The law

Four years ago I offered on a quirky building, saw that offer accepted, then had second (spouse-related) thoughts. “What,” she asked, eyes narrowing, nostrils flaring slightly, “were you possibly thinking?”

I slunk away to close the deal, since backing out was not an option. Reputation matters. The day of closing arrived and my money was sitting in the lawyer’s trust account when the call came. “The other side just contacted our office and indicated they will not have the necessary documentation in place to close today,” Peter said. “They’ve asked for an extension.” Good, I replied. Don’t grant it. We ain’t closing.

Legally, they’d dropped the ball. On the day the owners were obligated to hand over the property and the deed, they did not. I walked. Peter asked for my deposit back. They refused. The other side wouldn’t sign a mutual release, and without that, the listing broker (holding the funds, earmarked to cover the commission) told us to get lost.

It took weeks, money and a litigator to secure the refund. The owners then went on to sue their own lawyer for being such a stumblebum he couldn’t close a simple deal on time, and their new lawyer called me to volunteer as a witness. I laughed.

Buying real estate is not always easy, quick or efficient. Most realtors, who prepare a legally-binding contract called an APS (agreement of purchase & sale) have no legal training and may simply download clauses from the provincial real estate association website. What’s in that doc can be hugely important in the event of any dispute. So, kids, never ever ever ever make an offer (or accept one) without having your legal dude look at it first. Also include a clause giving you the right to secure your guy’s approval on any sign-back.

Be aware, too, of how deposits are handled. In almost all cases where a property is listed on MLS the deposit goes directly to the brokerage employing the listing agent, held in its trust account. The money is not given to the seller, or even the seller’s lawyer – unless specially designated. As shown in my little experience above, without a release signed by both parties in the event the agreement goes south, no funds will be released. So a buyer can walk away from a deal and the seller’s left with nothing but legal bills.

These days that’s happening a lot. People who entered into legally-binding contractual arrangements to buy real estate are turning tail. Yesterday’s post mentioned a few examples, like the new-home buyers in Oakville who want out of deals for $1.5 million houses they bought on spec to be built two years hence. They figured prices would continue to rise, but the opposite happened. The new homes have declined in market value (even before being finished) while their resale homes have also plopped. Now as closing day approaches, they’re moaning, whining, barraging the media, blogging, begging the builder and even telling the government to intervene.

Of course, there’s blog dog Derek. His buyer walked after over-paying in a bidding war, got sued when the house was resold for half a million less, and lost. It was a disastrous strategy, all flowing from the naïve belief he could sign a contract, repudiate it and lose only a deposit. Sadly most people cling to the same myth.

Yesterday half those coming to this pathetic blog to comment called Derek a greedy little weiner for going after the buyer and ultimately costing him hundreds of thousands in damages. This seemed to flow from the underlying sentiment that D ‘had enough’ already, still made a profit on his home and should cut the broken buyer some slack. Others defended our blog dog as a hero of righteousness punishing the stupidity and recklessness of a buyer who bid more than he could afford then tried to weasel out of a deal with zero legal justification.

At odds here are the concepts of legality vs morality. Derek was legally correct. The courts said so. Damages were determined and awarded. A deal’s a deal. Honour it or suffer. But was there a moral case for leniency, letting off the hook a guy who epitomized the behaviour that made real estate unaffordable for most families? Do you turn the other cheek? Weren’t both parties acting in their own self-interest?

Morality is fluid, so we need laws. When a beater house costs a million, involves extreme leverage and takes decades to pay off, the legal system exists to protect both buyer and seller. So if you can’t afford a property, don’t offer. If a bidding war erupts, go home. If you panic later, negotiate, or pray the seller’s lawyer is a doofus.

124 comments ↓

#1 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 5:16 pm

CONFIRMED PINK SNOW.

These guys out in Surrey have had their confirmation hearing and it didn’t go so well.

The details…

13697 Malabar Avenue, Surrey.

Paid 1.32 August 2016

Sold 1.19 March 2018

And so they got more than assessed,but it wasn’t enough to save them after getting ahead of the market in the summer of 2016.

Also could be classified as a sold over asking case even though they took it in the solar plexus.

If we add the difference between the two numbers and then add 5% for expenses and a little bit for opportunities lost ,we arrive at a 17% or roughly a 200k detour on the highway of life.

Don’t drink and drive.

Catch a taxi after trying to drink this one away at the Malabar…

M43BC

Sold on February 12th2018

13697 Malabar Avenue, Surrey paid 1.32 August 2016 ass1.17 asking 1.18

2016-12-15 : $1,459,900
2017-07-08 : $1,350,000
2018-01-02 : $1,188,000

https://www.zolo.ca/white-rock-real-estate/13697-malabar-avenue

https://www.bcassessment.ca/Property/Info/QTAwMDA3NUZNQQ==

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Feel free to make a donation.

Flop For Fox Fund…

http://www.terryfox.org/get-involved/ways-to-give/

#2 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 5:17 pm

Pink Pollen falling in Vancouver.

Good luck to anyone who is going to have any dealings with the person who is selling this place.

It looks like they already have a couple of strikes next to their name.

Strike 1….calls the house”new” even though it is ten years old.

Strike 2…Even after calling the house “new” a quick look at b.c assessment shows the house was actually built in 2008 and not the “new” 2010 as listed.

They got the number of bathrooms and bedrooms correct,so let’s just call that a ball.

Even after you get over the misrepresented details these guys are in serious trouble after listing this place for 2.88 after purchasing this place for 3.33 in March 2017.

The latest assessment is down to 3.47 ,from 3.54

Let’s see what happens.

Will they hit a home run or will it be a swing and a miss…

M43BC

4682 6TH AVE W VANCOUVER paid 3.33 March 2017 ass3.47 asking 2.88

https://www.rew.ca/properties/R2259063/4682-w-6th-avenue-vancouver-bc

https://www.zolo.ca/vancouver-real-estate/4682-west-6th-avenue

https://www.bcassessment.ca/Property/Info/RDAwMDBCQ1EzVg==

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Feel free to make a donation.

Flop For Fox Fund…

http://www.terryfox.org/get-involved/ways-to-give/

#3 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 5:17 pm

Pink Pollen falling in Burnaby.

Featured these guys once before and they really are all over the place.

Just 11 days ago they lowered the asking price to 1.65 ,then apparently after the two business partners had an arm wrestle,the winner jacked the price back up to 1.79.

In the same day.

So as it stands at the moment if they pulled off the Miracle on McKee ,they would settle for a Pink Draw.

The problem with that is no matter how many times they play with the price,for anyone paying attention it is a stale listing of almost one year and there assessment only comes in at 1.51 after basically treading water for the last while.

They need to get out before the next one comes,that is the McKee…

M43BC

6026 McKee st,Burnaby. Paid 1.68 February 2016 ass 1.51 ask 1.79 were asking 1.65

2017-05-16 : $1,968,000
2018-04-18 : $1,795,000
2017-07-17 : $1,938,000
2017-12-29 : $1,886,000
2018-04-09 : $1,658,000

https://www.zolo.ca/burnaby-real-estate/6026-mckee-street

https://www.bcassessment.ca/Property/Info/QTAwMDAzV0YyOA==

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Feel free to make a donation.

Flop For Fox Fund…

http://www.terryfox.org/get-involved/ways-to-give/

#4 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 5:18 pm

Pink Pollen falling in Vancouver.

This one is only really a Possible Pinkie at this stage as they could still make a few percent after expenses if it goes for ask ,but I found enough intriguing details to make me want to follow it to see how it ends.

They have been trying to exit the market since November though.

Besides the possibility of a loss ,another reason why I wanted to show this one as I thought that it encapsulated a bit of the mania that has engulfed the condo market of late.

Check out the recent sales history…

June 2016 699k

July 2017 1.05m

So basically in less than a year someone walked away with a 50% gain before expenses.

Now these guys are looking for their own greater fool ,but won’t make anything near what they might have thought they were originally getting.

Or if it drags on ,then they could already be the greater fool.

All is fair in love and war and speculation…

M43BC

3001 438 Seymour St,Vancouver paid 1.05 June 2017 ass 1.03 asking 1.15

3001 438 Seymour Street, Vancouver

Nov 2:$1,198,000
Apr 18: $1,150,000
Change: – 48000.00 -4%

https://www.zolo.ca/vancouver-real-estate/438-seymour-street/3001

https://www.bcassessment.ca/Property/Info/QTAwMDAwM05LNw==

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Feel free to make a donation.

Flop For Fox Fund…

http://www.terryfox.org/get-involved/ways-to-give/

#5 BlogDog123 on 04.20.18 at 5:31 pm

There’s the opposite scenario of Derek. A hypothetical seller is about to close on selling his property in a hot market. Sees the skyrocketing recent sales and wants to back out to re-list the house before closing date. Hey, I can get $100,000 more, I signed the APS for too little… Let’s re-list it… Return the buyer’s deposit… What could go wrong? Greed can go both ways…

#6 Camille on 04.20.18 at 5:41 pm

Legality versus morality. Whose morality, yours, mine? No there is only the law. Has to be that way. Morality with your money please. Are we confused?

#7 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.20.18 at 5:48 pm

Geez, Flopster.
Have the day off work or just cut out early to enjoy a few wobbly pops?

#8 SunShowers on 04.20.18 at 5:54 pm

“At odds here are the concepts of legality vs morality.”

You would be surprised how many grown adults don’t understand this distinction.

“Morality is fluid”

I disagree with this though. I think that morality is objective and that it’s laws that are fluid. After all, I think we can all agree that slavery was always immoral despite it being legal for most of human history.

Sorry for cluttering your financial blog with philosophy stuff!

#9 mark on 04.20.18 at 5:56 pm

Interesting how some people panic and buy, I’ve always panicked and walked away.

#10 Guy in Calgary on 04.20.18 at 6:05 pm

I have never bought in a bidding war before. Got lucky when we sold our beater in St Catharines we had 5 offers in the first few hours. What fun it was!

Bought the new one with no competition. It was sitting there unloved. Sellers were desperate. Blood was in the water. Got a good deal.

Real Estate is great!

#11 Willy H on 04.20.18 at 6:06 pm

Very interesting closing experience that worked in your favour Garth.

The planets must have been aligned.

Brings to mind our first home purchase in Bramalea some years ago.

Arrived at our lawyer’s office to grab the keys and sign-off on the docs.

My name was misspelt on every single doc and I had to manually correct each one, date and initial!

We were not impressed.

#12 NotLegalAdvice on 04.20.18 at 6:06 pm

I’m surprised you were able to get out of that deal so easily Garth.

Usually, in good faith, you should give the extension and have the party that failure to close on time, pay the penalties involved. The sellers lawyer must have been really incompetent.

What’s legal may not be moral – this is true. I’m still waiting for this decision to be appealed and our buddy D will be shocked at the outcome.

#13 A. Brockman, MA, Licensed under Ontario on 04.20.18 at 6:09 pm

We need Doug Ford to remove the speculator tax in Ontario. House prices need to rise in Toronto. To hell with Wynne’s proposal for affordable housing. We need a leader like Doug Ford to eliminate the bottom feeders, welfare leeches and crippled losers out of our great city of Toronto. Do you see those glass towers in the skies? They’re for winners, not welfare bums!

#14 the ryguy on 04.20.18 at 6:13 pm

Fun little story relating to this concept.

I sold my condo back in 2007, or thought I did anyway. Conditions were removed, inspection done etc etc. But the people wanted to back out as they had found another unit in the building they liked better.

They came to me, said “hey, we already got the countertops measured and weve put a $4k deposit on the granite, if we eat that will you let us out?” The $4k was half the total, I said no, but if you let me pick the granite and pay the remaining $4k we can all walk away.

They agreed, couple weeks later (after the nice new granite was installed of course) I re-listed and got a couple grand more for the place.

#15 Entrepreneur on 04.20.18 at 6:14 pm

So what I got from the above article is a do not buy because most buyers are not smart enough to figure out the contract. Except real estate agents who only want to sell to make their commission. And most places are overpriced to the area. And prices are falling.

Okay, most buyers are naïve and gullible. And the hype from the realtors to “quickly get in” is over. And now the meltdown. A contract is law, to make it orderly.

When it is only one, yes and maybe, but when many more (to change the light from green to red), feels like a trap but all done so legal, you signed on the dotted line.

#16 dosouth on 04.20.18 at 6:14 pm

Well, you can’t vfix stupid so you might as well teach it through the courts, after all that is what they are there for and life is, after all, one big lesson.

As Mr. T said, “Pity the fool (and that’s all, just pity) keep their money.

Derek should be congratulated on teaching a probably younger buyer a life lesson which mommy daddy, mommy/mommy or daddy/daddy just didn’t obviously do.)

#17 604 on 04.20.18 at 6:17 pm

For everyone thinking Vancouver is untouchable, I’ll leave this site to look through and the list is growing daily

http://bcforeclosures.com

#18 John on 04.20.18 at 6:30 pm

Very surprised by the mixed reaction to Derek’s story, obviously some hatred for anyone making money in real estate these days (notion that if you’re successful financially through luck or good timing it is automatically diminished and you owe something to others less fortunate).

As I recall Derek’s buyers asked to be let out of the deal and then went completely quiet, forcing Derek to quickly learn the law, spend his own money on a lawyer without any guarantee of repayment, and mitigate his damages to the best of his ability. Perhaps had the buyers worked directly with the sellers they could have reached an agreement, avoided costs, and found a way to close with a vendor take back or alternative agreement.

There is nothing involving greed here, it’s unfortunate a family is ruined financially but it is through making a bad decision (overpaying for a home you didn’t need) and then burying their head in the sand rather than dealing with it (avoiding the problem instead of finding a solution to it)

Remember that all Derek got was what was originally agreed to, and for that he had to go through considerable stress and uncertainty. Hopefully this story causes less of these issues going forward

#19 Bucky on 04.20.18 at 6:35 pm

For those about to flop…

Good posts, but does it occur to you that for may transactions this may just be the cost of laundering money? Pay X amount of dirty drug money through a numbered company, wait a couple of years to get out of the CRA crosshairs, sell and pocket squeaky-clean money. Rinse and repeat.

Just saying…

#20 Canabian on 04.20.18 at 6:36 pm

It’s ok, Garth. We are getting legal weed and will all become Canabians. No more hate an vitriol on the blog ;)

#21 Nonplused on 04.20.18 at 6:41 pm

Flop,

How did you manage to get 1 through 4 before someone went “FIRST!” Did you prepare them in advance?

#5 BlogDog123

I think the seller you propose would have trouble doing that after he’s signed the agreement. The agreement is binding on both parties. He would have to have a clause in the agreement giving him the ability to revoke the deal before closing, which most buyers would balk at. Who would sign a deal obligating them to buy the house, arrange financing, get a home inspection, hire a lawyer, and do all the other stuff necessary to close while carrying the risk that the seller could just pull the deal if he gets a better offer in the mean time? No sane person would. Although I don’t doubt that there are sellers who would try it but hopefully their lawyer and realtor would explain the situation to them.

What sellers do instead (at least the reasonably smart ones) is they don’t list or they list too high if they think prices are going up. And that of course leads to fewer listing, which leads to higher prices, which leads to a self reinforcing loop until the buyers just simply can’t afford it anymore, which seems to be what’s happening right about now.

#22 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.20.18 at 6:44 pm

@#13 A Brockman

Well.
I see the gasoline has met the flame early this evening.
I’ll just sit back and watch.

#23 Penny Henny on 04.20.18 at 6:53 pm

Of course, there’s blog dog Derek. His buyer walked after over-paying in a bidding war, got sued when the house was resold for half a million less, and lost.

//////////////////

I recall Derek saying that he did not initiate a bidding war. But if you want to split hairs his RE agent did, so is he also guilty by association.
What I mean to say is this. Don’t claim there were no bidding war when there was one.

Sellers don’t start bidding wars. Bidders do that. – Garth

#24 Whatcha Minnie on 04.20.18 at 6:58 pm

Last year, I went to Cartagena with my family – Cartagena is a city in Colombia ). We visited my cousins. I had not met them, so I was really excited to visit them. My first impression of them was very good, they are so friendly and fun. We visited many places but my favorite place was Barú island. The island is amazing, it looks like Paradise, I took a lot of pictures. The food was excellent. We ate shrimp rice and shrimp cocktail. I had a great time with my family. We spent three amazing days in Cartagena.

#25 Mr. White on 04.20.18 at 7:01 pm

I have never brought a property, a business, rented industrial property, or a expensive hunk of machinery, without a “subject to” clause in any agreement purchase. If anything goes south at any time, a subject to is a very nice thing to have.

If sellers are not interested in having an offer that has conditions, I will not buy. I will walk away from many great deals if I don’t have a means of escape if something unforeseen comes along.

Another good idea is to have a guy named Vinnie in the room while the deal is signed. Vinnie should be large, wearing sunglasses, and dressed very well. He says nothing, just stands there and never moves. Vinnie sets a scene that makes people doing deals think twice when they are figuring out how to screw you over.

After many decades in business, I have concluded that everyone you deal with, even your best friend, has little issue throwing you under a bus when real money is involved. So always have a great lawyer, whom you have worked with for a very long time, and a great banker, who can both get you quickly and easily out of the stupid jams that others try to get you into.

#26 Calgary Legal Victim on 04.20.18 at 7:03 pm

I did a deal with my lawyer friend many years ago. Long and the short of it was he would’ve ended up on the losing end, so he asked me to let him off the hook. I did as it didn’t cost me much cash, and I valued our friendship. (I acted morally).

As it turns out, he did some very bad things to me on the way out the door which ended up costing me tens of thousands of dollars (he didn’t act morally, ethically or legally).

I shouldn’t have let him off the hook; I should have had him disbarred. Too late now as statute of limitations have expired, but if I had to do it over again I would have taken his law license (I should have acted legally).

Morals, ethics and legality are all separate animals. The only thing I can tell you from experience is that protecting yourself legally will keep you financially whole. Wrapping yourself in moral or ethical cloth gives you as much protection as soggy TP if someone decides to screw you over.

#27 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 7:09 pm

#7 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.20.18 at 5:48 pm
Geez, Flopster.
Have the day off work or just cut out early to enjoy a few wobbly pops?

////////////////

Hey Crowdie,yes I am posting under the influence.

Of caffeine.

Been having a few medical issues lately and so I haven’t been doing much on the work front.

Learnt a valuable life lesson today.

Never sit at the seat closest to the pick up area in Sbux.

Garth mentioned a Stumblebum in his post ,and I met his close cousin today who dropped his drinks all over the floor and it splashed up on my jacket ,which was draped over the back of the chair as the young pups who work there are yet to take the course of how to turn down the heat.

I was already on my second cup and they served me up a couple more and a small gift card for the inconvenience of moving tables and the sludge on my jacket.

If you have no money ,then he opposite applies and THIS is the seat you should assume as long as you are not black and in Philadelphia.

Anyway four cups of coffee is o.k ,as I saw a study where they recommended no more than this amount.

The fifth cup….that’s the killer…

M43BC

#28 Nonplused on 04.20.18 at 7:11 pm

#8 SunShowers

Both morality and the law are somewhat fluid, the law generally being written and rewritten to reflect the morality of the time. There are many examples of this, slavery being just one. When slavery was legal (in the US, Africa and the Caribbean, don’t think it ever was in Canada), it was not considered immoral at the time. Thinking changed, and thus the law changed.

Divorce is another example. In our more agricultural past divorce for a woman was devastating as she got kicked off the farm and replaced with a newer model. Thus it was highly frowned upon and the Catholic Church outright forbid it for the faithful. Now that everything is dollars and cents and most women have their own jobs off the farm, you can get a no fault divorce initiated by either party for $1000 and a one year separation. Although the Catholic Church still isn’t keen and forces members who wish to remain in good standing to go through an “annulment”, whatever that means. My friend got one and he’s not even catholic and the marriage had obviously been consummated because he had 2 kids. So even the Catholics can be flexible.

Birth control used to be considered immoral until it became apparent that modern medicine was keeping all the babies alive and we were swimming in them, so now many people consider it immoral to have more than 3 kids. The law never did weigh in on this except for example the “one child” policy in China which would be an example of the law attempting to enforce a morality that overpopulation was a bad thing. (Didn’t work though.)

In biblical times it was considered moral and within the law for a man to have 4 wives and marry his fallen brother’s wife but not moral for a woman to have more than one husband, and the biblical law still reflects this. This was considered not only moral but necessary because the men kept killing each other in their bloody tribal wars, so men were always in short supply. However Roman Catholicism phased this law out and introduced the modern “one man, one woman” concept. Lately we’ve gone further and it can be “one man, one woman” or “two men” or “two women” or whatever you get when you use transgender terms but still only two people. Three of whatever they are is simply against the law.

There were no speed limits discussed in the bible and they did not get introduced until cars could actually go fast enough for people to die in an accident. Likewise seat belts were not introduced until cars could go fast enough and now not only is it mandatory for manufacturers to install them but in most places it is also mandatory to wear them even though you are only hurting yourself.

Smoking used to be no big deal because most people died before the cancer got them anyway. Now if you light up a cigar in a bar you get kicked out. Once outside you have to be 5 meters from the door. But VLT’s are still ok, even though they probably do just as much harm. They just don’t give you the cancer.

I could go on and on. The law and morality are both fluid and reflect the times. However one moral and law that seems to have been consistent for a long, long time is that contracts are legally binding. Once you sign, you are both legally and morally bound to the terms. So don’t sign checks you can’t cash.

There are a couple of other morals that don’t seem to have changed, for example theft, murder, and adultery or rape within your own tribe. Other tribes? Go crazy that’s the point. Today that part is also outlawed.

#29 Keith in Rio on 04.20.18 at 7:13 pm

I’ve got no problem crushing someones stones in the mist painful and lasting manner possible. The wailing from all the millenials holding their RE participation trophies is going to keep their parents awake when it happens.

#30 Linda on 04.20.18 at 7:15 pm

As I recall from earlier blog posts, Derek & spouse were selling their home to finance retirement & the buyer who tried to walk was a RE agent & spouse, so absolutely no excuse for ‘not knowing’ the law or what the consequences were if they didn’t honor the contract they entered into of their own free will.

As for greed, pshaw. What about the buyer’s expectation of being able to buy at an inflated price? I’d bet that buyer thought they’d be able to sell for even more than they paid. Ditto the Oakville lot. Like all who take a chance, they boast endlessly about the ‘wins’ & bemoan the injustice of any losses. ‘It isn’t fair’ they cry. These folks are adults, no? Seriously, have none of them any pride? O.K., I get that their hope is to get a price reduction/break/bailout as they go to social media with their tale of woe. But good golly, grow a pair (& yes, that applies to the ladies too).

#31 dakkie on 04.20.18 at 7:17 pm

Congrats! Canadians Just Set a New Record for Borrowing Against their Homes

http://www.investmentwatchblog.com/congrats-canadians-just-set-a-new-record-for-borrowing-against-their-homes/

#32 BillyBob on 04.20.18 at 7:30 pm

Today’s blog is pretty much exactly the mental argument I was running in my head yesterday as I read the comments. Of course “Derek” is legally in the right, and I also agree with the concept of upholding contract law to the highest standard. Otherwise, you just have, well…China.

But the ethical/moral question is stickier. Presented with the same situation, as Derek, I would have done exactly the same: pursued my legal options to the very end. A contract was signed. But given the implications of actually wielding that contract like a club and allowing my legal rights to enable another person to destroy their lives? Well…it would really have a lot to do with how the entire affair was conducted on the other party’s end. If they had been completely honest and transparent and simply admitted they had made a massive mistake and worked with me to find some middle ground, I could work with that. Maybe I’d only make a 5X multiple of tax-free profit instead of 6X. Whatever. But if they had been greedy, shifty, recalcitrant fools, I would be less inclined to cut them any slack.

But simply put, I’d like to think someone who’s been awarded a half million by a judge, on top of other massive, essentially unearned gains due to simple luck and timing, could afford to find some compassion were they to deem it warranted. Only Derek and spouse can determine that, so I absolutely do no judge them knowing the entire story, as I cannot. But sticking it to someone – even an idiot – just because you can, isn’t something to be lauded.

Likewise, suggesting that if something is legal, it’s automatically “all right” is nonsense, and not really a society I would care to live in. We rail at the fact that we’ve turned corporations into people (legally speaking), so why would we applaud turning people into corporations? There are lives behind these contracts, they’re more than just legal entities.

Most of the comments, on either side, seem motivated by plain old envy of ANYONE who has more money than themselves. Sums up the Canadian “lottery ticket” mentality, really.

#33 Wrk.dover on 04.20.18 at 7:34 pm

Whatcha Minnie

——————

Are you a teletubby?

#34 Leo Trollstoy on 04.20.18 at 7:35 pm

#232 SoggyShorts on 04.20.18 at 1:29 pm
I call BS. When was the last time you cut a quarter million dollar check because you felt bad about something that wasn’t your fault?
All these posters saying they would forgive the debt or cut them a deal after a year of legal fees and stress are delusional and or straight up liars.

bingo

#35 Leo Trollstoy on 04.20.18 at 7:37 pm

only poor people use morals to guide them in financial transactions

thats why theyre poor

but they feel good about it

so do i

#36 Desk work on 04.20.18 at 7:52 pm

#13 A. Brockman, MA, Licensed under Ontario on 04.20.18 at 6:09 pm

We need Doug Ford to remove the speculator tax in Ontario. House prices need to rise in Toronto. To hell with Wynne’s proposal for affordable housing. We need a leader like Doug Ford to eliminate the bottom feeders, welfare leeches and crippled losers out of our great city of Toronto. Do you see those glass towers in the skies? They’re for winners, not welfare bums!

—————————————

Dear Mr. Brockman, you can come out from under Mr. Ford’s desk. It’s after 5pm and even you deserve a weekend.

#37 jess on 04.20.18 at 7:59 pm

SEC Charges Additional Defendant in Fraudulent ICO Scheme

..”Text messages among the defendants reveal their fraudulent intent. After receiving a cease-and-desist letter from a major bank directing him to remove any reference to the bank from Centra’s marketing materials, Sharma texted to Farkas and Trapani: “[w]e gotta get that s[***] removed everywhere and blame freelancers lol.” And, while trying to get the CTR Tokens listed on an exchange using phony credentials, Trapani texted Sharma to “cook me up” a false document, prompting Sharma to reply, “Don’t text me that s[***] lol. Delete.”

https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2018-70

#38 Bottoms_Up on 04.20.18 at 8:02 pm

Derek had 29 other buyers in line. There is no moral arguement for not collecting what the 30th buyer agreed to pay.

If anything a moral issue involves the agent that supported that offer.

#39 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.20.18 at 8:08 pm

@#27 Flopster

Damn!.
Unable to drink alcohol? My worst nightmare!
Starbucks eh?
I just cant drink their coffee. Too burnt/bitter for my taste and the endless parade of “frappa lappaccino lowfatmilkmocha” morons endlessly ordering their “special mixture” makes me wanna scream or yell, “Its just a fricken COFFEE fer christsake!”.

Work related injury? Or sick of work?

Either way.
Keep up the good work with your RE info and …hopefully…. you’ll be back on the pizz in no time AND working.

#40 Whatcha gonna do on 04.20.18 at 8:08 pm

Bad boys, whatcha want
Watcha want, whatcha gonna do?
When sheriff John Brown come for you
Tell me whatcha wanna do, whatcha gonna do?

Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?
Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?

When you were eight and you had bad traits
You go to school and learn the golden rule
So why are you acting like a bloody fool?
If you get hot, you must get cool

Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?
Bad boys, bad boys whatcha gonna do?
Whatcha gonna do when they come for you?

#41 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.20.18 at 8:09 pm

@#36 Desk Work

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

#42 For those about to flop... on 04.20.18 at 8:16 pm

#19 Bucky on 04.20.18 at 6:35 pm
For those about to flop…

Good posts, but does it occur to you that for may transactions this may just be the cost of laundering money? Pay X amount of dirty drug money through a numbered company, wait a couple of years to get out of the CRA crosshairs, sell and pocket squeaky-clean money. Rinse and repeat.

Just saying…

//////////////////////////////

Hey Bucky,

I have absolutely no doubt that there is some shady stuff going on in Vancouver real estate.

It was only a couple of weeks ago that I declared on here that I never spend any of my spare time with these people.

I do what I was contracted to do ,and get a payment and stay away from all the extra curricular activities that go on.

As far as washing money goes there are so many people having trouble selling mansions on the Westside,they could only dream of a money launderer pulling up in their driveway.

I was working on a house last year that they wanted $18 million for,yes a few foreigners came around but no offers and no laundry was washed.

You think they prefer to by one bedroom apartments in Maple Ridge?

One of the main problems in Vancouver at the moment is a lot of people in the city refuse to admit that they or Vancouverites in general are part of the problem.

There will always be a bit of international capital flowing in and out of the city ,some just looking for a place to park money in a seemingly safe place, but if a lot of locals hadn’t willingly participated then the cherry on top of outrageous appreciation would have them perhaps looking elsewhere.

A lot of Vancouverites have frosted mirrors and can’t see that they are part of the problem that they complain about.

As far as taking losses on a mass scale and playing around with CRA it’s just not plausible in my opinion.

Some of the investors have done outstandingly well and some of them got caught going back for too many cookies.

A lot of people in this city will hold on and ride it down and possibly after the next provincial election,back up again.

The smart ones evolved as the market evolved.

The current status in Vancouver probably goes something like this…

How do become a millionaire in Vancouver real estate at the moment?

Buy a 1.2 million detached house in East Van.

The other side of the coin is that someone is buying a 1.2 million condo and next year will try and get 1.4 for it.

That’s where the play is at the moment,not taking losses on detached and playing around with the CRA

Vancouverites want the shelter,the appreciation and the perceived social status.

When and if the condo tower topples over then the game goes into overtime.

Foreign investors are a lot more attached to their capital than they are to this city.

Who’s gonna win…

M43BC

#43 Ace Goodheart on 04.20.18 at 8:23 pm

Back in 2012, up at the cottage, drinking what turned out to be too much red wine (it goes down easier up there for some reason).

Purchased a three unit rental building, at the corner of Eglinton and Weston, for the princely sum of $279,000.00. Sight unseen. Was told we couldn’t get into it, as the tenants did not have phones and the folks on the main floor were a little violent and not “people people”.

In a fit of drunken brilliance, which to this date I feel thankful for, I abandoned my usual meek demeanour and demanded that the agent include in the deal “vacant possession” thereby disposessing what would otherwise have been my future tenants from their homes.

Closing date comes around. Yes I had the obligatory “are you nuts” conversation with the wife. Back then I actually was nuts, had an insane desire to fix things, and figured I had fallen in love with my latest “project”.

So we get a call from the lawyer. The seller can’t close. He went to get the tenants out, and despite tricking them into signing some releases (with a bit of cash as an enticement) he could not get them to leave. It’s off to the rental housing tribunal. Do you want to just take the building with the tenants still there?

I said no. I didn’t actually want to take the building at all. So we extended the close date. Owner went to the tribunal, kicked out the tenants, they still wouldn’t leave, he brought the police in, they actually removed them and then we set a new closing date.

So we closed about four months’ late, with a bin in the back full of the tenants’ stuff that they left behind after the police took them away. They basically destroyed the place. First time I had seen the inside.

Roaches. Never, ever seen so many. Beside the destroyed, broken sink and toilet, the smashed kitchen cupboards, the broken windows. They were literally crawling up the walls. Mice running on the floors freely, like some kind of mousecapade.

Spent two years fixing that dump. Did it all myself other than the attic insulation. Replaced the front second storey windows during a wind storm that nearly knocked the ladder over and tossed me into the street. We rebuilt the place, by hand, into a very sweet little three unit rental, spanking new, for the sum of $22,000.00.

Rented it out. We have the same main floor and upstairs tenants. Basement is always changing.

Current value of the building? Around 800K. Once the new subway opens down the street, probably over a mil.

Worst mistake I ever made.

Best real estate play in my life, hands down.

#44 Long-Time Lurker on 04.20.18 at 8:24 pm

Didn’t The Technical Analyst mention that some big correction was going to come in May? Now the U.S. T-Bill yield curve is flattening –as Tony has mentioned. Maybe things will get interesting in the U.S. next week.

What’s Wells Fargo’s (a big U.S. bank) $1 billion dollar fine going to do to their shareholders’ or customers’ confidence?

Things that make you go: Hmm?

#45 What can I say on 04.20.18 at 8:37 pm

Vancouver will be fine long-term. In just a few short years people will be wishing they’d bought as much RE as they could in 2018. Why do I say this? Because I’m very confident that money (dirty foreign money) will continue to flow in Vancouver RE. There is so much dirty foreign money that has to be laundered somewhere and Vancouver RE is one of the nest ways. The Feds have ensured that it is. Their laws make it easy.

#46 jess on 04.20.18 at 8:41 pm

omg ..”Everyone is a spidergram now.”

https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2018-palantir-peter-thiel/

#47 Balmuto on 04.20.18 at 8:54 pm

Trump’s scaring away tech talent so they’re coming to Canada where tech is booming:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-04-20/h-1b-workers-are-leaving-trump-s-america-for-the-canadian-dream

It’s a good thing, we need the talent to meet the demand. We also need new office space, good thing some relief is on the way:

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-04-20/allied-eyes-10-year-bond-to-fund-office-push-for-toronto-tech

#48 mathman on 04.20.18 at 8:55 pm

Shocked that so many are questioning a person who accepted an offer in good faith, one made under no duress and a free decision

buyers have every right to write in conditions and make conditional offers. This buyer made the concious choice to not do that. The fact that they have children is irrelevant to the matter at hand which is the fact that they violated the contract.

The participation ribbon cohort on this blog clearly sees things differently. Think critically, ignore the $ and the extraneous facts – one party is in the wrong here and it is not D.

Math

#49 Ian on 04.20.18 at 9:02 pm

Get used to what you saw today folks…US stock AND bond market both falling.

Plenty more to come!

#50 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:05 pm

Ali # 256,

“Blacksheep, you just made a “new normal” argument.

That’s an automatic FAIL.”
——————————–
Generic statement….bla, bla, bla.

How bout digging down a little and please explain where my rational is flawed?

#51 common sense on 04.20.18 at 9:16 pm

Here is a great example of a lawyer being out to lunch and not doing their job south of Buffalo, NY a few years back…..

Gentleman builds a golf course and develops the membership over 10 years then sells it.

All well til he builds a new course directly across the street from the exisiting course, taking the original members over to the new course and puts the new owners of his old course out of business in 5 years….

Nice job by the lawyer not doing due diligence and putting a non compete clause in the original contract.

#52 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:21 pm

Stan the festering # 247,248,

“You post overall is exceptionally stupid so I will only address some key points:”
————————————————–
Wow Stan, you must have REALLLLY f-ed up financially to be so angry at a complete stranger simply because their view, challenges your own and makes you think.

Re read my post, the only things you said that were accurate, were the things I said, that you parroted back to me. I’m ten years ahead of you son, having already journeyed through and grown out of, the whole ‘Doomer thing’. Search G.F. circa 2009 forward and you will find many posts, not that unlike your own.

Naive, I know…

But I would like to think, I was a lot less pissy about it.
————————————————–
Stan’s confused beliefs, from just a single post:

Credit, doesn’t create money (only Gold bullion?)

Hyper inflation’s going to crush us all financially!

Rates must rise to stop inflation! (Forget wage pressures)

Real estate should be 3-X times Stan’s income, so he can buy a house.

Real estate must and will return to the mean.

Financial collapse, is just over the horizon.

Your an f-ing idiot, if you don’t see things, the way I do.
—————————————————
I have clearly over estimated your insights.

Don’t worry, one day you’ll figure out what’s really going on : )

#53 Mark on 04.20.18 at 9:22 pm

“Trump’s scaring away tech talent so they’re coming to Canada where tech is booming:”

Wishful thinking, but there is no ‘tech boom’ in Canada, and no significant hiring in Canada. Canada is, and probably will remain a tech wasteland so long as there is almost no availability of capital to Canadian tech companies and startups.

Trump isn’t scaring away tech talent either. That’s a complete concoction. There’s enormous amounts of untapped tech talent in the United States which has been excluded from the sector due to ongoing and prolific abuses of immigration policy.

#54 Bezengy on 04.20.18 at 9:51 pm

I was 16 when Dad sold the family cottage. Apparently he thought it was his decision alone with Mom, and I didn’t really have a “veto” I could exercise. (I was the only kid who used the thing cause I’m a cottage type of guy). Betrayed once again by parents who didn’t put me first, I committed to buy the first cottage I could afford with my first paycheck, and I did, but it wasn’t easy.
The cottage I bought was listed for 12k, I paid 14K, 15% interest rate, because [email protected] was sincerely trying to help me, and I remember the phone call from the seller’s lawyer telling me to find a new lawyer or else the deal would not close.
To this day I thank my lucky stars I got screwed by everyone involved in helping me out with my first real estate transaction. Fool me once…you know the rest.

#55 Tony on 04.20.18 at 10:23 pm

Re: #13 A. Brockman, MA, Licensed under Ontario on

We need Doug Ford to increase the speculator tax in the GTA.

#56 tccontrarian on 04.20.18 at 10:27 pm

How does it go again?

“Possession is 9/10ths of the Law”.

Most certainly law is ‘fluid’ and tends to play catch-up with the morals of the time – otherwise we’d still have “the rule of thumb”!
For those that don’t know, it was legal for a man to beat his wife with a stick, as long as it wasn’t thicker than his thumb.

Ahh, the good-ol’ days… :)

TCC

#57 TurnerNation on 04.20.18 at 10:34 pm

Crapto currencies continuing their explosion this week.
A bit of DCA and my sht account now is back to breakeven. ($500 is all I’ll risk on this)

#58 Tony on 04.20.18 at 10:34 pm

Re: #49 Ian on 04.20.18 at 9:02 pm

Short the market at your own peril in the month of May.

#59 Mark Baum on 04.20.18 at 10:38 pm

https://www.thestar.com/business/2018/04/19/threat-of-condo-cancellations-looms-over-pricey-toronto-housing-market.html

-Condo prices have increased about 20 per cent since February of last year, according to the Canadian Real Estate Association

-Since the start of last year, 17 projects, with 3,627 units, have been cancelled in the region

-That’s up from seven projects, with 808 units in 2016

-This month alone, Liberty Development Corp. pulled the plug on a three-tower, sold-out condo development, citing problems with construction financing. Liberty didn’t respond to an email seeking comment

*****

Can someone further explain this? It doesn’t seem to add up….

#60 morality on 04.20.18 at 10:50 pm

I can’t believe you asked about the morality of leniency for the buyer.

For the last 10 years, for every house someone “won”, there were probably 9 more who “lost”.

So for the last 10 years, people who bought beyond their means pushed the other potential buyers aside, they increased demand, and increased costs for everyone.

Those who played it safe, those who didn’t over leverage, those who shunned risk, ultimately lost out the most as they were priced out of the market.

So for all those renting and hoping to buy, we relish in prices going down. How about those morals and fairness?

Let’s not socialize the losses.

#61 Mark Baum on 04.20.18 at 11:00 pm

To further expand on my previous post (post #57): They fully sold out the condo, the underlying asset has risen in value by 20%, yet now they cannot finance the project?

#62 concerned1 on 04.20.18 at 11:12 pm

My neighbor is a bit of an idiot, but he told me one important thing. He said “When you die, people will only remember one thing about you, they will either say you were a “good” person or a “bad” person, nothing else. People don’t remember details. They will either remember you as “good” or “bad” that’s it!”

How do you think Derek will be remembered by generations of people on the other side of his deal? You might get money Derek, but you don’t get an unconditional pass in this universe for eviscerating a man and his family.

#63 waiting on the westcoast on 04.20.18 at 11:14 pm

29 Keith in Rio on 04.20.18 at 7:13 pm says… “I’ve got no problem crushing someones stones in the mist painful and lasting manner possible. The wailing from all the millenials holding their RE participation trophies is going to keep their parents awake when it happens.”

While evil in tone, I greatly agree… Lol. What I find strange about all of the moralizing is that many feel that Derek has an obligation to prevent the Buyers from harm.

So when a company / store has a sale to get rid of excess inventory, you should pay full price because you shouldn’t take advantage of their poor judgement of the retail market… Lol… Refund all those same “sale” prices for your phones, laptops, Lululemon pants, etc…

#64 AACI Homedog on 04.20.18 at 11:19 pm

That lawyer had the nerve to ask you to bear witness against yourself ? Crazy.

#65 waiting on the westcoast on 04.20.18 at 11:20 pm

#61 Mark Baum on 04.20.18 at 11:00 pm says… “To further expand on my previous post (post #57): They fully sold out the condo, the underlying asset has risen in value by 20%, yet now they cannot finance the project?”

Pure speculation on my part but I would assume either the company has a bad history or that lenders are beginning to worry about future demand for the project and are not willing to lend or only lend at a higher rate than the company desires…

#66 Reynolds531 on 04.20.18 at 11:40 pm

The ex says today she’s spending $750k on a new build closing end of September. Her house worth half that isn’t listed yet.

Does it make me a bad guy for hoping the market and rates crush her?

#67 the ryguy on 04.21.18 at 12:05 am

#47 Balmuto on 04.20.18 at 8:54 pm
——————————————-

Special kind of stupid right here. Reads an article…”oh wow, must be true”. Moron.

H1B Visas are a total crock of sh*t. They do not exist for the “best and brightest”, they exist from big tech companies bringing in foreigners that will do the coding for cheaper than the natives. PERIOD.

Just do a little research Balmuto. I know its hard, but give it a try. See how the “best and brightest” get treated once they are in the USA.

#68 Balmuto on 04.21.18 at 12:20 am

Canada is, and probably will remain a tech wasteland so long as there is almost no availability of capital to Canadian tech companies and startups.

You know something these guys don’t?

“Allied Properties Real Estate Investment Trust is planning to spend about C$1 billion ($790 million) over the next five years to meet the frenzied demand for offices by tech workers in Canada’s biggest city.”

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2018-04-20/allied-eyes-10-year-bond-to-fund-office-push-for-toronto-tech

#69 Leo Trollstroy on 04.21.18 at 12:22 am

tech is booming in Toronto as Americans land gigs up here

No wonder condo prices are booming

#70 Stan Brooks on 04.21.18 at 12:33 am

#52 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:21 pm

Pretty much,

1. There are better ways to invest your money than buying a shack in Scarborough for 1.3 mil. that could not sell for 300 k 12 years ago.

2. Investing requires money. If you have none, you go with the flow, leverage on real estate and get crushed when it inevitably corrects.

3. With your arguments you can justify pretty much any prices.

4. savings are money and stimulate investment. credit stimulates consumption, inflation.

5. Don;t worry about Stan’s income, it is higher than yours.

Chilax.

#71 Stan Brooks on 04.21.18 at 12:36 am

#59 Mark Baum on 04.20.18 at 10:38 pm
https://www.thestar.com/business/2018/04/19/threat-of-condo-cancellations-looms-over-pricey-toronto-housing-market.html

-Condo prices have increased about 20 per cent since February of last year, according to the Canadian Real Estate Association

-Since the start of last year, 17 projects, with 3,627 units, have been cancelled in the region

-That’s up from seven projects, with 808 units in 2016

-This month alone, Liberty Development Corp. pulled the plug on a three-tower, sold-out condo development, citing problems with construction financing. Liberty didn’t respond to an email seeking comment

*****

Can someone further explain this? It doesn’t seem to add up….

=====================

It is simple.

Builders build with loans from the bank and a business plan.

Now it appears that when houses dive by the time condos are built, there will be no buyers.

So builder cancels.

Why would you cancel a project if you expect higher prices and profit?

#72 Smoking Man on 04.21.18 at 1:22 am

None of you bastards see it.

Me in the fleash. Last Sunday in may at garths general store. High noon. Me and Jonney boy going to dance.

The young Italian stallion vs the old drunk bastard with crippling arthritis. I’m going to kick his ass.

#73 Smoking Man on 04.21.18 at 1:39 am

It’s still happy 420 where I’m at. Wisdom.

https://youtu.be/WOs3uIEyHaY

#74 AGuyInVancouver on 04.21.18 at 1:39 am

#53 Mark on 04.20.18 at 9:22 pm
“Trump’s scaring away tech talent so they’re coming to Canada where tech is booming:”

Wishful thinking, but there is no ‘tech boom’ in Canada, and no significant hiring in Canada. Canada is, and probably will remain a tech wasteland so long as there is almost no availability of capital to Canadian tech companies and startups.

Trump isn’t scaring away tech talent either. That’s a complete concoction. There’s enormous amounts of untapped tech talent in the United States which has been excluded from the sector due to ongoing and prolific abuses of immigration policy.
_ _ _
Gee, that’s funny Mark. Amazon is looking at taking over the old Canada Post Office building in downtown Vancouver because demand is so high, and not as a fulfillment centre.

You seem to live in some delusional world where tech in Canada is dying and house prices peaked in 2013.

#75 Smoking Man on 04.21.18 at 1:48 am

Message to Canada.

https://youtu.be/wJVpihgwE18

#76 SoggyShorts on 04.21.18 at 2:11 am

#54 Bezengy on 04.20.18 at 9:51 pm
I was 16 when Dad sold the family cottage. Apparently he thought it was his decision alone with Mom, and I didn’t really have a “veto” I could exercise. (I was the only kid who used the thing cause I’m a cottage type of guy). Betrayed once again by parents who didn’t put me first, I committed to buy the first cottage I could afford with my first paycheck, and I did, but it wasn’t easy.
*****************************
I’m sorry, what?! Your parents, who bought and paid for a cottage, sold it without consulting their kid?
Betrayal indeed!
I know that 16 year-olds across the globe all get not only a vote, but a veto on financial decisions in their family.
This is outrageous! Your parents should have been tried for treason!

#77 boomorbust on 04.21.18 at 3:11 am

#25 Mr. White

So true, very good advice you’ve given.

#78 Hamsterwheelie on 04.21.18 at 6:52 am

When we sold our home it was to finance another – that we were halfway through. If that buyer had backed out, after others had been told the house was sold, people would have assumed something was wrong during the inspection, offered less & we would have been in a very tight spot – our figures are 1/5th of Dereks. Would people have sympathized with us? Our home was only selling for $400 000 but we were still making a $240 000 gain in 6 years, so maybe folks would still think thats too much. Garth is totally correct – morals are fluid, the law is there to define things like contracts. Thank your lucky stars your income, lifestyle, and choices aren’t decided by other peoples swingin moral pendulum, what a horrible world it would (go back several thousand years) be.

#79 Stone on 04.21.18 at 7:27 am

#62 concerned1 on 04.20.18 at 11:12 pm
My neighbor is a bit of an idiot, but he told me one important thing. He said “When you die, people will only remember one thing about you, they will either say you were a “good” person or a “bad” person, nothing else. People don’t remember details. They will either remember you as “good” or “bad” that’s it!”

How do you think Derek will be remembered by generations of people on the other side of his deal? You might get money Derek, but you don’t get an unconditional pass in this universe for eviscerating a man and his family.

———

When you die, people will forget about you. Period! And anyways, you’re dead. What should you care even if you could? Dust to dust.

Here’s something new to learn – “Stupidity must be punished”. No exceptions.

#80 Hawk on 04.21.18 at 7:45 am

The people who were filled with criticism and hate for “Derek” are just dishonest people, plain and simple.

If on closure, the market price of the house had increased in value, the same people would be congratulating the new buyer and thinking what a sucker Derek was to have sold.

Derek was a lucky man though to have got the market timing pretty darned exact.

#81 Run, you have time on 04.21.18 at 7:56 am

#72 Smoking Man on 04.21.18 at 1:22 am
None of you bastards see it.

Me in the fleash. Last Sunday in may at garths general store. High noon. Me and Jonney boy going to dance.

The young Italian stallion vs the old drunk bastard with crippling arthritis. I’m going to kick his ass.

*******
RUN GARTH RUN. SEND YOUR GENERAL STORE COLLEAUGES HOME!

#82 Wrk.dover on 04.21.18 at 8:27 am

After you die, and the last person that remembered you eventually dies, did you really live at all?

It’s today today, go for real life.

Leave the phone at home!

#83 dharma bum on 04.21.18 at 8:46 am

The LAW.

“At odds here are the concepts of legality vs morality.”

The law says one thing, but people “feel” that they can do another:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynkZ9O1D4jY

#84 TnT on 04.21.18 at 9:01 am

#62 concerned1 on 04.20.18 at 11:12 pm

My neighbor is a bit of an idiot, but he told me one important thing. He said “When you die, people will only remember one thing about you, they will either say you were a “good” person or a “bad” person, nothing else. People don’t remember details. They will either remember you as “good” or “bad” that’s it!”

How do you think Derek will be remembered by generations of people on the other side of his deal? You might get money Derek, but you don’t get an unconditional pass in this universe for eviscerating a man and his family.

********

First: Your neighbor is an idiot?

Second: What universe do you live in where a guy like Derek should forfeit $500,000.00 owed to him?

Derek earned that money selling his House. Had it been GOLD Bars or Paintings or Classic Cars it does not matter.

Derek put an object up for sale and The Mortgage Broker BUYERS signed a contract for $2.25 Million.

Then The Mortgage Broker BUYERS tried to cheat Derek of his earned money.

Then The Mortgage Broker BUYERS ran and hid.

Then The LAW corrected the CHEAT that The Mortgage Broker BUYERS tried to put on Derek.

How do you think THE BUYERS will be remembered by generations of people on THE BUYERS side of his deal?

I’d like to ask your neighbor who’s the idiot?

#85 Ace Goodheart on 04.21.18 at 9:05 am

RE: #62 concerned1 on 04.20.18 at 11:12 pm

“How do you think Derek will be remembered by generations of people on the other side of his deal? You might get money Derek, but you don’t get an unconditional pass in this universe for eviscerating a man and his family.”

Still think he should have just closed the purchase. He would at least have had a house. Yeah, lots of debt too, but walking away was his own dumb idea.

“Derek” will be remembered as a person of his word. The buyer of his house will be remembered as a flake with no reputation, not to be trusted in business deals.

You know the old adage, do not mix business with pleasure. A deal is a deal. Keep the emotion and the feelings out of it.

Business is business.

#86 NoName on 04.21.18 at 9:32 am

#67 the ryguy on 04.21.18 at 12:05 am

Best and brightest…

Funny when that article showed in my feed, first thing came to my mind was why would someone take paycut… Than it hit me, if they are coming here it must be because lack of competition, hi paying job s are already taken.
CANADA
https://www.payscale.com/research/CA/Job=Software_Engineer/Salary
US
https://www.payscale.com/research/US/Job=Software_Engineer/Salary

When you add exchange rate and cost of living in Canada there are planty software companies in us in “cheaper” places comparing it to valley vs YYZ or YVR. Montreal is probably only place in canada to live and work. This pumping to or va as Canadian software “meca” is beyond funny…

#87 50 YEARS OF MAPLE LEAF INCOMPETENCE! on 04.21.18 at 9:34 am

Hey, Toronto Leaf Fans!!

Your team is going to get DESTROYED again tonight!!!

Bwahaaahaaahaaaahaaaahhaaaaaa!!!!

But why not just spend a fortune on tickets for game 6 anyway, LOL !?!

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/star-columnists/2018/04/11/maple-leafs-ticket-prices-would-be-easier-to-take-if-the-atmosphere-wasnt-so-dull.html

Buy from a scalper speculator, forget about asking for a refund when they lose tonight :)

Just like signing a house deal with no conditions, eh! :)

Toronto Leaf fans are just as moronic as all the idiots buying slanty semis there in bidding wars!

What a pathetic, fifth-rate city of LOSERS Toronto is!!!

Your hockey team, your houses, your city SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!

#88 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 9:38 am

#14 the ryguy on 04.20.18 at 6:13 pm
Fun little story relating to this concept.

I sold my condo back in 2007, or thought I did anyway. Conditions were removed, inspection done etc etc. But the people wanted to back out as they had found another unit in the building they liked better.

They came to me, said “hey, we already got the countertops measured and weve put a $4k deposit on the granite, if we eat that will you let us out?” The $4k was half the total, I said no, but if you let me pick the granite and pay the remaining $4k we can all walk away.
//////////////

Total $8,000 spent on granite! Wow!
I just had nice custom granite countertops installed for $80/sq ft.
$8,000 bucks, that is a lot of countertop.

#89 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 9:45 am

#23 Penny Henny on 04.20.18 at 6:53 pm
Of course, there’s blog dog Derek. His buyer walked after over-paying in a bidding war, got sued when the house was resold for half a million less, and lost.

//////////////////

I recall Derek saying that he did not initiate a bidding war. But if you want to split hairs his RE agent did, so is he also guilty by association.
What I mean to say is this. Don’t claim there were no bidding war when there was one.

Sellers don’t start bidding wars. Bidders do that. – Garth
//////////////////////

From what I read in one of the newspaper articles is that three bids came in on the property and instead of selecting the highest offer they were sent back to see if they wished to improve on their offer.
So to say they played no part in instigating a bidding war is not really genuine.

#90 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 9:46 am

if, of course, we can rely on the info from the article

#91 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 10:06 am

#52 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:21 pm
Stan the festering # 247,248,

/////////////////////

It happens to a lot of men when they approach 50.
They become angry. Angry at everything.
I just scroll by Stan Brooks now.
Imagine being Stan and coming back to this blog day after day only to piss and moan. That can’t be good for anyone’s mental health.

#92 Westcdn on 04.21.18 at 10:12 am

One of the weird things in my life. – animals seem to like me. I used to call my cat ugly and stupid. She had a mean streak. I saw her chasing down skunks. Christ… I would admonisher her. She would cock her little head and meow. She was a good mouser and actually smart. She died in my arms after a 22 year haul.

My dog was a stray and vicious. I befriended him and I would search through garbage to feed him – I called him Rex. My father would not allow him on our property but somewhat relented on my friendship and allowed me to give him better food. That dog protected me but people were afraid of him. My father got fired because he beat the snot out of his boss. We had to leave and my father arranged to have Rex shot. The job was butchered. Rex ran to me but I could see the wound was mortal. I looked at my father and he did what had to be done.

I can fill a book about the stories about the stories my parents told me and what they did. One of my favorite was how my father got piles.

The cat and dog were always happy to see me. They live in my mind. Hey, did you know that live spelled backwards is evil. I just grow plants now and take care of the hares (rabbits) that haunt my yard. The annoying thing is they like to dig small pits to hunker down.

#93 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.21.18 at 10:17 am

@#61 Concerned #1 pouter
“but you don’t get an unconditional pass in this universe for eviscerating a man and his family.’
+++++
Thanks for the laugh

Reminds me of a new neighbor I had years ago.
An accountant from Hong Kong.
He was just divorced and had bought the house next to us. Got his 6 year old daughter on weekends.
So anyway, I’m out cutting the grass and he comes over ( with his cute kid hanging off his leg).
He askes me,” Do you know anything about Life Insurance? My ex wife wants me to buy some for my daughters benefit in case I die.” ( his daughter was still hanging off dad’s leg beaming up at him , oblivious to the subject of the conversation).
“Well, I guess if you die your Life Insurance will make sure the child is financially stable moving into the future without any worries”, was my reply.
He looked at me kind of confused and smiling said, ” But I’m dead! I wont know anything! I wont care. I’m dead”.
“Uhhhh, yeah, I guess.” , I said looking sideways at the poor daughter clinging happily to a father that was willing to send her to financial purgatory, ” But dont you want to make sure she’s safe and happy?”

“But I’m dead. It wont matter what I think. I’m dead”

Cant argue with that logic.

So Concerned 1 some people just dont care what other people think of them after their dead…..because……. they’re dead.

#94 Bibi on 04.21.18 at 10:21 am

#52 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:21 pm

Thank you for your wise words. Now we know that it really is different this time and here.

#95 Raging Ranter on 04.21.18 at 10:30 am

@ Mark Baum, the cynic in me says the condo builders have seen that prices have gone up 30% since they pre-sold the units, so they feign “escalating construction costs” and “can’t get financing” in order to cancel the project, then start all over again. If they can pre-sell 70% of the units at 30% higher than they did two years ago, why wouldn’t they? The strategy is fraught with risk, but risk is what people do in a stupid market that goes up every single year seemingly forever.

Another possibility is that credit is tightening a lot more than is being let on, and they really are having difficulty financing. On the one hand, in a project with 70% pre-sold units, the “we suddenly can’t get financing” argument seems a bit specious. On the other hand, the lenders might be concerned that a lot of the depositors will no longer qualify under B20, and they might be worried that the builder is going to have to pursue a lot of deadbeat buyers in court like Derek did.

Disclaimer: All that is just speculation on my part. I have zero experience with the building industry and no clue what goes on behind doors when decisions are made.

#96 Jay Stephens on 04.21.18 at 10:40 am

College Made Me A Conservative

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/09/20/jay_stephens_college_made_me_a_conservative__prager_u.html

#97 maxx on 04.21.18 at 10:42 am

#16 dosouth on 04.20.18 at 6:14 pm

“…..Derek should be congratulated on teaching a probably younger buyer a life lesson which mommy daddy, mommy/mommy or daddy/daddy just didn’t obviously do.)”

That life lesson could buy a couple of medical degrees………..at least.

There is little that’s stickier than prices when Mr. re market is on his way down and that’s a signed promise to purchase.

There was a time not long ago, when re was “blistering” and a buyer would have a half-decent chance of getting away with cold feet.

Not now. Sign that purchase agreement and you are tethered without consideration.

None whatsoever.

#98 Gravy Train on 04.21.18 at 10:43 am

Here’s some advice a lawyer gave me last Feb. when I was considering buying property (not a complete list):
• Don’t sign anything without a lawyer reviewing it first.
• Head all correspondence with sellers or their agents with the words
subject to contract.
• Don’t pay any money to anyone unless and until your lawyer advises it.
• Insist that
subject to clauses be used in contracts to protect yourself from unexpected adverse events.

Garth, I’m no lawyer, but is Derek’s contract not legally binding if the defence can prove that the buyers did not have mental capacity? :)

#99 Reynolds531 on 04.21.18 at 10:49 am

Whether Derek was a good guy and will be judged or remembered as a good guy has nothing to do with that deal. The man has fifty years of actions that we know nothing about. Those will decide his fate.

Incidentally I used to work for a pension trustee. Some of our clients were churches, charitites, hospital foundations etc. All of them were vicious! Looking for everything they were entitled to, 100% of the time.

#100 Smoking Man on 04.21.18 at 10:54 am

The night.

Another baradge of drunken self destructive truths posted on LinkedIn .

The morning.
A race to delete them before anyone sees them.

The paronoia.
Did I delete them all?

My life can get complicated at times.

#101 Shawn Allen on 04.21.18 at 10:57 am

Buying on Speculation Has Been Dangerous and Common for at least centuries

“like the new-home buyers in Oakville who want out of deals for $1.5 million houses they bought on spec to be built two years hence. They figured prices would continue to rise, but the opposite happened.”

**************************************
Preparing for a visit to Amsterdam and a tour (Friday) of the world’s first stock exchange I read about the Dutch East Indian Company which IPO’ed – well before the term was invented – via subscription receipts in 1602.

By the 1630’s it was common to buy shares in the Dutch East India company by means of a forward contract -where you agreed to take delivery of the shares some time in the future – no money down if your reputation was good. The hope was often that the price would rise and you would sell when the “closing” date arrived for a profit. A number of wealthy people started making very heavy bets on speculation.

Soon, a number of people bankrupted themselves and some high-tailed it out of the City to escape the law. Other cases were litigated. Some people got out of the contract on technicalities. (Naked short selling was technically illegal but often practiced) All of this in the 1600’s and not much has changed.

Then, as now, it was important to hold people to the contracts they had made. Commerce would otherwise grind to a halt.

#102 Another Deckchair on 04.21.18 at 11:00 am

Laws and rules, vs. what you think is morally right.

Laws and are and there for a reason.

Forget Real estate.

Say you are flying your little airplane (Cessna or whatever) and you are going slower than the minimum airspeed, and the wings stall.

A little “woops – I didn’t mean it” is maybe ok; you broke the minimum airspeed rule, and the law of gravity takes over. So, you push the stick forward, undo the airspeed issue by “spending” some of YOUR energy (height) to recover.

If you don’t have sufficient height (energy), you are in BIG trouble.

Who do we blame now? Mother nature? God? YOU broke the rules, YOU broke the laws of nature, and now what happens? Maybe you didn’t really think things through, and, gosh, you made a mistake. Who pays??

How is this different than Derek’s case?

#103 Heloguy on 04.21.18 at 11:03 am

#66 Reynolds531 on 04.20.18 at 11:40 pm
The ex says today she’s spending $750k on a new build closing end of September. Her house worth half that isn’t listed yet.

Does it make me a bad guy for hoping the market and rates crush her?

Yes it does, but she is your ex for a reason.

If you tell her its a bad idea but she does it anyway and she gets crushed, then you have done your due diligence and then you can gloat.

#104 Fish on 04.21.18 at 11:14 am

@92

#92 Westcdn on 04.21.18 at 10:12 am
One of the weird things in my life. – animals seem to like me. I used to call my cat ugly and stupid. She had a mean streak. I saw her chasing down skunks. Christ… I would admonisher her. She would cock her little head and meow. She was a good mouser and actually smart. She died in my arms after a 22 year haul.

My dog was a stray and vicious. I befriended him and I would search through garbage to feed him – I called him Rex. My father would not allow him on our property but somewhat relented on my friendship and allowed me to give him better food. That dog protected me but people were afraid of him. My father got fired because he beat the snot out of his boss. We had to leave and my father arranged to have Rex shot. The job was butchered. Rex ran to me but I could see the wound was mortal. I looked at my father and he did what had to be done.

I can fill a book about the stories about the stories my parents told me and what they did. One of my favorite was how my father got piles.

The cat and dog were always happy to see me. They live in my mind. Hey, did you know that live spelled backwards is evil. I just grow plants now and take care of the hares (rabbits) that haunt my yard. The annoying thing is they like to dig small pits to hunker down.

****

Very informative and interesting, wow!

#105 Bibi on 04.21.18 at 11:29 am

#43 Ace Goodheart on 04.20.18 at 8:23 pm

I think Ace Goodheart, Leo Troolstoy, Blacksheep and Penny Henny should have their own blog to tell us more of their fascinating life stories. Joking man is nothing compared to you guys!

#106 Shawn Allen on 04.21.18 at 11:35 am

Yes, OPEC colludes to push up oil prices

Trump has come out and accused OPEC of artificially inflating oil prices. In fact he is 100% correct on that. The North American financial press seems to have forgotten a long time ago that OPEC exists to collude and push up oil prices. Back in the 1970’s most Canadians, as I recall, shook our fists at the evil OPEC as it caused oil and therefore gasoline and home heating fuel to soar. Perhaps Albertan cheered from the outset (Until Pierre Trudeau canceled the party with the National Energy Program). I realize that many or most Albertans and investors (I am now both) benefit nicely from high oil prices. But I am also honest enough to see that the benefit comes partly or perhaps greatly from OPEC which is engaging in collusion that in North America would, I believe, be illegal. Alberta would never admit it, but OPEC has been the greatest of friends to Alberta.

#107 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.21.18 at 11:41 am

@#87 50 years of Maple Leaf…
“What a pathetic, fifth-rate city of LOSERS Toronto is!!!
Your hockey team, your houses, your city SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!”
++++++

You must really hate visiting the Hockey Hall of Fame in downtown Toronto…….

#108 Mark Baum on 04.21.18 at 11:53 am

#71 Stan Brooks on 04.21.18 at 12:36 am
——

Thanks Stan, I’ll agree with you seems like a canary in the coal mine for condos.

#109 crowdedelevatorfartz on 04.21.18 at 11:56 am

@#92 WestCdn
“One of the weird things in my life. – animals seem to like me.”
++++++

Thats the only weird thing in your life?

#110 Dead Cat Bounce on 04.21.18 at 12:35 pm

#87 50 YEARS OF MAPLE LEAF INCOMPETENCE! on 04.21.18 at 9:34 am
Hey, Toronto Leaf Fans!!

Your team is going to get DESTROYED again tonight!!!

Bwahaaahaaahaaaahaaaahhaaaaaa!!!!

But why not just spend a fortune on tickets for game 6 anyway, LOL !?!

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/star-columnists/2018/04/11/maple-leafs-ticket-prices-would-be-easier-to-take-if-the-atmosphere-wasnt-so-dull.html

Buy from a scalper speculator, forget about asking for a refund when they lose tonight :)

Just like signing a house deal with no conditions, eh! :)

Toronto Leaf fans are just as moronic as all the idiots buying slanty semis there in bidding wars!

What a pathetic, fifth-rate city of LOSERS Toronto is!!!

Your hockey team, your houses, your city SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!

—————————————————————–
Everything you say about Toronto, and the Leafs are the truth !!!

(But I couldn’t help but notice your post #87, is that some weird salute to that little girl Cindy that plays for the Pens ? or just a coincidence ? )

#111 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 12:43 pm

#105 Bibi on 04.21.18 at 11:29 am
#43 Ace Goodheart on 04.20.18 at 8:23 pm

I think Ace Goodheart, Leo Troolstoy, Blacksheep and Penny Henny should have their own blog to tell us more of their fascinating life stories. Joking man is nothing compared to you guys!
//////////////////

Ok. But we get Whatcha Minnie and Westcdn and you have to keep Mark and Stan Brooks. :))

#112 Duke on 04.21.18 at 1:01 pm

#102 Another Deckchair on 04.21.18 at 11:00 am
Laws and rules, vs. what you think is morally right.

Laws and are and there for a reason.

Forget Real estate.

Say you are flying your little airplane (Cessna or whatever) and you are going slower than the minimum airspeed, and the wings stall.

A little “woops – I didn’t mean it” is maybe ok; you broke the minimum airspeed rule, and the law of gravity takes over. So, you push the stick forward, undo the airspeed issue by “spending” some of YOUR energy (height) to recover.

If you don’t have sufficient height (energy), you are in BIG trouble.

Who do we blame now? Mother nature? God? YOU broke the rules, YOU broke the laws of nature, and now what happens? Maybe you didn’t really think things through, and, gosh, you made a mistake. Who pays??

How is this different than Derek’s case

================

Everything you said is spot on correct. And I can see that you are a pilot too.

#113 concerned1 on 04.21.18 at 1:06 pm

First of all who is Henny Penny. I want to date her. Totally smitten.

Secondly, no wonder the world is in such a crappy state of affairs when all these blog dogs go around championing Derek and his selfish ilk. The reality is that the buyer likely could not get financing to buy the house! Has no one on this blog ever made a financial mistake or get caught up in the moment? Derek’s actions will ruin this family. Mark my words.

Seriously, sometimes this blog drains me of my humanity, thank god I know that there are still people out there with a shred of human decency. The fact is that more often than not when the buyer can’t afford what they bought the seller cuts his losses and starts over–but this Derek is a different breed of Gordon Geko.

#114 Fish on 04.21.18 at 1:35 pm

BIG plans??? let’s talk about Wild bill

#115 Dog in The Fight on 04.21.18 at 2:09 pm

In my area 4 houses have burned down in the last to years. In 2 cases they were set on fir by arsonists, and the other two were suspicious. In all four cases the homes were own by recent arrivals from….hummm

#116 Stan Brooks on 04.21.18 at 2:11 pm

#91 Penny Henny on 04.21.18 at 10:06 am
#52 Blacksheep on 04.20.18 at 9:21 pm
Stan the festering # 247,248,

/////////////////////

It happens to a lot of men when they approach 50.
They become angry. Angry at everything.
I just scroll by Stan Brooks now.
Imagine being Stan and coming back to this blog day after day only to piss and moan. That can’t be good for anyone’s mental health.

=============================

Sure/whatever you say.

I am here to show you the big brown spot on the back of your pants and to tel you that you need a change.

Treating it as exploration project on my part on how stupid people could really be.

Canadians continue to surprise me with their achievements.

Cheers.

#117 jess on 04.21.18 at 2:24 pm

self improvement “guru”

Sketch of Allison Mack tells 1000 words; Seagram’s heiress Clare Bronfman now running the sex-slaver cult
April 21, 2018

the law:
Editor’s Note: If you’re wondering why Raniere wasn’t prosecuted for these numerous statutory rapes, it’s because at the time they occurred, New York State had a statute of limitations concerning all rapes. Although that limitation has since been removed, it remains in effect for all rapes that occurred prior to the implementation of the new law.

https://frankreport.com/2017/07/31/ranieres-joyful-raping-of-12-year-old-destroyed-her-childhood-she-claims/

#118 Oft deleted much maligned stock picker on 04.21.18 at 2:43 pm

I like Derek ….a lot…..the con man in his case was the skeazy buyer whose obvious intention was to grab and flip….sorry….buttered toast always lands gooey side down.

Talked to some kids on Van Isle who wanted to know about buying…’cause prices are only going up’…..told them that the RE Board of Van Isle is a sack of dung….and shouldn’t be trusted…..awash in inventory…few sales….everything smells like mold…people too.

They’re paying $1200 p/m for a main flr of a hippie hovel in an area the locals punk as prime…what a joke….average build date….1903….opposed to $4000 ++ on a mortgage…..keep screwing the landlord for the repairs I said…..spend your money on living when your young….and get some pot pouri….I cant take that hippie stank.

#119 Rog on 04.21.18 at 4:16 pm

A deal a deal tough luck buttercup .

#120 Yvrmc on 04.21.18 at 9:51 pm

You accept my offer or you don’t , NEVER get into the middle of bidding wars. There is never ending real estate to purchase , sometimes just a little patience is required …. the buyer got greedy and his agent should be booted.

#121 Ace Goodheart on 04.22.18 at 1:16 am

#113 concerned1 on 04.21.18 at 1:06 pm

“The reality is that the buyer likely could not get financing to buy the house! Has no one on this blog ever made a financial mistake or get caught up in the moment? Derek’s actions will ruin this family. Mark my words.”

Think about this for a moment.

So the buyer decides he needs a 14 car garage, two acres and a palace/house for his family. I am guessing the 14 car garage was not for the kids.

Being a mortgage broker, he is fully aware, in a technicolor type, Disney animation Mickey Mousecapades way, of the inns and outs of borrowing money to purchase houses. This guy is a pro. (this makes this case all the more bittersweet, if he had been, say, a Moroccan Argan oil salesman, this just would not have been as good).

So he bids up a 2.25 mil pile, wins the house, and then gets cold feet. We are told in all the papers that they couldn’t close. I am not convinced. The guy was a mortgage broker. He probably could have figured something out.

But at any rate, after making a firm offer, they walk.

Put yourself in the position of the seller.

Your house is sold for 2.25 mil. You have turned down all the other offers, and accepted this person’s offer. It’s firm, no conditions. You are golden. Time to plan and move on.

The buyer literally sewered the seller. Left with a house that rapidly decreased in value, missed out on selling it to multiple bids, a firm contract that is abandoned, planned their next moves based on money that never came.

They had to re-list. Lower the price. Lower it again. They lost almost $500,000. And the buyer was just going to walk away from that.

Oooops! It’s OK. We’re Canadian and we forgive each other. What’s 500K between complete strangers? I understand you just got a little ambitious and forgot that you actually have to pay for stuff that you buy. Happens to the best of us. No problem. We’ll take the $500,000 loss.

Are you all absolutely bonkers?

There is just no way that any of this is remotely the seller’s fault. “Derek” is an innocent victim of another person’s folly.

The buyer has one enemy. One person to blame for all that has happened to him. One person who is responsible for all of his problems. To see this person, to understand who this is, the buyer has to do one thing: Get a mirror, and look in it. The person staring back at him, is responsible for all of his problems. That person is his worst enemy.

#122 Ace Goodheart on 04.22.18 at 1:35 am

Oh, and my above comment re: “Derek” goes to the Mattamy “social justice league” participants also.

Consider: If there are roughly 100 Mattamy “social justice” folks, who are trying to get out of firm contracts to purchase houses, being built by a company that also has firm contracts to all of its suppliers and tradespeople to build the houses, then you have this situation:

Loss in value of the houses based on a downturn in the real estate market:

Approximately $200,000 per house.

Number of buyers: approximately 100.

So let’s “math this sh*t up”: 100 x $200,000 = $20,000,000.00

Yes, twenty million Canadian Dollars.

So, for “social justice” reasons, we are asking a corporation to eat a twenty million dollar loss.

Again, are we absolutely bonkers? Off the rails, wackadoodle nutso jobs?

There is one way this stuff is going to work out, and that is the correct way.

If you are going to buy something, you need to pay for it. If you are not sure that you can do that, don’t buy the item.

I am very tired of people purchasing things they cannot afford, and then complaining to the rest of us when it becomes apparent to them that they have to pay for what they bought.

We are not going to pay for your stuff. The government is not going to pay for your stuff. The person/company you bought your stuff from, is not going to pay for your stuff.

YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR YOUR STUFF.

Please be sure you can do that, BEFORE you sign the contract.

#123 Pulp Faction on 04.22.18 at 1:53 am

I feel no sympathy for Derek’s buyer.
He bullied everybody else out of the sale, then decided to walk.
He’s like a guy playing poker who tried to buy the pot and got called. He would have been happy to take your money if it had gone his way.

#124 Ace Goodheart on 04.22.18 at 2:06 am

Not another TSLA post:

About 20% of TSLA shares are now borrowed by short sellers.

That number is expected to increase in the next few months.

Back last year I had told everyone “you should be shorting the sh*t of out this, the metrics make no sense, this company is a bankrupt, comatose debt addled skeet show, this is an easy short”.

Well.

They now burn $6500.00 per minute in losses. Then have $10 billion in debt. Their debt is being downgraded pretty much regularly.

They have a bunch of debt due this year. The rates for renewal are all in the toilet.

So. For those of us who don’t understand math, this is for you: Take away all the fancy talk about share price, market equity, market value. None of that matters. What you are looking at is a swimming pool.

That pool is either filling with water, or it is emptying.

TSLA’s pool has many, many leaks, and water is gushing out everywhere. Sure, you can turn up the taps, pour more water in. Selling shares is just like throwing a hose into the pool and turning it on. More water gushes in, and you buy more time.

But there is a fundamental flaw to this picture. This company CANNOT make money. Like, ever. They cannot produce a sufficient amount of vehicles, at a sufficient price, to be able to turn a profit. Ever.

So all we are looking at, is how long have they got, until the pool is empty? Until critical mass takes over, and there is more water going out, than going in?

My prediction is fall of 2018. They are going to run out of money.

If they spin some sh*t, goose the markets, and try to sell more shares based on some future product launch or some wiggida-whack idea of techno-genius (that is like their idea of using a fully automated production line – ie, a load of caca), then they might last a few more months.

But keep in mind, they have to sell more shares.

Or the pool is going to empty.