Why life isn’t fair

UNFAIR2

I have a little test for you.

Apply for a mortgage on these terms. You have enough cash on hand in your bank account, or in the form of liquid investments, to cough up a 35% down payment on a home. But you have no regular income. Maybe you’re between jobs. Or your husband left you. Or you’re retired. Nonetheless, you have an acceptable credit history, always played by the rules, owned houses before, are a ruly Canadian citizen and, besides, you have a fat down payment of 35%. Will the bank or the broker give you financing?

Now apply on these terms. You have enough cash on hand in your bank account, or in the form of liquid investments, to cough up a 35% down payment on a home. But you have no regular income and have never owned Canadian real estate. Nonetheless, you have an acceptable credit history, and that fat down payment of 35%. Will the bank or the broker give you financing? Oh yeah, and you immigrated to Canada a hundred days ago from Wazookistan and just got your permanent resident card.

Take the test. You’ll discover that the banks will refuse a mortgage to the Canadian and offer it to the new arrival. At a time when the feds are deliberately trying (and succeeding) to derail the national housing market by making it harder to people to score mortgages (like banning those 30-year amortizations), does this seem a tad odd to you? Even discriminatory?

It’s not widely known that banks and mortgage brokers have some special deals for folks who have recently decided to take up residence in this nation. In fact, catering to the immigrant crowd is a big business.

As BC mortgage broker Leah Coss puts it: “As a new immigrant whether you have a job or no job or are self employed, if you put 35 percent down, they don’t care about income, they aren’t going to ask you about credit. They just simply want to see the money, that it’s your own money. It cannot be gifted from a family member or anything like that. It has to be from an account whether it be an overseas account or local account. It has to be an account in your name and be your funds, then you can get a mortgage with 35 percent down.”

Says the Royal Bank: “Down payment without two years’ employment history: If you have a substantial down payment (35% or more), and aren’t able to provide the usual confirmation of employment / income to prove you can service a mortgage, you still may be able to get a mortgage by simply answering a few basic questions about your financial history, and your permanent residency status.”

Says Assured Mortgage Services: “New Immigrants can purchase with 35% down payment and have no job and no credit. Must be in Canada for less than 2 years.

Said a TD mortgage specialist when I interviewed him this week: “An immigrant would need at least 35% down, and a minimum of $40,000 from their own resources. They must have relocated to Canada within the past five years, and pass our own internal assessment. There would be a loan-to-value financing of 65%, but no income qualification or verification is necessary.”

Would the same person who is a Canadian citizen and has lost their job but still has an identical down payment get the loan, I asked? “Sorry, no. We require evidence that the loan can be serviced.”

As for mortgages insured by CMHC, with as little as 5% down, immigrants are also welcomed by our banks.

“In support of providing mortgage financing to new immigrants where no Canadian credit score has been established,” says TD Canada Trust in its online material, “our new policy will allow mortgage financing with loan-to-value ratio up to 95% for qualified new immigrant applicants and insurance from CMHC or Genworth.” In this case you need to be employed – for the last 90 days.

Canada needs immigrants, of course. So does our economy. Without immigration our population would atrophy and without the investment, skill and desire that newcomers bring, we’d all be poorer. But you’d think that twenty or thirty years of paying bank service charges, suffering bad advice from TNL@TB and being force-fed those dreadful mutual funds would have earned you at least equal footing with the new guy.

192 comments ↓

#1 TurnerNation on 05.14.13 at 8:30 pm

I am Josef – 1…

#2 sklosch on 05.14.13 at 8:40 pm

Moral of the story, Immigrants aren’t canadians according to the our banks.

#3 T.o. and GTA bidding wars debunked -May 14 on 05.14.13 at 8:40 pm

Not a lot of sales for this time of the year

http://recharts.blogspot.ca/2013/05/to-bidding-wars-debunked-may-14.html

http://recharts.blogspot.ca/2013/05/gta-bidding-wars-debunked-may-14.html

#4 Victor V on 05.14.13 at 8:40 pm

Canadian housing boom has been driven, in part, by the construction of condos.

“Indeed, the story of Canada’s decade-long explosion in housing is to a large degree the story of a construction boom in the condo sector. But that boom now appears to be coming apart at the seams leaving many wondering what’s in store for the condo markets in Canada’s largest cities,” Ben Rabidoux, a well-known bear on the Canadian housing market, wrote in this recent Globe article.

On Wednesday May 15th at 12 pm (ET), Mr. Rabidoux, a Canadian analyst with U.S.-based Hanson Advisors and the author of The Economic Analyst blog, will join Globe readers for an online chat about the future of the housing market.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/home-buying/which-canadian-condo-market-is-most-at-risk/article11911613/

#5 Bill Clinton on 05.14.13 at 8:41 pm

The first five to post?

#6 Biff on 05.14.13 at 8:42 pm

You’ve shown that life isn’t fair, but not the “why”. Why do these idiots put in banking rules like these?

#7 Brad J Lam on 05.14.13 at 8:42 pm

Garth, you should be our minister of finance?

#8 Jeg from Reg on 05.14.13 at 8:43 pm

No freaking kidding?!
So how do the banks and mortgage agencies justify their double standard?

#9 Randy on 05.14.13 at 8:44 pm

Glad they cater to immigrants…..We were able to sell my Mom’s place for good money while the market was still good..Maybe the Banks favour immigrants because lots of Gen x and Gen y ….are slackers…

#10 Victor V on 05.14.13 at 8:45 pm

http://themashcanada.blogspot.ca/2013/05/and-it-went-for_9760.html

It finally SOLD!!!!

I first posted this house at 48 Hawthorn Avenue in Rosedale in November 2011. It was listed at $3,495,000. I didn’t like everything about it but I really liked it.

Only a year and a bit earlier, the house had been listed at $2,950,000, and though I am not sure for how much, it sold.

And maybe that is why it didn’t sell at $3.5M when it looks like they might not have done any work.

The price was dropped just over a week after my first post to $3,350,000.

Though I loved the house, I thought perhaps it would be better priced at $2,900,000.

It never sold and it was listed the following fall for $3,150,000 after being listed in April for $3,380,000 with no sale.

Again, it never sold and the price was dropped this February to $2,988,000.

And almost 3 months later, it has finally sold…For $2,850,000.

$100,000 less than it had been listed for at the last sale in 2010!

#11 Ralph Cramdown on 05.14.13 at 8:47 pm

This is called “hard money” lending. If you’ve got 35% equity, a believable plan for paying back the loan and a marketable property that’ll appraise, you can almost always find a lender who — for the right interest rate — will be more or less indifferent whether he’ll get paid or repossess.

It seems that if you’re fresh off the boat, the lender is called the Government of Canada and his interest rates are MUCH lower than the usual hard money lenders’.

#12 Ralph Cramdown on 05.14.13 at 8:52 pm

#8 Jeg from Reg — “No freaking kidding?! So how do the banks and mortgage agencies justify their double standard?”

They’ve probably never been asked to, but if pressed, I bet it’d all come back to “blah blah blah helping immigrants get settled is a pressing national objective blah blah blah Section 1.”

Section 1 is the weasel’s way out.

#13 sklosch on 05.14.13 at 8:54 pm

Come one garth why aren’t you calling the banks racist pigs? You love invoking the modified version of godwin’s law.

Because race has nothing to do with it. — Garth

#14 Smoking Man on 05.14.13 at 8:56 pm

Its not fair, poor girl has missed a few meals, The happy dude got more than his fair share of steak and eggs.
Not fair….

We all make our own luck and misfortune, No risk no reward, not every hand wins, but if you don’t play you will never win.

Play the game and do what ever it takes that’s not a crime to gain advantage.

Morals are for chumps….

#15 canadian on 05.14.13 at 8:56 pm

So not only are the banks outsourcing jobs ,they`re outsourcing our real estate as well . Maybe we can outsource our useless politicians from overseas as well.

#16 Tom Vu on 05.14.13 at 9:03 pm

Very obvious:

She is not a shallow person , thus one who sees inner beauty.

PS: That guy could play goalie for Leafs and not let even light in.

#17 sklosch on 05.14.13 at 9:03 pm

Because race has nothing to do with it. — Garth

BS!

#18 Old Man on 05.14.13 at 9:05 pm

I would love to make a comment on this photo, but Mr. Turner will give me a delete in a New York minute, so will say nothing, as my dog Gertrude needs to be fed, as she loves my cooking.

#19 VanPerfecto on 05.14.13 at 9:08 pm

So what happens when the CRA goes after Immigrants income not being declared in Canada. Is this just a bluff by CRA or is something actually going to be done. Everyone needs a place to live; they don’t need gold bars. How can the “Canadian” compete? What sort of legacy is being left for our children. I guess I should get a job oversees pay a flat 10% tax and let my kids have access to health care and school for only 6 grand a year I pay in property taxes in Canada. This just isn’t right. It’s not about political correctness or racism it just plain isn’t right and the legacy being left is not pretty.

#20 VanPerfecto on 05.14.13 at 9:10 pm

I wonder if the same rules apply down in the States? Maybe this is why Vancouver costs so much while a short ride south property is significantly cheaper

#21 Mixed Bag on 05.14.13 at 9:12 pm

The question is why? I’m not sure that I understand why the bank is allowing greater risk with the new immigrant, when the old Canadian would be more established in Canadian life. Many immigrants will attest to how difficult it is to get into their profession here, when many of their credentials are not recognized; how difficult it is to get that Canadian experience that employers look for.

I can only think, follow the money, and wonder, is there some sort of incentive to the bank that we don’t know about.

#22 Yes, we know... on 05.14.13 at 9:15 pm

@ post #1

yes, we know you are Josef, as well as several other names that only pop up in the first ten posts and who always are trying to brag about being the first poster.

#23 Sebee on 05.14.13 at 9:15 pm

On a scale of 1 to 10, where does this guy rate?

#24 Peter on 05.14.13 at 9:18 pm

HI Garth, I am canadian , I have applied for 65% LTV mortgage with no income, not working (by choice), good credit history, extra paper work required , and slighty higher rates , approx. 35 basis points , and a real appraisal. It wasn’t a new purchase , but i was taking sole possession of the property from a brother who was getting married , was difficult tho, and should be but I would make the same loan to anyone with a 1ST mortgage and good appraisal, pretty safe if you ask me.

#25 Yuus bin Haad on 05.14.13 at 9:18 pm

and we get Medavie Blue Cross.

#26 Twoop on 05.14.13 at 9:21 pm

This is no different than some jobs. A Metis bud of mine applied for RCMP as a ‘white’ man and was rejected. Then applied as Metis and got in. They need to fill their quota I guess.

#27 Ham Part 2? on 05.14.13 at 9:23 pm

Wow, Garth , I think we are going to see some nasty comments this round. It’s a very sensitive subject and will bring out the ugly side of some of us. As for me, I’ll just leave it at saying that I am not very pleased with this country sometimes.

#28 Dean Mason on 05.14.13 at 9:24 pm

I guess the banks think that if they repossess the house,condo etc. that they will get back more than 65% value.If this is the case banks and other lenders should be warned Ottawa that if they lose money Canadians that pay most of all taxes should not bail them out.

Discrimination without representation.

#29 Smoking Man on 05.14.13 at 9:29 pm

Garth I Hope your cool with this, never posted something like this before. I don’t often do charity. Especially for others.

About six years ago a friend had a brilliant career as a exec at and IT company. He was brilliant manager working for the machine. Creative as hell. Out for beer one night he confess to me he wants to make a movie.

Co-workers rolled there eyes. Not I. I pushed him, Money aint everything, your going to be dead in like 30 or 40 years. Do it, at end of the day, when you die, all the shit you suffered for, all the loot tried to save will go to who knows who. Do it Man. Art lasts forever…

Well he did, 3 years writing the script 2 years set up, 1 year to make. It’s now at post production stage.

He went all in. Used every last dime to make it. It’s done sitting in post production. Now promo time.

He’s short stacked looking for help and donations, I don’t expect most to contribute, in fact don’t this is only an appeal to the well off on this blog, those who know what it feels like to go all in chasing a dream.

This is a brilliant move and will do well. I’m kicking in so serious loot. Executive Producer. But if you guys want to hang with me and a few Hollywood stars at the preview
click on the link, think it 200 for the show opening one in LA and one in NYC

The guy who played Bills brother in kill bill is in it, and some up and coming chic, forgot her name.

Harris is a good guy, nothing like me. He asked me for help, I’m going to and if anyone wants to make connections with low level Hollywood types, 200 bucks get you to the party. Only if you are well to do. There is no ROI on this donation, just some fun if you can make to LA or New York

If you can, see link

With my large donation don’t know If I will go with my stage name , or real name as executive producer.

It’s going to be smoking man.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1596892900/stella-maeve-michael-madsen-flipped-post-productio

#30 Cici on 05.14.13 at 9:34 pm

#6 Biff

To keep the speculation game going. With the hope that it may be less risky giving easy money to new immigrants who will supposedly find jobs, rather than giving it to Canadians with uncertain employment history. Also, it’s a game of numbers…there are more immigrants willing to put their life savings into Canadian real estate than there are unemployed Canadians willing to stash their life’s savings to the cause (especially with the housing slowdown becoming more and more apparent). And so the Ponzi scheme continues.

#31 Bank-hater on 05.14.13 at 9:38 pm

Bank are simply whores dressed up with nice people (albeit often clueless) working there. When you finally find a nice person who knows what they are talking about… shazam!… they get promoted and you never see them again. That’s one reason that led me to bet my money on the guy I did.

Trick: I just opened an RRSP at my bank and deposited $25 bucks. Having a credit card and bank account allows me to have the back account without fees. It feels great although somehow I know they are still getting the best of me…

#32 Cristian on 05.14.13 at 9:39 pm

That is called attracting immigrants to Canada, Garth. How are you going to make them come if you don’t offer them something in return? Do you think they’re just going to come to drive your taxis and shine your shoes without any other incentive?
Try taking the incentives away, and you lost them.
What is the Canadian going to do if they don’t get the deals immigrants get? Emigrate to Wazookistan? I somehow doubt it…
So tuck that Canadian pride back where it belongs and swallow the fact that you cannot have immigrants for free.
By the way, I am one of them, if you still had any doubts.

#33 Chickenlittle on 05.14.13 at 9:40 pm

Don’t forget that once these immigrants have kids they are not going to get the same deal. It IS unfair, though.
It also seems thaat certain people do not qualify as immigrants because they are from Europe.
A friend of mine in school never got the help she needed with her English because she was from Russia and the other ones were from another country that shall remain nameless. It always bothered her that some immigrants seemed more valued than others. Believe me, her and her husband do not leach off of the system. They are the kind of people you want to come!
I don’t get it!!!

Not that the other ones are not but….you know what I mean.

#34 Paully on 05.14.13 at 9:41 pm

Imagine, if you will, that the scenario was reversed. The Canadian with the long and responsible credit history gets the loan and the recent immigrant is denied.

The Toronto Star would totally freak out about how the poor, downtrodden immigrant was being mistreated.

The Liberals would probably want to convene a Royal Commission to determine why people with no income and no credit history are being denied mortgages.

Sheesh!

#35 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 05.14.13 at 9:53 pm

Hmmmmm,
And I naively thought all those “rascist” rumours about immigrants getting welfare( Nodebt! Are you an immigrant?) were total shite.
A Canadian taxpayer insured bank doling out mortgages to immigrants and refusing Canadian citizens under the same conditions?
WTF?
Who do i write about this horsemanure

#36 AisA on 05.14.13 at 9:56 pm

And the Rock says:

It doesn’t matter what the rate is, or where you come from, you’re still going to lose your sorry ass down payment!

Seriously though, nothing has changed in the last 20 years, Canada has been like this for a long while now.

Fresh meat gets the best treatment, those citizens who’ve been here slugging it out for ages, those anthropoids of the great white north, don’t mean anything anymore because they already realized that they are the old meat in the freezer, who, everyone who is both selling and buying meat wants to disappear.

Whoever is in power consistently treats the landed meat as royalty to engender loyalty, or should I say fealty, yes, fealty is the word. It WORKS. God save us from ourselves.

What I don’t get is why the show is so important still? I mean, It’s not like the big wigs of the Cons, Libs, and the No g-D Per’s haven’t metered out who gets what before each election. Politickin’ is the ultimate union.

Or our world is upright and on the narrow and the banks look at their books and say to themselves, gosh darned, these “fellow” Canadian folk are freaking debt insane and we have to cut them off at all costs, but we still gotta make a livin’ (or so we can continue to make a living).

I would wager that the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

#37 More Calgary Less Toronto on 05.14.13 at 9:56 pm

Good article.. but… You don’t tell us why this happens Garth?

#38 Bob the Imp. on 05.14.13 at 9:58 pm

You seem like a very serious man Garth… Here is a wonderful Youtube video to cheer you up:

Bird and Fortune – Subprime Crisis
http://youtu.be/mzJmTCYmo9g

#39 I am in C on 05.14.13 at 9:59 pm

Fare is what you use to take the bus.

#40 EIT on 05.14.13 at 10:07 pm

What happens if the immigrant cant pay the mortgage after 6 months? The bank gets the money and the house and the guy gets deported. Well he wishes he’d be deported.

#41 sluggo on 05.14.13 at 10:09 pm

Has to do with bulk insurance from CMHC. An approved bank(FRFI) takes a bunch of low LTV mortgages and uses them as insurance for capital relief and access into the MBS program. The structure of the pool determines who can participate. Either way you slice it, it’s a BS deal. An additional layer of capital added to an already overinflated sector.

#42 Chris on 05.14.13 at 10:19 pm

I was informed years ago that new immigrants to Canada can put the mortgage money loaned to them for a house in Canada into a bank in their own country paying, for example, 16% interest per year.

They then pay the monthly mortgage payment for their house here in Canada from the high interest earned in their motherland.

Rubbish. — Garth

#43 Smoking Man on 05.14.13 at 10:21 pm

Turner Nation, see above post. Get some of your Bay street buds in, I am doing the same, going to NYC party.

It would be so cool if the blog dogs helped, one thing to click on a radial button. Garth is the best financial blog. another to pledge a dollar to a fellow loon who went all in on crazy advice. Damn…..

See you in NYC

#44 Ford Prefect on 05.14.13 at 10:23 pm

I am with #37: a bit confused. For example does the federal government insure these loans to immigrants? I did not see this point addressed in article.

Insurance is required for high-ratio loans only. — Garth

#45 Devore on 05.14.13 at 10:25 pm

#17 sklosch

Because race has nothing to do with it. — Garth

BS!

All immigrants, regardless of race qualify. Ergo, not racist. Get your cousins from Wales to come to Canada so they can take advantage of this.

#46 Boomer21 on 05.14.13 at 10:30 pm

SM, your large donation? Of the $50 grand they want to raise app. $15 grand is promised. How much of that was you? $5, $10, $15 grand? Anyway a great way to raise money for projects that cannot find funds from conventional sources. What you shouldn’t do SM is portray yourself as anything other than an investor, no “executive producer” for you, just an investor and a bit crazy at that.

#47 brainsail on 05.14.13 at 10:33 pm

“Keystone XL Expansion Decision Won’t Be Made Anytime Soon”

“The decision may not be made until November, December or even early 2014, said a U.S. official, as President Barack Obama will not rush the process, which still has a number of stages to work through. One of those stages has not even begun yet and will run for months.”

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100732550

#48 Rural Rick on 05.14.13 at 10:35 pm

The banks know if your are a Canadian you have a doubtful future and you are already trained to be sheared. This is just to suck in the new guys and any off shore money they may have. God knows there is none in Canada. Don’t feel left out. Your still bank loves you.

#49 I love libraries on 05.14.13 at 10:43 pm

CBC would love to do an expose on this I’m sure…

#50 Section8 on 05.14.13 at 10:45 pm

Someone’s got to be exploiting immigrants with this extra advantage. I’m mean there has to be some kind of fraud going on.

#51 Smoking Man on 05.14.13 at 10:46 pm

#46 Boomer21 on 05.14.13 at 10:30 pm

SM, your large donation? Of the $50 grand they want to raise app. $15 grand is promised. How much of that was you? $5, $10, $15 grand? Anyway a great way to raise money for projects that cannot find funds from conventional sources. What you shouldn’t do SM is portray yourself as anything other than an investor, no “executive producer” for you, just an investor and a bit crazy at that.
……………………..

I’m pledging 200, gets me to the the party/premier entrance fee. in 24 days what ever he is short, I’m covering whats out standing. Hopefully nothing, my son is getting married in 3 weeks.

Looks like I got stuck with the bill. and the rehursall dinner, unfortunately bride sister has MS, high cost for family, so as always going the extra mile, its only few gambling credits.

hate parting with it….not natural for me.

#52 Sydneysider on 05.14.13 at 10:47 pm

Call me cynical, but isn’t it easier for the banks to bully new immigrants who find they cannot pay the mortgage? Who can they turn to for help? I’m surprised the banks don’t have a special package for people who cannot speak Canadian.

‘Speak Canadian’? Like Don Cherry? — Garth

#53 Ryan Perich on 05.14.13 at 10:53 pm

Garth…does this latest blog post not prove HAM / immigrants ARE in fact pushing up the housing market making it out of reach for Long term Canadians ? exactly what you said wasn’t the case numerous times in replies ?

It proves banks have double standards. — Garth

#54 mx420 on 05.14.13 at 10:56 pm

32 Cristian

LOL you think this is anything other than a way for the banks to screw you out of money. They KNOW you will not have a great job right. (exceptions to the rule) so most of you will spend a longer time paying off your shit… giving them more money.

Cant make money off someone with nothing, but you can if they have a bit!

ya we could easily have immigrants for free, your going sit there and tell me ONLY 200 000 a year from ALL over the world want to get here, what a joke.

#55 Good Authority on 05.14.13 at 10:57 pm

#23 Sebee
What guy?

#56 Inglorious Investor on 05.14.13 at 10:58 pm

Quite an incendiary post, but thanks for bringing it to light.

#57 thiscountryisgoing down the toilet on 05.14.13 at 11:03 pm

#42

“I was informed years ago that new immigrants to Canada can put the mortgage money loaned to them for a house in Canada into a bank in their own country paying, for example, 16% interest per year.

They then pay the monthly mortgage payment for their house here in Canada from the high interest earned in their motherland.

Rubbish. — Garth”

G…don’t be so naive…..or think that everyone else is if you continue to deny the effects and influence of not so honest immigrants……do you think these people are stupid and can’t figure their way through the obvious fiddles. Some of us had careers advising new immigrants how to beat the Canadian bureaucracy.

Some ethnicities and the lobby groups we pay to support them actually teach classes on beating the system in church basements and temple halls.

Funds are released to finance a property the debt is registered against. Not as cash. Get over your prejudices. — Garth

#58 Questions on 05.14.13 at 11:07 pm

Banks aren’t doing it for long term sociological reasons, so what’s their motivation? What’s their risk/reward calculators telling them?

#59 Inglorious Investor on 05.14.13 at 11:13 pm

“Said a TD mortgage specialist […]: ‘An immigrant would need […] pass our own internal assessment.’”

What would that be? To prove that they can’t read English so they’ll have no idea what the documents that they are signing actually say?

#60 Kris on 05.14.13 at 11:14 pm

My mortgage broker was talking of clients being approved for up to 6x their income in loans, due to the low rates. Even an industry insider like him found this reckless, wondering when we’ll return to the normal days when 4x income would be the limit.

#61 Brad on 05.14.13 at 11:20 pm

Who ever told you that life was fair?..

#62 Inglorious Investor on 05.14.13 at 11:23 pm

IRS Caught Targeting Tea Party And Other Conservative Groups. Rogue Trader Blamed.

Obama denies allegations that the country’s tax watchdog is targeting any specific group or individuals. “We’re targeting ALL Americans,” said the president.

#63 deaner on 05.14.13 at 11:27 pm

Any time a bank has a different policy or program in Quebec or Nunavut it’s essentially doing the same thing.

Non-immigrants without jobs, even with cash, must have fairly dismal default rates. Wouldn’t a normal person just go get a job, within several months maybe, and then get their mortgage.

#64 Tony on 05.14.13 at 11:28 pm

I guess when it comes right down to it and after the great Canadian real estate collapse an immigrant simply goes back home, but where does a true Canadian go if they already live here?

#65 YouthInAsia on 05.14.13 at 11:28 pm

Hey Garth,

Do you have any further comments or a blog post specifically centering around “recourse loans”?

I really think you guys should talk…..
http://www.cnbc.com/id/100736121

It looks like this guy John Carney (no relation to Mark) is pressing the issue to whoever will listen in the States…

BTW, the above post is scary! This could turn out worse than first initially thought…..

#66 Inglorious Investor on 05.14.13 at 11:38 pm

Associated Press says Justice Department spied on reporters’ phone calls in sweeping surveillance campaign.

Rogue trader blamed.

Eric Holder rushed to downplay the allegations. “The Associated Press is paranoid to think that we are targeting them. We’re spying on ALL Americans,” the Attorney General said.

#67 Tom Vu on 05.14.13 at 11:48 pm

I think we should all spray our tin foil hats white….that will keep them out !

#68 RMEAGP on 05.14.13 at 11:49 pm

Banks have probably realized that most immigrants will work their butt off to establish themselves, unlike many entitled Canadians.

#69 not 1st on 05.14.13 at 11:55 pm

Garth, the new batch of immigrants aren’t the boon to Canada that you think they are and can’t really be compared to those who came here when Canada was first being settled.

First of all, in a booming market, wages should be rising which would attract locals to these jobs even if menial. However, the employers cried again and now they simply hire off shore workers, pay them sh*t and offer no benefits and p/t time work. Foreigners who have never had a job in their life think this is great and are willing to bunk 10 a room just to cut down on expenses to make it work. Companies already offshored everything they could, so now their next step is to bring the cheapo labour in here.

Secondly, many have no intention of making Canada their permanent home. They will get their PR card or citizenship, then spend 6 months here working and 6 months abroad in their home country, or return their in their senior years. This is a Canadian of convenience.

And lastly, foreign workers are not returning dollars back into the economy. They are remitting all they can abroad to extended families. Some of Canada’s GDP is sliced off and reappears on other countries books.

#70 len on 05.14.13 at 11:57 pm

That is a really interesting post tonight.

Given that these would be uninsured mortgages in both instances so risk assessment becomes important to the bank I wonder if this practice has to do with risk (not racial) profiling. For whatever reason, the new immigrants have been shown to be an extremely low risk in terms of default in the past and so the lending criteria are adjusted?

From a risk perspective, would the lender not have analysts who build risk models based on past aggregate data?

I don’t know but it must make sense to the lender if that is the case, unless, of course, they do get some sort of incentives from government? One thing is for sure, they do it for a reason – we just don’t have enough information.

#71 rechrts on 05.14.13 at 11:59 pm

@#54 They know that the immigrants are serious and motivated, well educated most of them. There is a selection program to become imigrant in this country. There is no selection to be born in this country

#72 Rabbit One on 05.15.13 at 12:03 am

“New immigrant policy” is it called. It’s there for a decade or two.
It’s not fair but banks are very comfortable to give financing who can come up with 35% downpayment who comes from overseas, passed immigration process.
- rather than fellows who holds Canadian passport who have changed address and jobs more than 3 times in last 3 years.

Scarely enough, there was (is, still?) CMHC Business owner policy.
Just put 10% down, show you have provincial registered business and you have (non-audited) business financial statements.
Again, no questions asked, just get 90% financing on any properties. (ok, does not need to be that particular business related property, can be any residential properties)

Business financial statement does not need to show profit, Just to show your business is actually there, that’s it.

Same for first new immigrant policy.
Notice of assessment from CRA, showing your income is nil. or show your landed immigrant paper saying you are very new to Canada and not yet to file your zero income taxes, that’s fine.

All the bankers know this in BC but apprently not widely known to regular Canadian citizens…., sighs..

#73 jaguar on 05.15.13 at 12:12 am

It would be interesting to know what the default ratio was on that mortgage portfolio. I suspect very low, which is why those banks consider it a good business proposition. There’s lots more money after the 35% down payment. Money to make the payments… Money that needs to be moved out of countries before the governments of those countries find out where it really came from. Some call that laundered money, but I guess it depends which side of the looking glass you are on…….

#74 Rabbit One on 05.15.13 at 12:19 am

Btw, CMHC insurance can be done on Low-Ratio mortgage. (= More thnan 20% Downpayment)

Can be done just out side of bank’s appraisal, (Emily system), or whatever the reason would be.
I have done many CMHC deals in my career as a lender, and some are solely by borrowers’ choice.

Just pay CMHC insurance premium.

#75 Rabbit One on 05.15.13 at 12:23 am

Sorry, again
>I have done many “Low-Ratio” CMHC deals in my career

You may notice there is no limit for CMHC premium scale on “maximum down payment”, right?

#76 new on 05.15.13 at 12:35 am

Garth, first of all, should thank you for your hard work and all the information all these long.

About the bank “discrimination”, you shouldn’t be jealous, if any, at all. Banks are profit chasers. I believe you know much better, banks can’t make “enough” profit by just lending money, or offering mortgage for interests. The most profit they can make is when their clients fail so that they can forclose. As all we know, at least 40-50% of the interest of the whole 20 to 30-year-term were paid within the first 5 years. If not for CMHC insurance, you can imagine how much, I believe at least 30% RE price drop since late 2008 should already long been reached. Why 30%, it’s 30% downpayment which the price banks would chopped in a heartbeat to attract buyers to dump the forclosed properties. Well, it’s the forclosed homeowners’ hard earned money, why would the banks care? Then again, any new homeowner to come, and a new mortgage to offer.

So, you know what I am saying. For newcomers to Canada, can you imagine the failure rates for the mortgage they made. New comers to Canada, have no idea about the community, no jobs, many don’t even know how to maintain a house, and then 35% down! Can you imagine how much interests and whatever fees banks can make within the first 5 years within these kind of mortgages? Guess what, with 35% down, and none of these new people would cause trouble which means you can charge whatever fees without complaints, don’t you feel that’s the best deal banks can ever make?

Discrimination? Yes, moneywise!

#77 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 05.15.13 at 12:43 am

Well, I guess when the Liberal govt bought and paid for the Main Stream media in BC through advertising.

That sorta skews the Angus Reid polls. NDP ahead 20% for months leading up to the election

Libs win! NDP ( like the Canucks) snatch a loss from the jaws of victory.

Oh well.

Lets see how gum chewin’ Christy handles the massive deficit budget she and her minions have created ove rht e past 12 years. Pipelines and oil spills? Cant wait to see who she blames for that. BC Hydro going bankrupt with 50 Billion in contracts its on th ehook for? Sell it for a song to Christy’s friends like BC Rail.

and 4 years from now I will say to ‘NoDebt” and all the other uninformed fools that bought the sensationalist lies from the media…….

“Dont blame me I voted NDP”…….. :)

#78 Screwed on 05.15.13 at 12:53 am

Quiet here tonight. Probably all those disillusioned NDP voters and supporters hoping for that “change, one step at a time” are drowning in tears.

Well it ain’t happening and that is a good thing.

BC will continue to do well.

#79 Kilby on 05.15.13 at 1:11 am

Housing is going to be OK in BC as Christy Clark now has another majority government…”Families First”. Realtors were worried here that the NDP would get in and collapse the entire real estate market, everything will be better tomorrow.

#80 benchwarmers on 05.15.13 at 1:17 am

Just when you thought they were running out of suckers.

#81 Broadway skytrain on 05.15.13 at 1:21 am

HUGE UPSET in bc tonite
Ndp blows a lead like the maple leafs did.

Not only did they not win, they LOST a handful of seats!

Wow, just wow.

#82 carlyle on 05.15.13 at 1:23 am

Back in the 90s one of my ex gfs was from Hong Kong living in Toronto. She was 18 lived alone in a condo, while her dad worked overseas in Hong Kong.

The entire family was landed immigrants and supposed to all be in Canada. I suspect you’ll find variations of this scam but simply put Garths post is about banks coaxing that overseas money into mortgages in Canada. Whether the immigrant has a Canadian job or not many of them do have funds available, banks going after that money I guess.

#83 Canadian Watchdog on 05.15.13 at 1:41 am

#40 EIT – What happens if the immigrant cant pay the mortgage after 6 months?

#52 Sydneysider – isn’t it easier for the banks to bully new immigrants who find they cannot pay the mortgage?

If you want to know what's really going on: (#40) A lender and/or insurer will try to arrange a workout (as they call it) by forcing a borrower into a longer term mortgage at a higher interest rate and premium. (#52) Once a borrower who lacks the literacy to understand what he or she is signing and committing to; the lender and insurer (government) can then profit off them for many many years by giving them cheap oversized debt obligations that was never accessible in their home country. This is pretty much a legal debt slavery ring.

We don't have any real consumer protection agencies anymore since it was removed from OSFI's mandate many years ago. Canadians and newcomers are on their own.

#84 legal or what? on 05.15.13 at 2:03 am

Is this legal?

There’s a new mega condo project in Victoria that is attracting buyers by promising to help them avoid CMHC insurance premiums by lending them a portion of the down payment.

From the website:

“This is a rare opportunity to reduce your dependency on debt, build wealth, and enjoy a home and lifestyle beyond compare.

Buyers only need 10% down. LEAGUE will loan buyers an additional 10-25%, allowing them to qualify for a 65-80% conventional mortgage with Royal Bank of Canada and avoid the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) mortgage insurance premium. This also enables buyers to qualify for a longer amortization period of 30 years.”

http://www.capitalcitycentre.ca/financing#content

So I don’t know, maybe it’s technically legal (or not) because they’re just right out there doing it but doesn’t it obviously violate the spirit of the law when people with only 10% down avoid paying CMHC insurance by taking out another loan on the side of up to 25% of the purchase price?

How do they get away with this? Anyone know if these dodgy financing schemes are normal with condo projects?

1 bedrooms start at $260K.

#85 An immigrant who won't bring money to Canada on 05.15.13 at 2:05 am

What about car insurance companies which force you to take 1 or 2 million insurance where required minimum is only 200K? There are so many senseless and fraudulent things in Canada.

No, I won’t bring any money for 35% down to keep inflating these ridiculous prices. So there is no inequality there, all loans are available for Canadians only, keep borrowing guys! I am a happy renter.

And no again, I did not come to Canada for free health care. In fact, i would be happy to fly back to my home country and had my pregnant wife deliver there with much better health system. But I can’t do it since it will take years to get paperwork done by Canada gov’t for newborn to come back here. I am sorry but I am stuck with this free Canadian health system!

But we are adapting to Canada. We are getting ready to wait 2-3 years for citizenship application which takes about 1 month in UK and AU. We totally get the idea that we should not question anything as everything is perfect.

Canada is depicted as a dream before you come. But it’s more like a delusion and hallucination after you are in. e.g home prices would never fall

#86 Show me the numbers on 05.15.13 at 2:09 am

Downloaded a newcomers guide from CMHC. The table on Page 34 seems to suggest insurance is available for loans with 65% LTV.
A mortgage specialist told me Harper government encouraged the banks to lend to new immigrants as soon as the the Tories came to power in 2006.
I thought he was BSing me. Maybe not.

http://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/buho/upload/TheNewcomersGuide_E.pdf

#87 space889 on 05.15.13 at 2:52 am

Hmmmm…..didn’t I just post on this topic in a comment on vancouvercondo.info just two days ago?

#88 Crash Calaway on 05.15.13 at 2:59 am

Insane immigration numbers over the past decade has brought Canada to it’s knees.
The pieces of the pie gets sliced thinner and thinner until the pie cannot provide sustenance to anyone.

Canada has shot itself in the foot.
Was selling more fridges & stoves really worth the cost?
Growth for the sake of growth is like clear cutting the forest so you can make more axe handles to make more axes so you can cut down more trees.

I am not against immigration but it has to be implemented with more care and planning than a Stampede breakfast.
And home grown residents should never be back seated by banks and government in order to keep the supply of greater fools landing on our shores.

#89 Buy? Curious? on 05.15.13 at 3:04 am

Garth, today’s post is an 8 out of 10! I agree this post has nothing to do with race but stupid Canadians will get their panties twisted into a knot regardless. The banks know that there’s going to be a slow melt, correction or crash over the next decade and at the same time need to build up their cash reserves. What better way to profit than having Pavindar and company (no disrespect) handing over a wad of cash for a house at the peak of the market. It is not a dumb move by the banks. If a Canadian has a 35% downpayment, he or she (Ladies, I won’t forget about you) should follow Garth’s advice, invest the cash in something that pays you and move to a town where marrying your cousin isn’t frowned upon and just ride out the storm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=By4NUxd6z3s

#90 Djura on 05.15.13 at 3:07 am

#45 Devore on 05.14.13 at 10:25 pm

#17 sklosch

Because race has nothing to do with it. — Garth

BS!

All immigrants, regardless of race qualify. Ergo, not racist. Get your cousins from Wales to come to Canada so they can take advantage of this.

What advantage ???
With help like that who needs enemies.
What’s wrong tonight? Almost everyone sees this as some kind of gift or what instead of sharp fishing hook.

#91 FutureExpatriate on 05.15.13 at 3:26 am

Life may be unfair, but it took that guy one helluva lot of cash and/or drugs to have her as a girlfriend for more than the length of time it took to take that photo.

(In reality? Probably his sister.)

#92 Aaron- Melbourne on 05.15.13 at 3:39 am

lets be honest, its a NINJA loan any way you put it.

#93 Jack on 05.15.13 at 3:46 am

#32 Cristian
I take offense at your comment. Immigrants have it much too easy to enter our country. Try doing the same in the states. I also disagree that we “need” immigrants.
It sounds like you had it much too easy entering Canada. If you were a true Canadian immigrant you would not be telling us to swallow our pride. I would suggest going back to your own country. We have pride for a reason. Canada is a great country and we don’t need to be taken advantage of by other countries.

#94 observer on 05.15.13 at 3:58 am

The banks are just playing by the rules. The cause of the problem is government interference.

Government should not be backing up these mortgages and taking the risk from the banks. As long as goverment interference occurs you will have these irresponsible bank practices.

#95 Aussie Roy on 05.15.13 at 4:03 am

Post Haste on 05.14.13 at 10:10 am
Aussie Roy – regarding your reply to my post yesterday – can I buy you a pair of glasses or better yet – read the post, understand what I am trying to say before you open your blow hole -

……………………………………………………………………….

LOL, not sure why you didn’t realise I was adding to your comment not disagreeing with it.

Person attacks are never good.

Don’t worry I’m not offended, now where are my glasses. LOL

I think most of your comments here are great but in this instance you have made a completely wrong assumption.

Not to worry I ‘ll just chalk it up to a translation thing.

#96 Nick on 05.15.13 at 5:11 am

So, the banksters are inflicting mega mortgages on unsuspecting new comers, enabling them to buy realestate at peak bubble levels and you’re upset about them saving the Canadian citizens the grief?

I’d say they’re doing a bang up job protecting the Canadian interests.

#97 Small Town Steve on 05.15.13 at 5:33 am

#47 brainsail
“Keystone won’t be built anytime soon”

It won’t be approved until Obamamarx is out of office, rabid environmentalist, anti business, most UN American president in the history of the world tax successful people even more until they become ex-pats kind of president?

Canada would be better off declaring a pipeline to our eastern refineries as well as the pipeline to the coast a national emergency and get them built. Build them to the same standards as the proposed Keystone line and tell Obama to go F his hat. Why sell it at a discount to WTI when we could be selling it at Brent prices AND have it to market before the Keystone line is even approved.

You wonder why the TSX is sucking hind tit to NYSE? This is a big reason, not the only one but it is a big one.

#98 Asse on 05.15.13 at 5:37 am

Hey, isn’t that the billionaire bit torrent guy? Reminds me of Charlie Sheen without the bother.
When a judge said to charlie ‘you don’t seem like the kind of guy who would have to pay’ charlie replied ‘I don’t pay for sex, I pay for them to go away?’. Don’t some of you wish you had that ‘wisdom’?
This guys in jail now…hunted down by the authorities.
As for Garth’s post, all of our families originated as immigrants. We came for one, or both, of two reasons. Poverty and war. A promise of a better life for us and our families. Shouldn’t the country aim to assimilate, to provide ‘roots’, as well as possible? Buy the way, in many countries wealth was defined by property, something many either didn’t have or lost. It’s feels good to be wealthy;)

#99 The real Kip on 05.15.13 at 6:49 am

#7 Brad J Lam on 05.14.13 at 8:42 pm

“Garth, you should be our minister of finance?”

Oh Please! Once was enough! Stop smoking the bong before breakfast.

#100 Tripp on 05.15.13 at 7:03 am

Garth, there is a reason behing everything. I doubt the banks are into the immigrant attracting business. It would be interesting to see the whole contract. The advantage is percieved but that does not make it real. As everyone knows, the fineprint is the most important part…

As for fairness, there is a long list of other aspects that do not affect the immigrants in a favourable way. Professional recognition, insurance, healthcare come to mind.

#101 Tony Right on 05.15.13 at 7:03 am

I just got an email from my bank telling me my service charges are going up…again.

#102 Herb on 05.15.13 at 7:51 am

#99 The real Kip,

that was Revenue, Kip, REVENUE!

Watch where you swing that bucket.

#103 Herb on 05.15.13 at 7:56 am

#97 Smalltown Steve,

“Obamamarx … rabid environmentalist, anti business, most UN American president in the history of the world …”

That’s pretty funny. Keep ‘em coming.

#104 TS on 05.15.13 at 7:59 am

“I’m not going to intervene in the mortgage market, I don’t need to.”

who said that?!

#105 down and out on 05.15.13 at 8:04 am

Years and years ago crossing back into Canada after taking in a ball game with 2 immigrated friends we hit customs ,they zipped through with photo ID and paper work which I admit they paid for from our government ,I with my birth certificate and drivers license (no photo then) was held back even though I could almost see my house.We had a good laugh has my friends stated I had “no rights” has a born Canadian ,landed ones have proof of adopted country’s citizenship ,I only had a useless birth certificate(wow). Later our government started issuing photos for medical,licenses but I now I am required to carry a passport just like my immigrated friends to get back home .

#106 TurnerNation on 05.15.13 at 8:25 am

Smoking man…I don’t watch movies myself so no passion for that project. Hollyweird, go figure.

He should have opened up a microbrewery . I’d pony up for early shares in this one.

#107 CP on 05.15.13 at 8:41 am

Lovely… (sorry in advance its the Sun… ugh)

Brampton realtor charged with stealing from home

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/14/brampton-realtor-shalinder-kapoor-charged-with-stealing-from-listed-homes

#108 gotthardbahn on 05.15.13 at 8:56 am

Hey Garth – You sound surprised by this development. The banks aren’t stupid, y’know. They can see which markets are growing and which markets are stagnating, or even atrophying. That’s why, for example, TD Bank features gay couples prominently in much of their advertising. It’s the new reality.

Is there a gay mortgage? — Garth

#109 benj on 05.15.13 at 9:07 am

Garth, this is the first post that made me ashamed to be a regular follower. This tilt at a windmill, seems intellectually dishonest for you. Nothing like a little xenophobic populism to stoke the fire, eh? Financial institutions do not give loans for ideological or inspirational reasons, they want to sell a product. And I think you, I or anyone else who is not a xenophobic redneck can guess why newcomers might be an attractive class of client. 35% is a very substantial amount even for a native Canadian, and the majority of immigrants are from economies where that is literally a fortune, meaning either the family has worked extremely hard to amass that amount or they are backed by wealth, either way the bank won’t be losing out. More importantly and correlated to a rigorous work ethic is the fact that a new immigrant is bound to be a more loyal life long customer, especially if a company is perceived to have ‘given them a shot.’ And while default rates are amazingly low for all mortgages, I would wager that if you could tease out that stat for newcomers, it would be even less than the average. Business is ruled by percentages and probabilities, not sentiment. I know you know that, why the shell game?

In a country where a few banks control the financial sector and are systemically important, a level playing field is in everyone’s best interests. If the banks were favouring women with home loans, the content of my post would be the same. There is nothing xenophobic or redneck about equality. — Garth

#110 Sebee on 05.15.13 at 9:08 am

#55 Good Authority
What guy?

>The neckless one in the photo.

#111 TorontoBull on 05.15.13 at 9:10 am

interesting topic. However, there are some additional factors to consider. For example, South Asian community are used to multigenerational cohabitation. Brampton has 3.5 persons per household compared to 2.5 for the City of Toronto. Hence, the mortgage payments are shared among more potential earners, which lowers the default risk from a banks perspective. If you look at it this way there is no discrimination….

#112 Rational Optimist on 05.15.13 at 9:13 am

85 An immigrant who won’t bring money to Canada

You should perhaps consider going to the UK, then. Or back to your home country if health care is better there (and I’m not doubting you that it very well may be).

#113 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 9:15 am

Todays post with regard to banks issuing mortgages to selective groups could be construed as discrimination, wouldn’t you say?

#114 blokexistentialist on 05.15.13 at 9:16 am

The polls were so absurdly far off in the B.C. election that I wondered last night if some tinkering (certainly a given in the mainstream media these days) had gone on to garner more votes for the B.C. Liberals.
This morning it appears others are wondering, too. Have seen nothing but weak explanations, however.
Then again, it could merely be that the fear of job loss (while being up to your eyeballs as per mortgage and debt) was enough.

#115 refinow on 05.15.13 at 9:16 am

You think the double standard for new immigrants is bad, consider this.

If you have owned a house for 20 years, never missed a payment, maintained an impeccable credit rating, and your debt servicing ratio is under 25%, need to refinance that home, you are restricted to a maximum of 80% of the current market value of the home.

But if you have never in your life owned a home or looking at acquiring a “new house” to buy that is in a price range you have never in your life considered, have 2 active trade lines on your equifax report, and the ink is dry on your employment letter verifying you have past probation for your new job…… you my friend get the privilege of 95% financing.

Ever wonder why? Other than the obvious that there is not enough money to back stop CMHC’s commitments to insure $600 Billion in mortgages. Yes…

But consider this if an existing home owner is allowed to refinance, the only moneys collected by our fair government is a measly top up portion on the Mortgage insurance premuim, could be $1,000 to $3,000.

But if they move, and I have posted this before, I had a client sold his $500,000 house, used the bulk of his equity to pay off his debts, and bought his new $750,000 home with 5% down.

When you calculate all of the revenues generated from Real Estate Fees, for buying and selling, the new CMHC premium on the new house, the potential CMHC premium from the buyer of the old house, Real Estate Commissions + HST, mortgage commissions, mortgage penalties , lawyers fees, and oh ya land transfer tax payable on both properties from the new house, which they were both in Toronto and guess what our revenue this transaction created,???????

Ready…..A Staggering $188,000 of revenue has just filtered back into the economy. The Government does not want you to refinance, and have $2,000 , when if they force you to move to consolidate, it generates 900 X more capital.

Hidden agenda? I THINK SO

#116 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 9:22 am

#32 Cristian: “So tuck that Canadian pride back where it belongs and swallow the fact that you cannot have immigrants for free.”

****************

Are Canadians begging immigrants to move to Canada…or are they simply looking for a better life?

#117 The American on 05.15.13 at 9:25 am

At #97: Smalltown Steve, yes, you are clearly smalltown. President Obama anti-business? Wow, that took some low swinging balls and the brain the size of a peanut to make that statement. Without him, there are a few tiny American companies such as GM and Chrysler. His moves saved American jobs, brought companies from the ashes, and today they are producing much more competitive automobiles.

#118 Spiltbongwater on 05.15.13 at 9:27 am

I heard on the radio I can buy 3 rental properties in 90 days with no money, no credit and no risk. Garth, I could be cashflowing 10K per month in 90 days with Steve Martel. Looking better then your balanced portfolio isn’t it?

Then do it and let us know how things turn out. It was on the radio. Must be okay. — Garth

#119 John Prine on 05.15.13 at 9:31 am

Lets see how gum chewin’ Christy handles the massive deficit budget she and her minions have created over the past 12 years. Pipelines and oil spills? Cant wait to see who she blames for that. BC Hydro going bankrupt with 50 Billion in contracts its on th ehook for? Sell it for a song to Christy’s friends like BC Rail.
*********************************************
Didn’t get elected in her own riding, yes, amazing results. Everybody that hates the Libs but fears NDP financial capabilities just held their noses for ten seconds and voted for the talk show host. The economy couldn’t be much worse here now. If we have a balanced budget in 4 years it will be because every dam, highway and park will have been sold. Looking for corporate and sovereign buyers.

#120 Give 'er jerbowski on 05.15.13 at 9:37 am

Immigration Minister Kenney just took credit for exporting a militant Muslim terrorist who had been in Canada on various appeals for the past 25 years.

Per Kenney’s email of yesterday … “Yesterday I was pleased to announce the successful deportation of convicted terrorist killer Mahmoud Mohammad Issa Mohammad from Canada.

Using loopholes and endless appeals available under Canada’s old, broken immigration system to delay his deportation for an astonishing 26 years, Mohammad represents just how broken Canada’s immigration and refugee determination systems had become under previous governments…”

Thank you Mr. Kenney.

This one can be pinned mostly on previous Liberal administrations with their ‘see no evil’ attitudes and platitudes. This case goes all the way back to Trudeau I believe.

Wait a minute. I guess that Mulroney would have had a shot at ridding Canada of this unsavory guest as well.

The current government has been in power for eight years. Blaming the last guys is getting old. — Garth

#121 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 9:51 am

#85 An immigrant: “What about car insurance companies which force you to take 1 or 2 million insurance where required minimum is only 200K? There are so many senseless and fraudulent things in Canada.”

***************

We’re not being ‘forced’ — just intimidated. Not satisfied with that, a few years ago ICBC was suggesting we take out $10 million liability insurance.

#122 Koshy Alex on 05.15.13 at 9:51 am

There is more mortgage fraud happening in Canada. I am myself an immigrant from south asia. I recently met a guy who is a from SL and he told me that he has been in Canada for 6 years, talking further he proudly told me that he owns a semi in Mississauga, he drives an suv, has one more small car. He has three kids, he works in a hotel for less than 25 hrs a week, wife works part time in TH, combined together they may have an annual income of 40 – 45K. The only thing I could not figure out is how he managed to get his mortgage approved, the SUV has also been purchased with a loan.

#123 An immigrant who won't bring money to Canada on 05.15.13 at 10:01 am

#112 Rational Optimist
Hmm, advising an immigrant that he can actually move to a better place… I never thought about it!

#124 thiscountryisgoing down the toilet on 05.15.13 at 10:04 am

#19V

“So what happens when the CRA goes after Immigrants income not being declared in Canada. Is this just a bluff by CRA or is something actually going to be done. Everyone needs a place to live; they don’t need gold bars. How can the “Canadian” compete? What sort of legacy is being left for our children. I guess I should get a job oversees pay a flat 10% tax and let my kids have access to health care and school for only 6 grand a year I pay in property taxes in Canada. This just isn’t right. It’s not about political correctness or racism it just plain isn’t right and the legacy being left is not pretty.”

You’re so right…but it isn’t politically correct to state the truth publicly as we see from Garths many defenses of the status quo. If yuou speak the obvious you’ll ber called a nazi, rascist, homophobe, child killer….and every other ad hominem in the liberal arsenal…..sad.

I remember listening to Stockwell Day announcing the caucasion job freeze in favor of an immigrant only policy for governments recieving federal funds.

I have had many non white Canadians (long time Canadians btw) come into my office complaining that their kids with UNI educations are told not to apply for government jobs that are being held or created for immigrants only. Apparently it’s a social crime not being ‘new’ enough. No G….the politically correct monster of liberalism is alive and well in Canada…..in spite of the high local unemployment among Canadian youth…..whose parents have spents hundreds of thousands in taxation to support their children through the educational system only to learn that they are not eligible……and it stinks to high heaven. You want proof? Go into the Cantonese community of established ethnic Canadians or the Taiwan community and ask around…..second and third generation need not apply…if you’re white….forget about it…

Now……we’ve upset the media in BC who were angling the stats towards a socialist win by the NDP…everyone was wrong except the voters……what a surprise. The one reporter for the Vanc Sun has been banging pots for the NDP for twenty years and had free reign to denounce the current government at every turn.

G…re #120……..C’mon……we have a legacy overburden of appointed liberal civil servants in every level of government….why do you think its so hard for the current government to get anything done? The judiciary is still fighting for the antiquated Trudeau social poicies of the 1970′s and we can’t seem to get them out……we have the liberal union flying banners over parliament for gods sake sating their political stand against the current government. No dude…its not ‘getting old’ as you said to blame the last guys…..it will take a generation of reeducation to swamp out the toxic mindset left behind by decades of propaganda.

#125 Canadian Watchdog on 05.15.13 at 10:07 am

CREA: Canadian home sales rise in April

Ottawa, ON, May 15, 2013 – According to statistics released today by The Canadian Real Estate Association (CREA), national home sales edged up slightly on a month-over-month basis in April 2013. Activity has generally held to within short reach of current levels for the past nine months.

There's only one question that seriously needs to be answered: How many sales are actually presales (2015) counted as resales and included in today's average price? I challenge any analyst or media to confront CREA on this issue and have them clarify, on record, how resale and presale data is compiled into national statistics.

Canada is the only developed nation that still doesn't report 'existing sales' which filters out new home sales.

#126 Dupcheck on 05.15.13 at 10:11 am

Ask yourself the question? Are they really doing a favour to the new immigrant or are they using them? Maybe they are afraid to do this to the born Canadians, because they know the rules better and can sue, not pay, or play games. When it comes to the new immigrants the banks can threaten and scare them, so do the businesses that hire them do to. They are all using them, low wages until they wake up and see that they can get a lot more somewhere else, do not fall for it. By not giving you a mortgage when you do not have a job, maybe that is a favour they are doing to you, do not be jealous for something that your ass is being saved.

#127 Confusions on 05.15.13 at 10:15 am

Getting a mortgage is not a social service where every person should get equal treatment. Think about it, banks lend money with expectation of earning a return on their loan. Instead of being parital towards new immigrants, the banks are actually discriminating agianst them by letting them take on a burden that they may not be able to repay, and in the end the bank gets to hold on to the underlying property.

Lending rules are a guardrail against banks and borrowers taking on an arrangement that is not good for the borrower. Having a looser standard just means that the borrower is getting lesser protection.

#128 Shankar on 05.15.13 at 10:19 am

Come one garth why aren’t you calling the banks racist pigs? You love invoking the modified version of godwin’s law.

Immigrants can be of any race.

#129 AK on 05.15.13 at 10:25 am

#97 Small Town Steve on 05.15.13 at 5:33 am
“Keystone won’t be built anytime soon”

“It won’t be approved until Obamamarx is out of office, rabid environmentalist, anti business, most UN American president in the history of the world tax successful people even more until they become ex-pats kind of president? ”

“Canada would be better off declaring a pipeline to our eastern refineries as well as the pipeline to the coast a national emergency and get them built. Build them to the same standards as the proposed Keystone line and tell Obama to go F his hat. Why sell it at a discount to WTI when we could be selling it at Brent prices AND have it to market before the Keystone line is even approved.”
——————————————————————–
If the Canadian politicians would get the shit out of the way, the construction would have started by now.

“TRP” and it’s shareholders are the ones taking the risk with this project. I don’t undrstand why the idiot politicians continue to debate the nonsense.

Once they get out of the way, the project will get approved.

#130 Dupcheck on 05.15.13 at 10:25 am

oh yeah i forgot: By putting the new immigrants to debt the banks and gov lock them to Canada for life or at least 25 years. We all know a lot of immigrants leave and go back after they get papers and money. Maybe we are forcefully populating a country where the average age is 50 or so? I don’t know, but I don’t think Canadian Gov is stupid. Look at the taxes and money they make on all of us. Maybe if the born Canadians had more kids and worked harder the country would be fine and we would not need new immigrants to take advantage off.

#131 Gin Singh on 05.15.13 at 10:32 am

Life is not Fair :-) I guess the guy on the left is Certified Canadian and The lady in pink just landed from pigland ?

#132 angel on 05.15.13 at 10:50 am

the feds are deliberately trying (and succeeding) to derail the national housing market by making it harder to people to score mortgages (like banning those 30-year amortizations), does this seem a tad odd to you? Even discriminatory?-Garth

lol now Garth is into conspiracy theories

That was stupid. — Garth

#133 S on 05.15.13 at 11:14 am

Long ago, during my oil patch days I knew many immigrant families from various countries and of different ethnic backgrounds. Many of these bought properties, first trailers then quickly upgrading to houses, sometimes within months of coming to this country. They wondered why Canadians wanted to waste their money on ATVs, snowmobiles or expensive stereos while choosing to rent. My Canadian friends mused why these new arrivals wanted to work 18 hour days just to make their mortgage payments (remember those eighties rates?). Part of an explanation may be that in most traditional societies a house represents more than just a place to live. It is seen as a foundation of a family. Perhaps banks recognize that view and think it a safe bet to give immigrants easier terms.
Just a possible explanation. That doesn’t make it fair. Certainly seems to fuel anti-immigrant sentiment.

#134 Waterloo Resident on 05.15.13 at 11:16 am

That lady in the picture; her name is Natacha Peyre

Google it and you will be amazed.

Here’s info about her from Wikipedia:

“Natacha Peyre Requena is a Swedish actress, singer, and glamour model. Today she is one of Scandinavia’s most successful glamour models. Born in Ibiza, Spain, she is half-Spanish on her mother’s side and fluent in Spanish, Swedish, and English.”

#135 Piccaso on 05.15.13 at 11:19 am

Why life isn’t fair

How much you want to bet that POS wasn’t in a stripper bar and paid for that pic. lol

#136 Canadian Watchdog on 05.15.13 at 11:24 am

So much for Flaherty's bail-in plan.

Newswires: ISDA proposing new CDS trigger event for bondholders being dragged into bank rescues

#137 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 05.15.13 at 11:26 am

MASTER OF DOOM MARC FABER IS FEELING GLOOMY ABOUT CANADA

http://www.republicbroadcasting.org/index.php?cmd=news.article&articleID=5270

Marc Faber, editor and publisher of The Gloom, Boom and Doom Report, was late to arrive to our Tuesday live discussion at Inside the Market alongside David Rosenberg. But we posed some of the questions you left for him in a later telephone conversation.

Before we did, however, we couldn’t resist asking him about his views on Canada. Not surprisingly, the famed economist known for his contrarian and often pessimistic bent didn’t exactly offer an uplifting view.

“I think Canada is a case where you have huge leverage in the private sector and where the economy is slowing down, where you have a strong currency and where the price levels are now relatively high,” Dr. Faber told us from Thailand. “I don’t think Canada is very inexpensive any more. I travel there all the time, it’s rather on the expensive side. I think there’s significant risk to the Canadian economy.”

The real estate market is key to his sour outlook on Canada. He thinks the Canadian housing market may very well be in bubble territory, and not just in Toronto and Vancouver, but also in other major cities such as Calgary where there has been significant price gains in recent years. He’s not necessarily calling for a crash, but suggests there certainly could be significant depreciation in real estate values ahead.

Dr. Faber says the policies of the Bush and Obama administrations in the U.S. have made Canada look good by comparison as a place for foreign real estate investors to park their cash. But, on recent visits to Canada, he’s observed a significant disconnect between selling prices of homes relative to what they really should be worth.

#138 Smartalox on 05.15.13 at 11:31 am

Targeting immigrants does seem a bit predatory:
- I’d be interested to know if immigrants with debts in their ‘old’ countries would still qualify for this sort of deal. Could it be that the banks appraise these loans without being able to check credit histories, simply because none exist? Or that Canada’s credit rating agencies can’t access data from foreign credit rating agencies? That seems short sighted and extremely unwise, and no guarantee against future default.
- I wonder if immigrants from countries where unsecured debt is not a part of the consumer culture are targeted, as opposed to immigrants from those countries where consumer debt is popular.
- I wonder if immigrants from countries where only land-owners enjoy democratic rights are targeted, with the lie that immigrants must own property in order to benefit from Canada’s rights and freedoms.

#139 Tom Vu on 05.15.13 at 11:41 am

#127 Shankar on 05.15.13 at 10:19 am

Come one garth why aren’t you calling the banks racist pigs? You love invoking the modified version of godwin’s law.

Immigrants can be of any race.
===================================

Not necessarily:

If we don’t like your looks , and the way you drive …you are an immigrant.

Everybody else welcome …no prejudice here !

#140 Post Haste on 05.15.13 at 12:03 pm

This very fact that Garth has brought today is why I sadly must prep my kid’s that as they grow older, our society will deny them entry or access to jobs, schools because they are not viewed as part of a mandate.

My parents came from War torn Europe and faced discrimination first hand while living in both Montreal and Toronto. They kept it pretty much quiet towards us as they feared we would be brought up “hating” those who created these obstacles for them.

I, have a different view with my kids – life isn’t fair – and you must be prepared to face rejection based solely on your status, I am careful not to let my kids think that opportunities won’t be available, but that you must make your own opportunities – and nothing more – I won’t look at life with rose rimmed glasses – Thanks Garth for such an enlighten post -

#141 jess on 05.15.13 at 12:32 pm

ambivalence towards having children

450 students left behind ? declining enrollments = loss of $3 million in state funding since 2010.

http://news.yahoo.com/michigan-district-fires-teachers-closes-every-school-012040117.html

#142 Steven on 05.15.13 at 12:39 pm

Take the test. You’ll discover that the banks will refuse a mortgage to the Canadian and offer it to the new arrival. At a time when the feds are deliberately trying (and succeeding) to derail the national housing market by making it harder to people to score mortgages (like banning those 30-year amortizations), does this seem a tad odd to you? Even discriminatory?

Garth it sounds like the government and banks of Canada are both anti canadian and anti white!
Discriminatory indeed!

I think immigrants (like native Canadians) come in all colours. — Garth

#143 Randy on 05.15.13 at 12:40 pm

Is the Canadian Housing Market Falling Apart?

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100725735

#144 Humpty Dumpty on 05.15.13 at 12:47 pm

USDA Admits Exterminating Birds, Crops, and Bees

The government is committing what many people would call a crime. Killing mass amounts of animals via poison is a flagrant act of violence against nature that should not be tolerated or encouraged. People aren’t allowed to hunt in certain regions of the United States, but the government is allowed to kill off animals by the millions. Something is terribly wrong with this picture.

In recent years the world honey bee population has plummeted in North America. This is important because bee pollination is crucial for the fertilization of many crops. Just as many potential explanations arose over the mysterious bird deaths, many different theories have been proposed to explain the bee decline.

Electromagnetic radiation, malnutrition, and climate have all taken the heat of critics looking for answers. Recently, however, a document was leaked revealing that a bee-killing pesticide put in use by the EPA may be to blame. Adding to the controversy, more records have emerged showing that the USDA was fully aware of the pesticide’s threat to not only bees, but humans. The two-month-old report released by the USDA itself unveiled that the toxic insecticide used on plants are not only a threat to insects’ central nervous systems, but are also a threat to the internal systems of humans.

#145 Tripp on 05.15.13 at 1:09 pm

#112 Rational Optimist

“…back to your home country if health care is better there”.

No reason to take this personally. The quality of the Canadian healthcare has nothing to do with #85′s address. He just pointed to a fact, albeit in a very blunt manner.

There are countries that have better HC than Canada, I come from one. It is a reality and shooting the messenger does not help. What would work though is removing the ideology from this equation and learn from the better performers.

Some useful links:

http://www.oecd.org/canada/BriefingNoteCANADA2012.pdf
http://www.fcpp.org/publication.php/3222
http://www.cdhowe.org/pdf/Commentary_339.pdf

#146 Rational Optimist on 05.15.13 at 1:10 pm

123 An immigrant who won’t bring money to Canada

I just don’t get it. If you feel like you were the victim of people who convinced you that Canada is the land of milk and honey, I can certainly sympathize. But you say you can afford a plane ticket home, so why not? Why, exactly, would you want to apply for Canadian citizenship- want to become a Canadian- if in five paragraphs you can not muster one gracious or complimentary comment about the country?

#147 Holy Crap Wheres The Tylenol on 05.15.13 at 1:35 pm

#128 AK on 05.15.13 at 10:25 am

#97 Small Town Steve on 05.15.13 at 5:33 am
“Keystone won’t be built anytime soon”

“It won’t be approved until Obamamarx is out of office, rabid environmentalist, anti business, most UN American president in the history of the world tax successful people even more until they become ex-pats kind of president? ”

“Canada would be better off declaring a pipeline to our eastern refineries as well as the pipeline to the coast a national emergency and get them built. Build them to the same standards as the proposed Keystone line and tell Obama to go F his hat. Why sell it at a discount to WTI when we could be selling it at Brent prices AND have it to market before the Keystone line is even approved.”
——————————————————————–
If the Canadian politicians would get the shit out of the way, the construction would have started by now.

“TRP” and it’s shareholders are the ones taking the risk with this project. I don’t understand why the idiot politicians continue to debate the nonsense.

Once they get out of the way, the project will get approved.

Just unloaded on this issue yesterday in the blog. Government should not get in the way of business. If government was in the business of business, they would be out of business! The only thing a government should do is legislate protective laws for the people, by the people. They should collect taxes and distribute them accordingly back into the county level. I have no problems with social programs such as health care but make the health care industry and for that matter every industry they deal with accountable! As for the pipeline build this newer bigger pipeline east and west. China has an appetite, so does Europe. Then let Canada be the Oil bread basket to the world. Oh wouldn’t that hurt OPEC? Dam right it would! I would be willing to wager that Europe and China would want to purchase safe Canadian fuel from a stable democratic country than a bunch of unstable, despotic hard line dictators that rule their desert wastelands with an iron fist whilst indoctrinating hatred of the west into the uneducated masses that procreate more fear and hatred every day.
Build the dam pipeline! Build it Mr Harper! Go tell everyone to get the Hell out of the way we’re diggin!!!!

#148 Tom Vu on 05.15.13 at 1:57 pm

I think immigrants (like native Canadians) come in all colours. — Garth

===================================

They have discovered genetic marker that distinguishes Canadians from immigrants.

Details soon

#149 jess on 05.15.13 at 2:05 pm

Do you include these 2,200 people as the “uneducated masses ?”

http://grist.org/climate-energy/arkansas-town-in-lockdown-after-oil-spill-nightmare/

The people of Arkansas deserve a full explanation from Exxon about how this incident occurred and the extent of damages to private property and to our state’s natural resources,” McDaniel said. “My office is determined to get that explanation through our investigation because, at the moment, we still have many more questions than we do answers.”
UPDATE: McDaniel reported Friday morning that there is oil in Lake Conway despite ExxonMobil’s assurances to the contrary. “Great efforts have been taken to limit the spread of the oil to only one area of Lake Conway, which is referred to as the Cove, but the Cove and Lake Conway are hydrologically connected and are therefore one body of water,” Aaron Sadler, spokesman for McDaniel, told Grist. Meanwhile, access to the site continues to be tightly policed. According to InsideClimate, ExxonMobil threatened reporter Lisa Song with arrest on Wednesday when she entered the command center looking for government officials.

#150 ronthecivil on 05.15.13 at 2:07 pm

Wow, at the very last minute, BC actually grew a brain, if only for a few brief seconds!

Unfortunately, we’re still (slightly less) screwed.

#151 Rational Optimist on 05.15.13 at 2:09 pm

144 Tripp on 05.15.13 at 1:09 pm

You missed the very next part of my sentence: “and I’m not doubting you that it very well may be.”

I don’t work in health care, so I don’t take any comment on the Canadian system personally.

#152 Ronaldo on 05.15.13 at 2:23 pm

#142 Randy on 05.15.13 at 12:40 pm
”Is the Canadian Housing Market Falling Apart?”

Not according to Benji. We’re different here.

http://www.bnn.ca/News/2012/08/23/Housing-crash-fears-overblown-CIBC.aspx

#153 Grim Reaper/Crypt Speculator Ⓤ on 05.15.13 at 2:33 pm

As you know, in my career, I am the least discriminatory person there is. All races, creeds etc.

However, I have become a student of the differences of my clients yet still binds us all like sh*t to a blanket in this vast country from sea to shining sea.

Here are some of my notes:

Maritimers:

A man from Newfoundland went into the fish market to apply for a job. The boss thought to himself, “I’m not hiring that lazy Newf”, so he decided to set a test for the Newfie hoping he wouldn’t be able to answer the questions and he’d be able to refuse him the job without getting into an argument.

The first question was, “Without using numbers, represent the number 9.” Newfie says, “Dat’s easy” and proceeds to draw three trees. The boss says, “What in the world is that?” Newfie says, “Tree ‘n tree ‘n tree makes nine.” “Fair enough” says the boss.

“Second question, same rules, but represent 99″. Newfie stares into space for a while, then makes a smudge on each tree. “Der ya go bye,” he says. The boss scratches his head and asks, “How on earth do you get that to represent 99?” Newfie answers, “Each tree is dirty now, so it’s dirty tree ‘n dirty tree ‘n dirty tree – dat 99.”

The boss is getting worried he’s going to have to hire the newf so he says, “All right, question number 3. Same rules again, but this time represent the number 100.” Newfie stares into space again, then he shouts, “I got it!” He makes a little mark at the base of each tree and says, “Der ya go sir -100.”

The boss looks at Newfie’s attempt and thinks, “Ha! got him this time.” He then tells Newfie, “Go on, Newfie, you must be crazy if you think that represents a 100.”

Newfie leans forward and points to the little marks at the tree bases and says, “A little dog comes along and craps near the base of each tree, so now ya got dirty tree an’ a turd, dirty tree an’ a turd, and dirty tree an’ a turd, which makes 100.

When do I start me job?”

#154 Sasquatch on 05.15.13 at 2:54 pm

my question is how many immigrants have 35% to put down on a Canadian property? Most that I have met had around nothing to not more than the average middle income Canadian.

How ever it does appear that the rules have changed. Back around 2007, a immigrant with a less than 20% down payment, steady employment, and sound financial background from the UK had zero chance of a mortage in Canada for 3 years.

Now a Philippine with a similar situation can get a mortage no prob. Seems the banks are dropping standards to take on more risk just to make a sale.

#155 World View on 05.15.13 at 2:55 pm

There may not be a Canadian without job who can come up with 35% downpayment. In fact there may not be a Canadian who can come up with 35% downpayment even with a job. If a Canadian can and especially without a job, then he/she is wise enough not to buy a house. So he/she will not approach a bank for a mortgage.

So the comparison between Canadians and immigrants is difficult and probably hypothetical.

Regarding the banks’ behavior, Canadian Banks have been incredibly prudent lenders. Cant you see how stable they have been since the crisis.

#156 jess on 05.15.13 at 3:09 pm

the truth is hilarious

GHOST COMPANIES LLP schemes
Private Eye Investigates
An investigation into how Limited Liability Partnerships are used to launder the proceeds of crime across Europe
Private Eye Issue 1340, 14th May 2013
Video – 07:17 mins
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/eyeplayer.php

#157 Patiently Waiting on 05.15.13 at 3:13 pm

Lase 60 days reported combined sales of single family homes by the REBGV & FVREB demonstrate that sales are 35% lower than 2012, 47% below 2011, and 35% lower than 2008. Here are the numbers:

Year Sales of SFH’s (last 60 days)

2013 2709
2012 4139
2011 5068
2010 4787
2009 4353
2008 4143
—————————————————————

White Rock Sales just as bad …

Year Sales of SFH’s (last 60 days)

2013 179
2012 235
2011 477
2010 290
2009 229
2008 189

——————————————————

Last 30 days numbers are even lower, indicating that the trend is getting worse … as Garth said many times, sales fall first, prices then follow …

Cheers
pw

#158 Bill Gable on 05.15.13 at 3:16 pm

Fears of a housing “meltdown” are unfounded and the Canadian housing market “will be able to pull off the fabled soft landing,” says BMO chief economist Doug Porter.
In fact, the Canadian housing market is now “calm, cool and collected,” notes Porter in the wake of the release of housing numbers that show sales edged up just slightly in April from March but declined 3.1 per cent year over year.

>> Yeah, right.

Link: http://tinyurl.com/av2s3g5

#159 Bargains everywhere on 05.15.13 at 4:21 pm

#151 Ronaldo

I saw the interview with Benjamin Tal as well. The funniest part was when Howard pressed him as to whether he’d buy a condo in Toronto or a house in BC right now and he answered that he’d probably wait six months.

Interesting how someone can talk out of both sides of his mouth at the same time.

#160 SM_YYC on 05.15.13 at 4:34 pm

Hi Garth

Are you planing a speaking series in Calgary sometime this year?

Will you all behave? — Garth

#161 espressobob on 05.15.13 at 5:05 pm

As someone who has been self employed for thirty (30) years I find immigrants a boon to my business. These individuals are hungry to provide better services & supplies to those open minded enough to realize it!

Enough with prejudice, its getting old!

#162 GoldTank on 05.15.13 at 5:15 pm

Gold and metals tanking again….here comes the next leg down on the bubble pop….CPI numbers tomorrow morning, could send gold to $1350 easy.

#163 Tom Vu on 05.15.13 at 5:46 pm

Canadian Genetic markers:

Zamboni is top priority versus Health and Education

You know Casey and Finnegan are NOT a Celtic rock band or imported beer.

You dismiss all beers under 6% as “for children and the elderly.”

You know who Foster Hewitt is.

The trunk of your car doubles as a freezer.

Bonus DNA: Genetic Marker for Ontario
Q: How do you know Adam was from Ontario?
A: Who else could stand beside a naked woman and be tempted by a fruit?

#164 Tom Vu on 05.15.13 at 5:51 pm

#159 SM_YYC on 05.15.13 at 4:34 pm

Hi Garth

Are you planing a speaking series in Calgary sometime this year?

Will you all behave? — Garth

==================================

I advise Garth not to go.

Last time I gave seminar there, this bunch from Eastern Canada crashed the gig.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfW8kNAzOOs

#165 Smartalox on 05.15.13 at 5:55 pm

An interesting article that I linked to through the Globe and Mail:

http://nymag.com/thecut/

The author of the article evaluated the spending habits of the Great Gatsby, making a plausible case that Gatsby was spending well beyond his means, and was headed for a crash of his own.

I never really considered the story in this context, I always took Gatsby’s wealth as a given, but this analysis opens up a whole new theme in the book – that Gatsby was living beyond his means, even for the time. His excessive spending was all a ruse, a desperate put-on to impress people, or at least, one woman.

It’s been a while since I studied the book, but it might make an interesting discussion point for high school students, a counterpoint to the teenage obsession with brand name spending and a lavish credit-fuelled spending just to impress others.

My recollection of Gatsby’s lifestyle also brought to mind the spending habits of friends, relatives and ‘big spenders’ caught in the credit bubble, fooled into thinking they’re rich by easy money. Sounds to me like a lot of the same symptoms, but then again, it’s neveR different.

#166 Devore on 05.15.13 at 5:56 pm

#90 Djura

What’s wrong tonight? Almost everyone sees this as some kind of gift or what instead of sharp fishing hook.

Where did I say it was an advantage or a gift? I commented on the racism aspect. Only thing wrong tonight is reading comprehension.

#167 JuliaS on 05.15.13 at 6:10 pm

#153 Sasquatch

I am an immigrant myself. Where I come from, there is no middle class. There’s the poor and the rich, with nothing inbetween. 35% downpayment is no small potato, so for a country such as mine it would be a good litmus test. If you have that much, there’s likely more where it came from. If you don’t have that much, you probably got nothing (waiting to collect your next welfare cheque).

Canada has a relatively exuberant middle class compared to all the lands from which it receives visitors. I am personally familiar with 2 groups of immigrants – poor people escaping real hardships in their homeland and criminals – wolves in sheep’s clothing sheltering from law or funneling money to/from businesses and relatives.

Which of the 2 groups, you think, an immigrant belongs to if he has 100K+ on hand?

#168 JuliaS on 05.15.13 at 6:11 pm

#108

Is there a gay mortgage? — Garth

Show me one that isn’t!

#169 ronthecivil on 05.15.13 at 6:12 pm

Fears of a housing “meltdown” are unfounded and the Canadian housing market “will be able to pull off the fabled soft landing,” says BMO chief economist Doug Porter.

At least he acknowledged that it’s a fable!

#170 Steven on 05.15.13 at 6:14 pm

think immigrants (like native Canadians) come in all colours. — Garth

Do you mean varying shades of brown Garth?

You are done here. Bye-bye. — Garth

#171 Devore on 05.15.13 at 6:17 pm

#111 TorontoBull

South Asian community are used to multigenerational cohabitation. Brampton has 3.5 persons per household compared to 2.5 for the City of Toronto.

3.5 seems very low, considering Brampton is a bedroom community, and CoT is crammed with studio apartments and yuppie DINKs.

#172 Devore on 05.15.13 at 6:20 pm

#114 blokexistentialist

Or maybe NDP supporters couldn’t be arsed to get off their couches to cast votes (wouldn’t be the first time), or the polling methodologies are busted. Why blame everything on a government conspiracy or media bias? Plenty of incompetence to go around everywhere.

#173 happy renter on 05.15.13 at 6:52 pm

B.C. people who voted Liberal are brain dead.How can any logical person in their right mind forgive a goverment to lie,cheat,steal ,impose draconian taxes to the people and take many rights away for 12 years .B.C. serfdom for our children.

#174 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 05.15.13 at 7:15 pm

OK…Can someone help me make sense of this ?

What I am reading into this
(i) Canadian Citizen versus
(ii)Immigrants

……is an open invitation to bring in any funds from any foreign source aka laundered ?….whereas the local person is deemed a poor risk.

Or …in other words…they know the average Canadian can’t afford a house…but welcome the foreign money, no questions asked.

The Great White North $$$$$ laundromat ?

#175 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.15.13 at 7:23 pm

Before the real estate slump:

Everybody hates Garth Turner and his blog, because he says things we don’t want to hear, and he’s wrong.
He is telling people lies, the bastard.

After the real estate slump:

Everybody hates Garth Turner and his blog, because he says things we don’t want to hear, and he’s right.
He is telling people the truth, the bastard.

I feel so much better. — Garth

#176 DonDWest on 05.15.13 at 7:26 pm

If you believe mortgage lending practices are in favor of recent immigrants; you should check out business lending practices. Believe me, I know this from first hand experience. The amount of capita I have to come up with as a young white man just for any banker to even have a look am me is astronomical compared to say Chan, Abdul, and Ahkmar.

For me, if I want to get a 100K loan for a business I need 100K in the bank. For a recent immigrant, if they look hard enough they may just 100k worth IN GRANTS from various programs sponsored heavily by both our banks and government institutions.

Although, let’s keep on telling ourselves that immigrants are more entrepreneurial than the locals. After all, financing has NOTHING to do with it. . . Then once that immigrant creates a business, he/she only hires people of their own skin color, but that’s not racism. . .

#177 big town on 05.15.13 at 7:55 pm

This could be trouble down the line if those areas of new immigrants are forced to bail and we end up with swaths of empty houses that are not wanted by the general population who prefer to live in more generic areas. This whole attitude by the banks to give preference to new immigrants without jobs SMELLS very bad. I am floored by this. Never imagined I was second rate. Immigrants must think we are fools.

‘Generic’ areas. Wow. — Garth

#178 FATHER on 05.15.13 at 7:59 pm

dorf & garth, that was the best laugh today

#179 JuliaS on 05.15.13 at 8:18 pm

#172 happy renter

“How can any logical person in their right mind forgive a goverment to lie,cheat,steal ,impose draconian taxes to the people and take many rights away…”

For the punch line, how about presenting us with a honest, generous, fiscally conservative and freedom loving alternative.

#180 America's Sheeple Have Been Shifted into a Smaller Corral, With No Commotion on 05.15.13 at 8:23 pm

Please consider the implications of some recent events in America:

Your post was deleted because it was copied word-for-word from here. Wingnut. — Garth

#181 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.15.13 at 8:24 pm

“Canada needs immigrants, of course. So does our economy. Without immigration our population would atrophy and without the investment, skill and desire that newcomers bring, we’d all be poorer.”

This statement is true.
It is also true to say that a lot of these immigrants are Irish, Australian, British, Russian, and Other European.

You will find them working in remote bush camps for mining and oil and gas.

These are places that Canadians didn’t want to work because they didn’t want to live in __________.

#182 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.15.13 at 8:25 pm

It is also true to say that I should be on equal footing with immigrants from __________.

#183 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.15.13 at 8:26 pm

#177 – He sure takes it on the chin like a champ.

#184 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 8:32 pm

#78 Screwed: “BC will continue to do well.”

*****************************

http://cbc.sh/yhEV4Lm

B.C.’s debt rating downgraded by Moody’s.

#185 Herb on 05.15.13 at 8:32 pm

#152 Grim Reaper etc.

you can come and get me anytime. I’d enjoy the trip with you.

#186 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 8:49 pm

#149 ronthecivil: “Wow, at the very last minute, BC actually grew a brain, if only for a few brief seconds!
Unfortunately, we’re still (slightly less) screwed.”

********************

Many people in BC simply ‘held their noses’ while they voted for the lesser of two evils. There is no real victory. Just resignation.

#187 Daisy Mae on 05.15.13 at 9:03 pm

#174 Pulp: “Everybody hates Garth Turner and his blog, because he says things we don’t want to hear, and he’s right. He is telling people the truth, the bastard.”

I feel so much better. — Garth

********************

Very good! :-)

People just don’t want to, and often can’t, accept the truth. But I’m very, very, very glad we’re getting it!

#188 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.15.13 at 11:34 pm

“Many people in BC simply ‘held their noses’ while they voted for the lesser of two evils. There is no real victory. Just resignation.”
===================

That’s the most accurate analysis I’ve heard yet.

#189 welfare & free medicare on 05.16.13 at 1:03 am

screw you roundeye. we are coming for your natural resources and your politicians and bankers are handing them to us without a shot fired

#190 Pulp Faction (Dorf) on 05.16.13 at 1:07 am

“Many people in BC simply ‘held their noses’ while they voted for the lesser of two evils. There is no real victory. Just resignation.”

That’s the most accurate analysis that I have read yet.

I shared your quote on my FB page and everybody loves it !

#191 Julie on 05.16.13 at 1:28 am

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/story/2013/05/14/bc-liberals-christy-clark-election.html

Crusty loses her seat….but the party wins majority….and she is the dictator in charge…..and still gets to “rule” BC. The federal system is the same…..

This is why we don’t vote in our house. Our system is shameful and disgusting. Its like the USSR without AK-47s.

#192 Jonah on 05.16.13 at 5:59 pm

Thank God, I am no longer an immigrant.