The trouble with old people

oh shit

“Every Friday,” Ross says, “I play hockey with a bunch of guys who are over 55.  I’m a goalie, so even though I’m not 55, they let me play – I guess it’s hard to find 55 year old guys whose knees are willing to bounce up and down off the ice for an hour and half.

“Anyways, I overheard a conversation in the dressing room last Friday that I thought I’d share with you. It’s notable because (a) it was the first time I’d ever heard it, and (b) it completely validates what you have been saying for the past few years.

“I overheard one of the older guys (over 60) mention to the guy beside him (over 70) that he and his wife were thinking about selling their family home, and renting, in order to get some of the money that was locked up in the house.   The over-70 guy nodded in approval.  The over-60 guy asked if he had heard of anyone doing this before, as they couldn’t see any other way to continue to fund their retirement.

“The over-70 guy nodded, and said “yup, we did it a couple of years ago.  We’ve been renting now for two years – we had to do it, because we couldn’t afford the property taxes each year anymore”. So, my hat is off to you.  Two old guys who cough up $5 a few times a week to fire a puck around are selling the family homesteads and renting, just like you said would happen.”

Not so fast, Ross. Listen to Teresa.

“I’ve been a loyal reader for many years now, and I’ve spoken ad nauseum to whomever with a pair of ears to not buy RE right now. This includes my parents, of course, who this week just decided to make what I believe to be a very rash decision, and I just don’t know how to explain it to them… Perhaps you can help.

“They own a nice bungalow in the Montreal suburbs in, yes, a high demand area (houses regularly sell under 30 days in the area). My mother has had enough of the cleaning, maintenance and all that is required of owning a house. My father agreed and they immediately fell in love with this spanking new condo/penthouse just a few streets down, in the same area. The penthouse is 420k for 1300 sq ft, house is worth 360k. They will roughly bag in 110k in profits, which will be used to pay off the business debts (20k) and credit cards (??) accumulated when my father was building his business. They expect to have a mortgage of roughly 360k. I have no clue how much RSP or invested money they have, but probably not that much considering the years my father slaved to build up his business. Oh, and did I mention they had just locked their 5 year mortgage this summer?

“I mentioned having a mortgage beyond 65 sounds like a bad idea, but then again my dad’s a workaholic; mortgage or not, he will work till he drops. I don’t want to play the bad daughter here, but I find this all a bit too quick and rash, considering it’s a huge decision. They are just coming out of the debt tunnel and now this? I wish they would decide to rent and put as much money as possible into their savings, but I’m running out of arguments here. Can you please help me find the words?”

I juxtapose these letters for a reason. Real estate’s soon to be massively impacted by what the Boomers do, and it will not be monolithic. Some will downsize. Some will croak shoveling. Others will bail. Because most of them are just hitting 60 now (half a million a year for the next seven), there’s no template for what happens next. Nobody’s gone through it.

What we do know is that seven in ten will have no pension (other than the crumbs government gives), over 40% don’t have even a hundred grand saved and 78% own real estate. We also know the wrinklies make up 32% of the population.

That’s a higher proportion than in the US, where there’s a lot of talk about the coming “great senior sell-off.” It’s expected to start later this decade and usher in the next monumental housing crash, about 2020. Hmm. Seven years from now – not exactly the news you need if you’re 36 years old and shouldering a $450,000 mortgage.

One problem is way too many of the wrong kinds of houses. Just over 80% of all new builds in the last two decades across North America were single-family homes, mostly big and mostly in the burbs. There just aren’t enough young families in the demographic pipeline to suck up all that supply. And even if just a third of the Boomers try to convert their properties into much-needed cash flow, the market will be swamped. Prices will reflect that. Real estate as an asset class has a very poor future, no matter how cheap mortgages may get.

Ross’ hockey buddies are early adapters. Each year going forward there’ll be tens of thousands of new listings across the country from people who face a bleak retirement. If you’re a wrinklie, the longer you wait the greater the risk you’ll be selling for pennies on the dollars you expected.

Now, Teresa. What about her newly-mortgaged parents and their fancy digs? These cash-poor seniors have taken out a fat, 25-year mortgage that (statistically) they’ll never live long enough to pay off. They have diddly in the way of savings, no pension, and not enough money coming out of the house to invest and live off.

And yet here they are, moving into a luxury, spanking-new, sexy, spacious, hedonistic, penthouse condo.

So much for that inheritance. Damn hippies.

215 comments ↓

#1 Mississauga on 03.27.13 at 8:38 pm

Live in your parent’s basement as long at you can (well at least 5 years until the market hits bottom).

#2 T.O. Bubble Boy on 03.27.13 at 8:41 pm

Good thing the GTA has all of those multi-generational families to buy up the ridiculous 4000 sqft McMansions.

Will this save Brampton and Markham?

#3 TurnerNation on 03.27.13 at 8:41 pm

More like damn yippies.

#4 Ronaldo on 03.27.13 at 8:45 pm

Teresa, you better do up a balance sheet with your parents and determine whether you want to be on the will or not. You could be inheriting a lot of trouble by the looks of it.

#5 ange on 03.27.13 at 8:48 pm

#1

#6 Randy on 03.27.13 at 8:50 pm

It’s pitiful….Governments try to deal with demographic changes that we knew about for almost thirty years by spending us into oblivion….and printing money…

#7 Chester on 03.27.13 at 8:52 pm

The old farts got no one to blame but themselves.

#8 Ronaldo on 03.27.13 at 8:58 pm

For many people, it takes them a lifetime of work to save $100,000 excluding their home equity and only a few years to spend it.

10 years ago a neighbor retired. He was 65. Had his own business. Did heavy duty mechanic work. No pension, and $150,000 in RSP’s. Wife did not work. They owned a small home (100,000) which he rented to his son and wife which basically just covered the expenses.

They rented a small cottage for about $700. Only gov’t pensions. 5 years later, he tells me that he has burned throught his RSP’s and is now $50,000 in debt. They since moved away and I have no idea how they are making out. Many stories like that I suspect.

#9 observer on 03.27.13 at 9:00 pm

You know I hear the same thing. The oldies think they can work forever. The problem is, most companies don’t want these guys sticking around when they can hire fresh blood to grow with the company.

Just like a hockey team, once they get old they end up on the 4th line then kapoot off the minors then out the door.

At 70, if the hours gets cut or they get laid off, good luck finding another job. Except mabey as a Walmart greeter!

#10 Tom Vu on 03.27.13 at 9:03 pm

Re Photo:

I thought Queen Elizabeth liked Corgis.

#11 Bill Gable on 03.27.13 at 9:05 pm

“If I had a Million Dollars”….

Vancouverites are living in la la land.

“VANCOUVER – If I had a million dollars … I’d buy you a house (And a new survey suggests I would probably buy you that house with big yard in the suburbs.)

When asked what type of housing they’d buy if given $1 million, 34 per cent of renters and property owners in the Lower Mainland and Fraser Valley surveyed would rather have a large house and property in a suburban setting, compared with just 12 per cent who would opt for a luxury apartment in the city, according to a Mustel Research Group poll.

The poll, conducted for REW.ca, a real estate search website owned by Glacier Media Inc., surveyed 561 adults between Feb. 28 and March 12

>> Help Me Rhonda!

Link: http://tinyurl.com/c8c4se9

#12 Randy on 03.27.13 at 9:05 pm

My real estate agent delivered a pizza to my house tonite….I gave him a $3 tip…

#13 not 1st on 03.27.13 at 9:09 pm

Garth, you are wrong. Somebody HAS already gone through it….Japan. Look where they are. Worlds largest debt, worlds oldest population, worlds longest stock market decline. no growth or investments, cash in safes and mattresses, deflation..etc.

Some of these boomers are dreaming when they say they are going to work until they drop. Most think they are still 40 when the stats clearly say the last decade of life is spent in some degree of chronic illness. So what if you CAN’T work or employers won’t hire you. I see 25 year old immigrants running circles around the geriatrics everywhere. Most can’t work a computer, or a smart phone or move people through a cashier quickly. Who is going to hire your wrinkly a**?

#14 Daisy Mae on 03.27.13 at 9:12 pm

“They expect to have a mortgage of roughly 360k…”

***************

That, alone, is terrifying!

#15 The trouble with old people — Greater Fool – Authored by Garth Turner – The Troubled Future of Real Estate | The Affluent Boomer™ on 03.27.13 at 9:12 pm

[...] I juxtapose these letters for a reason. Real estate’s soon to be massively impacted by what the Boomers do, and it will not be monolithic. Some will downsize. Some will croak shoveling. Others will bail. Because most of them are just hitting 60 now (half a million a year for the next seven), there’s no template for what happens next. Nobody’s gone through it. Continue reading → [...]

#16 Cory on 03.27.13 at 9:12 pm

Garth,
Are you sure Canada isn’t at risk of banks and govt stealing depositors (aka savers)cash? Then why is this specifically mentioned in this years budget?

http://www.jsmineset.com/2013/03/27/strong-move-to-scare-big-money-out-of-too-big-to-fail-banks/

Read enough gold-humping sites and you’ll come to believe anything. — Garth

#17 Marc in Montréal on 03.27.13 at 9:18 pm

Some Quebec Provincial Homebuilders Association (APPCHQ) Numbers

-Compared to 10 years ago, people in Québec take almost twice as much time to come up with a cashdown of 10% to buy a house.

-In 2001 people needed 5 years to come up with the 10%, compared to 9.6 years in 2012.

-Housing today accounts for 26% of Québécois’ budget.

My “guess” : that later % will skyrocket in a few years as progessively home owners who bought when price where still decent are replaced with people who did when it was just the opposite.

http://argent.canoe.ca/vos-finances/immobilier/immobilier-presque-10-ans-pour-amasser-la-mise-de-fonds-27032013

#18 Mister Obvious on 03.27.13 at 9:25 pm

“…most companies don’t want these guys sticking around when they can hire fresh blood to grow with the company.”
—————————–

More like fresh blood who do exactly as they’re told.

#19 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 03.27.13 at 9:26 pm

The frightening ( and annoying) thing is…..
The banks will gladly mortgage these “almost retirement age” people…. WTF?

#20 Ronaldo on 03.27.13 at 9:27 pm

#9 Observer -

”At 70, if the hours gets cut or they get laid off, good luck finding another job. Except mabey as a Walmart greeter!”

From what I have experienced, and that is going back 15 years or more. 55 is pushing it as far as trying to get work after being laid off.

Companies are looking for young, energetic computer literate, gung ho people to fill those vacant positions.

The problem with many geezers like myself is that they have trouble with all the high tech changes being thrown at them and a lot of them tend to buck it.

For myself, I was fortunate in that I was involved with computers when they first were introduced into the workplace in the early 80′s and was able to grow with it. Still though, when I was laid off at 54, even with my many years of experience in a vaiety of fields, I had great difficulty in finding employment. Many resumes went unanswered.

I suspect too that once you get over that magical number 50, you could be viewed as a potential LTD problem. Just my take on it.

#21 Smoking Man on 03.27.13 at 9:30 pm

#9 observer on 03.27.13 at 9:00 pm
You know I hear the same thing. The oldies think they can work forever. The problem is, most companies don’t want these guys sticking around when they can hire fresh blood to grow with the company.

Just like a hockey team, once they get old they end up on the 4th line then kapoot off the minors then out the door.

At 70, if the hours gets cut or they get laid off, good luck finding another job. Except mabey as a Walmart greeter!
………………………………………………………………

You’re so dumb……………its funny

Oldies have loot and a perfectly groomed via school, obidiant certificate totting goddy too shoes slaves. Who work hard for next to nothing.

Us oldies will start small business and get your generation to play slave…..

You will be happy cause you swallowed the cool aid beilive hard work on your own free time(Home work) will get you the prize teacher taught you.

The prize a JOB…..

Us old farts got to watch our backs, the drop outs, they dont play by the same rules.

#22 HAWK on 03.27.13 at 9:30 pm

#4 Ronaldo on 03.27.13 at 8:45 pm

=============

Can you inherit other people’s debt in Canada?

(I mean besides the leech government putting ever more taxes on people for their debt binges)

#23 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 03.27.13 at 9:30 pm

@#8 Ronaldo
I know of two families in the past year where their financial ignorance and unpreparedness for retirement resulted in….suicide.

How much you wanna bet THAT ugly little statistic is gonna climb over the next decade amoung the elderly.

#24 mortgagebrokeron on 03.27.13 at 9:30 pm

I went to see a 70yr old and his 63 year old wife, she is working on contract for a 3rd party healthcare provider, 15/hr, he is in the insurance business makes 50 k per year, and they want me to consolidate their debt $280,000 total…..

There are lots of old people with paid off homes, and there are lots more old people with mortgages….

Has it always been that way???

#25 Who Cares on 03.27.13 at 9:31 pm

Look at that dog’s eyes. They say ok I’m coming with you because well, I’m a dog and we’re loyal but your driving scares the hell out of me!

#26 Victor V on 03.27.13 at 9:33 pm

http://www.thegridto.com/life/real-estate/dont-believe-everything-you-read-about-real-estateexcept-this/

Perspective is everything.

One major Canadian daily recently published a column that asserted that the average price of Canadian homes was going to decrease in 2013. At the end of the piece, they revealed that the drop would amount to a meagre 0.2 per cent. If you think about it, that’s a pretty insignificant amount: The average house price in Canada is $362,600, which means a 0.2 per cent dip is equal to just over $726. Really? I spend more than that each year on gum.

=================

This realtor is really laying it on thick in this piece! Of course, he’s falling back on the infamous HPI frankenumber. Take a peek at the rest of his rationalizations for why it’s still a good time to buy.

#27 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 03.27.13 at 9:33 pm

@#9 Observer
Dont be “dissin” Wal Mart Greeters ….or be prepared to face the wrath of ” Storefront sam”

#28 The Affluent Boomer on 03.27.13 at 9:39 pm

Not everyone is getting the message. Here is a piece in the Financial Post touting how smart it is for Retiring Boomers to use their house an ATM to fund their children’s new home purchase and their lifestyle. After all, their home is worth so much and “selling to downsize would mean substantial commissions and moving costs. “Besides, real estate is a very good investment in Vancouver,” he says. “The longer we can stay here, the greater the possibility of no-tax capital gains.” http://business.financialpost.com/2013/03/27/canada-housing-retirement/

#29 blase on 03.27.13 at 9:40 pm

Thought you’d mention the huge spike in inflation reported for February Garth. The wrinklies on a fixed income are feeling it.

Let’s see, if you were investing for 5 years down the road, what would seem like a better investment keeping in mind all these retirees coming into the pipeline:

a) $450,000 3 bedroom, 3 bathroom house, with a big property tax bill and huge utilities, tucked away in the suburbs.

b) $150,000 3 bedroom, 1 1/2 bathroom townhouse, walking distance to shopping, library, health care.

c) $80,000 1 bedroom, 1 bathroom apartment with library, mall, grocery, hospital all less than 5 minute walk away.

Wouldn’t want to be investing in a big new build in suburbia in the next 10 years.

#30 Smoking Man on 03.27.13 at 9:44 pm

Just read in the Financial Post

Tuition fees could double, triple over next 20 years.

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/03/27/brace-yourself-this-is-how-it-will-cost-you-to-put-your-baby-through-university/

Teach your kids to be a smoking man.

1) Lying 101
2) 9 to 5 Its business take no prisoners
3) Home School kids
4) There is no right or wrong, just Risk vs Reward
5) Study the Herd, not the charts
6) Build explosive self confidence
7) Morality whats that
8) Hounesty is weakness
9) Learn to manipulate slaves
10) Givers lose, Takers Win

#31 Richard and Zeus on 03.27.13 at 9:44 pm

DELETED

#32 Retired WI Boomer on 03.27.13 at 9:44 pm

#7 Chester….

First, please Define “Old Fart” my young ingrate son.

Yeah, some of the old fart wrinkled Boomers aging more every dam day HAVE a bleak future. Poor planning no doubt, for some. Life has a way of making one laugh like hell even when one has been very diligent in planning.

You find out your dear one has cancer, or you have a bad ticker. Worse, one of your kids has cancer, and will leave his, or her job long enough for treatment to find they are going to lose it, if not their life.

Yeah some did good planning, and even without a pension, have more than enough in their newly swelled investments to last them as long as they probably wish to last.

Garth’s comments though are right on!! The bulk are still clueless idiots, and will be handed their asses, and rightfully.

Just be careful with the lumping of all into the same box. I see many Gen-Xer’s, and millennial’s who don’t appear to have a dam clue, assuming they look up from their dam phones before one of us old Bommers’ run them down one day.

#33 East Van on 03.27.13 at 9:45 pm

250,000 immigrants per year to Canada will offset the aging population. The conservatives do well with immigrants, and will open the floodgates.

Nine million Boomers, dude. Not even close. — Garth

#34 sluggo8 on 03.27.13 at 9:46 pm

On the opposite side of the fence are the double dipping retired BC teachers playing Tuesday hockey out of Bill Copeland arena waiting for the call from the sub list, poaching calls from new teachers entering the system. All the while they collect their full pensions while the rest of their collective whine about how hard they have it.

Just saying.

#35 broadway skytrain on 03.27.13 at 9:46 pm

cash-poor seniors have taken out a fat, 25-year mortgage that (statistically) they’ll never live long enough to pay off
————————————–

sounds like a decent plan to me, they get to enjoy the place without paying the price!

#36 Who Cares on 03.27.13 at 9:49 pm

It is kind of surprising that older people would be able to obtain that kind of financing without some kind of substantial income stream beyond just employment. Even those who own their businesses would face harsher criteria to get that kind of mortgage in their mid sixties one would think.

Is it just as easy for them to obtain a mortgage as say a thirty-five year old?

#37 Rob on 03.27.13 at 9:59 pm

Its always all a out those boomers, driving everything up. Its sure tKing while for this deep correction to kick in.

#38 Richard and Zeus on 03.27.13 at 10:01 pm

#31 Richard and Zeus on 03.27.13 at 9:44 pm
DELETED
———–
Nice Garth…….one way street blog.

You are done here, ammo boy. — Garth

#39 Smoking Man on 03.27.13 at 10:01 pm

#36 Who Cares on 03.27.13 at 9:49

You can be dead broke at 60, who cares about getting a mortgage.

have a good Idea, get and I know its a forign consept to most dogs on here but….Investors.

Just think 9 million boomers, many with loot and many getting demensia…

Like taking candy from babeys

#40 Smoking Man on 03.27.13 at 10:07 pm

I can see the sign going up on a building on Lake Shore road in long branch……

Smoking Man’s School for Scoundrals…….

I will work, any Investors?

#41 a prairie dawg on 03.27.13 at 10:08 pm

#7 Chester on 03.27.13 at 8:52 pm

The old farts got no one to blame but themselves.

- — -

Spoken like a young fart. ;)

#42 Tony on 03.27.13 at 10:08 pm

If you retire in Canada the first thing to do is get most of your money in safe havens (outside the country). The people who don’t end up with nothing because the government takes everything they give you in clawbacks. Yes that’s the definition of an Indian giver. Some day America might institute a wealth tax in which case Canada will likely follow suit. Just another reason to get most of your money to safe havens outside the country.

#43 BC BRING CASH on 03.27.13 at 10:12 pm

My parents are pushing 80 and all they have to live on is their Govt. pensions CPP, OAS maybe GIS and and small sum from Aussie. They lived in Aussie as landed Immigrants for 6 years in the 60′s. Both Ma and Pa receive a small Monthly Pension here in Canada from Aussie for contributing to the Aussie economy. Ma didn’t work. She was at home with us kids, however the Aussies saw value in raising a family. Not a chance here in Canada. I feel Canada was at the time a much richer Country and likely still is. However in Canada its immoral for the people that in the end own our resources to benefit from our wealth. It is imperative that our resource wealth be handed over to Foreigners at the fire sale price of pennies on the dollar. H for example is in a blind panic to send our valuable oil resources to foreign Countries to processed into valuable refined products. This stupid mind set has to change if we are to prosper from our resources.
My parents are mega right wing pro Conservative pro business with no regulation anti social program wack jobs.
When I point out to them that they are alive and well and doing just fine by taking advantage of social programs for example free medical care and Govt. pension plans they get pissed of at me. Go figure.

#44 Sebee on 03.27.13 at 10:17 pm

Just one minute please.

How the heck is a bank extending a mortgage for a term their clients have no statistical ability repaying due to their age? Will these wrinkly 60 somethings get CMHC insurance on their mortgage? Of course they will.

Goal is to have no equity in that penthouse. Let the daughter clean it up after they depart.

#45 T-Bone on 03.27.13 at 10:21 pm

#12 Randy- Cheapo. You still think it’s christmas time? You should have asked him to do a market evaluation at the same time. Nice story, tell it again bro!

#46 Ronaldo on 03.27.13 at 10:24 pm

#26 Victor V -

”I spend more than that each year on gum.”

I needed a good laugh.

#47 a prairie dawg on 03.27.13 at 10:25 pm

The trouble with old people?

They can’t drive. Bus passes for all of them.

#48 Tony on 03.27.13 at 10:25 pm

Re: #28 The Affluent Boomer on 03.27.13 at 9:39 pm

The Financial Post is a great help! All the options they list are the worst things one could possibly do if you owned a house in Vancouver. Of course the smartest thing is to sell pronto before the market crashes further.

Crashes further? What crash? — Garth

#49 AK on 03.27.13 at 10:41 pm

#42 Tony on 03.27.13 at 10:08 pm
“If you retire in Canada the first thing to do is get most of your money in safe havens (outside the country).”
——————————————————————–

LOL, Tony.

I am calling my cousin in Greece tomorrow. I am going to ask him to open an account for me in Cyprus. :-)

#50 Freedom First on 03.27.13 at 10:41 pm

Yes, the numbers for the Boomers are terrifying. I listen to them talk too, and if anyone says anything about a RE correction in Canada, well, the Boomers just tune out. And I know most of them have no company pension either. Not surprised, as I know that most people, regardless of age will stick their head in the sand, do nothing, and hope the problem just disappears. Sorry. It never does.

#51 This is wonderland on 03.27.13 at 10:43 pm

About a year and a half ago I went to an open house in Glen Abbey. What I saw made me cringe, an empty 25 year old Glen Abbey home, shoddy Reno dirty floors and New Cheap Windows; installed crooked. What got me was the price tag, for only 681 700.00 you could be the owner of what I would refer to as; someone else’s Hot Mess.

The house sat empty for awhile sign came down and landscapers came in, the large evergreen tree was taken down the lawn was re-grassed and the gardens cleaned up and the garage re-painted. I happened to drive by last week and found that once again this home is on the market only this time for 739 000.00. Didn’t find it on MLS but on Housing Block, a web site I’ve never heard of before.

So is this a flip for a grand total 58 000.00 bonus bucks, or did someone give up and figure this year’s gotta be the year to get rid of this thing. Whatever it is it will be interesting to see how it’s played out during this spring market.

http://us.arkadia.com/real-estate/for-sale/canada/ontario/oakville/ltas-t671133/

http://www.housingblock.com/for-sale/1272-roseberry-cres-oakville-on-l6m-1v9/p_6487762/

#52 Dan in Calgary on 03.27.13 at 10:44 pm

Parents just closed on their house on Vancouver Island this week. Dropped the price below the realtors assessment and still took a month to rope in a buyer. I have to say I’m glad they’re out, travel and renting is the better deal for them, rather than being trapped with a mortgage until death.

The moral is they’re both boomers and they planned to get out and did. Partially because they see the softening market as a last call for the smart wrinklies to pull profit, partially to get out from under a life of limited income and mortgage payments. I have a feeling you’re right in your assessment and they are the tip of the iceberg…

#53 Gogo on 03.27.13 at 10:52 pm

With Canada’s experience with immigration vast land and abundant resources they can boost immigration numbers to compensate for the dying boomers…

#54 The Man From Nantucket on 03.27.13 at 10:52 pm

I have tried to be an ant as opposed to a grasshopper for the last 10 years because, unlike this “work till you drop” crowd, I’ve actually seen what the last 10 years usually look like.

Aiming to have enough in the portfolio that, if actually healthy and eager enough, I can choose to work at an interesting and rewarding role.

If your plan is to work until you drop, make sure you train, say your prayers, and eat your vitamins.

Also, make damned sure you have some skill or ability that few of the whippersnappers have. They’ll work longer and cheaper, so if they are capable of your job, you’re pretty well hooped!

#55 GTAwatcher on 03.27.13 at 10:57 pm

#13 yes, japan is going through it now – their rep for oldest population may also be due to fraud, specifically underreporting of deaths so the families can still collect the decedent’s pension – see

#56 visorman30 on 03.27.13 at 11:02 pm

I believe an earlier post pointed to Japan as a similar situation. There may be some issues with that comparison as North American companies seem to be doing pretty well whereas that may not be the case with Japanese companies (most notably Sony but there are others).

But even if we hold the comparison to be mostly true, what does that imply for Canada and how has the entire situation played out so far in Japan with respect to real estate? Are we talking 10+ years of a price trough?

#57 blok existentialist on 03.27.13 at 11:11 pm

#9 “The oldies think they can work forever.”
Well, you know, some of just can. Or as near as makes no difference. My maternal grandfather worked until he was 97. Then his sons and daughters corralled him and put in a home where he languished for two years. He died of boredom a month before his 100th birthday.
His professional association voted in a clause of mandatory retirement at age 65 when he was in his eighties. He blithely told them he was ‘grandfathered’, since he’d already worked past age 65. (And he was, too. They were pissed off, but they didn’t have a legal leg to stand on.)
He didn’t need to work. But it was a big part of his life so he kept doing it. I remember him laughing about the ‘free money’ (his Canada pension) that the ‘fools in Ottawa’ sent him every month.
He was one tough old guy, a patriarch with a capital P.
His kids, on the other hand, were a bunch of boring marshmallows. They could hardly wait to retire and degenerate at age 65.
I’m a throwback. I’ve never had any intention of retiring. (A damned good thing, too, because my relatives have the annoying habit of living into their nineties on BOTH sides. Horrors, why would anyone WANT to be retired for 40 years? Be like living in a concentration camp.)
Canada Pension? That pittance will be gravy, not the main course. When I can’t work with my back, then I’ll work with my brain. The two go together, don’tcha know.
Walmart greeter? Hey, you can do it. Boomers are the best-educated generation in history. I’m sure most of us can think of lucrative stuff to do that won’t suck up your dead-air space.
Maybe I’ll switch my site name to Methuselah.

#58 GTAwatcher on 03.27.13 at 11:16 pm

oops, website ate the url – see http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/world/asia/11japan.html

#59 Vandamncouver on 03.27.13 at 11:20 pm

Garth, I’ve heard you many times allude to rising tax rates in the future. You’ve also said that RRSP’s aren’t really a good idea, because you’re taking after tax-dollars and making them taxable again.

My question is, does F keep an eye on the RRSP amounts currently held by Canadians? I assume by rising taxes you meant income tax. Does the government look at the accumulated RRSP amounts and say “well, if stuff gets bad by 2016, a 3% tax guarantees an average of x dollars from RRSP’s.”

Can they tap into that if needed and is that why you’re cautious about this?

Government of course can do so, but it is unlikely. More probable are surtaxes and higher marginal rates plus eventually moving the GST back up. — Garth

#60 Shawn on 03.27.13 at 11:28 pm

Meanwhile in New York…

In Manhattan right now. It’s booming here. Knicks game was a sell-out at an average of about $200 a seat. A few beggars on the streets. In fact VERY few. Fewer than Edmonton and Calgary in my experience.

Huge bank towers everywhere. Tons of bank branches. Prosperity abounds. Good luck to all doomers.

#61 hobbygirl on 03.27.13 at 11:37 pm

Crashes further? What crash? — Garth

Isn’t ‘After the Crash’ the title of your book?

The crash referred took place in 2008. — Garth

#62 DormitoryDiarrhea on 03.27.13 at 11:43 pm

At least the Globe & Mail is talking some sense:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/joe-wants-to-know-is-renting-radical/article10465869/

#63 This is wonderland on 03.27.13 at 11:47 pm

#28The Affluent Boomer

Thanks for posting that interesting article.

One of the best things about reading these little pieces of Bu#@$hit is the comments at the end. Seems one astute reader noticed that the”retired” home owner in the piece (Allan Hoegg) actually works at Invis. And that Rob Regan-Pollock, who is the senior mortgage consultant that the National Post contacted to explain the benefits of Reverse mortgages is actually Allan Hoegg’s boss; something the National Post forgot to mention to its readers. So Allan who is a wealthy “retired” Mortgage Broker, has re-mortgaging his home through the company he works for.

So ya your 70 year old parents who are on a limited income should do the same, cause it’s just that safe and easy.

As my mother would say….these people have no shame.

http://www.teamrrp.com/team/

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/03/27/canada-housing-retirement/?__lsa=3d3e-e1dd

#64 (former) hippy on a gulf island on 03.27.13 at 11:53 pm

Great post tonight.

Wife and I both retired last year.

We are boomers and (almost by definition) former hippies.

We will both be 62 this year.

Wife has small pension from her work. I have no work pension, but we both are taking early CPP.

Love your blog and read it every day.

Life is good.

Sold house in Vancouver last year and moved to a Gulf Island.

Now have a bit more than $3,000,000 in RRSPs, TSFAs, RESPs (one kid still in university) and unregistered plans, all in the market in diversified investments consistent with your suggestions.

Thanks for your very helpful blog.

Keep up the good work.

#65 maria on 03.28.13 at 12:00 am

I live in a quiet neighbourhood in Etobicoke that is supposedly highly desirable. Almost everyone is a senior. Two streets away, a senior has put up an old house for just over $900K. You have got to be kidding me. It’s not even on a GOOD street….it’s right on a main road. And really, it is not worth it, since houses two streets over sell for a million but they are actually large sprawling homes. It has been sitting for sale for the past month. If anyone ACTUALLY buys it for that price I’m going to sneak over in the middle of the night and spray paint YOU ARE A GREATER FOOL on their door

#66 Vangrrl on 03.28.13 at 12:29 am

Speaking of princesses…

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2013/03/27/business-carney-diana-tweet.html

Carney’s wife finds London housing a wee bit on the shabby side, yeah? :)

#67 Soylent Green is People on 03.28.13 at 12:43 am

#56 blok existentialist on 03.27.13 at 11:11 pm

Above is one of the most appaling biggest maroon posts aver and i didn,t think anything cud go below the horrble poster fire boy

It equated 40 yrs of ret to living in a concentration camp?! As just one item

Blech
.
.

#68 Soylent Green is People on 03.28.13 at 12:47 am

I forgot to say what i wanted to say!

Went to dinner at red lobster tonight, lovly waiter working night shift married with two young kids was a real estate agent, gave me his card, admire him for doing whatever it takes… I think… Anyhooo

Worse he,s working at a chain two suburbs over from where he lives, couldn,t find a job in his own neighbourhood where i know they have plenty of their own chain restaurants!!!

#69 Tony on 03.28.13 at 12:49 am

Re: #49 AK on 03.27.13 at 10:41 pm

Offshore tax havens.

#70 Small Town Steve on 03.28.13 at 12:51 am

Wrinkles are insane!

#71 The Bear on 03.28.13 at 12:59 am

Hey Garth, thanks for the hard work running this awesome blog,

Not to be a doomer, I am quite neutral on the issue…
But I was recently sent a copy of the 2013 budget, which had some suspicious new elements to it.

http://www.budget.gc.ca/2013/doc/plan/budget2013-eng.pdf

pg. 144

“Establishing a Risk Management Framework for Domestic
Systemically Important Banks”

pg. 145

” – The Government proposes to implement a ―bail-in‖ regime for
systemically important banks. This regime will be designed to ensure that,
in the unlikely event that a systemically important bank depletes its
capital, the bank can be recapitalized and returned to viability through the
very rapid conversion of certain bank liabilities into regulatory capital.
This will reduce risks for taxpayers. The Government will consult
stakeholders on how best to implement a bail-in regime in Canada.
Implementation timelines will allow for a smooth transition for affected
institutions, investors and other market participants.”

As far as I know, deposits are a liability… now I would love some clarification on exact meaning of the wording and how “common place” it is in legislature.

#72 HomeOwnerFreak on 03.28.13 at 1:11 am

#61: interesting link, DormitoryDiarrhea. Interestingly, they use 4% ROI in their calculations, far from the gains that Garth claims are out there in a balanced portfolio…

#73 Turtle on 03.28.13 at 1:22 am

“… My mother has had enough of the cleaning, maintenance and all that is required of owning a house. My father agreed and they immediately fell in love with this spanking new condo/penthouse just a few streets down, in the same area…”

I have no problem with people falling in love with something… with new condo in this case. But I do not understand the “falling in love” thing when you NEED TO BORROW $360,000 to get it. That is just so sad.

Sometimes I think that new things like Facebook help people make poor decisions. The itch to get something is just too strong. People don’t see the real needs and fool themselves with fake ones. All you see on a Facebook – other people’s accomplishments… new house, new car, new vacation etc. They look at themselves… “hey, we deserved it too”.

Debt is a Slavery of 21st century. People start to forget what Freedom is about.

So sad.

#74 blase on 03.28.13 at 1:24 am

You can live in West Van in a two bedroom, two bathroom home, not in a glass tower, walk to the beach or shopping. 5 minute drive to Stanley Park. $60,000.

http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId=11721126&PidKey=-2103999908

#75 Freedom 85 on 03.28.13 at 1:26 am

http://www.budget.gc.ca/2013/doc/plan/budget2013-eng.pdf

from pg. 154/155 of the pdf.

start

The Government proposes to implement a ―bail-in‖ regime for
systemically important banks. This regime will be designed to ensure that,
in the unlikely event that a systemically important bank depletes its
capital, the bank can be recapitalized and returned to viability through the
very rapid conversion of certain bank liabilities into regulatory capital.
This will reduce risks for taxpayers. The Government will consult
stakeholders on how best to implement a bail-in regime in Canada.
Implementation timelines will allow for a smooth transition for affected
institutions, investors and other market participants.
Systemically important banks will continue to be subject to existing risk
management requirements, including enhanced supervision and recovery
and resolution plans.
This risk management framework will limit the unfair advantage that could
be gained by Canada’s systemically important banks through the mistaken
belief by investors and other market participants that these institutions are
―too big to fail.‖

end

So much for being different from Cyprus…I guess we can have bail-ins too.

#76 Suede on 03.28.13 at 1:29 am

US Economy is definitely rebounding. Call it the Vegas Index.

Can’t find a cheap deal for a 5 star hotel like 2 years ago. Lots of Amerikids with disposable income this spring.

Poker tables will be ‘hook, line and sinker’ time

#77 observer on 03.28.13 at 1:38 am

#21 Smoking Weed Man

============
Yeah, some have money, but most has all their assets stuff in one asset (HOUSE). If they think they can live off of zero income and not sell their house then think again.

I own a business, I know the younger generation never worked as hard as the older generation. But when your 65 and looking for a job. I would think twice before I would hire you vs a younger fresh out of university or someone with several years of experience.

Also remember a person at 65 might not have the drive and desire to succeed as a new guy. Theres alot of things to consider. “Found Dead at desk because of Heart Attack”, Foundering health, stress leave etc.

Advantage, can’t get pregnant due to uterus already fallen.

You’ll be surprise how many oldies don’t have much in savings.

#78 Freebird on 03.28.13 at 1:58 am

Medical care and other social programs in Canada are not ‘free’. They are paid for by taxes. You know the taxes we all pay.

#79 Vandamncouver on 03.28.13 at 2:20 am

“Government of course can do so, but it is unlikely. More probable are surtaxes and higher marginal rates plus eventually moving the GST back up.” — Garth

Thanks for the reply. I just wanted a little clarification as to why you don’t seem overly thrilled with RRSP’s.

I’m assuming you would recommend interest-bearing investments within an RRSP, more aggressive equity investments within a TFSA, and tax-preferred investments like dividends in a non-reg? I’m sure I’m simplifying it and it’s not that cut and dry, but am I on the right track?

#80 Jane24 on 03.28.13 at 3:49 am

I also don’t understand how these folk can be granted a mortgage at that age. We tried to move last year and because mortgage rates are low and I didn’t want to cash investments, we tried to get one. I am 58 and hubby is 62.

The English bankers told us that they would only offer if we could prove that it would be paid off in full on my 62 year old hubby’s 70th birthday. Barclay policy is that no mortgage can exist past this birthday. Since that meant huge monthly payments we opted to stay put.

So how do they qualify in Canada is it CHMC?

#81 maxx on 03.28.13 at 5:32 am

#51 This is wonderland on 03.27.13 at 10:43 pm

From my own observation, a current play seems to be to list higher in hopes of settling closer to what the seller wants. I also see some “peek-a-boo” listings- here now and “gone” a week later only to be back “on” again.
More than ever, it is critical to study and know the markets and most importantly, if at all possible, to wait. More obvious drops will manifest soon enough and these transparent maneuvers will resolve into strategic duds. People can see through this and are beginning to know the power of waiting.

#82 Alliston on 03.28.13 at 5:46 am

Hope is not a plan, being a cheapskate in your youth does not create wealth for your retirement

#83 Rick Perry on 03.28.13 at 6:09 am

Ever wonder how a bank can get away with only having 7 or 8% of its assets as actual cash? That’s because our wise government, just like every other western gov’t, allows the banks to create money out of thin air and lend it to someone. They they get to charge interest on that money they just created. You and I counterfeit a $100 bill and we go to jail.

The Bank of Canada is the same way – money is created out of thin air and lent to the government at interest, which then must get the interest payments and the principal from us taxpayers to avoid a deficit situation. This was not the case until 1974, when Trudeau caved to international pressure. From 1935 to 1974, the Bank of Canada was actually part of the government of Canada, and provided funds for such projects as WWII, the St. Lawrence Seaway, the Trans-Canada, etc. all without the burden of interest.

We are being reamed by the banking sector so much that its hard to even comprehend, because our government allows it.

I don’t know how much evidence you need, but people should be taking out there money out of the banking system and securing it with physical assets and getting out of debt ASAP.

Banks do not create money. The Bank of Canada is a taxpayer-owned crown corporation. And you are a gold salesman. Go away. — Garth

#84 blase on 03.28.13 at 6:43 am

#81 Hope is not a plan, being a cheapskate in your youth does not create wealth for your retirement

—————

It’s called saving. Have we really gotten so bad that people don’t know that saving creates wealth? geez.

#85 drydock on 03.28.13 at 6:49 am

#40 Smoking Man.

I lived for 7 years in Mimico and New Toronto used to drink in the Blue Goose just across the street from the Longbranch Go Train Station.
Partied there one night with the Paradice Riders MC.

#86 Ex pat 2 on 03.28.13 at 6:50 am

Generational warfare. Boomers vs non boomers. What A silly approach. There are people who have done quite well in life, and people who have not. Generations are irrelevant . What matters is whether one is able to retire with decent income or whether one is able to survive well in life. If you have saved, or if you have a decent pension, you will have decent retirement . Start at 30 or so . Invent wisely, not at 3 percent. Minimize tax. This is good advice whether you are 39 or 59 . What is the point ot his generational blame game that many of your posters seems to engage in.

#87 Dave on 03.28.13 at 6:57 am

Teresa’s parents should not have paid off their tax deductible business debt.

#88 My thoughts on 03.28.13 at 7:33 am

One not so friendly oakville agent just relisted her house for $200,000 more then she was asking last month and year. This on the theory that people are listing higher hoping to get close to what they want. Staying out of the game is obvious now. I don’t fault people for wanting more money… But this driving up of the prices needs to stop. Obviously these people don’t need to sell. Well… I guess I just won’t have to move. There is truth to people feeling like they need to be better then the other guys. Competing on fb etc. we’ve used this year to max out investments and recieved amazing gains. Things our friends will never know about but will provide us with a better future for sure.

#89 Bigrider on 03.28.13 at 7:51 am

The name Teresa + parents in a bungalow + buying more RE = italian heritage

#90 detalumis on 03.28.13 at 8:09 am

#8 I sincerely doubt your neighbour told you how much money he had. People don’t even tell their kids let alone their neighbours. A person who pays $700 a month in rent and can plow through 200K in funds in five years along with all the government senior money must have a gambling addiction.

#79 Canadian banks used to have age restrictions on mortgages but they removed those many years ago. My neighbour tried to get a mortgage at age 60 back in the day and was turned down because of the old rules, he lived until age 89 and his widow is now 93.

#91 Pr on 03.28.13 at 8:33 am

Board of director governed, president of economic stability management said: Cyprus is going to be the model moving foward! So if you have money in the bank specially in europe take it out now.

Like real estate in Canada, is manipulate so dont be caught with a falling asset in those turbulent time, it can go bad, very bad, and very fast.

The denial that everything is fine, no its not fine and it will unfold. LIBOR, MF-Global, computer morgage fraude, subrime, greece, cyprus, climate-gate, false birth-certificate, Etc.

#92 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 8:42 am

Good post. I know many who either:

- downsize & spend winters south

- need to downsize because they can’t handle stairs, cleaning & landscaping, or costs.

#93 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 8:48 am

@#56 blok existentialist on 03.27.13 at 11:11 pm

“why would anyone WANT to be retired for 40 years? Be like living in a concentration camp.”

>>WTF?! Imagine a retirement where you have health and money to do what you want. EVERYONE would want that.

#94 Shawn on 03.28.13 at 9:06 am

Evil Banks make money? If you can’t beat ‘em….

Rick Perry at 82 said:

Ever wonder how a bank can get away with only having 7 or 8% of its assets as actual cash? That’s because our wise government, just like every other western gov’t, allows the banks to create money out of thin air and lend it to someone.

***************************************

Actually banks hold 7 or 8% of assets as cash because most depositors leave money in the bank and 7 to 8% covers the banks’ liquidity needs.

Cash pays the bank nothing so they invest in higher yield assets.

Without this system how would one borrow money?

Instead of dooming and whining how about buying bank shares?

Warren Buffett owns many, many banks shares and in the 70′s owned a little bank (was later required to divest it).

Who you gonna listen to?

#95 mark on 03.28.13 at 9:20 am

Good to see more lazy ass reporting in that Financial Post article where the boomers are using their house as an ATM.

Allan Hoegg, the featured talent touting his HELOC and belief Vancouver real estate IS a good investment, is an undisclosed mortgage broker.

#96 Shawn on 03.28.13 at 9:21 am

Banks create Money?

If they do, it’s a (very) good thing.

Bank lends YOU $10,000 and YOU leave it on deposit or spend it and the vendor deposits it then it can be loaned out again. Interest is often payable on deposits.

If banks create money, they don’t create wealth from thin air and only create deposits when WE leave our loans on deposit. WE are as much a part of it as are the banks.

It’s just how banks work and they are essential to the economy. Bank doomers should expand their reading list and consider buying bank shares.

#97 Men Who Stare At Sheeple on 03.28.13 at 9:26 am

“In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act” – George Orwell

Here is Joe Rogan speaking truth to power! Caution profanity!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jl2JQfxnnHU

An amazing depiction of America and spot on! There is nothing left to say!

Joe spoke more truth in 10 minutes than the government, education system or the M$M speaks in a lifetime.

This man is a true American patriot!

#98 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 9:27 am

@#82 Rick Perry on 03.28.13 at 6:09 am

“Banks do not create money. The Bank of Canada is a taxpayer-owned crown corporation. — Garth”

>>>You guys are splitting hairs here…

Banks create credit NOT money…
It is important to distinguish between the right to “issue money,” which is the sole right of the Bank of Canada,

and the ability to “create credit,” which, through legislation and regulation enacted by Parliament, is largely done by commercial banks through the issuance of loans.

#99 Downside Weights On The Vancouver RE Market – “One of the older guys (over 60) mention to the guy beside him that he and his wife were thinking about selling their family home, and renting, in order to get some of the money that was locked up on 03.28.13 at 9:31 am

[...] “Every Friday I play hockey with a bunch of guys who are over 55. I’m a goalie, so even though I’m not 55, they let me play – I guess it’s hard to find 55 year old guys whose knees are willing to bounce up and down off the ice for an hour and half.” “Anyways, I overheard a conversation in the dressing room last Friday. One of the older guys (over 60) mention to the guy beside him (over 70) that he and his wife were thinking about selling their family home, and renting, in order to get some of the money that was locked up in the house. The over-70 guy nodded in approval. The over-60 guy asked if he had heard of anyone doing this before, as they couldn’t see any other way to continue to fund their retirement.” “The over-70 guy nodded, and said “Yup, we did it a couple of years ago. We’ve been renting now for two years – we had to do it, because we couldn’t afford the property taxes each year anymore”. – anecdote from ‘Ross’, relayed by Garth Turner at greaterfool.ca 27 Mar 2013 [...]

#100 Tyrone Asauras on 03.28.13 at 9:33 am

#73blase

http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId=11721126&PidKey=-2103999908

Urban trailer park! I love it! What’s the catch?

Last Toronto area one I know of closed a couple years ago

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2011/06/23/end_of_the_line_for_mississauga_trailer_park_residents.html

Years ago when I was young and dumb, I almost bought in, figuring shelter costs for a single-wide were about half of those for a condo.

I did consider the risk that the land owner would given an offer he cannot refuse……

Still, if you consider that the worst case salvage for a $60K trailer in decent condition is probably like $35K, with annual rent of $8,000 or so, you’d break even in a few years versus renting a sky box in a dense urban area. You’d break even more quickly versus renting an urban bung-a-hole.

Intriguing!

#101 Buy? Curious? on 03.28.13 at 9:39 am

I’ve said it before, Garth, my man, you are a hero! If you were the leader of North Korea, we’d have Kim Chee on Mars by now.

I love hearing of overheard conversations of old people in change rooms in sweaty states of undress. If you can’t find honesty there, where are you ever going to find it?

I hope Boomers are checking in with their Estate Lawyers, making proper plans. You don’t want to leave a mess to your family when you die.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJRIUXMTlsQ

#102 Dupcheck on 03.28.13 at 9:40 am

@ Smoking man, you are rude. Educated people after all are the minority in the whole world. Only 10 % of the population have degrees. You that claim to be different are just like the majority that probably barely graduated high school and always complained about anything. You are one of the 90% that claim that are something special. Don’t be so cocky.

#103 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 9:40 am

Theres a lot of anti american sentiment on this blog…say what you will….the average Social Security for a lifetime contributor south of the border is $2500 p/m….thats $5000 per couple vs the ‘crumbs’ you get in Canada…..I have to ask….where does all the money that gets taken from our paycheques go.?????…..I ‘ve called it a systematic looting by the civil service for their over the top compensation…but the liberals would differ…of course.

This one of a thousand reasons there is a better consumer economy in the US…..more people can retire with dignity…….but we need to get people to understand the root cause of the short fall problem…..not just point fingers higgldy piggldy.

#104 Herb on 03.28.13 at 9:41 am

#30 SM,

so that’s your private Neanderthal, SM! Congratulations, no doubt you are the meanest knuckle-dragger in the valley.

#105 Humble on 03.28.13 at 10:05 am

A snapshot of retirement security for people with no real assets.

This blog states that’s imperative that you follow certain high risks strategies if you hope to avoid running out money in retirement. Here are the facts about retirement with no real assets.

The average Canadian currently has access to 3 income support programs when they reach 65. The Canada Pension Fund(CPP), Old Age Security(OAS), and Guaranteed Income Supplement(GIS). Now lets look at the average and maximum benefits you can expect. All figures are monthly CPP max 1030/ average 534, OAS max 546/ average 515, and GIS max 740/ average 501. These figures are for individuals so if you are couple you will face claw backs. Now you may assume that if you add the averages up you will get a true statement of benefits. Because of the program design you will face claw backs even on these meager income supports. In regards OAS and GIS you will get less as your CPP benefits go up. I found an amazing set of tools at the following Canadian government website to get an accurate picture of your retirement benefits. Just scroll down until you reach the benefit calculators(takes 10 seconds input on individual calculations).

http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/isp/oas/tabrates/tabmain.shtml

Here is an example for individual with no assets plus 1)Average CPP benefit This example is from the benefit calculators results but try out the calculator yourself if you doubt the numbers.

Example) age 65 individual with the average CPP payment of 534 a month. Result: CPP 534/ OAS Plus GIS 964 so the average person is looking a princely sum of 1498 a month.

Now can you survive on 1500 a month? Lets looks at Ontario currently(2009+2011) the best numbers I could find of caseloads for both Ontario Disability Support Program (ODSP) and Ontario Works(OW)/more commonly called welfare. A total number of people in both programs which includes individuals/families/children was roughly at 890 000 or 6.8% of total population. This numbers shows total contacts in a given year, so 890 000 were on the benefit but that does not mean they were getting benefits for the whole year. By law individuals on ODSP make a $1075 monthly maximum and OW a maximum of $600 monthly. I am no social benefits guru so I encourage to look at internet if doubt the numbers. But it clear a lot of people are surviving on almost nothing in Ontario. I really pity people on welfare in Toronto with it cost of living. Maybe some these people have access to some subsidized housing plus food banks to survive.

But back to retirement/ can a senior live with dignity on $1500 at month? In Toronto it could be challenge but I encourage people to move to other areas of Ontario. For example take Chatham Ontario, a community of roughly 40 000 people located south western Ontario. Macroeconomic conditions are poor so the cost living is suppressed. According to classifieds a senior can expect to pay 500 to 700 a month for an apartment with includes all utilities plus some appliances. Split the difference and that leaves you 900. A phone, internet, and cable 130 a month so your down to 770. A senior/unlimited riding bus card costs 70 a year and service is reasonable. Now you have 750 for food and clothing plus anything other you consider essentials. You can live in dignity avoiding charity like food bank situations if you want.

This a future that many boomers are totally unprepared for. If you no assets this blogs financial advice can neither help or hurt your situation. But even you 100,000 in assets saved up it will not materially improve your situation. Over 20 years starting at 65 you will only receive 5000 a year. Roughly 420 an month over the 1500 average. So you afford a better apartment and maybe finance a car.

According to Canadian government retirement policy here are 2 gems you should be remember. 1) If your income during your lifetime was mainly composed of wages rather than investment income. The governments fully accepts the fact your living standard will fall to a fraction of the level you had when held a wage paying job. 2)Pension security is based a 3 legged chair. Personal savings, corporate contribution, and government security programs. Personal savings are not very impressive in Canada and debt in retirement is increasing. Corporations are moving away from defined benefit(life time pension) plans to defined contribution(RRSP) plans. And that’s if your lucky enough to have corporate plan. Government will provide some benefits to keep you living on the edge of poverty but that’s it. Maybe when boomers realize their diminished dreams of economic freedom they will raise hell. Old people vote so maybe the government will provide more.

The future of retiring boomers is not good. They will be profoundly disappointed with their new standard of living. For generation you have heard bank commercials talk about RRSP contributions and economic freedom is easily within reach. People heading for retirement are mental unprepared for reality.

Cheers People

#106 rosie "moving backwards" on 03.28.13 at 10:11 am

Oh No! Precious bugs. A very reliable source with a remarkable track record at predicting has spoken. Squirrel pot pie anyone. http://blogs.marketwatch.com/thetell/2013/03/27/marc-faber-aka-dr-doom-says-theres-nowhere-to-hide-from-bubblegeddon-not-even-gold/

#107 jwr on 03.28.13 at 10:13 am

Stickler you describe the system perfectly but if credit is not money then what is it? If I get a loan at a bank to buy a car I think the car dealer will readily admit that he received money for his automobile. If I whip out my credit card to buy groceries at a store I do believe I paid for those groceries and that the grocer will say he was paid for those groceries.

This is a credit-based fiat monetary system we currently enjoy and banks do indeed create money or credit or who cares what you call it but if it’s readily accepted for payment in exchange for goods and services, it’s money baby.

#108 HD on 03.28.13 at 10:14 am

#70 The Bear on 03.28.13 at 12:59 am

Aren’t you the 19 year old kid?

Best,

HD

#109 NYCer on 03.28.13 at 10:21 am

So my friend finally sold her condo.

Bought for $300k, sold for $380k. $80k increase in 2 years. However, she put $100k in renos, agent fees, taxes, maintenance, interest etc etc. She lost about $78k.

Had she rented, her rental cost would be $48k for the 2 years so buy buying, she lost about $30k net (not including investing her downpayment).

So ownership cost her $30k more. And now she is looking to buy again. A mess. I’ll stay quiet this time ad I am sure in her mind, she made money.

#110 rosie "moving backwards" on 03.28.13 at 10:39 am

Like I always say. Stop spending money you don’t have. http://qz.com/67341/its-hard-to-except-consumption-to-rise-when-people-are-not-saving-money-through-the-developed-world/

#111 Canuck Abroad on 03.28.13 at 10:53 am

Buyers’ remorse? Lemon house? Crap reno gone wrong?

This house sold in 2010 for 879k, then finally sold one year ago for 1,050k after two price drops (1,179k then 1,099k) despite “major renovations”. It is now it is on the market again:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/home-and-garden/real-estate/second-effort-sells-yongedavisville-home/article4100151/

Listed for 1,102.5k (won’t get it):

http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId=12980903&PidKey=1168706179

Also weird: the G&M article talks about major renovations but that the place had “unsightly pipes” (huh?). The new listing says it’s renovated, has “granite” and quality flooring, but it’s being sold “as is” and drops a bunch of lagalese re reps and warranties. I’m sure there is a good story in here somewhere, but the bottom line is somebody is taking a fat loss after adding up the buying, selling and holding costs for a single year.

#112 Daisy Mae on 03.28.13 at 10:54 am

62This is wonderland: “One of the best things about reading these little pieces of Bu#@$hit is the comments at the end. Seems one astute reader noticed that the”retired” home owner in the piece (Allan Hoegg) actually works at Invis. And that Rob Regan-Pollock, who is the senior mortgage consultant that the National Post contacted to explain the benefits of Reverse mortgages is actually Allan Hoegg’s boss; something the National Post forgot to mention to its readers. So Allan who is a wealthy “retired” Mortgage Broker….”

**************

My jaw dropped when I read your post. Thanks for enlightening us. There really IS no shame, is there? (Still shaking my head…but why should anything surprise?)

#113 rosie "moving backwards" on 03.28.13 at 11:06 am

Looks like the folks in L.A. took my advice about spending money they don’t have. http://www.zillow.com/local-info/CA-Los-Angeles-County-home-value/r_3101/#metric=mt%3D24%26dt%3D1%26tp%3D5%26rt%3D6%26r%3D3101%252C12447%252C46298%252C45457%26el%3D0

#114 MP on 03.28.13 at 11:07 am

@92 Stickler

@#56 blok existentialist on 03.27.13 at 11:11 pm

“why would anyone WANT to be retired for 40 years? Be like living in a concentration camp.”

>>WTF?! Imagine a retirement where you have health and money to do what you want. EVERYONE would want that.
___________________________________

Also called a LIFE. Start living it, and stop waiting around for retirement.

#115 Freedom 85 on 03.28.13 at 11:11 am

My question to you Garth is if we are so strong financially in the banking system, why is there a proposal to include bail-ins in the 2013 budget? My guess is that TFSA are a freebie thrown to savers and since there is no free lunch, the feds will use that amount to protect equity positions if they so need. or eventually fee it, so citizens can ‘do their part’ in maintaining a stable banking system.
Something like that.

So keep your money in a can. That sounds safe. — Garth

#116 Devore on 03.28.13 at 11:16 am

#82 Rick Perry

The Bank of Canada is the same way – money is created out of thin air and lent to the government at interest, which then must get the interest payments and the principal from us taxpayers to avoid a deficit situation.

The interest is returned to the government.

Yeah, they didn’t put that in the newsletter you’re parroting, did they?

#117 drydock on 03.28.13 at 11:16 am

# 84

Made a mistake it was the Mimico Go Station not Long Branch.
Did a street view tour the area seems to be pretty much the same.
Rafferties Bar and Grill is gone,it’s called The Maple Leaf now.

#118 Calgary Rip Off on 03.28.13 at 11:31 am

This blog shows the key concept that there is no security in purchasing real estate. That is the key concept. Justification to buy or not to will be on viewpoints and opinions, not hard evidence because the future as predicted may change. A person is best off by looking at past history rather than the assumption that age 60 is retirement and therefore a person will sell to fund that retirement. Problem is that there are too many personal variables at this point to outright predict that the general trend of the baby boomers will be to unload real estate. Many of these properties were purchased and many people will lose by selling now to fund this “retirement”. And many persons in the 60 year age bracket cannot retire. As for the younger generation that possess mortgages, it is wise to have one because chances are there will be no retirement at all, ever. Therefore, what monetary gain will be accrued by waiting to purchase a mortgage meanwhile accumulating massive debt paying a lease to the tune of 1600 a month, or more, with nothing to show for it. If the housing market does of course tank, the only real risk is if the crash is so severe that mortgage owners cannot refinance due to the market and their present income. This is a wild gamble to take, to wait and see. Many of the persons commenting on this blog are older than generation X and therefore have one or more properties and their dissuasion for the younger generation to wait and buy rather than buy if they are ready may be inaccurate advice and best avoided. Why? As it stands right now, if I had waited, an additional $36,190 dollars wouldve gone to the landlord. This is quite a difference from what my parents paid for rent for a house $60,060, for raising me, from age 5, to age 18. So in only 2011 until now almost $40K wouldve gone to a schmuck landlord just because he was privileged and bought a shack in Calgary when housing was reasonable. So this is quite a gamble of proposing that the younger generation wait until the old people decide what they want to do. This is purely reactive and reactive isnt the way to live your life or budget your finances. You must plan on what you have seen historically and what you can afford. So if housing crashes, is your job stable and pays enough to refinance the mortgage when it comes up? If yes, then if you will be living for a long time after all the baby boomers are dead and a problem no longer, then yes you should buy. If however as a younger person you will be caught in the nonsense the boomers have created due to job change or otherwise, you should wait. Many of the young persons will not be retiring until 2050 and therefore, the boomer mess will be done and over with because most if not all of the boomers will be dead and gone.

#119 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 11:53 am

#110 Canuk Abroad – this is a good posting, and love the location, but there is something wrong, and what could it be. Need a survey on that one with a title search, and why stucco? The insulation has to be checked and a good look at the plumbing, wiring, and foundation too.

#120 detalumis on 03.28.13 at 12:03 pm

#104 you really don’t know any poor people do you. I grew up in Hamilton in the poor side of town. People that reach 65 think they have won the lottery because you get $500 more and the waiting lists for subsidized housing shrink down. In towns like mine, Oakville, you can pay $420 a month to live in the subsidized senior buildings – you have your choice lakeview in between expensive condos or walking distance to the quaint downtown, everything at the door, special buses to take you shopping, meals in the building if you don’t feel like cooking.

The poor senior is a myth, they have more money than the poor 35 year old welfare person or the poor ODSP person. What the govt is afraid of is that these poor seniors will live too long and that there will be 3 times as many when the boomers all retire. Each one could easily cost taxpayers 30K a year in subsidized rent, health care and spending money. When they end up in LTC the cost doubles and it doesn’t come from the poor senior’s pocket. Whenever there are cutbacks to social housing it always is at the expense of the younger groups never seniors, you don’t see any sleeping on the subway grates do you – nope I don’t think so.

Me I will apply for the senior buildings when I hit 60 – forward thinking so I am at the top of the line when the waiting list triples.

#121 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 12:12 pm

I remember the day when a Doctor gave me a large check to place in a second mortgage on a home with a big equity position, as he trusted me to do him well, and left it up to me. I placed the deal, and just before closing the Lawyer called me about a technical matter on title, but would close anyway. He told me, and for the first time in my life took him down at the knees, as said will not fund you sob. On title was a lien from a past divorce, so my client had a contingent 3rd mortgage, as promised a 2nd, so killed the deal, and told him to eat the legal fees. Trust nobody!

#122 Axxman on 03.28.13 at 12:12 pm

#114 Freedom 85 – All countries have been asked (via the Financial Stability Board which Pope Marcus of Carney chairs) to develop a bail-in regime. Politicians hated that there was no recovery option when the it all hit the fan in 2008 – so bail-in actually provides a tool to use – if desired. Better to have a tool than be a tool.

#123 Uwinsome on 03.28.13 at 12:15 pm

https://www.chipmoney.ca/index.cfm?utm_source=BellMedia&utm_medium=RON_CPC_BB&utm_campaign=Bell_March_2013

Comments Garth?

For seniors who hate their children. — Garth

#124 Doug in London on 03.28.13 at 12:15 pm

Garth said: One problem is way too many of the wrong kinds of houses. Just over 80% of all new builds in the last two decades across North America were single-family homes, mostly big and mostly in the burbs.
_____________________________________________
Really? No kidding! So who were the geniuses who thought of building all these wrong kind of houses? Even an idiot like me thought of that, and the punch line is I figured that out in February 1987. These big monster homes aren’t just a Brampton and Markham thing, there are many subdivisions of big homes going up around the edges of London. Who’s going to buy all those houses? Obviously not all those former employees of Diamond Aircraft.

#125 Uwinsome on 03.28.13 at 12:23 pm

Flaherty has to work a little harder:

http://www.bnn.ca/News/2013/3/28/Banks-pushing-low-mortgage-rates-in-branches.aspx

#126 Buy? Curious? on 03.28.13 at 12:25 pm

People’s perceptions are changing. The myth of buying a home as a retirement plan is over. Soon as people take an active interest in managing their finances, the better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fb5q2eie4ko&feature=player_embedded

#127 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 03.28.13 at 12:27 pm

#34 sluggo8 on 03.27.13 at 9:46 pm

On the opposite side of the fence are the double dipping retired BC teachers playing Tuesday hockey out of Bill Copeland arena waiting for the call from the sub list, poaching calls from new teachers entering the system. All the while they collect their full pensions while the rest of their collective whine about how hard they have it.

Just saying.

===================================

My understanding is that these retired teachers have to maintain some sort of license and if it lapses they can’t teach anymore., ie the Gov’t wants to stop this.

Personally, I see a lot of this civil service double dipping which I think the public should rise up and protest. We see things like police retiring at age 55 and then joining the Translink police, and making even more.

Those jobs should go to the UNemployed.

Of course the civil service will whine like the stuck fat pigs they are.

#128 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 12:28 pm

Dupcheck on 03.28.13 at 9:40 am

@ Smoking man, you are rude. Educated people after all are the minority in the whole world. Only 10 % of the population have degrees. You that claim to be different are just like the majority that probably barely graduated high school and always complained about anything. You are one of the 90% that claim that are something special. Don’t be so cocky.

Don’t be so cocky, are you serious, how can I not be, I’m very special…

Your new here, I never complain about anything other than the more schooling on has the more unless they are to themselves and can easily be exploited by people like me.

Learn to trade teacher, click on my name, I have Batman and Camel Toe strategy published.

#129 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 03.28.13 at 12:38 pm

More news…

Sounds macabre…but the Health Care system is geared to address the old age problem.

What we will see is rationed health care, compounded with the long term effects of modern medicine.

There is such a thing as “accepted standard of care” . If the Drs. and Nurses end up killing you by following the aforementioned, no recourse. Of course, that implies that the accepted standard of care is what their professional college has approved, often with Gov’t immunity protection.

In addition, you will see the health care mafia milk your savings in the future, its already started.

Post some links later

#130 Holy Crap Wheres The Tylenol on 03.28.13 at 12:48 pm

#21 Smoking Man on 03.27.13 at 9:30 pm

#9 observer on 03.27.13 at 9:00 pm
You know I hear the same thing. The oldies think they can work forever. The problem is, most companies don’t want these guys sticking around when they can hire fresh blood to grow with the company.

Just like a hockey team, once they get old they end up on the 4th line then kapoot off the minors then out the door.

At 70, if the hours gets cut or they get laid off, good luck finding another job. Except mabey as a Walmart greeter!
………………………………………………………………

You’re so dumb……………its funny

Oldies have loot and a perfectly groomed via school, obidiant certificate totting goddy too shoes slaves. Who work hard for next to nothing.

Us oldies will start small business and get your generation to play slave…..

You will be happy cause you swallowed the cool aid believe hard work on your own free time(Home work) will get you the prize teacher taught you.

The prize a JOB…..

Us old farts got to watch our backs, the drop outs, they don’t play by the same rules.

Oh my God! I totally agree with Smoking Man on this one! Maybe I’m dead and in heaven, nope crap I am still alive. Well Smoking Man is correct we will rule the world right until they try to pry my gun from my cold dead hands!

#131 panhead on 03.28.13 at 12:56 pm

Companies got things figured out. Remember going on strike for 3 months years ago to keep our pension. All boomers with little debt. Kept our pension and all had a great time. Couldn’t break us … now we are FAR outnumbered by younguns’ with huge debt. Can’t afford to miss a paycheck so company’s got em’ by the …

#132 broadway skytrain on 03.28.13 at 12:58 pm

the more schooling on has the more unless they are to themselves and can easily be exploited by people like me.—————————–

while there is sometimes useful truths in your crazy rantings, be careful not to generalize too much.

my well educated engineer ‘friend’ learned to trade too, and in 4yrs went from about $0 to paying off his central van sfh mortgage enitrely at 29yo. he has not worked a day-job since ’99.

idiots and geniuses come in all shapes, sizes and levels of education

#133 The Prophet Elijah on 03.28.13 at 12:58 pm

#102 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 9:40 am
Theres a lot of anti american sentiment on this blog…say what you will….the average Social Security for a lifetime contributor south of the border is $2500 p/m….thats $5000 per couple vs the ‘crumbs’ you get in Canada…..I have to ask….where does all the money that gets taken from our paycheques go.?????…..I ‘ve called it a systematic looting by the civil service for their over the top compensation…but the liberals would differ…of course.

This one of a thousand reasons there is a better consumer economy in the US…..more people can retire with dignity…….but we need to get people to understand the root cause of the short fall problem…..not just point fingers higgldy piggldy.
———————————————————-The cause of the problem is an unsustainable system. How to solve: ever heard of austerity, cowboy.

#134 Tom Vu on 03.28.13 at 12:59 pm

#127 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 12:28 pm

Learn to trade teacher, click on my name, I have Batman and Camel Toe strategy published.

====================================

How do I interpret graph if it/she lying down or standing on head ?

PS I ask about other positions later.

#135 The Prophet Elijah on 03.28.13 at 1:03 pm

#75 Suede on 03.28.13 at 1:29 am
US Economy is definitely rebounding. Call it the Vegas Index.

Can’t find a cheap deal for a 5 star hotel like 2 years ago. Lots of Amerikids with disposable income this spring.

Poker tables will be ‘hook, line and sinker’ time
———————————————————-
There is no true recovery built on debt. Debt has to be purged first to return to prosperity. Since the GFC US debt has grown exponetially. Come on now.

#136 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 1:06 pm

#127 Smoking Man – I am waiting for you to open your school of higher learning, and will there be a night school? I also need to know the tuition fees that you will be charging as will enroll as a student, as want another diploma to hang on my wall. I also want to know if lots of women will be there for after parties so we can have intellectual discussions over a few beer at a local pub, as would be a plus on my page.

#137 The Prophet Elijah on 03.28.13 at 1:09 pm

Banks do not create money. The Bank of Canada is a taxpayer-owned crown corporation. And you are a gold salesman. Go away. — Garth
——————————————————–
What do you think the US Federal Reserve is doing to the tune of $85 billion a month?

Central banks create money. Commercial banks do not. — Garth

#138 Dorothy on 03.28.13 at 1:09 pm

#85- this is one of the most common sense posts on here today.
Generational warfare is a pointless exercise, designed to deflect attention from those who are truly responsible for the current economic mess the western world finds itself in. Ill thought out Government policies, and greedy Corporations, are the cause of many of our current problems, yet few are pointing their finger in those directions.
That doesn’t let individuals off the hook; we’re all responsible for our own actions and must accept the consequences of what we do. But many things that affect our lives are beyond our control, or at least it seems that way much of the time. I truly believe that if people were more willing to get involved in politics, and speak out against policies they don’t agree with, things CAN be changed. But first we have to all stop this pointless generational infighting, and begin to see that we’re actually all on the same side. We, the silent majority, have all been shafted in one way or another by those in power, and it’s time we started to demand change.
We need Governments who make decisions that benefit the country as a whole, NOT just their wealthy friends. It isn’t necessarily true that policies that benefit large corporations are the best policies for the entire country. Look at what happened when policies deregulating the financial industry were touted as being the best way to go. Or how about policies that said individuals should have more involvement in how their pension funds are invested, as opposed to being in pension plans (that one worked out really well, didn’t it? NOT).
The problem is that those advising the Government are all too often beneficiaries of the policies they are advocating. And those who are actually in decision making positions within government don’t fully understand the people who they are making the decisions for.
This investment thing is a good example. The Government bods who thought people should have more say in how their pension savings were invested, are much more financially savvy that the average man in the street. And what works for the knowlegable few, does not necessarilly work for everyone else. Most people I know who have tried to invest their own pension savings via a defined contribution plan, are going to be retiring on a very low income. For the majority, this kind of pension plan has turned out to be a very poor investment because they don’t fully understand the choices they have, and have neither the time nor the inclination to keep on top of it. But those in power are so far removed from those they rule, that they failed to grasp these facts. And the result is an entire generation retiring into much reduced circumstances.
The fact that poorer generation is also one of the largest in history, is bound to have a negative effect on the overall economy. So where was the wisdom in enacting policies that contributed to their impoverishment? Yes, those policies enriched many financial corporations, but they definitely haven’t benefited the country as a whole.

#139 The Bear on 03.28.13 at 1:11 pm

#107

Yes I am. I’ve reading this blog for 2 years now, never been an active poster unless there is something that doesn’t make sense…

Like page 145 of the 2013 of the Canadian Budget noted in my earlier post #70

#140 Angela on 03.28.13 at 1:14 pm

Re the parents just getting out of debt and jumping right back in, they have a syndrome that my parents would have called “can’t stand the luxury.” We all know people like that, just when things start to get good they turn around and make things difficult for themselves because they can’t stand the luxury of things going well, like it’s foreign and they’re comfortable in debt or whatever.

#141 daystar on 03.28.13 at 1:15 pm

#103 Herb on 03.28.13 at 9:41 am

Lol, yes, spoken like a vaudville villian… or self aggrandizing attention seeker, whichever shoe/slipper fits! Here’s one for you SM, I’ll light a Bic just for you buddy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KyLqED_zOI

Back on Sabbatical now (cause I really, really like it!).

#142 Piccaso on 03.28.13 at 1:17 pm

@#8 Ronaldo
I know of two families in the past year where their financial ignorance and unpreparedness for retirement resulted in….suicide.

Nahh… just commit a crime and you’ll have a bed to sleep in and 3 squares a day.

#143 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 1:26 pm

Now see a big problem in Toronto as the younger crowd is coming out bigtime to live an adult life away from mom and dad with jobs in the core, and they are renting to live the good life. The vacancy rate is about 1%, and rents are moving higher with supply and demand, so the rental wars have begun, as they want their piece of the pie to party with an improved job market. This should get interesting, as it is all a matter of demographics via employment, so they are splitting from the suburbs and moving into the core to rent.

#144 John Prine on 03.28.13 at 1:29 pm

In BC a lot of my over 55 friends take advantage of the Property Tax Deferment Program where you don’t pay until you sell or are carried out. This year the rate is 1%. Gives you typically another $200 to $400 a month spending money. Even after 20 years there should still be enough for the kids…So coupled with the Provincial Homeowner’s Grant and the extra Age Grant past 65 does make staying in your house a little easier.

#145 SingleToiletDormitoryDiarrhea on 03.28.13 at 1:39 pm

The S&P just broke a new record! All hail to the stock market!

#146 jess on 03.28.13 at 1:43 pm

Tony

“An essential requirement for a successful criminal prosecution is original documents. There were very few original documents available and there was no legal mechanism to compel Caymen entities to produce such documents,” Ms Feehily wrote.
“Section 1078 of the Taxes Consolidation Act provides proceedings must be initiated within 10 years from the date of the commission of the offence,” Ms Feehily added.

A long-awaited report into the biggest financial and political scandal to hit Ireland has been published exposing the names of nearly 200 clients who held accounts with a “sham” bank. The scam also involved offshore trusts, foreign-registered companies and complicated financial manoeuvring.He said his office would now be supporting efforts to recover the 3.2 million euros (£2m) cost of the report.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/2104230.stm
Deputy prime minister Mary Harney said the report was a damning insight into “a world of conspiracy, fraud and tax evasion” over many years.
=

http://rowans-blog.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/why-british-banking-industry-has-become_27.html

#147 Bottoms_Up on 03.28.13 at 1:49 pm

My car payment is more than my property tax payment. Someone that can’t afford a car payment probably shouldn’t own a house? Or does their example exemplify just how cheap houses have historically been?

#148 AK on 03.28.13 at 1:57 pm

Dow 20,000: 10 Reasons Why

http://www.jamesaltucher.com/dow-20000-10-reasons-why/

#149 Bottoms_Up on 03.28.13 at 1:57 pm

#33 East Van on 03.27.13 at 9:45 pm
————————————–
Let’s play a little game, 9 million boomers…let’s say 1/3 of them sell their homes over the next 15 years….so that’s 3 million people…BUT, they’re married to each other, so that’s really 1.5 million sales…..so sales/yr come in around 150,000.

Out of those 150,000 sales, how many boomers will re-buy instead of rent (half?)? And what will they re-buy? Condos? Bungalows in small towns? Cottages? So let’s add 75,000 more deals per year….now we’re looking at boomer-driven real estate transactions of 225,000 per year….prices of boomer homes will come down, BUT, whatever boomers decide to buy instead will go up………….

#150 Victor V on 03.28.13 at 2:02 pm

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/personal-finance/mortgages/time-to-sell-my-house-and-rent/article10465869/

Baby boomers are a bunch of house huggers, but there are exceptions.

One is a guy we’ll call Joe. He e-mailed a short while ago to ask for some feedback on his idea of selling the family house and cottage, and renting his family’s next home.

A quick summary: Joe’s got a big house, a big mortgage and he’s worried about the housing market in the years ahead. His main question: “Would a move like this be considered radical, or could it become a trend?”

================

Blog dogs, please drop by the Globe’s site to give Joe some advice. There are a bunch of realtors in the comments thread encouraging him to go “all in” in real estate. Talk about conflict of interest!

#151 Dr. Hoof - Hearted on 03.28.13 at 2:10 pm

Listening on radio to a gal who graduated from Harvard in the 1970′s and later got an MD

She said that tuition at Harvard back then was approx. $ 4,000 per year. She said that, in sense of proportion, it was approx. 1/2 the average family income

Here in BC…I recall it being maybe $1500 for undergrad tuition ?

Now, its way out of line. She said that tuition is above the average family income.

What you have is a system set up to screw you right out of high school… put you into major student debt…to get used to it, then roll the dice again to get further into debt via brainwashing of House horniness.

In other words, how many 30 year olds are $500,000 in debt with student loans and that new condo ?

At the other end, I can see retirees who think they are secure going to get their feathers plucked.

In other words jaws tightening at both ends of the chronological spectrum.

#152 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 2:15 pm

#132…PE…ever heard of responsibility?

In Texas…where I live today……there are no overarching contracts with thugs and unions……no strikes…taxpayer money is carefully stewarded by responsible managers.

There are museums and galleries…public transpo…new infrastructure the likes no Canook has ever seen….great public hospitals…..cheap and available health care for all …a complete social net….new schools….great policing and service…..and no state income tax. …with u nemployment levels Saskatchewan would envy.

Even the arts has full state funding and housing…….I ask again….where does the money that is ripped off canadian paycheques go when by comparision you’re living in third world conditions with a stalinist regime of high paid elites herding you around by the nose.

You need austerity and systemic realignment of priorities in Canada…..in Texas they call it responsible and free government.

BTW…. the voters are far better informed of the issues here because of the huge number of independant tv and radio stations…..unlike a certain monopoly loving country I know.

1)recently I read in Canada’s media where the egg marketing board in Canada has been buying US eggs at US prices ( 36 eggs for $3 at any supermarket) and jacking them up to profit from Canadian consumers at $3.28 for 12 eggs. How does this fraud serve the consumer? Cost of living here is less than 50% of Canada.

2) People are waiting ten years and more for elective surgery under Canada’s ‘free system’. We constantly read of heart patients dying before they recieve treatment…….unions say the system is underfunded…while stats show that the same unions take 100% of the budgets for hospitals? Is that called hypocrasy? Liberals will call it ‘austerity’ it seems. BTW..a private insurance policy can be had for $300 p/m in Texas….providing instant access to health care…so much for the lies of the CBC eabout nasty US healthcare h?

3) In Europes PIIGS it was over lavish spending on goverment workers that broke the countries when the ponzi scheme finally washed out the last taxpayer…is that austerity?

4) And darn it….people are really polite and genuinely happy here…..art..great weather…low taxes….cheap food…….gee..if this is austere…bury me in Texas….cowboy.

#153 jess on 03.28.13 at 2:17 pm

myth : that it is a legal requirement for all publicly traded companies to maximize shareholder value

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6jJxGDM9mBg

see Scholarly articles for 1932 adolf berle and dodd
Shareholder Primacy’s Corporatist Origins

========
spam code or just some scuba gear and a few sharp-edged tools.
http://qz.com/68115/forget-about-the-cyberbunker-attack-heres-how-to-take-an-entire-continent-offline/

#154 HD on 03.28.13 at 2:26 pm

#139 The Bear on 03.28.13 at 1:11 pm
#107
Yes I am. I’ve reading this blog for 2 years now, never been an active poster unless there is something that doesn’t make sense…
Like page 145 of the 2013 of the Canadian Budget noted in my earlier post #70

I am just very impressed. When I was your age (now 28), there was no way I would have ventured on this type of blog to enquire about financial/economic issues.

I was more interested in playing basketball all day and finding creative ways to impress ladies.

True story.

Yet, I was considered one of the wisest kids of my crowd…

More power to you.

Best,

HD

#155 JuliaS on 03.28.13 at 2:41 pm

#30 Smoking Man

I like your set of rules.

Laws are made to protect lawmakers from law abiding citizens. Follow their rules and they’ll lead you straight to the slaughterhouse.

To sum up your points:

Teach your kids the concept of “power” as oppose to naive expectation of justice. Teach them to take notion of things that affect their lives, as oppose to following mainstream gossip that has zero to do with their personal well-being.

#156 Rainclouds on 03.28.13 at 2:45 pm

#62 Wonderland

Bang on observation

I sent your observation over to Whisperers on the edge as he is evicerating the “2nd largest english speaking Canadian Market” with a ” lazy and compliant media” as coined by GT:-)

http://whispersfromtheedgeoftherainforest.blogspot.ca/

Newsprint revenues in the toilet and they wonder why………………Pathetic really

#157 Paul on 03.28.13 at 2:58 pm

“250,000 immigrants per year to Canada will offset the aging population. The conservatives do well with immigrants, and will open the floodgates.”

**************

Some people don’t understand what net migration is. Once you subtract the people that leave Canada, we only get a population increase of 194K per year, not 250K.

Then there’s the matter of our declining population growth rate, in spite of all those immigrants:

http://www.indexmundi.com/g/g.aspx?v=24&c=ca&l=en

#158 The Prophet Elijah on 03.28.13 at 3:02 pm

#137 The Prophet Elijah on 03.28.13 at 1:09 pm
Banks do not create money. The Bank of Canada is a taxpayer-owned crown corporation. And you are a gold salesman. Go away. — Garth
——————————————————–
What do you think the US Federal Reserve is doing to the tune of $85 billion a month?

Central banks create money. Commercial banks do not. — Garth
——————————————————-
Bank of Canada is a Central Bank, and they are printing money via QE:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-01-28/mark-carney-leaves-canada-stealth-qe-rising-fastest-pace-2009?page=1

#159 Sean on 03.28.13 at 3:17 pm

Do banks really give people over 65 a 360k mortgage? On a 25 year term? So what happens to it if they drop dead before 90???

#160 rosie "moving backwards" on 03.28.13 at 3:29 pm

# 148
I like my expert better than yours.This guy is a genius. He has the inside scoop. I can feel it my bones. Why he isn’t more widely quoted is a mystery to me and his legion of followers. http://triblive.com/business/johndorfman/3724363-74/market-percent-stocks#axzz2OrdhbTSp

#161 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 3:30 pm

#136 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 1:06 pm
#127 Smoking Man – I am waiting for you to open your school of higher learning, and will there be a night school? I also need to know the tuition fees that you will be charging as will enroll as a student, as want another diploma to hang on my wall. I also want to know if lots of women will be there for after parties so we can have intellectual discussions over a few beer at a local pub, as would be a plus on my page.
……………………………………………………………

No diploma old man….Its learn to earn…5k per student
we put our heads together find a gap in the market, need that needs filled.

We lie about our skills, embelish like crazy

We use the tuition as a base, then go find an investors…

We higher gards as our slaves to do the work, loyal, stupid and esaly controlled.

We make it happen……

Sit back and collect our bounty…..

#162 Ret on 03.28.13 at 3:30 pm

Only a sucker tries to live on $600 a month Ontario Works. (Hope springs eternal with that program name.)

You get a job, pull a phony Compo claim and you just added $400 a month to your income.

Don’t forget to get your doctor to approve your Handicapped parking permit and book your weekly physio massage appointments to keep that Compo claim in the system. With all that extra time on your hands, you can now have a couple of Cash for Life kids, do a little work under the table, stock up at the food bank and you are golden.

I just got home. Cheques are out! The bars are packed. Cabs are flying around like crazy. Hamilton’s Barton and James Street areas in the north end are a hoppin. Spend it all, there’s more coming. HST cheques on April 5.

There is some good news though. Ontario’s Salary Disclosure list came out this afternoon listing the thousands of municipal and government workers making over $100,000 a year and earning gold plated pensions to boot.

Six parking meter ticketers and a cadet cop in T.O. are now able to live large as they raked in more than the $100,000.

I’m so screwed. No glass back for a Compo claim or government parking meter reader job.

#163 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 3:35 pm

#133 Tom Vu on 03.28.13 at 12:59 pm
#127 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 12:28 pm

Learn to trade teacher, click on my name, I have Batman and Camel Toe strategy published.

====================================

How do I interpret graph if it/she lying down or standing on head ?

PS I ask about other positions later.

……………………………………….

Standing on Head, Sell the Camel Toe, Buy the boobs.

This could have been funny my auto correct spelt smell. rather than sell…hahahahah

Just focuas on the lines, you cant be distracted playing this game……

#164 blok existentialist on 03.28.13 at 3:36 pm

#56 and #92, on working ‘forever’
You miss the point.
I thought ‘Freedom 55′ was a joke the first time I ever heard it … right up there with the ‘paperless desk.’
I observe retired seniors with health problems/disabilities who are bored out of their skulls with retirement. They would give anything to have a job of any kind so they could feel a useful part of the world again.
The investors on this site are still ‘working’ hard, though they call themselves retired.
I was fortunate enough to win the gene-pool lottery (outside of math skills), so I will naturally take advantage of it and keep right on working in the conventional manner. But it doesn’t mean I won’t do other things. And I will continue to add to my portfolio of different income streams on the off-chance that I will be hit by a refrigerator falling out of an airplane at some point in the future.
I hope neither of you are trapped in some miserable, but lucrative job … only sticking it out with dreams of escaping the wheel via an early retirement.
Don’t play dead until you have to because no one escapes the wheel.

#165 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 3:39 pm

#155 JuliaS on 03.28.13 at 2:41 pm
#30 Smoking Man

I like your set of rules.

Laws are made to protect lawmakers from law abiding citizens. Follow their rules and they’ll lead you straight to the slaughterhouse.

To sum up your points:

Teach your kids the concept of “power” as oppose to naive expectation of justice. Teach them to take notion of things that affect their lives, as oppose to following mainstream gossip that has zero to do with their personal well-being.
………………………………………………………

Nicely said……………………………..!!!!!

Think about it, you walk into a bank in Cypris, hand em a note and ask for 50k, you go to jail…….

Yet the bank can take all your money, not a damn thing you can do about it.

I know this shit I’m a smoking man. I understand humans, when your up against the wall….

Strongest Alpha wins………

#166 Dr. Hoof-Hearted on 03.28.13 at 3:40 pm

I get (2) local community papers as well as the Vancouver papers.

Community papers are basically ads and flyers….the odd newsworthy item. Way too kiss – ass slanted

Vancouver papers are too heavily skewed to RE, which will be their death knell.

Which is why I go to internet radio and news…and the odd “no holds barred ” blog.

The same old lying Bullsh*t from MSM gets repetitive and grating on the nerves.

#167 jess on 03.28.13 at 3:47 pm

The Upper Tribunal has issued a ruling disallowing a £200m loss made by FTSE 100 Land Securities that was to be offset against its tax liability, which was generated through a tax avoidance scheme operated by a subsidiary of Morgan Stanley.

Land Securities old shares in one of its group companies to a Cayman Island subsidiary of the US investment bank, which HMRC claimed had then artificially inflated the value of the shares by pumping money into the subsidiary.

Jim Harra, director deneral for business tax at HMRC, said: “This scheme was flagrant tax avoidance that provided finance to a FTSE 100 company that appeared cheap because the Press release

HMRC’s Director General for Business Tax, Jim Harra, said:

“This scheme was flagrant tax avoidance that provided finance to a FTSE 100 company that appeared cheap because the UK taxpayer was expected to pick up a £60 million bill.

#168 jess on 03.28.13 at 3:57 pm

tony ..offshore financial industry promotes to justify itself

Five not-so-convincing ways that tax havens justify their existence
By Naomi Rovnick — March 27, 2013

#169 Who Cares on 03.28.13 at 3:57 pm

“Theres a lot of anti american sentiment on this blog…say what you will….the average Social Security for a lifetime contributor south of the border is $2500 p/m….thats $5000 per couple vs the ‘crumbs’ you get in Canada…..I have to ask….where does all the money that gets taken from our paycheques go.?????…..I ‘ve called it a systematic looting by the civil service for their over the top compensation…but the liberals would differ…of course.”

I don’t know where you get the anti- American stuff from other than a couple of idiots and let’s not forget there are idiots that have taken the opposite tact on here and chose to rant about how awful Canada and Canadians are. Note what they have in common is the one word, IDIOTS.

Your SS information is completely wrong also, see below.

Social Security Basic Facts

February 7, 2013 (Printer Friendly Version)
•In 2013, almost 58 million Americans will receive $821 billion in Social Security benefits.

December 2012 Beneficiary Data

Retired workers

37 million

$46.3 billion

$1,262 average monthly benefit

dependents

2.9 million

$ 1.8 billion

Disabled workers

8.8 million

$ 10 billion

$1,130 average monthly benefit

dependents

2.1 million

$ .69 billion

Survivors

6.3 million

$ 6.6 billion

$1,215 average monthly benefit

#170 rosie "moving backwards" on 03.28.13 at 4:14 pm

#162

At least this crowd didn’t make the sunshine list. Close though. http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-bell-council-interactive,0,5213462.htmlstory

#171 Canada’s economy: On thinning ice | The Economist | The Affluent Boomer™ on 03.28.13 at 4:27 pm

[...] WHEN the world financial system collapsed in 2007, triggering a global recession, Canada recovered faster than any of the other members of the G7 group of large developed countries. Its banks remained solid, while low interest rates encouraged consumers to borrow and spend. But five years on, consumers are showing signs of flagging. The economy is set to expand by a paltry 1.6% this year. So the authorities are casting around for another source of growth. The trouble is they cannot seem to find one. Continue reading → [...]

#172 Who Cares on 03.28.13 at 4:40 pm

102 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 9:40 am

I just realized who you are and that this is a common refrain for you. You make Smoking Old Man look brilliant. You have nothing to offer except you think the states is better than Canada. Especially Texas, I have spent tons of time in Texas and think you better get out and look around a little because it is not the paridise you make it out to be for many of it`s residents. That is not to say we don`t have our problems here in Canada but you are misinformed, parinoid and really just plain full of shit. You should be added to Garth`s banned list if you ask me. You`re a shit-disturber. The kind of paristie that doesn`t have the nerve to yap off to someones face. You are the one I see most with something negative to say about this country everytime you get on here. So just STFU stupid.

That was abusive and pointless. Apologize or it’s your last comment. — Garth

#173 daystar on 03.28.13 at 4:47 pm

#155 JuliaS on 03.28.13 at 2:41 pm

Do you like his website too? Might wanna check it out before you run smoke for SM.

#174 chickenlittle on assignment on 03.28.13 at 4:48 pm

The Smoking Man School for Scoundrals?? I am in, even just for a good laugh!

#175 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 5:00 pm

@ #106 jwr on 03.28.13 at 10:13 am

Stickler you describe the system perfectly but if credit is not money then what is it? If I get a loan at a bank to buy a car I think the car dealer will readily admit that he received money for his automobile. If I whip out my credit card to buy groceries at a store I do believe I paid for those groceries and that the grocer will say he was paid for those groceries.

This is a credit-based fiat monetary system we currently enjoy and banks do indeed create money or credit or who cares what you call it but if it’s readily accepted for payment in exchange for goods and services, it’s money baby.
————————————-
>> I agree with you, that’s why I felt compelled to respond when Garth poo poos comments about banks creating money. He always says “banks don’t create money” to attempt to undermine the commentator….Garth knows what banks do…and knows the commentator does not really understand the system.

If I could get a bank charter to open my own bank…bet your ass I would.

#176 Victor V on 03.28.13 at 5:02 pm

Broad S.&P. 500-Stock Index Closes at Record High

The Standard & Poor’s 500-stock index closed on Thursday at a new record, eclipsing its previous closing high, set in October 2007.

At 4 p.m., the benchmark index was at 1,569.19 points, up 0.4 percent for the day, despite a report of rising claims for unemployment benefits. It closed the first quarter with a robust 10-percent gain.

The blue-chip Dow Jones industrial average, which was also up 0.4 percent Thursday, passed its 2007 milestone earlier this month, but the S.&P. 500 is widely considered to be a broader-based reflection of the American stock market. The Nasdaq composite index of largely technology stocks added 0.3 percent Thursday.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/29/business/daily-stock-market-activity.html

===========================

Good news for those of us with diversified portfolios.

Renting and investing never felt this good ;)

#177 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 5:03 pm

@ #113 MP on 03.28.13 at 11:07 am

@92 Stickler

@#56 blok existentialist on 03.27.13 at 11:11 pm

“why would anyone WANT to be retired for 40 years? Be like living in a concentration camp.”

>>WTF?! Imagine a retirement where you have health and money to do what you want. EVERYONE would want that.
___________________________________

Also called a LIFE. Start living it, and stop waiting around for retirement.

>>Who says anyone is waiting for retirement and not living their life? Your comment makes no sense.

#178 Stickler on 03.28.13 at 5:14 pm

@#164 blok existentialist on 03.28.13 at 3:36 pm
“I observe retired seniors with health problems/disabilities who are bored out of their skulls with retirement. They would give anything to have a job of any kind so they could feel a useful part of the world again.”

>>That is terrible. Sounds like those people dont have the health, or $ to do what they want…or have been broken so badly by the system that they can’t imagine a life without pleasing the man. Glad its not me. Hope its not you.

#179 Alliston on 03.28.13 at 5:17 pm

#83 It’s called saving. Have we really gotten so bad that people don’t know that saving creates wealth? geez.

I do know that saving does not create wealth, does not create wealth. If you believe in that BS myth – go to work for 40 years, save 10% of what you earn and then when you retire, you’re wealthy. NO – actually the individuals selling you that line of BS are the wealthy ones. What about all that wasted time, chunks of your life you’ll never get back?

#180 jess on 03.28.13 at 5:32 pm

Do lobbyist ads for the recruiting agencies promote the ‘skills shortage’

—————–
“Sixteen McDonald’s workers at three stores decided to strike after they learned about an earlier walkout by 300 student guestworkers who, like themselves, came to the U.S. on four-month J-1 cultural exchange visas.

In August 2011, student guestworkers from China, Turkey, Ukraine, and elsewhere walked out of a Hershey’s packing plant in Palmyra, Pennsylvania. Community leaders sat in to support the workers and the protests gained much media coverage.

The McDonald’s workers had similar complaints—either a drought of work, so they barely made enough to survive, or endless shifts, as long as 25 hours, for which they got no overtime pay. If they complained, they were threatened with deportation. The students were also expected to be available any time, with virtually no notice.

“We paid $3,000-$4,000 to come here,” said Jorge Rios, an Argentinian majoring in social communications. He said he signed a contract with GeoVisions, the firm that recruited the McDonald’s workers, that said he would get 40 hours of work a week and the possibility of more, at Pennsylvania’s minimum wage, housing, and free transport to work.

“In reality,” he said, “we were kept in basements, working 25 hours a week, and we couldn’t do anything else because we were expected to be on call all the time.”

http://www.labornotes.org/2013/03/student-guestworkers-pressure-mcdonalds

#181 BPOE's BrainFart on 03.28.13 at 5:32 pm

@#98

WHY, do you post these ridiculous repeticious “copy/paste” comments?

Possibly the most inane drivel yet seen.

#182 BPOE's BrainFart on 03.28.13 at 5:37 pm

@#142 Picasso
…and all the sex you dont want.

#183 Doug in London on 03.28.13 at 5:47 pm

@blok existentialist, post #164:
Freedom 55 a joke you say? If you invest wisely, you can retire long before that age. I took a generous buyout from a company (and I had some savings also) at age 34. After that I worked intermittently and LOVED the freedom of not being tied to the misery of a job running my life. Now, at age 52 I will retire by my 53rd birthday later this year. That will be freedom 53, not 55.

You’re also wrong about seniors bored out of their skulls with retirement. I’ve experienced the freedom of retirement and LOVE it! Having the freedom to do what you want and when, without the ball and chain of a job is AWESOME! Retirement is not the end of life, it’s more like starting a new chapter in your life where you have more freedom than ever before.

#184 TEMPLE on 03.28.13 at 5:57 pm

#162 Ret on 03.28.13 at 3:30 pm

There is some good news though. Ontario’s Salary Disclosure list came out this afternoon listing the thousands of municipal and government workers making over $100,000 a year and earning gold plated pensions to boot.

So go get a job with the civil service if it is such a good deal. I mean, your comment begs the question, right? If civil servants are overpaid for doing easy work, why aren’t you working in the service too?

TEMPLE

#185 Dr. Hoof-Hearted on 03.28.13 at 5:57 pm

The death of Canada will be the Governance models we allow to continue.

There is no Left versus Right, that’s a joke…its all neo cons that are fully willing to exploit the middle class and use the Civil Service as their goons.

Its them versus us.

#186 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 6:03 pm

#169 Who Cares – as starting with Bill Clinton all the funds in the USA security program was borrowed to balance the budget, and what is left? Well the only truth that President Bush ever had to say was a kick at a filing cabinet called the SS program and laughed by saying no money there but I.O.U’s. All the funds are gone.

#187 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 6:23 pm

#169..Who Cares…. indeed…….you either went to the Real Estate Pimp School of Using Averages to Spout Bull Cap or have zero background in simple math. Like in Canada…..SS payments are made on an individual basis and not by ‘averaging’.

Look genius…heres why ‘averages’ are so misleading for people with little education.

EX…..Ten people on an block. 9 make 100,000 p/a…..and one makes a million….adds up to 1.9 million …with me so far?

Divide by ten to get the averge and everybody suddenly makes an ‘average’ of 190,000…..except the one smart guy making a million who gets a douching of $810,000……liberal math…..get you every time.

Averages are for suckers and dummies who can’t figure out how to get new batteries into the calculator.

BTW…I was wrong I said $2500 is the amount of SS in the US…actually I was off by $154 dollars.

“Social Security retirement benefits are calculated for each individual, based on his or her own earnings, assuming both parties worked and accumulated the minimum 40 credits each to qualify. Spouses who were homemakers or disabled may draw against the working spouse’s record, and typically receive 32.5 – 50% of the spouse’s monthly benefit.

In 2010, the maximum individual benefit is $2,346 (or $4,692 for a couple). This assumes the person retires in 2010 at age 66, and has made the maximum FICA contribution every year since age 21, an unusual scenario.

The average monthly payment at the beginning of 2010 was $1,164.00.

PS…be careful what you read on the internet…especially about the facty bits…….sometimes you’ll get knee jerked by your own petard..

#188 Crash Calaway on 03.28.13 at 6:44 pm

In picture above the terrified dog screams

“Granny please turn around, I want to go back…
my odds of survival were better back at the pound!”

#189 Mr Buyer on 03.28.13 at 6:47 pm

#165 Smoking Man on 03.28.13 at 3:39 pm
Strongest Alpha wins
………………………………………………………………….
For me there are differences between alphas. There are alphas that create Camelot and alphas that create living hell on earth. Iff I were to fight for the top slot it would be for the express purpose of creating a just society. One must be a bare knuckle fighter to survive among bare knuckle fighters (although I think it is best to wrestle a boxer and box a wrestler) this is obvious. A truly exceptional leader in my warped estimation has a vision of some sort that is more along the line of one for all and all for one. An opportunistic alpha with the sole purpose of prevailing over and at the expense of others with no allowances for others to benefit from their relationship with said alpha, well that alpha lacks a higher vision. Life certainly is not sunshine and lollipops but can be made more so by an inspiring alpha that is ready willing and able to prevail over the destructively self serving alphas…

#190 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 6:54 pm

I have no idea what you are all talking about as the unfunded liabilities in USA going forward is about $100 trillion to pay for future entitlements. This is the amount of hard earning assets that must be in a Trust Account now, so now what?

#191 Mr Buyer on 03.28.13 at 7:05 pm

#143 Old Man on 03.28.13 at 1:26 pm
so they are splitting from the suburbs and moving into the core to rent.
………………………………………………………………..
It has been done before to a greater extent by the boomers. Rents come down in collapsing bubbles, even in Tokyo (although they have gone up in some areas). Why do rents come down? I have to ponder that, but it has been observed in the collapse of Japan’s bubble. I think it has something to do with scarcity of reliable renters with successive vacancies being a drain to be avoided at the expense of overall rental income. Like selling a house, renting has transaction costs to the landlord that have an impact upon the bottom line.

#192 SingleToiletDormitoryDiarrhea on 03.28.13 at 7:07 pm

From The Economist today:”Disappointing exports, stalled investment and fiscal austerity leave the overstretched consumer as Canada’s only hope for growth” – see http://www.economist.com/news/americas/21574481-disappointing-exports-stalled-investment-and-fiscal-austerity-leave-overstretched-consumer

#193 Randman on 03.28.13 at 7:08 pm

I’ll be waiting for your flippant retort Garth

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.ca/

“Inquiring minds in Canada managed to slog through a massive 433 page budget proposal and discovered a Depositor Haircut Bail-In Provisions For Systemically Important Banks.

Sure enough. Right on page 145 of the Canada Economic Action Plan for 2013 We see …

“The Government proposes to implement a bail-in regime for systemically important banks. This regime will be designed to ensure that, in the unlikely event that a systemically important bank depletes its capital, the bank can be recapitalized and returned to viability through the very rapid conversion of certain bank liabilities into regulatory capital. This will reduce risks for taxpayers. The Government will consult stakeholders on how best to implement a bail- in regime in Canada. Implementation timelines will allow for a smooth transition for affected institutions, investors and other market participants.”

In case you are unfamiliar with bank parlance, deposits are not “assets” they are “liabilities”. A plan that would turn “certain bank liabilities” into regulatory capital is a plan to confiscate deposits.”

Wrong. — Garth

#194 Nostradamus Le Mad Vlad on 03.28.13 at 7:18 pm

Inner Peace: This is so true

If you can start the day without caffeine,

If you can always be cheerful, ignoring aches and pains,

If you can resist complaining and boring people with your troubles,

If you can eat the same food every day and be grateful for it,

If you can understand when your loved ones are too busy to give you any time,

If you can take criticism and blame without resentment,

If you can conquer tension without medical help,

If you can relax without alcohol,

If you can sleep without the aid of drugs,

Then You Are Probably

The Family Dog!
*
And for those who are aware that constant change is a necessity so have become completely disinterested in the world’s affairs, here are a couple of donuts . . .

http://jhaines6.wordpress.com/2013/03/28/presstv-look-out-the-briiics-are-coming/
and
http://dailybail.com/home/russia-and-china-plan-new-bank-to-replace-the-imf.html

#195 Randman on 03.28.13 at 7:30 pm

How about this guy?

Cyprus is a non event…

There is no more crisis in Cyprus…

Who cares? It’s the size of Edmonton …not important …

Tell that to this guy…

“”I went to sleep Friday as a rich man. I woke up a poor man.”
His money was all in the Laiki ”Popular” Bank which was the main casualty of Cyprus’ bailout package set by the European Union. Laiki is to be dismantled. Savings of less than €100,000 are to move to the Bank of Cyprus. Anything more than that will almost certainly be wiped out as the bank is wound down, its remaining assets taken by the bank’s creditors.
Last week he heard a rumour that the bank was in trouble and went into Aiya Napa to ask his bank manager – a friend – if he should move his life savings.
”There’s no problem, nothing to worry about,” he was told.
Not so. ”I go to bed and I can’t sleep. I walk around, I have a coffee. I am thinking about my family.”
John’s tears flow. As he chokes up, his son George, who moved to Cyprus in 1990, explains.
”The whole family, we used to work at the markets. I would work at the markets on the weekend to help my parents while my mates were off having fun. Honest work in honest jobs. Now all that hard work is paying
the debts of other people and the government. It’s disgusting, to be honest.”

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/i-went-to-sleep-friday-as-a-rich-man-i-woke-up-a-poor-man-20130328-2gxab.html#ixzz2OsckJY2v

Doisregard these warnings at your own peril…..
This is not about gold or silver or prefereeds or the sp500

This is a real threat to your wealth …..get your money
Out of the system…at least enough for 6 months expenses

We are. Surrounded. By. Fools. — Garth

#196 Cow Man on 03.28.13 at 7:37 pm

# 184 Temple

Some of us are not willing to put a price on our integrity. It wouldn’t matter what the pay some of us would not work as government masters of the indenture servitude tax payers. It is all about an honest days pay for self respect.

#197 Daisy Mae on 03.28.13 at 7:41 pm

My neighbour recently sold. The semi-attached townhouse in a gated community was on the market less than a month. Priced ‘right’? She moved across the highway into a condo. With real estate commissions and other assorted legal costs, what’s the point?

#198 Randman on 03.28.13 at 7:42 pm

Wrong. — Garth

Wrong? That’s it?

Wrong as in the wording doesn’t exist in the budget?

Wrong as in you don’t think they would ever do that in Canada?

Wrong..as in “it’s wrong that they put that in the budget?

Please clarify

#199 blok existentialist on 03.28.13 at 7:46 pm

#183 — Congratulations are in order since you’ve found the right solution for you. I wish you a happy ending. But one size does not fit all. I’m perfectly confident that I’ve found the right solution for me.

#200 Macrath on 03.28.13 at 8:18 pm

Canada Bank Bailout Cost $114 Billion At Peak, CCPA Says
“In March 2009, CIBC stood out for receiving support worth almost one and a half times the value of all outstanding shares.

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/04/30/canada-bank-bailout-cost-ccpa_n_1464398.html

That was the bail-out next time is the bail-in!

#201 JuliaS on 03.28.13 at 8:22 pm

I went to a few town meetings recently in Vancouver. The city plans to develop the Granville corridor, increasing height limits and letting land leases expire to allow developers to move in and build condos. Granville St. separates the multi-million dollar UBC cottages from the rest of BC. As their inhabitants age, they should, no doubt, choose to downsize and move into cheaper houses and rentals. They’ll probably want to be as close to their old residences as possible. The semi-abandoned Fraser River area in the West End would’ve been rebuilt already, if it wasn’t for all the land left poisoned and polutted by the chemical factories about 30 years ago.

So, Granville St, is up for bidding but there are no takers. I’m noticing CRE spots that have been empty since as far back as 2010! The only big ongoing project is taking place at the South End that was supposedly 70% sold the moment it was announced. It In fact it sold so well [sarcasm] that construction had to be delayed by 4 months due to insufficient project funding.

Lots of places are eyed for demolition on a mere assumption that building permits would get snapped up in an instant. Meanwhile some construction sites east of Granville have gone pass their move-in dates with nothing but a security fences guarding empty blocks. Builders are going under one by one quietly. No mainstream reports. No mention of it. Only the city talking how they’re going to sell all of the land, take care of affordable housing and collect enough taxes to balance the budget by 2014. Yep! Sunshine and unicorns.

#202 Robbie on 03.28.13 at 8:27 pm

It seem like the same questions/comments/observations come up again and again, so I’d like to have a simple list for those who are daunted by all the information. Here, in part, is what Garth is trying to tell you.

DIVERSIFY…no one asset is immune from rises and falls in value (no, not even your house, your gold bars or your Liberace record collection)
LIVE WITHIN YOUR MEANS…credit cards and loans are useful but don’t let them be an anchor. Do you really need a new car, boat, etc.? When I shop and see something I think I want, I hold it in my hand and ask myself, “How have I ever lived without this?” After reflection, I almost always end up putting it back on the shelf.
GET GOOD ADVICE AND PAY FOR IT WISELY: Hire someone who makes a profit by trading your assets and…guess what…your assets will get traded and purchases will often be made in stocks/etc. that have bonuses attached for the advisor. Or, you could hire someone by the hour who makes nothing from your purchases and just gives advice.
MONEY IS ONLY PAPER…BUT IT IS ALSO ACCEPTED. Call it “fiat currency”, note that it is not backed by gold or silver and suggest that there is no intrinsic value. However, try buying groceries with gold bars, diamonds or vintage baseball cards. Money is accepted and that’s why it works.
IF ALL AROUND YOU ARE TELLING YOU TO DO SOMETHING…IT IS LIKELY WRONG. “Buy a house like your mom and dad did and you’ll never go wrong,” “Tech stocks will continue to go up and up.”
PLAN FOR YOUR FUTURE…no, the government will not have lots of money to give to you when you’re retired
DON’T WORRY, BE HAPPY…okay, maybe Garth doesn’t exactly say this, but if you follow a lot of his advice, you won’t be worried about what to do with your money, how much bigger a house you can afford. Maybe then you’ll have time to relax and enjoy life.
WHAT USED TO WORK NO LONGER WORKS…the world has changed. Housing is no longer an easy way to increase your assets. Governments have borrowed so much that there’s little left to increase spending on pensions, hospitals, etc. Stop believing in what used to work and look around and see what works now.
THE ONLY PERSON WITH A BEARD WHO YOU CAN TRUST IS SANTA CLAUS…actually Garth doesn’t say that but I had to throw in at least one thing to irritate him. :)

#203 CrowdedElevatorfartz on 03.28.13 at 8:41 pm

@#198 Randman

As in, he thinks your …… wrong.

#204 The American on 03.28.13 at 8:43 pm

Ohhhhh, goodie… North Korea, here we come. How might this affect markets?
As only Brian Williams (my favorite) can deliver from NBC Nightly News:

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/28/17498063-nuclear-capable-stealth-bombers-sent-to-south-korea-amid-kim-jong-uns-threats?lite

#205 The American on 03.28.13 at 8:48 pm

And one more (sorry, I just had to post a Fox “news” report. When Fox “news” *actually* has the story right, then you better take note).

http://news.yahoo.com/video/stealth-bombers-deployed-over-south-191330689.html

#206 Bman on 03.28.13 at 8:59 pm

What’s a “gifted” 5 percent down payment?

http://www.attainyourhome.com/

#207 Alex on 03.28.13 at 9:10 pm

#205
In fact “Fox” is the only news station reporting the facts_ and that’s a fact

#208 Randman on 03.28.13 at 10:15 pm

@#198 Randman

As in, he thinks your …… wrong.

Actually your wrong is wrong

Should be

You’re wrong

Just saying…

#209 TEMPLE on 03.28.13 at 11:14 pm

#196 Cow Man on 03.28.13 at 7:37 pm

Some of us are not willing to put a price on our integrity. It wouldn’t matter what the pay some of us would not work as government masters of the indenture servitude tax payers. It is all about an honest days pay for self respect.

Total bullcrap. I suspect your “integrity” more a function of your ignorance and ideology getting in the way of learning about the civil service, what it does, and why we need it. In other words, the taxpayer is too smart to hire people like you.

TEMPLE

#210 Who Cares on 03.29.13 at 12:47 am

#187 afraidit allmightend on 03.28.13 at 6:23 pm
You’re giveing maximum and that is the average from the social security website, look it up.

I’m no realator, I’ve spent forty years as a long haul truck driver interacting with real people that you have never met.

You have got on here and bashed Canada repeatedly and I’ve had it with it. You love Texas, great. You love the U.S.A great stay there and restrict your bullshit to US websites.

I stand by that you are a spineless little twirp that is brave behind a keyboard but wouldn’t dare run your yap if you were standing in front of me. Now you on ignore and I’ll bybass anything you post because you are a waste of time, waste of breathe and waste of skin.

#211 afraidit allmightend on 03.29.13 at 9:07 am

# 209 WC…..Telling the truth is not bashing……the liberal agenda is to demonize the messenger….I stand up to the stupid and communists every day of the week…….now…get back to learning how to spell.

#212 futureexpatriate on 03.29.13 at 9:43 am

#210 The liberal agenda?

Dinosaur nutcase.

#213 Cow Man on 03.29.13 at 10:40 am

# 208 Temple

Good rational comment on your part. In fact I presently am gainfully employed by the tax payer. After I finished my own 40 year career as a independent business person. Why am I replying to you I have no idea.

#214 TS on 03.29.13 at 3:08 pm

250,000 immigrants per year to Canada will offset the aging population. The conservatives do well with immigrants, and will open the floodgates.

Nine million Boomers, dude. Not even close. — Garth

9 million per year?

#215 SCIBIDUBADEBUMBADO on 03.29.13 at 5:04 pm

An ex realtor just applied for a part time position with my company paying $12.00/ hr.