The naked boomer

boomer1

The doctor is IN.

Our first patient is one of those deteriorating, despised Boomers – you know, the ones who have everything and drive the Gen Whatevers into an envious, frenzied rage. This one even lives in an expensive retirement town in a valley in a province that shall remain nameless, but has a name that contains the initials “BC.”

So, greedy little aging, pathetic flower child, what could possibly be wrong in your egocentric, sha-na-na live-for-today life?

Hey Garth. Love your blog, read it all the time. We thought we had a plan, it blew up and now we are totally confused. I read about the prices going back up in Vancouver, others saying the tough times are over, etc and then I look around my small town. Lots on the market for sale. My husband is 60, so retirement’s close and we are scared to do anything. Were going to try and sell the house, then figured there was no point, now there seems to be a spring rebound – although the list of homes for sale is still very long up here – the neighbour’s house has been on the market for a year now. Ours has the advantage of being only a couple of years old and has all kinds of ‘cottage cute’ going on – but that probably doesn’t mean a thing. Standard real estate fees here are 7% on the first $100,000 and 3% on the remainder – no one will negotiate, we’ve called many – so it’s that or do it yourself.

I read all about the boomers with their big houses, lots of money, etc and yet there are tons like us – no money, started late, trying to land on our feet. Maybe $10,000 in equity in the house if it sold. $1000 in a sock drawer. Two modest vehicles and an old, very small RV that are paid for. $4000 in debt with a credit card and a line of credit. No savings, RRSPs, stocks and bonds or company pensions. A  vacant lot we tried to sell for a year and finally gave up. It too has a mortgage – $300 a month. With only 5 years til retirement starts, we need to do something drastic but everything seems the wrong thing to do. Our mortgage payment is $1200 ($208,000 mortgage) – if we did sell, then we face the rental that’s not easy to find up here. We’re almost at the point where we’d live in the RV if we could but a teen still at home negates that one.

There must be a better answer than just keep paying the mortgage til the job is gone and let bankruptcy catch us, but we sure don’t know that what that might be. We thought maybe you or readers would have some ideas – any ideas!

Nearly retired in Small Town BC

Hey, that was a surprise. You sound quite screwed, actually. But let’s think about what options you might have.

First, time ain’t one of them. Hubby’s sixty and you have virtually no financial assets. Not cool. But, like most Boomers, you’ve got real estate – a house and a vacant lot. Despite what you might think, this is a problem since going forward what you’ll need is money, not stuff, especially in that place.

So, job one is to sell the lot. Why would you give up on trying to flog it, when all you have to do is keep dropping the price until it sells? Whatever equity you have there is dead money – paying you no income and probably devaluing along with the land. What’s worse is that you have to finance this puppy, with a mortgage and property taxes.

Sell. Now. Dump the money in an RRSP (I presume you have miles of contribution room), so you can wipe out current year income taxes, which will free up income to pay off the credit card. Invest in growth equities or funds – financials, energy companies, health care – and get some professional help doing so.

Hell, even take back a mortgage on the property. That will give you an income stream and a higher return than any GIC.

Second, bail out of the house. Staying there because your mortgage payment is comparable to rent will do nothing for your financial future. Without savings or reserves, you’ll be forced to sell this real estate at some point anyway. So, why do it later when the BC housing bubble truly bursts, mortgage rates are double today’s levels and buyers are scarce?

You have no choice but to lease, downsize or move into the RV and sell your child to a mountain family (however that may not still be legal).

Third, move. Not just out of the house. Out of town. You’re ensconced in one of the most expensive digs in the country and obviously don’t have the resources to stay there in retirement. Once the jobs evaporate, why stay? I hear Windsor is lovely this time of year…

Anyway, let’s see what the blog dogs have to say. And let’s hope some of the juiced-up, pissed-off, boomer-baiting wannabes come by. You are a fine lesson in what not to be.

Still love this blog?

179 comments ↓

#1 Nostradamus Jr's Analyst on 06.09.09 at 11:31 pm

Ahh, spring is nearly over and the 5 year fixed rate is up another .40% to add to last weeks .20% increase.

Sell now or be priced out forever.
Let the games begin:)

http://www.canadianmortgagetrends.com/canadian_mortgage_trends/2009/06/fixed-rates-up-again.html

#2 Mike in Etown on 06.09.09 at 11:47 pm

I am 32 and don’t want to bait any boomers. I just feel totally taken advantage of, demographically speaking. Knowing what’s coming and what will be expected of my generation is not comforting.

#3 kc on 06.09.09 at 11:56 pm

I venture to guess the name less town just might happen to be Kelowna or in that general area. (small town though … Peachland … Nelson…. 208K owing makes this a tougher guess so maybe it is BS) Dang they are screwed. That old addage we have the 9th green on our back yard isn’t paying off as well as you had hoped. I am willing to bet you are the bravest of your neighbours for you are actually admitting to your problems and others are sand heads… (ostritch effect) good luck and hope your kids learn from your mistakes. Still not too late to plant a garden.

#4 Increasing that 1% on 06.10.09 at 12:00 am

OMG that was funny Garth, but ooooh – OUCH at the end “You are a fine lesson in what not to be”
I think she should take your advice otherwise.
Now, about that “mountain family” – hmmmm, that’s an idea, never thought of that one for the teen…

#5 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.10.09 at 12:08 am

Give up on the idea of retirement.

Do what most people do in the world, work and pay the bills….cradle to grave.

As for Garth’s advice. Forget the markets…..you’ve gambled too much with father time already. The markets could eat your income and non existent equity/capital in one bad move down.

Find a job/business you enjoy and make that your retirement.

#6 Da HK Kid on 06.10.09 at 12:41 am

yup, sell it all, lot, house, RV, one car! I dont know if moving is an option with your job but if no rentals around you may not have a choice. If there is only one person working, the other better do so right away.

I dont know what you have done all these years to end up like this but it’s never too late to turn the tide.

Good Luck!

#7 Sylvia in Vancouver on 06.10.09 at 1:07 am

holy crap.

i don’t know what’s scarier: their situation or that dreadful picture.

#8 Jeff Smith on 06.10.09 at 1:09 am

Talk about mortgage rates going up! Any detractors should take your advice seriously Garth.

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/648138

#9 . . . fried eggs and spam . . . on 06.10.09 at 1:10 am

Sell the home and RV (preferably on or before Victoria Day 2011), even if it’s only at break-even level after paying off all mortgages / debts / loans.

After that, rent a townhome or duplex, park as much cash in a non-registered plan, live frugal lifestyles (which will probably be forced on most of us), work as long as possible, even two or three part-time jobs, keep heads to the grindstone and steer clear of trouble.

Dr. Spock out (to lunch).
——
#140 john m on 06.09.09 at 8:08 pm — “. . . the Harper government is trying to create bad feelings between the east and west . . . Do we have a seperatist movement within our government?”

From what I understand, Harper’s policy, driven by Tom Flanagan and back room staff, has strictly been to divide and conquer. That’s all.

Then he (or his successor) would let the US take whatever they need, and end up subjugating us in the process.

That is what NAFTA and the SPP are for, as well as the militarization of all three countries.

However, the dying worldwide economies cropped up at roughly the same time. Not many could have foreseen all these events happening so quickly, so “. . . the best laid plans of mice and men . . .” — no one seems to know what is going on. Sooner or later, a war is inevitable.
——
Hah! At last! The US Fed has been subpoenaed. Toss the lot of ’em in the slammer, and let maggots and cockroaches gorge on their testicular functions! — http://tinyurl.com/l9azog

This may have something to do with the above. — http://tinyurl.com/mwu473
——
Dollar Drama video = Possible introduction of Amero. Hence the militarization mentioned earlier. — http://tinyurl.com/lsw8va — North America’s currencies are worthless and pointless!
——
The EU Talking Heads may be turning on each other. — http://tinyurl.com/mas7la
——
Yet China just keeps rolling quietly along, making good business deals all over. — http://tinyurl.com/nsqfnf

#10 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 1:10 am

Since it seems you wouldn’t get that house paid off in time, then selling within 5 years is inevitable.
So sell now, because the longer you wait, the harder it is for you.. physically, emotionally, mentally, economically .. and the pressure to sell increases as time goes by. Sell both lot and house ASAP.

#11 Jeff Smith on 06.10.09 at 1:13 am

By the way, why does mortgage rates go up when bond yields go up… Sorry, I don’t have a financial background

******************************************
excerpt:

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/648138

“While mortgage rates rose slightly last week, that move was insufficient to offset the bank’s higher costs because bond yields have climbed higher since that time”

#12 taxpayer like you on 06.10.09 at 1:28 am

“there are tons like us – no money, started late, trying to land on our feet.”

But Garth said

“So, greedy little aging, pathetic flower child”

Greedy? I dunno. Stupid? $208000 mortgage at 60?
Yep. That would be stupid.

So Garth, which kind of boomer do you dislike? From previous posts, many bloggers seem to hate the “successful” boomers, or those that have acheived (and display) material wealth. Keeping in mind you are a front-end boomer, displaying his Harley whenever you
can, just who/what is it you are targetting with boomer-
bashing?

#13 Mike (Authentic) on 06.10.09 at 2:53 am

I think there are A LOT of parents in this situation and it is not that uncommon. I do think these 2 have it “better” than most as they own more property in an expensive town they can sell off.

If it was me (and I was 60) I would be looking at the near future, not long term to secure my money for retirement. I would pay off all debts (credit card first), sell anything I really didn’t need anymore (1 vehicle now), downsize out of the RE market, move to where my family is (or if they are there, get the smallest place you can be happy to live in) and invest in a SAFE place, like a GIC or something like that.

I wouldn’t touch the stock market as you really no longer have money “you can afford to lose”. And if the market is going to go down again it may not recover for 10+ years.

Do it all now before all the other Parents NEED to do it and you will avoid the RE check out line ups on the way out.

Mike

#14 Dave on 06.10.09 at 2:56 am

There is always the option of selling everything and moving to rural NB. Get a house with a woodlot for next to nothing and grow your own food. At least you will survive and the view isn’t that bad.

#15 Munch on 06.10.09 at 3:59 am

Cool!

Garth back in the land of “Nothing to lose, If I offend you, tough!

I like listening to people who have nothing to lose – cozz the first thing they gain is usually the truth!

Munch

#16 John on 06.10.09 at 4:11 am

You can continue to work past 65 so you need to work longer. So what. At 40 I am miles ahead of you and still plan to work past 65. Go back to school now and, say , learn real estate. You have a knowledge of the area and can now exploit that. Be ready for when CPP and OAS become a tax credit amount and not a cheque in your acct. Good luck. John from Toronto

#17 charles on 06.10.09 at 5:49 am

Jasmine Mccanttells’ Blog,

Wednesday already. Hate mornings. Wait what’s that? A grey hair. Great, now the minister is going to push for a Senate appointment for me. Dad says hang on, they may never find some of all the other stuff. Oh dam, got to stop by Victoria’s Secret for the minister, then swing by the Harbour Commission to pick up a few items in the closet there. Something about dressing for the job. That nuclear file is going to wreak havoc with her clothing budget.

Any resemblance between this satire and real life is purely coincidental.

#18 Bottoms_Up on 06.10.09 at 6:11 am

(a re-post for the unwashed)

#48 Nostradamus jr:
“I believe the last thing Ontario needs (and Canada for that matter) are an influx of large, uneducated, and unskilled immigrant families.”
———————————————
Ok, let me ask you this: how did YOU get to this wonderful country of ours? Did YOU just sprout up from the ground? I can tell you I’m here because my Irish decendants (largely unskilled) came here in the 1830’s.

Also–Canada’s birth rate is 1.6, far below the 2.1 needed to sustain a population. Thus, we either need to supplement with immigration, or significantly stimulate the birth rate.

Thirdly, I know many 1st and 2nd generation Canadians, and they are largely educated (and rich–actually, as a requirement of entering Canada one must show they have enough money to live for a few months). We are talking about people that were MD’s in China, engineers, Ph.D.’s etc.

So I don’t know what planet you’re from, but I do know your comments are unwashed.

Remember, you heard it here first.

#19 David Bakody on 06.10.09 at 6:17 am

Where do they all come from? you guys have got to be kidding ……. simple hold a RE style garage sale ….. matter of fact sell everything right down to kitchen sink and last pair of dirty socks! ….. sell sell and then start over where you should have 40 years ago. Make savings your #1 priority and watch every penny until you understand, hell you could have another good 20 years if you remove stress ….. think less is more!

#20 Maurice on 06.10.09 at 6:20 am

AMigos: As Boomers, all that you had to do to be successful, was to stay sober and show up for work. How could you screw up so badly? Shows why we Canadians should have deep appreciation for the imigrants who come to this country and make success out of nothing.

#21 Bottoms_Up on 06.10.09 at 6:22 am

Maybe they should buy a “3 wolf moon” t-shirt to cure their ails. (scroll down and read the first comment)

#22 Bottoms_Up on 06.10.09 at 6:24 am

“3 wolf moon” video!!

#23 D on 06.10.09 at 6:30 am

One the things that you didn’t mention, which surprised me a little, was that the whole notion of “retiring”, particularly in this context, is an illusion. The idea of being able to say “Okay, I’m done, now to enjoy the good life” when you haven’t prepared for it is like going on the diving board planning to jump into the concrete swimming pool you never bothered to fill.
My in-laws are in a similar situation, and are a couple of years older than those in the article, and they just went from “retiring in 1 year” to “retiring in 7 or 8 if they are lucky.”
Sorry folks, the “divine right to retire” is a modern age illusion that requires years and years of preparation, planning and re-evaluation as you go. You’ve seen the seniors working at subway, right?

#24 Nostradamus jr. on 06.10.09 at 6:42 am

1/
Dear Nearly Retired,

…Garth’s suggestions are almost spot on.

I would suggest you sell then purchase in a local trailer park subdivision vs. a move to Windsor Ont.

2/

Dear SMW,

…If you had read my earlier posts on immigration you would not have accused me the way you did.

Certain European countries have allowed in massive numbers of immigrant, uneducated large families with a certain religous bent.

I also posted the same statistics you have.

Canada is the envy of the world…..untold millions of refugees would today jump at the chance of living in Canada.

Look at where California is at today w/ its huge residing illegal Mexican population.

I have no doubt the world refugees will try as the world situation deteriorates…what should Canada do?

#25 wjp on 06.10.09 at 7:06 am

NDP wins in Nova Scotia, now we have three socialist governments in Eastern Canada, one in N.S., one in Queens Park, and one in Ottawa…funny how they all have different names but same agenda, spend, spend and spend more…then tax! The end of all this will be lower real estate values, and a lower standard of living!

#26 Repatriated Expat on 06.10.09 at 7:12 am

Dire situation, requiring drastic solutions. No easy way out of this one. Liquidate the liabilities, downscale your lifestyle until you can afford to keep you head above water. Oh ya, and work until you drop.

I used to be a whiny Gen-Xer due to a lack of opportunities after university, but in retrospect going through hard times when it seemed like everyone else was prospering was a godsend. This last decade was an incredible time/opportunity for anyone living in Canada to prosper, no excuses.

The next decade will bring much greater economic changes and challenges to our lives, which in essence what this blog is about.

The most bitter pill of all is coming to accept a new reality where we all will have to adjust to a lower standard of living. The message is: don’t go into it with your lifestyle/finances already maxed out.

#27 Bobby G on 06.10.09 at 7:21 am

Look at this chart
http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=d12&w=1&t=c&a=200
Remember way back to summer 2008 when
US dollar index was around 70 and oil hit 150
It’s coming back and people like the above couple are toast
For anyone who just bought a house –
What the the hell were you thinking?
The markets are about the same
percentage above the 200 day MA as they were
last June right before they came crashing down
Get ready

#28 puzzled on 06.10.09 at 7:36 am

Shouldn’t these people make the most out of his job and stay with it until the end. There obviously won’t be another one.

Later on, after selling the vacant lot and with money stashed away in the RSP, they won’t loose much in a bankruptcy.

#29 Munch on 06.10.09 at 7:49 am

What’s wrong with working during retirement?

Work is love!

We don’t work for money – we work to grow – why would anyone want to stop growing at 60 or 65?

When you stop growing you die!?!

#30 Devil's Advocate on 06.10.09 at 7:59 am

RE: OFFSETTING A CAPITAL GAIN WITH AN RRSP CONTRIBUTION: Might want to be careful on the selling of the lot and deposit of the proceeds to an RRSP. If they sell the lot and realize any significant profit by doing so which they subsequently try offset the capital gains taxes of by contributing to an RRSP for the tax deduction they will find they meet an interesting, little known, hypocritical tax phenomena called the “Alternative Minimum Tax” assessed by CRA which might essentially wipe out the benefit.

The Alternative Minimum Tax is a 6 page recalculation of tax assessment against those who might otherwise have opportunity to effectively reduce their taxes by taking advantage of tax loopholes such as that which RRSPs were intended to offer. It was originally targeted at higher income earners but over time, with inflation since its introduction, has, and will continue more so, to hit average taxpayers.

As I said it is not common knowledge. Even when I called Revenue Canada many of their personnel didn’t know much, if anything, of it. Here are a couple of links to get you started.

http://www.professionalreferrals.ca/2003/10/tax-shelters-and-alternative-minimum-tax-amt-in-ontario/

http://blog.taxresource.ca/rrsps-to-offset-capital-gains/

We sold a revenue property last year. I saw the unfolding economy for what it was (falling real estate values and a competitive rental market). The property was more of a hassle than it seemed worth. After CRA bent us over and had their way with us we’d have been better off keeping the property. But then we did have a “modest” income stream from it as it was not vacant land.

RE: BAIL OUT OF THE HOUSE: Kelowna real estate values have increased in each month of this year from a median $396,000 in January to a median $436,000 in May. Can you say “Dead Cat Bounce”? Nowhere else in the country are the economic fundamentals so contrary to such an increase than in Kelowna. Not even the center of the universe Toronto and outlying manufacturing burbs that have been hit so hard by the loss of jobs. In Kelowna we never had jobs to begin with. It’s a “crack cocaine” economy where residents are high on the two to three months a year of sunshine we do get.

RE: MOST EXPENSIVE DIGS IN THE COUNTRY… you said it second only to Vancouver. Way more than anything out East. Wanna turn your bank account into $1,000,000.00? Come to Kelowna with $2,000,000.00. Over the years I’ve seen many a family move to Kelowna only to get financially beat up and then leave with their tail between their legs.

Sorry folks but you’re screwed. But you are not alone.

#31 pbrasseur on 06.10.09 at 8:03 am

The solution is obvious, and Garth’s advice is not it (retiring to Windsor, man how depressing!):

Do like millions of boomers will have to do: Keep on working and keep on living the way you like.

#32 Toronto C9 Renter on 06.10.09 at 8:12 am

To Nearly Retired…

Another option is to renegotiate your remaining mortgage which should get your payments much lower — $1200 seems really steep in this interest rate environment. Also, re: the lot, totally agree there is always a buyer at the right price — keep trying!

To #24 “Naus-tradamus” who said — ‘……If you had read my earlier posts on immigration you would not have accused me …”

Please get real — all of your previous rants reveal you to be a xenophobic bigot that fears / hates anyone who is differerent from yourself, especially Mexicans, Muslims, People from Ontario and Nova Scotia, and goodness knows whom else. I think I speak for the crowd in suggesting its time you find a new storyline, this one is really getting tiresome (not to mention sad)

#33 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 8:18 am

Reality Check is coming!

Mortgage rates set to rise again

Soaring bond yields are setting the stage for a second round of interest rate hikes on residential mortgages in about a week.

After nudging rates higher on longer-term mortgages last Wednesday, Toronto-Dominion Bank is once again raising borrowing costs on its popular five-year, fixed-rate loan. Effective tomorrow, the posted rate on that mortgage moves 40 basis points higher to 5.85 per cent.

Last week, TD and the other banks increased their respective interest rates on five-year, fixed-rate mortgages by 20 basis points to 5.45 per cent.

Solid banks, insurers cost more, public told

Banks and insurers have a cheerleader in Ottawa if they charge more for less.

Canada’s watchdog for financial company solvency says firms must guard profits and capital.

“In a period like now, there is not a lot of room for error,” Julie Dickson, superintendent of financial institutions, said yesterday in an interview. “We are not out of the woods yet.”

What was that about VRM’s?

#34 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 8:21 am

Reality Check #2

This one is for Steve and Iggy and their loyal followers of the status quo!

NDP sweeps Nova Scotia vote

Wait for Ontario to get the chance to vote!

#35 lgre on 06.10.09 at 8:22 am

Tuff situation, at this point its better to have some cash and no RE then the other way around…sell the place, pay off debt and rent..move to a cheaper area if possible, from here on save and invest in more secure vehicles..at 60, I dont recommend stocks..yes we had a nice run up, but we can plummet just as easy, specially in this environment.

#36 Kris on 06.10.09 at 8:27 am

Why on earth do you still have a kid at home?? Maybe he/she could set up a little weed patch on that vacant lot and generate some excellent cash flow to help you out with expenses.

#37 Grantmi on 06.10.09 at 9:09 am

Text….

Mom and Dad…. Please!!! You’re embarrassing me! Put your clothes back on!!

Signed Teen

PS: Shot a squirrel today… will be home soon!

#38 D from London, ON on 06.10.09 at 9:10 am

# 12 – taxpayer like you

Garth is not targeting the boomers with his post, he is trying to draw out the boomer-bashers like me (he says so at the end of his post). This is a great way to segue out of the political chatter of the past few days and get back to the nominal topic of this blog.

# 20 – Maurice

Exactly, bro. If you are a leading edge boomer you have to have worked pretty hard to screw it up like this. Basic life rewards were handed out just for showing up, and if one had a modicum of sense and self-restraint one could have made a very good life for oneself (many have).

Sadly, many more boomers have blown through the “trust fund” our society bestowed upon them and now find themselves in deep do-do (note that even the otherwise fiscally responsible boomers have been hammered by divorce, and especially multiple divorces). Lifestyle choices are coming back to haunt those who thought the good times would keep on rolling (e.g. these two, who thought they could have a mortgage as they head towards retirement, own a vacant lot and and RV and have no savings).

This post echoes the theme I have been saying all along “Boomers, the party is OVER”. It has been a blast getting to 60, now it’s time to pay the piper. If you have been somewhat prudent, you’ll have the coin to pay him – if you’ve been reckless, well, I hope you like squirrel stew.

At least this couple has the guts to take Step 1 in the 12-Step program – “Admit to yourself and at least one other person that you have a problem”. I commend them for that. And I agree that they should liquidate it all before the rest of the boomers who haven’t been saving their nuts for a rainy day wake up and turn North America into a giant garage sale.

As for all the other generations following: Learn from this couple’s example, and as the OLG says “Know your limit – play within it”.

If I take my own advice I guess I’ll have to give up my dream of a boomer-wannabe trophy house. I don’t know if I am willing to follow my own advice (I wouldn’t be the first to say “Do as I say, not as I do”!).

#39 Comfortable in a coma on 06.10.09 at 9:19 am

This situation is so common. Many of this generation spent their money as they got it. Bought RVs, boats and Harleys. Now the result is no nest egg.

You have no savings, no equity, no pension. There is nothing drastic that can give you a comfortable pension now.

Suck it up! Sorry, You made it, you spent it, now you have to keep working.
It’s too late for a comfortable retirement. CPP and a part time job are your future.

You need to reduce your monthly overhead to the minimum to get anywhere. Two incomes are required here.
If you like where you live, hang in there, make your house payments and consider it rent. Real estate commissions will take all your equity if you sell. You are unlikely to pay it off anyway and at least you won’t have to move when your landlord loses his rental property investment.

Sell the vacant land to stop the bleeding there. Sell one car and the RV and the family jewels to pay off the credit card. Don’t buy anything on credit ever again!

Enjoy each day and accept that you are not going to be going on cruises during your sunset years.

Sorry, that’s reality.

#40 Mel Eager on 06.10.09 at 9:24 am

Dear Nearly Retired,

Can you explain how you got into this situation?

Obviously you did not save very much over the past 30+ years of working, but what prevented you?

Your mortgage is also barely paid down, what happened ?

I think it would be beneficial to the group to learn how you got to where you are today.

Cheers,

Mel

#41 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 9:31 am

Well, they certainly do have a situation! However, it seems they, like most Sheeple, still believe in the Old Way of life?

Okay, here arer a few reality checks.

1. Cut down your ‘stuff’, including RE holdings, to what you actually NEED!

2. Forget about impressing anyone, they will not give you Jack Sqwat when you are in the HOLE!

3. Forget the 65 retirement age, and especially the Freedom 55 BS that was nothing more than a marketing tool for investment firms. That is a hangover from the ’70’s to early ’90’s. Yes, you may have a company pension but ask the GM folks how that has worked out? Plan on working as long as you are able to, and be prepared for changes as your physical ability diminishes. That is reality.

4. Sit down and assess your skill sets. Then start your own business and you will get lots of tax writeoffs for your home, vehicle, expenses, etc. Become a Consultant (It sure works for eHealth in Ontario. Nice package as well it seems)

5. If your teenager is 16+ then send him/her out to get a job, a car, and an apartment while they still know everything. ;-) Make it clear they will have to contribute to the household they have enjoyed as a freeby for so long, if you do not already have that active.

6. Sit down with all your close family and work out a plan regarding possible moving to another location. You could also do what millions of Asians and other immigrants do regularly, i.e., share a household as a family. (And people wonder why the immigrants have gobs of money? because they work together for the common good of their family)

7. Lose the RV, the lot, and any unnecessary vehicles. They cost a lot of money. If you find you need occassional transportation then take a taxi. It is far cheaper than the cost, insurance, and maintenance of a vehicle that sits the majority of the time. Plus, if you have a business it is a deductible transportation cost.

8. Above all BE SATISFIED and THANKFUL for what you have, have had, and life itself! Get the Hell off the Merry-go-around and live life using your brain. You are free from the Matrix is you choose to be.

#42 PTDBD on 06.10.09 at 9:50 am

The naked Canadian Mint undergoes quantitative easing – millions not accounted for. RCMP to investigate.

#43 Rob H. on 06.10.09 at 9:50 am

I’m loving the recession, I’m sorry to say. Yes – investments took a hit, but then again, with unemployment at 8.4% nationally, people are actually going to have to appreciate getting a job.

The days of the “Entitlement Generation” are over.

Aging boomers, who aren’t quite as badly set as your example, will be spending their retirement nest-eggs, taking reverse mortgages.. and their children will have to learn *gasp* to be self-sufficient..

About freaking time.

#44 rory on 06.10.09 at 9:57 am

Hey Boomers …OAS, CPP & and a RV to escape to Mexico or even further south.

#45 Bajwa on 06.10.09 at 10:10 am

Hello Mam,
I like Garth’s advise, i.e move out of this area. BC is pretty scary… Gangs, drugs, killers… Its still not a bad market to sell your house and lot.. you know the “greater fools factory” is still in production!

#46 Nick on 06.10.09 at 10:10 am

Garth, if you’re going to post that picture, at least make bottles of eye-bleach available through the Xurbia shop…

#47 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 10:30 am

Mike in Etown @ #2 wrote:

“I just feel totally taken advantage of, demographically speaking”

. . . . . . . . .

Mike, I too would like to complain. About my grandmother’s generation. She died over 20 yrs ago at the age of 105.
What she witnessed and experienced in her lifetime, including Haley’s Comet twice, would make every man including yourself jealous. Those darn 1880’ers had it all — the Second industrial revolution, modern inventions galore, McMansions in San Fran for 5000 bucks. They inflicted changes in mankind’s society as had never been seen before. It’s all THEIR fault :(

Come with me Mike, join me, I’m going to join the Luddites!

#48 Jan on 06.10.09 at 10:31 am

As a boomer who is 10 years younger than the leading edge boomers – I have had to fight hard just to get a job. The leading edge boomers got all the choice jobs and even with a university education I was barely able to get a decent medium wage. Then kids happen then divorce. Only the Gen-Xers had it harder than me. Yes I know a lot of 50 year old boomers who have nothing in the bank and will be completely dependent on their company pensions to pay their mortgages. However there is no excuse for the 60 to 65 year old boomers. They had it sweet. They were able to walk into jobs with little education and amke the big bucks.
You can spend wastefully your money when you are young or you can spend your money wastefully when you are old – BUT you can’t spend wastefully your entire life. That is called bankruptcy.

So face it foolish boomers. Now in your old age you have forced yourself into an extreme frugal lifestyle not retirement.

#49 perplex on 06.10.09 at 10:34 am

to Munch:

I would like to draw to your attention that most jobs in our society are repetitive, do not provide intellectual stimulation and are exhausting. This leaves many working people with no time for friendships, let alone time to reflect. It is for too many a mad run to retirement w no friends and by then at best a mind in need of a lot of stimulus. So the consequences……..

I suggest a read of The Economics of Innocent Fraud by a respected Canadian, John Kenneth Galbraith (2004). I found the thin little book in my library.

#50 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 10:41 am

#25 wjp

There is a helluva lot more to a happy life than money and RE values.

Spend, spend, spend? Where have you been? Look at the Harper government. They have us $150 BILLION in the hole from a positive surplus.

Get off the CRAP Kool-Aide and give your head a shake.

You’re sounding like the Redumblicans in the States. Same old, worn out rhetoric from long ago. They don’t even know who their leader is anymore, but one thing is for sure, it’s some bald headed, old white guy without a clue, living in the past of a long gone era.

#51 wjp on 06.10.09 at 10:50 am

Bill…Bill…Bill….go back and read my post, I was refering to the NDP in Nova Scotia, The Liberals in Ontario and the CPC in Ottawa….different names but same socialist policies…spend…spend and spend….bailouts etc…
All for votes….time for independent MPs Bill…

#52 wjp on 06.10.09 at 10:52 am

Oh and Bill…you might want to read the book “The Shack”

#53 Seilfworcehtsa on 06.10.09 at 10:52 am

“If you look at what you don’t have in life you don’t have anything.
If you look at what you have in life, you have everything.”
Sell the lot, sell the RV, don’t carry a balance on the credit card(s), keep the house and pay down the mortage as quickly as possible. Get a boarder in if you have to. Fear of inflation is driving interest rates. The $1000 mth rent today could be $2000 in 10 years and your $220,000 house could be worht $400,000. Go figure. You will only be 70 years old in 10 years. Used to be that 72 was the proper retirement age.
Free advice is just that…free. If you take my advice expect a bill for $2500 or else make a similar donation to charity. LOL and that’s is a fine looking woman and he is no slouch either. You got your health…you got everything.

#54 wjp on 06.10.09 at 11:02 am

Someone earlier in this thread made mention that certain European countries have allowed immigrants into their country…I believe that all members of the European Union have no choice, part of the Union allows anyone from any member country to move to any other member country without permission. In Canada, I believe we still decide who can enter and who can not. The comparison and point made is invalid between the European Union and Canada.

#55 Sean in E-Town on 06.10.09 at 11:12 am

Ah, generational rivalries. Yeah, I do think that the tax system, wages, pretty much every set of economic advantages that accrued generally to those running up to CPP age are denied me… this is simple retail politics, of which the current prime minister is a maestro. But that doesn’t mean that those who weren’t hip to the system, weren’t already lined up with an affordable mortgage and a pile of savings by the time Paul Martin began swinging his budget axe in the ninety’s didn’t end up screwed (My dad, bless his heart, assumed a mortgage in 1994 and paid it off last year, right before he lost his job. He can carry his expenses on what EI gives him for now.)

Anyway, being an early millennial, or trailing edge GenXer, I understand how people can feel upset about the upheaval they felt in their lifetimes, but, they acquiesced to it. Continual discussion that I, political economist working at a gas station while in school had with customer:

“Why are gas prices so high?”

“Did you vote for Turner in ’84?”

“No.”

“That’s why.”

Though, that still doesn’t top the best drunken rhetorical question I will have ever heard in my life, in 2006, the year the bubble filled from drunken oilpatch worker unsuccessfully trying to make a withdrawl from an ATM:

“How can I be outa money? I work on the oil rigs.”

There are plenty of 30 year olds who rode this wave too, but since most of them aren’t propertied, we don’t hear the increasingly shrill BS about how housing’s going up up up from them nearly as often.

#56 D from London, ON on 06.10.09 at 11:14 am

# 47 – Barb the proof reader

This post is absolutely your worst ever – mindless drivel. I suggest you up the dose on your meds as you’ve been rambling lately. You used to have quite a few good points, and were a good reality check for the blog.

I can appreciate posters who talk from their own experiences, even if their points are contrary to mine. I very much dislike your posts about your dead relatives. Please try to keep your posts based on your own experiences or personal opinions. We can all read the history books and find examples of groups that have been hard done by, and both sides of my family have stories of tragedy aplenty.

Keep it real, or keep it to yourself.

Thank you.

#57 JoJo on 06.10.09 at 11:18 am

Now I’m just watching BNN news, and Merrill Linch reported that the most immportant thing that we’ll avoid DEFLATORY Depression. Hmm, but they didn’t mention Hyper-Inflatory Depression.
Hmm, Garth still think that Depression- means unemployment rate over 10%, and very high interest rate and very high value of $ US currency.
It’s OVER Garth this scenario.The last 100 years USA was the highest industrial and production country in the world. Not any more. Because current GDP in USA is 70% consumption not production.
But, learn from history from Europe,Africa etc.
You can see Hyper-Inflatory Depression
(Germany-1920,Zimbabwe, etc) when you have over 30% unemployment, and paper currency going in toilet.
AND its comming only when Goverment is in overDEBT situation.

#58 Nathan in Edmonton on 06.10.09 at 11:23 am

Rich Boomer, Poor Boomer (isn’t that a show on TLC?) anyway, I’m not sure if it really matters anymore… Rich Boomers will become poor over the next decade as they start to bailout their children and lose their retirement savings/investments; not to mention paying increasing taxes and healthcare costs. Just live within your means and sell the deadweight, it’s what we all must do.

#59 D from London, ON on 06.10.09 at 11:24 am

#49 – perplex

Thanks for the tip on the JKG book. I have put a hold on it at my local public library. I plan to report back here filled with righteous indignation once I have read it. ;-)

Based on the reviews, I think Bill-Muskoka (NAM) would find it interesting too.

#60 Just a Girl on 06.10.09 at 11:25 am

My elderly neighbour is “retired” yet he still cuts grass and gardens for part-time employment. He lives with his wife in a post-war house the size of a postage stamp. It is impeccably maintained with pride. He works very hard and always cheerfully. He has so many offers for yard work, he turns some of them away. If I spent a day with him, I’m sure I could not keep up with him!

For him, retirement is not about sitting on his arse, playing golf, having dinner parties in an outdoor living room, or taking cruises. He is still working in his 80’s, and is more physically and mentally fit than anyone I know. He enjoys making things grow and his love of gardening helps him pay the bills.

So I agree with other bloggers here … do what you love (or know best) and make that your ‘retirement job.’

#61 Jon B on 06.10.09 at 11:35 am

I don’t like complainers. Shut up and make the best of the hand you were dealt and stop blaming others (like the boomer generation).

#62 $fromA$ia on 06.10.09 at 11:41 am

Live in the RV on the lot and get a dog house for the kid.

Better yet sell everything and rent. Keep the dog house for Mr. Flaherty. We have him to blame for our mess.

Watch, in two years a house may be worth buying because of the inflation comming up will justify it!

Garth whats your take? People are still buying homes with 8-10% unemployment.

#63 lemontory on 06.10.09 at 11:44 am

As I see it, there are 2 possible outcomes here:

1) work till you die because you don’t have a choice

2) health issues will kill you first (has anyone noticed how boomers are dropping like flies these days? can’t tell if it’s because there are so many of them or if they just didn’t take care of themselves)

either way, it’s gonna be ugly.

#64 hagbard on 06.10.09 at 11:48 am

If by Windsor you mean they rent there, forget it. Try taking a look at what’s available for rent in Windsor. We live outside of Windsor, and there’s truly next to nothing here. Lots of ugly, shacky houses to buy however for cheap.

#65 Future Expatriate on 06.10.09 at 11:56 am

Garth Turner… you ARE a baby-boomer.

But NOT the weakest link.

Also omnipotent, omniscient and omnivorous. — Garth

#66 Future Expatriate on 06.10.09 at 12:00 pm

That photo’s a couple of models, by the way. A guy who looks as upper level executive as that one has a trophy wife at least half the age and half the weight of the woman in the pic, and the woman in the pic is, more often than not, single or paired with a guy double her weight and when very lucky, younger.

#67 Erasmus on 06.10.09 at 12:09 pm

Here is further confirmation at the US financial markets are going to hell in a handbasket. You got to like these terms that economists come up “hyperinflationary depression”. While we might not agree with everything our blog leader has to say – we can’t say that we weren’t warned. And where the US goes . . .

http://www.stockhouse.com/Community-News/2009/June/10/Rising-U-S-interest-rates-signal-hyperinflational

#68 Samantha on 06.10.09 at 12:14 pm

Mr. and Mrs. Nearly Retired in Small Town BC:

You have already received some good advice and comments.

How did you get there? Let me see if I can answer that one for you:
no financial planning, or you did plan, but life happened and you were dealt a catastrophic life event.

And now, you are exhibiting signs of the deer in the headlights resignation to your situation and future.

“Were going to try and sell the house, then figured there was no point”

“Ours has the advantage of being only a couple of years old and has all kinds of ‘cottage cute’ going on – but that probably doesn’t mean a thing.”

Turn off the apathy and turn on your self-discipline. Nothing changes if nothing changes. Time for some tough self-love.

First change your attitude – you attract what you put out. Why isn’t your house selling? Does “cottage cute” mean cluttered, dirty, junky or clean, bright and depersonalized and welcoming? Don’t know what I am talking about? You have a computer and it’s a google search world so start searching articles for house staging (inside and out). Paint is cheap. If you still can’t figure it out, get someone who will be brutally honest and find out what you need to do to make your house more marketable.

A vacant lot?? Where is it? Is it adjacent to your property? If so, get a package deal going. Do some landscaping and get the vacant lot visually connected to the house lot, and then market it accordingly.

If the vacant lot is not adjacent to your home, then much depends on where it is. In town, commercial area, out of town etc. Is it suitable for campers (sell it to someone looking for a place to camp or possibly someone looking for a lot to put a mobile or modular home). If it’s in town and in a commercial area, check with local business to see if they would buy it.

You need to address the issue of financial planning and budgeting. “$1000 in a sock drawer” again conveys a very lax, laissez-faire attitude towards things fiscal. Gail Vaz-Oxlade is a good place to start and she is also on the internet. Frugal and simple living does not mean a poor quality of life. Many of us do it and quite joyfully.

Pay off the credit card and line of credit debt. Why 2 vehicles? Get rid of one – you can’t afford it.

If you want to salvage what is left of your lives, then you need to accept your current situation, face it and start making the changes in attitude and life management that you need to make if you want some semblance of comfort and dignity in your “golden years.”

Stable, safe and secure should be your new mantra. It will take some work, tough choices including perhaps a move elsewhere, but you can do it.

#69 OttawaMike on 06.10.09 at 12:18 pm

How often have you wondered why citizens of the poorest places on this earth are generally happier than the materialistic, richer, western nations.
This NY Times writer sums it up nicely:
http://happydays.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/07/the-joy-of-less/?em
I am in the process of shedding my superfluous possessions and trying to live with less.

#70 smw on 06.10.09 at 12:30 pm

Even historically low rates can’t hold back the upcoming avalanche.

http://news.google.ca/news/more?pz=1&ned=ca&topic=b&ncl=dSD1Glst_RoiD3MBArwbpgSpVHJpM

Just for all you “know it alls” in the last couple of days pointing your fingers and saying “nah nah nah nah nah”!

#71 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 12:35 pm

Dear “Nearly Retired”,

Need more motivation to sell? Just add up projected monthly cost saving. After selling lot, house & RV you’ll be free from ‘some’ necessary evils. You won’t have high cost of owner’s insurance, property taxes and maintenance.

Best bet is to work till you die.

You’re not going to be able to afford to travel anywhere, anyway. Besides, the ‘joys’ of travel are over-rated. Just become worldly in other ways, like advanced reading, hobbies, self-education, wider views and perspective. Use your brain. Teach something. Join free community social clubs.

Plan for and start a respectable joint business with your husband like cleaning homes using non-chemical substances, hard work, dedication and being handy-people, Jack & Jill of whatever trades or talents you have. Be reliable, indispensable and trustworthy. This will be something that you can carry on after 65 and until your early 70’s.

Instead of enjoying ‘doing nothing’ (another over-rated pursuit), enjoy the self-respect of doing something productive and having solved your own problem.

Whoever of you “retires” first, starts the cleaning business, then the other joins in later. Work hard, honest, clean green, get a good reputation and gain clients by REFERRAL ONLY.
Note: Do not advertise. Word will spread if you are good. Stick to plan.

Find the nicest little spot you CAN afford, to launch, and then live your new lifestyle, and enjoy your free time in your new little home on weekends.

Most of all —-> You were wrong before. You need to get ahead by creating a new example of self-restraint, reality & good planning…. so your kid can learn that.

#72 smw on 06.10.09 at 12:36 pm

Believe what you want, but the indicators are saying that we’re not even at bottom yet.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601082&sid=anSyp5Kko6G4

Dilly of a pickle!

#73 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 12:40 pm

#47 Barb the proof reader

Yes, it is definitely THEIR FAULT! ;-) My dad was so tight with money you couldn’t have driven a flax seed up his arse with a mallet! He actually had the gall to make me go out and work for my spending money at the young age of 8 years old.

He sat around on Easy Street too throught the First Great Depression, and yet somehow managed to have a good life, keep us in a nice home with food on the table, leave a little money, and made an honourable name for himself. He studied to become a professional, and DID!

I know my grandparents had it easy too, they were farmers for the most part and just sat on their arse watching the grass grow their entire life.

They, like we Boomers, have had total control over the economy, actions of others, unfair taxation, health issues. Why, darn our hides, we have never had to deal with a difficult issue in all our years. Life has been a perfectly smooth ride on Easy Street.

We should be sorely ashamed, but most of us are too friggin’ tired to feel it. even so, we still have more ‘Git ‘Er Done’ than most of the youngin’s who think they have all the answers.

We have a little motto they will eventually learn. ‘If you think you are too old to do something, Just go DO IT!’

Now, I am all tuckered out from typing so I had better go start laying the 110 lb pavers for the patio.

#74 nonplused on 06.10.09 at 12:46 pm

Never sell the RV. If the US experience has taught us anything, it’s that if you don’t have an RV then you have to live in a tent.

I loved the one couple they interviewed in California who took out a HELOC to buy a spiffy new RV, got foreclosed on, and now live in the RV title free. Ha, ha, what a great move. Best digs in the tent city too.

RV’s are part of your “really bad day” box.

Oh ya, and all the people who bugged out of New Orleans in their RV’s also faired better than the folks who had to wait months and months for a FEMA trailer.

Once the banks kick us all out of our houses and tear them down RV’s will be an absolute must have item, and they are on sale right now pretty cheap!

#48 Jan

?????

#75 Naked Boomer on 06.10.09 at 12:49 pm

First off, let me assure you all we submitted the letter but not the picture, it was priceless! Someone asked for more background/info on how we got to this point: short version, divorce for both before we married each other that left us pretty much penniless (no, we didn’t leave our marriages for each other, we just happened to have both walked away from very bad situations and met years after) one very sick kid and one major illness for hubby that prevented him from working for quite some time. We do not live in a very expensive retirement town, we used to, and we went back to said town to see Garth at one of his presentations. We had escaped to a very small town in BC for a very good job for hubby a few years ago. We are still there. Yes, we bought a house, first big screw up on the ‘start over’ plan. Didn’t know it was a screw up. Thought the modest home would be something we could sell that would help with retirement. Yes I do work, not much work here for me though so it’s part-time while I continually watch for more. We need 2 vehicles to both work, no transit system here. The kid is at home because she is a teen-ager in high school, seriously…The RV is a 22 year old tiny thing, it might garner a few thousand bucks. It’s allows for extremely cheap holidaying to nearby lakes – getting away that takes minimal gas (an hour to three) and that’s it. We bought the lot when a ‘deal’ presented itself just before we bought the house, thinking we could sell it later and make some money. Ha! It’s devalued substantially, we pulled it off the market when it hit the point we’d have to kick in to pay for the real estate agent and the legal fees, etc, no money to be made or to pay off credit and certainly nothing left to drop into an RRSP. We are re-listing it to see what happens.
Yep, still like the blog! Love getting ideas from others, always better than just your own.

#76 encanto on 06.10.09 at 1:00 pm

Have I missed any of you comment on the new rules the government will introduce on applying for early pensions at the age of 60. It was a small article in the vancouver sun largely overshadowed by” whoops, we will be over 50 billion in deficit.”

I did not understand the part about phasing in the penalties til 2011 and 2012.
Does thagt mean if I want to retire in February 2009 and apply for pension at 60 I will be Ok. I think I should do it early as there may not be any pension money left by 2014.

#77 hagbard on 06.10.09 at 1:14 pm

#69 OttawaMike

I’ll take your stuff.

#78 JeffinPickering on 06.10.09 at 1:14 pm

“The days of the “Entitlement Generation” are over.”

That’s the one piece of absolutely great news in the current climate.
I’m 30, and I live frugally. That is, not cheaply, but prudently and within my means.
I don’t plan on counting on CPP to take care of me in my old age (it’ll be long gone).
I didn’t run out and buy lots of crap I couldn’t afford.

How is it that lessons like working for the things you want, saving, having an affordable house, etc. that were taught to me by my grandparents (now in their 80s), were so badly missed by so many of my parents’ generation (now 55-65)?
Where did the boomers demented notion of “I want ten times more than my parents had” come from? What happened to living within your means and enjoying the simple (and often free or cheap) things in life?

For the couple in question:
*5 years until retirement? Sorry, as has been pointed out, you don’t get to retire now…or ever.
Let’s say you both live for 25 more years. Even in that short a time, if your bare minimum living expenses were $40K a year, you’d need to make $1,000,000 real dollars just to get through. You certainly aren’t going to make that in the next 5.
*How on earth could you only have $10K in equity in your home? I had more than 10,000 equity in my home the day it closed! Prices haven’t fallen enough to account for only $10K in equity.
Borrow against the mortgage? More than once? To buy the worthless swamp land?

I think may of the boomers got fed a lot of crap, and bought into it all hook, line and sinker.
I’m talking stuff like:
-You can spend all you like; CPP will take care of you in the end
-You deserve everything your parents never had…mansions, unlimited toys, unlimited cruises around the world from 65 until death, etc.
-You can’t lose in real estate. Sadly, people were convinced you could make money on any speculation/second property…oops.

What can they do?
Sell everything, keep working, and focus on other things in life besides the great retirement dream. Oh, and for the love of your kid, please make sure he/she learns the lessons early that you didn’t until now.

That doesn’t mean the rest of their lives can’t be rich and fulfilling. It just means it won’t be what they thought.

#79 Toronto C9 Renter on 06.10.09 at 1:15 pm

to #47 Barb the proofreader…

Agree completely! And for that matter, what about those Greeks and Romans, surely we can blame them for something as well! They also had it too easy with their fancy aqueducts and their chariot races etc! ;)

To #56 D From London…

Earth to D…Its called satire! (you know – like on the Simpsons)

#80 Crash on 06.10.09 at 1:26 pm

One factor in keeping R/E prices inflated in smaller BC cities is the drug trade. With the lax sentences in BC for grow ops (if ever even busted, which is in itself unlikely) the risk is low for the potential rewards. In a town like Nelson, there are likely hundreds of grow ops in the town and around the area.

#81 Ted on 06.10.09 at 1:34 pm

My advice? They are screwed and seeing as they are old already and don’t have much time left take on as much credit as possible, buy as many un-repossessable items as you can and then go bankrupt! Best option for them at this point.

#82 Mummers on 06.10.09 at 1:34 pm

Spend, spend, spend…..

Everyone’s living in foggy land because of crap kool-aide they’re drinking. Told by the establishment to spend money and ideas are dismissed as fa-la-la.

Go bang your heads against the wall all you sheeple.

A load of crap!

#83 Samantha on 06.10.09 at 1:38 pm

#76 encanto:

Here’s a link that should help explain the pension changes:

http://www.thestar.com/business/article/644498

#84 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 1:48 pm

#75 Naked Boomer .. 06.10.09 at 12:49 pm,
30 years ago hubby and I lived in a rented tent trailer on the outskirts of Calgary and drove our old vehicle and minivan to our jobs. We searched hard for a cheap, but really nice rental house that we could live in and enjoy, eventually bought it, an inexpensive but nicely located house that we paid off as fast as we could, 13 yrs. We did sparse, necessary reno only.

You had already eventually learned, probably the hard way, to not follow the crowd…. until that particular mistake later in life when you tried to catch up quick by buying a house in that price range.
You did not look at what you could in fact afford. Do that now.

#85 victoria reader on 06.10.09 at 1:50 pm

I remember something Garth wrote a few years ago in the newspaper that said in a perfect world you should pay off your home in your forties. Ive been double paying my mortgage since then and am on track to do just that in fear of being like these people. I never learned how to be a good consumer from my baby boomer parents or at school, it was not until after I bought my home and starting reading posts from people like Garth. My only opinion is that they should get rid of thier debt.

#86 colette on 06.10.09 at 1:54 pm

I know how these nearly retired boomers could have gotten to this point and feel that there is a lot of smug people who might just be the ones who live in a dream world.

How about moving for a job…to a local that has a higher real estate market than you left? Or how about if you did move because you had to the market like so many in BC over the last 20 years crashed so any equity was lost.

How about when you had to move to a new local there was nothing to rent so you had to buy and with little money down in a high market?

How about you were part of the forestry or mining industry that has been busting all over the place in BC? Or maybe like many have been involved in protracted labour disputes that put you behind after being locked out/ on strike for months on end so then you had to play catch up?

How about if for what ever reason…maybe all the stress of moving and starting over and being in debt because of the real estate/job situation your marriage dissovled.

Maybe you remarried and then had a child at 40? These days it seems the younger gen Xers are waiting this long to have their families.

How about that the tax system has murdered families in the last 20 or so years…especially those who are one income, middle income…no child deductions, no baby bonus, no income splitting for the stay at home spouse.

How about if you were an one income family and the stay at home spouse wanted to train for a job there were no programs or help so you went into debt to get an education so you could get a job?

Life for many was not all fun, spend, living the high life. Many of us who are flat busted broke did the best we could…many of us tried to do what was good management…buy a home to raise a family, invest in RRSP’s even if it meant that you might have to get a loan from the bank to do it. (many of us then had to cash in the RRSPs when hardship fell or to go back to school)

Many of us just didn’t have a chance.

#87 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 1:55 pm

#75 Naked Boomer ..

And best of luck. It’s absolutely possible to move the goal posts.

#88 CalgaryRocks on 06.10.09 at 2:05 pm

#67, I predicted hyperinflation way before Garth who still predicts deflation, as far as I know.

I should start my own ‘end of the world’ blog. It’s the only boom in town right now.

#89 char on 06.10.09 at 2:15 pm

You DO need to do ‘something drastic’.

You only have 10,000 in equity, no pension, so you may need to go bankrupt no matter what. If ever a desperate move was called for, it’s now.

I believe we’re coming up soon on a huge stock market crash. It will hit when the Dow gets to 9 or 10 k. IF they’ll let you, sell short the market. I see it as your only option after your lifetime of herding. Yes, risky, but you’re screwed anyway, so what the hell.

And you could end up rich.

#90 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.10.09 at 2:16 pm

Next leg down for Canada?

Welcome to the lag economy.

Consumer confidence up but still not buying much.
Inventories high from the stock that couldn’t be sold prior.
Deflation = Overstock

Canada is an open economy based on exporting mostly raw resources.

Ready to get side swiped? Next leg down coming soon for Canada’s real estate and economic picture.

#91 Calgary_the_prize on 06.10.09 at 2:24 pm

Nice post Garth.

Id like to eat people like this alive in Calgary. They are responsible for this current real estate mess here. Investing in properties as speculation, equity, its screwed it all up for people that work hard and cant afford a house here. At 37 I dont expect to retire, ever. Why is it that the people older than me expect to retire? What is that? I act like Im in retirement now, except I work. I make sure that every working moment outside of work Im doing something so when Im 65 I will know that each day I lived and valued, not waiting for some stupid “retirement”. Lots of the docs I work with talk about their vacations and properties-what a bunch of crap. You make the best with what you have in front of you. Those out of shape old morons in that picture shouldve stayed in shape, gotten a cool hobby and done something productive instead of working as a status quo serf and then expecting joy to come from retirement. Learn balance. Learn to enjoy now and still work. Its very possible. Even in Calgary. Stay tuned for crushing interest rates. I hope the rates go to 12% then principals will be crushed and all this whining will have a stake put through it about real estate. Only then will people buy a house to actually live in. Face it: There is no security and these old people want it, actually everybody does, and it doesnt exist. You are born, and you die. Its just a question of when.

#92 PTDBD on 06.10.09 at 2:26 pm

Questions that I would ask MP Raitt:

Why is the meeting of isotope manufacturers only happening next week? Why wasn’t it held anytime during the previous 18 months :-) going forward :-) when the possibility of another outage was quite obvious.

Are Canadian taxpayers now liable to pay law suits that result from this shortage if negligence is proven?

Question that MP Goodale didn’t get answered: How much of a shortage is there expected to be in Canada.

#93 mikef on 06.10.09 at 2:31 pm

Cut Nos jr. some slack Bottoms_Up

He probably was talking about Quebec where the only
criteria is the willingness and ability to speak French.

Montreal is full of half-literate Haitians,Africans,
Vietamese etc.

Every public job posting has a lineup out the door

#94 Joe on 06.10.09 at 2:34 pm

I feel like I have a fairly good understanding of the longer term fundamentals. I’ve found that this understanding has made me a terrible market timer. I am consistently far too early to the party, but I suppose that is better than being too late.

As I forecasted in rosier times, and was laughed at, Vancouver rental rates are falling. The proof is now in the pudding.

http://www.vancouversun.com/Home+cooking+relief+renters+prospective+buyers/1682064/story.html

I’ve also heard comments that housing prices have stabilized. This is little more than a “spring bounce” fueled by manufactured interest rates, misleading comments from our authorities, effective marketing and the last of the pent-up desire to hold a piece of real estate.

The problem with our economy is that people have too much debt. They have mortgages which are too big and credit lines which are tapped. You don’t cure a heroin addiction by giving a user more drugs, just like you don’t solve a problem of too much debt and too little savings by manufacturing lower interest rates.

A bigger problem is that too many people are employed in jobs which ought not to exist, if it weren’t for excessive consumption. These jobs will fall by the wayside.

In the coming year or two, rates will move higher as rents continue to fall, unemployment rises and credit continues to contract. This quadruple-whammy will crush housing prices even as the government prints more and more money.

There is no end in sight and we’re not coming out of this. Government stimulus might push some of the pain down the road, but that is it….and by then, we’ll have turned a curable cancer into a fatal disease.

#95 David Bakody on 06.10.09 at 2:47 pm

#76 encanto:

Not good news at all …… most hard working Canadians are well burt out by age 60 let alone 70 or better, many have been able to find easier work closer to home using the early CCP to supplement wages. Also the cost of operating a car is now up to $12,000 a year and that is take home pay. oh did I mention all those prescriptions that can come out of no where like another one the Dr. gave me this morning and I am retired.

#96 Evangeline on 06.10.09 at 3:14 pm

((You have no savings, no equity, no pension. There is nothing drastic that can give you a comfortable pension now.))

Maybe this kind of situation would be less common if we didn’t live in such an entitlement society. We live in a nanny state where the values of having to fend for and take care ourselves has been somewhat eroded. We live with the vague promise in the air that mommy-daddy government will take care of us from cradle to grave and the unreality of that illusion is now taking its toll.

#97 JoeCalgary on 06.10.09 at 3:14 pm

Hello, Naked Boomer,

Thank you for taking the time to respond and for having the patience with your accusers to display grace while doing so.

It is with dismay I read that some think all boomers are alike in that opportunities were so very golden. Those of us who have lived through it know better. Cross your fingers for those who get involved in injury-accidents and then get to watch insurance companies become instant enemies.

You’ll be fine, no matter what you do, because you’re living with your eyes open and your heart in tune. The very best to you.

#98 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 3:16 pm

#75 Naked Boomer

Thank you for clarifying your situation. you both are far more typical of the Boomer generation than is acknowledged. Divorce is a nasty, painful, demeaning, and financially fatal experience for most people.

As to your teenage daughter, she can, and should get an after school job. Not only will she feel better about herself, but will learn many life skills that only come with experience.

I worked after school every day during High Scool and made ghood contacts that paid off later in life. rate of pay at one job, selling shoes, was $1 per hour and 10% commission. i broke the company one day sales record at 16.

How, by paying attention to what the customer really wanted, being friendly, and taking all the spare time to learn the business, the stock location, prices, and other things that are critical to successful Customer service.

Weekends I mowed lawns on Saturday morning, and had a paper route. I still had losts of free time to pursue my hobbies, play basketball, and study.

We did NOT have computer or video games, and TV was for the evening with the family. We had no iPods, Game Boys, or cell phones. We actually lived life in the here and now. We also tended to walk wherever we went, especially to a friend’s house, or we rode our bicycle.

The phone was for real and necessary communications, not chattering away hours on end. We also had no Designer anything. Jeans were Levis or Wrangler, shirts were ether plain or coloured and no fancy artwork. We made our shoes last until we outgrew them or wore them out. Nothing but real things of necessity. Somehow we survived, and so did YOU!

We got presents on Christmas and our birthday, nothing the rest of the year, and none of the current ‘Oh I have to have this because all the opther kids have one.’ We also learned to share with others, and we all got to enjoy other things because of that. We also knew our neighbors and participated in the community that was next door.

BTW, it took a lot of courage to ask for help. Hope the comments have given you some solid ideas. Often we know what to do, but it really helps when others say what we have pondered.

It will seem like an endless mountain of coal, but every such mountain gets moved one little bit at a time. Just make sure you, or others are not piling more on faster than you are removing it.

Oh, and do give yourself low cost, but important treats. Life is hard enough without it becoming a doldrum of responsible conduct. We are, after all is said and done, merely human. :-)

#99 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 3:21 pm

work til you die.

#71 Barb the proof reader

Funny how the Inuit figured that out a long time ago. As the story goes when an Elder can no longer contribute they simply float away on an ice floe and die.

I plan to continue working until that day comes. That is how life is for the majority of people on Planet Earth.

In the process hopefully the Elders will teach the younger genrations valuable skills, not just legends and FUD. Now, if only they will listen, eh? Show them by example, still the best teacher of all.

#100 Shiner on 06.10.09 at 3:29 pm

#69 OttawaMike
Really enjoyed the link. Nice one.

#101 Calman on 06.10.09 at 3:41 pm

Hi Garth and followers of Garthdom,

If I understand correctly:

The price of oil is on the way up due to inflationary pressures.

The non oil producing provinces of Canada are going to suffer a continued depression of some sort with continued job losses

Does it Follow:

There will be more oil job creation in Calgary that will attract the unemployed from accross the country thus push Calgary realestate hirer?

Not sure if this is a correct assumption, does high oil= high relestate in “the heart of the new west”

#102 David Bakody on 06.10.09 at 3:50 pm

#99 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 3:21 pm

Best get a plan “B” Bill the ice will soon be gone also.

Bill less than 2% of people on the face of this earth can put their hands into their pocket and pull out any change to buy a cup of coffee and it been that way for years. now things are worst because many who once shared have lost money to do so.

#103 dave from Oakville on 06.10.09 at 3:54 pm

#24 Nostradamus jr

……Certain European countries have allowed in massive numbers of immigrant, uneducated large families with a certain religous bent.

Well I guess its only the uneducated that actually want to leave and come to the west as uneducated people live a tough life in most other countries. Here of course they get huge benefits from this socialized nation. Welfare, healthcare, education etc. Maybe we should be allowing the educated ones in only. And don’t think for a minute that there is not a lot of educated people in places like China. They currently have more honor students than the US has students and thats just China alone. In a recent US computer skills contest … Of 70 finalists, 20 were from China, 10 from Russia and two from the U.S. Wonder how many Canadians there were.

……Canada is the envy of the world…..untold millions of refugees would today jump at the chance of living in Canada.

Funny how I’ve read there were declining from places like China and Mexicans are moving back to Mexico and fewer are coming to the US. Of course the problem is must of these people have been sold on our American propaganda through advertisements and wonderful Hollywood movies showing everyone owning huge beautiful homes and cottages and multiple cars and never ever seem to be working. Its not until they get here they realize they’ve been duped.

#104 . . . fried eggs and spam . . . on 06.10.09 at 3:54 pm

Several excellent posts today, not the least of which are . . .
——
#24 Nostradamus jr. at 6:42 am — “Canada is the envy of the world…..untold millions of refugees would today jump at the chance of living in Canada.

“Look at where California is at today w/ its huge residing illegal Mexican population.”

Like spreading jam over bread, Canada could easily absorb a population of 250 mln., IF they were happy to spread out through the country, instead of congregating in and around cities.

With the chart I posted yesterday, about the sunspots withdrawing and showing the planet cooling down for the next few decades, not too many warm-blooded people — from the tropics and others — would be able to live with the very cold temps. we are experiencing now, and will continue to do so for some time yet.

Has anyone contemplated 1/2 – 2/3 population downsizing (control) yet?
——
#26 Repatriated Expat at 7:12 am — “. . . but in retrospect going through hard times when it seemed like everyone else was prospering was a godsend.”

Top notch post, as when one is going through the most difficult of times, that is when he / she is learning the most about life. There are no free lunches, no handouts.

What one puts out is exactly what one gets back. It’s called positive and / or negative karma, reaping what one sows.
——
#27 Bobby G at 7:21 am — “. . . last June right before they came crashing down . . . Get ready”

Story today in the KDC that commodities, precious metals and the like are about to take off in price, yet with the second / third / fourth wave of foreclosures, bankruptcies, commercial RE and the like, someone, somewhere is making a fortune off the rising / falling conundrums.
——
#43 Rob H. 9:50 am — “. . . Yes – investments took a hit, . . .”

Most, but not all. Our investments, a lot of which are in Cdn. equities, oil and energy, small amount of commodity-based mutual funds, etc. either trod water and / or increased slightly. Right now, they are about even.
——
#63 lemontory at 11:44 am — “. . . (has anyone noticed how boomers are dropping like flies these days? can’t tell if it’s because there are so many of them or if they just didn’t take care of themselves) . . . either way, it’s gonna be ugly.”

See response to Nostradamus Jr. above. Controlled population reduction — that’s what this ridiculous A-H1N1 cockamamee drivel is all about.

Govt. gets to put three shots of hot air in sheeple so no one dies. We’re all gonna break on through at some point; it’s the middle part we’ve gotta handle right now.

That is the ugly part we’re all going into now.
——
#67 Erasmus at 12:09 pm — “. . . The tidal wave of new “liquidity” is already being transmitted through soaring commodity prices . . ..”

See response to Bobby G. above. The upside and downsides are already clear, but you’re right — it’s a tidal wave that will swamp most of us.
——
#72 smw 12:36 pm — “. . . but the indicators are saying that we’re not even at bottom yet.”

Exports are falling all over. Not only do sheeple live with blind-folded eyes in the exterior world (so most can’t see the forest for the trees), we continually elect zombie-sheeples to run our goddamn govts. for us!
——
Interesting to see how easily m$m is deceived / manipulated. On the front page of today’s KDC, just shortly after their 40th birthday, Northside Industries in West Kelowna will shut down for good July 10.

Northside was a metal fabricator. Yearly property taxes rolled in, they employed 250 skilled workers and had a yearly payroll of $9 mln. Now — gonzo.

In contrast, in yesterday’s KDC, the head honcho of Re/Max from Colorado gave a speech. Said our market was “overheated and had to take a breather”, before it got back to normal (whatever normal is).

See the difference? A plant manufacturer shuts up shop as there is no work, yet the RE person says we’ll be back to normal soon.

Could he be a paid shrill for the feds.? He sure as hell duzzent make any sense at all! The RE market here may not go down as quickly as other parts of the country, but it is going down.

#105 wjp on 06.10.09 at 3:58 pm

#97 … Great post Joe, I think you said it all!

#106 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.10.09 at 4:13 pm

#95 David Bakody – “Also the cost of operating a car is now up to $12,000 a year and that is take home pay..”

What are you talking about?
If it was a Hummer and I drove it 24/7

#107 POL-CAN on 06.10.09 at 4:43 pm

I hope that no one here thinks that the price of oil is going anywhere but down….

Oil consumption falls by the most since 1982

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/oilprices/5496316/Oil-consumption-falls-by-the-most-since-1982.html

The only reason oil has been going up of late is because the US $ was tanking. As was gold and copper etc.

The bond market has been getting bitch slapped for a few days now in terms of yields. The only way they can lower the yield (thus mortgage rates) is to crash the stock markets again (forcing the flight to safty i.e. T bills and bonds) or to STOP deficit spending and this BS QE and bailout nonsense…….

Which is more likely?

#108 Comfortable in a coma on 06.10.09 at 4:59 pm

HaHaHa! So many angry people, so many bitter posts!

At 60 years old, the chance of selling everything and moving somewhere to start over are slim. Not many companies hiring young or old.
I think a lot of posters here are not living with reality either. If you own a home near where your job is, and there are few options to rent, selling your house isn’t going to fix anything unless you move into the RV.
If they have to pay rent at a similar amount to their mortgage payment, with no equity in their house, they gain nothing by selling.
Try to remember they are 60 years old and starting over is not an option to take lightly. Investing in the stock market is not an option if you have no money, so cutting expenses is the only place left to gain after tax income.

If there is an opportunity to work elsewhere with lower expenses, then that changes things, otherwise you need to think only what can you do with your present situation. Cut anything anywhere you can that costs you monthly money.
Do all you can to maximize your after tax cash flow.

Tough place to be, but you need to make the changes as soon as possible.

#109 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 4:59 pm

#56 D from London, ON

:)

Did you not look up Luddites?????????? Please look in the dictionary for Luddites. Give me a break.. LOL! Maybe you’ll get the joke if you know the meaning of the word.

And how could you possibly take seriously any post begrudging another generation? Now you’re just being silly.

To quote post #79 as they pointed out to YOU:

“Earth to D…Its called satire! (you know – like on the Simpsons)”

And, D, I would’a hoped a fellow Londoner would have a better sense of humour! I’m a product of it’s 200 year ago original settlers, born, raised, 22 yrs there, forks of the Thames, original stone homesteads, rah rah. Lighten up.

#110 Samantha on 06.10.09 at 5:19 pm

#75 Naked Boomer on 6.10.09 at 12:49 pm. Thank goodness you are not the semi-naked Boomer in the photo (lol).

I can relate to your history. My husband and I met after our former partners decided the grass was greener elsewhere. (The marital assets they acquired helped to green that grass also). So we were both older and starting over when we met.

Moving to a less expensive locale can make a huge difference. My husband and myself both live with significant health issues and disability. The reduction in our income precluded rebuilding our respective lives in BC, so we moved.

It’s been tough at times, but finding an affordable area to live, with the services (health care support etc) that we require was paramount. My husband was a born/raised BC person and he loves MB. It’s easy to love living somewhere when you can afford it.

Aside from a lower cost of living, we live below our means – very frugal. I can make a dollar stretch until it squeaks. Bulk food, coupons, sales, thrift store clothing. Our entertainment varies from used books, peanut butter sandwich picnics to just watching the song birds outside our windows.

Leaving BC was the best choice we made because it levelled the playing field. We had a fighting chance to survive. I wish for you the same – a fighting chance. Don’t give up. Keep going no matter what and with a plan, common sense and time, you will find your way.

Blessings to you and yours.

#111 Tom Jeffries on 06.10.09 at 5:23 pm

Not to be self serving – but this blog has some of the most astute and well considered posts – anywhere.

Most enjoyable and thought provoking.

I have a feeling a new national movement is starting to take root.

The sane and sensible are getting their day in the sun.

#112 dave from Oakville on 06.10.09 at 5:32 pm

Why would anyone want to live here in Canada? Just look what $200K buys you in AZ

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/30021-W-Avalon-Drive_Buckeye_AZ_85396_1109913985

Wonder what that would go for here in Oakville?

Ahh yes but we have our healthcare.

#113 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 5:39 pm

#102 David Bakody

OK! Plan ‘B’: Buy an inflatable on sale at Canadian Tire, take along a knife, and when far enough out, STAB The THING! LOL No life preserver allowed, unless the Canadian Coast Guard come by. Wouldn’t want to ruin a good ending by being arrested, eh?

#114 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 5:44 pm

#102 David Bakody

Oh, and now I know why Tim’s only accepts cash, or the Master Card (Slavery in Plastic). ;-)

#115 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 5:51 pm

#95 David Bakody

You are about right on the cost of operating avehicle.

Figure the following:

1. Insurance-$2000 (with a good rating and depending on your postal code)

2. Payments (To have one covered under bumper to bumper warranty plus tires, and other consumable items) $5,400 (for a low cost vehicle)

3. Fuel-$5,200 a year (at $100 per week)

4. Routine Maintenance (Oil and filter changes, tire rotation, etc.) $200 per year minimum

Total cost-$12,800

#116 dd on 06.10.09 at 5:54 pm

Here is the pill to take to make all your troubles go away:

Move to a small inexpensive town.

Rent

Grow vegies in the garden

Dont buy anything new, except food and maybe underwear

Learn to live with less

Die happy but poor.

#117 dd on 06.10.09 at 6:00 pm

#24 Nostradamus jr.

… you still don’t deal in reality. Canada needs more people for a tax base or higher productivity to off set aging.

#118 Ray MacDonald on 06.10.09 at 6:07 pm

I find it rather offensive that there’s so much boomer bashing going on – especially of leading edge boomers. Not all of us were born with silver spoons in our mouths.
I am the child of Depression era parents. My wife is the daughter of Italian immigrants who came to Canada with virtually nothing.
I had to work my way through university after my dad died when I was in Grade 12. I graduated on Friday, started my career on Monday and worked steadily for nearly 36 years. I suppose I was lucky to have a job all that time. My wife also worked for 33 years as a French teacher.
We got married in 1972 and bought a house the next year.
We have always lived in less real estate than the bank said we could afford. We had the place paid off before we were 40 and then started serious saving.
After we helped my daughter through university we had another good 5 years to save before I began having health issues in my late 50s. At that time we decided to retire and move to a small town in Eastern Ontario. We had saved enough by then to make it possible.
We don’t own an RV, cottage or boat but we are doing OK.
So pardon me if at age 62 I don’t want to go flip burgers at Harvey’s.

#119 cowgirl kiss on 06.10.09 at 6:27 pm

Calgary Gossip…

Well, I was talking to my manicurist today – that bastion of knowledge and SHE said that when she was doing a bank executive’s nails SHE said that they have
HUNDREDS of foreclosed properties that they aren’t selling (just a few at a time) because they have SO MANY they are afraid of creating a housing crisis if they let them go all at once.

I don’t know if it’s true, but I’m just sayin’ ….

#120 Nostradamus jr. on 06.10.09 at 6:29 pm

Mikef, davefromoakville, fried eggs…

…I can take the heat from posters, no problem…Garth however seems to delete every third or fourth of my postings.

Canada certainly has room for many hundreds of thousands of new citizens…however Canada is prone in these turbulent times… wars and starvation are very possible…Canada could suddenly be overun with hundred of thousands of refugees due to its open policy for any refugee who only has to land or step on our beach, claim refugee status and utilize our generous system.

Canada can’t afford it.

…Since this post must be specifically related to Real Estate or Federal Politics…How would the above affect Halton property values or Halton Federal Politics?

#121 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 6:45 pm

boo hoo for the poor boomers, sorry if I don;t shed a tear.

A lot of boomers on this blog, Garth included will never understand the plight of us gen x’ers. Here is my take from personal experiences and those that I know.

1. Lots of boomers who are planning on living the good life after they retire at 55-65 are not going to work longer, even though they have nice pensions, this puts pressure on all of the new graduates from school or those of us in our late 20’s to 30’s

2. Back in the 70’s and 80’s it was a lot easier to get a good job, you did not require a Masters degree to teach grade a grade 3 class nor did you have to do a 4 year apprenticship to become a trades/journeyperson.

3. Now with a huge sense of entitlement, and the political parties all panering to the mighty boomer voting block, its going to be all of the new gradutates and those in our late 20s early 30’s who are going to be paying down the huge deficit.

Boomers who are now in their 50’s and 60’s have had more opportunites then their kids ever will. If they were careless with their money or made bad descions will now have to work longer.

The thing that gets me is you hear all of them whinning like little babies about not be able to retire etc… having to work until they are 70, well every teacher, plant worker etc.. that decides to stay on longer just took that job away from a new grad. Sadly, with their boomer first mentality they never ever care to think about the consquences of them working longer, because its all about them.

We should send them all to retirement homes or out to paster were they can remise about all of their “lost opportunites”

end of rant

#122 Guardia Civil Tricornio on 06.10.09 at 7:09 pm

Sell up, downsize, lose debt and keep working.

Don’t feel like your both bad parents – cause your not. Mine were worse, one an accidental AeA fatality years ago while the other’s pretty much thrown all away @ the casino. Both victims of the ‘tingle’ of their games…

#123 john m on 06.10.09 at 7:25 pm

Well you can knock the boomers all you like but todays younger generation is what i really wonder about.It isn’t the boomers who are working at Mcdonalds driving brand new leased vehicles nor was it the boomers that scooped up the no money down homes.On my block alone there are 4 all over 24 who are still living at their parent’s homes (boomers) ..all have been to university…none of them have steady jobs –nor are they looking…all drive cars and have all the toys (mommy and daddy (boomers) are paying for it. I was an employer for years and ask any other how hard it is to find any young people who are willing to work and don’t already know more than the boss and have absolutely no work ethics..just a culture of entitlement.

#124 PW on 06.10.09 at 8:30 pm

Is anyone out there thinking about retiring as an ex-pat to Central America? Many countries like Panama are offering fast-tracked citizenship to retirees with only $800 monthly income. If you can’t afford the standard of living in your own country when you retire, why not think about moving to a country you can afford…?

#125 Future Expatriate on 06.10.09 at 8:41 pm

#124- Because when the food riots start there, they’ll be 1000 times worse than here, AND you, being their uber-riche, will be the first house they come to to do the Charlie Manson thing to.

As far as law enforcement, down there, they’ll be in the mob headed for your house.

So unless you plan on building a multi-million dollar armed walled compound next to a handy military base where you can buy off the men when you need them, exactly like George W. Bush did in Paraguay, I’d advise forgetting about settling anywhere south of the US border, unless it’s in the south pacific.

#126 Linda Pearson on 06.10.09 at 8:43 pm

re: #121 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 6:45 pm

Kitchener1, please go back and re-read what you have posted. When you have done so, please give some consideration to the likelihood that you are under-employed, if employed at all, because you are unable to assemble a cogent, grammatical, correctly spelled few paragraphs. After you have addressed your inability to adequately communicate in what I assume to be your native language, perhaps then you can blame other people for your failure to advance in life.

#127 Canadian Army Guy on 06.10.09 at 9:01 pm

The world according to DD:

” #116 dd on 06.10.09 at 5:54 pm

Here is the pill to take to make all your troubles go away:

Move to a small inexpensive town.

Rent

Grow vegies in the garden

Dont buy anything new, except food and maybe underwear

Learn to live with less

Die happy but poor.”

THIS IS WHY most of the posters here are stoners…

Rent in a small town???????????

With what money?

From a job in a small town?????
Small town Ontario?????

LOL!!!

Keep on tokin’

#128 john m on 06.10.09 at 9:09 pm

#121 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 6:45 pm

boo hoo for the poor boomers, sorry if I don;t shed a tear.

A lot of boomers on this blog, Garth included will never understand the plight of us gen x’ers. Here is my take from personal experiences and those that I know.

1. Lots of boomers who are planning on living the good life after they retire at 55-65 are not going to work longer, even though they have nice pensions, this puts pressure on all of the new graduates from school or those of us in our late 20’s to 30’s————well to start off with if your in your late 20’s to 30’s and still haven’t found employment who’s been keeping you? Bet your boomer parents. And don’t try to give me that crap about how boomers don’t know what your facing… i am a boomer and i left home when i was 16 and when there was no work throughout my life in my field i worked at whatever i could find–i didn’t have boomer parents who were quite content to let me bask on their bank accounts while i hung around home till my late 20’s all the time whinning because i was too lazy to get a job at whatever…nor did my parents send me tho college —they couldn’t afford it.I educated myself as i passed thru life—in fact when i left school my father told me i had a week to get a job and start paying board or move out,that was the way for a lot of boomers our parent’s were not cash cows for their kids.Bad times or good times there is work if your not too self important to do menial tasks because you have a piece of paper and are far too important for that——SO stop your whinning….im not!

#129 . . . fried eggs and spam . . . on 06.10.09 at 9:33 pm

#119 cowgirl kiss at 6:27 pm — “. . . if they let them go all at once. I don’t know if it’s true, but I’m just sayin’ ….”

Chances are good there is a lot more going on than what anyone knows. A week or so ago, an American site (can’t recall which one) said US banks (acting in concert) will soon flood the market with thousands of foreclosed properties.

That makes about as much sense as growing broccoli in Antarctica. Almost nothing will sell (except to the ultra-rich), so there is an underlying thread of deceit, probably stemming from Bernanke / Paulson / Carney / Geithner to screw Cdns. and Americans even further.
——
#120 Nostradamus jr. at 6:29 pm — “. . . wars and starvation are very possible…with hundred of thousands of refugees due to its open policy for any refugee who only has to land or step on our beach, claim refugee status and utilize our generous system.”

Same thing happened in the UK in the ’50s, ’60s and ’70s. Illegal immigrants worked their way to Belgium, Holland, France, etc., paid for their boat trips in cash to cross the Channel during the night.

After landing, they were directed straight to the local pogey office. No questions were ever asked, clerks simply kept their heads down, rubberstamped their applications and they were UK citizens, entitled to all the benefits that regular Brits got.

Notice the word “entitled” again. History repeats itself time and time again, yet what do the politicians do about it? Baffle us with their bullshit from big speeches. No one else can figure out what they are saying. See Obama link below.
——
Earlier, I mentioned the groundless and hyped pig / bird / human flu, and that it was nothing more than a joke. Well — http://tinyurl.com/l2nf32 — I forgot to include exorbitant profits for Tamiflu and their relatives.

‘Tis better to take an Aspirin for a cold or headache and a Fisherman’s Friend for a cough. Speaking of which, how convenient. — http://tinyurl.com/mmq67f

One more, with part of a para. below. — http://tinyurl.com/llmry6

“. . . rapid and dynamic young and growing population, while that of Great Britain and France was stagnant or in decline after the British Great Depression of 1873 which led to huge emigration of population to the USA. It’s no accident that the leading political elites of the G7 argue that the greatest threat globally is the rapid birth rate in developing countries.”

Remember ‘population control’? It’s almost here!
——
Good to remember that all political leaders are simply pawns in a chess game. As long as they toe someone else’s line, they can stay where they are for as long as they want.

In this 9:50 clip, Obama gives two separate speeches, based on a new “thought-control” measures. The commentator is good, as she breaks it down. — http://tinyurl.com/n7b3d9

It certainly helps one see the reality of these “behind-the-scenes” written speeches, and a lot of double-meanings in them.
——
Paras. below speark for themsleves! — http://tinyurl.com/lecsad

“The multiple frosts that have blanketed Western Canada in the last week are the most widespread in the top canola-growing province of Saskatchewan in at least five years, the Canola Council of Canada said on Tuesday.

“Two overnight frosts last week have already resulted in some Saskatchewan farmers reseeding their canola, a Canadian variant of rapeseed, said Jim Bessel, senior agronomy specialist in the province for the industry group Canola Council.”

Webmaster’s Commentary: “… in JUNE!”

#130 smw on 06.10.09 at 9:35 pm

#120 Nostradamus jr. aka Scooby Doo

however Canada is prone in these turbulent times… wars and starvation are very possible

And wars and starvation aren’t happening today?

Also, don’t you find it ironic that the only people on this blog that really give it the the “East”, are a handful from the “West” that, as their defense to their slander, state they’re from the east?

Sir or Ma’am, whether your a “self hating easterner” or not, your still a bigot.

Otherwise, have at it, ramble on, keep crazy coming.

#131 905er & Spouse on 06.10.09 at 9:36 pm

Naked Boomers:
Sorry to hear about your situation, that really sucks…

If you keep your home, rent part of it out or take in boarders. Get rid of at least one car. I second the idea of finding some way to reduce taxes by having a business of some kind, even if it brings in very little. Keep working!

Think of ways to live frugally, do a google search on this. Don’t buy anything new, always used. Try craigslist.com or kijiji.com. Better yet, use freecycle.org and get used things free. Don’t pay for TV or cellphones, high definition TV is free with an antenna and the quality is great. For clothing, always use thrift stores. My mother is a great example, she volunteers at one and always gets first dibs at the good stuff. Think of ways to save money on food. Two recent discoveries: Tofu is healthy and is $1 for a huge slab good for two family meals. Oatmeal is 16 cents per 100g in the bulk section.

It will require a complete re-thinking of your entire lifestyle, difficult but possible. Do you have earlier life experiences you can draw on to do this? I just think of my many years in university and putting myself through 2 Masters degrees to get where I am. I lived very frugally and can put myself back there. Don’t worry what others think. You can be poor but rich in mind and soul and live with dignity.

#132 D from London, ON on 06.10.09 at 9:43 pm

#79 – Toronto C9 Renter
#109 – Barb the proof reader

Earth to the two of you – what do you think I am, an idiot? (Wait, don’t answer that…).The OED defines satire as “the use of humour, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people’s stupidity or vices.”

Do you not think I saw Barb’s post like that? I saw the ridicule and criticism of my “stupidity” (from an Entitlement Generation lady) loud and clear. And now you both further insult me by asking me to smile while I get it up the pooper? What are you thinking? (Wait, don’t answer that, Barb already told us via her “satire”).

As for my response to the “satire”, as a wise fool once said “You throw balls against me, I throw balls against you”.

#133 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.10.09 at 9:59 pm

#114 Bill

You are magic with the numbers Bill.

How about BC numbers for a standard postal code.

Insurance $1500 (on a new low cost vehicle)

Gas for the average person based on average usage is about $1500 to $2000 – go to the dealership and check it out(they have comparisons on usage and cost savings)

Now do you have to pay for that car for the rest of your life ………I don’t think so.

So, we aren’t even close to 12K ……..Bill or David.

Just the facts monsieurs……just the facts.

#134 Sean in E-Town on 06.10.09 at 10:01 pm

Here’s an awesome story: I talked to my realtor, and told him: “I’m gonna take your advice and wait a year.” He said. “Oh I never said that.” I recounted my bullish view and his response “If you really think prices are on their way down, than wait a year.” Thought for a moment. “Oh yeah, right.” Mentioned his favorite economist Peter Schiff (Inflation Bunny) was on Daily Show, actually made some cogent points. Gotta make stuff to have an actual long-term economy, high interest rates would have taken the air out of these bubbles.

Still not gonna buy gold, since I don’t see a spike in demand for cell phones and computers. Gold is an industrial metal now, and the inflation bunnies will get themselves in petrodollars (CDN comes to mind…)

Anyway, he, despite having kid two days ago, able to use commission like I need paycheque, wants a beer with me next week. I got a good realtor. If in Edmonton and need a fairly neutral realtor with keen intellect, Feel free to drop me a line at [email protected] and I’ll send you his contact info, or send him yours.

Anyway, the rarest endorsement of all on this blog, that from an RE bear, for a realtor who’s the client’s servant while being realistic, I thought I’d bring him up, without making it an ad for the man. If you’re made up buying or selling and in Edmonton, I’ll pass on his name and info, or yours if you like. When I buy… (Not today, the market needs to discipline these guys) then it’ll be through him.

P.S. He convinced me not to buy this year with one discussion. I looked at a condo with asking price in the high 90s, said with rent-price place was really worth the low 80’s. He said, “Okay, let me show you every $82,000 asking condo in the city. Done.” We smiled and I was pretty certain then that I’d wait a year. I like a guy who can be independent without dictating to me. I think you would too.

On the me under a roof front, I’m gonna board with a guy for 400 a month including everything in his usually for students three-bedroom apartment in his basement. Means I’ll be plunking 30-40K down next year instead of 25-35. Makes me de-leveraged and happy.

#135 john m on 06.10.09 at 10:08 pm

#126 Linda Pearson on 06.10.09 at 8:43 pm———well said i love it :-)

#136 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 10:18 pm

#111 Tom Jeffries

Hopefully the sane and sensible will win at the polls during the next election. There is a serious need for a Centrist (fiscally, politically, environmentally, and socially balanced) movement in Canada to allow a real government to be formed instead of the Sheeple mess we have now. I mean that irrespective of party BTW.

#137 Real Estate Deal or No Deal on 06.10.09 at 10:19 pm

Naked Boomer,

Why settle?

I agree with Garth sell everything as fast as you can. But then, is there something you feel passionate about that you could market?

Perhaps you might have a passion for something and could start a consulting business or something that creates a bit of residual income … think in terms of how do I do something that cause money to start trickling to me …. then do a lot of it.

Good Luck.

#138 Naramata on 06.10.09 at 10:24 pm

Thanks Garth for the picture …….diet starts tomorrow! I am sooooo motivated now.

Thanks as well for “The Strategy” I read it, and saw you in Penticton …..used my equity ….can’t imagine where I’ld be today without your guidance . Thanks again..

#139 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.10.09 at 10:30 pm

#133 Bob and Doug …the Canadian Bro’s

No, you do not have to pay for the car forever..UNLESS you believe that it will last forever without repairs? My point being that at today’s labour rates a relatively minor thing can cost you thousands.

I analyzed, based on experience, what the real cost of vehicles are and found that I had a choice…either pay it monthly and have full bumper to bumper warranty coverage, or be prepared to lay out megabucks for repairs.

Likewise, the trade in value on a worn out vehicle is ZERO! You will have to pay to have iot hauiled to the salvage yard.

Bottom line is you are going to pay either monthly or pay later. I chose the Pay As You Go Plan which means I accept the costs (albeit consider them assinine), and therefore, have peace of mind, especially during harsh winters.

I can at least budget a monthly term payment. Unknowns remain just that. I guess that is why I do not gamble in the Lottery or the casino.

Simple reality, all vehicles are design to deteriorate over time. Ford perfected that with the Three Year POS. They got a harsh lesson, but the game goes on.

I treat it like I would rent. A prorated cost for the use and convenience. Simple as that. In return I get reliability and peace of mind. A depreciating asset that allows me to make money.

#140 Jake on 06.10.09 at 10:31 pm

#129 Great links. I particularly enjoyed the speech by George W. Obama. How about another wolf in sheep’s clothing post Garth. Seriously, let’s have a conspiracy day just to mix things up.

ps, Just where did you find those pictures. What were you googling that led you to those pictures?

#141 Sean in E-Town on 06.10.09 at 10:38 pm

Sorry, bearish view instead of bullish, but you probably got that already. Yeah… methinks basic one bedrooms in Edmonton are destined for the 70’s.

#142 dd on 06.10.09 at 10:57 pm

.#127 Canadian Army Guy

…With what money?From a job in a small town????Small town Ontario?????….

Well it seems that the couple have pissed away their life savings or haven’t even saved at all … They are the ones smoking POT my friend. …. Almost retired and no money. What? Did their stone finally wear off?

#143 dd on 06.10.09 at 11:00 pm

.#127 Canadian Army Guy on 06.10.09 at 9:01 pm

There is more to Canada than Ontario.

#144 teepee on 06.10.09 at 11:05 pm

Nearly retired in small town BC,
Sell your lot and house yourself. It’s easy to do. Get an appraiser (not a RE agent) and lawyer. That’s all you need. Advertise at or around the appraisers value. You have his/her document to show the prospective buyer. Right off the bat you’re able to sell at less than the going market without paying a commission. Get an ‘Agreement of Sale’ at the local stationers. Take a deposit and let their lawyer deal with your lawyer. I’ve done it many, many times over the years. I’ll buy through a RE agent but never sell through one. Good Luck.

#145 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.10.09 at 11:23 pm

#139 Bill
When your finished paying for that car that is worth nothing………please send it my way.

Last time I checked a used car lot. Trade – ins were worth quite a bit.
So your idea of $12,000 cost of owning a car has not been “analyzed” very well by you.

Facts only …… as fiction isn’t in my diction.

#146 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 11:23 pm

D from London, ON,

You took it the wrong way. No one, not that other poster nor anyone here made fun of you.

The fact is, that out of the blue you did a personal attack after I posted to Mike Etown #2 to go along with his humour regarding generational blaming. I assumed you stomped in error, so I tried to give you an out — the benefit of the doubt. Now I’m not sure about you.

I refer to Mike Etown @ #2 who was being humourous in blaming “a generation”, he was obviously playing a joke or being funny, because to blame a generation simply doesn’t make sense. What happens as history changes is completely intertwined with all the many generations existing at that time, interlaced and interacting at the same time. Each YEAR finds change. Generations are just labels. There is no such thing as generalized blame on a single generation. All there is, is what happens with changing societies, opportunities are missed. The world changes. People adapt, inventions happen. Change happens. Crisis occurs. There is no “blame” of a generation. And no, I can’t imagine why you would imply that anyone thinks you’re stupid in any sense, and I don’t know where you got that nor why you say that nor where you’re coming from. In fact now it seems really odd that you, out of the blue, tore into my joking with Mike Etown at #47.

You simply did a personal attack at #56. Anyone can read it. And then you cranked it up and took it out on another poster later. They were simply trying to lightheartedly enlighten. So your attack on them seems further untoward. But you started this with a personal attack for no reason, so cut it out. Or fess up to a misunderstanding. Personally I thought you had a misunderstanding, and I still do.

#147 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 11:28 pm

#126, truth be told, I am employed, middle management for a blue chip company. Good salary, up until I receieved this promotion 3 years ago I was working two jobs, now I no longer have too. I am one of the lucky ones in my age group, started off years ago with a great company and moved up the ladder.
I have many friends with Masters degree’s that are underemployed and even one that is unemployed.

Should have re-read the blurb before posting, thats what happens when your typing while on the phone/dog sitting/making dinner.

I still stand by all of the points, boomers had it easier then any other generation when it came to finding good jobs. They made bad choices that will be paid for by younger generations. Yet they cry and whine, that whimper that you hear coming from them now is going to grow louder and louder over the years.

RE#128 John M

My parents did not give my much other than a roof over my head and three meals a day. I paid for all of my own cars, insurance, motorcycles, vacations, clothes, University education etc and have been living on my own since I was 21. Started my first part time job at 13, worked two jobs to get through university, up until I was 27 I worked one full time job and one part time job. Sorry, wish I had some rich parents that I could mooch of. The work ethic I describe is very typical in my generation as just about all of my friends did the same.

#148 maria on 06.10.09 at 11:32 pm

#68 Samantha on 06.10.09 at 12:14 pm

Your post is precise and clear ! Congratulations!
I hope they follow your smart advise!

#149 Devil's Advocate on 06.10.09 at 11:44 pm

I would like to chime in on rebuttle to all the boomer bashing…

My wife and I are late boomers who graduated from University in 1981. As you will recall the economy then was not unlike today in many ways. It was tough to find a job and for years we were plagued with calls from creditors (Student Loans).

Today our two children are set to graduate under much the same circumstances but through great effort on our and their part without the burden of student loans.

Today it is the “first time buyer” who is fueling the housing market, such as it is. These buyers are highly leveraged as were we when we bought our first home. The difference is when we bought interest rates were 15% today they are a third that. Futher when we bought housing prices were pretty much assured to rise. Today they are pretty much assured to fall. When we financed our home interest rates were poised to fall. Today they are experiencing pressure to rise substantially in the not too distant future. Despite all the reasons to the contrary “First time buyers” are anxious to buy and I have heard many say that “given the reduced prices over last year and low interest rates it is a good time to do so.” Is it?

More to the point; when these fresh first time buyers find that those words of wisedom they did not heed from the likes of Garth Turner, Peter Schiff and a host of others prove to be the “free education we experienced boomers offered but they rejected” will they then blame the boomers for having gotten them in the financial mess they are clearly headed for? Education is a bargain at any price. The best education comes from experience. Listen to those who have gone through it and learned from their errors. Or don’t. But don’t blame them for the lessons you will learn as they did too the hard way.

#150 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 11:48 pm

126 Linda Pearson – Good post Linda. I loved it too. I guess normally I skip over their boomerblaming posts but I’m getting the picture today – that these kids actually believe themselves. And, come to think of it now, it’s nothing new, since kids blamed a parent generation 35 years ago, and 25 years ago, and 15 years ago… the more things change, the more they stay the same.

#151 taxpayer like you on 06.11.09 at 12:07 am

kitchener 1/John m

The biggest irony is that you both seem to have similar life experiences, yet you both heap scorn on the others generation.

Make sure to read Barb 146 again – the guts of the large paragraph (you too D Lon, and van renter if you’re checking in)

#152 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 12:08 am

#147 kitchener1,

The work ethic you describe is the same boomers had. You are making the error of generalizing.

BTW write out your history again, it’s the same as mine, and I got not one red dime from my parents either.. Oh, except I worked 3 jobs not 2 (at the same time), paying for all my university, with my own apartment, at 19, and a car, and my own pet. Work began at 13 too.

And when you say “I wish I had some rich parents that I could mooch of. The work ethic I describe is very typical in my generation” Personally I do not wish I had rich parents to mooch off of. Why? Please get the dog off your lap and rethink what you said for a moment. If you had rich parents you wouldn’t have turned out like you did, and you do seem proud of yourself. Certainly you are not putting yourself down. You are however, assuming boomers were not like you. They were, more than you know.

#153 nonplused on 06.11.09 at 12:21 am

#115 Bill-Muskoka (NAM)

$2000/year for insurance????? Where in the heck do you live? I have 4 vehicles for 2 drivers and we barely clear that including trailers. Maybe you are driving a little to fast and smashing bumpers a bit.

My most expensive to insure vehicle is $650 a year and it’s a loaded 2006 Explorer Limited with the leather seats, DVD and all that. With collision.

Payments: there should be no payments. Buy cars cash. If you can’t afford new, buy used.

No doubt your fuel costs are right in there for many people.

#154 Dave on 06.11.09 at 12:35 am

okay, what in the heck did these people do for 60 years?!?!

There are truckloads of bad decisions made with this couple. Lets not think this is something that just surfaced.

#155 TheFirstRick on 06.11.09 at 1:15 am

#146 Barb the proof reader on 06.10.09 at 11:23 pm
============
You go girl!! Keep setting everything straight, OK?

I’ve gotta ask though. In person, do you tend to finish peoples sentences for them?

#156 john m on 06.11.09 at 1:20 am

147 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 11:28 pm —then what are you whining about,your previous post you and all your friends were so hard done by that life was hardly bearable—and as far as the work ethic’s of your generation you are obviously as far from reality as you are bad at spelling :-)

#157 TheFirstRick on 06.11.09 at 1:23 am

#147 kitchener1 on 06.10.09 at 11:28 pm

=============

You’re post #121 was dead on.

#158 Dan in Victoria on 06.11.09 at 1:33 am

Hmmm….Mommy and Daddy Michelien man.Here’s the way I see it.You’re never going to own a payed off home.You would have to pay twenty odd grand per year on the principal for ten years to do it,why bother?So basically you are leasing that home from the bank,you are responsible for all costs assicoated with this lease(new roof,painting,plumbing disasters,etc.)Good deal for the bank.So sell it,theres a value to that house of X$$$.What it sells for is what it’s worth plain and simple.Maybe your all ready underwater on it,who knows?Quit waffling get an honest apprasial and move on it.Be aggresive on the price,don’t spend a hundred to save five get my drift?Don’t chase the market down,get ahead of it.The lot that you own, is there restrictions on what you can build?If not consider a small two story house,i’m talking 700 square feet per floor max.You say there are no rentals,so stick a one bedroom suite in the bottom and get some cash flow out of the place .http://wwwwesthomeplanners.com/house-plan-1231.html is the sort of thing I am talking about.You’ll have to do your own plan searches to figure it out.Look at Jenish garage plans also.Use your imagination on what to do downstairs.You could also have a modular home set up. A friend of mine who had a modular home set up said it was about 80 grand new,but he mentioned to check the “equipment auctions”he had seen them as low as 50 grand used.So if your’re paying 300 for the lot now and say you need a 100 grand to do the modular or small house(high hopefully)say at 5.75% thats about 650 a month on top, so 950 a month plus taxes etc.If you can get 500? a month from a suite.Figure it out.Make your home generate some money.Also there has been some other astute advise offered by other posters,keep in mind you have to change from living to surviving….needs not wants.(Keep the RV) Good luck.

#159 john m on 06.11.09 at 7:21 am

#151 taxpayer like you on 06.11.09 at 12:07 am

kitchener 1/John m

The biggest irony is that you both seem to have similar life experiences, yet you both heap scorn on the others generation. ———–pffffffffft “kitchener 1” lived at home till he was 21–in my generation that was practically unheard of—in FACT when i was 21 i had been on my own for 5 years –worked 2 years as a deckhand on a lake boat and finished 3 years enlistment in the Canadian Navy—He “don’t impress me much” :-)

#160 pjwlk on 06.11.09 at 7:33 am

#16 John: “Be ready for when CPP and OAS become a tax credit amount and not a cheque in your acct.”

Jesus, I never even thought of that, but yeah how else are they going to pay for Baby Boomers? Make it so they have to keep on working…

#161 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 7:53 am

155 The First Rick 06.11.09 1:15 am:
Barb … in person … do you tend to finish peoples sentences for them?”
–The First Rick

Dick,
Allow me to remind that amidst your other again unprovoked & unwarranted slurs on 05.28.09 at 11:17 pm #123, you said, and I quote:
Barb … I skip your posts entirely”
–The First Rick

. . . . . . . . .

Dear Dick,

You said you skip them entirely?
Sure wish you could be true to your word!

Ps What causes you to be unable to skip over people’s posts?

#162 Jonathan on 06.11.09 at 8:00 am

#107 POL-CAN

Ever heard of JP Morgan – the largest purchaser and seller of oil in the world? You bet oil prices can go way up even when demand falters.. it happened in early 2008. All it takes is speculation and futures – or in other words, a bubble. Supply and demand are not as important.

#163 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.11.09 at 8:06 am

#153 nonplused

I live in Ontario. Where do you live? Some provinces have fair insurance costs, but Ontario is open season on everyone’s wallet. I have a clean record, but the costs increase each year for about the same reasons fuel prices do, i.e., a seagull crapped on an oil rig. Because the bastards can get away with it.

In fact, when we moved last year we got an increase. I asked why and was told ‘You live in a higher risk area based on your postal code.’ BS! I live in a safer area now than before, but the insurance companies have the kiddies at Queen’s Park in their pocket.

Also, having my own business I have to carry $2 million liability coverage.

Again, please share where you live.

#164 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.11.09 at 8:17 am

#149 Devil’s Advocate

Sorry mon ami, but you are NOT a Boomer. Boomers were those born immediately following the end of WWII in the period between about 1945 and 1953. It a time of replenishing the population that was significantly above the normal birth rate.

Here is a fairly accurate discussion on the subject. Note the following generation was called Generation Jones.

Baby Boomers

Just to help you ID yourself.

#165 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.11.09 at 8:37 am

#133 Bob and Doug …the Canadian Bro’s

Why would I state BC numbers? I know nothing about them?

As to paying cash for a new car, good luck. Besides, that cash can be used for other things like building a business. Only the very wealthy or foolish divert their cash flow in large sums like you insinuate. With the very low interest rates for new vehicles one is better off borrowing money for that than a LOC to finance business needs.

I do not know many people who can plunk down $20-50K for a vehicle without paying interest to someone.

#166 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 9:02 am

#164 Bill-Muskoka (NAM)
Bill you are a fountain of information.. (“Elders” are known to be.) As for me, I am officially taking no more blame for being a boomer since apparently I’m something called Generation Jones effective today. Just barely. Labels, eh? I feel younger already.
I won’t put a smile in this note to you because apparently some other posters (or are they posers) either don’t ‘get’ smiles or are afraid of smiles. And some people just wake up grumpy!

#167 TheFirstRick on 06.11.09 at 9:58 am

#161 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 7:53 am

Ps What causes you to be unable to skip over people’s posts?
=============
Well, I try to skip your posts but your sanctimony stands out like a speed bump. I’m forced to slow down unfortunately.

You just keep setting everyone straight, OK. Eventually the world will be just as you think it should be.

Signed,

Something you are so in desperate need of,

DICK

#168 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.11.09 at 10:04 am

#165 Bill…..

Did you read my post. My only request is please after you are finished paying for that new car. Give it to me as you believe it is worth zero.

As for the BC postal code I just chose that because that’s what I know. But I have seen other provinces insurance costs and I know BC isn’t the cheapest.

Just the facts Bill…….fiction isn’t in my diction.

#169 Bob and Doug ...the Canadian Bro's on 06.11.09 at 10:06 am

Also Bill those low rates you get on car financing. ….well you are paying for it. A cash sale will net you a much better deal.

Cheers,

#170 pjwlk on 06.11.09 at 10:34 am

Lots of talk here about working until you die and never being able to retire.

I wouldn’t have a problem with that if the government wasn’t taking money from my pay cheque every week for the last 36 years while extolling the belief that I will be able to enjoy a happy retirement. That in my mind is nothing more than embezzlement!

#171 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 1:07 pm

#167 TheFirstRick on 06.11.09 at 9:58 am

Rick,
Nice attempt at humour but your style of FUD’DING won’t work, on me, nor on others here. I’ve learned well from Mr. Garth, and I appreciate the wisdom of others, and learning from them.
Your unwarranted, MPD-style triangulation attacks however, on commenters’ character, are not getting you the negative returns you are wishing for, and they won’t. People catch on quickly — so your repeated attempts actually just bury you further. (Oh, I’m sorry, I should have cautioned you, that may seem like advice, and you’ve stated that offends you too.)
So again, please live up to your word when you avowed so strongly the other day that you skip my posts. Try again, this time harder.

#172 Samantha on 06.11.09 at 1:47 pm

#147 kitchener1 on 6.10.09 at 11:28 pm

You sound like a sensible person with a good work ethic.

I would like to respond to a part of your comment:

“I still stand by all of the points, boomers had it easier then any other generation when it came to finding good jobs.”

Actually, there were jobs in the late 60’s/70’s – lots of them, but for many of us not “good jobs” or well-paying jobs (think back to how women were paid then – the “pink ceiling”).

I can only speak from my own experience and from what I observed from my peer’s experiences. I left home at 15 (no choice) and worked for subsistence wages. There was enough to pay rent in an apartment in not a great part of the city, and lots of Kraft dinner (lol). I went back to school and began to upgrade my education/skills. Like you I worked 2 (during school 3) jobs. But, even using this strategy my wages pitted against the cost of living was an uphill slog.

Many of us were told by our parents to save. Unfortunately, we weren’t told how to save. Now, that might sound silly, but please consider how difficult the concept of saving was for a young person who barely earned enough to pay rent, utilities and food. Putting away a dollar or two a pay as savings seemed hopeless. I definitely didn’t understand compound interest back then. Financial management skills were something many of us had to learn the hard way.

Your sentence that follows:

“They made bad choices that will be paid for by younger generations.”

Yes, I made bad choices and I took responsibility for them then and expect to do no less today or tomorrow. I’m human, not perfect, and try as I might, doubt that I’ll get through the rest of my life without making a few more whoppers. (lol)

Every generation makes “bad choices” and each generation that follows will make bad choices, too. And, so it goes the cycle of time and life and generations. No one has all the answers – we make it up as we go.

You know, as an aside and this is directed toward anyone that has “boomer bashed”, if we replaced “boomer” with ethnicity, or physical appearance (weight) or gender and then considered the comments bashing the boomer “group”, I think we might realize that “boomer bashing” is ageist and discriminatory and no better than the logic used by racists.

Laying the blame on any “group” for the troubles of society is a slippery and dangerous slope. Yet, somehow humanity keeps repeating that one with terrible consequences.

Blame fixes nothing. Communication, compassion and empathy could make for a wonderful world.

#173 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.11.09 at 1:58 pm

#169 Bob and Doug …the Canadian Bro’s

You obviously do not get the point. You will pay one way or another if you have to borrow money. In business cash flow is everything. Just ask GM or Chrysler how that works, eh?

It is like leasing only without the end of lease GOTCHA! You are free to unload, upgrade, downgrade, (aka Trade-in) at any time. In the meanwhile you are covered for almost all repairs by the warranty.

The days of Shade Tree Mechanics is OVER! Unless you have all the testing equipment you will still end up paying for the costly repairs. Then what do you have left? A vehicle with little or no value for the next one you will NEED. Besides, I have reached the age I am NOT crawling under a vehicle to repair the bloody thing. Been there and done that for decades.

Remember everyone’s friend Murphy. Things seldom break until the situation if Aw Shit! I consider it preventive maintenance and know it pays to pay for it in smaller sums which puts me ahead of the game.

Therefore, you are paying monthly as you use the vehicle instead of a lump sum and get to use the cash for other things like earning money on your money. Plus you get to use the CCA on your business taxes.

Do as you wish. I shall do the same.

#174 Jeff Smith on 06.11.09 at 4:45 pm

#163 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.11.09 at 8:06 am
I live in Ontario. Where do you live? Some provinces have fair insurance costs, but Ontario is open season on everyone’s wallet. I have a clean record, but the costs increase each year for about the same reasons fuel prices do, i.e., a seagull crapped on an oil rig. Because the bastards can get away with it.

In fact, when we moved last year we got an increase. I asked why and was told ‘You live in a higher risk area based on your postal code.’ BS! I live in a safer area now than before, but the insurance companies have the kiddies at Queen’s Park in their pocket.

Also, having my own business I have to carry $2 million liability coverage.

Again, please share where you live.

*********************************************

Its possible the government has a hidden agenda. Every liter of fuel we buy the government takes a large percentage of that gas tax. Apparently the gas station only makes maybe 5cents to 10cents per liter. I doubt the government would want to change the status quo.
Likewise if the insurance company makes a larger profit, the government will get a larger corporate tax chunk from the insurance company. The end users like pay. Its not much different from GST, Income tax, This fee, that fee.

#175 Barb the proof reader on 06.11.09 at 5:25 pm

#172 Samantha “Laying the blame on any “group” for the troubles of society is a slippery and dangerous slope. Yet, somehow humanity keeps repeating that one with terrible consequences. Blame fixes nothing. Communication, compassion and empathy could make for a wonderful world.”

Samantha, well said. I enjoy your posts.

#176 Samantha on 06.11.09 at 7:45 pm

#175 Barb – Thank you Barb. I enjoy your posts, too.

There is a nice mix of viewpoint, information and ideas here. (Keeps my old Jones generation grey matter going lol)

#177 MenWithHats on 06.11.09 at 10:27 pm

Canada’s adjusted unemployment rate is well above fifteen per cent .
The fat little, melon, bean counters never include those who have given up looking for work and those that have exhausted their EI and our now languishing on social assistance (welfare)

#178 Bill-Muskoka (NAM) on 06.12.09 at 4:40 pm

#174 Jeff Smith

Oh there is no HIDDEN AGENDA. it is right there in our face. We are their piggy bank which is why our’s is usally empty or has just a few pennies. Got to keep their corporate friends happy you know, the ones that finance the Big Parties (of all types).

I do not mind paying taxes, that is part of being a citizen and Canadian. I do mind greed, corruption, and outrageous severance packages like the moron running eHealth got. I also mind the arrogance, unwillingness to listen to the average person, and the ridiculous salaries ‘administrators’ are paid.

I also mind the assinine fees being charged for housing developments, permits, etc.. Theh we have idiocy like the taxpayer founded 407 that sold off by Flatulance (aka Dim Jim) to a private and unregulated corporation. I wonder what his campaign contributions were that little deal?

Brown bags filled with money everywhere!

Our taxes should be for helping US!

#179 Moribund Monty on 06.25.09 at 9:56 am

LIFE’S A BITCH, THEN YOU CROAK

Me and the wife are strugglin along on 55 a year. Luckily the house is paid for and we have some RRSPS that didn’t get hit too bad. We got some xtra coin stashed in the bank but don’t know what to do with it. Our pensions have been keeping up with most of the inflation. Duh wife is goona take her CPP early so we can vacation all winter but Onatario is so cheap with the medical coverage u can’t get out of this horrid climate for longer than 40 days or you loose your medical coverage. I guess we will have to move into the other country which is 40 miles away or buy a cottage up there so we can make PQ our permanent address to qualify for their medical plan.
I drive school bus for beer money and to get up in the morning.

We spent 3 months in FLA this last winter. It wasn’t too bad with the heated pool and gated communityand all. We had 4 bedrooms so we had lots off non paying visitors. Most of em payed our food and done the cooking. The temperatures ran about 80 f every day. We managed to get over to the Barrett-Jackson auction in WestPalm Beach to see how the other half lives. Heh Heh.

I stayed in a FLA hospsital for some tests and they charged OHIP 6,500 clams for a 3 hour stay and some tests. Sure gladd I ain’t an American

Anybody wanna buy a 67 New Yorker? She’s appraised at 12,000—make me an offer.

Like I say, when your a poorstrugglin civil servant retiree LIFE’S A BITCH, THEN YUH CROAK!

Gotta leave now, got to see a sexton about my tomb payments.