee called to confirm his appointment, I started asking weasel questions about the trust affair, before seeing if Carney approved of 40-year mortgages with zero down payments. The Conservatives on the body hooted me down while the chairman (now the junior finance minister) ruled me out of order. Later they all beat the crap out of me in the parking lot.

But this is now behind us. The youngest-ever central bank czar in the history of the western world is preparing the next bullet point on his CV – governor of the Bank of England. He’s the first non-Brit in the 318-year history of the bank, and will soon have more power over the economy there than the government. The UK is the sixth biggest economy in the world, and we’re tenth. Britain matters bigtime to the fate of Europe, and the global GDP. We, on the other hand,  just hope the NHL settles soon and are trying to remember where we put the sled keys.

Of course there’s some curiosity across the pond as to what this Carney guy might do for the $993,000 salary he’ll be collecting. Here’s Adrian:

I enjoy your blog, and the parallels between the Canadian housing bubble and the one we’ve been, ah, enjoying, for the past few years.

I’m in England and have just found that your Mr Carney is taking over next year as Governor of the Bank of England – an organisation that has worked hard to protect the interests of home-owners over here by keeping interest rates too low so that prices stay high.

Is his appointment likely to improve matters here, do you think, or to allow the bubble to continue?

Well, Adrian, Carney’s clever and ambitious. He apprenticed at Goldman’s, squirmed his way to the top of Finance in Ottawa, realized early that F was weak and malleable, and played his cards adroitly. He scored the London gig based on his stirling rep as the central banker that kept Canada from imploding in the GFC. Without a doubt, he provided a stable hand on the tiller while the elected politicians waffled and obfuscated. But he also let us down.

A year before economies imploded in a real estate-induced frenzy, ripping into financial markets and bringing capitalism to the brink, I asked Carney – soon to become bank governor – if he was worried about the housing market. He said no. His subsequent actions proved that. In fact the guy could be called the architect of the situation we have today, when the average Toronto family can’t afford the average home, Vancouver has been destroyed by land speculation and we’re on the verge of a nasty correction.

Mr. Carney said nothing when his pal F pushed through forty-year amortizations and allowed zero down payment loans to be covered by CMHC. It was that move, surprisingly shoehorned into the 2006 budget, which spread the fuel for an explosion of property prices. All it took to ignite was the spark of emergency interest rates, which Carney himself provided two years later.

The result you know. By the Spring of 2012 the average SFH in Vancouver cost $1.2 million, Toronto was a bidding-war battleground and urban Canadian real estate values had climbed 128% from pre-Carney days. So what did the Governor do? Yes, he embarked on a cross-country road trip to warn people they were borrowing too much. This was when five-year mortgages dropped to 2.99%, chartered banks were giving savingless couples down payments – plus 100% financing – and CMHC’s automated approval process was rubberstamping borrowings in seven seconds.

Can you say hypocrite?

Adrian, you get the guy at a moment when – thanks to Mr. Carney and his sawed-off buddy – Canadian house prices are 49% higher than those in the States (with ten times the economic output) and our household debt has hit a record level higher than that which preceded  the US housing crash. Our savings rate has cratered during this period. One third of retirees will have a mortgage (first time ever), and four in ten families say they have trouble making monthly payments. Worse, a whole generation of people now in their thirties and forties are pretty much screwed unless real estate collapses, screwing their parents.

But, dammit, the macros look good.

The global meme is that Canada escaped the worst of the recession, while Britain grinds away with 8% unemployment and a budget deficit that next year could exceed that of Greece. The reality’s something else. There is social distress in Canada in the wake of our leaders’ decisions.

“Mark Carney is a quality governor,” the Chancellor of the Exchequer told the British House of Commons. “He is quite simply the best, most experienced and most qualified person in the world to be the next Governor of the Bank of England.”

Great. Can we also interest you in an elfin deity?


#1 PermaBear on 11.26.12 at 10:18 pm

Good luck in England, Mark!

#2 Randy on 11.26.12 at 10:18 pm

Wasn’t Carney just a Bernanke hand-puppet ? How long is Bernanke’s arm ?

#3 TurnerNation on 11.26.12 at 10:19 pm

1. Goodbye, Blog Dog Carney.
Congrats to Toronto’s newest full-time football coach.

What are the chances of these positions’ vacancies being filled by H’s stooges:

Ontario’s Premier, Ontario’s Finance Minister, Toronto’s mayor, BOC’s Govenor? 40% chance…?

Never let a good crisis go to waste. Nothing is left to chance. Not even for litte ole’ Canada. Still the Queen’s servant.
Don’t forget to vote: monster A or monster B.

2. Anyway, we’ll be talking about Smoking Man’s exploits for years to come, like the old Saturday Night Live skit’s Bill Brasky character.

“The format of the sketches resembles the improv game “Two Describe a Third.” Three or four friends (known as the “Bill Brasky Buddies”) gather in a public place to drink Scotch, smoke cigars, and loudly reminisce about their mutual acquaintance Bill Brasky. The Brasky Buddies are all apparently businessmen who worked with Brasky. They all have red cheeks, red noses, and big white teeth. They appear to be coming from a business conference, and are already very drunk.

The discussions begin with an agreement that “Bill Brasky is a son of a b__ch,” and then proceeds to tall tales of Brasky’s superhuman feats, usually focused on his huge size, virility, celebrity connections, amazing tolerance for drugs and alcohol, and reckless disregard for human life. If their stories are to be believed, Brasky is enormously tall and heavy, can eat anything, can tolerate any amount of drugs and alcohol, is superhumanly tough, and has caused the death and maiming of many people. All of the salesmen have been his victim at one time or another, but they are all celebrated with the same gusto. At regular intervals, they raise their glasses to toast him, shouting “To Bill Brasky!”

#4 T.O. Bubble Boy on 11.26.12 at 10:22 pm

Can we interest ANYONE in an elfin deity? Please… pretty please with credit bubbles and structural deficits on top?

Maybe F and Rob Ford can start a new city together?

#5 Moose_N.I on 11.26.12 at 10:22 pm

I’m goin for it “fuuurssst”!

#6 Kip on 11.26.12 at 10:25 pm

I think Mark Carney is a solid governor at the Bank of Canada. The Brits are lucky to have him.

#7 Nick on 11.26.12 at 10:27 pm

You are so right!

Carney will do to the Brits what he did to us.

#8 scots on 11.26.12 at 10:28 pm

Nice elfin deity I was wondering when the big guns were going to be let lose on this well groomed,mild mannered superstar. For shame

#9 a prairie dawg on 11.26.12 at 10:32 pm

“Later they all beat the crap out of me in the parking lot.”

– — –

We’re assuming this was done verbally.

Or you sustained enough bruising for some street cred.

#10 john m on 11.26.12 at 10:33 pm

Great post…..That’s reality!

#11 Marco from Van on 11.26.12 at 10:33 pm

Having moved from the UK to Canada 2 years ago, I can tell you that Carney will have his work cut out. Things are a lot less cohesive there and there is a very fragile coalition that can well flip to a minority government.

This move has been speculated in the media for months, now confirmed. My egotistical worry is more about who will replace him? Will his departure provide those who want a reversal of mortgage rules and fiscal loosening a face saving U-Turn opportunity?

The UK has a very complex housing ecosystem where social housing is at the core of planning permissions (eg. In london you have to build 50% affordable housing for all high density developments of of a certain density or above – quite low).

Every neighborhood has a “council estate” in an aim to avoid ghetto, society is fully diluted and welfare benefits much more established (including housing support) than what I have been able to observe in Canada.

Carney will also be “managed” by an establishment that thrives in maintaining a status quo built on a very long heritage (300+ years).

As a man who clearly understands how to play politics and how to get out before all the positives turn into negatives, he will be able to use the UK as a 3-5 year springboard onto a loftier place – like the IMU or other global level offices.

Good on him for playing the system like we all should – I wonder what the replacement will be like…

#12 Kris on 11.26.12 at 10:35 pm

Very reminiscent of John Roth (CEO of Nortel). In 1999-2000, consulting firms were falling over each other giving John awards like “CEO of the Year”, and politicians vied to have photos taken with him. Merely 2 years later, Nortel went bust and thousands lost their jobs, and class-action lawsuits bayed for John’s blood.

Hindsight revealed, as if often does, that things weren’t as they seemed. John’s ‘Best CEO’ awards were based largely on Nortel’s $120 stock, not on any great forward-looking insights. And the stock price, in turn, was based largely on mob mentality, and again, not on careful analysis on the future of the telecom industry.

Nortel accounted for 1/3 of TSE in its heyday – Talk about all eggs in one basket. Its downfall arguably left no Canadian untouched – Precisely why such a downfall was thought to be improbable by most analysts in the years preceding.

#13 Grim Reaper/Crypt Speculator on 11.26.12 at 10:39 pm

Take it from me…never have(2) Irishmen in the same room let alone in charge of the Country’s finance.

PS: If I didn’t know better, I’d say that Garth was once in Gov’t

#14 Roland on 11.26.12 at 10:40 pm

Carney can’t manage a central bank, but he can sure manage a career.

Think of it: Carney escapes Canada before the real estate bubble here completely deflates. He reaches England, where Cameron and a crew of expendable elected chumps will take all the blame for austerity and double/triple dips.

Prior to this appointment, Carney turned down the top IMF position because he didn’t want to dirty his resume in the Euromess.

After a term at the BoE spent gracefully throwing up his hands in poses of helpless but erudite despair, Carney will be ready to take over the IMF, since by that time no blame will attach to him for the Euromess.

Once at the IMF in a few years’ time, Carney will be perfectly positioned to tell Canadians about the necessity for a harsh programme of Structural Adjustment…

That is a “world-class” career in the making. That is the sort of career to which every young Canadian should aspire: work for Goldman, shift blame, cover your butt, and pursue mediocrity all the way to the top.

I wonder who will be chosen as the sacrificial goat for the BoC, now that our Golden Goldman Boy has moved on to the big time.

#15 a prairie dawg on 11.26.12 at 10:40 pm

Not much of a market anymore for high mileage elfin deities. Pity?

#16 Cory on 11.26.12 at 10:40 pm

Carney should be removed from his post immediately. This is standard procedure when people who can control or sabotage a company’s operations. In this case, the BoC. Not saying he would but he is in such a position of power, it is a no brainer to escort him to the door. Not out of bitterness toward him for leaving, but for security reasons.

#17 Hearrt on 11.26.12 at 10:41 pm

I couldn’t agree with your post more Garth.

The continuous accolades, and genius/ hero status that the media portrays regarding Mr. Carney has always mystified me.

Does it really take a genius to do what he has done as head of the Bank of Canada? Constantly announce no increase to interest rates, while coyly suggesting otherwise?

Yes many naive new house owners of recent times will soon pay dearly from the upcoming real estate correction, and they can credit Mr. Carney and the Government of Canada for leading them to the slaughter.

It will be interesting to see if Mr. Carney actually performs in what looks like a much more challenging assignment.

#18 X on 11.26.12 at 10:41 pm

C left at a very opportune time. Give him credit for knowing when to get out.

#19 JustTryingToProtectEquity on 11.26.12 at 10:43 pm

Mark Carney sees the writing on the wall. He knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Canadians are indeed severely overleveraged. His policies, and those of Jim Flaherty, have created the biggest housing bubble in Canadian history and have created a scenario wherein over 50% of our citizens will retire in debt… If they ever retire at all. Like Dalton McGuinty, here in Ontario, Carney recognizes that the numbers, the ever growing household debts, are untenable and their is no solution. A crash is imminent. Historic low interest rates, coupled with Flaherty’s 0 down/40 year (subprime)
ammortizations have set the stage for an economic slowdown the likes of which we have not experienced here in Canada in any of our lifetimes. Why not skip town now, while he can still wrongly take credit for helping Canada avoid the global financial meltdown? Why not take this high prifile and high paying post in a country that is already mired in it’s own overleveraged mess? It’s the Goldman way, create the problem, foist it on the taxpayers, then point the finger… and run.

#20 Randy on 11.26.12 at 10:46 pm

Carney just did what the Fed told him to do…Didn’t Kennedy get assassinated when he tried to eliminate the Fed ?

Why didn’t Oliver Stone include this in his movie…?

Ron Paul must have had a Death Wish….Audit the Fed !!!….crazy…

Tin foil, aisle four! — Garth

#21 HogtownIndebted on 11.26.12 at 10:47 pm

The downturn is clearly hitting the SFH in Toronto now. This nice home in the supposedly immune St Clair West area is one example in an area where many listings from $400k and up have now malingered for months. the number of vacant homes for sale here is growing steadily.

From Guava:

June 23, 2012

New Listings Sat Jun 23 14:29:02 2012
C2399996 – M6C – 310 RUSHTON RD Toronto, Ontario – $1,499,000

From MLS today:

310 Rushton Rd Sold: $1,160,000
Toronto, Ontario M6C2X9 Toronto C03 Humewood-Cedarvale List: $1,249,000
Orig Price: $1,289,000 Taxes: $8,308/2012 93 % List
SPIS: N Humewood-Cedarvale 114-16-N DOM: 31 Contract: 10/26/2012 Sold: 11/26/2012

Er, actually, realtards, that is 77% of list. And it took over 157 days, a few weeks short of 6 months. Thanks for your honesty and the ongoing integrity of your data.

#22 Mike Leblond on 11.26.12 at 10:47 pm

I think less of Carney than others on this blog appear to. It is easy to be a hero when you give free money away to every prince and pauper (and to the banks). Who doesn’t like Santa Claus? OK, OK, Canadian banks are in good shape but that is in good part because they have been lending money without incurring any risk. Like Greenspan, Carney is not sticking around to deal with the consequences of his near zero interest rate policy.

#23 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 10:48 pm

Carney Likes his booze.

The machine teaches us that drinking, recreational drugs, and things that detach us from reality are not healthy. Well I beg to differ. I believe those things spur creativity, give you new ideas and dreams, help you detach from your machine written slave programming and find ways to better your life. They alter pyridine and prospective. Our minds have been shaped to serve a master via the educational industrial complex, it wants us to follow rules, make no waves, and fit in and be someone’s dog, wag our tails and follow the rules. To most suffering from a lock down un-exploring hard drive I may seem mad, or psychotic. Perhaps I am. I have a wacky religion, that’s not taught or encouraged it’s called entrepreneurship.

A school in Brampton has suspended some students that where chirping some teachers amongst themselves on twitter, couple of their buddies told on them.. The arrogant first line protectors of the status quo took extreme offence. The kids were Expressing a charter given right of free speech, the school board jumped to violent words like consequences, punishment, and an inference that this adolescent chatter would haunt them they’re entire life. This is creativity killing obedience training at it’s best. The young offenders will be fine in fact the more the machine try’s to hurt them the stronger they become. The threats were not directed at those who chirped, they were designed to keep the other baby slaves in training frightened and in line.

#24 Sydneysider on 11.26.12 at 10:50 pm

#11 Marco from Van has it about right. .. He lived in the UK for 10 years and still wants to go there? He must be in for the short term only.

#25 Amazed on 11.26.12 at 10:51 pm

Amazing how rumors turn into fact. I’d heard this about mark awhile back and now here it is. Obviously it’s in his interest to get out while things are good. I guess the biggest question is “now what?”does someone take the fall… Will they artificially inflate the bubble again?

#26 Randy on 11.26.12 at 10:52 pm

On June 4, 1963, a virtually unknown Presidential decree, Executive Order 11110, was signed with the authority to basically strip the Bank of its power to loan money to the United States Federal Government at interest. With the stroke of a pen, President Kennedy declared that the privately owned Federal Reserve Bank would soon be out of business.

JFK Assassinated in November 1963….

Just a coincidence or a warning to all future Presidents…Don’t mess with the FED…

Don’t mess with me. Go away. — Garth

#27 a prairie dawg on 11.26.12 at 10:55 pm

#18 X

C left at a very opportune time. Give him credit for knowing when to get out.

– — –

Maybe he’s a closet Kenny Rodgers fan.

#28 obert on 11.26.12 at 10:58 pm

wow! God save the Queen ;)

#29 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 11:01 pm

#26 Randy on 11.26.12 at 10:52 pm

I challenge you to join this group, I’m a member, we are the Canadian globalists. My focus is education reform

It should open your mind. Anyone can join.

#30 Mel on 11.26.12 at 11:02 pm

They can have him. If Mr. Carney was such a good central banker, he would not have done the same thing that all the other central bankers around the world did, and that is ‘mortgage debt’.

I feel sorry for anyone who will replace him. He/she will have to clean up the mess that he was part of.

I have never respected him, or our Finance Minister.
Both did nothing good for our country except lots of bragging that never stops. ” We are different” is the slogin that is constantly spit out. I am sick and tired of it!

It is time for change, however, I don’t expect much change at the top. Maybe things will start to change when crisis in mortgages will hit the country. But who will take the blame? Oh I know who will, it will not be Mr. Carney, or Mr. Flaherty. It will be all those out of control Canadians. Who else!

#31 a prairie dawg on 11.26.12 at 11:04 pm

Sources have it that a deal was offered to England, but the language barrier proved to be a problem.

We offered them a 2-fer but they thought we said poofer.

Talks broke down shortly thereafter.

#32 Steve Merrill on 11.26.12 at 11:05 pm

Government Sachs Extends Its Tentacles …

Current members of that club include Mario Draghi, the head of the European Central Bank and a former vice chairman of the firm; Mario Monti, the Italian prime minister and a former international adviser; and Gary Gensler, the head of the United States Commodity Futures Trading Commission.

And the list of Goldman alum in previous government posts is much more extensive, encompassing the likes of Henry M. Paulson Jr., the former Treasury secretary and onetime Goldman chief executive, and Neel T. Kashkari, a top lieutenant under Mr. Paulson who helped draft the Bush administration’s response to the 2008 financial crisis.

That’s to say nothing of Robert E. Rubin, the former Treasury secretary; Stephen Friedman, the onetime chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York; and Jon S. Corzine, the former senator and governor of New Jersey.

#33 claudius emperor on 11.26.12 at 11:05 pm

do I smell something in the air?
Is F thinking about retirement?
Is H planning to spent more time with his family?

Is it coincidence that M.C and McG are leaving at the same time?

#34 MC on 11.26.12 at 11:06 pm

On the bright side…..the gov’t has secured 30-40 years of a stable tax base with all this debt that needs to be repaid.

Maybe that was the point all along……

#35 Timing is Everything on 11.26.12 at 11:06 pm

Mark Carney, Just 4 U…

#36 wes coast on 11.26.12 at 11:07 pm

The only reason that Canada was unscathed in the GFC is due to global inflationary monetary policy which just so happens to push commodity prices through the roof. Mark C. had nothing to do with it. The best is yet to come for Canada – as our high dollar crowds out other investment and draws in more resourced based imvestment – when the commodity bubble burst so does Canada. I’d love to say Mark had something to do with this – but quite frankly monetary policy is made in Washington not Ottawa. Our rates should be much higher – but that would only force the dollar higher creating more problems for us in the short term. So we react to the Fed’s efforts – and we keep rates artificially low in Canada. The Fed wants inflation in the US to fight disinflation. As a by-product we get that in Canada and think all is well. But it won’t end well when the commodity bubble bursts. Mark. England can have him. He’s likely of more use there. We can just put any peon in the BOC to react to Big Ben in Washington.

#37 Marnic on 11.26.12 at 11:08 pm

Garth, is that photo caption supposed to say “untouched” or “unretouched”? Either way it’s bogus.

Sounds like you are, too. — Garth

#38 Soylent Green is People on 11.26.12 at 11:10 pm

Omfg i,ve only read firsttwo paragra and had to tweet




#39 MrHulot on 11.26.12 at 11:10 pm

There is one and only one reason Canada came out of the 2008 recession unscathed. Paul Martin. Great Finance Minister, poor Prime Minister.

Nothing to do with the elfin deity or Mark Carney.

#40 Soylent Green is People on 11.26.12 at 11:10 pm

Omfg i,ve only read firsttwo paragra and had to tweet


#41 Click Here, its different on 11.26.12 at 11:11 pm

lolol Thx Garth …

I agree with all here saying Carney is leaving the ship just in time before we hit the iceberg.

But I wonder. England ? Theres a huge iceberg there too. Why not Vatican ? Or Luxembourg ?

Hes a real trooper. “I will screwup until the very end”.

#42 Bo Xilai on 11.26.12 at 11:13 pm

Mark Carney’s job for the last three years…

BOC Rate Announcement – Do nothing. Read Press Release.

One month later – Press Conference “Canadians are taking on too much debt… Rates aren’t always going to be this low. Change your spendthrift ways…. Blah, blah, blah…”

BOC Rate Announcement – Do Nothing. Read Press Release.

Repeat and rinse…

And for this he’s considered a great central banker?

I could have done his job in my spare time.

#43 Nemesis on 11.26.12 at 11:18 pm

Indeed… And yes, OldPol that is why I ‘affectionately’ refer to him as MarkTheCarney…

#44 Inglorious Investor on 11.26.12 at 11:21 pm

As the Brits might say, “Good show, Garth, old boy! Jolly, good show!”

How many times have I said that the housing bubble was largely the government’s fault? It was their meddling that made money too cheap and mortgage rules too unruly.

Sucking in an entire generation of greedy, property neophytes who did not understand the dangers of house prices rising faster and faster than real incomes.

And older extent homeowners with no savings but many square feet of granite and stainless not understanding that when everyone’s house goes up in price no one is truly richer.

And it was all for the banks. Never forget that.

Speaking of which, there’s Mr. Carnage, who on behalf of his bankster masters, facilitated the entire mess and then began disingenuously bleating warning after warning that Canadians had too much debt. He’s the over doting mother who stuffs her kids with far too much food and then complains they are fat.

But we Canadians, the special, the chosen, the exempt from economic reality and market forces were eager and happy to saunter right into our own financial destruction becoming debt slaves and tax cows to the banks.

Perhaps the bank with the red “S” logo will change their tag line to: “You’re dumber then you think. I mean, man, but you are really, really stupid! Bwahahahahaha!…”

#45 Victor on 11.26.12 at 11:22 pm

I do not know how to call a banking system good when GIC rates lower that inflation rate and this is before income tax. Why do banks earn >3 times more by giving loans than people giving them money?

#46 GTA Girl on 11.26.12 at 11:22 pm

It’s been an interesting news day. Story on Carney breaks the same hour as Mayor Rob Ford is booted.

Argos beat Calgary.

By-elections in full E-Day swing. (Doesn’t a bit of you miss those crazy E-Day GOTV days, Garth? I do)

There’s a shift in the air. ‘stupid’ no longer sells. A the hard-right way of politics seem awful shrill.

Breath of fresh air… Canadians need it

#47 Axehead on 11.26.12 at 11:26 pm

Awe…where are the ‘peckerettes’ in todays blog?

As for Carnet: just another banker; he lowered interest rates yet called Canadians irresponsible for borrowing; hypocrite yes, hero no. I’ll not relish his watch of our Canadian financial system – in the end, we are worse now than when he started, and now that the SHTF, he’s bailing.

#48 dd on 11.26.12 at 11:27 pm

Central planners. I mean central bankers – money printers in action.

#49 SpaceMonkey on 11.26.12 at 11:30 pm

The photo is obviously manipulated/fake.

Is saying “untouched” a sarcastic comment? If not, it’s very misleading and sly to say that it is untouched. Stuff like that ruins credibility.

Now I’m worried. — Garth

#50 chaser on 11.26.12 at 11:33 pm

If F is an elfin deity, does that make Garth a dwarven deity?

#51 randman on 11.26.12 at 11:35 pm

John Embry…..

Embry also spoke about the new head of the Bank of England: “Mark Carney has just given up his post as the head of the Bank of Canada to take over as the head of the Bank of England. Well, he’s an ex-Goldman Sachs guy. So that puts Carney as the head of the Bank of England, Draghi as the head of the ECB, and Monti running Italy, even though he wasn’t elected. These are all ex-Goldman Sachs guys. This is scary stuff. Goldman is everywhere.”

Round and round she goes……

#52 Marnic on 11.26.12 at 11:35 pm

Sounds like you are, too. — Garth

What an odd retort. It’s a fake picture…the research will take you about two minutes.

#53 Blacksheep on 11.26.12 at 11:35 pm

Daystar and the calamari diaries,

“Not to dismiss what Goldman Sachs is all about,”

“but the Bank of Nova Scotia has a larger market cap than GS for those who pretend GS is the biggest whale.”

The Squid isn’t about being the biggest, it’s about having the most control.

“Can Mark have a greater influence on the banking industry as a whole in England?”

“Yes he can and I wish him all the best.”

Of course he will and…..of course you do.

And since you trust Huffpost enough to link:

take care

#54 mark on 11.26.12 at 11:35 pm

I’m sure 100% of this was reflected in every Global, CBC and CTV news report tonight.

#55 Ronaldo on 11.26.12 at 11:38 pm

#41 Bo Xilai –

”BOC Rate Announcement – Do Nothing. Read Press Release”

You forgot to include: “Read Garth’s blog”.

#56 George Theophylactou on 11.26.12 at 11:38 pm

Hey folks, time to let you in on the show

Buy/Curious, Linda Pearson, Davey Boy (come on, at least don’t use your nickname), Teacher and myself are all TTC subway operators (ages 39 -55). That’s the reason none of their posts have relevance to this blog. TMZ Joe?? Is that where you go for fun?

Guess I’m the real Smoking Man, just not the poor SOB that posts incessantly on this blog. You flushed me out Joe, and even better you got that shmuck to stop so thank you!

Buy/Curious = Joe
105 Joe on 11.17.12 at 4:01 pm
Smoking man=oldman
Choice in music would be Ministry – Burning inside… I do like Rage, NIN, Janes Addiction but most of all Sinead. Be creative Joe, I’m waiting.

I’ll just call Buy/curious Joe for now under the above assumption. I’m sorry that you now obsess over me. If it gives you purpose and meaning then do what you must. Next time you ‘bang’ a coworker please don’t BBM it out. I’m guessing some others are not so amused with you. She is a good girl who was just looking for some love, and she is someone I respect and care about. Do what you must Joe, it seems as if you have too much free time on your hands and on that I’m envious.

#157 Linda Pearson on 11.26.12 at 6:21 pm
Linda (who I’ll just call Barb because I like the name), I’m sorry about some of the rumours I’ve heard about you. I have never said you were sleeping with anyone. You did say some rather odd things about a mutual aquaintance and his girlfriend. You did tell me, and reiterated after I refused to believe, that Buy(Joe) just sent out a BBM saying he had ‘banged’ a friend. I don’t think she deserved to be messaged to everyone in your group as a ‘bang’. I also referred to another coworker as a ‘lady’ and you immediately started trashing her. She is a lady. As a classy woman I’d expect you to treat others the same. I really do wish you well and hope you find some peace or whatever it is your looking for.

136 Davey Boy on 11.26.12 at 2:43 pm
Davey Boy…don’t use your nickname. How about Johnny Boy? I don’t know what I did to you. Guess I didn’t follow the rules. Sorry Buddy.

Teacher on 11.23.12 at 8:04 am
Teacher..waiting to learn..wish me well on this journey. You haven’t revealed yourself so I’m not sure.

As an aside, I’ve never cheated on my wife. Not while we are married and not when we were dating. Not with a woman, man, dog or goat; free or paid. The odd time a pretty girl seems to go out of her way I run, and men no longer approach either, thanks Joe.
I’d polygraph that gladly. Actually I’d polygraph anything you wish. Whatever nonsense I partook in my youth I don’t remember. As Robin Williams quoted on blacking out ‘my conscience said I’m out of here…this I don’t want to remember! Fortunately the only person I really hurt was myself. I haven’t had more than one (1) beer in almost 10 years, aside from my wedding and that I blame on the waitress’s and excellent table wine at the old mill. My exceptional drinking days were, but not limited to, 18-21 and 25 for about 3 months after being dumped. My liver, and now my knee are just fine thank you very much! I was limping for a while but I worked it out. How’s your back Joe?

Nasty shiz going on here garth!! Hope this has entertained. Let the sloggin’ begin!!

I will never take the tube again. — Garth

#57 John on 11.26.12 at 11:39 pm

He is from Goldman. What else is there to say?

#58 JJ Petes on 11.26.12 at 11:40 pm

From one ivory tower to another. They work in a world of theories and models driven by the Keynsian ideologues which have no real world benefits, only consequences.

Of course it will all fail in the end, several years from now. When we have to reset the monetary system, have a debt jubilee against bondholders and start over.

I think what will future historians write about this period? We need not care about who’s running the central banks at all, they all follow the same doctrines so Carney in England is completely irrelavant.

What we need are real solutions to create a money system with far less leverage, non usury levels of interest in the 1% to 3% maximum range, and have reserve ratios of at least 20 percent for all banks and loans made for the creditor and for the borrower.

It does not need to be backed by gold, anything can be money if the supply is controlled. We would never be at this point if there was higher underwriting standards and 20% downpayments before borrowing any money. That and banks must keep 20% on reserve and may not exceed 5 to 1 not this 10, 20, to 50+ leveraged reserve ratios which will fail.

The derivatives markets could not flourish under this standard, but they would work as intended; as a hedge for producers of said commodities.

We need real solutions to the debt issues and out of control government spending, especially in the US where the government now runs Trillion plus defecits per year.

We need governments on term limits of 4 years maximum then your out of office. We need the people who go to work in government for 4 years to have at least 20 years in the private sector first. We must abolish all public pensions. We must abolish all public unions for they only serve themselves and “collective bargaining” is in reality bargaining only for themselves without taxpayer intervention or say.

We need to move as a political system from a Republic that we have now to a democracy. The difference being that we vote people to represent us as groups where a democracy each household has a vote on any law change through referendum.

I can go on but those are some basics. We are far from that. So Mr Carney you make no difference here as you will make no difference in England whatsoever, the monetary system as it is desigened currently will need to be reset and I hear no one, anywhere stepping up and talking about real structural and fundamental reforms so very needed to occur…

We need this to happen,

Before we go to war


#59 Blacksheep on 11.26.12 at 11:40 pm

Daystar and the censorship diaries,

“Another universal goal for the enlightened is peace through harmony and if we aren’t about that, we’ll find conflict without question and where does going blind with assumptions into picking a fight, asking all the wrong questions and disrepecting all the natural born leaders get you?”

“Challenging authority is another matter. One should never challenge authority unless the challenger
“knows” the authority is not only wrong, but will never get it right due to the enlightenment traps I speak of and then some and again, thats what I see far too often from so called “challengers” on this site.

“They don’t know what they are talking about, they only think they know, motivated by individualistic egotistical ideals that breed conflict over holistic ideals that breed harmony and as such, are blinded to how “stunted” their life’s journey has become”

“until an alpha comes along… a wolf playing among domestics, teaching them the ways of nature and social graces through putting them in their place by using their own words and goals against them, warning them occasionally bluntly, “fire isn’t for pups, its for adults, go play with water for a while and learn to piss with the pups lest you get burned”
Your…obviously not an Alpha or you wouldn’t waste this much energy on such long winded posts, trying sway others from independent, critical thinking.

In case you forgot:

Alpha’s promote free thinking and challenge the system, not conform to it.

take care

#60 Click Here, its different on 11.26.12 at 11:43 pm

@Marnic @Monkey

Of course its a fake picture ..! Did you really think F and C would pose with “FORECLOSURE” signs in front of cranes ???

#61 Suede on 11.26.12 at 11:47 pm

Oh wow, another Goldman Sachs alumnus heads to a major position for a central bank or in government. Conspiracy alert.

Or maybe Goldman has a great eye for intuition and talent.

Ride the wave or be a victim of it.

#62 Suede on 11.26.12 at 11:48 pm

When Morgan Stanley opened up offices in BC they hired 8 of the top 10 energy traders in Vancouver for “name your price” amount.

hard to say no to companies like that. No conspiracy, money talks.

#63 Click Here, its different on 11.26.12 at 11:49 pm

BTW, Greece will be bailed out … Again … And 44 billions this time …

#64 winter's coming on 11.26.12 at 11:54 pm


I think that’s what’s wrong with the world. Not that there are users, scammers and fair-weather friends out there, but that people like yourself cheer them on & emulate them.

Success should mean something else. Not this:

“As a man who clearly understands how to play politics and how to get out before all the positives turn into negatives, [Carney] will be able to use the UK as a 3-5 year springboard onto a loftier place – like the IMU or other global level offices.

Good on him for playing the system like we all should –…”

but then this probably isn’t the place for my moral outrage.

#65 Marnic on 11.26.12 at 11:55 pm

#60 Click: It now says it’a an illustration; when first displayed it was being passed off as an unretouched photo.

I translated it into crayon for you. — Garth

#66 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 11:57 pm

St. Marguerite d’Youville suspension

This is why I drink, I love Canada so much, We have 30 million with resources up the ying yang.

Yet we make slaves rather than opportunists.
Dogs rather than Masters.
Employees rather than employers.

I made the hard way, don’t need to be hard. If we just educated our kids, not school them. This country would rule the world.

What a waste.

#67 TOUGH TIMES on 11.27.12 at 12:02 am

The 50% crash in RE has started and Carnival Carney knows it. This mess was created by both his and the Con Gov’t Policies.

We bailed out our banks at the tune of $150 billion with the shittest mortgages put on the books of the CHMC taxpayer. The Con’s introduced 0 down, 40 year mortgages. Anyone and there pet would qualify for a mortgage in the tune of $500,000K plus. Why was CHMC Pre-approving $2 million dollar homes as starter homes on the taxpayer dime. Wake up people you were fed bull-shit to enslave you in a unrepayable debt.

Basically this clown has bailed out of the RE Titanic and wiped his hands cleans. Can you believe these are the type of people we have running the country at the top. Canada currently has $600 billion debt and another $600 billion in CHMC (Sub-Prime Debt) totalling over $1 Trillion Dollars blog dogs. CAN YOU SAY WE ARE SCREWED!!!!

If you are a HGTV Virgin I would strongly suggest you sell NOW (Might be too late) and get out of the RE market ASAP as you were suckered by the bank slave masters, realtards, builders and developers. If you haven’t bought yet I would suggest you start low balling these Realtards by 50% on RE. The Crash has started and there is no stopping it now folks.

All the investors / flippers are going bankrupt at Trump Towers this is your future HGTV virgins and you must try to get out NOW or if you are buying start low balling these Realtards by 50%.

Even Carnival Carney has jumped shipped. WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR!!!!! Take control of your destiny now HGTV Virgins.

The whole RE industry is in FULL OUT PANIC as the 50% CRASH has finally arrived. Soon construction jobs will begin to be lost which employees 1.5 million people. When you have 500,000 of these folks unemployeed (coming soon) welcome to your GREAT DEPRESSION CANADA. No different than other countries who lost 50% in there FAKE RE VALUES i.e. US, Spain, Ireland, Greece you name it.

Its called the NEGATIVE FEEDBACK LOOP within our ecomony. Carnival Carney was the first one to take the live raft and say BYE, BYE Canada.

#68 dosouth on 11.27.12 at 12:04 am

Guess they didn’t get your memo Garth –

#69 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 12:15 am

If it wasn’t Carney, it would have been
Jim O’Neill

#70 DON on 11.27.12 at 12:18 am

#23 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 10:48 pm

We agree on this for sure! Let children be children besides they are most likely bang on in their opinions of their teachers.

#29 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 11:01 pm

Geezus – it must be the end of the world or something – I agree with you again. Educational reform is needed badly in Canada the bar seems to have fallen in the last 20 years and students regurgitate the book word for word and not taught how to think analytically. Pieces of paper (dipolma’s do not make you smart, your collective knowledge and wisdom are what it takes).

#71 DR. WAYNE on 11.27.12 at 12:18 am

#5 Moose_N.I on 11.26.12 at 10:22 pm

I’m goin for it “fuuurssst”!

SO AM I … ‘a$$$$hollllle’ would be Mr. Moose. Oh ya … learn how to spell ‘going’ …

#72 FTP - First Time Poster on 11.27.12 at 12:19 am

#14 – Roland

Your comments are bang on the money!

Just to refresh everyones memory, Zero Hedge broke this story back in the summer which i reposted here & got poo-pooed by several of you misinformed malcontents.

BI posted an article (below) which nearly made me puke. The fact Carney is leaving is a clear sign the party is over. BTW – did anyone else catch the news clip of F & Carney making the announcement? F broke out into hives – looked like his head was ready to explode!

#73 GTARealEstateCorner on 11.27.12 at 12:19 am

I’ve been following this blog for a while and while it seems many people can’t stand Smoking Man, I don’t know why but I feel sorry for him. It actually pains my heart when I read his posts. He’s probably a decent guy who just had some major issues in life, ended up on the wrong side of the financial tracks. BUT that doesn’t give anyone the right to constantly belittle him. Please leave him alone and let him be. His posts are completely harmless and if it helps him deal with his issues, so be it. Buzz off folks. Live and let live!

#74 Smoking Man on 11.27.12 at 12:23 am

#56 George Theophylactou on 11.26.12 at 11:38 pm

I’m afraid, very afraid. Won’t be chirping you. I yield to the alpha.

Nice Job George, Thanks

#75 Chuck on 11.27.12 at 12:26 am

Ok, so how do you short the residential real estate market?

#76 randman on 11.27.12 at 12:30 am

“It does not need to be backed by gold, anything can be money if the supply is controlled. We would never be at this point if there was higher underwriting standards and 20% downpayments before borrowing any money. That and banks must keep 20% on reserve and may not exceed 5 to 1 not this 10, 20, to 50+ leveraged reserve ratios which will fail.”

Dream on my friend …..absolute power corrupts and the big banks have absolute power …….

It doesn’t have to be backed by gold….you are right …but
can you come up with a better alternative?

#77 Boomer21 on 11.27.12 at 12:34 am

#56 George
Why don’t all of you take this “issue” to Facebook”. You can’t tell the players without a program and I am getting confused with all of the cross talk. I usually scroll by a lot of this sh#t but come on, who could figure this stuff out! Why don’t we try to stay on topic; Real Estate and Finance not personal vendettas amongst TTC drivers, track whatevers and Daystar gazers going on forever with no relevance to the topic. Sheesh!

#78 Ford Prefect on 11.27.12 at 12:37 am

I have great sympathy for Mr. Turner. It must be galling in the extreme to see a slime ball like Carney praised to the skies.

At the time he was appointed governor the woman who then handled our investments said ” Heaven help us, he is a Goldman Sach’s product. “

#79 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 12:46 am

#70 DON #23 Smoking Man

Educational reform is needed badly in Canada the bar seems to have fallen in the last 20 years and students regurgitate the book word for word and not taught how to think analytically.

Who needs reform when graduation rates are soaring, like Ontario going from 68% in 2003 to 82% today. Link If everyone is passing it must be success, right?

Our education system has become nothing but a business to stupefy their kids. I hope parents figure this out sooner then later.

#80 city slicker on 11.27.12 at 12:52 am

My question has always been why did they start the zero down 40 year amorts in 2006? The financial crisis didnt hit until 2008

#81 metal-nut#756 on 11.27.12 at 12:57 am

“Carney appointed to head bank of England”…

………………..>>>>>haha! SUCKERS!<<<<…………..

Let's see how much you admire him after his 'monkey see monkey do' (from Bernanke) ZIRP policies blow up the Canadian economy in a few short years when interest rates explode upwards.

Maybe I shouldn't laugh too loud, because who knows what the next Chief Governor of the BoC will do. I imagine more of the same – PRINT, BABY, PRINT! I should apply for the job, I'm pretty fast hitting CTRL+P.

Look, Carney is a very smart guy, but all he did was implement 'serenity now – insanity later' policies (aka. kick the can economics). The judgement of the quality of his policies should be reserved for at least 5 years from now, when they've had a chance to fully affect the Canadian economy.

Remember kids, the entire financial world also thought that the Greenspan Wizard was a genius…. until 2008!

What was his biggest mistake? Blowing bubbles with extremely low interest rates held down for too long – the primary trigger of the housing bubble in the USA. Guess where Canada is at now? Ya…

#82 Concessionman on 11.27.12 at 12:58 am

Govn’r Garth…I like the ring to that…

#83 hawk on 11.27.12 at 12:59 am

#20 Randy on 11.26.12 at 10:46 pm


If there is possibly a single leader left in the western world, possessing integrity and worthy of respect could it be Ron Paul?

I wonder, but I like the guy and have a hunch that maybe just maybe he really is righteous, unlike others.

#84 Grim Reaper/Crypt Speculator on 11.27.12 at 12:59 am

Opinions are like Dr. Wayne…

everbody has one…

#85 Webcanto on 11.27.12 at 12:59 am

Another shyster buggering off before it gets bad and he is held accountable. There needs to be laws to prevent this type of behaviour.

#86 Victoria Tea Party on 11.27.12 at 1:01 am


A blast from the past courtesy of British rocker Gary Wright. Remember the melody to this song?

“…Dream Weaver, I believe you can get me through the night
Dream Weaver, I believe we can reach the morning light
Fly me high through the starry skies
Or maybe to an astral plane
Cross the highways of fantasy
Help me to forget today’s pain…”


From the prestigious London Telegraph paper’s key finance columnist, Jeremy Warner, was this assessment of Carney:

“…Mark Carney: new age is dawning for the Bank as George Osborne bags his man…Something of a coup for Britain’s beleaguered coalition Government or more evidence that Goldman Sachs is taking over the world?”

Dream Weaver (?), iconic banker born of Goldman- Sachs and raised in Ottawa’s byzantine and opaque civil service roundelay, Mark Carney is a financial rock star if you thumb through the British press coverage.

The gentleman has cut a giant swathe as the Old lady of Threadneedle Street tarts and primps a bit here and a bit there awaiting next July 1st’ arrival of her winsome, would-be, rescuer.


“…This may come as a shock to those who believe there are some jobs too British to be handled by a foreigner, and even more of one to people who worry about the apparently unstoppable rise of the Goldman Sachs diaspora – yes…Mr Carney was a Goldman Sachs apparatchik. But is it really so very odd when you consider the realities of today’s global village?”


Another view lof the Carney/Goldman Sachs nexus, from Zero Hedge blog:

“… Pity: all one needs to realize and remember how the events in the world play out is to remember one simple thing: GOLDMAN SACHS RUNS IT. Everything else is secondary.


The big question facing Britain about Mr. Carney is where his loyalties may lie. Are they with his new gig or with his old Wall Street haunts?

Certainly the now extant collateral damage inflicted upon Canadians who indulged in real estate debt, during Carney’s tenure thanks to his various monetary (and F’s various fiscal) policies since 2008, could in some quarters, seem to be a whiff of tarnish on those bold, brass-plated bank entrance doors!

But that could also just be just harsh criticism by those resenting Carney’s meteroric rise through the world of finance.

After all, he’ll have a helluva mess to clean up in Dear Ol’ Blighty’s horribly corrupted corporate banking establishment.

However, on the sunny side of things, his job will be made that much more pertinent, when he observes the power of the London Metals Exchange, and the otherwise overwhelming influence the “City” has over continental Euro stock and bond markets.

Carney will fairly seem to bestride the world, and I’m not joking here, from his next perch.

He will have magnified power levers that not even the US Central banker, Ben Bernanke has.

Big Ben may yet get to polish Mr. Carney’s door handles, for crying out loud! No, really.


Do I think Carney’s new job is a slam-dunk for Goldman Sachs already global reach?

Or is it a straight-up promotion for a highly respected banker whose Churchillian-style “Coventry” actions prevented collapse of Canada’s financial system but at a terrible price for so many suckers who, instead of living their current real estate nightmares, should have just shut the hell up and kept on renting and dreaming…

“…Though the dawn may be coming soon
There still may be some time
Fly me away to the bright side of the moon
And meet me on the other side
Dream Weaver, I believe you can get me through the night
Dream Weaver, I believe we can reach the morning light.”

#87 Carpe Diem on 11.27.12 at 1:01 am

Who cares with Mark goes next. England will be an awesome career move for the guy. Next.

What is much more news worthy is TSFA’s $500 contribution increases.

Wow … me and my woman can now contribute more in this!!!

Interestingly, Globe and Mail reports negatively on this since they assume the top 1% benefit from this.

I disagree. If you are not an RE idiot, you benefit from this.

BTW … the G&M paywall is very easy to bypass.

#88 Gord In Vancouver on 11.27.12 at 1:02 am

Thank you, England!

#89 Devore on 11.27.12 at 1:06 am

#52 Marnic

What an odd retort. It’s a fake picture…the research will take you about two minutes.

Research?!? Do you have eyes?

The picture is so obviously fake and doesn’t even try to look unretouched, announcing its fakeness like it’s an earthshattering revelation deserves you all the sarcasm and ridicule Garth can dish out.

Seriously, get a sense of humour people.

#90 new-era on 11.27.12 at 1:06 am

yes he is the best. Because of him and his continuation to kick the can down the road, we are in the situation we are in now.

He’s is good for the banksters and will eventually create the greatest transfer of wealth, destroying the middle class and handing all the powers to the Banksters.

Welcome to your new MASTERS Canadian. The banks will own you.

#91 Danno on 11.27.12 at 1:12 am

Without reading through all the posts, prior to writing this, I’m hoping I don’t repeat someone else’s post. One thought… Isn’t it convenient to leave just before the bubble bursts and shows his true efforts. It’s always the rats the leave a sinking ship first.

#92 Devore on 11.27.12 at 1:16 am

#73 GTARealEstateCorner

He’s probably a decent guy who just had some major issues in life, ended up on the wrong side of the financial tracks. BUT that doesn’t give anyone the right to constantly belittle him.


Let me re-compose myself here…

Belittle him? You realize to him you’re a lowly dumb track fiver. Or sixer. Or however his dumb analogy goes, I always forget. His hubris and superiority complex easily exceeds anything DA ever put to (virtual) paper (we’re still waiting for SM’s dead-tree format book), and it’s perfectly fair game to call him out on equal terms.

#93 Hoof-Hearted on 11.27.12 at 1:16 am

From the UK:

Mark Carney’s ‘shock’ appointment means more of the same

Osborne’s choice for governor of the Bank of England will do nothing to prevent the next collapse of the financial system


The FT was right when in January this year it described Carney as [FT paywall]”the leading example of a new breed of ambitious, internationally focused central bankers who view regulatory and monetary policy issues through a more market-based lens”. He favours an “open and resilient financial system” – code for giving the banks free rein in global capital markets. And like many of his peers he believes that the key to recovery lies in all western economies “capitalising on the immense opportunity that emerging markets in general and China in particular represent”. Like others, he prefers exports over the expansion and strengthening of domestic markets.

So be very afraid. Business-as-usual will prevail. And nothing will be done to constrain the City, and therefore to prevent the next collapse of the financial system.



Instead like many others who adopt a “market-based” approach to regulation, Carney prefers to tinker – retrospectively – with the capital ratios of banks. This is because he and many others in central bank circles know that most of the Britain’s banks are very highly leveraged. That without the support of the Bank of England’s quantitative easing programme, and its very low lending rates – all effectively backed by British taxpayers – Britain’s banks would effectively be insolvent.

And so Carney will continue with quantitative easing – which has provided British banks with the liquidity needed to indulge in speculative activity both at home and abroad, speculative activity that bears a scary resemblance to that undertaken before the crisis.

etc. etc.

Carney is simply more palatable to the Brits than a Bernanke or Greenspan, but once Goldman Sachs, always Goldman Sachs ….PERIOD.

#94 Frank Dean on 11.27.12 at 1:19 am

Even on a pathetic blog it’s “sterling”. Especially when discussing the Bank of England.

#95 Marnic on 11.27.12 at 1:21 am

I translated it into crayon for you. — Garth

And you even spelled all the words right. Well done.

#96 Realist on 11.27.12 at 1:29 am

>>(with ten times the economic output)

What has the total size of the economy got to do with house prices? Do you expect prices in Andorra to be almost free because its total economy is so small?

You make some good points about the incompetence of this guy but spoil it by exposing your own economic illiteracy.

#97 Toxicosis on 11.27.12 at 1:33 am

Stop laying all the blame on Flaherty for all of this Garth. Carney like Bernanke played his part like a good profiteer….um puppet. Carney blew this bubble well more than Flaherty, he is the central bank head you know. I also could have sworn eight months ago you said rates are goin up for sure. What happened there Garth? Did you underestimate the global economic picture, the 67 trillion dollar shadow banking system, the money printing, fiat paper dilution mania(still ongoing), the collapse in growth but not debt. No sorry, you just missed reality. But it won’t miss you. Funny thing you were wrong about rates, wrong about Carney leaving, wrong about the collapse in gold and silver, wrong about how money printing destroys economies not support it. You’ve been spot on about the housing bubble, but continue delusions concerning some magical comeback in U.S. real estate.
You’ll probably tell me you’re not wrong, but provide no significant analysis to back your position. It’s okay though Garth, reality eventually weeds out the willfully blind from the population. Regards.

#98 Anon on 11.27.12 at 1:33 am

I translated it into crayon for you. — Garth

Gold Jerry, Gold!

#99 Alberta Ed on 11.27.12 at 1:57 am

It might be more useful to have someone other than an economist/banker in charge at the fed. Good luck to the BOE.

#100 Tim on 11.27.12 at 1:58 am

What would have happened to the economy if interest rates weren’t kept so low during and immediately after the financial crises? How much would business have contracted and what effect would that have on employment? You don’t even mention this.

#101 Freedom First on 11.27.12 at 1:59 am


You have steel balls Garth…….Not very many people in the world have the gonads to print “The Truth”. Kudos!

#102 George Theophylactou on 11.27.12 at 2:10 am

The nonsense that’s been played out is not close to being over. Where this goes will be up to them. They know I’m pissed.

#103 2centsCdn on 11.27.12 at 2:15 am

Timing is everything. Carney is no dummy. He knows its a good time to get out of Dodge. If he passes on this opportunity, a year from now his resume won’t look so good (Canada crumbling)….. the timing and circumstances are perfect for ducking blame and a career upgrade.

#104 $$$BPOE#1 on 11.27.12 at 2:16 am

Interest rates going down. Stay tuned for announcement. Projects selling out right left and center in BPOE.

#105 Metro Van Observer on 11.27.12 at 2:19 am

I have said it before and I will repeat it here again, Carney may look a lot like Alan Greenspan in hindsight. It may be just a matter of months. Garth has done a great job here of lifting the veil a bit.

#106 Bast on 11.27.12 at 2:29 am

So clever – leave when everything is on the brink of going cattywampus in Canada and look in the rear view mirror and shrug. Am thinking that Osborne also had to throw in a knighthood to seal the deal beyond the 50% salary increase, so it will soon be Sir Mark Carney – but he’ll have to change a few rules in order to do that first. (Canadians can only receive honourary knighthoods and therefore cannot lawfully use the term “sir”.)

#107 daystar on 11.27.12 at 3:07 am

#59 Blacksheep on 11.26.12 at 11:40 pm

Let me guess, you’re constructively criticizing me for “my benefit” no doubt. If you really do have any sincerely genuine concerns for my behalf, I appreciate your efforts but your time is most likely better spent looking after needs of your own. Best of luck.

#108 Debtfree on 11.27.12 at 3:23 am

If you’re ever in a poker game carney . And you can’t figure out after a few minutes who the patsy is . Then you’re the patsy . That’s who Canada is ,The patsy . But we did not all drink your cool aid .

#109 Tony on 11.27.12 at 4:16 am

I do remember Mark Carney single-handedly broke the back of the Alberta real estate market with that interest rate bump the third Tuesday of June 2007. He’ll go down in history as the guy the broke the real estate market in Alberta back in 2007. Lets hope he doesn’t do the same thing to England.

#110 Buy? Curious? on 11.27.12 at 4:44 am

#56 George Theophylactou on 11.26.12 at 11:38 pm

What the hell was that? Did your nurse just give you back your computer privlages back as long as you took your medicine?

#111 daystar on 11.27.12 at 4:45 am

#36 wes coast on 11.26.12 at 11:07 pm

Thats my take on it.

#59 Blacksheep on 11.26.12 at 11:40 pm

Well… I say I’m a dog star but really, I’m just a seven sisters kinda guy. (easy to tell, really)

There’s your alpha wolf. Its never really quite what it seems is it.

#112 Questioning Calgary stats on 11.27.12 at 4:51 am

Garth it was obvious that Canada was in a housing bubble by the end of 2006. It didn’t take Carney to lower rates to emergency levels two years later to produce that.

You used to say that Canada was in a housing bubble in 2008 when you predicted the crash that subsequently started but was extinquished by massive intervention. Now you talk as though our housing bubble formed after the GFC, around 2009. Please clarify.

Will the correction that we are experiencing now reach lower prices than the crash that had started in 2008, if it had been left without massive housing market intervention and stimulus?

#113 TheBigLebowski on 11.27.12 at 4:56 am

Garth, your mastery of Hegelian Dialectic is really admirable Garth. How you spin things like this as just Random events. Never admitting that we are simply living through a long term business plan in which Goldman Sachs is one of the major CEO’s of this corporatist/fascist business model . Carney got shuffled to England because he is a Goldman yes man and was vetted years ago for his unquestioning loyalty to the Globalist banking dictatorship now coming into view. But I have to give you credit. Your loyalty is also apparent to this same hierarchy . though playing a role as a lower level pit goblin, your simply another willing brick in this New World Order pyramid.

#114 Crash Calaway on 11.27.12 at 5:43 am

Let’s recap,

– Carney does absolutely zero at BOC
– Carney stumbles across book by Joel Skousen on strategic relocation and becomes a prepper.
– Carney points his fan to England in order to avoid the shite that is heading towards it.

Amazing how the politicians always shuffle the deck at the right time.

#115 Richard and Zeus on 11.27.12 at 5:56 am

I wonder how many guvmint werkers will halv too be fiered to cauterize the economic wounds. 100000 maybe?

#116 Nubbers on 11.27.12 at 6:51 am

This is very positive news for Canada. It shows that we (Canadians) are willing to takes the medicine and get the worst of the crash over and done with ASAP, or at least well in advance of the next election.

Conversely, the bubble fans in the UK also see Carney as good news, as we (British) sacrifice sanity in order to have a lost decade or two like the Japanese.

#117 Cloud on 11.27.12 at 6:53 am

I dont get it, why does everyone believe in central planning and appointing having czars…. this in not capitalism at all, this is socialism… and socialism always leads to communism… I for one believe that not one group of elite bankers can determine interest rates or control free market forces… This is going to end very badly in the long term…

#118 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 7:05 am

I can’t believe how many loons are on this blog. If the New England Patriots recruited Kevin Glenn, you’d say “he knew it was a good time to get out of Calgary.”

I don’t know that economist. — Garth

#119 Francis on 11.27.12 at 7:34 am

Many many thanks for Dear England. It needed to be said.

Should be said once every week until the next election !

#120 somecatchphrase on 11.27.12 at 8:10 am

It’s encouraging to see that several commentators have noted that Canada doesn’t really have a truly sovereign monetary policy.

Canada’s central bank governor is effectively hamstrung by the policies of the US Federal Reserve. Canada will have super low rates for as long as the US does. It won’t matter who is running the Bank of Canada.

In a yield starved world, if Canada raised rates, the loonie would go up versus the US dollar, further decimating what’s left of Canada’s manufacturing sector, not to mention the retail sector.

Our manufacturers can’t compete with Indiana or Ohio, let alone Mexico or China. This is with parity between the two currencies. Imagine what would happen if Canada raised rates. Imagine if your Canadian dollar was worth $1.10 or $1.20 south of the border.

Imagine the line ups at the border. The classic BTO song “You Aint’ Seen Nothing Yet” comes to mind. There’d be new reality shows called something like “Extreme Cross Border Shopping.” CBSA would need to double or triple it’s staffing levels.

On the upside, a surging loonie would improve the healthcare that’s actually available to Canadians, as more people could afford to go south and actually get the healthcare that they pay for.

If you want to know the true architects of Canada’s housing bubble, I would tender the following candidates:

1. Ben Bernanke (ZIRP)
2. Alan Greenspan (ZIRP)
3. Richard Nixon (August 15, 1971, Executive Order 11615)
4. Whoever was behind the creation of the CMHC back in 1946.
5. Adolf Hitler (I think the creation of the CMHC had something to do with providing housing and employment for returning veterans in the aftermath of WWII.)

#121 pbrasseur on 11.27.12 at 8:15 am

“Can we also interest you in an elfin deity?” – Garth


What the heck, we’ll throw in Justin Bieber as signing bonus!!!

#122 Dade on 11.27.12 at 8:36 am

I’ll never forget The letter David Dodge wrote the CMHC. If anyone could see what would happen next, it was him:

6 years later…

#123 TurnerNation on 11.27.12 at 8:47 am

Success, in this case, means getting most Canadians indebted to their bank. Via houses.

Gotta love it, Adam Smith’s “Invisible Hand”.

#124 House Horny Housewife on 11.27.12 at 8:48 am


Mr. Carney strikes me as a very ambitious and dangerous individual. Someone who will seek out power to secure his position. I don’t think he got to where he is at such a young age by accident and I am sure he had to climb over many heads to get there.

He is certainly leaving Canada at the right time, isn’t he ? If things go as badly as you say in the future, he will be seen as having held down the fort and having kept Canada from imploding but lo and behold look what happens when he leaves his post. Cunning indeed. Timing really IS everything.

Unless he has already checked out his new position and knows who’s ass to kiss over there across the pond (after all, he already managed to get the position didn’t he), he will probably be taking some time to “learn the ropes” (and by this I don’t mean where the stapler, pencils and photocopy machine are located). Once he has “acclimatized” to the new “culture” (wink wink nudge nudge) you can bet he will be invinsible.

To his credit, he is taking on a huge challenge so kudos to him for having the balls to take on that much risk. Should he be seen as weak and inefficient by the brits, however, you can bet that he will be sailing back across the atlantic in a blow up dinghy.

On England’s end, I don’t know what the heck they are doing and think they are just as desperate as Spain is for foreign residents to come in and solve their problems. They are hoping that this guy is some sort of miracle genius simply because they see that Canada seems to have escaped the world economy’s fate, Carney’s alma mater and his age in relation to his successful position. Don’t they know that “all that glitters is not gold” ?

Oh and did you say around a million DOLLARS for his new salary ? He will go through that in a nanosecond over there. You want expensive real estate, try buying something in London .. and talk about miniscule … kitchen islands are virtually unknown much less master ensuites and walk in closets.

Good Luck Mark !


#125 The American on 11.27.12 at 8:51 am

I cannot stop laughing. I love the name of the jpg file for the picture in the post. “Peckerettes2.jpg” How perfect. With Mark the new head of Bank of England, I think it is becoming quite evident he will be exiting BOC just in time before the shit really hits the fan. I wonder if the Queen knows what she’s got coming her way… hmmmmmm. The real question is this – Is ol’ Markie boy being forced out, or is he going by design. To hold both positions at the same time is a gross conflict of interest and frankly, unethical from a business ethics perspective.

#126 Victor V on 11.27.12 at 8:55 am

Whoever gets the job inherits an economy that has shifted rapidly to slower growth.

A correction is under way in the housing market, household debt is at record levels, and businesses and consumers alike are feeling the strains of the global slowdown.

Unemployment stands at 7.4 per cent and the jobless rate among young people is just about double that, while inflation is tame.

Fresh evidence of the slowing recovery will come Friday, when most economists expect third-quarter growth to come in at less than an annualized 1 per cent.

“There are certainly growing risks in the Canadian economy,” said Sébastien Lavoie, Montreal-based assistant chief economist at Laurentian Bank of Canada. Mr. Carney is leaving at a time when “household debt is crippling, there’s tightening on the fiscal front and the tailwinds of the Canadian economy are starting to evaporate.

#127 Fred on 11.27.12 at 8:56 am

If I understand correctly one of Carney/Flaherty’s other moves during GFC 2008 was the equity swap of (crappy?) mortgages for cash. I think it started at $25B but might have ended up over $100B? The money came from the punching of numbers on a keyboard. At the time I seem to recall Garth pointing out that this money was backstopped by nothing other than the reputation of the Canadian dollar.

It looks like this move worked, in that it put liquidity into the banks (no bailout needed? So why did they suddenly need liquidity, i.e. money?) and the mortgage assets seem to be getting paid off. And no one seems to be worried about the reputation of the Canadian dollar.

#128 Herb on 11.27.12 at 9:06 am

#115 R & Z,

engage in much wishful thinking, my truth hammering friend?

#129 Tony on 11.27.12 at 9:11 am

Re: #122 Dade on 11.27.12 at 8:36 am

David Dodge was responsible for the real estate crash in Alberta back in the summer of 2007. The June interest rate hike the third Tuesday broke the market right down the middle.

#130 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 9:20 am

It’s encouraging to see that several commentators have noted that Canada doesn’t really have a truly sovereign monetary policy.

Nor does any other country with a globalized, trading economy.

If you want to know the true architects of Canada’s housing bubble, I would tender the following candidates:
[truly nutty list of candidates elided…]

It’s pretty simple. Cheap, easy money, low down payments *AND* a guarantee of your mortgage by a government rated triple A. You really think somebody would lend your sorry ass money at 3% for five years without a guarantor, regardless of the actions of Hitler or Nixon?

#131 fancy_pants on 11.27.12 at 9:21 am

Good riddance!
Too bad MC wasn’t just another one of Aesop’s Fables. And here I thought liars were never rewarded…
…excuse me while I dig my tongue out of my cheek.

#132 TurnerNation on 11.27.12 at 9:23 am

For some reason I am reminded of Lord(?) Black of “Crossover”. My country, my peerage?

#133 Carney's Crap on 11.27.12 at 9:37 am

In the words of the great Canadian economist John Kenneth Galbraith and very fitting on this day of central banker discussion:

“In central banking as in diplomacy, style, conservative tailoring, and an easy association with the affluent count greatly and results far much less.”

Truer words have never been spoken.

#134 wxman44 on 11.27.12 at 9:45 am

Agree with you totally Garth. Mark Carney could very well go down in history as the worst Canadian central banker. His zero interest rate policy just fed the drug addict..the debt crazy Canadian. Of course everything is roses when the bubble is expanding. When the bubble pops within a year or so then everyone will be crying and Mr.Carney will be nowhere to be found.
He is an incredible hypocrite..telling Canadians that their debt levels were too high yet at the same time keeping interest rates at record low levels for years. Allan Greenspan was once the rockstar of central bankers and look how he is regarded now. Good luck england you will need it..

#135 Herb on 11.27.12 at 9:51 am

#122 Dade,

great find! Yes indeed, nobody could have seen this coming …

#136 Eaglebay - Parksville on 11.27.12 at 9:55 am

#88 Gord In Vancouver on 11.27.12 at 1:02 am
Thank you, England!
Best post so far today.

#137 Bad Chemist on 11.27.12 at 9:59 am

#23 Smoking Man on 11.26.12 at 10:48 pm

Carney Likes his booze.
The machine teaches us that drinking, recreational drugs, and things that detach us from reality are not healthy. Well I beg to differ. I believe those things spur creativity, give you new ideas and dreams, help you detach from your machine written slave programming and find ways to better your life. They alter pyridine and prospective.

Pyridine is used as a precursor to agrochemicals and pharmaceuticals and is also an important solvent and reagent. I would not suggest taking this orally or even letting it touch your skin.

#138 T.J. BONES on 11.27.12 at 10:10 am

Sir Garth : Is it coincidence that C is going to England just as the lIBOR SCANDAL is rising?

#139 I think Marnic is on to something on 11.27.12 at 10:12 am

I think you are right, Mr. Garth did do something to that photo. Very well done Champ – thank goodness you are there.

#140 robert james on 11.27.12 at 10:45 am

I think it would be very nice if Harper moved to Israel to be with his dear friends in their time of need..

#141 Steven Rowlandson on 11.27.12 at 10:47 am

The only justification for ZIRP is to lower interest costs to the government so that it frees up funds to pay down government debt. Other than that it is merely a subsidy for fiscal irresponsibility and irresponsible lending practices. Unless government is cleaning up its fiscal act ZIRP should not be allowed.

#142 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 10:53 am

Mark Carney could well go down in history as our BEST central banker. After all, inflation hit double digits, nobody would lend to the Government of Canada for less than 8%, unemployment hit double digits, and our dollar went to US$0.40. Wait, none of those things happened.

Think about it, people. If you have to have a housing crash at the end of a boom, causing high unemployment and debt default, is it better to have it WHEN THE ENTIRE REST OF THE WORLD IS IN A DEEP RECESSION, or maybe delay until our trading partners are back on their feet and buying our exports again??? Honestly, it appears to me that some of you people think successful central banking looks like United Airlines Flight 232.

#143 SpaceMonkey on 11.27.12 at 11:09 am

Hey “I think…”,
You thought wrong. Marnic never said that Mr. Garth did anything to the picture.

For the first time, that I recall, Garth made a point to say that the photo was “untouched”. He has since removed those words.

Because you apparently can’t handle it. — Garth

#144 Canuck Abroad on 11.27.12 at 11:24 am

All that is wrong with Vancouver…

The really sad part is if you look at this house pre “reno” on google maps it’s a cute little house that probably didn’t really need much done to it (if anything).

#145 squidly77 on 11.27.12 at 11:32 am

Just as Canadians reach their debt load zenith, the creator of the now pin pulled hand grenade bolts. He has assured banks and other financial institutions maximum profit and leaves the general population basically broke.

He will now skip over to Britain and blame his predecessor for any and all of the extreme financial measures that he will implement in the land of limes, just as his predecessor here will blame Carney himself.

When the Fox has eaten all the Hens, the Fox has no reason to hang around.

Goldman taught him well, he employed the Vampire Squid to perfection.

#146 big T on 11.27.12 at 11:33 am

big question was Mark lucky, or smart, since maggie T
the UK has been run by a succession of angry socialists,
and gentlemen players, the country has been asset
stripped,and is grossly overpopulated with a large percentage of unemployables, is a turn around even
possible? good luck Mr Carney..

#147 live within your means on 11.27.12 at 11:38 am

#140 robert james on 11.27.12 at 10:45 am
I think it would be very nice if Harper moved to Israel to be with his dear friends in their time of need..


Along with Baird.

#148 Dupcheck on 11.27.12 at 11:42 am

So Carney jumped ship right before the storm hits land. Smart move. Retire his position with honor at the top of his glamour. Just like Chretien did before the Liberals went down.

Why would Carney leave if the best was yet to come to Canadian economy that is so reliant on the housing market? He knows this mother f… is going down soon.

#149 squidly77 on 11.27.12 at 11:44 am

Definition – Vampire Squid.

A 2010 Rolling Stone article[13] by Matt Taibbi likened investment bank Goldman Sachs to “a great vampire squid wrapped around the face of humanity, relentlessly jamming its blood funnel into anything that smells like money.”[13] This comparison was later used by other critics of Goldman Sachs, such as the Occupy Wall Street movement.

You really need to read the following link. Vampire Squid

#150 George Theophylactou on 11.27.12 at 11:46 am

Boomer 21
I’m not a teen. I actually read this blog because I appreciate the way Garth formulates and expresses his opinions and it’s relevant to our families financial well being. I am in the market for a larger home in an expensive area of Toronto but I’m realistic, and patient. What will determine our next move is the price differential and the interest rates at that time. A 30% drop in mine and the prospective will result in expanded options.
I am sorry to have brought this nonsense here but it will be cautorized/neutered soon. Some of us appreciate and respect our jobs even if we don’t really like them. This is NOT indicative of all transit workers but unfortunately should be used as an example.

#151 Marnic on 11.27.12 at 12:02 pm

Yeah, it’s all Carney’s fault your lives suck. What a group smear this entire page is.

#152 Telecon on 11.27.12 at 12:06 pm

I think we should replace Mr. Carney with a parrot. Then we can train the parrot to say, “Squawk, I’m gonna raise interest rates, squawk!” and/or “print money, bacaw! print money!”

It would be a great way to save money and maintain confidence in our policy. Hey we can even name the parrot Mark Carney!

#153 Soylent Green is People on 11.27.12 at 12:17 pm

This is weird, check out Mark’s 1% married to a 99%er?


he British wife of the new governor of the Bank of England is also well acquainted with the “green stuff” – she’s an environmental activist with an interest in the Occupy movement, runs her own eco-website and is on a political mission to help reduce inequality caused by “rotten or inadequate” institutions.

In an article for Canadian website iPolitics, published just a week before the announcement of her husband Mark Carney’s appointment as Governor, Diana Carney wrote: “The politics of division are coming home to roost. The grass is always greener on the other side and the Occupy movement has provided a voice to many unhappy people.

“The visibility and excess of the top 0.1 per cent.. play a part.


#154 Ronaldo on 11.27.12 at 12:18 pm

Hey realtors, I hear the next bubble is in parking spaces. Better get out there and buy them up. No time to waste. At least not in Hong Kong.

#155 Buy? Curious? on 11.27.12 at 12:20 pm

Well Everybody, I finished my short tribute to Smoking Man. It’s up on YouTube. Type in “Smoking Man 2012”.

#156 somecatchphrase on 11.27.12 at 12:34 pm

Ralph Cramdown, your post gave me a chuckle. You basically reiterated the substance of my argument at same time you were calling me names.

Last time I checked, Bernanke and Greenspan were providers “Cheap, easy money.”

Last time I checked, the CMHC facilitated “low down payments *AND* a guarantee of your mortgage by a government rated triple A.”

“You really think somebody would lend your sorry ass money at 3% for five years without a guarantor, regardless of the actions of Hitler or Nixon?”

No, I don’t. That’s part of the point I’m making.

The bit about Hitler was mostly for $hits and giggles, however, if Hitler is responsible for WWII, and, if WWII was the driving force behind the creation of the CMHC, and, if the CMHC is a key cause of the housing bubble, then Hitler does deserve some blame for the housing bubble, in a roundabout, tongue in cheek kind of way.

If there’s a flaw in my argument, it’s in assigning Hitler way too much gravitas for his role in starting WWII; it’s a gross under-simplification of history to assert that Hitler was solely responsible for WWII.

With respect to Richard Nixon’s role in the global debt crisis, which includes Canadian mortgages backed by CMHC, I would suggest educating yourself regarding what happened on August 15, 1971. The works of Niall Ferguson, Jim Rickards, Eric Sprott, and Ben Davies (Hinde Capital) may help.

It’s all about how many layers of the onion that you want to peel back.

#157 joecalgary on 11.27.12 at 12:46 pm

To the simpletons that thought that photo was meant to be real

Are you seriously that feeble minded? Ofcourse the photo is fake. Thats not the point.

#158 OkanaganInvestor on 11.27.12 at 12:49 pm

How Carney married such a wonderful woman is beyond me:

‘She has described the notion that humans should halt all consumption to save the environment as a “good point” but “very hard given the way our societies function”, and has also lamented the “relentless exhortations to buy and the fact that much of our sense of self is tied up in our possessions”.

Mrs Carney, who met her husband, Mark, at Oxford, is vice-president of Canada 2020, a Left-wing think tank, and reviews environmentally-friendly products. The couple, who have four daughters with dual British-Canadian citizenship, live in Rockcliffe Park, Ottawa, one of Canada’s richest enclaves where their neighbours include ambassadors and executives. Mr and Mrs Carney bought their home for £800,000 in August 2003, but its value is believed to have risen substantially. Records suggest that they made £95,000 of improvements in 2009.

In an article this month, Mrs Carney said that income inequality in countries such as Canada and Britain was “the defining issue of our time”.’

#159 Geoffrey L. on 11.27.12 at 12:57 pm

Nice one Garth! I prefer “Evil Leprachaun” myself! You rock man!

#160 joecalgary on 11.27.12 at 1:01 pm

to #109 Tony the house humping italian

If a slight hike in rates ‘broke the market’ then wasn’t the market broken in the first place?

20% off this time next yr in ‘we got oil’ Alberta

#161 Patrick on 11.27.12 at 1:10 pm

Anyone able to verify if this is correct. Vancouver West home selling for 32% below assessed value??

#162 Pr on 11.27.12 at 1:19 pm

(Carney)…He is quite simply the best, most experienced and most qualified person in the world…
– To put a nation, in total servitude with DEBT.

#163 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 1:22 pm

#156 somecatchphrase

The discussion has been mainly about whether Carney’s done a good job, with far too many people weighing in negatively. From your post, it appeared you blamed him for not reining in CMHC, which wasn’t his job, though I’m sure he called Flaherty about twice a week with that advice.

I didn’t need to look up your precious date. There’s only one reason Nixon ever gets mentioned in monetary discussions. Niall Ferguson — superb economic historian who doesn’t have a handle on much of the newer stuff. Eric “we get the fees, you get the volatility” Sprott just gave me an epiphany on why ‘bugs are always so grumpy. ANYONE would be grumpy if they had to stomach the volatility of either of his two main funds. The world is NOT as volatile as you think, you’re just measuring it with the wrong yardstick!

Face facts: As bad as things have occasionally gotten in the last forty years, they don’t hold a candle to the panics, depressions, runs, busts, bubbles and financial institution failures in the several hundred years prior to that. We’ve been getting better at managing economies, and jettisoning the barbarous relic was part of that.

#164 DonDWest on 11.27.12 at 1:23 pm

What kind of society are we becoming when a person is credited as being smart for destroying a country and then bailing right before judgement?

Dear capitalism, you see what you’ve done to people? You’ve made cowardice called intelligence. You’ve made destruction called ingenuity. You’ve made crime called cunning.

Literally, we’re experiencing hell on Earth – where good is evil and evil is good. . .

#165 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 1:25 pm

#142 Ralph Cramdown

or maybe delay until our trading partners are back on their feet and buying our exports again?

Take a wild guess which two countries account for 80% of Canada’s exports. Hint: One is on top and the other is below Canada. Chart

#166 Marnic on 11.27.12 at 1:31 pm

Ah, #157 Joe, so late to the game, you poor man.

#167 DonDWest on 11.27.12 at 1:33 pm

#140 robert james

“I think it would be very nice if Harper moved to Israel to be with his dear friends in their time of need…”

A refreshing and witty post in an otherwise group of dullards. . .

#168 tkid on 11.27.12 at 1:34 pm

The original photograph …

#169 David McDonald on 11.27.12 at 1:42 pm

Low interest rates have produced a world wide housing bubble. Even the governor of the Bank of a very sensible country like Switzerland sounds a lot like Governor Carney; sounding warnings about high housing debt without being able to do much about it.

Some bubbles have burst as in the USA, Ireland and Spain with substantial economic damage. The best Canada, France, Switzerland and Korea (to name a few) can hope for is a slow deflation. In the mean time all this stimulation from RE has kept us out of recession.

In the best case the USA will pick up in 2013(as Garth hopes); Canada will hitch a ride and will slowly recover from the spending binge. In this case Carney will be a hero. If we get a Spanish scenario then he will be a goat. Either scenario is beyond his control. Time will tell.

#170 Seriously? on 11.27.12 at 1:43 pm

Good ole “Sir Mark (f***em’ n’ chuckem) Carney”

Send him to the showers now.

Never speak his name again.

Get another job to help pay down the 600 billion dollar tax hit.

Shut-up and just be a good Canadian.

Run to the store and stock up on Preparation H.


#171 Victor V on 11.27.12 at 1:47 pm

The OECD projects Canada’s economy will grow by 1.5% in the final three months of this year, and advance only 1.8% in 2013.

Next year’s projection is half a point below the Bank of Canada’s official forecast, although the two institutions agree that 2014 will see an improvement to 2.4% growth.

The Bank of Canada may need to raise its benchmark lending rate by the second half of next year to avoid inflation, the OECD said.

While growth will remain “moderate” until the middle of 2013, “economic slack is not large,” the OECD said.

Canadian household debt has surged to a record amid low interest rates, prompting policy makers to warn of risks to the country’s financial system.

The OECD said the tightening of mortgage-insurance rules by the government in June will cool house prices. “If housing- market imbalances worsen, the government should respond with further macro-prudential measures,” the OECD said, referring to regulatory steps rather than monetary action.

#172 EIT on 11.27.12 at 1:49 pm


Fixing England is like building a pyramid with copper tools. (impossible)

#173 happy renter on 11.27.12 at 1:52 pm

Great blog,Garth.When I read the news yesterday” I said good riddance”.He’s just a puppet for elitest bankers.Any clown can make some a speech and say we’re holding rates at %1 and Canadians needs to manage their debt levels and inflation is under control.
When I read people were praising for what he’s done ,I had good laugh.Yeah I’d like to punish the savers and get everyone to keep borrowing.
England is just behind Japan and Ireland of having the highest debt.I can’t wait when England collapses and he goes down with the sinking ship.

#174 Blacksheep on 11.27.12 at 1:57 pm

Daystar # 107&111,

“# 53 & 59 Blacksheep”

“Let me guess, you’re constructively criticizing me for “my benefit” no doubt. If you really do have any sincerely genuine concerns for my behalf,”
Daystar, your once again, feeling around in the dark. I’m not attempting to be constructive. Not for your benefit. No genuine or otherwise concerns for you.

You could not underestimate the loathing I feel, for your ‘purpose’. This is not personal. It is strictly based on your pushback agenda here. With systemic, subliminal messaging, you lurk in the background with overly long, robotic posts, knowing 8 in 10 Dogs, will skip right over, and that’s fine because your after the new seekers that hunger for knowledge and read absolutely everything.

But hey….If you reach, 20% of the Dogs and 80% of the Newbie’s, you call that success. You have a ‘role to play’ but don’t expect it to go unchallenged.

take care

#175 Patiently Waiting on 11.27.12 at 2:03 pm

Mark “the Talk Carney’s” timing for getting out of Dodge is impecable as the housing market that he & Flaherty created with emergency low interest rates and loose lending standards begins it’s inevitable unwind . . . if his departure isn’t the canary in the coal mine I don’t know what is . . .

Here are the latest posted stats from the Fraser Valley Real Estate Board – Note November Sales are down 20% YOY . . . and this is just the begining . . . thanks a lot Mark . . . good riddance!

FVREB STATS – as of November 27, 2012
17 of 21 Working Days
NOVEMBER 2012 Listings 1463 Sales 743
OCTOBER 2012 Listings 2086 Sales 847
NOVEMBER 2011 Listings 1673 Sales 936

#176 Martha on 11.27.12 at 2:15 pm

Since you mentioned Goldman/Sachs…..

#177 JustAnotherDuck on 11.27.12 at 2:30 pm

Mr. Carney’s legacy…

It’s in the Bank of Canada Act. Passed by the budget bill of 2008.

Page 18 as I interpret it….

In times of financial instability the Bank of Canada can now buy ANY security or ANY financial instrument in ANY amount deemed necessary by the Governor.

You may want to think about that, or even read it.
Otoh…nobody else seemed to think it important. So f’it.
After all, when to we ever have times of financial instability?

#178 Dorothy on 11.27.12 at 2:31 pm

After reading a lot of news media stuff about Mr. Carney’s upcoming move, including a lot of speculation about who may be appointed to replace him, I’ve come to the conclusion that none of the assumed candidates are going to be able to effect enough change to save Canada from whatever is about to happen to our economy.
Because, as Garth points out, Canada is not a big enough player on the world economic stage to have a significant influence on whatever is to come. All we can do is react, and hope for the best.
Housing bubbles, financial crises, and bank solvency issues, appear common to all the western economies, so it seems obvious to me that internationally accepted principles and practices are what are really to blame. And until they are changed, all of our western economies are still at risk.
Unfortunately I haven’t seen much evidence that the internationally accepted principles and practices I speak of have changed much since the begining of this current economic mess we all find ourselves in. Yes, there has been some tinkering here and there, but for the most part things have remained the same. I suspect that part of the reason is that the folks who implemented these policies have not been hurt by them as much as the governments and citizens of the countries affected by the policies. In fact, many of the folks responsible for the economic mess, are just as well off now as they were before all this happened. So why would such people feel the need to make any changes?
It’s a well documented fact that many of those in a position to implement changes in most of our western democracies are all members of the same “old boys network”, so it shouldn’t be surprising to find they all tend to think alike. And IMO until countries begin appointing people who have new (i.e. different) innovative ideas, nothing is going to change.
The Bank of England has missed a golden opportunity to seek someone who thinks differently than “the old guard”. I hope Canada doesn’t make the same mistake. Because it is only when each individual country begins to reconsider the kind of person they hire for such jobs, that the whole rotten system will eventually change.

#179 zeeman1 on 11.27.12 at 2:32 pm

#14 Roland.


Garth, Carney has clearly read and understood “The 48 Laws of Power”.

#180 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 2:34 pm

#165 Canadian Watchdog
Take a wild guess which two countries account for 80% of Canada’s exports.

The US?
and the UK?

#181 Blacksheep on 11.27.12 at 3:14 pm

TheBigLebowski # 113,

“Carney got shuffled to England because he is a Goldman yes man and was vetted years ago for his unquestioning loyalty to the Globalist banking dictatorship now coming into view. But I have to give you credit. Your loyalty is also apparent to this same hierarchy . though playing a role as a lower level pit goblin, your simply another willing brick in this New World Order pyramid.”
Dude, 100 % agree. Your angst is palpable, but might I suggest a lighter approach with the labels.

Garth provides us uncensored interaction with a multitude of Cattle, that are seeing the fences for the first time. Critical mass is required.

take care

#182 Daisy Mae on 11.27.12 at 3:38 pm

“Can we also interest you in an elfin deity?”


So….Carney is jumping ship and leaving the little twerp holding the bag? Yes, it would be wonderful if England takes him. Then Harper will be standing alone…..

Politics is a hateful business.

#183 Blacksheep on 11.27.12 at 3:46 pm

Blacksheep # 174,

Should read: ‘overestimate’.

Emotions, lead to errors.


#184 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 3:51 pm

#180 Ralph Cramdown

Right you are again Ralph. Canada is actually in the worst position possible as total domestic credit demand heads peak to trough with foreign credit demand contracting.

It looks something likethis.

#185 Linda Pearson on 11.27.12 at 3:53 pm

#56George Theophylactou on 11.26.12 at 11:38 pm

You’re a riot Alice!

#186 Fabrega on 11.27.12 at 4:21 pm

It amazes me how so many people on this blog and elsewhere praise this guy Carney. Do you guys know what is a Central Bank? Who they represent? I thaught so…..WTF!

#187 dan zen. on 11.27.12 at 4:53 pm

Carney and Harper govt. shut down euroscum global bank tax scham …I don’t know how he got the bank of england post after that ?…It cost Canada a seat at the UN security council …but Carney gets the nod for the BOE ??!!???

#188 Astute Poverty on 11.27.12 at 4:53 pm

Gotta hand it to Carney his timing is impeccable, he skips out of here at the height, and swoops into Britain as it’s digging itself out.

#189 Daisy Mae on 11.27.12 at 5:07 pm

#136Eaglebay – Parksville on 11.27.12 at 9:55 am
#88 Gord In Vancouver on 11.27.12 at 1:02 am
Thank you, England!
Best post so far today.


Agree. Often wondered about the man. He never impressed me….so, goodbye! And thanks for nothing.

#190 QuietMan on 11.27.12 at 5:16 pm

To all reading the comments:

You do not realise the gift that the poster Smoking Man gives. He reveals a great deal about the the way the current system (the machine) works.

Firstly, if you want to become sucessful, wealthy and live large, you must be a phscopath. . Think about your boss, politicians, bankers, real estate agents, financial advisors. Think psychopath. You will not be far off. SM suggests morals are relative. For pyschopaths , morals are just a way to manipulate and control. There is no God except money and power. Morals are for the weak and stupid.

Lie. People are just mindless consumers to be used for your own benefit. That is all. When you dont need them, flush them. You are cattle to be herded and culled. Bernays would be rpoud.

He also teaches that our polical masters/MSM are just puppets to their financial masters ( SM’s bilderberg posts, home price articles in the papers). Tell them what you want, the polys/MSM will do it. Nice doggies, here is your treat…..

He tells you that the education system is a sham. It is a propaganda system indoctrinating the kids. Get your own education in the real world. You will get a real education and not spend the rest of your life unlearning what you learned at the government sponsored day internment camp.

Smoking man says he wants to help you. To make money and break free. How? By showing how many digits he has in a bank account. And telling you that you must become independent. How? Hang out your own shingle. Learn to market. Sell something. This is how to break free from 9-5. Agreed.

Yet, I see that he is now a “Canadian Globalist”. So instead of teaching you to be free, he wants you to be a slave to the UN. Nice one Smoking Man. Be free by traqding one master for another. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss……………

SM deep down loves the machine. It sustains and drives.

So I owe a debt of gratitude to Smoking Man. These insights have helped enormously. They depict how the current system works, its dysfunction and its unsustainability. And to formulate a plan to fight against it. How? By getting real and simplifying your life.


Getting rid of toxic relationships from your life.

Questioning everything you are told by your boss, the media,popular wisdom, your co workers.

Believe in God and pray: You came into this world with nothing, you are going out with nothing except your morals and past actions. For which you will be judged.

Finding out about the power structure,how it works and who it benefits.

Turn off the TV,radio and newspapers

Sell of all the useless goods that clutter you living and owrking space. Use the funds to get out of any consumer debt you have.

Use any extra money you have invest after getting rid of debt to purchase tangible goods. Not digits in an account that can be hypothecated away. Oil,gold silver, food, tools.

I dont know if this will be posted. I suspect the minders here will be very upset with this. So be it. I tried.

We forgive you, SM. — Garth

#191 NFN_NLN on 11.27.12 at 5:48 pm

#164 DonDWest on 11.27.12 at 1:23 pm

What kind of society are we becoming when a person is credited as being smart for destroying a country and then bailing right before judgement?

MONTREAL – It’s difficult to imagine a central banker as a rock star, but that’s what Mark Carney has become in his 4½ years as governor of the Bank of Canada.

By L. Ian MacDonald

Read more:

Enjoy the read…

#192 texpat on 11.27.12 at 5:51 pm

Good commentary, Garth. The FP was full of obsequious fawning over this bankster. Pathetic.

#193 Just Checking on 11.27.12 at 5:56 pm

#95 Marnic
How do you spell dufus?

#194 Ralph Cramdown on 11.27.12 at 6:02 pm

#184 Canadian Watchdog
Canada is actually in the worst position possible as total domestic credit demand heads peak to trough with foreign credit demand contracting.

Eh? Here’s the US story: “Non-mortgage household debt balances instead jumped by 2.3% in the third quarter to $2.7 trillion, boosted by increases of $18 billion in auto loans, $42 billion in student loans, and $2 billion in credit card balances.” And corporate? “We are seeing nothing short of a stampede towards fixed income markets”

#195 Pr on 11.27.12 at 6:08 pm

Hey Mark, you may want to read this:

Congo rebels surround central bank in Goma.

#196 Shane on 11.27.12 at 6:12 pm

Carney, should be sticking around till summer of 2013 to deal with a possible reccesion in Canada or Ontario for that matter.

#197 raginnn on 11.27.12 at 6:36 pm

Condo buyers breaking contracts as prices fall.
The $hit is hitting the fan in a big way.–condo-buyers-breaking-contracts-as-prices-fall

#198 Mike on 11.27.12 at 6:37 pm

Great post again Mr Turner.

Not being a good politician (read: actor/teleprompter reader) makes you a better human being.

Carney and his lady friend are simply being treated well by the Soros/Murdoch MSM empire.

If you want to see REAL environmental action check out what they are doing at the Keshe Foundation.

Carney’s lady friend, and I mean no disrespect, and her commitment to the planet, is a joke. A bad joke at that.

#199 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 6:45 pm

#194 Ralph Cramdown

Non-mortgage household debt balances instead jumped by 2.3% in the third quarter to $2.7 trillion

US HELOC delinquency rate Q3 Chart

$42 billion in student loans

Q3 Student loan delinquency rates soar Charts

$18 billion in auto loans

GM extreme subprime loans Chart

Nice recovery. The U.S. isn’t going anywhere but down again.

#200 FTP - First Time Poster on 11.27.12 at 6:47 pm


I see Max Keiser follows your blog. He linked this post on his website.

#201 cofessions of a real estate bear on 11.27.12 at 6:53 pm

Tim 100 If they {central bankers} raised interest rates when the crash happened society would have been much better off by now. The bad debt would have been purged from the system and real growth could have commenced.

Yeah, worked great in 1930. — Garth

#202 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 7:01 pm

#197 raginnn

Condo buyers breaking contracts as prices fall

Before the headlines start blowing up with mortgage fraud, here's an excerpt from RECO stating who overlooks this area.


Mortgage fraud is a criminal act, and while RECO has no jurisdiction to prosecute under the Criminal Code of Canada, the Real Estate and Business Brokers Act, 2002 gives RECO the power to investigate criminal offences that are relevant to a person’s fitness for registration under the Act. The Registrar’s position is that any registrant proven to have knowingly participated in mortgage fraud faces losing their registration. It should be noted that some registrants alleged to have participated in mortgage fraud voluntarily terminated their registration.


In order to effectively combat mortgage fraud, it needs to be addressed by all parties involved in the real estate transaction.  Organizations such as the Law Society of Upper Canada, the Canadian Association of Accredited Mortgage Professionals [you know the guys who are currently asking F to revoke mortgage rules for first time buyers who have no savings] and other real estate regulatory bodies are active in combating mortgage fraud either by releasing educational information or through collaborative efforts.

Consumer Tips

Avoid being an unwitting participant in mortgage fraud. Be suspicious of situations where you are:

-Asked to inflate (overstate) your income on a mortgage application, indicate you plan to live in a property being purchased as a rental property or provide other false statements.
-Asked to sign documents that contain blanks or asked not to complete certain sections of a form or document.
-Offered a fee for the use of your name and credit information.
-Discouraged from visiting the property, having the property appraised or inspecting the property you are purchasing.

Finally, if it sounds “too good to be true” it probably is.


#203 salonist on 11.27.12 at 7:05 pm


if your life has been one big party, and like the irish there are no strangers just friends you’ve never met.

#204 Intuitive Missus on 11.27.12 at 7:09 pm

What a haircut.

1092 Argyle Dr   Sold: $9,360,000  
Oakville, Ontario L6J 1A7 Ontario  Halton    Old Oakville List: $11,499,000  
Orig Price: $11,499,000 Taxes: $73,039/2012 81 % List
SPIS: N  Old Oakville   – –  DOM: 114 Contract: 8/1/2012 Sold: 11/23/2012

#205 Smoking Man on 11.27.12 at 7:22 pm

#190 QuietMan on 11.27.12 at 5:16 pm

Hell of tribute, but you messed up on the god part, you must have read my piece Gaza vs Israel as you posted on my blog, The bit about Ancient Con Men.

Or was it sarcasm, if that’s the case good job.

as far as membership to “Canadian Globalist” it was a lie.

It is on my to do list, I am a predictor after all.

#206 Stoopid Idiot on 11.27.12 at 7:35 pm

Not consperital just historical

#207 tkid on 11.27.12 at 7:47 pm

It’s love …

#208 TurnerNation on 11.27.12 at 8:15 pm

NYSE security margin debt is at all time highs again.
Is the shoeshine boy giving ETF tips yet? ;-)

#209 daystar on 11.27.12 at 8:29 pm

#174 Blacksheep on 11.27.12 at 1:57 pm

“Daystar, your once again, feeling around in the dark. I’m not attempting to be constructive. Not for your benefit. No genuine or otherwise concerns for you.” – Blacksheep

This tells it all, doesn’t it.

You could not underestimate the loathing I feel, for your ‘purpose’. This is not personal. – Blacksheep

You feel loathing? And thats not personal? OMG. When I read the substance of hatred, I think, “not fit to challenge never mind lead”.

“It is strictly based on your pushback agenda here. With systemic, subliminal messaging, you lurk in the background with overly long, robotic posts, knowing 8 in 10 Dogs, will skip right over, and that’s fine because your after the new seekers that hunger for knowledge and read absolutely everything.” – Blacksheep

Thats your singular view (along with anyone else I’ve ever P.O.’d, small surprise) and I pretty much know you haven’t got a clue as to what my goals or “agenda” truly is.

“But hey….If you reach, 20% of the Dogs and 80% of the Newbie’s, you call that success. You have a ‘role to play’ but don’t expect it to go unchallenged.” – Blacksheep

From where I see it now, your challenge is supported not with research but assumptions (I think false) that enable you to sidestep any responsibility of questioning a so called opponents stance and goes straight to challenge motivated purely by ego. How does one define self defeat?

take care

Or for that matter, false sincerity?

By the way, your comment here:

“Alpha’s promote free thinking and challenge the system, not conform to it.” – Blacksheep

… is all wrong. Again, do the research:

Don’t just stop at this link, check out the SEE ALSO links as well as this because you are clearly focusing on the micro instead of the macro:

Good alpha’s by nature don’t promote free thinking or challenge the system like you think they do, they rule with existing hiearchy’s and systems of their predecessors through conforming precisely because its gotten their group this far (the only reason I can think of for deviating is survival) and their main motive (don’t forget this) is the survival of the species in every respect, not just breeding or preserving ordered hierarchy through whatever means necessary including aggression and physical force, but social behavior as well. If you haven’t quite understood it yet, the best leaders are willing to lay their lives on the line for survival and often do. Without survival in mind not just for this generation but all the following generations to come, leadership is nothing more than an ego’s play, a superiority/inferiority complex acting out, another leader ripe for defeat.

#210 Vatodeth on 11.27.12 at 8:30 pm

Good Riddance

#211 Daisy Mae on 11.27.12 at 8:51 pm

#173 Happy Renter: “He’s just a puppet for elitest bankers. Any clown can make some a speech and say we’re holding rates at %1 and Canadians needs to manage their debt levels and inflation is under control.”


Exactly. What did Carney do for us…really?

It must be very disheartening for Garth to know what he knows, and witness what unfolds.

#212 Daisy Mae on 11.27.12 at 9:02 pm

#171 Zeeman1: “Garth, Carney has clearly read and understood “The 48 Laws of Power”.”


I checked out Wikipedia…and ‘The 48 Laws of Power’ was very interesting. To succeed in business, you must be ruthless, callous…rule #1. Reminds me of the Lehman Bros’ failure. They did not get a bailout. Maybe justice does prevail eventually.

Thanks for bringing this to our attention.

#213 new canadian on 11.27.12 at 9:03 pm

#184 Canadian Watchdog
Very good one. As US keeps going down more every month, nobody will pay top dollar to Canadian lumber! Eh, proud lumber exporter developed country.

#214 Smoking Man on 11.27.12 at 9:11 pm

#208 Turrner Nation.

You’re onto something. CMC Markets, my equity derivative trading provider just reduced margin ratios on Mini commodities futures.

Something’s up. :)

#215 TurnerNation on 11.27.12 at 9:16 pm

Why would subway operators post here when they are mostly underground without cell coverage?
However, if you mean Subway sandwich artists then it makes more sense.

#216 Canadian Watchdog on 11.27.12 at 9:23 pm

#211 Daisy Mae

Exactly. What did Carney do for us…really?

The BoC’s role is misunderstood by many. Carney stated many times in his statements and during questioning that household debt is a small variable in the BoC’s monetary policy decisions. It’s all about exchange stability and maintaining liquidity, payments and settlements in our banking system. Go read the Bank of Canada Act and I assure you there’s no mandate for consumer protections, same with OSFI.

As long as it’s on household balance sheets, they don’t care.

#217 a prairie dawg on 11.27.12 at 10:16 pm

London calling.

Mark, it’s for you.

#218 ozy - we do not need Bank of Canada at all on 11.27.12 at 11:13 pm

Obvioulsy – we do not need Bank of Canada, nor a bloated governement charging taxes.
No need to RRSP, TSFA RESP, erroding money with 10% inflation a year (or 15% if you count house prices)
We only need the GOLD & Silver standard back, and have the workers paid in gold loonies and parasites crack in two.

#219 ozy - The Mighty Meaty Carnage is out - the party (the RE collapse) can now OFFICIALLY begin? on 11.27.12 at 11:21 pm

The Mighty Meaty Carnage is out – the party (the RE collapse) can now OFFICIALLY begin?

#220 Cigar Goop on 11.28.12 at 12:06 am

Timing is everything. We are heading down as the US is coming back. That will dull our blow. We were fiscally contrarian running surpluses when the rest did not. That was our strength going into 2008. C and H had nothing to do with that. C and H had nothing to do with the US recovery which as timing will have it, help us.

#221 deja view? on 11.28.12 at 3:23 pm

I’m beginning to suspect that GT is a financial Stephen King.
Probably because my mother was a two pack’r, I usually have to read Garth’s riveting & informative columns twice to ‘get it’, but if nothing else it’s an opportunity to be entertained and build my vocab.
The first read is cracking context and nuance and looking up words like ‘meme’.. elfin etc and to reacquaint myself with obfuscate.
It’s only then that a clearer picture emerges which in this case tells me what I already know.

Being a somewhat capable minimalist bohemian with some RE assets but no basis in conventional financial reality, I am indeed screwed.. but for now it’s back to breathing new life into my old trawler knowing that it holds the meaning between me and the bottom, which is escape!
As long as one can dream there is still hope.. and reality be damned.