It may be July. It may be hot. Yet there are those who blow hard on the spent embers of the residential housing market, hoping the flames will reappear.
Two small examples of the delusion that envelopes our society, and more incontrovertible proof real estate may be in for a fiery descent. After all, how can things work out well when you sell houses to people who have no money? Or when a vendor’s naked greed shows the emperor has no clothes?
First we whisk you to the corner of Gerrard and Parliament in downtown Toronto, better known in the day as The Projects, or Regent Park. It was once the site of a monumental public housing mistake which actually replaced a tawdry Depression-era slum. And while the buildings change, social problems remain. But, as the Daniels Group so cleverly knows, if you build it, they will come.
Even if they have only enough cash to buy a loveseat at Ikea.
This highly successful Toronto developer is flogging units in its new condo building here, called One Park West, with a unique program it developed. Of course, it sells units for 5% down, and arranges financing for the other 95%, which is backstopped by the taxpayers who read this toxic blog. And, of course, if you borrow your first mortgage from a lender like TD, you can actually get 4% back in cash – or $10,000 on a $250,000 loan – which means the bank can pay part of your 5% deposit.
But why stop there? This is prudish, buttoned-down Canada where only the creditworthy get to obtain real estate.
So, if you don’t actually have 5% to buy a condo (prices average $400 a square foot), you can buy one for less than the $16,000 needed for a $320,000, 800-sf box. How much less? Well, $3,500 is enough under Daniels’ Gradual Deposit Payment Plan. The rest you pay monthly. Just like Ikea.
But there’s more. If you are over 18, a renter and earn less than $77,900, then you qualify for Daniels’s First Home Boost program. The developer will give anyone with 5% down and extra 10% – “Boost your down payment from 5% to 15% interest and payment free!” – which drops the mortgage to 85% of the purchase price with a small reduction in the monthly. Sound too good to be true?
Well, the ‘boost’ is actually a second mortgage, increasing the overall indebtedness back up to 95%. And it’s not exactly free. If the unit is sold anytime within 20 years, the second mortgage must be paid in full, plus an amount equal to 10% of any gross capital appreciation. So if the $320,000 unit sold for $350,000 in five years (good luck), then the second mortgage of $32,000 would be paid from proceeds, as well as a penalty amount of $3,000. Then from the $285K remaining would come the realty commission of 5% (plus HST) of $16,000, for a net of $269,000.
Did I miss anything? Oh yeah, the 85% mortgage of $272,000. Is this a great country, or what?
To its credit, Daniels says if the unit is sold for a capital loss, the second mortgage will be waived. But as you can see from the above, there are several ways to fleece the lambs.
Now to Bubble City, for an historic moment in time, when we stand back and pay homage to an orgy of self-importance, myopia and wet coast animal spirits which must surely mark the demise of a market gone insane. Or maybe it’s just me. But what would you pay for this bung?
…with this dream kitchen…
…well some greater fool just shelled out $2,165,000 for an unrenovated wood frame house on a cinder block foundation built in 1940. Says the Vancouver realtor: “Water and mountain views, half block from Locarno Beach Park, 4 bedroom bungalow with full basement on prime 60 x 95 freehold lot. Hold it, rent it or build your dream home.”
Or weep. Or giggle. Or give thanks.
Say, do you smell smoke?
Note: I will be speaking in downtown Vancouver on the evening of September 16th. Reserve a seat here. — Garth
186 comments ↓
We spent a couple of hours on Saturday night looking at houses in Port Alberni. That would go for around 160K or so.
So a couple of million more across the pond.
Delusional.
$2.165M for a piece of crap on an average-sized lot.
I’d really like to understand why the person shelling out over $2M for garbage wouldn’t prefer something like…
San Francisco #1, San Francisco #2, or San Francisco #3.
or, even:
Manhattan #1 or Manhattan #2.
or, to provide a more direct comparison to Vancouver:
Seattle #1, Seattle #2, or Seattle #3.
But Garth, 1/2 a block from Locarno Beach!!! You can see the fireworks without sitting in a two hour traffic jam!! 20 minutes of awe inspiring pyrotechnics that attracts 100′s of thousands of people!!! Vancouver’s prime cultural event!!! You could even be home in time to thwart the break and enter in progress!! Who wouldn’t pay 2mil for this!?!? LOL
“It’s different here.” – Real Estate Jester.
Garth, 2 million would buy a really nice little house somewhere that is really nice and not a cultural wasteland like ‘couver in a truly nice place like Nice. Ooops, I keep forgetting the peekaboo view of the mountains and all the asians wanting to live in a cultural wasteland.
Hey, but that $2.165 million for the 60 times 95 foot lot, gives you 5700 square foot of lot…
Hey so that’s only $380 per square foot for the land.
(hmmm when did they start selling land by the square foot???)
And!, you get the tear-down thrown in for free.
I tust this hard-bargaining buyer was able to get the appliances thrown in as well. (And maybe those three chicks from yesterday’s picture…)
Holy smokes, I can probably see that mansion from my balcony. We have to be in the blow-off top phase or somebody with a massive grow-up just did the harvesting and has more money than brains.
We all know our fair share of ding-dongs, but this is off the scale!
The end is near. That was the greatest fool, now it’s all downhill!
But the ??, when will the craziness end?? It appears that there is a never ending pool of idiots…
Trailers here in Yellowknife look more attractive than that, newer as well and only $300,000.
It is not what it seems.
These buyers are not so wrong. They are just taking chances.
If in a year time the price doesn’t increase to cover that year’s expenses plus profits, then… anyway, the government is backing all the loans. They don’t even put downpayments, it is also borrowed from the banks and backed by taxpayers.
So, these buyers have almost nothing to loose.
Remember, they didn’t buy the house because they thought they could/couldn’t pay for it. They bought it because they are totally convinced that they will be able to sell it to somebody else with similar mentality at a higher price. If there are not buyers, then, the taxpayer will pay (in a very different way).
It is almost a risk free “investment”.
omg……swoooooon………thud!
Gerrard and Parliment, only a few blocks from St james town. Many of the condo’s in that area that have been built are still vacant to the rate of 20% plus.
One of those “trendy” or up and coming areas. Way to much money for that hood.
Good play buy the developers. Watch that trend it will grow.
Developsers are trying to get out “in front of the market” and out do each other to get the project done and sold.
Garth, you forgot to mention the new advantage organ harvesting incentive clause further down on the agreement and how first time buyers willing to give up a kidneys can claim one months supply of Canadian backstopped complimentary cat food. Next post right?
Stunning. I can’t believe even a Canadian bank would finance so much as 25% of that amount on that house. Must have been a cash deal but that doesn’t seem right. Realtors entering phoney deals in MLS to get the stats up? That doesn’t seem plausible either. Maybe it has tulips.
I figured it out! It must have been a developer trying to buy up much of the block for a 40 story condo tower. Tulips wouldn’t do it.
Insanely over-priced in the Lower Mainland, yet with all the talk of a double dip recession and rising interest rates, layoffs, lack of good paying jobs in the Lower Mainland – everyone is self employed because most
can’t find a good job-slowing sales, there has been no substantial decrease in prices. There would have to be a 50% drop for houses to become affordable or in line with the fundamentals here. What’s the likelihood of that?
Tom
Hi Garth,
I only discovered your blog 2 months ago …….your blog confirmed all of my own thoughts. The sad part is that I did not act upon those thoughts sooner…….since I have been used to mostly living among “delusionals”. I have lived everywhere in Canada, and before moving to AB in 2006 at the height of the so-called boom…………I lived in Montreal. We also had a great cottage outside the city which had 3.5 acres and had only cost us 40k. Then AB job offers came and we bought a house in D-Edmonton for 370k. Now we are moving to TO for even better paying jobs and trying to sell our house in AB. The house is the best priced house in the neighbourhood…..like 20k below what would be comparable. We already dropped the price 60k from 7 weeks ago. Still we have not had any offers. We are losing big money on this house because we did extensive renos to the tune of 25k. I just want to get out of AB and its “living-20yrs-behind-the-rest-of-the-world” culture and rent in TO. I will also buy land in ON so that I can hunt and fish (like I do now —– I am really good at this) — this will be my recreation and true “insurance for self -sufficiency” if things go wrong with the markets. We do not have a mortgage and if we sell at 360k, we will have a net worth of 430k. We are both 36. What do you suggest for us? Drop the price even further and suck it up before all else is lost?
T.O. Bubble Boy on 07.27.10 at 9:46 pm
Your SF, NY & Seattle #1′s were far from the water in comparison to the Vancouver lot. The house is an obvious tear down – it’s located half a block from one of the best beaches in the city, 15 minutes from downtown and in a very upscale neighborhood of single family homes. Vancouver is also a very desirable growing city. (sorry, it is – check the stats.) Not saying it’s worth what it sold for, just that the value can’t be judged on a tear down structure.
Note that San Fran and Manhattan have more or less held their value, despite the worst housing crises since the depression, so what’s the likelihood of Vancouver tanking, with a more moderate housing crises here? Not to compare it with New York, but what else do you have in Canada? Stamped land Calgary? Northern Ontario?
“Rare Find” indeed!
2419 sqft, 4 Bedrooms, 2 bathrooms. That’s roughly $900 of living space. It wasn’t that hard to find the original ad in caches.
I hope they got the weed investment package while they’re at it.
Excuse me while I smack my head against the wall to stop it from hurting.
Hmmm.. I smell smoke all right, but it’s not tobacco…
I forgot to say that we have 2 kids and have always struggled to make ends meet. I inherited 150k to pay off the mortgage and now I feel like I am wasting it on a price-feefall.
I was guessing about $250,000…but, seeing as it is Vancouver, I’d be prepared to raise that to $450,000. CASH.
Greetings all, been out with sun stroke for the past little bit –
Here’s a bit of a bell ringer for the bunch in Van and to let you know what a little less than 2 mil and a bit more can get you.
http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId=9201756
This one is the original Ivey estate house – Think the flooring in the foyer (original detail I think) might be the same colour as the wood in the vancouver kitchen??
2.85 Mil WITH indoor olympic size pool –
OR next door for 1 & a half:
http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?propertyId=9629698
and this lovely was carved out of a chunk of the original house
how do you spell imbalance??
isn’t it I M B E C I L E??
-
“What problem (3)? Say, do you smell smoke?”
Not forest fire smoke in the Chokeanagan. Burnt and bbq’d Property Virgins, yes.
“. . . a vendor’s naked greed shows the emperor has no clothes? . . . some greater fool just shelled out $2,165,000 to buy a loveseat at Ikea.”
This planet has really gone off its rocker! Lemme outta here — stop the world ‘cuz I wanna git off!
Chaos – FYI. Plus — Could be something, maybe nothing — west coast ‘quakes unlimited!
Link in. Another ‘The October Surprise’? Obama’s ratings are tanking fast, and he needs to pull a rabbit out of a hat!
What sayeth China about this mess? They have their own backyard to clean up as well.
Breaking Up is hard to do. Maybe. “The Chinese and other foreign lenders will be very unhappy about their investments. So will anyone who is a creditor of the U.S.”
Looting the public purse is what all govts. excel at.
Mish says bears are hibernating.
There is a connection between all the dots. Kinda long-winded, just glaze over how this whole mess has been taking shape while sheeple were sleeping. Connecting the dots is a little further down.
Once again I am blown away by these examples! What is so amazing about Vancouver? I don’t have any rental comparisons, but I find it hard to believe a similar (or nicer) spot couldn’t be rented for less than $4000 a month, which is still only 1.2 million over 25 years. I also doubt the buyer bought with cash so even with a 25 year amortization, 25% down (unlikely), AND 2% interest for the life of it (impossible) they’re adding AT LEAST $400K in interest costs. I’d rent some killer digs, bank the extra $1.5 million over the next 25 years and then retire to a nice small town that isn’t populated by dimwits.
Insane. Vancouver has always been a weird place to live but boy, we have major mental issues extant.
I have lived in this burg off and on for thirty plus years, and I honestly think that there is something wrong with folks here. The carnage is going to breathtaking.
Two reasons to NOT buy a Toronto condo:
1. Students. From what I’ve heard, many of these ridiculously expensive brand new condos in downtown Toronto are being rented out to university students, often in groups to split the rent. Clearly there is a massive oversupply of condos if landlords are willing to rent to students at all, let alone for low enough rents that they can afford them.
2. The “occupancy” fee. Apparently, from a conversation I overheard, you are expected to pay about six months of rent to the developer when you first move in to a brand new condo, before the condo is officially registered as a condo corporation, which does NOT go toward paying down your mortgage. What a great way to pad greedy condo developers’ pockets.
That Vancouver bung will be torn down in no time and up goes another mansion. Congratulations to the sellers.
ell some greater fool just shelled out $2,165,000 for an unrenovated wood frame house on a cinder block foundation built in 1940.
———————————————-
impossible. I don’t believe that. The house that was in that picture could not have been sold for that much. There must be a mistake. No one can be that stupid.
Rockefeller Reveals 9/11 FRAUD to Aaron Russo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nD7dbkkBIA
One word – unbelievable.
I smell smoke from the big spleef the realtor lit up with the buyer before they made the offer. It’s gotta be the weed here on the wet coast for people to be so delusional…or the guys wife busting his a$$ to buy her a house. I hope this RE wagon crashes by at least 50% so it crushes some sense into these stupid idiots. I can just see the RE agent all smug and pompous after he/she closed this deal. West side agents are the slimiest I have seen…that is why this crash can’t come too soon.
Probably an immigrant with pretty big wallet. You don’t have to feel sorry for him. Maybe the $2mil amount is just pocket change for him.
#3 TheFirstRick on 07.27.10 at 9:49 pm
But Garth, 1/2 a block from Locarno Beach!!! You can see the fireworks without sitting in a two hour traffic jam!! 20 minutes of awe inspiring pyrotechnics that attracts 100’s of thousands of people!!! Vancouver’s prime cultural event!!! You could even be home in time to thwart the break and enter in progress!! Who wouldn’t pay 2mil for this!?!? LOL
I’m surprised that Vancouver is seeing such a greater fool to purchase that 2 Million dollar home! IN Edmonton here sales are softening very quickly average housing price have contracted about $10,000 in just the last three weeks. Condos have gone down about $15,000 since it peaked in April this year. Lots of for sale signs still cropping up. Many newer buildings built 3-4 years ago in Edmonton still haven’t sold out even though they’ve been trying to sell for many years. I think about 5 large condo complexes have either just gone bankrupt since they cleared the land/or poured the parkade…. more info on edmonton mls stats here: http://www.bobtruman.com/Edmonton_SFH_stats/page_1918017.html
$2.2M? Just looking at the photo, I guessed 5% of that. Cute little house, but but it looks like the garage is missing a roof.
You could buy sooooo much more for $2M. You could retire at any age in some decent countries with that. WTH was the buyer thinking? Was this a financed purchase? If so, WTH was the lender thinking?
This reeks of certain cities in California, circa 2005, except Cali is much nicer.
#133 dark sad person
Here’s what the mother of all investors has to say about GOLD:
http://www.commodityonline.com/news/Why-Warren-Buffett-hates-to-invest-in-gold-23070-3-1.html
I would take my cues from somebody who know what they are talking about. If you post a reply figuring you know more, that only means you are AN IDIOT!
**********************
“that only means you are AN IDIOT!”
That’s probably the only thing I’ve heard you say-that has a half assed chance of being correct–
Good old Warren-the GS/Wells Fargo bum boy-who once warned-that OTC derivatives were-
“weapons of mass destruction”
Same “crook” phrase that Bush used-to go into Iraq illegally-
(from your link)
“He has frequently spoken of his belief that inflation will rise in years to come as governments try to deal with large and rising amounts of debt. Gold would seem to be a natural refuge.”
********
The guy who wrote that article is either dreaming about what your main man said-or-Warren doesn’t know squat about Gold-or the “fact” that Gold is “not” a very good inflation hedge-although it does hold its buying power–
Ask Garth-about how well Gold does in inflation-
(one of the “few” things we agree on-about Gold)
*************
So-let’s have a look at your Guru-
“Warren Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway Inc (BRK) said on Friday that first quarter profit tumbled 64 percent, hurt by losses tied to derivatives contracts and a steep slide in insurance premiums.
Net income for the Omaha, Nebraska-based insurance and investment company fell to $940 million, or $607 per Class A share, from $2.6 billion, or $1,682, a year earlier.”
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/business/business-berkshire-results.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Ka-boom
This weekend, at the annual general meeting of Berkshire Hathaway, Mr Buffett said he was keen to diversify away from companies whose business was largely in dollars, since he expects the US currency to lose more value in the coming years.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=&xml=/money/2008/05/05/cnbuff105.xml
(2008) Ka-boom
Warren Buffett, chief executive officer of Berkshire Hathaway Inc., said the global credit crunch has eased for bankers, and the Federal Reserve probably averted more failures by helping to rescue Bear Stearns Cost
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=a9qMR2tesBU8
(2008) Ka-boom
*******
“Warren Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway Inc (BRK) said on Friday that first quarter profit tumbled 64 percent, hurt by losses tied to derivatives contracts and a steep slide in insurance premiums.
Net income for the Omaha, Nebraska-based insurance and investment company fell to $940 million, or $607 per Class A share, from $2.6 billion, or $1,682, a year earlier.”
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/business/business-berkshire-results.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
(cough) losses “tied” to derivatives–ohhhh no
ya mean those nasty “weapons of mass destruction”
********
Bloomberg is reporting Berkshire Profit Plunges 96% on Stock Market Bets.
Warren Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway Inc. posted a fifth-straight profit drop, the longest streak of quarterly declines in at least 17 years, on losses from derivative bets tied to stock markets.
Fourth-quarter net income fell 96 percent to $117 million, or $76 a share, from $2.95 billion, or $1,904 a share, in the same period a year earlier, the Omaha, Nebraska-based firm said in its annual report. Book value per share, a measure of assets minus liabilities that Buffett highlights in his yearly letter to shareholders, slipped 9.6 percent for all of 2008, the worst performance since Buffett took control in 1965.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aOYOfTNCuQIQ
(2009) Ka-boom
**************
GOLDMAN, DERIVATIVES
“We love the investment,” Buffett said. “Our preferreds are paying $15 a second, so as we sit here, ‘Tick, tick, tick, tick,’ that’s $15 every second,” he said.
Buffett added that the SEC lawsuit was not a serious enough event to raise reputational issues that would call into question the Berkshire investment.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE64010G20100501
(2009) seems uncle Warren had a change of heart about the WMD’s huh-
I could go on about how he bought 140 million oz’s of Silver at around $5 and sold at $ 10 and after the sale-the price went to a high of around $20-
Sooo–looks to me like–he sold-way to early–
(there’s a more dark and sad story that goes with this-but-better not get into that “here”)
So–Warren has made some costly mistakes and has changed his calls-”lots” and as the above proves–
He’s been wrong on “lots” of calls-
Even though he warned everyone about derivatives-
He was in fact-up to his ass in them-
Do you suppose-he could possibly be doing the same sorta thing with Gold?
Naw–not good old uncle Warren–
question for you–Gman
Do you think he’s leveraging into US real-estate-like you want to-considering you take your “cues” from him?
I know–I know–Uncle Warren has some big bucks–
This being Vancouver, it’ll no doubt be razed to build some shiny, new, equally poorly constructed piece of crap.
Hard to believe that where I live that same house would maybe crack 150k…
Some serious problems in this country. I mean in comparison if the housing price collapsed people like myself if not owning the house outright would be taking a hit.. but survivable given if proper investments like Garth talks about had been made elsewhere.. but a $2 million dollar WW2 house? People are screwed.
Garth: I wonder what would happen to someone who tried to warn people by carrying a sign in front of these real estate sales centres as a protest? Do you think they would be arrested? Why is it that the real estate inndustry is permitted to assault our eyes with their propaganda and yet we are not allowed to respond in same?
Bye bye GOLD. Does anyone remember India bought 200 tonnes of Gold from the IMF at 900 an ounce. The news read “India buys gold”. It should have read “IMF SELLS GOLD”.
PS: Not sure what I dislike more, the counter tops or lending institutions.
I would really like to have 5 examples of price inflation and 5 of asset deflation to help me understand.
Anybody?
I think we are facing an upside down pyramid scheme. The few supporting the many.
I have a backup generator and I would reccomend a backup portable air conditioner. Invest in air conditioners.
C’mon Garth what a bargain don’t you know REAL estate doubles every 10 years and never goes down.
Said with my tongue firmly in cheek……LOL
The SAD thing is I’m sure there are lots of people there in Canada that still think this way. This rubbish thinking is still alive and well down under – unfortunately….
Who cares?
Let it collapse.
Actually I want the whole western hemisphere along with the developing world to be knocked back to the economic stone age.
No more internet. No more Garth books. No more homes.
Just like Haiti now.
Enjoy…
I would really like to have 5 examples of price inflation and 5 of asset deflation to help me understand.
Anybody?
——————————————————
here’s 2 examples and the only 2 that matter.
inflation = expansion in credit
deflation = contraction in credit
when there’s an expansion in credit, like the massive expansion in credit we’ve had the past 10 years, you get inflation. Just about everything rises in price.
When credit contracts (financial institutions lend out less) prices across the board pull back. That’s deflation. This is what has been in happening slowly but surely in the world since the crash of 2008 (not so evident in Canada just yet).
The terms inflation and deflation should be used in a more macro sense. There isn’t inflation in bubble gum and toilet paper and then deflation in celery and napkins. The credit markets determine inflation/deflation.
We’ve had many decades of inflation. That is what we’ve dealt with. Massive credit expansion to the point that we started out with people in the 1950′s and 1960′s earning one income in a home and supporting 3 or 4 children – no credit cards required either. Now, a two income home supports one or two children and still carries massive debts.
Some would categorize what we’ve gone through as hyperinflation. I would agree. Years and years of credit expansion and then 2008 happened. These types of cycles aren’t new. Inflation turns into hyperinflation and then credit markets become overexhausted and deflation happens for years to correct the poor lending standards.
Hope that helps.
@ #19 BoB:
Seriously? “It’s near a great beach!”
Well – how about Miami Beach then?
8 beds, 7 baths
6 beds, 6 baths
6 beds, 4 baths
6 beds, 8 baths
5 beds, 7 baths
5 beds, 4 baths
And – all of these are actually built, and near REAL beaches!
“To its credit, Daniels says if the unit is sold for a capital loss”
Are you sure this is a Daniels program?
The structure of it (interest free loan with forgiveness on loss / reasonably low income cut-off / only available to current renters, etc) sounds to me to be program conjured up by government to bring a mixed population to a once- and possibly soon-to-be-again lousy area of town. These peoples’ net worth won’t be so “mixed” after this program is done with them.
I doubt that Daniels would give interest free loans of $30K out of their own pockets. That would be very expensive. With only 10% of the profits upside and loan forgiveness on the way down it reeks of government “investments”.
No doubt the motivation was the gentrification and destimatization of Regent Park.
I would really like to have 5 examples of price inflation and 5 of asset deflation to help me understand.
Anybody?
————————————————-
and don’t bother gobbling up words from those that suggest inflation is when money is printed. Money can be printed but can be buried in a bank or financial institution that is unwilling to lend. There’s more credit available than there is money. Understanding the magnitude of lending capabilities of financial institutions, if there’s a severe contraction in credit it obviously offsets any printing of money that some assume will lead us into hyperinflation.
Fractional reserve lending is a practice that allows a bank to lend out ten times or 1000% of what it takes in. You deposit $500 in the bank, the bank can lend out $5000. This action leads to inflation, however lately there’s less lending from banks across the board. Financial instistutions aren’t exercising the lending they’ve done in the past…..pretty dramatic and overwhelming lending considering it’s 1000% of what they take in.
So this is another example of why governments can print, print, print, print, print and they still won’t get inflation. Credit is done compared to 3+ years ago. Government printing doesn’t offset the crazy lending of the years before 2008 to create inflation. We have deflation and M3 points out this fact.
There is no way that tiny house has a kitchen as big as that along with four bedrooms. Uh uh, ain’t no way.
$85,000 is the most I’d pay for the place, depending upon location.
I’ve been looking to buy a house in Toronto for the last couple of months. After reading this post I decided to visit Vancouver on MLS. Wow!! I feel so much better. if Toronto had those crazy prices I’d have NOOO chance. I’m not a Canadian and have not been to Vancouver (and don’t think I dare) the water must taste great over there? Free private school for all? Streets paved with gold perhaps? free drugs? anyone?
So, you think we’re not in a bubble, nor did we practice subprime lending?
http://stocks.investopedia.com/stock-analysis/2010/Short-The-Canadian-Housing-Bubble-FRE-FNM0511.aspx
Hold on to your f*cking hats, folks! This roller coaster is just getting started
In response to #54:
No, Dandy… Vancouver is just a lame, soul-free city with self-absorbed, dilusional people who think they have a good investment. There’s a lot of lemmings there who are easily swayed by pretty marketing campaigns. Look! Something shiny over here! It is going to be the hardest-hit market in all of Canada. I’ve recently heard B.C. referred to as “The soon-to-be Florida of Canada.”
#54 dandy on 07.28.10 at 7:39 am
Indeed, indeed it is. Just as you imagine… the water is sweet, schools abound with knowledge, nary a pothole to be found, a virtual smorgasbord of soft drugs to which the friendly police officers turn a blind eye and more… oh so much more. And dandy it can all be yours, all of it… if you can pass the test.
But seriously… ya… it is pretty damned nice here. Why do you think it costs so much? Supply and demand has something to do with it.
#54 Dandy, Actually Vancouver does provide free drugs. They have a controversial program to provide free Heroin (government supplied and paid for) for addicts.
#54 dandy on 07.28.10 at 7:39 am
My theory is that it’s the haze of pot smoke trapped by the mountains and (and remember you read it here first!!) an effect as yet undiscovered: When all the giant blue foot mushrooms release their spores everyone has their third eye squeegeed
#55 Consider This on 07.28.10 at 8:01 am
There are people in other parts of this country who save up all year long just so they can vacation in British Columbia for two weeks.
“The Best Place on Earth”… As boastful as that slogan is from what I have seen of the world truer words were never spoken.
#55 Consider This on 07.28.10 at 8:01 am
Thank God for people like you who just don’t get it. Hopefully you never will. More for us.
I can’t beleive the homes they are building in Richmond,B.C.
Property-$500k New house-$400k
Selling 1.3 Mill.
And they are selling!
#52Original-the whole inflation/deflation argument is a smokescreen. What you are getting is a federal government/large financial institution growth model at the expense of the overall economy. The federal guv doesn’t and will never “print” money and hand it out on the street corner-money is created to fund government programs and government employment and money is loaned at very favorable terms to large financial institutions. The overall, outside or non-connected rest of the economy has to support this. Eventually, as has already happened in the US, the overall economy is far too weakened yet the machine does not change direction. In fact, the cries go out for more fuel for the machine as its growth was not strong enough.
“I have a backup generator and I would reccomend a backup portable air conditioner. Invest in air conditioners.” #46 Brian on 07.28.10 at 5:34 am
WTF? Yes and really, really big screen t.v.s too.
“$85,000 is the most I’d pay for the place, depending upon location.” #53 tkid on 07.28.10 at 7:35 am
Be patient and some day you will… in monthly rent.
it’s not the short walk to Locarno beach—it’s the short walk to Wreck beach that metters–for those that don’t know it’s a clothing optional beach
I lived in Vancouver for a while (sold in 2007 and got out) and the only reason I ever heard for ever-rising house prices was the lack of land. But you know, any city that is developed has a lack of land, so why would someone spend over $2 mill for a 60 x 95 building lot? It’s insanity, that is what it is. And that is exactly how it felt when we lived there.
You would get up early and race out to new open houses out of fear that if someone beat you to it, the house would be sold. Everyone you knew had a story of someone buying and selling and making a fortune. Everyone had rental units that were going up in value daily. Yes, there were also stories of the leaky condos and $50 and $60 thousand special assessments, but hey, those stories weren’t as exciting as those flipping houses.
You were nuts if you didn’t own a place. And folks around you had no trouble telling you that. It didn’t help matters either that every time you opened the newspaper the real estate section would give examples of recent solds and list previous selling prices. It’s a license to print money.
The challenge with an insane marketplace is that eventually the fog will lift. It has to. These million dollar properties are tear downs and let’s face it, you shouldn’t be tearing down anything that you pay a couple mill for. All those houses in West Van in areas like the British Properties were built in the 1940s and 50s and have had nothing done to them since. In any other city no one in their right mind would touch them. Most of Richmond is built on reclaimed land, as is most of Coal Harbour and the downtown harbour front.
It’s amazing what folks will pay to live in a rain forest that is long overdue for a major quake.
(BTW: I keep an eye on our previous neighbourhood. The couple that bought our 3 year old home poured another $45K in renovations into it and still haven’t recovered from the 2008 dip. But that is out in the burbs, not in Vancouver proper)
#54 dandy
“anyone?”
FWIW, I visited Vancouver way back when and was unfavorably impressed with property values as they seemed reminiscent of San Fran even then. The best explanation I could come up with was Canada’s use of the metric system and all.
Since, I’ve watched in horror as San Fran commuters, predatory lenders, developers and real estate agents overran California’s Central Valley bringing all their madness and justifications even as the stabilizing wage base (canneries, agricultural and manufacturing jobs) continued to erode.
As a member of an ‘Okie’ family who had lived in that valley since the big ole Dust Bowl, we knew what properties had been valued at and were aghast at the types of mortgages being offered.
A house such as the one pictured maybe would have went from anywhere from 80-150k US depending upon location. When that type of property started smelling of a quarter to a half million$, we knew the lid was going to blow. We were right and damn lucky to sell two weeks before the bust.
2 million for location and nobody even cares about the building? wow.
You can chase after prophets if you like, but I gotta tell ya –all those folks down here in the states taking a hit… they’re just regular folks whose good faith has been betrayed and they’re definitely suffering now.
It doesn’t make me feel any better to know the same thing happened in Florida, Arizona, Nevada, etc. and I’d rather Canadian’s look closely at what happened here and not risk the same. Maybe not a financially shrewd thing to say, but truth nonetheless.
#25 JM in London on 07.27.10 at 11:30 pm
Of course you can, and should, get a whole lot more house in London, Ontario than Vancouver, British Columbia. There is a reason and that reason is not confined within those walls it’s outside them.
Ya see here in British Columbia we’re not so much about houses as location. Take a look outside JM… look at the bigger picture.
I’d gladly pay $2mil for the Vancouver one wayyyyyyyy before that one in London, Ont. Seriously. And apparently I’m not the only one.
Have I not predicted a 50% increase coming to Hongcouver Proper within the next year due to the HST killing new construction and igniting Resale/Renovation Industry?
Yes I did.
Nostradamus jr.
#39 dark sad person
You have such a short term view of gold.
1) Why don’t you tell what the price of gold was in 1981 when we had double digit inflation?
2)What was the cumulative increase in inflation from then?
3)Has gold kept up with inflation over 30 years?
What you will find is that over the past 30 years (actually 200 years) it would have been better to leave your money in a savings account. Please refute that.
As for your question about US real estate, I think it goes without saying that location is key, vacancy is key and you have to do your homework. If the cashflow works and you can generate NET RETURNS of over 10% (after ALL costs) then you have to at least consider it. Would I? I am more of an equity person and would rather be buying US and global equities than real estate as I still remember being buried with our .62 cent dollar. In the end we are still a small country and diversifying out while we have parity is a smart move in my mind. Not to say I wouldn’t by property. I’d love a place in San Diego but we’ll see.
As for those West Coast bashers, I live there. It’s crazy I know and not to say it won’t crash but West Coast will still be more valuable than the rest of Canada post crash (and a lot of people will get hurt). It’s always been this way and will always be this way. By far, best place to live in Canada and maybe the world.
Free heroin sponsored by government for addicts! Holy Toledo!
#25 JM in London on 07.27.10 at 11:30 pm
One last thing JM…
The house in Vancouver is SOLD… And the one on Chantry Place in London Ontario?
Need I say more?
#43
“Bye bye GOLD. Does anyone remember India bought 200 tonnes of Gold from the IMF at 900 an ounce. The news read “India buys gold”. It should have read “IMF SELLS GOLD”. ”
No, it should have read “India buys gold from IMF”, or “IMF sells gold to India” since like that’s what happened.
By the way, if you are selling I’m buying.
How is Port Moody RE? What are the good areas in Port Moody? I am looking to buy RE in Port Moody in the future. Anyone living in Port Moody now? Any comment?
#59Gman-you feel Vancouver is maybe the best city in the world. Fair enough, but now compare Vancouver circa 2010 to Vancouver circa 1985-in real dollars, what buys you a shack now bought you a real nice place then. Logically, Vancouver circa 1985 had a far higher standard of living.
the cash-back mortgages have been in effect ever since Flaherty abolished 0% or no down mortgages… this was a workaround for the banks to keep churning their loan portfolios and earn risk profit… since these mortgages are insured by us the taxpayers via CMHC
#69 Nostradamus jr. on 07.28.10 at 9:14 am
Actually you’ve got that backward: The HST isn’t gonna do a damn thing to the new construction industry nor is it going to help the resale/renovation industry. There is no increase in the cost of new housing until you are over $525,000 and then it is so marginal that those who intend to buy new are unlikely to be swayed away from the choice as they want what they want and clearly have the funds to do it.
The renovation industry on the other hand will find some difficulties in adjustment as there is no rebate available to soften the increased costs and G.C.s will likely use excuse of the HST to lay blame for their padding of their bottom lines for a bit as long as they can get away with it.
The economic tax boon to the government will not come from increased taxes on new construction nearly so much as increased taxes on real estate commissions from 5.0% to 12.0%. THAT increase tax revenue would blow your mind. One average months worth of the increases in taxes on real estate commissions in Kelowna would be approximately $275,000 additional tax revenue… just from Kelowna…. Additional. Of those homes sold maybe 10%, at best, are new construction that might offer an additional $100,000 in increased tax revenue. I can run the numbers but I’m pretty confident it will prove out.
And of course this doesn’t cover the additional tax revenue on legal fees, home inspection fees, appraisal fees, survey fees etc. etc.
8:30 time to go to work… “work”? Summer, Cargo Shorts, Short sleaved bowling shirt, flip flops, convertible, in the beautiful Okanagan… on a balmy sunny day… showing property to new friends from out east who so desperately want to enjoy all this too… How can you call that “work”. Gotta love it.
It doesn’t sound like the US middle class is coming back soon.
http://tinyurl.com/23zmbm4
The team’s findings were grim. Simply stated, more and more families are facing utter economic devastation: completely out of money, with their jobs, savings and retirement funds gone, and nowhere to turn for the next dollar.
Dont be so suprised about that house selling. Canada is currently one of a few countries worldwide were the banks will give someone that kind of capital with a 10-20% downpayment on property.
The US used to but when the practice came to an end so did there housing market.
Seriously, thats why RE is were it is. Easy credit and if it goes bad, the buyer will walk and declare bankruptcy. Basically like a call option on price.
Devils Advocate, very true, the house did sell and that says a lot. That property is worth e very penny because a buyer was willing to pay that.
What worries me is if those 2mill properties all over vancouver start seeing a 20-30% drop in price, thats going to be huge losses for the banks or CMHC. And I mean HUGE. I don;t think the population in general understands the risk here
#75 Brian T
Not saying West Coast won’t correct. I figure at least 20-25%, higher for those stupid million dollar properties. Property has overshot inflation and will now probably go below trendline before it recovers. Either that or people’s income double. This will take years.
Been here, done that.
Are there any people predicting a real estate downturn in Canada that aren’t Garth Turner?
I can’t even remember how much of a crash Garth is predicting any more for the major centers. Certainly not 30%, a la Miami. Certainly not 20%, a la subprime lending fraud matched to hedge fund demand for shortable paper.
So what diabolical price target are we at for Toronto, Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal?
I know, I know. How dare I.
Devil’s Advocate = Developer’s Advocate. Dude, you’re dilusional. Get back at me in a year and see what you have to say then, okay? You’re so far off base with the reality of the situation at hand. Also, Bangkok is the world’s new “Top City.” Read a little more nonbiased information, and perhaps you wouldn’t be so ignorant.
nice house. i think i rented it for a while..
the owner put maybe $125,000 to $300,000 down (5 -10%) or maybe less depending on their finanicng arrangments.
the day the got possession the craiglisted the basement for $1600 and the upper level for $2500 per month. one year leases.
then they ignored the poor renters as the house went to shit
the owners don’t pay taxes on the rental income (illegal).
they hope to sell it at a profit in a year and will claim it was thier primary residence (no capital gains tax) (again illegal)
or they might tear it down without a permit using “friends” that have an excavator
build a 3 story crapper mansion (perhaps a duplex) with zero imagination and questionable insulation (zero possibility it could handle even a slight drizzle). then list it for 4 million or so
the above apporach has sadly worked for people in vancouver for years. the owners don’t know what they are doing but have guts/balls whatever
I have noting against them but I hope (for my sake and for the sake of all working families in vancouver) that they get destroyed by an american-like decent.
It appears Americans have lost faith in real estate. I think it happens here. a house should be a home. savings and investments should be done elsewhere.
#77 Devils’s Advocate. You are either an idiot or a realtor working Vancouver…say perhaps you are both?
Maybe the owner of the Vancouver property expects to mine gold under the house or dig a hole to china.
2 million for that? wow a sucker born every minute .Hey its a lovely neighbourhood.
Very popular with just about everybody. especially on fireworks night.
I wanted to show the weekly crime map but the gang of b and e ‘rs working the area but they have apparently moved north of 16 avenue and dunbar for the time being.
they had been recently operating around the bungalow area . and slightly to the east as well
for those that are interested
http://vancouver.ca/police/crimemaps/index.htm
and dont leave anything of value in your car….
http://vancouver.ca/police/CrimeMaps/tfauto.pdf
or actually hide your car as it is a prime spot for stolen vehicles
http://vancouver.ca/police/CrimeMaps/stauto.pdf
this is all occuring within rock throwng distance of this fine 2 mill home.
incidently we just had to replace the door knob assembly on one of our apt back doors as it was breached during the fireworks last week . they used the sound of the fireworks to cover the hammering on our door.
“My husband and I each bought tree……now we got six……can’t sell…..damn healtor no good, can’t sell anyting….I not ask too much…must get rich….dis is Canada after all”
“Why can’t I sell”
For those that are wanting to buy here is a list of top ten safest cities in the USA; and maybe dispel some myths.
America’s safest cities, 2009
1. Honolulu, Hawaii
2. El Paso, Texas
3. New York City, New York
4. San Jose, California
5. Austin, Texas
6. San Diego, California
7. Seattle, Washington
8. Portland, Oregon
9. Denver, Colorado
10. Los Angeles, California
Source: CQ Press City Crime Rankings 2009-2010
Been going around with a good friend who is trying to buy in Milton/Mississauga.
What’s happening is that when we show up, they pitch him to sign the buyer rep agreement with them.
Only now, they are offering 1% cash back, 7 night vacations, $500 cash back, etc, etc.
Something’s in the air…
We have this culture of financialization. People think they need to make money with their savings rather than with their own business. So you end up with dentists who are more traders than dentists. A dentist should drill teeth and use whatever he does in the stock market for entertainment. – Nassim Taleb author Black Swan.
He thinks people should own their own business. Inflation is coming before Jesus
#70 Gman on 07.28.10 at 9:31 am
#39 dark sad person
You have such a short term view of gold.
1) Why don’t you tell what the price of gold was in 1981 when we had double digit inflation?
2)What was the cumulative increase in inflation from then?
3)Has gold kept up with inflation over 30 years?
What you will find is that over the past 30 years (actually 200 years) it would have been better to leave your money in a savings account. Please refute that.
*****************
1–Why don’t you pull up a chart-then you wont have to keep asking me–
http://www.kitco.com/LFgif/au75-pres.gif
2—When you say “inflation” do you mean-
Was there more Gold produced then dollars or credit??
Or do you mean increasing “prices” which is “not” inflation-
Make it clear what you’re asking/demanding–
Weakness in the US Dollar tends to be offset by strengthening of gold prices. Gold remains a principal financial asset of almost all central banks alongside foreign currencies and government bonds
Read more: http://www.lenntech.com/prices/gold.htm#ixzz0uzdLLPmv
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_nSTO-vZpSgc/Rdh85QBPcwI/AAAAAAAAAXg/f26Q-D_UcAc/s1600-h/US%24Index-vs-Gold-1970-2007.png
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nSTO-vZpSgc/SXb8L9ZgSSI/AAAAAAAAFaU/7K4pNbtU6yY/s1600-h/%24CRB-monthly.png
3–If you knew how to read and interpret–you would have understood what i said and have been saying all along–
“Gold-is a poor hedge against “inflation”
We are “not” in inflation now-in fact we are in “deflation”
Gold does well in deflation-read this–
http://www.nowandfutures.com/d2/BehaviorOfGoldUnderDeflation.pdf
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_nSTO-vZpSgc/RbZwf5lgCXI/AAAAAAAAAN0/WJYO6dh-ogg/s1600-h/Gold-CPI-FF-Rate.png
Gold does extremely well in Hyper-inflation and we’ve had that-2001-2007
http://www.barchart.com/chart.php?sym=GCQ10&style=technical&p=MC&d=X&sd=&ed=&size=M&log=0&t=CANDLE&v=1&g=1&evnt=1&late=1&o1=&o2=&o3=&x=56&y=7&indicators=&addindicator=&submitted=1&fpage=&txtDate=#jump
I’m done with going around in circles with you-
You cannot or will not-read all the data i’ve provided prior-
Your hate of “Gold” clouds your brain i suspect–
Here’s one more little tidbit for you–
Back in 1981-Volcker raised rates to 20+%
Wanna know why?
It was for “one” reason only–
To “save” the USD and pull money from “Gold”
I know some here will agree-”You” not so much–
I have no idea why you brought Gold into the picture-
The subject was–
Are US house prices at bottom-
As far as house prices bottoming in “some” areas of the US?
I’ve said that–
Maybe you should try reading twice and talking once-
hi !
re: vancouver bung
what if for the guy 2 mils is not so much money ? there are people in this world making money, lots of money.
maybe he is a contrarian: when everybody talks about “do this” he does the opposite.
#88Ralph-re US crime, El Paso (about 700000 pop) has only one murder for 2010 through July 17. That is besting Canadian rates.
That sole 2010 El Paso murder was an elderly couple murder suicide-the main danger in El Paso is your old hubby-if he/she doesn’t get you nobody will.
On a unrelated financial topic, got a Citibank creditcard statement today, a $25 annual fee suddenly appeared, called to cancel card as it was used 4 to 6 times a year, and paid off in full. All of a sudden they would waive the fee, and give me $50 “free money”, so much for a 14 year relationship. Claimed it was to pay for 9.9% annual rate, which I had never recceived any notice on.
#89 BigAl (Original) “…they pitch him to sign the buyer rep agreement with them. Only now, they are offering 1% cash back, 7 night vacations, $500 cash back, etc, etc. Something’s in the air…”
Yes, first get the public to accept the idea of the rep agreements by candy coating them, then they stick it to you by saying “it’s been mandatory for a while now”. Will the Canadian people stand up against it? I think not. Beer and cable TV though, that different…lol
Doesn’t anyone remember the 1980′s US recession? Big one. Bigger than this one. Impacted home prices here. Even in Toronto. But big smoke home prices didn’t go down at all. This is the same. This is 1982. Toronto prices for instance, didn’t take off until 1987. So that puts the REAL peak potentially somewhere around 2018 (i.e. 8 years after 1982). Early on your calls much!?!?
The big gains are still to come. Don’t believe me? Read a newspaper. Read a trade journal. Get off this blog. I feel bad for those that are consistently doomers, you’re lives are being ruined by it. Once you get off the train, you’re off for good. Watch out below!!!
Some real world obervations:
Just got off the phone with a realtor friend of mine as well as a mortgage broker.
Realor says that things are slowing down, its always slow this time of year but much more so then in the past. He says that if things dont pick up in fall – he is expecting a small blip in activity but nothing huge. Thinks that prices will drop as more desperate people are forced to sell in the fall. He thinks (and I agree) that marginal areas in the GTA (suburbs) will drop fast as a lot of people brought homes there that shouldnt have. Interesting note is that listings are slowing down fast, so it may balance out in a few months.
Mortgage broker- tells me that new mortgages are trending down fast, very slow, last time it was like this was 08 after the crash. See’s a lot more incentives from lenders. Says that he is not seeing a huge tighting of credit other then the new rules making it hard for a few clients to qualify. For now, mortgages are still being approved although the big 5 banks are looking for only the best credit worthy people available. The second tier lenders will still lend but even they have become a little more strict, they have changed their lending agreements so the penalties are huge if people cancel earlu (second tier lenders). Also told me that its getting tough for some brokers, he is ok as he has been at it for a while but he sees a lot of realtors and brokers looking for other work very soon.
there u have it from the front lines
#88 ralph
No myths dispelled. As with any large city, there are safe areas, and not so safe areas. To say all of LA is “safe” is misleading at best. You can’t just randomly throw a dart at a city map, or buy in the cheapest hood, and expect the area to reflect the city-wide average. You could easily find yourself in gang territory in even the “safest” US city.
#90 Tonguestump
No, he thinks wealth should be created from real production, as opposed to financial engineering.
Work creates money, not the other way around. Entrepreneurship, income assets, goods production, and returns on capital (tier 1 capital) invested to grow well run businesses. Not leveraging 3-to-1 to bet on next month’s price of gold.
#98Devore-there is a flip side to that safety coin. The safest parts of even quite dangerous US cities are very very safe.
Just FYI
Heroin is not provided free to addicts in Vancouver. What is provided is a safe place to shoot up one’s own supply. ‘Insite’ provides clean needles, medical supervision, etc. for addicts who want these things.
We prefer to have our addicts using this facility rather than dying from overdosing in back alleys.
Definitely a crack shack bought by a crack head .
Where oh where do these delusional cretins come from ?
#72 Devil’s Advocate on 07.28.10 at 9:42 am
I always do give you credit for staying consistent on the BC message. Kudos for the slavish devotion.
I, on the other hand – am not pumping anything, just posting observations for comment.
I think you might be assuming I’m somehow in pursuit of the giant property?
I live, I ski, I work, I travel
- funny thing that last bit -
find a reasonable (and even flatlands like London are overheated on the price) price on a decent property and ya get to do all kinds of fun stuff like come to BC and see a bunch of it.
Even better? Been able to live in a few different international places and there is no doubt BC is a nice place but there are many as comparable!!
#102 urban ranger on 07.28.10 at 12:29 pm
Just FYI
Heroin is not provided free to addicts in Vancouver. What is provided is a safe place to shoot up one’s own supply. ‘Insite’ provides clean needles, medical supervision, etc. for addicts who want these things.
We prefer to have our addicts using this facility rather than dying from overdosing in back alleys.
Took the words right out of my mouth .
Ditto .
#97 kitchener1 on 07.28.10 at 12:09 pm
My observations down the 401 are similar on both fronts. Your broker is correct, the stricter rules have made it more difficult for the bottom half. We’ve run into nearly identical situations with a couple where 6 months ago we have had financing. What’s going to be more telling (and somewhat sad I think) is that on renewal, the ones who have just made it in under the wire are going to be in either serious trouble or having to eat a private mortgage with crushing interest rates…
Signed up for the 16th. Will check my buns at the door.
Devil’s Advocate: “Supply and demand has something to do with it.”
Yes, because high demand is characteristic of a bubble. Demand was once through the roof in CA and FL. Now, not so such.
Your ersatz reasonableness is slipping in your multiple posts today – smacks of desperation and too much time on your hands as sales are tanking. Enjoy your shorts and flipflops, you’ll have lots of days to wear them soon enough.
#98 Devore and #88 ralph
I hear they chop the heads off people riding Greyhound buses in Canada.
Devil’s Advocate, I have lived in Vancouver, Victoria and Kelowna as well as a few other smaller BC towns. I have also lived in nearby Washington and hung out on and around the San Juan and Gulf islands.
BC is lovely but it ain’t that great. The people are not as nice as they are in Washington and the real estate is priced 300% higher. There is nothing that BC has that other pacific northwest locales don’t – its only mass delusion that keeps BC so pricey.
I’d much rather be in Oregon, Northern Cali or Washington, where your dollar goes a lot further and the scenery is just as nice.
#36 Jeff Smith on 07.28.10 at 1:02 am
Probably an immigrant with pretty big wallet. You don’t have to feel sorry for him. Maybe the $2mil amount is just pocket change for him
Hey Jeff Smith, no immigrant could be that stupid, it had to be one of em stupid Canadian citizens who don’t know no better. LMAO
oh, hey you are back already!
>#69 Nostradamus jr. on 07.28.10 at 9:14 am
>Have I not predicted a 50% increase coming to >Hongcouver Proper within the next year due to the
>HST killing new construction and igniting Resale/Renovation Industry?
>Yes I did.
Nostradamus jr.
The lease on my daughter’s apartment (which is in my name) expired on May 31 and switched to month by month. The landlord just offered to reduce the rent in exchange for signing another one year lease. We won’t be doing that for a $1,700/month apartment, since similar apartments in her building are now going for $1,500/month. Her building is entirely condo owned. Is this the beginning of rent reductions on rental condos, I hope, I hope, I hope, since my son is now also on a month by month in a fairly expensive part of Vancouver?
dark sad person
You must spend hours just researching useless stats.
Volcker raised interest rates to quell inflation and kill it dead in its track. That’s a historical fact.
Actually bonds do well in deflation, not hard assets. Hard assets to well in inflationary environment. Don’t know where you got gold does well with deflation because we have never had deflation (for an extended period of time) post WWII, except in Japan. Must be extrapolating from an era which is not relevant to today’s market. If you know anything about stats, that leads to great instability in predictions, such that it renders the stat unreliable.
You are barking up the wrong tree. i can run circles around your stats but I don’t have the time nor energy to debate this issue more than what I’m doing, especially with someone who thinks they are smarter than Buffett.
As for Buffett, sure he’s lost money, everybody does. The ones that make money just make more than they lose (consistently). I think you are the type that is vice versa.
dark sad person = virgin investor and should be avoided
I’ll tell you what gold is. The emo boomers attacking each other on this website. 100% pure comedy gold. I wish I could invest in it. Garth’s fear-mongering and rabble-rousing is a great product. I’m considering buying his book as a token of thanks. I wonder, Garth are you still signing the copies?
Gman give it a break, best place in Canada ha ha, best place in the world ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Garth, I’ll pay for compromising pictures of Devil’s Advocate
LOL!!
I’m probably missing something, but it seems like a great number of people misunderstand Devil’s Advocate’s position(s).
Only a complete jackass would buy a place like this for a price like that! It’s also probably infested.
#101 Devore – Taleb has recently added almost 100 new pages to Black Swan. All new material. May 2010. No worries on his fossils. Check it out fooledbyrandomness.com
#101 Cont’d – He has offered one of the best pieces of advice some people have seen from any best-selling author of a book on finance.
“The people are not as nice as they are in Washington…”
Hmm, don’t know about THAT, but, on the whole, BC people are not as stupid.
“You could easily find yourself in gang territory in even the “safest” US city…”
So true. And, in most of the large American cities I have been in, you don’t have to go far off the beaten track to GET TO the beaten track.
Most American cities are big, grimy toad holes.
#105 JM in London on 07.28.10 at 1:08 pm
Right on!
But what do you mean “slavish devotion”? Actually, I consider it rather well enough informed devotion. I’ve been around to some nice spots but all in all come to the conclusion that this is better. Oh I have my problems with some of the goings on around these parts of late but for the most part that’s nothing more than other people trying to imprint their misplaced ideals on the political landscape. Really is nothing more than a minor nuisance given all the other benefits of living here. Mostly folk from Ontario wanting to bring their idea of civilization to the valley. You don’t sound like that sort though JM so come on out and let us host you to a day on the hill this winter or a day on the lake this summer or a round of golf this fall or a wild mountain bike ride this spring.. You pick just give me a heads up at Kelownial@gmail.com
#109 betamax on 07.28.10 at 1:20 pm
My “ersatz reasonableness” is actually quite genuine and not at all slipping in my multiple posts of today. There is no desperation hidden between the lines of my posts betamax. Fact is sales ARE off, substantially, but I have garnered more than my fair share for this month anyway. As for too much time on my hands you’ve caught me in the middle of that time which is normally my summer vacation as did the five clients I who called me today not knowing so.
If you check back on my posting history betamax you will realize that I am not at all looking at the world through rose coloured glasses. There is some serious sh1t happening out there and a lot of people are going to get burnt. But after contemplating all of that, it occurs to me that we each have choices in how we play the game. I’m pretty happy with my choices for the most part and am confident going forward that I will be able to make the best of it. How are your choices working for you? Are you even making choices or just sitting on your hands awaiting your fate?
#111 prairie gal on 07.28.10 at 1:23 pm
I absolutely agree with you. All of the Pacific Northwest is a wonderful place and as far as I am concerned. And the Yanks are a wonderful people for the most part. I don’t understand Canadian’s stuck up attitude about our American cousins. It’s like that of the British toward us. What’s with that anyway?
As far as I am concerned we should have split up the continent from North to South not East to West. But back then they didn’t know what promised land lay in wait out West. Who knows maybe it will eventually go that way as certainly Canadian Easterners have a whole lot more in common with their counterparts South of the boarder than they do with us out here on the West Coast. Seems like a logical fit don’t ya think?
@ stuckinalberta
Hey if you had taken that $150k and invested it at 5% in a nice safe utility stock you could have taken the $7500 per year and used it to pay your mortgage down, and you would have kept your capital asset!!
Live and learn eh.
This is educational!
Fallen Soldiers’ Families Denied Cash Payout as Insurers Profit
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aF133j0QyP30
Oh Crap! Nasty Jr. is back!!
There goes the neighborhood again!
#111 prairie gal on 07.28.10 at 1:23 pm
On the matter of the disparity between prices in the US Pacific Northwest and British Columbia I tend to agree with you. However, the US by far led the way with regard to wreckless monitary policies and lending practices. Not that we didn’t join the party but we did so later and in a more conservative way even though arguably but a minor difference.
There are some positive signs coming out of the US housing market. Still is a rocky road ahead to be sure but now 5 years into this depressed market I do tend to believe they are at least nearing the bottom and even a flatline for a time there-after is a comparatively good thing to that of the last five years.
So what is my point? My point is I do agree with you that British Columbia prices are too high but I do not think they will fall so much nor so quick as many believe or hope for them to. If the US real estate markets stabilize that in itself with instill a level of consumer confidence both north and south of the 49th. Once a level of consumer confidence begins to return prices will be less inclined to drop north of the 49th as the US prices pay catch up. It’s that “equilibrium” thing I keep preaching.
Now I could be wrong as those “positive signs” could be nothing more than BS SPIN. But when Garth speaks I listen and Garth seems to believe there is some promise in those American markets. In any event I remember 1981 very well and while I will not say it was just like today it had more similarities than not. I’d be willing to bank on the expectation that this time will pass just as that time did and when it is all said and done you will see a world of opportunities that passed you by. Hindsight sucks don’t it?
#18 stuckinalberta — “Drop the price even further and suck it up before all else is lost?”
If both jobs are relatively well-paying, that would be the prudent thing to do. Better to sell and clear all debts, then rent a good townhouse for a few years.
#31 jack — “Congratulations to the sellers.”
Absolutely. When all bills are paid, all debts cleared the invest the net amount, avoid taxes and get the best bang for the buck.
Nice retirement package!
#48 DAME EDNA — “Let it collapse.”
Then throw in a rogue asteroid which cleans earth of all deadspots (us) and lets life begin anew. NO DERIVATIVES, CDS or DEBTS!
#59 Devil’s Advocate — Agreed. One other gorgeous area is in the south-east of France, about an hour from Marseilles and 15 mins. from Avignon.
My latest thoughts turn to the mls website, is it just me or have people noticed a very big slowdown in the websites ability to fucntion? It seems listings take forever to appear, almost like they purposely want us to get frustrated and not spend time seeing just how low things will go.
Seems as though there are a few posters with similar platforms as myself on this blog…they have been enlightened.
…We are doing the West Coast Spirit’s Work, spreading the Gospel…
Nostradamus jr.
@28
“I also doubt the buyer bought with cash so even with a 25 year amortization, 25% down (unlikely), AND 2% interest for the life of it (impossible) they’re adding AT LEAST $400K in interest costs.”
For $1,300/m I rent a large, two-level, one-bed apartment with a massive deck (and a much nicer kitchen) in a nice building about a 3-minute bike ride from that $2m shack. So I can live where I am for 20 years or so and pay less than the interest on that house over the same period? I get the ‘lifestyle’, the nice place to live and the money in the bank. Cool.
I am very pleased with those better than expected answers. As for Advocate, I have some elderly friends who invested $4,000 in a air conditioner system which broke down and could not be fixed. Yes, a backup portable air conditioner in Toronto would have been nice, you idjiot. But seriously, your innocent misunderstanding provided me with one big laugh. Don’t take everything so seriously. Respect your opinions.
Garth, How high do you think the BoC will raise interest rates to? How long do you think they will stay there?
MOSCOW — budget deficit that ministers approved a wide-ranging plan Wednesday to sell-off state property, senior officials said
#115 gman on 07.28.10 at 1:55 pm
You are barking up the wrong tree. i can run circles around your stats but I don’t have the time nor energy to debate this issue more than what I’m doing, especially with someone who thinks they are smarter than Buffett.
**************************
If you can run circles around the stats–do it–
Otherwise-consider your ass kicked–
Name calling and your “bullshit” theory’s-mean squat-
You’ve embarrassed yourself-in front of the whole board –
#124 Boombust
“Most American cities are big, grimy toad holes.”
Maybe it’s time you changed your travel destinations. Please, start with cities in India.
At least it didn’t have granite and stainless steel… only back-in-vogue yellow formica.
Probably not the right time to buy US real estate, let alone Canadian :
http://online.barrons.com/article/SB50001424052970204078204575377403833112416.html#articleTabs_panel_article%3D1
There’s something else we don’t know about this house if it sold for that amount…….even for Van it’s off base.
“Canadian Easterners have a whole lot more in common with their counterparts South of the boarder than they do with us out here on the West Coast…”
Hardly. I think people in Ontario, Quebec and the Maritimes are much more “refined”, shall we say, than the morons who inhabit places like New Jersey, etc.
You need to get out more.
I was in Newark and Atlantic City just this past month. Ugh! Dumps. They should bulldoze ‘em and start over.
And, the dumbest people you’re ever likely to come across.
However, being a NATIVE VANCOUVERITE, I guess I’m a tad spoiled.
N’est-ce-pas?
“Maybe it’s time you changed your travel destinations. Please, start with cities in India.”
I was never the person who brought up American cities. Someone else did.
I’ll stand by “toad holes”.
Even NYC is only “nice” from about 106th down to the Battery and from river to river.
And, as for the “attractions”?
Ever been to “TIMES SQUARE? If so, I’m sure you’ll agree that it’s only two grubby streets the happen to cross over each other. Big Deal.
“Crossroads of the World”, my ass.
And, thousands of tourists taking photos like ther’s no tomorrow. Suckers.
Immigrants didn’t get rich by being stupid .
They can read s spread sheet and understand that Van RE is grossly inflated .
They will wait,for the most part, for the RE market to tenderize .
…We are doing the West Coast Spirit’s Work, spreading the Gospel…
Nostradamus jr.
Spreading bullshit is not God’s work .
Heavens to Betsy ! That is one flash unit .
Complete with 1940′s style, yellow formica .
I’d give you a buck .
141 SeanR
…the rental reits are “spinning” in full force …after incentives to rent they will justify rates hikes which in turn will please those investors. ;^)
-
From wrh.com: THOUGHT FOR THE DAY! “Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But, I repeat myself.” — Mark Twain
And this man epitomizes the above! 0:37 clip.
Foreclosures “Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are beginning to initiate foreclosures at a faster pace.” Why are they accelerating? Does big biz, which controls govts., know something sheeple don’t?
Dismantling of the Euro. Once that has gone, the pound, Cdn., US, Oz and NZ’s dollars can finish, then — One World Currency! NOT! China, NKorea and Russia won’t play fair!
US only “. . . The US Government threw away our manufacturing over the last 30 years, gave tax incentives to corporations to offshore high-paying jobs at the same time the national debt was being run up to bail out Wall Street from the derivatives mess; a crisis created when Congress repealed the Glass-Steagal act in 1999.” wrh.com.
Abandoning the mfg. sector.
Great Incentive to insulate garages and home before winter arrives.
CIA “Asian intelligence sources reportedly state that: “Wikileaks is running a disinformation campaign, crying persecution by U.S. intelligence- when it is U.S. intelligence itself.” (soros & co back wikileaks / kosher mob & oval office).”
Update on CC — GW it ain’t!
Monetization Seems the US may be running out of privileges!
Wonder if this could be applied to Canada?
Re: the plane crash in Islamabad which killed all 152 on board. Similar to the Polish govt. being wiped out at Smolensk a few months back. “Rather interesting timing coming right after the Wikileaks release of those papers suggesting that Pakistan’s ISI is aiding the Taliban. It will be interesting to see the full passenger list.” wrh.com.
I was thinking maybe that price was a typographical error or this is end stage housing buble madness. Probably the latter. To be polite, that hovel does not look like like a home the equestrian class would avidly fork over $2M for voluntarily. That shack is turning 70 soon and shows no signs of aging gracefully.
http://www.trulia.com/property/3016019039-9710-Wendover-Dr-Beverly-Hills-CA-90210
#133 Nostradamus jr.
Welcome back Nost.
Jody: the mls website, is it just me or have people noticed a very big slowdown in the websites ability to function?
I noticed. I used to look up the area around my parents house in TO (north west corner of 401 and 400). I’d type in the street and voilà the listings would pop up. Since it sold (praise the Lord) this no longer happens. I think the functionality of the site has been deliberately downgraded.
Look, bloggie doggies, I come here to try and learn a few things from Mr. Turner, as well as catch some very smart commentary. But, and the big but, is the alarming trend toward some real tin foil hat, come gleeful chortling about this economic debacle, kinda stuff, seeping into the dialogue.
I find it alarming that there is a cadre of people cheering for Mad Max part three.
Not one thing entertaining about someone suffering. Full stop.
That is not to excuse anyone if they get greedy and become the Dust cover picture on Mr Turners next opus – ” Greater Schnook”
@144 Boombust
Someone who never lived there, wouldn’t get to see the good parts of NYC. In fact, the good parts of NYC don’t want to be found.
I miss it sometimes. Truth be told, I couldn’t cut it. But it is clear that you only experienced the surface of what goes on.
I noticed. I used to look up the area around my parents house in TO (north west corner of 401 and 400). I’d type in the street and voilà the listings would pop up. Since it sold (praise the Lord) this no longer happens. I think the functionality of the site has been deliberately downgraded.
——————————————–
near the sheridan mall?? There’s all kinds of places for sale there. Red dots everywhere.
#110 Betamax. I’ll second your comments re Devil’s Advocate. Sounds like he’s trying to protect his turf.
Real estate investment opportunities, in the US as touted on this blog, is no panacea for Canadians looking to offset (hedge?) a collapsing real estate market here.
One commenter details the safest US cities in which to own real estate. Fine, but what about next year? What if today’s safest city is tomorrow’s economic urban warfare HQ?
The American economy is in tatters, pure and simple. Check out CNBC and any other US/Canadian mass media business outlet and, once you’ve ploughed through the manure, the truth emerges: so many bad stats, so little reason to head south.
EG: Wednesday, durable goods orders, a key economic indicator, continued its collapse from May into June. A safe bet is that July will be awful, too. Why not? What’ll have changed? Nothing.
Also large corporations, most of which are celebrating stellar second quarter earnings last week and this week, have stashed away, collectively, nearly $2-trillion cash in their jeans.
Two things here: much of the dough came from laying off workers, not so much selling more crap; and, the stats are compared with even more dismal figures from 2Q 2009! So the whole reason for the Dow Jones to go up, for most of the last week or so, was bogus. Phoney.
So, why would you want to buy US RE, at this time in history, when the prospect of so many more bad economic things happening seems so near at hand?
Bottom line: the US exhibits all the hallmarks of a third world country in a state of continuing disintegration. Did you see Michael Moore last night on Larry King Live? He said “nothing works here anymore” in reference to the Gulf of GOO disaster. And today, in Windsor, Ontario, the last 500 GM employees were sacked ending a 90 year relationship with that city where GM used to employ 17,000 (!) workers. Business gone to China, I expect where GM is making a killing employing workers for bowls of rice.
Canada should start reaping this US whirlwind by winter. Battening down the hatches now, by cutting back debts and otherwise retrenching, seems very unglamorus but the task at hand has to be viewed as action being taken during a full-out emergency. In this economic case PRESERVE YOUR CAPITAL. With asset deflation howling all around us, that is better than losing your shirt in this perfect economic storm. And it sets you up to become a stock market vulture, something Garth must already be setting his sights on. I am.
“It seems listings take forever to appear, almost like they purposely want us to get frustrated and not spend time seeing just how low things will go.” #132 Jody on 07.28.10 at 4:08 pm
Yup that’s what we’re shooting for all right
#135 Brian on 07.28.10 at 4:15 pm
I understand… I also remember when air conditioning was a luxury.
#143 Boombust on 07.28.10 at 5:19 pm
Let me paraphrase my original comment.: “We out west, I think, have a lot more in common with our western US counterparts than we do our own eastern countrymen. Si?”
#146 Men With Hats on 07.28.10 at 5:34 pm
You speak for your God and Nost and I will ours.
#152 45north on 07.28.10 at 6:34 pm
See above…
”I find it alarming that there is a cadre of people cheering for Mad Max part three.
Not one thing entertaining about someone suffering. Full stop.” #153 Bill Gable on 07.28.10 at 6:35 pm
Well put. Welcome aboard!
Regarding the Vancouver Bung … I don’t smell smoke, I smell a pile of bung coming from the realtor.
Unbelievable. Truly.
A lot of you all cackling and chortling about how dumb it is to pay $2M for that place – oh PS there is a place 5 minutes drive down the road listed for $25M (as in twenty-five with six zeros after). oh PPS the CEO of a big corp is putting a $10M house on a $5M lot down the road.
I guess the price was right for someone. Good for the seller and the buyer.
Tsk, tsk some here say: “How irresponsible it is that CMHC is on the hook for the mortgage if it defaults” How the heck do you know that it was financed? Do you not think that there are folks around who can plunk down that kind of dough on a place? Maybe it’s still less than 40% of their net worth.
Sounds like sour grapes ‘coz a bunch of you are on the outside looking in.
http://www.europac.net/media/video_blog
Here you go, low rates and inflation will prop house prices. Get ready for everything else going up in price.
Theres a storm on the horizon for Bank stocks!
$2 Million is insane. Look what 1/10th of that buys you on the other coast – complete with a view of the ocean, hills, wilderness, great neighbours and no crack whores around the corner.
http://www.realtor.ca/PropertyDetails.aspx?&PropertyId=8878382&PidKey=-794155355
for 2 mil you can buy Chris Tucker’s mansion!
http://realestalker.blogspot.com/2010/07/comedian-chris-tucker-selling-short.html
#144 Boombust
Peace brother, I was also born in Vancouver.
“Squirrels: In 1909, the City of New York presented Vancouver with a gift of eight pairs of grey squirrels for Stanley Park . Now the park is riddled with the critters, who are favorites of city residents and visitors alike. Hold still, with some seeds or nuts in your hand and, usually in a few minutes, one or two will tentatively approach and make a grab for them. ”
http://units.sla.org/chapter/cwcn/conference/NWRC2006/Vancouver.htm#stanley
Welcome back Nostradamus Jr. You are one of the bright lights in a sea of doom.
Garth, any chance you could ban Devil’s Advocate instead? He’s giving realtors a good name
RE GARTH IN VAN on Sept 16
Really Garth… we know you are comin’ out west to check out the dirt so as to find a place to plant a new bunker. Fact is Kelowna is the place ya wanna be so pack up yer boots, dawg, social director (wife) and come on out. I’m sure you can run your operation from anywhere in the world so… And don’t let Kelowna prices scare ya none. I will personally take it upon myself to find you a perfect spot where your equity will only grow to a most worthy bounty – pro-bono ta boot.
I’m there three days later. Tell the chicks at Joey’s to hide. — Garth
re: NYC
“I miss it sometimes. Truth be told, I couldn’t cut it. But it is clear that you only experienced the surface of what goes on.”
It’s ALL surface. Just ask Donald Trump.
Ever see that dipshit on Larry King?
“Y’know Larry? New York is the greatest city in the world!”
Yeah? Who says? It’s all about the marketing.
I HEART NY.
#144 Boombust
Peace brother, I was also born in Vancouver.
“Squirrels: In 1909, the City of New York presented Vancouver with a gift of eight pairs of grey squirrels for Stanley Park . Now the park is riddled with the critters…”
What’s your problem? You don’t OWE it to anybody to “I HEART NY”.
Now, get a life and bug off.
#143 Boombust on 07.28.10 at 5:19 pm
Let me paraphrase my original comment.: “We out west, I think, have a lot more in common with our western US counterparts than we do our own eastern countrymen. Si?”
Oh. Are you falling for that Gordon Campbell “Cascadia” business?
At your peril.
#160 Burnt Norton on 07.28.10 at 8:45 pm
Ding, ding, ding, ding…. and we have a winner folks. Exactly B. Norton… exactly. Step up and claim your prize. The rest of you behind your pick (door #2) is a seat you can take while you wait for the buyer or seller of that house to give you that handout you expect your due. Get comfortable it’s gonna be a while.
The house is likely deducted from the land value because it is a tear down. The cost of tearing the house down would be a negative. The fool who bought the land is probably from China where there is no place to put your stolen corruption wealth. These buyers are typically people who know they have to get their money out of China anyway they can. If you walk into the Bank of China in a tier 2 or 3 city, you will be accosted by black market currency buyers that will give you a little better than the bank rate on US currency. they will sell this to Chinese leaving the country.
At this time there is the equivalent of a 5 foot X 5 foot cubical of commercial real estate UNDER CONSTRUCTION for EVERY man woman and child in China.
That bubble is going to pop!
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/3758047/China_30_billion_square_feet_o
builders seem to think it’s a good time to buy Florida RE.
This from a Sarasota builder.
Adams Homes’ most expensive home available tops out at about $200,000, which is a 3,000-square-foot house that includes four bedrooms, three-and-half baths, a large kitchen, a great room, a game room and two-car garage.
“Of course none of us are economists, but we expect to double sales next year and double them again in the following year,” Carroll said. “People are being cautiously optimistic, but they want to invest in Florida.”
Not sure if anyone posted this yet…
The actual realtor site for this sale:
http://www.gustinhomes.com/index.php?page=tmpProperty&file=23
(oh my – this wasn’t a joke!)
Have a good laugh…
Public School — 1959 vs. 2009
Scenario 1:
Jack goes quail hunting before school and then pulls into the school parking lot
with his shotgun in his truck’s gun rack.
1959 – Vice Principal comes over, looks at Jack’s shotgun, goes to his car and
gets his shotgun to show Jack.
2009 – School goes into lock down, FBI called, Jack hauled off to jail and never
sees his truck or gun again. Counselors called in for traumatized students and
teachers.
Scenario 2:
Johnny and Mark get into a fist fight after school.
1959 – Crowd gathers. Mark wins. Johnny and Mark shake hands and end up buddies.
2009 – Police called and SWAT team arrives — they arrest both Johnny and Mark.
They are both charged them with assault and both expelled even though Johnny
started it.
Scenario 3:
Jeffrey will not be still in class, he disrupts other students.
1959 – Jeffrey sent to the Principal’s office and given a good paddling by the
Principal. He then returns to class, sits still and does not disrupt class
again.
2009 – Jeffrey is given huge doses of Ritalin. He becomes a zombie. He is then
tested for ADD. The school gets extra money from the state because Jeffrey has a
disability.
Scenario 4:
Billy breaks a window in his neighbor’s car and his Dad gives him a whipping
with his belt.
1959 – Billy is more careful next time, grows up normal, goes to college and
becomes a successful businessman.
2009 – Billy’s dad is arrested for child abuse. Billy is removed to foster care
and joins a gang. The state psychologist is told by Billy’s sister thatp she
remembers being abused herself and their dad goes to prison. Billy’s mom has an
affair with the psychologist.
Scenario 5:
Mark gets a headache and takes some aspirin to school.
1959 – Mark shares his aspirin with the Principal out on the smoking dock.
2009 – The police are called and Mark is expelled from school for drug
violations. His car is then searched for drugs and weapons.
Scenario 6:
Pedro fails high school English.
1959 – Pedro goes to summer school, passes English and goes to college.
2009 – Pedro’s cause is taken up by state. Newspaper articles appear nationally
explaining that teaching English as a requirement for graduation is racist. ACLU
files class action lawsuit against the state school system and Pedro’s English
teacher. English is then banned from core curriculum. Pedro is given his
diploma anyway but ends up mowing lawns for a living because he cannot speak
English.
Scenario 7:
Johnny takes apart leftover firecrackers from the Fourth of July, puts them in a
model airplane paint bottle and blows up a red ant bed.
1959 – Ants die.
2009- ATF, Homeland Security and the FBI are all called. Johnny is charged with
domestic terrorism. The FBI investigates his parents — and all siblings are
removed from their home and all computers are confiscated. Johnny’s dad is
placed on a terror watch list and is never allowed to fly again.
Scenario 8:
Johnny falls while running during recess and scrapes his knee. He is found
crying by his teacher, Mary. Mary hugs him to comfort him.
1959 – In a short time, Johnny feels better and goes on playing.
2009 – Mary is accused of being a sexual predator and loses her job. She faces 3
years in State Prison. Johnny undergoes 5 years of therapy.
How stupid we have become!! Think about it!!
Our bubble has caught the attention of the IMF: http://www.planbeconomics.com/2010/07/28/imf-is-the-canadian-housing-market-overvalued-a-post-crisis-assessment/
They suggest that back in mid-2009 the Canadian market was in equilibrium. I wonder what they’d say if they updated their data to mid-2010?
@ boombust
Nevermind. My kind has nothing in common with your kind. Enjoy your version of the world. I’m sure it’s all very neat and clean. After all, it’s good to be clean.
“Enjoy your version of the world. I’m sure it’s all very neat and clean. After all, it’s good to be clean”
Glad you finally came around.
#130 Devil’s Advocate on 07.28.10 at 3:55 pm
…those “positive signs” could be nothing more than BS SPIN…
They are…
“…yesterday’s so-called huge housing sales “success” story. The lame stream media regurgitated the same bile all day long: New Home Sales surged by nearly 24%. Did they tell you the whole story? Of course not.
The whole story is that the near 24% increase from the prior month was only possible because the prior months data had been massive revised – LOWER, of course. (Don’t you just love the much later lower revisions that nobody seems to care about? That’s one of the way the market is “rigged” to do as the central planners wish.) In fact, 57,000 heretofore prior new home sales were stripped away from the data…”
http://www.secretsoftraders.com/futures/laughable-188888
The May number was revised lower by 33,000 to reach the WORST EVER SALES DATA IN HISTORY… and April was revised lower for the SECOND time by an additional 24,000 sales. So we have colossal revisions of 57,000 worse than reported sales but yesterday’s data point was better than expected by 20,000…from the worst level in history… and this is good news? Home prices also fell 1.4% according to this report.
Any reporting short of the full story is laughable, yet the headline is probably all that you heard.
Responding to #124: You’re right, BC people aren’t as stupid… BC people are just plain retarded and completely brain washed lemmings. Have you been to Nanaimo or Vancouver Island? There are a lot of summer teeth there – You know, some are here, some are there. Washingtonians are by FAR better educated than people in BC.
Also, they aren’t stupid enough to continue buying grossly, GROSSLY overpriced real estate as the tards back in BC. BC is so incredibly screwed you won’t believe your eyes. Just give it some time. Your shmarmy, nasty attitude will be cooled. The U.S. will recover and Canada will most certainly be in the shit box. Many economists are now in agreement with this, and this sentiment is quickly growing and becoming accepted, especially in the past sixty days. Get over yourself. YOU ARE OVER.
Canadians overall are lazy, hypocritical, uneducated, hypocritical, envious, hypocritical, ignorant, and oh yeah, hypocritical wannabes. They look inward and never outward. This is why your hell hole of a country will ALWAYS be behind the U.S. on most every level imaginable. Once you start getting off your asses and doing something worthwhile and innovative, you may even be worthy enough to wipe our asses. Until then, you’re basically pure shit in our eyes, so we’ll just look the other way as nobody likes the sensation of burning shit in his or her eyes. See, how is that for being direct? We’re not passive aggressive pussies like mot of you. You’re not leaders, nor will you ever be. We say it like it is without having all this bullshit rhetoric. Canada sucks on so many levels I wouldn’t know where to begin and I don’t have years to write a 10,000 page novel. Every person I know living there wants straight the hell out. That’s why you’re always talking about us – you have nothing better to do and when you do nothing but talk about your “enemy,” it means you want nothing more than to be like him or her. See, wannabes.
#58 DD on 07.28.10 at 8:07 am
#54 Dandy, Actually Vancouver does provide free drugs. They have a controversial program to provide free Heroin (government supplied and paid for) for addicts.
+++++++++++
The government doesn’t give out free smack, just a place to shoot up. It’s expected that the junkies maintain the status quo and continue with the petty theft and B&E’s to support the addiction.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBBE7R7DWJc
120 Prof ANON on 07.28.10 at 2:27 pm
I’m probably missing something, but it seems like a great number of people misunderstand Devil’s Advocate’s position(s).
+++++++++++
A Realturd often trying to speak sense while spewing the industry rhetoric the rest of the time? Probably the cause of the misunderstanding. Me thinks The Devil will be running for public office in Kelowna any day now.
#167BoomBust-gotta agree about the NYC hype machine. I remember going up the Empire State building-people on lower Fifth Avenue, everything fine. I come out at about maybe 8.00 p.m.-nobody on the street and the stores on lower Fifth Avenue had pulled down heavy metal shields over the store windows-shields COVERED with graffitti. Asthetically speaking, the place really is quite a dump, a tribute to the marketing/promo machine. SanFran is breathtakingly beautiful compared to NYC and hardly promoted at all.
#151 dd on 07.28.10 at 6:33 pm
#133 Nostradamus jr.
Welcome back Nost.
Fan boys make me puke .Oh, well one mental midget to another .
Yes Garth some one did indeed find a greater fool.
$2,165,000 for a 1940s bungalow. Say it ain’t so Garth.
If its true then I don’t feel too bad about charging the value of Canada for my silver. Lots of greater fools out there . All I need is one with a license to print currency.
Steven
#60 Devil’s Advocate on 07.28.10 at 8:32 am
I understand that you are a realtor. Please keep your realtor propaganda to yourself! THIS IS NOT THE BEST PLACE ON EARTH!!! NEVER WAS AND NEVER WILL BE!!!
I prefer going on vacation to US where I can get twice as much for my buck, and it’s more enjoyable then BC. I’ve been to Okanagan valley where you sell overpriced houses of cards, mediocre place at best and hugely overpriced.
In states I can get fine dining, 5* hotels and entertainment for much much much less.
I lived in this province for 10 years and I can’t get this so called “west coast spirit”….Is it about smoking pot, giving addicts free drugs, enjoying 180 days non-stop rain or wandering around in the woods?
There is no real business here, and never will be. How $15-20/hour jobs can be supporting 2.1 mil price for the teardown built on the space of three parking spots for trucks?
I got it, tulip bulbs were planted in the ground there, that’s why 2.1 mil price!
i welcome deflation, all the good for nothing non producers will get it up the ***